"The End Of Donald Trump!" Exposing The Lies, Greed, and Fraud Of 2024 | David Pakman

they're imposing a leftwing agenda Biden exercises Trump's obese let's start there I don't think it's fair to call that imposing an agenda when it's just what the data demonstrates you got to go beyond the headlines we have to make decisions of principle versus practicality Trump's gone too far he's humiliated us on the world stage it may keep him out of prison to become president it sort of has to be Biden David Pacman thank you so much for coming on the iced coffee hour we really appreciate it the pleasure is all on this side of the table gentlemen thank you man you have debated B David Ben Shapiro Michael nolles you've appeared on Joe Rogan and on Lex fredman you have a YouTube channel with millions of subscribers you have plenty of viral Clips you have a super popular daily podcast thank you so much it's so good to be here just recently I saw you were actually invited to the White House from kamla Harris yeah which is not just something that the average person gets invited to I mean that's that's pretty incredible yeah it was interesting just to see what are they thinking about for the next year up until the election and it was like an off the Record ation with some other content creators it was super interesting you know I expected that I would show up and it would be basically like some kind of propaganda meeting here's 10 talking points this is what we want you to kind of go out and repeat and this is the message that we want this is what we think will be useful for the upcoming election it was super informal just ask her whatever you're curious about and it was really interesting to see how the the vice president's office operates I didn't come away with any talking points but it was a super interesting experience so it was confidential though well you know off the Record has a specific meaning which real journalists would be able to Define much more clearly but it's basically I can kind of talk in general about their perspective but the idea I think is that you don't quote specific things not that there was anything that would be mind-blowingly controversial anyway so the Super Bowl was not a setup between Taylor Swift and Biden you know it didn't come up but I feel like if we had have 10 more minutes with her it was imminently about to be asked and then she would have had to answer it yeah how do they reach out to you to with email really what was the email like so a lot of people may not know that the Biden Harris Administration have digital teams where usually it would just be like we have a print journalism liaison team and like a corporate media liaison team they actually have a digital so they have people both in the president's office and the vp's office that just work with digital content creators and they send out information or offer people for interviews I interviewed the Secretary of Transportation Pete budajudge a little while ago so they helped to set that so they already knew me to some degree so they said for the State of the Union do you want to come out and U do this and I said sure that sounds interesting so were the general talking points well it was whatever we wanted to ask about so what I what I was interested in talk there was no agenda what I asked about was what's the perspective of the administration as we approach the election with regard to what's happening in Michigan with the uncommitted vote that's essentially saying we're not voting Trump but we're not thrilled with Joe Biden I'm hearing from a lot of these people people from the left who call me and they say I'm not a trump person but I'm angry that Biden hasn't done enough on this or that or I disagree with him and I just wanted to know how aware of this are they are they taking it seriously what's the sort of conversation that they're looking to have just to see you know what I hear every day on my show on Reddit social media are they even aware that this is a conversation that's going on and they seem to be very much aware of yeah so when I see someone like Camala Harris or someone like you know currently in the administration posting a tweet and then like let's just say on some random tweet hundreds of hate comments or hundreds of support comments are all responded to 100% like I always wonder okay if 99% of the responses are hate comments how do they not see that and then delete the Tweet or write the tweet and realize that hey maybe I said something very unpopular but my guess is that they're privy to all of it the vice president seemed acutely aware of everything that's going on in terms of this kind of blowback that's happening in some circles on the left I still think it's relative small and maybe we'll get into that but no they're they're tracking everything that's going on they know what's going on did they only invite liberals Or democrats to this uh yeah I mean that's typical you know when when these uh there there's sort of two groups there's the establishment corporate media who are often officially apolitical and then there's some of these other smaller off the Record groups and uh as far as I know every Administration essentially invites people that are generally on their side now that being said of the 10 people in the room I'd say half or more of the questions were at least to some degree adversarial or or pointed so there was no liit Miss test as far as you can ask about anything you want but I think generally Democratic administrations invite people that are more or less on the left and same with Republican Administration it would be interesting to have uh a lot of adversaries there inv people from a wide spectrum and just see what people are saying if they're trying to gauge uh the the response especially on social media yeah I was asked would I have gone to like this if Trump were presid because doesn't it legitimize someone that I don't think is I I would go and I would ask my questions I mean sure I don't think I'm endorsing anyone in particular if I just go and get to ask any questions I want to ask I I would have absolutely accepted that under Trump if you could ask Trump one question right now what would it be how afraid is he and how seriously is he taking the the trouble that he's in because there are really mixed reports about it you know I think normal people if you had hundreds of millions of dollars you had to come up with facing 91 felony counts and four criminal trials where effectively you're talking about what is a a life sentence right I mean he's obese doesn't exercise he's a terrible diet and is almost 80 years old statistically speaking anything other than a very very light sentence could be a life sentence for him how afraid are you I I I I am not exaggerating when I say I would need to be medicated for anxiety if I was in his position and there's reports that he is really that stressed out about it and there's reports that he doesn't seem to understand how serious this is and there's reports that he just thinks he's going to Prevail ultimately that he'll just win and he's going to be fine so I I'd want to know where his head is at right now so how was Kamala Harris did anything surprise you about her or did anything surprise you about the White House I've covered how in corporate media interviews and speeches she doesn't necessarily come off super likable and she was extremely likable personable behind the scenes and also had a facility with every top I that came up everything from AI which was a topic of conversation uh in a bunch of different ways to foreign policy just extremely knowledgeable and comfortable talking about all of these issues and I it was not my impression of her going in why do you think she comes off so poorly with maybe more formal interviews I don't have a definitive answer to that I think it's a couple different things there's so many people around the president and the vice president that often times this is my opinion obviously the way they go into an interview is based on how they've been briefed and prepared and for anything that's on the record I think there's probably a feeling of higher stakes and and maybe a more buttoned up tone or attitude that doesn't allow them to really be kind of like who they really are I think there's a big difference between sitting in a room off the record with you know 10 people like me and an NBC news interview or a speech that you're reading off of a teleprompter where every word is scripted and calculated so I think naturally it's harder to come off as as positively in a more formal setting I think that's that's the big pck part of it do you know where Joe Biden was at the time of this meeting my understanding is that he this was the day of the State of the Union so my understanding is that around the same time or a little earlier than my meeting with the VP he was doing a lunch in with corporate meeting and then was just preparing for the the State of the Union do you think during the state of the union he had any medication in him that was allowing him to be a little bit more excited or Al during I love the uh the the excited terminology so I recently interviewed uh Dr Harry seagull and I asked him about this specifically you know we talked about Trump and Biden cognitive State and Har seag he's a uh professor of psychology and Psychiatry at Cornell and the I'm not going to get the name exactly right Cornell Wild Department of Psychiatry or something along those lines my question to him was cuz if you turned on Fox that night Hannity was saying you know he's jacked up and then the next day it was he's on drugs he's on some type of drug and I couldn't help but laugh because my very you know my dad's a psychiatrist but I'm no expert in in drugs of this kind so I went to people who know more about this stuff but my instinct was I don't know that there's anything that will hide cognitive decline in the way that was being alleged so I asked Dr Harry seagull about it and informed formally some other people they their impression was in terms of energy you're basically talking about caffeine right and lots of people would have a cup of coffee or two before a big speech that's not going to hide the cognitive decline you know he doesn't know what day it is you drink coffee now you know what day it is what about like ADHD medication let me get to that yeah so then I said to Dr seagull what about ADHD medication is there is there something like that and he said that ADHD medication so first of all we have no reason to believe Joe Biden has ADHD so then what we're talking about is a sort of off label or almost recreational type use of those medications and he said there's no evidence in the literature he's familiar with that if you're suffering from the sort of cognitive decline that some are alleging that that would actually help you so I don't I'm not an expert in this right so I had to go and ask people what I was told by people who know about this stuff is other than just getting some energy from caffeine which so many people do uh there's really not a drug that would mask the co sort of cognitive decline that some are attributing to him what do you say to all the people who say but no that's just because they're hiding it and there's these Elite level drugs that only people in the upper echelon of society have access to and it's it's something you don't know about what do you say to those people well then it's also something they don't know about and then so what are we really talking about we're now now we're talking about feelings and not facts and I would say you can feel whatever you want you can feel that there's drugs we don't know about that work in ways that we don't we the public has not been notified about and doctors seem to know nothing about we're kind of operating in the how do I know there's not an invisible tiger on the table right now between us I I don't know the thing that I guess I've had a realization recently of is that you can find data to really support anything and I feel like this was confirmed recently with Elon musk's interview with Don Lemon and we'll get onto this later in this podcast but they had a very contentious section of their the debate I should call it a debate more than an interview where Elon was just like well where are you getting this data from Don says like well there's plenty of different sources okay well what are the sources and I can find data that actually goes one to one against the data that you're citing and I think like I'm sure that we could find plenty of different psychologists and professors and this and that experts that would say he probably was on something which doesn't necessarily like completely obviously deny whatever claim that you just made but I think that it's it's a it's a really challenging path to go down to try to figure out whether or not he he is using I uh so I disagree with you in a couple different ways I think it is it's generally true so Sam Harris talks about um the setting of small fires that can be hard to put out and this the analogy is you know let's say there's a debate about climate change or whatever and um you can sort of prepare for most of the known arguments that a a climate science denier might present but then you get to a table like this and they say well but did you see that small study from the Philippines and then what about the Liberian whatever study and if you don't know about it all of a sudden there's been a number of small fire set that you can't necessarily put out because you're not familiar with them and as we know those sorts of debates are more about who's more articulate or can sort of score these emotional points rather than about who's necessarily correct I think with the example you're bringing up of we can also find psychologists or psychiatrists that would say whatever I have no doubt that you could find mental health professionals that would have a different opinion about Trump Biden on cognitive decline but we either have studies that tell us here's what sort of drug could work in that way or we don't and while you could definitely find opinions I have no reason to believe that there would be specific drugs that some psychiatrist could come up with and say Here's the drug that if you gave it to Joe Biden his serious cognitive decline would evaporate for 90 minutes during a speech I just don't think that exists if it does I would say let let's find it let's cite it although really quick are you running a business and you want to hear this sound a lot more often well if that's the case our sponsor Shopify is there to help for those in aware Shopify is the global e-commerce platform that's already helped transform millions of businesses worldwide for example Shopify is an endless list of Integrations thirdparty apps and flexible templates to customize your online store exactly the way you want to and what set Shopify apart from their competitors is their ability to turn browsers into buyers with the internet's best converting checkout that's 36% better on average than other leading e-commerce platforms and Shopify actually Powers 10% of all e-commerce in the United States supporting Brands like Alberts rothy and Brooklyn in over 175 countries in fact my coffee company bankroll coffee.com runs exclusively through Shopify and when it came time to actually set up the business there was no other competition it was just Shopify they're that good that we wouldn't even consider using anybody else plus they've got an award-winning support team to help you every step of the way so if you want to get started and check it out yourself you could sign up with a $1 a month trial period when you go to shopify.com all lowercase once again guys all it takes is $1 we have had so many entrepreneurs on this podcast that have made millions of dollars with Shopify so check them out shopify.com all lowercase what's your background and how did you get these beliefs that you had today because I listened to a few of your things I was most impressed by you making $75,000 a year at Circuit City part that was the one bit that stood out to me someday I will do a podcast about my experiences at at Circuit City that would be a big thing I mean my background um essentially my background is really business and not politics nor broadcast casting so I um studied economics and communication undergrad and then I got an MBA and that's really my official background all of the broadcast stuff uh has been learned by doing and then politics I'm from Argentina and Argentina every politics at every table dinner table breakfast table school every it politics is so Central that I just grew up in a family that talked about politics all the time so I think that's where I generated an interest in having opinions but really my background is in business so why did you make the switch from business to politics because it sounded like you did really well in sales I I actually credit working at Circuit City with sort of setting up my success in everything that I've done because at 16 being told you're going to sell laptops and desktop computers and digital cameras now to people that you've never met uh you you learn so much about quickly building rapport with people reading people uh understanding how to have conversations make small talk uh influence all these different sort of soft skills that are super useful and doing stuff in front of the camera I did fine in that I did well doing that I think I never really went into business it's not that I abandoned business I never really went into business other than the business of my show I mean that's really you know I own the business and it it's very entrepreneurial as I was doing my MBA I saw colleagues become financial advisers or bankers and um analysts and things that did not appeal to me the schedule didn't appeal to me the lack of flexibility didn't appeal and so I was fortunate enough to be in a position where I could sort of just let's give this show a year and see if it can become financially viable and it did and I haven't had to get a real job fortunately now why not just work full-time at Circuit City I'm going back to this 75 grand a year part-time selling computers right why not do full-time so actually two things happened at Circuit City yeah uh when I was a freshman in college we used to be on commission at Circuit City so you really wrote your own paycheck you know and Circuit City was spending too much money on payroll they decided to go the Best Buy model so they converted people over from commission to hourly if you were making under 10 bucks an hour obviously at the time you know inflation was very different at this point if you were making under 10 bucks an hour you were laid off because you just weren't a good enough salesperson if you were making over 22 bucks an hour you were laid off because they didn't want to offer you such a high hourly rate there were two people at my store myself and one other who were above that threshold so I was actually laid off by Circuit City I would have stayed while I was in college and just kept selling laptops while I got my education but they laid me off when they made that transition within a couple years they were bankrupt turns out laying off the top salespeople was not the best business decision they could have made and they went out of business how shifting from that into politics though it just started as a podcast when I was an undergrad let me just start a podcast in a community radio show once every two weeks and then as it slowly grew and it became easier to put a couple cameras in a room and film yourself and start uploading the stuff to more platforms it was growing fast enough that I could justify giving it another 6 months giving it another 6 months and seeing can we make any money can we make enough money to hire some people can how far can it go uh so it was just blending my interest in entrepreneurship and my interest in talking about politics it was it was basically that simple so how were you growing in the beginning and what that Revenue look like for the first few years zero there was Zero revenue and I tell a lot of people this um you know our our Revenue curve at some Point went way almost vertical there were years during the show made zero and at the time I had recruited my little brother and one of my um childhood best friends and we all were kind of like this is a fun thing to do it's a hobby let's just try it but I think for four years we had zero revenue and it was okay because I was getting my undergrad degree then started working on my MBA so did you have listeners uh we had listeners yeah there was just no you know this was the beginning of monetization of a lot of these things before we got on YouTube there was no Revenue initially when you would get on YouTube you couldn't earn any money until you were accepted into the partner program it wasn't automatic the way I think it is now although I'm not totally sure about that and how do you pick if you're going to take more of the stance of the left or the right there's no calculation my show is exclusively just what's my opinion what do I feel like talking about today there's no oh you know how how would my audience react to this that or the other thing if I uh what if I fabricate a position on an issue that's not mine it's really just do I feel like talking about this and my honest genuine positions there's no calculation or character that I play it seems as though especially online people like you to take a very hard stance I'm either really over here or really over here and you stick with that because that becomes the core audience it's it's less of a Market Per Se in the middle have you found that to be the case I can't say if there's a market in the middle that's an interesting question um I think my understanding is maybe there are people who claim to be in the middle I don't know how well they do or if they're really in the middle sort of thing uh what I can tell you is if we look at the left right Spectrum I'm very far from the farle in the sense that the far-left is very clearly delineated often as being um socialist or in some cases Marxist in some cases Lenin leninist communist really well well well to my left uh I'm a Social Democrat which is a form of capitalism it's well-regulated capitalism it's similar to the models that um are in Scandinavia um and some other northern European countries so there's no doubt that I'm very far from from the far left what I hear from my audience I I I do think that your audience will start to mirror your views over time and so in my audience the views that I have are mirrored by a lot of people in my audience obviously the rightwing really doesn't like me because they see me as a socialist even though I'm very much not the actual socialists don't like me because I'm not actually a socialist so to some degree we're all kind of carving out an audience for ourselves sure let's define some of these terms so you said you're a Social Democrat right how would your policy look different than what we have currently in United States and then maybe if we could Define like liberalism and conservatism liberalism is tough because whether it's capital l or lowercase L and whether you're talking about the global definition or the one that's been adopted in the US modern definition yeah so here here's the way I would kind of lay it out I'm somewhere to the left of Joe Biden and Hillary Clinton and to the right of socialists and so the differences between what we have at least in theory I would argue that what we have in theory isn't actually being executed on but as I talked to Patrick Bet David about when he started talking to me about socialism you know I asked him do are you okay socializing the military or would you want various for-profit mercenary groups and depending on which war we want to fight we hire one or the other he essentially no no no the military it should be government run Etc okay what about the VA what about all these things the difference between someone like Patrick B David and social Democrats is we want to look at socializing a few more things so I think we should figure out a way to get everybody healthare and I'm okay with government government being involved there in education I'm okay with government being involved there what social Democrats generally want to do is we want to put some kind of floor that no one has to drop below in terms of standard of living and the way we do that is is with progressively higher taxes on uh the wealthiest people and uh that's really what we see in places like Sweden and Denmark they still have good business environments you still can make a lot of money I believe Bernie Sanders says there really shouldn't be billionaires I'm kind of agnostic as to whether there should or shouldn't be billionaires but I want to make sure that as we get to the top top top of those income ranges we're just appropriately taxing just that we can make sure no one's homeless or hungry or lacks Healthcare these are like really basic things that a lot of countries have figured out so the topic of whether there should or shouldn't be billionaires is an interesting one because you said that with the specification of income when a lot of these billionaires of course A lot of them make a lot of money uh maybe on the record they don't but a lot of their wealth is just in assets or whatever stock they their own company what do you think as to that type of billionaire then yeah I so it's you're sort of getting at the concept of a wealth tax I've said that I believe the wealth tax conversation is barely of discussion for two different reasons number one it's not even remotely politically viable even among Democrats you're saying it won't pass it's just not going to pass and number two it's not obvious to me that it would be legal constitutional now I'm not a legal scholar or constitutional scholar so much like with the uh neut Tropic medications uh I'm going by by what I read from experts about this stuff it seems it would be you're getting at a really good point which is if your um earned income is low and you're either earning through capital gains or you have assets of high value including assets that can be difficult to Value uh real estate not so difficult to Value Fine Art more difficult to Value right uh I I just don't really know that the practicalities of a wealth tax make it the super interesting um uh uh compelling way to me to approach this problem what is the answer I'm not totally sure you probably want to tax capital gains at the same rate as income now I'm not saying people don't sell I'm not saying I advocate for every single one of these things I'm just kind of laying out a framework that some people would put in if you don't sell you can't capture the gains that that absolutely makes sense so I think it's a complicated uh question with a lot of different possible solutions but we're not really at a point where this is super politically viable and part of part of my approach to this is I don't think we can cut our way to Prosperity so the the right-wing idea of we simply need to reduce spending I don't think that that's really going to be the big economic uh bo that some think it is but there are areas including military and defense spending where I think we could we really could significantly shrink and reallocate to some of the social programs that I'd like to see my understanding with a lot of government spending is that they give budgets and if the budgets aren't utilized in full they don't get the same budget for the next quarter or the next year to me that seems like a problem incentivizes spending yes there's no doubt about that it seems like there's a lot that can be cut down purely because just optimized for Waste yes and one of the other things about this is you often will hear people say hey instead of money for X in the military what about money for y for whatever and and you're hearing it a lot right now where people say instead of gift cards for undocumented immigrants what about housing homeless veterans great idea to house homeless veterans a lot of the people talking about this don't actually want to spend the money to house the homeless veterans they they're using it politically opportunistically now but the way a lot of these budgets are done or vertically departmentally you you can't just move the money from one to the other after the fact in way many people are why do we have that uh sort of boundaries yeah why do we have that that method for government spending of just like here's your budget if you don't use all of it you can't get more of it lots of Corporations have the same thing so I don't think it's Unique to government I mean there's you know large corporations you know they have marketing budgets and if we have to if you don't use the whole budget you probably didn't need it and next year we're going to cut it I I don't think that this is I think this is a function of large organizations be they governmental or or corporate or nonprofit I don't think it's Unique to government do you think that's just because it's simpler that way if just like this is our easiest way to get the job done and if we waste some money it's just a cost of doing business I think it's a shortcut to try to simplify rather rather than a situation where we go back to the drawing board you know VI ramaswami who I'm not a fan of was talking about zerob based budgeting for every department now he was using it as an excuse to do things I don't agree with which is like eliminate a whole bunch of departments doesn't matter though the the the point is doing that rather than just saying okay what was the budget budget last year did you use all of it great it goes up 1% you didn't use all of it we're cutting it it's it's a shorthand to simplify what is really complicated stuff I always had an idea that if the government just allocated even if it's like1 billion do every single year for a team of like the best possible accountants a thousand accountants however many thousands of accountants just to intern audit the entire like all of the money that is distributed by the federal government and then provided like a very succinct and concise letter to everybody to read and everyone can have opinions on it like why is that not being implemented I feel like that would actually put some scrutiny into these wasteful organizations who would make the final say though is it like one account responsible at least it would like bring some of the stuff to light CU I remember back in when I was in high school like I was hearing about $22 muffins that were sold know I mean it was $250,000 $500,000 refrigerator insted in Air Force or a 1.6 million public bathroom you know it's like so there's like three different things here one sometimes these anecdotes are used to make broader points that aren't necessarily that useful in figuring out like the big picture so I know about you know the $400 urinal dividers or or whatever okay we can look into that I don't know how big how bigger picture necessarily that fits into what we're talking about it's a symbol it's a symbol of something we can debate of of what uh the idea of hiring 10,000 accountants I mean so the the idea of a full comprehensive audit of the federal budget is a is a great idea in theory couple problems with it are number one a lot of the people who want to cut the budget dramatically would never go along with hiring 10,000 accountants they actually want to close entire departments lay off 20 or 50% of federal workers so you'll never get them to actually go for it and then number three as you're kind of pointing out is who has the final say and what are the political biases and it would be fortunately and I hate that we have to be this kind of cynical um unfortunately it would lead to a lot of the same uh partisan political infighting that causes the gridlock we already have so it's a it's an interesting idea in principle but when you get into the practicalities of how unfortunately government is working right now and the hyper partisanship I would be kind of naive to say oh that'll absolutely that'll Sol do you think it sounds good in theory I think the idea of such an audit does sound good in theory but if we can't even agree on what the facts are or what should be actually involved in which are two things that that Democrats and Republicans often don't agree about what's the point of bringing in the accountants until we know what the target is but I feel like there is a majority population that thinks the government does not spend money appropriately I think that is majority completely different reasons right I know and then we can we can figure out these reasons when we actually have some transparency with how they're spending our money and I also think on an ethical perspective it makes sense if someone is taking your money and then they're using it in areas you have no idea where it's going have an idea where it's going I agree 110% with that I think the the problem so there's more transparency some people just assume we have no transparency a lot of them haven't looked it up I mean you can look up howd I understand money goes missing or it's not as fine was it for urinals or toilets you know right so some of these details are not always fully transparent but a lot more information than some people assume is out there but the real problem is even my guess is 80 or 90% of Americans would disagree with how their tax money is is being spent for a hundred different reasons and in a 100 different ways and getting the consensus is what's really difficult the way the ways I think my tax money is being misspent are very different from the ways that other people think my tax money is being misspent although you know what before we go into that we have spent a lot of money here in the podcast to bring you the best episodes possible from traveling to different people to hiring audio Engineers to filming and 4K but you know what you don't have to spend a lot of money if you want to be successful with video content and our sponsor streamyard is there to make that a reality for those una aware streamyard is a live streaming Studio platform that allows you to create highquality content with just the click of a button all you need is a camera and an internet connection and then from there you could stream directly from your browser so my favorite thing about streamyard is their multistream feature that allows you to stream to multiple different platforms all at the same time and when we got on Instagram Tik Tok and Facebook it absolutely exploded our growth and with streamyard they just make it so easy streamyard is really the best way to begin creating high quality content with no money out of pocket like they even have a free feature which means it's free you don't have to spend any money to get started with the link Down Below in the description so guys check it out with the link Down Below in the description it would mean so much they've also just supported our podcast for a very long time so it would help tremendously thank you so much streamyard and back to the episode do you think that we should spend more than what the country gets in taxes I have two answers to this okay number one if we really cut in the areas that I don't think we should be spending as much on I don't think that we would have to so that's number one that's if you give me the pen to start Crossing off or circling that's number one number two the deficit spending question we know that depending on the economic multiplier of what we're spending on deficit spending can be economically stimulative or not so for example and I know based on the guests you've had this idea has been discussed at nauseum tax cuts for the very rich for money that they don't need has a very low marginal propensity to consume it'll often just get stuck in a bank account which is low economic multiplier food stamps on the other hand have a very high economic multiplier because number one people are people who receive Food Stamps really need that money so it's not going to sit in a bank and number two it's often spent in local communities so now this is not my opinion and you can tell me why I would like to know if you could just Define for those viewers economic multiply yeah so it's basically the recurring impact of a dollar in the community so if you take a dollar and stick it in a bank account uh it can be fractionally lent through the fractional banking system and then generated as a loan and then those loans are used for a whole bunch of different things so we might assign an economic multiplier to it of 1.1 on the other I'm making these numbers up but it's just for illustrative purposes on the other hand you could say well food stamps uh are all spent it's fully reinserted back into the economy it then goes to the wages that are earned by the workers of the grocery store which they spend in their community so that might have an econ ecomic multiplier of 1.8 for example so it generates a different amount of economic activity it's sort of like but there's a delayed effect it that depends with the velocity of of uh the area in which you're you're putting the money but the the best example that really illustrates this is if you imagine someone making $155,000 a year and someone making $15 million a year if I give the person making 15K a thousand bucks you can be very sure that thousand's going right back into the economy because they need that th if I give someone making $15 million a th000 bucks it's a rounding error it's much less likely to be reinjected into the economy so that, will have much more economic stimulus being given to the person who makes 15K could we get a basic understanding of each predominant political party that exists today so we we talked a little bit about liberalism we didn't really discuss conservatism and then any other main thing that should be defined before we continue uh lower L liberalism generally encompasses everything up to and including social democracy on the left and I would say center rightism of the style of like a Mitt Romney that's all small L liberalism which is based on the idea that uh cap capitalism and markets are generally the best way to direct resources uh we do have a progressive system of Taxation which is used for some welfare programs kind of the status quo of of most western lowercase L liberal democracies that would be liberalism big picture there's conservative and progressivism within liberalism so it's important to understand that capital L liberalism for a while in the United States was used to to mean like Democrats or maybe now term progressives is used now we're moving more in the direction of social Democrats when I was on with Lex Freedman we spent a lot of time on on this stuff and a lot of people responded saying defining the labels is not useful right now because they're shifting so quickly and so often looking at issues or specific ideology can be more useful but in a sense in my my mind social democracy and progressivism mostly exist on the left of lower case L liberalism some moderate conservatism does too then you get out to the further left and the further right and they're kind of different things what type of person is usually found under those main labels honestly I don't think I'm as up to date on these numbers enough to say super confidently where I would draw the lines I mean I think very big picture women tend to be slightly more left than men in the United States not by a major margin but by a few points um Jews and um black Americans are two of the most democratic leaning groups Evangelical whites are one of the more right leaning groups that tend to vote for Republicans I mean you can really slice and dice this in a lot of lot of different ways younger folks in general tend to be more likely to vote for Democrats than older folks although there's some degree to which there was a little bit of a change to that in 2020 where you you had a contingent of older folks that that were very much not impressed with Trump and voted for Biden it's really hard to give one answer to this because it it evolves uh it's very regionalized and um you can also get into trouble by kind of like stigmatizing or or um putting certain groups into Corners as if they are just like a a mass of people like for example even though Jewish Americans a group I'm a part of are one of the overwhelmingly left-wing groups in the country there are also prominent right-wing Jews which sometimes can confuse the story you know there's examples of everything in a country of this many people one thing that I find really interesting is that liberalism and conservatism or left and right is a representation of a fundamental different difference in belief about human nature right at least that's the way that I like to think about it because you have very smart people on both sides they can boil these topics down all the way until these types of people generally believe this philosophic philosophically about humans and this type of people generally believe this what's an example of that personal Liberties you know what I mean are people better off when given you know as much information as possible to lead their own life and be as free as possible versus no people need pressures from their culture from their society from government uh from their families to be able to be guided into you know uh of being a productive member of society or something like that would be an issue on which someone was advocating for Less information to be given well this is the question that I have for you now that you're questioning me is that what do you think are the fundamental differences in philosophy between the right and the left I don't think there's one answer to that I I I wish I could give like super piy uh and and black white answers on this but there's different wings of left and right so let's take the freedom thing as an example sometimes there's the idea that the Republican party or the conservative movement are the movements of freedom and that the left wants to restrict freedom but when you really analyze it a lot of times what you actually have is that the right wants everyone to have the freedom to mostly choose the things that they've decided are within the acceptable Overton window of what can be chosen so an example would be pro-choice versus an Choice it's not that the left is going around saying oh people should be having abortions but it's give take government out of it let let people decide with their family their loved ones whatever uh what medical professionals what is right for them that's a freedom that the right wants to take away and they'll give you a lot of different justifications for why either because they believe that abortion is murder or for all sorts of different reasons but fundamentally that's not a freedom but Freedom as long as it is within the bounds that we've decided is acceptable I'll give you another example um when it comes to uh military spending and defense spending uh my view is that we should really have a much more direct way if we don't like the way that the military is being deployed and I don't mean like the big story uh headline story Wars like the Iraq War which was a major thing I mean do we need 50 military bases in German or might we be okay with 25 this sort of thing which is really one layer removed I would want more freedom and mechanisms to say that's not the way we want to do it whereas defense spending to much of the right is sacran that's not a freedom that they want to provide so the point I'm trying to make is even a lot of these Topline things we hear freedom is valued more on the right than the left and certainly I see more Republicans wearing the Freedom T-shirt that's now very popular it's it's overwhelmingly Republicans who are wearing these t-shirts and espousing this at least in theory but when it really comes down to it there's a lot of ways in which it's the left that really wants to give people choice and freedom right but that's based off of interpretation of data I think that's how it all is unfortunately so you think that the there is no fundamental difference in beliefs about human nature that exists generally speaking on people on the right and generally speaking people on the left and it's just a misinterpretation of data that exists that causes people to scoot to one side or the other no I think there's a lot to this I think that there are there there's a a bunch of different categories here there are some studies that suggest that there are different things going on in the brains of those predisposed to be on the left versus the right and the idea that for example fear centers are more developed or um larger I I doubt larger is the right term but um that are more prominent or active in the right and that a lot of right-wing ideology is fear-based in a sense I mean think about when we talk about immigration why has the claim that dangerous documented and or undocumented immigrants are committing high levels of crime and we need to stop them from coming into this country why has that been so Salient with one group of people in the US but less with another my view follows what I believe is the irrefutable data if you have different data to present to me I'll look at it but the data is documented and undocumented immigrants have lower violent crime and all crime rate it's the natural born citizens that's that's what the data show so if you really want to make the country safer by this data it's the natural born citizens that we got to be keeping that by percentage or by the number of incidents prime rate okay yes so it accounts for population size yeah um I I I know why that's relevant and it it it is based on rate okay so when I look at that my fear Center is not activated but there are lots of folks who got behind Trump's travel ban who got behind a lot of the immigration policy policy based on the false notion that not only are crime rates going up but that immigrants documented and undocumented are more likely to commit crime so that's that's a fundamental difference the fear-based politics is resonating more with the right than the left see that's that's what I'm interested in because I don't think that it is just only a different interpretation of the same data that exists to every single person I think obviously there are spins on that data so people interpret it differently but also a fundamental difference in brain activity on people on the right and people on the left or a lot of the times what I can do is I can stereotype somebody like for example I meet somebody I talk to him for 10 minutes I'm like okay this person's probably conservative or this person's probably probably liberal we haven't talked politics at all okay I've just got to know their personality and that's what I'm interested in is like what are these differences and maybe you don't have any like you know personal anecdotal experiences or data on that but that was that fear I don't necessarily disagree with I think that's actually prettyy interesting couple things one I think I I we don't have to get into this but I want to mention just to like get on record I reject the notion that everything is just down to interpretation of data I believe there are empirical realities it's often a criticism right now levied against the political left from the political right that we on the left are postmodernists who uh believe that every every interpretation is equally valid and there's no empirical reality I certainly don't believe that and I don't believe that every issue is just subject to an interpretation of the facts I think they're they're real empirical realities to build on top of the the fear example I think culture is a big part of it I've spent time in rural Northern Indiana for example all that there is are Evangelical churches and shooting ranges it's logical to me that you end up with way more conservative people there than if you grow up for example in New York City or in San Francisco it's it's logical to me because of the environment and because of the culture people's politics also tend in general tend to follow the politics of their parents although of course there's people who kind of rebel and end up with different political views but family upbringing is a big part of it there are a lot of different layers to this and it's a it's a sociology question it's a political uh psychology question it's a lot of different things that's the hard part is that there's so many different sciences that all would be involved in this like are humans naturally selfish or selfless how much are humans affected by their environment versus how are they not does power corrupt when it gets to a certain size or does it not and I feel like these things if you map them out just general fundamental philosophical questions about human nature could probably be differentiated amongst both sides I think so and I think it's important to note that there are large swaths of the Republican party that think that a lot of the disciplines you're talking about and saying are so important here aren't even worthy of study and they say these These are worthless things to study in college liberal arts in general and a lot of Sociology anthropology Etc there's a large contingent of this country that thinks these are worthless disciplines but I agree with you understand you correctly that they're very valuable no I 100% agree with you and I think like if we're talking about its core yes they're very valuable in theory but I think probably if you ask a lot of the conservatives how they're being taught in school that's what they'd probably disagree with maybe the fact that there are those disciplines that exist in the first hand you'd find some conservatives that agree that okay you know that shouldn't be taught in school because they're seeing it more as a Marketplace and what kind of job are you going to get with this degree etc etc but I think most conservatives would probably just disagree with the hidden agenda that usually comes with those sorts of um studies well we're opening up quite a can of worms here and I've I've heard some of your I I call them rants not pejoratively but some of your uh spirited comments about college that you've had with others with my friend Destiny and with others yeah I don't consider myself you know like a woker or whatever PE people who watch my show know that I've been very critical of when woke and Dei go too far by the way I use woke as if we all know what it means but it's been so perverted that what what but the the Dei stuff when it goes to too far I think the left shouldn't defend it we should actually just say oh yeah that goes too far when academic stuff is going on that I disagree with when I see um identity politics used in a way that I think just doesn't make sense doesn't doesn't add to the conversation but actually limits or takes away I call that stuff out so to the extent that I'm sure we wouldn't agree about every instance of what's happening at Higher Learning institutions that's a problem I I have no no shortage of issues and problems with with that wing of the left and when I see that I call it out I just noticed cuz I was at you know Public School uh all the way up until High School obviously and then I went to college UCSB and I noticed basically with every single class there was a hidden agenda that they were always trying to teach you some certain things about human nature about policy or this or that um and I think that's probably what most conservatives are going against when they're I never I never noticed that maybe it was different never show up for class it was different I had a couple classes where up on that and I went to some pretty you liberals but I I think it's important not to confuse there's two different things here there's the concept of a hidden agenda being crowbarred into an academic discipline and there's also sometimes just empirical realities that sometimes just reality has what if overlaid on politics would be a left-wing bias but sometimes it's just reality there are certain policies for example like I'll give you an example if you house feed and give Health Care to homeless people the total cost to the economy is lower than from having folks living on the street the crime that it can generate when desperation takes hold using emergency rooms as primary care because they don't have calth that's that's a math let me finish though that's a mathematical reality and if you taught that in a college class you would have folks who go they're imposing a left-wing agenda well come up with a different explanation for the data that we have and then maybe we'll come to different conclusions but that's just sort of like an empirical reality I don't think it's fair to call that imposing an agenda when it's just what the data demonstrates I don't disagree and I think that with instances like that like obviously if that's what the data shows that's what the data shows uh but in in other ways which is more of like the wokeness an examp that's the other stuff like reparations and stuff like that was talked about by the teacher in a very positive way which didn't even actually have anything to do with the class and obviously it seemed like like for me I shouldn't say Obviously but it seemed like there wasn't any room for any other dialogue and as a student you feel a little bit threatened to speak out against something like this and I'm sure once again a lot of people can attest to this because your grade's on the line sure um I'm with you so here to the extent that that's going on I'm with you 100% I had a class or two in college where it felt to me as though your grade was dependent on agreeing with certain opinions of the teacher mhm that were under dispute potentially or not totally obvious and I think that that's a problem I'm with you on that to the extent that that exists I think we're on the same page so for another one and this could have just been my interpretation we'll move past this really quickly but for example we were forced to read handmaid's tale we who uh a class so this was the the class reading was can I take a little bit of issue with the term forced it was part of the curriculum right you just mean it was part of the curriculum yeah okay so it wasn't any more forced then you're forced to study algebra or um you know right so you're forced to study algebra there were books that were assigned which I chose not to read and it just affected my grade I think the choice of the word forced in some cases but not others is maybe a little problematic SCI they not grabbing the back of our head putting up it was part the curricul it was part of the curriculum it was assigned to us if we didn't do it we would have failed out of the class so it wasn't forced it was just a sign a requirement of the class a requirement of the class um and when I was writing my complete analysis on this book I knew that I had to skew whatever my interpretation was of this book to a certain ideology because if I went against it I had fear that it would impact my grade in a negative way and that's not something I'm there to get good grades that's you know why I was going to to to col it's just kind of life right like anything you want if you want to get a job you're going to appease to the boss if you want to get a client you got to appe peas to the client yeah but it seemed like there wasn't room for any other dialogue and when education exists to teach you how to think to learn rather than what to think and what I think that's when uh water start getting muddy I think Graham is making one really good point which so there's two there's two things here there's your perception of whether there was space for descent I've had situations where I was aware of the professor's opinion but I felt that there was room for descent and as long as I backed up I mean really what the ideal situation in a class like that to me would be that the opinion of the professor maybe does come through maybe it's unavoidable in some areas for the professor's opinion to come through but it should be an environment where the students know that as long as you can defend a dissenting opinion you're not going to be punished in terms of your grade I think that's okay I think in those situations being aware of the professor's opinion is not necessarily a major problem but to your point Graham I think there's a great degree to which much of life is about reading social cues and situations and sometimes we have to make decisions of principle versus practicality and in terms of jobs in terms of friend ships in terms of relationships I think it's a really great skill to have I'm not advocating for Dissent to be punished in school but to your point I think it it is a reality that we do have to evaluate okay here's what I really think about this project that my company is undertaking if I tell my immediate supervisor this I'm almost certainly going to be denied a promotion or they're going to say we're not finding that there's a cultural fit Etc so to some degree you might have to suck it up and kind of go along with the project and whatever needs to be done I think that that's a reality in a lot of life and and I think that that's a really good point and people should understand that separate from I don't think if you have the wrong opinion you should fail a class I think that's a problem I think we're in agreement on principle and it's the example what we each think about examples is it where I would leave it where there would be examples that you may find problematic and I don't or vice versa you're a man that's done plenty of different debates what has been your favorite debate I actually hate doing debates and a lot of the reason why is the amount of of prep required to try to avoid embarrassing yourself is absolutely staggering and no matter how much prep you do like I said someone can set a couple of small fires and you end up looking kind of stupid and debates really are not a referendum on what is accurate it's a referendum on being articulate you see these four five hour debates now four to five hours is so long for the kind of modern world that I struggle to think people really glean some bigger picture sense other than moments where someone looked stupid or was very aggressive and appeared successful and that doesn't really in my view determine what what is correct and based on the facts uh and then on the other hand the other thing I I struggle with with these debates is sometimes they're way too short to even really get out there and be able to explore an idea so I I don't really love the format what I really like doing is researching a topic looking the at the pros and cons steelmanning arguments against and kind of coming to some conclusion and presenting it to my audience and then we can follow up on that and people can call me and question things I got wrong I like that format better uh and I don't watch a lot of these long form debates for the same reason okay so how do you think aside from doing your own research maybe like talking to a very articulate and intelligent denter of whatever opinion do you think that can still be productive in a sense okay so so a conversation for you know just to ascribe a word to it rather than a debate so what do you think has been your favor favorite contentious conversation you know one of the ones that sticks out in my mind is when I interviewed the white nationalist Richard Spencer this was years and years ago this I don't know if you you know who that is he was sucker punched once somewhere I I don't remember by by someone who disagreed with him and shortly after that he still had a black eye if I remember I mean this was this this was very fresh and the conversation was so interesting because in talking a little bit about his upbringing and how he came to to believe the things he believed it really opened up a path for me to talk to more extremists and started realizing a lot of their backgrounds and upbringings share commonalities and that people often get to extremism through similar sorts of backgrounds and things that happen so I I find his views deplorable and some in my audience questioned even having him on I've explained why I have people like that on but think it was extremely interesting to just start really figuring out because this was years ago I think seven years ago or longer how did he come to the con because that these These are such extreme foreign things to believe that Jews and white people fundamentally are so different that they we can't get along and and kind of live side by side productively in society Beyond just polite superficialities it was it really opened my eyes a lot you noticed from that going back to their childhood upbringing what led them to that with a lot of these in guy it's often men not always there's usually some history of being lonely and ostracized and then finding some kind of community that often happens to have these hateful beliefs now with with Spencer specifically I don't know that he has this kind of isolated trauma background necessarily uh so I'm trying to think back to it but with a lot of other this guy Frank mink who I've spoken about is's a former Neo-Nazi and others there's often crazy family situation isolated sometimes violence being alone ostracized physical violence sometimes and then all of a sudden an explanation for why the world is tough which is often point at this group or point at that group combined with a pseudo Community or community that says hey come join us and by the way here's all the stuff we believe that is really really common how do change those beliefs do you make any effort to try to do that or is it more so about understanding where this person is coming from I don't go in TR I mean in a 20 or 30 or 40 minute interview you're not going to be able to change these beliefs from what I've spoken to in terms of cult experts and psychologists you sometimes need months if not years of empathetically probing where beliefs come from creating an environment where people would be comfortable saying hey you know I'm kind of starting to question this thing that I believe this is a really long process so for me those interviews are mostly seek to understand but also expose that a lot of these beliefs are not rooted in fact they're rooted in in bias and bigotry so you're hope hoping that maybe someone of his audience watches you and then can reflect on themselves and maybe work on themselves or even people in my audience who may be considering some of these beliefs or finding them compelling in some way who would you say is the most influential person on the left and the right right now I think on the right it's Trump still by the numbers I mean 40% of Republican primary voters did not vote for him but 60% still did he's taken over the Republican National Committee he didn't debate or participate in the mainstream Republican conversation about who should be their nominee it did not affect his polling whatever whatsoever or whatever um facing 91 felony counts and four criminal trials not affecting his popularity uh so I think on the right it's Trump I think the left is a little bit um fragmented right now so it really depends on who you talk to and who you ask but here's the key difference I would say in my experience and I this I can speak for myself I'll speak for myself I don't really care so much about the individuals I care about the ideas and sometimes you'll hear from trumpists it's very obvious Biden couldn't have won 2020 because you don't see any of the boers with the big flag Flags you don't see people wearing Biden hats or t-shirts or the bumper stickers or the lawn signs and as I've said before um we on the left don't really deify the individuals there was a little bit of deification of Bernie Sanders years back I it was a small portion of the left I don't believe Obama was deified in fact very quickly some of the people who were disillusioned that he was not functioning as progressively as they had hoped very quickly said I'm actually disappointed with Obama I think there was a little bit of a cult of personality around Bernie uh there was a little bit of a cult of personality around Tulsi gabard although I don't even really think she's on the left she and she's now a trumpist and speaking at maral Lago and whatever so um it is true that I would never put a bumper sticker on my car or wear a hat about a candidate I'm more concerned with is this the best option in November and so I'll go out and vote and then go back to running my business and and living my life so I think the left isn't looking for figures in the same way that the right is at this point in time do you recommend people listen to other political commentators and if so who on the right and who on the left I don't listen to any other political commentators with the exception of if I'm preparing to address something on my show really it's number one because I just don't have the time and number two I really try to sort of isolate myself from what other people who do what I do are saying and inform Myself by reading history and economics long form books and then straight reporting stuff from the Associated Press or Reuters or investigative stuff so I deliberate I I don't have the time and I try to isolate myself from it so I really hesitate to recommend pundits per se what I will tell you is that if if and this is this is dangerous because there are people who are going to hear me saying this and say David are you endorsing these right- wiers and what I'm answering is who do I think on the right is worth listening to in terms of they're not screaming at the top of their lungs bad faith actors they're just conservative and and have things to say that I think can be valuable it's folks like David Brooks Brett Stevens Thomas Soul it's not that I cheerlead these folks and say the they have my ideology they don't those are the sorts of folks not pundits but those are the types of people that I think it's it's worth seeing what what they have to say uh William F Buckley who a lot of people found insufferable did very interesting interviews from a right-wing perspective he was brilliant you don't have to agree with everything he said but looking at his content on YouTube could be interesting for people on the left who want to hear a different perspective that's the sort of thing I tend to recommend do you think it could be worthwhile spending a little bit of time each day seeing what the other side is saying I I see what the other side is saying I'm just not what who how are you seeing it in news reports elected officials what are what is official policy that's being said what is being said at campaign events what I mean more is I don't spend time watching stuff like Ben Shapiro or Michael nolles but I have a number of different newsletters I subscribe to and clip Services where I can look at a glance and say okay so here's their take on they're all going with Biden was on drugs at the State of the Union got it okay so I'm aware of that but I don't sit and watch an hour of Hannity and and that sort of thing clip Services I feel like can do it Injustice to this surrounding context of what's being you got to seek out the context there was recently one and what I've been doing recently and I absolutely love this so I go on a walk a day and it's a long long walk and I listen to your episode and I listen to Ben's episode and I do them back to back and it's really interesting because you guys both talk about different found it advantageous to see what both sides are saying but as on on the the clip thing yeah uh since I was listening to Ben recently he had this whole thing about retirement age and how he thinks retirement people shouldn't even retire and people clipped that and I thought I got wildly out of context really yes I didn't follow that story so I don't know what was said explain I didn't see yeah so he said people should not retire he thinks the idea of retirement is stupid there's a lot of data that shows after you retire your your mental health goes down your physical health goes down you're likely to die afterwards jobs give people purpose and then a lot of people were saying oh well I've been a plumber my entire life um you know I'm a brick layer I carry bricks I can't do that when I'm you know 80 years old which is what Ben is advocating for oh it's so easy for you to say this since you just sit in a chair and read and talk but he provided all of those examples in his uh in his original is the source clip which was just like hey obviously granted some of these types of jobs it's not really feas IDE your all5 and you're fre to whatever want that will Bey existence he doesn't believe it's true based on know his audience that that's the thing like I hear that and I understand what he's saying but I believe most people they're working terrible jobs they absolutely hate in the weekends like Friday at 6 p.m comes around that's the moment they look forward to so Ben's saying you shouldn't retire is them saying no I never get a weekend we hear that and we think oh yeah you know you get to a place of financial Independence and you could you know keep a job keep that social interaction I agree with Ben but I this thing it's poorly worded poorly landed and you have to give so much context no I agree I I agree with that because a lot of people obviously don't have the like they don't have those toward uh types of jobs but I do think what is important is that you continue working towards something and not just give up and think that if you abandon all responsibility and abandon being a productive member of society when you become 65 that you're going to be happy could replace that which just be productive yeah yeah yeah I mean listen I I don't know if you're asking me for my opinion on the the contextualizing of it or on the content of it but on the content of it I I think that you've got to know your audience I think the context is critical I do think that there are lots of really good substitutes for jobs for different people including volunteering including raising kids or grandkids include there's all sorts of different things depending on what you value I do think I mean listen I I can speak from a position of great privilege on this where at this point you know I I am financially independent and I love love what I'm doing and I want to continue doing it and it's a very different situation to say I don't know how long I'll continue doing this but I'm enjoying it and it might be a long time or it might not and I don't know that is not the situation for I mean it's got to be 90 plus% of the country at least if not 95 or more and so I do think that sometimes the the the context or not it's not sounding like a super InTouch thing to say even even with some of the context that you're providing I think the context was very important I mean he was citing data that showed that like after you retire all of these other things start drastically getting worse in your life I don't know enough about it to comment on today I've heard the same thing so I mean what Jack is saying is is correct it's just when you're telling someone who's working at a factory but that's that's the thing the thing is when it was clipped out of context which he provided that context in the source content then everyone started attacking him and that's why I'm saying like well maybe people are just so quick to anger on that's the the problem everyone just wants to get angry online of something yes and it's easier with clipped content which is what I'm saying which is I think you got to seek out the context 100% I use the clip Services how many people care to seek out the context like something like that people on the internet you see that I don't care about com see that write a little nasty comment feel good and then just you know just go as a Creator as Creator I care I do think that sometimes this was out of context is incorrectly Ed and used as a defense of the indefensible and sometimes I'll joke with my audience I'll say you know here's the clip and here's an extra minute before it and here's an extra two minutes before it the only context that could change the meaning is if in the 5 seconds before the clip the person said I'm about to make a joke and I don't mean what I'm going like sometimes that's the only context and Destiny recently did this I think and he got clipped and he even said I it's something about the Israeli Palestinian conflict something like he gets paid by Israel he said I'm say something that's not true if I remember correctly let's see if it gets clipped out of context and then he said I get paid by Israel 30,000 millions of views and it got millions of VI that happened that happened to us too recently actually we made a a joke to Sam and Colby who were on the podcast and we said that Mr B sold his channel for5 billion to Disney they're like what no way and they were like yeah just sold it he's not going to appear on his channel anymore it's but like a second afterwards we're like no just joking no he didn't do that so it was a joke and yeah we all laughed like oh you got us we like all right done but then we saw it on Twitter getting millions of views and and Jimmy even responded to it saying no I did not have to sell my channel to Disney and then he posted another tweet later that day and he said people are making up lies about me or whatever first I did this and then second I sold my channel to Disney what's going on with information flipped out of context but it was you know mhm clip anything you want I feel like just seeing some clips and maybe seeing like even what the people are voting for on the opposition I feel feel like listening to a huge pundit on the other side whether that's Tucker whether that's Ben could be beneficial in long form I I have to do I have to fit a lot of prep into a short period of time so the the only practical way for me to do my show I can't I just can't watch all that stuff it's you know you I figure out here's a group of uh uh clip Services I follow here's some newsletters here's the you know five sources I'll look at and I'll look at what people email me and see what's trending on my subreddit and then okay let me pick seven to eight things to talk about today and then once I've chosen them now I'll go in and do the deeper dive so like as an example if I see on a clip I think recently on a clip service I saw a clip what is a clip Service uh there's different there's different um newsletters that people write that include sort of like a here's what happened there's like for example decoding Fox News is one who she's on X and she does Fox News follow what what's being discussed on Fox News specifically is she leaning to a certain side leans left yeah I mean I think anybody who's critically clipping Fox News is going to be on the left at this point in time so I might see one clip from her and then I'll say this is interesting let me research more and then I'll go and I'll find oh actually there's four different things with context that would be interested in talking about the clip gives me the idea to then go and see what was the full context of the of the thing is it a good topic or not uh that's kind of more my Approach so what clip services do you use or what research do you do on a daily basis to give you the opinion of the people on the right so it's it's topic dependent okay so for example the bidens on drugs thing right I decided enough people are talking about bidens on drugs that I want to talk about it the day after State of the Union so then I went and found what did Hannity say about it what did uh Fox and friend say about it what was on real America's voice all these different channels what about writing are more serious conservative uh uh pundits writing seriously about Biden's on drugs not that I could find so that's interesting it's interesting that it's a story that's playing really well in audiovisual media and in rapid response but you aren't seeing written stuff about Biden was clearly on some kind of upper or whatever the case may be then I'll go on Reddit on like the conservative Forum I'll look for posts about what do you guys think Biden's clearly hopped up I'll look at the comment is there dissent among those on the right or are they like Biden's obviously on drugs to try to get a sense of what what are what are we seeing from different people about this one of my favorite things that Ben does on his Daily Show is he provides with context a lot of different material from people on the left and then immediately talks about it and he does that for a long time and I know you do some similar stuff on your show but I think that that is one of the most effective things that he does and I feel like that could be an interesting thing to consider I I think I do that pretty regularly I don't know I see a lot more on Ben show okay I think he has a much longer show than I do also yeah so what policies do you like that are more conservative I mean listen this is I I every time I bring this up um I get people writing to me saying that's your opinion now because you're more successful and stand to benefit from it but actually this has been my position since I was 18 and I started thinking about some of this stuff um I don't love the idea of just raise taxes raise taxes raise taxes endlessly create higher and higher tax brackets with higher and higher marginal tax rates I want to first look at how can we more efficiently use the money that we're already collecting from taxpayers and I don't have the same reflexive just jackup tax rates that some people on the left have I I find that there's a lot of other stops on the trip so to speak before just cranking up tax rates now when I look at the the big discussion in the United States right now among the majority of the country is like should the top tax rate be 35 or 38 as reasonable as is possible and make sense and also we need to make sure that the basic Public Services uh and safety nets are properly funded that I think we should have which are good for everybody right I mean listen I am able to um you know when when people threaten me there are resources where if I have a serious threat a specific threat I can send those threats to these are taxpayer funded law enforcement organizations that are going to investigate and are going to try to figure out is this person a legitimate thread and we've had situations like that and the FBI has shown up at people's doors I benefit from that so it makes sense that we collect tax money for that my uh Team drives to work on roads that are taxpayer funded they had public educations on which they learned to write and think in ways that are now beneficial to me as an employee right so my point here is I don't fetishize just cranking up taxes my instinct is hey let's figure out how to better use the taxes we're collecting so I think there's some on the on the left uh I um on nuclear energy I'm not going around advocating for nuclear energy but my view on it has changed dramatically because a lot of the fear-mongering on the dangers of nuclear is based on 50-year-old technology where if we were to start building new nuclear these the technology has changed completely and on a per kilowatt uh uh basis is the safest uh um high production energy that there is now I'm not going around going rah rah let's build nuclear but I think that's some on the left who just go oh nuclear disaster most dangerous thing I just don't think that the science bears that out GMO Foods is another example again I don't think this is conservative but I think that there are some on on the left who hear me say what I'm about to say and they go you sold out to big agriculture I've researched extensively and interviewed multiple experts on this I found no evidence that eating GMO food is unhealthy it is true that some foods are genetically modified such that they can tolerate the use of pesticides the pesticides which are apparently very unhealthy for for human health but just the nature of food being GMO I've not found that the concerns from some on the left about that are warranted and there are people who hear me say that and they're like oh you sold out to to Big agriculture so those are a few things that come to mind well let's talk about taxes for a moment uh I tend to agree with you on a lot of those stances in terms of tax rates why does it seem though that a lot of the democratically Run states are failing more so than the Republican states because California is a great example of taxing at the highest level I they just raised it to 14.4% this year the top tax rate in what sense is California failing homeless okay prices roads quality of life congestion how's crime in California crime is down nationally significantly and you can always find specific places where a certain type of crime is up I don't know if you guys have looked at the crime rates they are down significantly from the Trump era but this is bigger than Biden and Trump I'm not even saying it's because of anything they've done crime rates have been declining for 30 years so they're down how is it in California in which I I don't know specifically in which part what I've seen uh firsthand is San Francisco and Los Angeles which have been hor so here's my thought on this um in terms of makers versus takers the blue states are the makers that are disproportionately paying in federal funds to the federal government and the red states are the takers meaning that they are subsidized by the blue States why is this bunch of different reasons in general the blue states have significantly more Dynamic economies that tend to have multiple Industries rather than uh red states which often depend on one or two uh Industries so that makes the red States less Dynamic per capita incomes are higher in blue states it is true that cost of living is higher in a lot of blue States cost of living generally is a function of demand a lot of people want to live in California that's why they're willing to pay what it costs to live there because it's worth it to them for one reason or another now I think the exception to this is housing policy in a lot of States really limits the amount of new housing that can be built and one of the best ways that we could reduce the cost of housing would be building way more units unfortunately a lot of the zoning and other housing regulations that many right- Wingers favor limit the amount of housing that can be built so I would love to see a lot of these conservatives who say that the blue states are too expensive um kind of put their money where their mouth is and not block initiatives to make it easier to build more housing units so that's one thing if you look at California I don't know 2023 but in the last few years California actually had a surplus number two California on a per capita basis has some of the highest levels of innovation by patents uh in the world if California were a country it would be one of the most dynamic economies in the world so this isn't about I've never lived in California I have no particular reason to defend California um but California gets a really bad rap and a lot of the realities about California like why are there a lot of homeless people in California uh the weather is really good and to some degree people go where they perceive that they are going to be treated better to some degree I don't have any problem with treating homeless people well I think it's being bungled to a great degree right I mean I think that there's a much better way to do is as as I said if we just paid a house feed and for medical care what we would save in terms of policing and medical expenses and all these different things would be dramatic but a lot of the reasons that California is expensive is because it's in demand I don't see how California can be in demand could you elaborate how it is in demand haven't they had a net migration loss over the last couple of years yeah like the Surplus I think you alluded to and I remember seeing this I don't have the specifics but I believed it was mostly people earning under a certain amount were moving to California and people earning over an amount were leaving so the Surplus was defined as people uh who weren't contributing as much tax-wise as California lost okay that was my understanding of that but I don't have it in front of me yeah I think we would still agree that a surplus is a sign of more economic health than a deficit right I mean for whatever reason who those who those people are like I think Elon Musk would be equivalent to how many tens of thousands of people in terms of economic Prosperity yeah like okay I I think we're getting a little bit in in in the weeds though but so I think where where I kind of zoom out to on this continues to be um in terms of uh top educational attainment in institutions mostly blue States per capita income higher in blue States paying in more being being the subsidizes I mean if you split the country into blue and red States the red State country would not be viable it would be too dependent on a small number of Industries it would be running at a deficit um so I don't see the truth of the argument that the blue states are failing now when it comes to Crime I'm open to figuring out well where you know Oklahoma City has a higher violent crime rate than New York City these are per capita rates obviously adjusted to the population you don't hear too much about that but what's going on in Oklahoma City what's what's the problem in Oklahoma City that they have a higher crime rate than New York City doesn't really make super hot headlines for Fox to talk about Oklahoma City instead they talk about New York City but I I think with a lot of this stuff you got to go beyond the headlines all right let's talk about Trump versus Biden uh what is a Mago Republican someone who votes Trump I mean let's start there right I mean a magga republican is a republican unlike Mitt Romney who has said I'm for low taxes low regulation the things that conservative Republicans traditionally stood for but Trump's gone too far uh he's humiliated us on the world stage the things he has said and done the inciting of January 6th uh his glamorizing about authoritarian dictators these things just you know you can't do it Full Assault civil liable for ETC so if you're a republican that's supporting Trump not at all like what I just described is Mitt Romney you're a Maga Republican I think that's where I'd start if you vote for Trump you are a magga republican well I don't think there's any I mean this is just my opinion I don't think there's any particular definition right sure based off your I think there are probably some reluctant Trump voters who maybe would say listen I'm not Maga I just think Biden's worse and maybe to some degree reluctantly they're voting for Trump uh it seems that there's fewer of those now than there were in 2016 and 2020 given that Biden's been president almost four years and everything's more or less okay we can you know get into details if you guys disagree uh but I think that for the most part magga Republican means you're voting you're voting Trump what do you think is going going to change if anything if Biden remains in office policy-wise I expect more of the same I mean hopefully he'll tackle cannabis if he gets a second term I would love to see him tackle it now but doesn't seem to be a priority we're talking about legalizing it taxing it at minimum DEC I don't I don't from what I've read I don't think that he could uh issue a federal dictate to legalize recreationally in all states I don't think he could do that but decriminalize and reschedule certainly at minimum I I would expect more of the same which I think is pretty okay uh and but I think the other aspect to this would be if Trump does lose in 2024 uh he'll claim he won almost certainly he's already saying the only way he'll lose is if it's rigged you be the judge as to whether that's true but it may finally put the nail in the coffin of magat trumpism so it's possible that Biden will be I mean obviously if Democrats win the house and retain the Senate then there will really be a mandate especially if magat trumpism is kind of beaten beaten back but you may even have more Republicans that are kind of willing to say yeah I reluctantly went along with it but there are things that have been um not done not achieved which we're willing to work with Biden on so I'm I'm kind of cautiously optimistic and what's interesting is this is very much counter I continue to tell my audience Trump winning would be way better for my show like financially for me Trump winning and the interest that is generated when you have such a radical you know comical in the worst sense sense of the word person in the White House it generates so much interest for the type of work I do it'll be worse for me as an individual in the sense of my show but I think it would be by far the better thing for the country why do you think Trump has a personal interest in being president if you're putting yourself in Trump's shoes why does he want to be president versus Biden I think this time around Trump is very much motivated by the perception that it may keep him out of prison to become president I think also it's ego- driven which is he he he took a loss in 2020 and he doesn't want that to be his legacy so he sees this as the way to uh redeem himself in some way so I think it's ego ego-driven narcissism and the belief that it may keep him out of prison and then what about Joe Biden I think Biden does not really want to do this and he's even said I didn't necessarily think I was going to run for re-election but now that it looks like Trump is the nominee and he could win it seems that Biden recognizes if he quits now Trump probably wins because at this point replacing a candidate would be very chaotic but back let's say a year or so ago eight months ago I mean we still knew Trump was going to run again yeah do you think that a different person on the left would have been a more formidable opponent against Trump or do you think Joe Biden is the best option I talked about this in a spirited way with Jen yuger from The Young Turks recently my view is that it sort of has to be Biden now this is different than I think Biden is the most electrifying candidate I could imagine he's not and if it were up to me back in 20120 uh I would have gone with someone younger I do think that the next generation is ready I think Biden recognizes that he says I'm elderly you know I'm doing this because I think I'm the person most positioned as an incumbent to win and I think to go to your question even eight or 10 months ago Biden knew and I also looking at the data that incumbent presidents get reelected 75% of the time and when the economy is good and we can debate whether it is I don't know if you guys agree but I think the econom is pretty good by most metrics when the economy is good it's even higher than 75% that's much more likely to get you your guy in the Oval Office than starting to look for someone at this point in time and having to explain why Biden isn't running I think that there's a lot of political risk to that Jen didn't agree yeah I think it really just depends on who you ask in terms of is the good or bad I think for people who are invested in the markets they see prices at alltime highs home values at alltime highs their Investments are doing really well but for anybody else who's not invested in the market they just see Rising prices they miss the boat on housing and stocks are at all-time highs even when inflation declines if it's over zero things are still getting more expensive there's no doubt about that so sometimes I'll talk to people on my show and and we'll say hey inflation's down and they're like yeah but prices are up yes they are because even at 2.8% they're still going up from the already high jump was high you're starting off here and the jump is 30% and your income's G up even 5 10% there's still too much of a difference for over the recent period wages are outpacing inflation which is a good thing there's something interesting in polling which is if you ask people how is the economy doing the numbers are improving but a lot of people still say the economy is not doing that well if you ask people how are you doing way more people say oh I'm I'm doing well I'm actually I have a job we're at almost full employment wages recently have been rising faster than inflation yeah things are expensive because we had the but there's a question as to how an an individual is doing and their perception of how the economy is doing the economic opinion is starting to come around my sense is if nothing disastrous happens GDP unemployment wage growth I mean alltime High stocks a lot of these things look pretty good historically if nothing happens between now and November I think Biden's well positioned to win who do you think is more mentally sharp Joe Biden or Donald Trump boy where do we even jump this is this is a good topic I like this top or just suffering from age maybe yeah so I want to go you answer I interviewed a what do you mean how do you answer that I'm going that's what a lot of people are saying lot people are saying yes a lot of people saying a lot of stuff related to I agree with you it's absolutely true interviewed a couple experts on this recently Dr Harry seagull Dr John Gartner here's their consensus opinion and then if there's a different view from a psychologist or psychiatrist I want to interview them on my show I want to hear the other side okay but how they out uh info davidpakman.com so far here's what the doctors John gner and Harry seagull have told me on the Biden side what they see is normal age related um characteristics of someone who has had a stutter his entire life and physically is definitely more frail than he was 10 years ago he's walking gingerly this includes that sometimes he's speaking slowly a low energy manner sometimes he'll say things that are inaccurate now one of the big differences that the doctors pointed out as compared to Trump is that when Biden makes one of these mistakes he will either immediately or very quickly correct himself in other words he's not lacking context and in this kind of mental fog where he doesn't even know what he's saying he'll pretty quickly correct himself in MO most cases with Trump what these same doctors observed is that he will say things that make no sense whatsoever either pheic paraphasias these are where you you sort of you're trying to say one thing but you can't say it and you repeat a different wrong thing sometimes it's a it's a non-word multiple times and then kind of bail like there was this recent thing where he said oh and you know Saudi your at uh and then he just could not speak and had to move on in his speech or when he talks about um sometimes with certain words instead of establishment he'll go EST estabish and he'll just have to move on or when he'll say you know uh uh what was it that he said who was it that uh Nikki Haley was in charge of security on January 6th Nikki Haley is in charge of security you know it's crazy and she did nothing about it you know Nikki Haley Nikki Haley Nikki Haley Haley yep it was crazy and he doesn't realize he's repeating Nikki Haley he's he Nikki Haley had nothing to do with that it was Nancy Pelosi he doesn't realize that he's doing it and that's a big red flag they called it a uh a neurological red flag or ticking Time Bomb when I interviewed them so their view is that Trump seems if you know what to look for way worse off couple other things that some have commented on I don't know if you guys have seen the way that when Trump stands he hinges forward at the waist in a really strange way almost seems to defy gravity you can look it up online now some people say it's his lifts that he wear but others have suggested that that combined with sort of dragging of his right leg is a potential sign of a cognitive issue as well again this is all from only from what you see online it's not somebody who's evaluated in person so it makes it sometimes difficult and so that there's a lot of different different issues here he seems to do worse at night which is sometimes something called Sund Downing that happens with uh Alzheimer's dementia and cognitive decline now nobody I've talked to said that Trump is deeply cognitively compromised but they are finding that it's happening more and more frequently where it used to be like once a month he'd say Obama's the president right now he often says it multiple times in a single rally now and doesn't correct himself and when he's called out on it he'll go that was satire it's like satire you have no sense of humor no sense of satire and there was no indication that you knew what you were saying so there's a lot of these kind of red flags from the folks I've spoken to so you think that he is more impaired I spilling my water that not impaired sh you should run for president uh I can't I was wasn't born in the US so I I need Arnold to get the Arnold do you think that should stay real quick yes or no no I think I should be allowed to run okay yeah for sure um the other thing with Trump is WRA your little thing there's no qu I can just avoid the puddle if okay I'll get it go ahead the um the other thing that is absolutely the case is Trump blasts his face with self-tanner and dyes his hair and I believe has had you know pretty significant uh thank you this is great I've never seen this on an episode before I love that oh I've I've spilled one broke the glass on an episode before yeah we put that in the intro too I appreciate that um you know he you you don't think Joe Biden does anything to his face to make it look more alive I don't know if he's you know there's there's the idea that he had a facelift maybe he did but Biden's let his hair go totally white and he's pretty pale and so I do think that that makes Trump look healthier in a very particular way on physical health you know Biden exercises Trump doesn't Trump obese and he a terrible diet I feel like Trump has better physical health than Joe Biden Trump's obese I don't know about that he he is definitely large yeah but if if you're talking like coordination and like I feel like I haven't seen Trump like fall too many times and he plays golf still Trump again so the dragging the right leg thing is something some people are looking at you might remember when the general had to walk him down the aisle at West Point and it looked sort of strange listen b Biden looks sort of frail I I don't want to deny to the there he absolutely is looking sort of frail he's wearing sneakers reportedly because it's more comfortable he walks better in them is coming down the low stairs off of Air Force One he's in his 80s there's no question about it but I think that there's the perception because of Trump's uh Tanning and hair dye and the hair transplant he looks more robust there's no doubt about his voice is stronger also which increases the perception of his health there's there's no doubt so you would say it seems as though there has been more decline on Trump and he is currently mentally and physically probably worse off than I only am going by the professionals I've spoken to because I'm this is not my area of expertise what do you think the chances are that there will be election fraud in 2024 Define election fraud what is your definition of election fraud it depends on what the purposes are of defining it I recently interviewed Ken Block Ken Block was hired by the Trump campaign to find the fraud that they were arguing happened he found very small numbers of um qu I use this in quotes because it's not really quote dead people voting so dead people voting can be someone who submitted an absentee ballot and died before November dead people voting can be someone showing up and saying I am exp person or filling out an absentee ballot for someone that has died a couple different things that dead people voting can mean sometimes it's confusion between Junior and senior like father son sometimes senior has passed away Junior votes it's credited as it had been having having been senior it's still only one vote but technically it was someone who voted in the name of a dead person he found you know we're talking about in all the states they had them look at a few dozen examples of all of these different things maybe hundreds total so it wouldn't even have been enough to have any impact whatsoever now in do we care about that sure we would love the we would love the number to be zero why not right it would be great to have zero examples of this but in a country with 340 million people and you know 155 million 160 million votes with margins that at their smallest were in the tens of thousands there was nothing even approaching 1% of what it would would have taken um to make a difference in even a single state do I think that it's likely that someone will vote twice in 2024 or someone will submit an absentee ballot in someone else's name either accidentally or deliberately significant amount no you think that there will not be a significant amount of election fraud in 2024 Define significant significant meaning it makes an impact no okay yeah and the reason why is uh it just hasn't happened I can't say ever because I'm not a student of every presidential election but certainly um in the last 20 plus years it just hasn't happen this is kind of a random question but it's something I'm very interested in we've never asked anybody about this uh oh what do you think and I know this happens a lot on both sides of the aisle this is the famous one though of course oh boy of Nancy Pelosi's trading techniques so what do do you mean the stuff with her husband or just the timing of the trade Investments and the timing and the success I think buying calls on you know Nvidia which is I think it's I think it's very suspect I would like to see something much more extensive than what's already in law passed where neither you nor your immediate family are allowed to trade I mean listen I'd have to devotee a little more time to it I think certainly individual stocks uh what about mutual funds I I don't know I I think you shouldn't be forced to divest if you're serving in the house or Senate but you probably have to say I'm either selling everything or I'm locking in and I can't touch it while I'm in office see I think that you should either there's a few options one is just uh index funds and ETFs just ride the entire Market that's the most easy to implement but the other thing is right now there's a 30-day where it's like 45 days um uh notifying period if you buy a stock you have 30 days to discl it's not the exact amount it's a range that you have yeah it's a range like 0 to 10 10 to 50 50 to 100 it's pretty big uh but the penalty on that is like a few hundred like is very little so if they report two weeks late on that and they report two months in it's not that big of a deal I think it'd be interesting to have it live so that if you want to make a trade it has to be publicly available for 24 hours and all of that should be like at this point we shouldn't any reason why it can't be live like on techologically speaking can on a on a dashboard somewhere you know congress's trades and you see the upcoming trades for one day just has to be public and then they're allowed to trade whatever they want to but it's there public could do with it whatever they want to I don't know what would be legal and feasible my inclination is to want that level of transparency and as is always the case when you talk about imposing restrictions on public officials you'll have some people who come out and say well you know you're going to dis the more restrictions you put in you're going to disincentivize people from even wanting to run that's not always necessarily bad you might disincentivize some people from running who we don't necessarily want if their goal is to legislate in order for you know to to impact their own Pockets now I don't know enough about the specific trades Nancy Pelosi made I know that there was a Tesla related trade that garnered some controversy I don't know enough about exactly what she did to be able to come here and say she def definitively was acting on inside information it's I just don't know enough about it but my instinct is we we need more restrictions here we need more transparency um and uh that that's always my inclination yeah I will put up some data a screenshot right here to either approve or deny what I'm about to say but if I remember correctly a recent very famous trade Nancy did was she bought I think it was around a million dollar or high six figures worth of Nvidia calls which call options are something that you do to leverage your money yes so she's extremely bullish on something and also if public data is true that her net worth is right around a certain amount she put in a significant amount of her net worth in something that is highly speculative yeah which I think already looks a little bit suspicious and then of course it went up some crazy I think the argument is that she's passing legislation or on boards that has a direct impact on the stock AB that's really what it is but you but you can reverse engineer that from I know she also had some bad remember there was the the Pelosi tracker in like 20121 she had a series of really bad calls there when the market dropped not winners few people got fired and then the trades got better TR got better she started legislating a little more no Roblox is a big one I think she put some money on that it lost almost all I heard she's actually like a leaderboard player in Roblox and that's how she was familiar with the trades that makes perfect sense to me yeah no listen I uh she's she's obviously not the only person doing this but she speaker of the house she was getting a lot of attention I do think her net worth numbers are like inclusive of or related to her husband yeah so I think that's a factor that which probably makes it not nearly as much of their Collective net worth but I don't have listen the last the last thing I'm going to do is defend Democrats or Republicans trades that look at all suspect or lacking transparency yeah let's talk about the Border this seems to be a very pressing topic right now you said on your podcast this was two days ago oh boy I don't remember what I said here we go he said speaking of Maga lunatics who are disgustingly serving as the lap dogs of insanity we've now learned who will be the impeachment managers for Republicans processing an impeachment against the Secretary of homeand Homeland Security Alejandro mayorcas how do you think mayorcas has performed as director of Homeland Security which is a job that that's main responsibility is to counter terrorism and enhance security secure and manage our borders I think that his performance has been unremarkable in the way that many secretaries of Homeland Security have been I the first thing is I draw a distinction between the border and terrorism now the the first part is sometimes the framing on some of these issues from the right uh I don't think is accurate and in this case these allegations that there are endless terrorists coming in over the US Mexico border that quote and these are not words I use but that mental institutions are being emptied into the United States you know a lot of these claims are being made totally without evidence a lot of the claims about fenil or fentol as some on the right call it I don't know why they say that but that's that's what they say uh being trafficked over the US Mexico border um to a great degree precursor chemicals are being flown in a lot of it is coming in through legal ports of Entry so like it it's not totally untrue but it's only a fraction of it you know with a lot of this stuff there's a bunch of different Distortion and half truths right but do you think so far he has done a good job um fortifying the southern border I don't know that by by fortification I know exactly what you mean there have been a couple of changes from Trump to Biden they've not been super significant one related to title 42 and the justification of covid for the faster deportation of individuals that was was that the remain in Mexico uh yes exactly so that's been a change but there have not been dramatic changes to border patrol budgets I mean here here's my honest opinion about this I've said before uh although the facts are that documented and undocumented immigrants commit crime at a lower rate than natural born citizens countries have a right to have immigration policy enforce it deportations are legal you know I'm not someone this exists on on the left but I'm not someone who just goes everyone period should be just allowed in we should have an open border my family did it legally we were not in as dire situation of some as some of the folks that are coming and and seeking Asylum seeking Asylum is legal so we just need to adjudicate that more quickly for me the the real issue is I see this entire thing two days after Biden became president they were talking about the Border nothing had dramatically changed in those two days what did change a Democrat was in the white house that's all that changed those two days so it was two days after they started talking about it but then shortly afterwards didn't he resend all of the Border polic or not all of the Border policy but a good amount of the Border policy that was instated by trump it wasn't so much about resending but they more actively started trying to reconnect families that had been separated there still border separations happening but it's it's fewer I think my point is this I we we should have a border all Norm we got to deal with Visa overstays which isn't a sexy topic so they never talk about that all of these things should be dealt with but right now the idea that things are dramatically disastrous under Biden compared to how they were under Trump is a reaction to the fact that they don't really have anything to run on which is why they're running on Biden crimes that don't exist at least as far as they've been able to find evidence and they're running on the border because the economy is as we talked about by most economic metrics pretty good student loan forgiveness some improvements on Healthcare and Healthcare access negotiating Pharma costs infrastructure bill so they just don't really have anything right but but on the border wasn't there a lot more strict policy on how you can enter the United States when Trump was president and then a a lot of that was rescinded by Biden when he got into office the only thing I'm aware of being rescinded is title 42 I am not an expert on the border but the only thing I'm aware of that functionally changed was title 42 do you think title 42 would be a good thing obviously I know why it was instated which was the whole using covid as a reason but do you think that that is a reasonable let's say framework for new policy to be inated to prevent or to limit and filter the immigration a little bit more the problem with it is it's going to put a lot of people in really dangerous and risky situations so I know that there's a lot of discussion about false and bogus Asylum claims um those have to be figured out and weeded out I think it's actually easier to do that when individuals come and present themselves at the border rather than filing some form from southern Mexico or whatever the case may be so I I think we risk assuming we have empathy and concern for folks with legitimate Asylum claims in Mexico or countes South I think the way to keep them safest is to allow them to make that claim at the border what I think is problematic is not that bogus asy Asylum claims are being granted it's that the process is so slow that it's taking too long and a lot of the complaints from the right about you know these these people dehumanizing language they enter our country and then you don't know where they go and bahah and then they never show up if the Asylum system moved more more quickly you would cut down on a ton of that so I think we need more immigration judges I have a lot of I have friends in Border Patrol and uh uh Customs they all say we we need way more immigration judges to adjudicate more quickly do you think that we should be trusting people that come to the southern border and my understanding is all you have to say is I fear from my government wherever I'm coming from I fear that they're going to come after me or something you are filtered then into the United States with an eventual court date and I don't think that there is any incentive to actually show up to this court date there is that's it's a very complicated question that's all you need to initially say but these from again from what I understand from my friends and colleagues that are in Customs and Border enforcement Etc the Asylum process is more than just that initial statement that's just how you're basically declaring I'm seeking Asylum then there is an adjudication process my understanding is the adjudication process is not a corrupt non-functional process it's just that it takes too long and there's not enough immigration judges involved that's my understand right now so you think so far in the years of of Biden's presidency this immigration the whole I guess thing going on with immigration is so far fine or so far sub fine there has been undocumented immigration to the United States for a really long time the numbers of those encountered Crossing illegally es and flows for a lot of different reasons including combination of policy seasonally covid and different reasons it's it's not unique to the Biden Administration that people are entering the US illegally is it a problem that some people who enter the US illegally commit crimes that's absolutely a problem they happen to commit them at a lower rate than natural born citizens but crossing the border illegally is a crime yes oh and you're you're eligible for deportation uh it is a misdemeanor it's not a felony which I you know there's people who don't understand that you're eligible for deportation countries have a right to enforce border policy all of the no argument from me on that but the Border enforcement so far has been fine if the standard for fine is no one has crossed illegally it's not been fine under Biden and it's not been fine under Trump my standard is that we need to be doing a combination of things we aren't doing to dramatically reduce the amount of people who try to cross neither Biden nor Trump nor Obama did them those things are you've got to punish the companies that are hiring undocumented immigrants because if you don't the incentive them to keep coming over here by the way to work in really difficult jobs often in in poor conditions right so this is not easy work but you've got to do something about the companies that are doing the hiring not enough is being done there in theory it's against the law very little prosecution of that we should be working with the source countries that folks are coming from to change the economic circumstances that make them take the risks of coming here in the first place we're not doing that we've got to deal with Visa overstays which is a big aspect of it that doesn't get a lot of attention we need to more quickly adjudicate Asylum claims we've got to do something permanent on DACA meaning those who were um minors when they came here there's this long list of stuff that needs to be done it's not fine overall it's not fine now it hasn't been for decades it's not specially bad under Biden is my view so it's not changing anything with the immigrants that are coming through the Border but it's reforming things that are already existing internally such as putting a little bit more burden or pressure onto corporations and then working like you said with the source countries not necessarily stopping I I you know obviously for lack of a better term stopping with the direct immigrants crossing the border like hey you can't do that completely fine to do that I have no problem with enforcing that you should not be allowed to do that my point is it's not an acutely bad problem right now and if these right-wingers were really serious about dealing with the problem and the same thing applies to Democrats who also haven't fixed it if they were really serious about the problem there's five or six other things they don't even have any interest in talking about to put their money where their mouths are they just want to talk about the physical border because it's what's politically Salient right now do you think we would have been better off if Trump had built the wall no no do you think that we should have a wall on our Southern border I have no problem with a wall legally the problem I had with Trump's plan was it's absurd to think that it will really solve the problem because number one you could scale the wall with $90 worth of Home Depot Parts as as has been widely demonst there are Parts where you wouldn't be able to build a border Trump said we don't need to worry about that because there's water but people can cross the water number three it doesn't deal with Visa overstays number four it doesn't deal right so again it gets back to the same list and he was using it as a cudel not as a cudle he was using it as a one of his many deceptions by saying I'm going to build this wall in four years and Mexico will pay for it those are outright lies a physical impossibility to do that in four years and Mexico was never going to pay for it and it was another one of the promises that he used with this populist rhetoric to sort of coales Voters over things that obviously weren't going to happen so for that reason Not only was it not the solution to the immigration problem he claimed it to be it was unbelievable from the get-go and and farsal that it would even be a possibility to do but do you think eventually it would be a good idea to try to get a wall down there I know you said it won't solve illegal immigration but I do think it can deter some and prove it there's no question that physical barriers will have some deterrent effect but a lot of what I've read is that it will shift to other venues ports of entry and mechanisms of Entry so again I don't consider myself an expert on this issue but I talk to people in Border Patrol that I know and in other departments and they all say not not all there are people in Border Patrol who love the idea of a wall the folks I know say the wall is fine but we need so many other things that aren't being done including the list that I gave so yes or no for the wall I am not an advocate of pushing for a wall I'm absolutely fine with physical barriers being erected I think they are not a particularly good use of money and I don't think they will be particularly effective but from Le there's no issue you know people say oh it's illegal to we can build a wall places have walls you could do it I would be more inclined to negotiate on a wall by the way I I think the the money isn't really what what it would cost to doesn't sound worth it but I'd be willing to negotiate on a wall if we could get permanent docka status a commission to focus on um going after the companies doing the hiring all the other things I mentioned I'd be willing to throw the bone of the wall and waste some amount of money on it if they'd be willing to do all the other stuff that I think will be really effective do you know how much a wall would cost I don't remember it was extensively studied at the beginning nobody has for for years now Biden hasn't been trying to build a wall so I don't remember I think it was something on the order of 15 billion is that possible that's it 20 20 I don't remember that does not sound like a lot of I really don't remember what were your thoughts on Google's famously coined woke AI Gemini what were your thoughts on that the Gemini one was the one where it was putting uh historically inaccurate races for certain generative image corre requests and then you could ask questions like should I be ashamed of my white pride or should I be ashamed of my black pride and it would give varying answers to effectively the same question okay that part I didn't look at I I mean to me it seems that if what is the point of the tool if the point of the tool is historical accuracy it seems that some of the images I saw where there was a black person in a role where we know that there were not black Geor Washington was black or something like that yeah I mean I don't think there's any problem with going to an AI and saying can you generate an image of a George Washington like figure dressed in Period clothing that is uh black that doesn't seem problematic in principle to me I think where the problem maybe came in was in some of the more automated I I don't even know if assumptions is the right word because it's just an AI but it seemed that the problem was some of the historical inaccuracies and maybe insens I think it was written in to combat some historical bias and make it more um equal to all Races something was written in there and the AI took that and then manufactured images that were not hisorical repres prod historical photos of people that were white at all of anybody it wasn't doing it for a while yeah and then they they fixed that and then go back and now you can but I also heard that one AI that you could talk to and it started off as a clean slate but then after the first day didn't it turn like really racist and hateful which AI I don't know I remember hearing a story about this of just people were feeding it stuff and it turned like really hateful yeah I mean I think the point I was getting to is but one is Google this seems to be this seems to be based on the data that it's trained with um and the sort of guidelines that are established I think AI experts know a lot more about this this stuff than we do but for me the the concern to me is more about the purposes playing around with different racial characteristics to generate interesting images at at face value I'm not really worried about it it seems natural that it's something that the tools could do I think the question is big picture what is the trajectory of these tools I agree I think the bigger picture is definitely the concern obviously if you just look up a photo of someone and turns out in the photo they're black when in actuality they're not yeah no problem whatsoever in that it's just what does that symbolize or what does that indicate is going on behind like why is that happening yeah what do you think about Elon running Twitter do you think he's done a good job so far no I don't think he's done a good job from a business standpoint and I don't think he's done a good job from a um content standpoint uh I think from from a business standpoint it's matter of the numbers the Twitter blue flop was a brutal flop I me brutal brutal flop miscalculation I don't know but didn't didn't go well ad revenues down by some estimates uh the platforms lost 50 to 80% of the value relative to what he paid now you can argue he overpaid and it wasn't really worth that to begin with that that's fair in terms of the content I mean I'm I'm almost off the platform now other than like a private list of people I follow uh who are all kind of like Clippers and journalists so I can see what are they writing about in clipping and prep for my show but otherwise I'm off the platform because it's just become a cesspool for nonsense the verification uh you know the blue check mark used to be a useful tool to interact with certain people I know that's now gone so if I look at my verified feed if it even exists I don't I don't even know it's horrible but the one thing that I hate about Twitter recently is it any interesting thread that that I actually go watch yeah and you click it I'm actually interested to see like what are the responses it's like viral video meme meme meme viral video so everyone trying to get the clips of the videos there's no discussion anymore on twiter it's so difficult to find something that's not just Spam but they're all but they're all the Twitter blue so they of course they all get pushed to the time they pay seven bucks a month but they're just spamming these videos that don't have nothing to do with the topic that's a problem usable really the uh it it is basically unusable anytime I will randomly post something in the comments um it seems as though very roughly speaking 25% are like obvious just Spam messages insta replying with the link to some kind of trash 25% are uh just overtly anti-semitic attacks on me 25% is just general nonsense you know it's just it's just become a worthless platform for me I know there's a lot of people that are still on it and use it and like it but it's almost worthless I I I'll tweet like once every two months now what are your thoughts on transwoman competing against biological woman in sports depends on the sport and I think not enough is known about this yet uh so I think first of all I try to defer to peer-reviewed research and medical experts on this so I'm not super interested in what right-wing pundits or whatever have to say about it um from the research I've done and the peer-reviewed research that is out there it's not uh it's sort of of a complicated it's a more complicated issue I think than get men out of women's sports which is what you hear from Trump at rallies there are certain Sports where it really doesn't seem to matter sports like what equestrian archery um o others that you know there are sports that are gender segregated and don't really seem like they need to be there's um you can make the argument that there's gymnastics events that don't really need to be gender segregated that aren't based on strength so you've got a category of so so there's the totality of sports then you've got this gendered Sports so we're slicing slicing slicing some of these it doesn't really seem like it makes much of a difference there are others where if you look at some of the research data if you were to restrict it to um uh assigned mail at Birth individuals who have been on the right hormone treatments for X period of of time that the performance Advantage Falls within a standard deviation which basically means like it's within the normal variability you would expect among those born biologically female or assigned female at Birth so like that would be an argument to me for saying in those cases it doesn't doesn't really matter my kind of take on this is I think a lot of this stuff is new enough that we don't have every answer yet uh there are some who are really using this to c find a new Public Enemy Number One for a while it was gay men now it's moved on to the trans Community to scapegoat in some cases I'm against that I'm for treating everybody with dignity so yeah you know I think I I don't I don't have an answer it's it seems obvious that in some sports it doesn't make sense and it should be okay to say that and it also seems like in some sports it really doesn't make a difference and we're still learning about other sports we're still learning about the impact you know there's those who say David you know muscle mass doesn't matter because there's something about the angle of the hips to the femur that on I'm just not sure about that yet we're still learning about a lot of this stuff and then the other thing I'll say is a lot of athletic institutions have already been dealing with this for decades when it comes to intersex individuals and they have existing protocols which could be looked at and very few people who are just about get men out of women sports very few of them take the time to look and say oh how does the NCAA handle this or how does this or entity or that entity and I think there's a lot to glean from that there was a lot of data on inter sex people there's policies for how different athletic leagues uh handle those situations which could be instructive in thinking about uh this issue I I have never at least I don't think I've met like an intersex person and I don't I don't even know how many exist so I don't know if that's like it's like it's I think it's a third of 1% of people I heard that sounds really high I could be completely wrong SS L I think there's a couple things there's a couple things that go on there's a lot of I don't know if the right thing is to call it I want to be careful here I don't know if it's called a treatment Because treatment implies disease and I'm just not sure I think that there are interventions both both hor hormonally and surgically that are often done with folks that are born with different traits so that by the time they hit puberty one would not know because it's been dealt with in one way or another earlier in life so I think that that's part of it oh this is 1.7 oh hcr.org says that 1.7% of people are interex yeah so people born with sex characteristics uh that do not fit typical binary Notions of male or female bodies I was thinking 1% you said onethird of one maybe it's 17 Range High to me but then again I guess you wouldn't know if it in a lot you just get treated when you're a kid and your parents don't tell you I don't I don't know about don't tell you that that I I I I'm stepping out of uh my medical knowledge okay maybe we're all yeah yeah outside of the frame here but that's fascinating I had no idea it was that high think assum that point is there are resources that we could go to that have established protocols for this stuff which could be really instructive uh it would also be interesting to measure the difference in intersex people versus biological male or biological female because I don't know if there's even some like inner like middle I'm not sure you know um okay another thing that's really really popular right now is squatting do you see this as an issue or do you see this as something that is overblowing squatting as in occupying an OCC a house a house and stain it's blowing up I want to talk to this guy his name is Flash and he's the squatter squatter have you seen him making the rounds lately so he goes in and will squat on the squatters so imagine you're a homeowner and you get a squatter in your house you call this guy and he says don't worry I'll take care of it because the law says if the squatter claims they have a lease you have to go through the eviction process it could take months and squanders have the resources to extend that to years they could do certain things they can file for bankruptcy they can file certain position it'll take a long time so you call this guy flash you say hey flash I got a squatter he says don't worry you got five grand I'll take care of it but he does it legally he's not the type that goes and like you know bangs on the door and tries to forcibly remove them does it legally he says you sign a lease with me and now I have a legal right to the property and I could squat on the squatter so he goes in squats on the squatter they see him there and he has a legal right to set up cameras throughout the entire property with the exception of of a bedroom right so he goes in puts cameras everywhere and invites his buddies over to the house and says don't worry I got a sign lease just like you if you call the police I got a lease it's a civil matter you can't kick me out but I'm here with my buddies you could leave if you want to but uh oh by the way there cameras everywhere and most time they they leave but he posts the footage online and he's gotten this huge response from people he I think is really uh pushed such an initiative because of how ridiculous it is they're recently in Florida they just passed a bill uh against uh squatter protection so they made it a crime to falsify a lease they made it a crime to trespass on a property they really discouraged squatting and so I I hope California would be next but it's a big issue listen big picture uh I am completely infavor of homeowners being able to enforce their property rights I'm against squatting in principle I'm against it legally um and I think that in some cases the process for legally getting a water out is too long and convoluted so we're I'm 90% of the way to whatever right the other 10% that I think is important to bring up is the risk is you make it too easy uh for a legitimate tenant to be denied certain property right a certain they wouldn't be they'd be renters rights uh or to fully and properly have disputes adjudicated and so I think the one thing we want to balance with I mean listen obviously people who don't have a lease don't have a right to go and live and occupy an empty house there's no question about it what I would want to be sure is that we don't pass laws that allow um uh landlords to violate the lease or otherwise the housing rights of individuals who are legally so here's something I'm I was just thinking about um that would solve a lot of this is having all lease signatures verified or you get them notorized yeah with a photo or something like that is that not required I don't for agement no so in California what interesting if your leases I think it's either 30 days or 6 months a lease under that technically does not have to be in writing it could be a verbal agreement and that's just is binding in California for anything else you have a lease agreement that's signed but it does not need to be notorized okay so you could just show up and I could you know Forge Jack signature and say oh that's the Le there's your signature we signed it last night I think having notorized documents video photo proof at this point needs to exist in a database this is like hey I was here here's a notary a third party sign this and that way if you have a lease agreement that's not notorized with a photo or a video of the person signing it it's not good idea yeah it's an interesting idea and that may be specific to California some states may require a notorized I've seen it's it's not required to be notorized it's just a signature got it which is wild to me do you think the American dream is dead there is no question that when you have an economy as dynamic as the American economy with strong dozens or hundreds of strong Industries and the level of opportunity that exists to some degree the American dream is very much alive um th there is a a type of corruption that exists in some countries with regard to basic Public Services police contracts bureaucratic stuff that's not really a in the United States that Fosters opportunity to a great degree there are some things that are are working really well about the American dream in addition class Mobility is really low and so when you look at the statistics of How likely are you if you're born in the in the bottom 20% of society by family income How likely are you to get out of that um compared to if you are born wealthy or How likely are you to just stay there there's definitely a problem in terms of real real mobility and so I think there's still significant opportunity and there are also barriers to that opportunity this is not meant to be a gacha although it may seem like a gacha so just let me know if it is and we can just not answer it but I asked Destiny this and I thought it's an interesting question if you are poor in America today with no dependence no disability cognitive or physical between the ages of 20 and 60 is it your fault there's a bell curve right so if we take everybody born to a poor family and we put them on a bell curve you're going to have um a variety of outcomes that are going to be distributed at the tail end of that curve you're going to have some people who are born poor and end up in the 1% and then so we could start by saying well how did how did they do it is it just because they decided Well it's usually a combination of timing and odds as well as personality predisposition and factors sort of Beyond one's control I'll just give you an example as it applies to me right it's possible and sometimes articles are written about me where they say you know I am responsible for building this thing and I took the initiative and worked hard and blah blah blah the truth is that some of it was the environment I was born into in the sense that when I graduated from college and started working on my MBA I was still living at home so my expenses were such that and and you know my housing situation was stable such that I didn't have to work so could tool around and hang out try my podcast while I got my MBA and I didn't have any big pressing need to immediately start paying for housing right so that doesn't have anything to do with me in addition I'm willing to repeat the same thing day in and day out for years doing my show such that I build an audience and eventually I get to that escape velocity and then it starts growing some of it has to do with me some of it doesn't the timing was a factor I was doing it at the start of news and politics on YouTube that helped made it easier than starting right now it's a very specific to an individual thing there are certainly people who get to being 20 and they were born into poor families they were forced into H into finding some way to make money at 14 because otherwise the parents or the single parent weren't going to be able to make rent which took them out of school college was an impossibility they didn't have the social skills Etc can we say it's their fault that they're poor at 20 not really is it true that there is lots of opportunity and that with normal distribution some poor people will end up having positive outcomes in that environment sure that's true so it's complicated what are your thoughts on tipping culture in my view tipping really was created for those individuals who are in specific categories of service workers where they're not making a full wage that was the initial kind of point of it now it's everywhere you go to you know a B I said the other day I went to a bakery and I bought a $30 cake and it suggested a 20 30 and 40% tip and I'm kind of like well if you're making me a coffee but no but actually there is a baker but that's not the person who's getting the tip it's the person who put it in a box I I still tipped you know but I it to me it seems like a way that is pushing just higher prices on the consumer more subtly to get the employer out of just paying a higher wage that's my fun I heard a lot of the recent was because of square yes it's ALS that strip and pment processors take a slice of thep so they're incentivized to prop tips as well I believe that's where that like you know turn around and it's just standard on everything I paid a tip when I got my car smogged me too when you got your car what smogged what does that mean is that window tint smogged is when you have to go and see if your car has so every year you have to go and get your car small because it wouldn't really pass was it a bribe no it it was like a square thing and the percentages were your percentages the so I had like it's 18 22 25 no mine mine went up to 72% so I would every single time it's like memory of mine whenever that tipped prompt prompt comes up usually I click the top one so I accidentally when I got a smog test tipped 72% because it was just like robotic memory the smog I think was like 20 so it was a cheap smog and I think that's why they Justified the little I always do other I always do other and then I write in like $1 to $2 depending on what service is yeah obviously not for like a server but the reason I got heat with this was people wrote to me and said David you know you're in a position where this is just like a curiosity to you you don't know what it's like out there you're not depending on this money I'm sympathetic to all of that people also said you're kind of depending on tips yourself you have a membership program where in a sense you're giving away a podcast for free and hoping that some people will be nice enough to tip you through a membership program it's only one 10 one of 10 Revenue sources I'm totally sensitive to that my problem isn't with the workers that are struggling and who are being underpaid and put in a position where now they are counting or dependent on tips to afford even a basic living my my gripe is not with them it's the way that the combination of employers cynicism and payment processors wanting to take 3% of everything have combined to just P at the end of the day it's just passing more cost onto onto the consumer at the that that's what it is yes or no Progressive Penal on speeding tickets so if you make a lot of money you pay an $80,000 speeding ticket yes with a cap okay up to how much no idea you've interviewed Richard Spencer American Neo-Nazi anti-semitic conspiracy theorist and white supremacist you've also interviewed the Westborough Baptist Church as well they're famous for being extremely anti-semitic and homophobic how do you draw lines on who you're willing to talk to versus who you are not basically it's like a three-part test first question is are they purveyors of of ideas that are getting at least some attention or or uptake in general Society so like I don't interview the Westboro Baptist Church anymore because mostly we've moved beyond that type of overt homophobia it still exists but it's different now at the time when they were when I interviewed them there was still a movement that opposed gay marriage that was significant so first of all I was like these are these are ideas I find bad that are getting some people sucked in so I want to rebut them number two do I think that I can actually rebut them rather than provide a platform for them to evangelize cuz I wouldn't want to do that I wouldn't want to bring someone like them on and give them a platform where they might actually succeed at convincing people so I I want to make sure that I'm actually prepared if that's the case then I'll talk to whoever because I think that there's some greater good in doing it but there's extremists who have ideas that are so Niche that no one is following for it I don't find it worthy of confronting them and there could be extremists who are are extremists with bad ideas in an area I'm not well versed or prepared to contest I won't do that either now what if you lose a debate with one of these people let's say you bring them on they're extremists but they somehow just sound more confident they're more well-versed they start all the little fires you can't quite get them do you decide at that point to not post it it's never happened okay yeah I mean it's a good question which is would I decide not to post I don't know it's never happened what are your thoughts on pbd hiring quis Cuomo I have thoughts I actually love it and I know people are going to Flame me because all of his audience absolutely hates it I think it's an amazing I love it what are your thoughts I'm agnostic on it I'm I'm kind of confused by it honestly I mean I think I would need to know more about his vision for what he's doing which I don't know uh it's certainly an interesting it's getting people talking which some say is objectively a good thing but uh I I kind of has he started producing content seen him on some of they just did a live yesterday I haven't seen anything yet I I want to see it first so he he asks him like a contributor just like you know like Vinnie and and like Tom just asking him questions on what're discussing and does he live in Florida now I'm not sure but this was physically present in the studio I love this idea I think it opens up a lot of dialogue he has a lot of people listening to him so does pbd and finally I feel like we're having open discussions that's moving people forward I went to your Discord to ask your hyper fans for questions so I joined the Discord and I asked do you guys have any questions for David oh man I didn't I didn't hear about this for my mods this right here is is the question that I got there was one big question there were a few questions but there one that Rose above all of them I've never heard this asked wow is it okay for white people to sing the n-word in rap songs as long as they're alone in their car commuting to work we need to know what David thinks do they have hate in their heart they're singing a song they're just singing the song and they're by themselves they don't use this word to attack black folks correct it's hard to say you're not allowed to just do that in your car right I mean I don't know I mean I guess the question would be if I apply it to myself as a Jewish person would it be okay for a non imagine that there was a song with the k word mhm would it be okay if it's in the song it's not even a good analogy because the k word hasn't been taken back by Jewish people in the way there's been an we should we really should it's so hard to make an analogy you know I do not have an opinion about what people do in the privacy of their cars if it really is private so you plead the fifth yeah okay what do you think the ideal tax rate should be uh zero no I'm kidding no listen I I said this on pbd and then someone wrote to me and said David the math doesn't work and I said how the hell do you know how I'm structuring it I would love it okay I would love it if the top tax rate was 30% and we could fund a beautiful social safety net where everybody's housing there was no one H homeless hungry or without health care I think that would be a beautiful thing and let people keep 70% or more of their money I would love that I've been told it doesn't really work mathematically given the US budget and the number of people or whatever but in an Ideal World I I don't need people to pay high tax rates for no reason I just want to make sure we're covering and paying for the things we should pay for now what about a flat tax I'm against that why I I believe that the the framing of the tax system was designed to be Progressive to some degree now I don't need a 93% top marginal tax rate and in practice a flat tax becomes a regressive tax because the Richer you get you don't necessarily spend proportionately more on your needed Basics so it becomes a regressive tax yes or no is democracy at stake in 2024 I yes but maybe in a different way than you would assume but I'll leave it at yes is it I could or I couldn't care less I couldn't care less I agree bring the laptop so I I think Trump's an F I'm gonna make me lay a d desanctis probably an F Jordan Peterson you know his old lectures aren't the worst thing in the world so I would put him as a d Alex Jones is an f f we're getting to some contentious stuff here uh oh boy mean listen I drive a Tesla at least for a few more months then it's gone for good what oh I don't like this I'm ready move on so I think Elon is very problematic but what he has done to push forward on electric cars is very very significant so I would actually put him at a c even though I think a lot of his ideas are are very bad okay um Jesse Lee Peterson has high comedic value so I'd put him at a d rather than an F no amazing amazing you didn't catch that oh I didn't catch that fine leave him at the D that's okay put him at D um Russell Brand I think that's an F Tucker Tucker actually has some okay takes if you get them like in a private situation so I would put Tucker at D this is this is going to get very problematic I don't even know who all these people are Bernie I'm going to put as an a rather than S only because I think the practicality and presentation of some of his ideas is not top top top uh oh man this is really tough Charlie Kirk I'm going to put his an F remind me this guy's name Matt Walsh Matt Walsh he's an F there's no among FS like you think Alex Jones is the same as Charlie Kirk is the same as yeah all right I think so I think they're all worse than F so there like the lowest I have here is f so I'm just GNA I'm just going to dump them I'm also not devoting so much thought to this necessarily but um pbd you know I found him very personable and open to modifying some of his ideas at least to some degree even though he was very very aggressive with me he hired Cuomo so I'm going to put him as a c uh I'm going to put myself as a Mason amazing all right is that fair amazing Candice I'm going to put at I think all these daily wire people are basically F she's not daily wire anymore man no she's not you know what that makes that puts her up at D wow all right how about that Just for kicks she joins Infowars VI yeah then you know VI VI's an interesting guy Vision he's he's a Visionary in some way I'd put v as a no you know what I kind of have to say VI's better than Candace so I'm gonna go to C Jack geez I did not expect that all right uh it wasn't supposed to be a spit take no no that's interesting Ben Shapiro you think he's good or bad faith I think he is mostly good faith with some exceptions that I've called out I'm gonna put Ben Shapiro as D or C I'm gonna I'm gonna go C with Ben Shapiro um Steven Crowder Oh my God that's an easy f i I don't even have a challenge there uh Biden man now it's getting really really tough I'm actually going to put Biden at the same level as Bernie even though my politics are more Bernie aligned I've got to hand it to Biden that he has exe he's exceeded my expectations on execution and so I really value that um Gavin Nome I'm actually gonna put Nome at a because I think that he has the Gen sequa that the Democratic party needs generationally and in terms of attitude doesn't mean I think policy I don't think he's God's gift to progressivism on policy necessarily but I think he has a lot of potential he's a good talker he'll be president one day that's what I think I think it's possible I think it's possible and then uh let's see mayorcas so for me if if I think that someone does nothing for me but they're not actively bad for me it's like a b so there's a lot of these that are just going to end up in B so like I think B uh Ian vou I consider to be I'm not a socialist he's a socialist I don't agree with that so man but he's obviously better than Shapiro because at least he supports me in getting to social democracy so he's got to be better maybe he's a see the problem with these is why are mayorcas and and vou on the same it doesn't really make sense you don't have to put Ben as a c like because like he's amable or whatever it could also just be good faith like even if they have policy prescriptions that disagree with yours but you think they're trying to Sol like I feel like that is a commendable trait oh I'm going to have to start over oh actually no I mean honestly that's not how I'm doing this this is really tough what's your rubric my rub agreement with you yeah in terms of basically policy in terms of what I think is good I mean listen let let's let me put it this way with some of these like I think Anna and Jen mostly do a good job and I disagree with them on some stuff so they're probably like I I agree with them you know somewhere around B I guess and AOC I probably would have put it a c previously but I think she's actually become much more pragmatic and interesting now so I'd move her up Don Lemon I think is like a fine interviewer I had him on my show I'm going to be on his show but it's not like I'm going around looking for Don lemon's opinions on stuff so a lot of these don't do much for me one way or the other I've never seen an entire John Oliver episode um this guy right here who right there is that Nick Fuentes with no beard oh okay I mean you know he'd be very low like that's easy F uh RFK would probably be a c because he has a bunch of stuff I agree with but I think he's kind of gone off off the rails on some things Trudeau I think is like okay but like you know we're kind of at the point where I don't know that I've have super strong takes on a lot of these people I think what this is really exposing is that I don't really deify for lack of a better term any of these figures it's just sort of like yourself right I'm well but I didn't go s I just went amazing which is for comedic value it's for comedic value exclusively so yeah I don't know it's it's it it's tough I think kamla's probably she impressed me when I met with her in person so I'd probably put her up I mean see here's the thing I'm GNA have to move vouch down because for me KL is not at Biden level but I gotta probably move vouch so now they start moving around can move them you can move them are you really going to make me can you keep going if you don't want to we're not going to force you to do anything but this right here is what the people love Jack's favorite one is force yeah I mean maybe I have to move a couple of these up to S right to to give myself more space sure and so then I mean I probably still keep my Yus down at B uh oh boy Hassan Destiny II I don't know where I'm going to put him probably I mean he's he's kind of kind of gone off the rails lately probably at vouch level I think but do I agree with vou more than Hassan maybe I need to move vou up but vou had a strange thing with horses so I don't know did you guys hear about that let's not even discuss it yeah it sounds we're going to put it on the screen we're going to put whatever we're talking about on the screen Chris Cuomo I think is interesting you know it's probably like a be Trudeau probably sort of like Kamala this I I how much am I going to be canceled because of this I think I'm in trouble people love this Lex you know since Lex interviewed me my opinion of some of his playing a little soft with extremism hasn't super impressed me but I'd probably put him here John Oliver I just have to opt out I just I know a lot of people like him I don't know much about what he Destiny put Lex's S I think did he yeah I'm not going to be bullied by Destiny's opinion no no no Rogan ah you know Rogan's tough because if you if you look at what he was saying four years ago versus what he's saying now my opinion has shifted dramatically he's jumped in on a lot of just repeating right-wing talking points without necessarily understanding them fully so I probably would put him man this is really tough you could say you know BC yeah can can you put something in between you really can't guess it's B no it's probably got to be lower though but then I might have to move vou again I'm really concerned is just an is getting pushed down yeah oh Yik AOC I'm going to move up I don't I I probably put her you know she's really gaining a lot of political Knowledge from being in Congress about how things work we'd love to have her on that is that is she's one of my she turned down my request Don Lemon man I don't know I guess B and then Jen and Anna I don't I don't know you know a lot of these people are my friends I I don't know what I'm doing here I think it's sort of like this see here's the thing see how there's this triangle that builds towards the bottom no DFI I am negatively biased like I think most stuff is very so so yeah you know and then now let's make one final adjustment to make it accurate this reflects my actual self-esteem no come on man no you got hair like me that hurts me man I'll I'll leave myself for satirical reasons thank you so much for coming on appr for making me do this say whatever you want shout out whatever you want you books that's all linked down below you have a membership program we have all the stuff I I'm I'm not going to push anything on people but just you know find my content if you like it cool if not there's plenty of other things to watch without emailing me that you're angry cool thank you so much we really appreciate it guys any comments about the entire episode leave them down below we'll be reading them really appreciate all of that until next time see y amazing