WoW Forever Fixed SO MUCH… But I Still Have Concerns

Okay, people have been asking me, "San, please react to these panels. You missed them at Blizzcon." I know. I was stun locked. I was I was taking pictures of people. I didn't have a PC the second day. The first day I had some problems with the RTMP feed and I was like, you know what? I'm just going to look at the game and and actually get in the game instead of reacting to panels. I can react to panels anytime. So, we're going to do that today. Let's get to World of Warcraft Forever, the what's next panel at Blizzcon. >> For a first look at the next chapter of Azeroth. >> Audio balance. Hello again. Long time no see. It is amazing to be up here actually able to at last talk about what's somehow both the best kept and worst kept secret of the summer. Shout out to the classic WoW subreddit. No, it's not too late to start World of Warcraft forever. >> Um, this is a people coming in here spamming as fan. Is it too late to start blah blah blah? >> Season of discovery was an experiment on many levels, >> right? Sod was awesome. >> Boom. It was deliberately pushing boundaries and we pretty much said that outright time limited seasonal experience. It gave us a chance to find the limits of how much change. >> That's what was good about sod is that it go before things started to feel like they didn't belong in that world or alongside those philosophies. It's been a lot of fun over the last year reading and watching all the online discourse about what classic could be, should be, and definitely shouldn't be. But now, let me turn it over to the team so they can tell you exactly what it is. Okay, >> here we go. Tim's great. >> Hello, Blizzcon. >> So, what exactly is WoW forever? For us, it begins with the simple belief there are still adventures worth telling in the original world of Azeroth. We're not looking beyond Azeroth for the next chapter. We're not moving forward to Outland and beyond. Instead, we're looking deeper into the world players already fell in love with. The Eastern Kingdoms, Calumdor, the places we've traveled through for decades. We're revisiting mysteries that were never fully explored, stories that were never fully told, regions that existed on the map but never had the chance to become adventures of their own. We believe Azeroth still has secrets worth uncovering. >> True. >> And for and that's what WoW forever is. not expanding away from Azeroth, but expanding deeper inside of it. So before we show you exactly where that journey begins, I want to talk briefly about the principles guiding every decision that we've made. First, let me get my slides here. Sorry there. First, approachable and familiar. We believe the world should still >> You know what's funny is uh so I talked to Mike Mooreheim last night. I told him I was like, I just watched your 2005 Blitzcon panel before I came, you know, just like for for fun, you I went back and I looked at some of the Blizzcon 2005 panels and he was like that was the only only Blizzcon that I memorized my entire intro speech and everything. He's like after that we had to go to teleprompterss. We absolutely had he's like just had to do the teleprompter after that cuz you just there's too much to talk about. There's too many notes and he's like that was the only one that I memorized everything. >> We believe the world should still feel like classic. Every addition we make is measured against the spirit of the original game. >> True. Not whether it's new, not whether it's flashy. >> True. >> Whether it feels like it belongs. >> True. >> That's why you won't find flying mounts. >> Yeah. True. >> You won't find level scaling. And >> I love I love all this. This is all This is all remain a dangerous world where preparation matters, communication matters, and working together matters. >> Yes. Thank you. We're not interested in making the game difficult simply for difficulty's sake. When challenges are overcome, we want it to be because players prepared, learned, cooperated, and succeeded together. Now, second world as the main character. >> Yes, we believe Azeroth itself should be one of the most important characters in the game. Leveling is just as important as endgame. Yes, >> and we want to keep investing in the world itself through new zones, new quests, new rewards, and new adventures across all levels of play. Not every story needs to be about saving the world. Sometimes the most memorable stories happen in a remote village, along a forgotten road, or a corner of the map that you never expected to revisit. >> Yeah. >> Third, journey before destination. We believe your effort should matter and it should continue to matter. While Forever is designed as a long-term home, not planning around future level cap increases that invalidate your accomplishments. The professions you invest in matter. The routes you choose matter. And the gear you earn matters. The experiences that you have with friends matter. Our catchup system is quite simple. Play the game. Play the damn game, son. Play the damn game. I love it. Play the damn game. >> That's how you catch up. >> Run dungeons. Make friends. Explore the world. Earn your rewards. >> Let the kids play the game. >> And finally, protect and nurture social experiences. Many of our favorite memories from classic happened because of other players. Because someone helped us complete a quest, because a stranger joined our group, because a dungeon run turned into a friendship. We have had to be disciplined when adding convenience to the game because every quality of life decision affects how players interact with one another. Now, we want to create reasons for people to explore and adventure together. And that's part of the philosophy behind new systems like camping. And it's why every patch will include content for different kinds of players, whether you enjoy solo adventures, dungeons, raids, PvP, or something in between. Because the best adventures are the ones that we share. So those pillars guide every decision that we make. But what do they actually mean in practice? Now for us, it starts with Azeroth itself. People often talk about vanilla Azeroth as though it's a solved game, as though every mystery has been answered. Every story has been told. Every corner of the world explored. But when we look at Azeroth, we see something very different. We see potential. We see unfinished stories. We see unexplored places. We see regions players have been wondering about for decades. the Gilaeus, Mount Hyel, Oolum, the mountains north of Angoro. I wonder what's up there. The spaces that exist between the familiar parts of the world of Angoro. The possibilities don't stop there. Forgotten Kingdom. >> So, take a look at this. These are all the places that they highlight that they want to open up. >> This is Desolus Stonetown Mountains area right here. Hyel, Gilaeus. He said mountains north of Angoro. This is south of Angoro but like old area Gila. What's here? Is this Galleran Qualas? The area between Stormwind and Iron Forge. Twilight Highlands east of Menithal Harbor. So the mountain range between Redidge and the Badlands or Blasted No. Yeah. Redidge and Badlands. Blasted lands. STV Blasted Lands area down here. Okay. Interesting. Interesting. Okay. >> Titan mysteries, the Emerald Dream, the Caverns of Time, >> countless adventures still waiting to be told in the vanilla world. But every journey has to begin somewhere. And when we started planning WoW Forever, we wanted to begin with places deeply rooted in the world players already know and love. So, let's take a look. Some of these I had I had panned and other ones I I hadn't. >> Couple of them. >> Today we're introducing four new regions to Azeroth. >> Yes. >> Four new adventures built directly into the world of the Eastern Kingdoms in Calumor because Azeroth finished growing. This is how that growth begins. >> So let's start with a place many of us have wondered about for more than 20 years. Mount. >> Who's this? This is Tim Jones. >> We all know the story. We know the story of Archamon's defeat, but what happened afterwards? How did Hydra recover? How are the forests healing from the corruption? How are the wild gods affected by the events at top the mountain? And what dangers still remain? And Mount Hyel is a new endgame leveling zone where players can finally journey through the Dark Whisper Gorge and explore one of Warcraft's most important locations during a period of history that we've never really experienced before. Now, you'll encounter new stories, rewards, new reputations, and both solo and group content as you help shape the future of this recovering land. And for players seeking a greater challenge, Hyel also serves as the home of one of our launch raids, Hyel Summit. And >> Launch Raid Hydrol serves as one of three entrances into one of our other raids, the Barrow. missed this >> because some of Azeroth's greatest victories still have stories yet to tell. >> So does it launch raids with an S. Is that going to replace Molten Core? >> Of Azeroth's great raids. The Barrow Deeps. >> Barrow Deeps is another raid. So it's a raid that leads into another raid. No MC at launch. They say that later. Let's go. Let's go, dude. Let's go. Okay. Hell yeah, dude. Hell yeah. >> Because some of Azeroth's greatest victories still have stories yet to tell. >> That's one I was big on. >> Not every adventure begins. >> Rework it and release it later. >> Some begin in places. >> Rework it, release it later. Was >> flown between Mulore and Desolith. >> Let's go, dude. >> You've probably seen a set of ancient ruins passing far below. A small detail in the world. A mystery hiding in plain sight. Welcome to Shendrol. Here you'll meet Morton Eden Shade and learn more about the Shendelar, the people whose history is deeply connected to Elroas, Dire, and Prince Toreldren himself. >> Okay. >> The players will also continue story lines involving the Gulkus and the Magum Centaur tribe while discovering new reasons to visit dungeons like Maradon and Razer Fend downs. >> It's a great example of one of the things we love most about Azeroth. Even the smallest corner of the world can become a truly memorable adventure. Dude, this is great. >> One of our core beliefs is that the journey matters, and nowhere embodies that philosophy better than our new zone, the Riverglades. Located along the eastern coast of Eastern Kingdoms, between Red Ridge, Burning Steps, the Badlands, and Swamp of Sorrow. This place is big. >> The Riverglades is a major new leveling zone inspired by stories that stretch all the way back to the Warcraft games. >> Years ago, human forces pursued retreating orcs to this region. And when help never came, many of those settlers were forced to remain behind and build lives of their own on the frontier. Generation later, the descendants still endure. This is a rugged land of rivers, grasslands, trade routes, struggling communities, old grudges, and new opportunities. Humans and orcs, ogres, and nolles, goblins, and murlocs, all competing to survive in a region where no one has it easy. And that's what makes the Riverglades special. This isn't a story about saving Azeroth. It's a story about living in Azeroth spanning from the mid30s to the mid-40s. Riven. >> Okay. I was gonna ask what the level range was. 50 new quest. >> Level 30 to level mid-30s to level level mid-30s to mid-40s is what he said. Big big big big big big big. That's huge. That's Oh my gosh, that's so huge. So, so like one of the things I think one of the big points of discussion for talking about classic plus and trying to like open up the world of Azeroth, the level 30 to 50 questing it's there's a lot of like it's very broken and depending on if you're hoard or alliance like it kind of shifts like for alliance for example like that 40 to 50 range is brutal and then 50 plus it's it's like okay it gets better but 40 to 50 is a drag and then I think for the horde it's kind of like 30 to 40ish is a drag. So having some more things in that mid-level, more mid-level content to flesh that out. Oh, it's wonderful. It's wonderful content for both Horde and Alliance players, new reputations, new rewards, and entirely new ways to progress through your leveling journey. Now, players will also discover a neutral goblin port that expands trade routes throughout the Eastern Kingdoms and beyond. And for those of you looking for trouble, you'll find Crol Do Stronghold, an enormous outdoor dungeon where a powerful ogre civilization is conducting some very questionable business. And yes, we thought it might be nice to have an outdoor dungeon, so it's not in running Scarlet Monastery for the 25th time. >> Yes, >> true. >> So far, we've explored places tied to the familiar parts of Warcraft's history. But Azeroth should still be able to surprise us. Sometimes the greatest mystery isn't beyond the horizon. Sometimes it's above us. Welcome to Zephris Isle. Now, thousands of years ago, a group of highborn exiles forged a pact with the elemental wind spirits, and they built a civilization in the realm of Skywall. This wasn't entirely without precedent. Classic players may remember stories like Thunderfury and Prince Darren, where we first caught glimpses of the elemental powers beyond Azeroth itself. Now, Zephris gives us an opportunity to expand on some of those ideas while still creating something entirely new. But the civilization of Zephris is in trouble. The air spirits that once protected these islands have vanished. Ancient structures are beginning to fail. Communities are becoming isolated. And the skyborn people are divided over what comes next. Some seek answers from the wind spirits. Some wish to reclaim the arcane traditions of their ancestors. Others have turned to darker powers. Zephris A is serves as a brand new starting experience from levels 1 to 12 and combines classic Warcraft aesthetics with elemental architecture inspired by Skywall itself. And that is why we're introducing an entirely new playable race, the Skyborn. Yes. Now, the Skyborn are not a neutral race. At character creation, players will choose whether their Skyborn joins the Horde or the Alliance. >> I I'm not a big fan of the Skyborn. I don't really intend on playing one personally because I'm I mean I'm I play a human I play a male human retribution paladin. You think I'm gonna play Skyborn? I had to freaking go to therapy to freaking make myself play a blood elf in Burning Crusade. All right. Of course. Of course I'm not going to play Skyborn. But for me, I didn't really like the idea of Skyborn because I'm like, man, there's too many elves in the lore of Warcraft. There's just way the hell too many elves, man. If you want to add an elf, that's fine, but let's add an existing elf, like a high elf. And the concept of the high elves being on alliance instead of the blood elves being on horde is kind of cool. I think that you could have gone into a different direction for the horde. A lot of people said ogre. I don't like the goblin idea. I like goblins being a neutral race and like the steam wheel cartel and stuff. I like I like the goblins being neutral and vanilla and classic. Like I think that's a very classic thing that goblins are neutral. But here's my biggest problem that I have with the skyborn elves. It's not even that the skyborn elves exist. Okay, my biggest problem I have with the Skyborn elves, and he mentioned how it's not a neutral race and you decide which faction of Skyborn you want at launch or like a character creation, but it does feel very like Mist of Panderia with a panda being neutral. You, you know, you have aesthetically it's like one for both. I really really don't like that. I think you did need two races. There's some things that I think are just a miss. Uh and and for me, this was a miss. Do I care that much? Not really. But it's a miss because it just kind of goes against what I would have expected in something that they're very clearly marketing as classic plus. It doesn't feel like something that you would have seen in the original design principles of the game. If this game was to continue to be made with those same original design principles, it doesn't feel like there would be a race that is although not technically neutral, it's two factions of the same race split across the two factions. I I do think that doesn't really fit in the in the scope of the game. That's me. That's what I think. >> And while they share a common ancestry, they no longer share a common vision for the future. Now, Horde Alliance Skyborn embrace elemental traditions and work closely alongside the earth and ring granting access to the shaman class. Now, alliance skyborn pursue the arcane legacy of their ancestors and work alongside the Kieran tour granting access to the mage class. Now, both factions can play warriors, hunters, rogues, and druids, including some brand new skyborn druid forms created specifically for the race. And the Skyborn also feature new racials, customizations, voices, dances, and a wide range of unique visual options. And >> I will say this, I love the Skyborn dance. I think the Skyborn dance is so troll and stupid that it's it's perfect. I love it. >> More importantly, the Skyborn represent exactly the kind of story we want to tell in WoW Forever. Something new, something exciting. It feels like it belongs in Azeroth. Now whether it's helping restore Hyel, uncovering forgotten histories of Shendrolos, building a future on the Riverglades frontier, or taking your first steps through the skies of Zephris, these are only the first chapters of WoW forever. This isn't a seasonal experiment. This isn't a one-time expansion, and it isn't the end of Azeroth's story. It's a commitment, a promise to keep growing this world with new regions, new mysteries, new adventures, and new stories for years and years to come. But a living world needs challenges. New dungeons, new raids, new battlegrounds, new rewards. And to show you what's waiting for adventurers brave enough to answer that call, I would like to hand things over to Nora. >> Nora is great, too. Nora is a classic Andy. >> Adventurers. >> Nora is very much a I've talked to Nora quite a bit. She's she's a she's very much a classic Andy >> expressing just how proud I am of the team for making this dream >> is great. >> Like many of you watching right now, we've poured our hearts into >> and it's an honor to be entrusted with this beloved world and this incredible legacy. >> But ah look at me getting all sentimental when there are matters that require our attention. There's adventure to be had all across Azeroth. And well, let me just show you. In the Altterak Mountains, a disruption has thrown the magical city of Doran into chaos. The mages of the Kirin have erected a magical barrier over the city to conceal the restoration. >> I have the video 3. >> The barrier seems to be down. Furthermore, I'm hearing all sorts of strange reports. Enchantments backfiring, arcane constructs going haywire, demonic energy has been running rampant, there are cats everywhere. I guess that part's normal. Anyway, far be it from me to imply that the all powerful mages of the Kieran Tor don't have the situation under control, but if uh perhaps if you're willing to brave the dangers, you could lend them a hand. Uh especially if you're around levels 28, 33, there might be some magical artifacts in it for you. And besides, there's a whole city to explore. So, no, this isn't just a dungeon. Of course, the optics of some ragtag group of adventurers helping out these powerful mages would not go over well, but I'm sure we can find some roundabout way to get you into the city. Anyway, that's just scratching the surface. Let's turn our sights closer to home. The once great city of Lorderon was devastated by Arthus and his scourge. The Forsaken have been hard at work trying to restore the city. There are memories here. Old family heirlooms, keepsakes from loved ones who never made it out of the city in time. >> Okay, >> the ruins of Lordon are treacherous as scourge still lurk in its darkest corners. But to make battles worse, we've heard reports that a necromancer has moved in, and all signs point to an attack on another city. Honorable members of the Horde may choose to take up arms and assist the Forsaken in reclaiming these ruins, ideally in the level 15 to 20-ish range. While members of the Alliance, well, I can't imagine the Foresaken taking kindly to your presence here. So, you may need to find a way to sneak in. >> But don't worry, Alliance. We have something close to home for you, too. >> The dwarven capital city of Iron Forge is carved within the mountains of Denmaro, and its mighty halls might be. >> Beneath the city dropper lies the Hall of Fames, a final resting place for the dwarven monarch. So, >> this is a place that has been well tended and for the most part left undisturbed. But if you guys can believe it, someone's broken into the place. I suspect the Dark Irons. And perhaps if you're a member of the Alliance, you might feel inspired to uproot these intruders. Although, I'll warn you, ghostly whispers echo these corridors. It's probably best to make sure you're at least somewhere in the 13 to 18 level range. As for Horde, one thing's for certain. The dwarves I know would never let some horde walts right into their sacred burial chamber. I suppose if you're curious, you'll need to find a way to sneak in or perhaps carve your way through. But enough about home. You're here for adventure. Azeroth holds many secrets, and it's no surprise that there would be no so many archaeological dig sites to scatter throughout the land. These courageous enough to brave errant titan constructs may set their sights on one dig site in particular. Located in the wetlands just above excavation, you'll find a place trapped in time. Although we don't know much about it, but that's the point. A strange mist has been floating down from the mountains and flashing lights have been spotted on the horizon. So, there must be something up there. You'll check it out, won't you? I would make sure that you're in the levels 29 to they're 24 to 29 range, I'd say. So, you're prepared for what you might find. I'm sure the Explorers League might be interested in those findings. But if you're not a fan of swamps, I understand. So, how about something a bit more tropical? These ancient troll ruins located off the coast of Strangle Thorn Veil have been submerged in waves and inhabited sea creatures for as long as I can remember. And I don't mean to alarm you. Uh but those ruins have suddenly risen out of the ocean. >> Oh, >> you can see it just off the coast. It appears to be some sort of city. >> Well, one thing's for certain. Drown City is what we got to play at Blizzcon. >> Make sure nothing nefarious is going on in there. I've heard reports that trolls and Naga have been spotted there. And I >> I will say this about Drown City. Um, a lot of how I felt about Drown City whenever I played it at Blizzcon, it kind of felt like I was playing a retail dungeon with a classic character. It's kind of a hard thing to talk about for me because it's it's a very intangible sort of feeling. And I'm pretty big on like whenever I criticize something to uh kind of kind of pinpoint specific things that you can back it up. But I and I have a hard time explaining this one because it did feel kind of intangible and I don't know if it was just the layout of the dungeon or there was something about it and maybe maybe it'll like click in my head at some point what made me feel that way. I heard the same thing from multiple people. We'll see. My hope is that I just kind of am being dumb and I'm and I'm wrong about that feeling. But we'll see. >> Thought I saw a pirate ship crash into the place. I wonder how they're doing. Could be pretty dangerous. So, I'd make sure you're at least around levels 35 to 40 before venturing into that place. Some players may find this prison familiar. And no, I'm not implying you're a bunch of criminals, >> but you should. >> There may be a few devilish rogues among you. >> Gor, this prison is famous because it's rumored to be the place where the Deas once held highranking nobles for ransom. It was at one point even rumored himself. >> Okay. In the past, we were able to go visit this location, but we couldn't actually go inside in forever. Of course, now you can, and it would be nice if you considered going down there to clear the place out. There seemed to be some sort of conflict happening between the Defias and the Naga inside, so now would be an opportune time to move. You'll want to make sure you're ready to put up a fight, though, so uh a group's around level 48 to 53 should do it. The Shaper Terrace. Where have I heard those words before? In Wrath of Lich King Classic, I recall there was an old Titan facility deep within Scholazar Basin. But were there others? What happened to them? Anyway, uh perhaps one of our most treacherous locations yet. In the hills of Unboro Crater lies a place seemingly untouched by time. I've heard it described as, I quote, a whole lot like Jurassic Park, whatever that means. There are old Titan buildings scattered throughout the area, wildlife running among beautiful power crystals scattered throughout. And you guessed it, there must be some source of power here, right? Well, if you're interested, perhaps you can go in and investigate if you're levels 58 to 60, maybe. >> Oh, is it a level 60 dungeon? Shaper's Terrace. Okay, so this is this is the Angoro Crater dungeon. That's cool. Look, I don't know why you would want to venture into a stronghold crawling with ogres, but if you're into that sort of thing, I've got the opportunity for you. In the Riverglades, outrunners have been kidnapping folks. And I've heard several randings have occurred within the region. Sturdy adventurers in the level 40 to 55 range could potentially put up a fight and end the ogre's mischief in the region. But be warned, in the twilight hours of the night, I've heard weird chanting coming from the place. Could it be cultists? But >> do nature. >> Wait, what was it called? In Croll Do >> Could it be Cists? >> Cru Stronghold. Oh. Oh, this is the ogre dungeon they already talked about. >> But back to nature in times past. >> I remember standing before a gate in Ajara and wondered what it was on the other side. >> I'd tell you, but if you're around levels 55 to 60, you might as well go check it out for yourself. A great Furbol city lies within. But if you're familiar with the Fergold's plight, well, I suspect they might be struggling to save off some sort of corruption. It could be very dangerous. The tunnels leading into Blackm Hold run deep and wind far into the mountain. In fact, should you decide to explore these tunnels, you might find yourself in an entirely different kind of danger, >> which brings us to our first raid. >> To the night elves, the Barrow Deeps is a sacred place. >> The Barrow Deeps. Oh, wait. While there may be a variety of barrerow dens scattered throughout the land, >> that's that's a break off of the timber >> lead to one pivotal location we call the Barrow Deeps. >> None truly know how far or how deep these tunnels run, but it must be massive. The night elves hold some of their most dangerous prisoners in this location. In fact, rumor has it an infamous demon hunter was once kept here. Why does Why does Nora not have her badge on? Chad, >> the night elves are hesitant to let anyone in, including allies. But I've heard that like the furbolds of Black Mold, they may be dealing with some sort of corruption. But these dangers are no joke. In fact, if I were you, I'd send no less than 10 of my greatest adventurers. But we've got more danger in store. At the battle for Mount Hyel, Malfurion Storm Rage chose to sacrifice the power sustaining the night elves immortality for a chance to defeat Legion Commander Archamond. It worked. >> Hyel Summit Raid. >> Holy smokes. Coming to terms with losing one's immortality mustn't be easy. And there must be some who disagreed with his decision, right? Ah, anyway, fast forward to today and we're hearing reports that someone or something has been draining the power from the land surrounding Pyel Summit. Now, like the Barrow Deeps, you'll want to be prepared. If you were to send, say, 20 of your finest, I'd say you'd have a reasonable chance of surviving. This is by far our largest raid in WoW Forever. Beautiful snowy peaks tower over the area. >> I have something to say. I do not want them to get rid of 40man raids. Every time I talk about this, people It's like, it's like a fallacy to me. People always, oh, you're a streamer. the streamer. I'm not a streamer. I can't get fun of people to be able to read me. Dude, I didn't freaking pop out of the womb and turn on the camera, you know? Is that how it works? I've guild led. I've raid led before I was a streamer. I had 40man raids, everything. I don't want them to get rid of 40man raids. With that being said, I think it's very very important to have 40 mans, 20 mans, and 10 mans. I think they need all three. And I do think that you need less 40 mans than you need 20 and 10. And I think that this is a one of the L's from Burning Crusade. When they went from 40 man to 25 man raids in Burning Crusade, I think that was a mess. I think whenever you had 10-man Karazan and 25man Groulles and everything else, that was a miss. I talked to Jeff Kaplan about this, who was one of the game directors. Before Overwatch, he was Wrath of Lich King and Burning Crusade and Vanilla. I talked to Jeff Kaplan about this. I was like, why'd you guys do 25 man raids? He was like, uh, yeah, like I don't I don't know. I just we just kind of picked 25. Like, you know, we we probably should have done 20, but you know, at the time we're just like, I don't know. We just picked 25. So, that's it just kind of like they just picked the wrong number. I think that they need to keep 40man reds. I think they need to have more 20 mans added and they need to have more 10 mans added. But I think 40 mans should be kept and you you add less of them than you add 20s and tens. But when you have this like 10man, 20man, 40man situation, it's easy to combine raids to group together into the bigger raids. They're all your best gear should come from the 40man raids and the 20s and the 10ens. There should be something in each size of raid that is good for like everyone. You know that somebody should have something in there that like this is some of their best gear that they can get for something so that you have a reason to run every single one. The progression of the raids should not be dictated by the size of them. The size of the raid should only serve as a way to add to the feel of the raid and it being just like this epic feeling of, hey, we're taking 40 people into this thing. We're combining raids. Raid one and two are combining in our guild to go to the 40man. this this tier, then they split up to run the other 20man raids. Hey, and our 20man raids split up to go into two 10 mans. So, from a guild management standpoint, it it adds up really well. I love it. I think I think that is the way to do things. Continue. >> A raging river carves a path through ancient elven ruins. >> You need a chef hat. You're cooking. Thank you. >> Ghosts from the third war can be heard. There's plenty of adventure to be had and perhaps plenty of power to be had as well. Legendary power. But this is World of Warcraft. And >> I didn't see the tier sets. >> Tension is at an all-time high between the Horde and the Alliance. >> Go back. Go back. >> You'll get to duke it out in the classic battlegrounds you've always and the craft. >> I Dude, it's it's like half and half. I think they look retaily. I think they look real real retaily. And it's not so much about like what what means it's too retaily. I actually don't think that about the boots, the legs, and the chest. But I'm looking at the shoulders, and the shoulders and the helmet right here is really what's it's hard to tell from this tiny little screenshot, but the shoulders and the helmet are throwing me off. The helmet less so, but the should there something about the shoulders. >> And tension is at an all-time high between the Horde and the Alliance. Rest assured, you'll get to duke it out in the classic. These are also these are also the retail models. So maybe maybe they look different on the classic models. I'd like to see what they look like on the classic models. >> Known and love, but we have something more for you. Off the coast of Calumdor lies the Dark Spear Islands. A strategic location for those seeking to gain an upper hand in the conflict. This is a 15 versus 15 battleground that follows the same rule set as Eye of the Storm. If you want to win, you'll need to control strategic positions throughout the islands. The catch is that this battleground features a Rappy Basin style capture points. You'll need to interact with a flag, then stand to defend it to >> top lane, mid lane, bottom lane. Is this a Is this a MOA? I think a MOA style battleground would be really good. >> Secure that location. Or you guessed it, you'll be joining the Dark Spear trolls as they fight to eradicate the Alliance from their >> Eye of the Storm. >> An alliance. You are to report to the Theramore Expeditionary Force for deployment. I want them to do a MOA. >> We've also spent a lot of time thinking about >> I want I I would like them to do a mobile 2006. The class team modestly redesigned several of the talent trees such as priest, mage, hunter, druid. They made the changes they made back then weren't really about making every class equally good at everything. Rather, they wanted each class to feel unique. They wanted to give us a reason to bring each class on their next adventure. The changes we've made in classes in Wild Forever follow that same spirit. We want to cover gaps where they exist, but we don't want to erase what makes each class unique. For example, paladins, there's a new seal that allows you to tank a bit more effectively. If healing's your jam, you might find talents that enable you to do a bit, just a bit of group healing. and uh rep paladins. Uh I don't know, maybe now's your time to shine. >> We've moved. >> It needs work. The sealed twist talent needs work. I love their implementation of seal of fury. This was not something I thought of. I did not think that they would add a seal of fury back into the game. I I don't even know about them adding Holy Strike back into the game. Personally, the implementation of Seal of Fury, I think, is really nice. They didn't make Seal of Righteousness, the Burning Crusade version of Seal of Righteousness in order to not trivialize it and it would kind of replace Seal of Blood or Martyr. It would it would apply like a two-way twist if they did it the right way, but it would coincide with the itemization and the fantasy of having spell power as a rep paladin in vanilla that you don't have in Burning Crusade. And I really do think like from a class fantasy standpoint, it could be one of the best versions of a paladin. I don't think this version of prop paladin is as good as like the wrath propaladin. I think Wrath Prop Paladin was way too overpowered. Not good. From a class fantasy standpoint, it's so close, dude. Like I I've said before, I would give it like a seven out of 10. It's so close. If you just tweak and move a few things, you could actually make the what I feel like would be the best version overall of the Paladin class with the classic sort of feel to it. >> Away from talents that simply give you small incremental improvements and have instead tried to give you talents that you notice. You may find yourself in situations where you're making real meaningful tradeoffs depending on how you want to build your character. But that's not all. Wow forever is huge and you've got hundreds of brand new items to look forward to, including all sorts of really fun and exciting onuse and unequip effects. For example, check out this I found backstage, which you can equip as your farm weapon. And possibly related, we have this grave robber shovel for uh you know what uh when you want to uh dig a grave. Anyway, we've gone through and made a variety of updates and existing items and rewards throughout the games. Check out the title charm now super effective against certain sea dwellers and white man shapo which has ooh an in >> reduces the cast time of spells and effects that revive targets. That's funny. >> Increase the healing and damage done alongside a reduction in the cast time of resurrection spell. >> I also love that they did the burning crusade version of uh plus healing where you have 30% of it go to plus damage. I love that they did that. Now, let me touch on race abilities in WoW Forever. We want to give you reasons to want to spin up a new character and embark on a new journey, which is why we've done a pass over race abilities to make them feel more distinct. I'm increasing the speed that each race has something special to bring that other races do not. >> I think it will mess up. >> You can see a sneak peek of a few of our upcoming racial passives. A 5% increase of damage dealt against beasts if you're a dwarf, and a 5% chance to drain health from your target if you're undead. But I highly encourage you to check out tomorrow's Wow Forever deep dive panel where my friends will go into a lot more detail on what I've teased today. But I'm an introvert and it's time for me to crawl back into the shadows from whence I came. So I'm going to go ahead and hand things off to our wonderful production director, Clay Stone, who will share even more fun and exciting WoW Forever updates. I I think it's good to mention too because I've mentioned it in the past but but not right now. I think there needs to be like a really rigorous pass through with the itemization. I feel like everything is a little bit too strong right now. I think whether it's the ratios, whether it's the items, everything just looks like it's tuned a little bit too high. And it's very very important to reel these things back a little bit because you're gonna have a big power creep issue. And we always talk about horizontal progression and all this stuff. Blizzard has repeated that sentiment back to us. I'm a very big believer in horizontal progression and to take this insane power creep that you have in vanilla and to just bring it down a little bit. Not not like not flatline, you know? I know horizontal is flat, but we we got to we got to normalize this instead of it being this big exponential curve to just like right here, right? Super super important. What's happening right now from what we're seeing on the tool tips is everything is just the the scaling and the numbers. They're they're off heav I think it's heavily off to be honest, but we don't know that until we play the game. And I think it's important to give that feedback and be very direct about it. But we'll know whenever we play the game. But I totally agree. I I totally see that cuz this was a big problem with Season of Discovery and it causes a nightmare for PvP balance. You're not going to have resilience. Are you going to just crank a bunch of stamina into the gear? You know, in Burning Crusade, they had to reduce the value of stamina in order to increase the amount of stamina that was on the gear. Keep those same vanilla design principles. Don't let the power creep go completely out of just go bonkers. I had an old video from years ago talking about power creep. If you're more interested, if you want to go back and watch that video, SAM power creep video today. It's a good one. >> But I'm an introvert and it's time for me to crawl back into the shadows from whence I came. So, I'm going to go ahead and hand things off. >> Thanks for Hello, BlizzCon. >> My name is Clay Stone and I'm the associate production director on the WoW Classic and WoW Forever team. So, we've talked a lot about things you might be expecting, but let's take a minute and talk about some things perhaps you weren't expecting. Let's start with our rendering updates. You got to see a bit of this in our gameplay trailer during opening ceremony. And admittedly, we went pretty hard. Not every zone is going to be set at sunrise or sunset all the time. But I want to make a bold controversial statement. We believe WoW Classics art style is timeless, which is why our focus was not on changing the game art, but on small ways we could push specifically things like the environmental effects. >> I like this now flow forest. >> I think they did a good job of this. >> Or the way the fog rolls into dustwood. >> I think this water looks way better than retail's water. or the way the moonlight now breaks through the leaves of the trees in Ashenville. I I >> I think they did a really good job of >> it's the same original Azeroth that players fell in love with all those years ago with just a few small but powerful effects updates to make it more than ever >> of kind of like the technical updates >> but keeping the same sort of feeling of of classic. So, in addition to the new professions content arriving at Wild Forever, with camping, we are doubling down on trade skills. >> Almost anywhere in the open world, players can craft a campsite. Other adventurers can stop by, stay a while, and use their trade skills to craft something for the campsite, granting everyone there a specific buff. When we think about our core pillars and nurturing and protecting social experiences, this is one of those things we're talking about. And because players need to sit there for a moment before they gain any buffs, maybe, just maybe, they just might talk to each other >> legacy system. >> Dude, look, it's Tim Jones. He's playing a shaman. If camping is us doubling down on trade skills and community, WoW Forever's new legacy system will see us tripling down on an element of classic that is only found in classic, the 1 to 60 leveling journey. For as epic as Endgame is, and I promise, >> we know that there are some players who just love the classic leveling journey. Although the legacy system benefits everyone, it very much aids players who love to run alts as they unlock new perks across their alts by achieving new goals on each new leveling journey. >> We are really excited about this one and how well it fits into classic wild design philosophy. Now, I'd like to switch gears and talk about the >> They didn't spend too too much time talking about the legacy system. I took a look at it at Blizzcon, just being 100% honest. Um, I think that the legacy system has some things that were a little bit too strong. The five talent points thing is pretty cool and it's a pretty strong incentive for people to level new characters, especially if you are wanting to make twinks in Battlegrounds. I worry a little bit about that. I worry about battlegrounds twinking because if you have five more talent points, that is an insane power spike. Is it gonna kill low-level battlegrounds? I don't know. You could argue that twinking kills it anyway or something. I I don't think it's as bad as uh as something like five five talent points is a massive massive increase. Way more than uh enchants or something like that. I don't know. There was a few things I saw like that. Uh I saw another one that increases your stealth detection level. Why do we need something that increases stealth detection level as a part of the legacy system? It says it doesn't work in battlegrounds, but hello world PvP. It ends up being a mustave for world PvP for you to go and level more alts. And I think that's something that's not good. I actually think they should just outright get rid of it. I think I think they should just get rid of it. The stealth detection one, but I do think the idea of the legacy system isn't bad on its own. I just think you have to be very careful about what you put in there and what you don't put in there. I do think there's a lot of things that like increase the amount of XP you earn a little bit too much. I really need to go down and sit through and like like look at every single thing. But this is we're going into beta and there's one key thing about this version of the game versus anything we got in the past for classic. This is a new game. This is an actively developed new version of the game. And what that means what that means is that we are going to have the opportunity to give feedback on stuff and they will actually change it. Okay? It's not going to be like pulling teeth for them to actually update and be agile with something, try something new. Hey, this isn't good. Let's change it. Because they don't do that. It's so annoying that they don't do that in classic. They don't they don't take care of the classic like they should. It feels like a lot of times because they're so focused on this no changes thing that has always been kind of like it's it's been like a fallacy in and of itself. But um but yeah, very good. Very good. And if there's one thing I've learned in my time as part of this community, it's that players love to debate what is and is not classic. Players discuss in social, in forums, and even make polls. >> True. >> And if there's one thing every player agrees on, it's what is classic plus. >> When I took this survey, I was like, "Oh my gosh, yes. Blizzard is going to see this and we're going to be able to have proof and say, "Look, this is what we want, Blizzard. Now, you can do it, >> dude. This survey I look, Jord's great, but man, I saw this survey and I was like, you got to kill this thing with fire. This is ass." >> In reality, after looking at this data, it's like it's >> 100%, dude. I saw I was >> what I thought. It's the exact It's the exact Oh my gosh. Like it's literally proving that like nobody knows what they want. Like that's hilarious, bro. >> So, since we're all in agreement on what we want, >> let's talk transmog. Now, some of you are saying, >> listen, I personally am not a fan of the transmog. I never have been. However, you got to pick and choose your battles. And if you can toggle it, if you can toggle it and I don't see your transmong, you can be whatever you want to be. Even I think this isn't great, but it's like it's less of an issue to me. I think of it like this. Imagine like I'm me. I'm a normal person, okay? Debatably, but I'm like a normal person that I see the world for what it is, okay? I see what I see. You're wearing, you know, a t-shirt and shorts or whatever, and that's what I see. And then I imagine the person who has transmog toggled on. And who is this? It's like DJ Khaled. Okay. Have you guys ever seen a DJ Khaled Snapchat story, Instagram story, anything like that? This guy is like completely delusional. The whole world that he sees is just completely different than what's actually there. That's kind of what I imagine. And that's okay. He wants to see whatever he sees. I see what I see. And we're good. You know, look, you can think what you want to think. You think that you're wearing this thing. Okay. your robes of gold and riches and you know you got all your rings on. You're wearing a t-shirt and shorts. Okay, that's fine. You can think that. You can be delusional. That's okay. You know we the best armor. >> Yes, finally. This is my moment. I feel seen. But we know some of you are saying transmog not in my classic plus. We say, "Is it too much to ask for both?" >> In WoW Forever, Transmog is entirely optin. If you want to turn it on, it's on, and everyone you see in the world can look their very best. >> But for classic players, especially those of us who enjoy world PvP, many of us want they truly are, and what they've accomplished. So, turn it off. >> And it's clown suits for everyone. >> Yeah. It's so funny though, the applause that the the non-transmongers give. >> World, there is a lot more to learn about the classic modifications we've made to this system for those who choose to use it. Stop by tomorrow's deep dive panel to learn a lot more about this as well as the camping and legacy systems and much more. >> It's funny. >> For now, let me move on to another absolutely not at all controversial topic. Character models. Dude, I'm telling you, the push against this, >> I'm telling you tooth and nails newer HD character models, but many of us unordered, >> which is why we've made it completely toggable gamewide. Your character, the NPCs, other player other player characters together, unified in either HD or SC. For fellow classic players, that means you get to see all the beloved original races SC designs. And for those of you who prefer a more modern aesthetic, you can go with the modern HD designs. You choose what you see. Oh, and there is one more thing. We feel like classics animations are just as important as its art style. Here you will see a newer modern HD dwarf running with its modern animation sets. >> Oh, dude. >> Now, let me show you that same HD dwarf running while attached to the classic animation. >> They should do this in retail. >> I am. Why do they not do this in retail? It looks so much better on the right. I've talked about this for ages. >> I'm so proud to announce that we have gone back and painstakingly restored the classic animations you know and love across the game's HD character models. >> They should have they should have done it in retail, too. >> No. >> Who cares about this? What are we doing? No, no, no, no. Come on. >> So, let's see. We've talked about a few new zones. new dungeons, two new raids, classes, system. >> I'm going to probably play classic the whole time, right? Like classic graphics. That's just what I enjoy looking at and stuff. Sure. But I think that is something that like objectively just looks better. And I a lot of people I think feel this way and I think that they should add that sure as an option maybe for retail. >> But friends, this is only a glimpse of WoW forever. We simply don't have enough time to talk about new professions content, new reputations, all the new itemization rewards updates blowing up much of the old meta, the new PvP system, our change to riding skill to preserve that classic classic moment when you finally earn your right to ride your first mount, our official support of game pads for players who prefer to play using controllers. Playable this weekend on the show floor in an indevelopment state, by the way. And of course, the integration of previously unfinished and unused vanilla WoW content. I think this is a big one. I don't care about gamepad support. PvP is a big deal to me. I'm a big PvPer. I always have been. Uh even though that's like not what I was kind of known for originally. Like I've always PvP is like the the core of the game to me and the world feeling alive. But one thing that you'll see across this is is one of my key points that I talked about and it's addressing the entire game. Don't focus on endgame. Don't focus on leveling. Don't focus on crafting. Don't focus on PvP. Focus on everything. Okay? All that I just said and more. And I think that's that's one of the things that's absolutely vital to the success of this game is really looking at the game for what it is. And it's the whole game. It's the whole world. That is one of the key design principles of classic woow vanilla wow and it starts to kind of falter even into burning crusade by the way that I think is super important for them to hit on and and I think they truly want to do that. >> Take a second to talk about where we're going. We have learned a lot since season of discovery, including the benefits of a strong road map, which is why we are building WoW forever in the way it was originally conceived back in the early 2000s, but with everything we've learned for the past 25 years, a fast-paced production for a slowpaced game, which will allow us to deliver where we go from here. We have big plans for the coming months. You will see new raids unlock on December 9th, followed by raid after new dungeons, PvP updates, world content, and so much more. All in addition to the original vanilla WoW content. >> Play up to level 30 September 17 to October 22nd. Early name reservation character creation October 27th. Launch November 4th. Raids unlock December 9th. Barrow Deep's Hydro Summit Enixia's Lair. I kind of don't like that they that they don't have this. Reminds me of the Burning Crusade launch, but at least this is better than going from 10 man to 25 man. So, we This This isn't This probably isn't so bad. You can merge You can merge two two raids to this, and you can merge two of these to this. I think that's probably good. In the spring, they want to have two new raids, two new dungeons, new quest and playable area, new legendary quest line, PvP season refresh. So, I want to hear more about the PvP season and then major updates. Revamped iconic raid. Revamped iconic raid. So, in the summer, they'll probably release their first 40man new raid, expanded world content, two new dungeons, PVC season refresh, professional. Dude, they might be giving us too much. Is that too much? How are you going to have this much content without making some of the older stuff obsolete? because then you're gonna have too much stuff to do and you're not gonna have time to you're not you're not gonna have time to do everything because you don't really want to make I worry that this is too much. Like I'm like, dude, chat. I don't know about you guys, I got other things I got to do, man. I got a job. Look, guys, I got a wife and kids. Only one. I had two wives. I got another wife and kids. >> And this includes new quests throughout the leveling 1 through 60 journey as we add to this horizontally expanding evergreen classic Azeroth. And I want to take a second to briefly point to that major updates box right there in summer at the far end. It's a few words there that say revamped iconic raid. There's been a lot of speculation about when this game could take place, which is why I want to reiterate that this game takes place at the beginning of World of Warcraft and tells stories authentic to that time period. The original iconic raids that you know and love have not opened yet and we're excited for you to rediscover them in the future. But friends, this is just a taste of the year of the year ahead and not even a peak at where we're planning to go beyond this. >> However, it is based on what you've seen so far. I promise you it is so much bigger than that. >> Our ambition is mighty, but most importantly, we have room to pivot based on community feedback. I think it's super important. >> We're building this game with you and we are not just building for today >> but for something that lasts and nothing is off the table. Not even a new class. >> Going back to this road map, you may have noticed there's a big gap right there right around the winter time frame. Let's discuss that. Uh but first I want to take a second to talk about a picture. a picture that was framed and has hung on my wall at Blizzard since 2023. >> Hardcore represented a turning point for us. >> Oh, I heard about this. >> We had tried a few things before it, and as Ian covered, we've absolutely tried new things since, but hardcore represented the moment when Blizzard and the community came together and showed not only why World of Warcraft is one of the greatest games ever made, but why that original adventure still holds so much promise for where we could go in the future. which is why I'm also so proud to announce that hardcore will be coming to WoW Forever as well. >> Um I dude I don't like that they're doing it so early. I I don't I don't like that they're doing it so early. I feel like I feel like hardcore should come like way later. I don't want to play the game hardcore right off the rip. And to me, like within a couple months of launch, it's still pretty much right off the rip. I mean, it's gonna be one month, a month, two months of launch. Like, if they wanted to do hardcore in the summer, then I think that's I think that would have been good. Like end of spring summer, then that's fine. You know, give it like six to n months, I think it needed at least 6 months, but like doing it like 2 months in. If I'm playing the real game for real, I don't want to go play I don't want to dip and go play hardcore for content. Like to me this is like a catering to streamer. This is like an actual like you know you know me like I'm not I'm obviously not streamer hater type person. Obviously I'm very like grounded what I'm saying but this very much is like a catering to streamers and catering to stream community thing where they know like the stream hype of the new game is going to dwindle within a couple months right one to two months after launch. And they're they're it's like they're trying to juice it for streaming. But I don't think that's necessarily the best thing for the game. I I would really like to have seen them like give it a little bit more time because it's like you do hardcore and then this patch comes out it's like well I want to go focus on the real game or like a lot of people not really wanting to play hardcore because they're focused on their main character. I don't think hardcore hits this hard two months in. I'm talking about maximizing hardcore. It probably needs a little bit of time and you could maximize it because then you're pulling people from this cuz I don't think you're going to really have a big fall off after two months. I think 6 months maybe. That's just my opinion. And if you happen to pick up the collector's edition, we hope you love the logo on the box. >> As stupid as I think the name World of Warcraft Forever is, >> and I don't really actually care that much. You can call the game whatever and I would play it. I think the logo is actually pretty good. I think they did a really good job with the logo >> box. We hope you love it on the game box. And when you see what else is inside that box, we hope you love >> We hope you love your very own bear statue. which signifies where this all began. Not just with hardcore, but also way back in November of 2004. On behalf of the Wild Classic team and the entire World of Warcraft team, thank you. When I started on Classic, our dream was to get here. We are here because of you. Thank you for being here. Thank you for your feedback. Thank you for believing in this dream. I'll see you in game on November 4th. Beta starts this Thursday and you can play the demo here today. Have a great Blisscon everyone. Wow. Pretty good. Pretty good. Pretty good. I think that was a great deep dive, a great what's next panel. I I think they did a great job with that. There's obviously some things that I'm I'm more excited about than not. There's some things that I think maybe it would have been better if they did this and that. Uh but that's okay, right? Like that's that's just part of it. I have a lot of hope. I really do. I really do have a lot of hope for for Classic Plus, Wow Forever, whatever you want to call it. And I also have a lot of hope going forward that people are going to enjoy a lot of the content coming here because again, Classic Cast is coming back. Chat, Classic Cast is coming back after 7 years hiatus. I'm bringing back my old podcast from before Classic launched. I'm very, very excited. We're going to be doing it on an all new YouTube channel. Everything is SPF TV. YouTube, Instagram, Discord, Reddit, Twitch, Twitter, Rumble, uh Kick, Tik Tok, Instagram, if it exists. Everything is SPF TV. You can follow me everywhere, sub everywhere, do whatever it is, whatever it's called everywhere. Make sure to do that. I multiream everywhere on Twitter, on Rumble, on Kick, on YouTube, and on Twitch. So, you can watch my stream however you want to watch my stream. Thank you guys so much for watching. We got big times coming. Classic WoW guys back. Wow is back.