Video summary
The podcast argues that a return to traditional gender roles, often associated with the "Trad" movement, cannot simply replace progressivism because fundamental societal realities have shifted irreversibly. The host emphasizes that women now possess unprecedented control over reproduction through birth control and widespread employment, meaning any future framework must account for these facts rather than attempting to revert to an era where men could secure relationships solely through financial provision or "Alpha" status. While the speaker acknowledges some value in traditional masculine-feminine dynamics within intimate settings like the bedroom, he criticizes modern conservative rhetoric that relies on derision and hatred toward women. Instead of viewing male leadership as authoritarian dominance, a viable future model must be cooperative, involving consultation and consent from female partners who are often highly educated and successful professionals themselves. A significant portion of the discussion addresses the changing landscape of dating preferences among women over the last two decades. The host notes that while roughly 45% of women previously refused to date men earning less than them, this figure has dropped significantly to around 29%, suggesting a gradual shift in expectations as female status and education rise. Consequently, relying on traditional metrics like income or physical dominance is no longer sufficient for attracting partners; men must offer unique value beyond financial resources or sexual access. The speaker posits that women have successfully integrated masculine traits such as independence and career ambition while retaining feminine qualities, whereas many men remain stuck in outdated socialization patterns where they prioritize work to the detriment of emotional connection. This creates a disparity where women are becoming "Alpha Omega" figures who manage their own lives effectively, leaving men struggling to adapt without incorporating necessary feminine attributes like communication and empathy into their psyches. The conversation heavily critiques toxic elements within the manosphere, particularly regarding emotional vulnerability and manipulation tactics often promoted by red pill ideology. The host explicitly distances himself from these views, labeling them as "blue pilled" in contrast but also rejecting extreme misogyny to advocate for a balanced approach. He argues that while some men fear being emotionally vulnerable will lead to rejection, true strength lies in the ability to be communicative and open without appearing weak or childish. Drawing on personal experience with his wife and observations of successful relationships, he suggests that emotional intelligence is a critical predictor of relationship longevity, outweighing factors like education level or earnings. The speaker illustrates this by noting that women often crave partners who can show vulnerability alongside competence, creating a dynamic polarity rather than the one-dimensional aggression sometimes advocated in online communities. Finally, the episode touches upon how social media and technology are reshaping standards for masculinity through fitness influencers and Testosterone Replacement Therapy (TRT). The host observes an alarming trend where men feel pressured to use TRT or performance-enhancing gear just as women face pressure regarding filters and cosmetic procedures, leading many young lifters to expect unrealistic results in short periods. He clarifies that while he uses TRT himself without symptoms of low testosterone, the accessibility of these treatments contributes to a distorted view of male potential where natural development is undervalued against artificial enhancements. Ultimately, the speaker concludes that society should optimize for maturity and emotional growth rather than superficial metrics like Rolex watches or follower counts on Tinder. He urges men to integrate femininity and masculinity not as binary boxes but as complementary traits that enhance their humanity, focusing on building flourishing relationships based on genuine connection rather than competing in a rigged game of objective status symbols.
Read the full video transcript
if the progressive thing isn't viable
does that mean that the Trad thing's
viable
uh no absolutely not absolutely not and
this one this is kind of what this is
what frustrates me so much is that
Progressive are obviously lost but then
like conservatives or some of the Trap
people like okay we're gonna go back to
being tread no you're not we're never
getting rid of abortion we're never
gonna go to birth control women are
working in ways that they never have
before and they have so much control
over reproduction that the world is
fundamentally changed and whatever we go
forward with in the world it has to take
into account those two realities so
anybody that's walking out here
expecting that men can get women with
paychecks or by being Alpha you're
everything you're saying it doesn't
matter anymore you're talking about a
world that doesn't exist anymore
um and anybody that's talking about like
very traditional roles in terms of like
who's earning more money in the house or
whatever you're probably not relevant
anymore so we have to carve out some
world in the future where we have some
idea of a masculine or male archetype
that's compatible with the fact that
your wife might be earning or even out
earning you right that has to be a thing
because once Pandora's Box is open in
terms of like the reproduction [ __ ] and
the working [ __ ] it's just not going to
go away women are going back to to what
they were before it's not going to
happen and it sucks because like it
would be interesting to see a lot of
like Trad talks in that direction
there's only you know what there's only
one person I've ever heard give a good
take on tried relationships and it was
[ __ ] Ben Shapiro did you see Ben
Shapiro's conversation with Lex Friedman
bits of it uh I come from a very
conservative background I grew up
Catholic and when I listen to
traditional people talk about male
female relationships
that the woman was staying in the house
it was always something I was talking
about with the utmost amount of respect
um a woman might stay in the house but
like this this whole the way that like
the father is the leader like it's kind
of true but it was always with
consultation and consent Cooperative yes
always and the way that people talk
about it today is with such [ __ ]
derision and hatred for women and like
oh yeah like she stays in the house the
man is the leader the man is in charge
and it's like even the sitcoms before
even when the fathers were highly
competent show that the woman was very
much an important figure Bill Cosby was
like was he a doctor or a dentist and
like his wife like even he was good of
his wife um in The Fresh Prince of
Bel-Air
um the uncle
um Uncle Phil was a [ __ ] high-powered
attorney lawyer and his wife was very
scary right that was always the case the
way we rolled that forward into the
period where men became the Clowns the
Homer Simpsons of the world the Peter
Griffins of the world it's even more
it's the is the competent one she's the
one that's balanced she runs the home
she runs the man yeah even in a
traditional sense so like when the try
people talk about this is one of my big
complaints about like red pillars this
is always so much adversity between men
and women rather than like cooperation
so any Trad thing going forward
um I don't think there's anything wrong
with tread stuff some of it is fun
um like some masculine feminine roles
can be fun in the bedroom out of the
bedroom whatever but it just has to be
done with respect to where the kind of
like the labor market is and the
education and everything and the
Reproductive Rights are today because
that's not going to change so it has to
incorporate that going forward how do
you square the circle of uh women's I'm
going to call it over uh success but
women's increased success in both
education employment and status with the
fact that on average women want to date
a man who's as educated or more as
employed or more as status for a lot
more women want to but that has changed
pretty dramatically um I wish I had this
set in hand but I want to say it was
like 20 years ago it was like it was
like 45 of women would never consider
dating a guy that was earning more than
that was earning less than them and I
think that number has fallen out of like
29 and it'll probably continue to change
over time but um yeah that's going to be
something changing going forward the
this might just be my capitalist mindset
but but like I always when people email
me and they always say like Destiny I
want to start like this business I want
to start this website like what's your
piece of advice to me the one thing that
I always ask somebody is
if you want to start a small business
first question in my opinion you should
be able to answer is why would somebody
use your thing over anything else if you
don't have a Snappy response to that
then quit go do something else you need
to know a media like they want to use my
thing or watch me because I can offer
this unique thing and I think you should
approach everything in life like that so
if you're a man and you're approaching a
woman and you're trying to say like okay
I want to be in a relationship a woman
well what do you have to offer what's
the value add it can't just be a
paycheck because women are working it
can't just be dick because she's got
birth control and Tinder it has to be
something more than that and people
aren't equipping men I think to have a
good answer to that question
um you know you can talk about the alpha
hyper masculine stuff but like to be
that masculine you're talking about like
one percent of guys you know you're
talking about like even six figure
depending on where you're at might not
necessarily be the [ __ ] you know you're
talking about a very very small
percentage so I feel like a lot of
people aren't equipping men like to be
able to like have that value ad for
women what else some of the value adds
then if it's outside of providing
resources employment Etc there's gonna
be a
a lot of people saying this here's how I
view like The World Is Gone okay
women
um were feminine men were masculine and
women over the past 20 30 40 years have
done a really good job at kind of like
capturing and incorporating a whole
bunch of masculine traits okay women are
working they have a lot of Independence
they're kind of managing their [ __ ]
they've done a really good job at
incorporating that while also still
being feminine some people say I make
you less feminine but like they still
have like the feminine traits too they
can take care of houses they can clean
and all they should maybe some of them
can't cook whatever
um for men I feel like because of the
way that we were raised The Way We Were
socialized or whatever we still kind of
have our masculine things like men can
work jobs and do that and they do
sometimes even to their detriment for
example like over the coronavirus
pandemic
um
men were staying home more than women to
continue working to provide their for
their families right so the education
Gap grew even more during the pandemic
seven times more men dropped out of
college during covert than women yeah to
maintain like households and everything
right so men are still working they're
doing that but the problem is men
haven't Incorporated any of the feminine
traits into their like psyche so women
are now like these like Alpha Omega like
masculine feminine creatures that are
now going through yeah they're going
through the world and men are like okay
well um I'm like I'm very masculine and
it's like okay well can you be
communicative do you have emotional
intelligence can you do any of these
things things that traditional like guys
don't give a [ __ ] about because like I
don't like I don't need to be
emotionally intelligent yeah you need my
money to survive [ __ ] what are you
gonna do right and now she's like well I
have enough money [ __ ] you and I was
like okay so one of the one of the
things that I could see is a
complication or a wrinkle there is that
the sex drive and desire for women from
men is so great that even a woman who
has ingrained her masculine is still
going to be attractive to the guy for
sure I'm not convinced that a guy who
has embodied his feminine becomes more
attractive to to a woman especially when
you have this disparity with regards to
earning an education
I think it's possible I just think we
have like really weird and toxic ideas
of like what feminine means especially
from like red pill or manuscript faces I
run into this all the time that for
instance it's oh man okay here's a
really really insane example to me that
I hear okay I don't know if you've said
this but a lot of red pillars say this
thing where it's like if you're ever you
should never ever be emotionally
vulnerable to a woman because she might
never ever I've ever said that I'm not
just to get it out there so that you
understand my positioning within the
world of men's advice I'm not a part of
the manosphere I never have been I'm not
red pill I never have gosh I gotcha okay
I am so blue pilled that I'm cooked in
the eyes of the manosphere and I'm so
bigoted that I'm a misogynist in the
eyes of Guardian readers guys so I split
the difference straight down the middle
you have okay okay and when it comes to
the emotional vulnerability thing
that is a story that is told by men who
have only ever been in relationships
with women who haven't got good uh
emotional control there are women out
there who will and I've been in
relationships with some of them that so
vulnerability as a strength show me
opening up or even yeah or even so
people will say that like if you're ever
emotionally vulnerable she might leave
you right but if you're like and if
you're an emotionally intellectual man
you know emotional intelligence
um emotional vulnerability is one of the
biggest tools a manipulator can use
totally [ __ ] mind [ __ ] somebody
because showing limited Master
vulnerability can get a woman incredibly
obsessed with you and any guy that like
is like a manipulative person knows that
well think about what the push and pull
is right the high-powered Boss [ __ ]
female lawyer that wants to be tied up
and domed by her husband on the night
time why is that hot why is that
interesting because of the polarity
sometimes yeah the same the same thing
goes for the guy that can be vulnerable
on one side but is also super competent
you know going out there and doing his
thing is able to show strength but show
something else too yes yes absolutely
the polarity is really important and I
know this in my life because I'm online
I'm like hyper aggressive Ultra debate
bro you know very uh I'll say yeah I'm
very very aggressive but then um did you
say want to be pegged in the bedroom no
nice try
um but like on a personal level if
somebody sees me and I'm like a bit more
emotionally vulnerable or more open to
somebody it feels like very special it
feels very earned like oh cool like and
every woman I've talked to I have never
in my life had a woman tell me like God
I wish you would just be more aggressive
to me personally it's always like I wish
you would open up more I wish you'd be
like more blah blah blah I'm just like I
try I have issues with someone it's like
yeah but um that just that's an idea of
like what it means to be more feminine
but every time you say that to like a
red pill or whatever they're like oh you
want to just like cry and sob and blah
blah blah no that's being a [ __ ]
child okay think about that uh it's
better to be a warrior in a garden than
a gardener in a war quote that everybody
loves to throw around okay turn that on
its head and say it's exactly the same
thing but in this instance being a
warrior is being able to integrate your
emotions yeah but okay is it not better
to have an understanding of your
emotions being connection with and then
choose to deploy them when you think
that it's appropriate and be able to
open up as opposed to being like no this
is just a black box that me and no one
else is ever going to look at and I'm
going to die at age 70 because of
[ __ ] like emotional spiritual death
yeah
yeah it's just it's really dumb like
that having that emotional intelligence
is so so important it's the number one
thing I need to work on in my life that
I'm like actively like working a lot
with my wife even is like trying to be
like a little bit more emotionally
communicative because I've grown up like
as a very stoic person but um I think I
think that every woman wants like that
type of communication with a guy on a on
a healthier level but a lot of men don't
learn it because we don't really
communicate with ourselves like that
um there are some women out there I
think that would see I I've been around
them ones that uh will say if I see my
partner make a joke that doesn't land I
like I cringe inside my ovary shrivel up
inside the hyper hyper tuned to a man's
state it might be there are also some
women that only did guys with super huge
forearms but I mean like there's always
going to be like the exceptions of
course whatever you say yeah well there
you go yeah but I mean like for in
general like being a bit more
emotionally intelligent and
communicative is pretty important as a
guy I think you have to you need to be
especially to understand like women like
you need to be more in tune with
yourself to see it like in other people
too remember as well the the biggest
predictors when it comes to longevity in
a relationship are emotional stability
conscientiousness growth mindset those
are the one they have the best
predictive power
the stuff like
um traditional attractiveness
education level education level is uh
controlled for a little bit but earnings
have none of this but that's not what
you're optimizing for and this is where
I think that in trying to integrate some
of the insights I talk about a ton on
the show but saying okay what's your
outcome goal here is your outcome goal
to be able to [ __ ] as many girls as
possible or to sleep with one guy and
never catch feels or is it to try and
have a flourishing relationship that's
going to make you feel fulfilled and not
mean that you die alone at like [ __ ]
75 with a ton of dogs yeah like
what are we optimizing for yeah yeah and
like I talk about
like in my opinion there's like people
treat it as like there's two boxes
you've got femininity and masculinity
and then like you try to like maximize
women femininity men masculinity and I
always like there's like three bucks you
get like femininity maturity and
masculinity we all need to work on our
maturity and then like femininity
masculine there's like really fun things
on the side you know if you've got a guy
who is incredibly intelligent he's a
hard worker he's really driven he's in
tune with everything and he's like he's
you know tries his best like that's
awesome if he's also like six four
that's a huge that's a bonus it's like a
fun thing on the side or if you've got a
girl who's got like you know she's got
all of her stuff figured out and she
like big boobs like that's cool like the
masculine feminine things are like
really fun things on the side and they
can like be really fun things to play
with but that's not like the main
driving contributing successes in these
relationships I think you know think
about what current dating optimizes for
though it optimizes for those easily
displayable objective metrics of success
it's the Rolex on your Tinder profile
it's the number of followers that you've
got it's the blue tickets the car it's
the size of the boobs it's a lip filler
Etc yeah and for [ __ ] men today is
[ __ ] trt I can't I think guys are
heading towards a world where we're
finally going to start to see how
negative social media can affect you in
the way that has been affecting women
for so long okay why because all these
[ __ ] now okay all these guys I
don't give a [ __ ] 99 of Fitness
influencers are on [ __ ] gear and trt
counts as gear now okay every
[ __ ] does I haven't seen so many
videos so many things you guys like oh
these are like my six month uh results
for like lifting or whatever and these
guys are like they're lean as [ __ ]
they're getting huge and it's like oh
like I'm 27 Lifting for the first time
in five months this is my like bro
really so why is that what's that got to
do with the female impact of social oh
because I think for women I think women
see like a whole bunch of like this is
what women should look like you should
be this and that and like everybody's
using like filters and lip filler and
and
for guys it's like yeah it's gonna be
next oh well if you're a guy and you've
been Lifting for six months you should
look like this and it's like no shot
yeah interesting and I've seen more and
more of those like pop up everywhere now
where it's almost like and because trt
is so accessible these days
yeah they're very low what do you think
the last time I checked is 308 wow that
is low yeah yeah that's like nearly
subclinical I think like it's like I've
heard the Rangers number from 300 to 1
000 or you've got eight you're playing
with eight yeah or 350 to 1000 so I'm
already below it but I don't have any of
the symptoms of low T so like uh yeah
I'm drunk dude I'm in the gym I'm doing
my best but yeah well played um in other
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