Why The Pelosi AKA Honest Act Finally Fixes The SCAM on Capital Hill & Wall Street Chris Josephs

Money printing has turned the entire world into gamblers, forced to risk it all in the stock market just to escape the crushing effects of inflation. Now, today's guest is showing that even that game is rigged. Chris Josephs accidentally became one of the most important whistleblowers in finance. His app, Autopilot, started as a joke with a tagline "Invest like a politician", but ended up exposing just how deeply corrupt Congress has become. His online trackers show how lawmakers like Nancy Pelosi appear to be profiting from insider knowledge while everyone else is left to try their luck. If you've ever felt like the system is broken, here's your proof. And here's your road map for how to win even when the game is rigged against you. Has Congress just become a corrupt hedge fund? Because looking at some of the data that you guys are putting out, it seems self-evident that they are trading on insider information. I mean, I wouldn't go so far as to say that they are blatantly outright wanting to trade on insider information. Very generous. Yeah, I know, right? I'm covering my bases. But, what I would say is they do a lot of sketchy stuff that align with things that could be portrayed and seen as insider trading for the everyday individual. You know, examples like buying a stock, having a law come out to benefit that stock, the stock goes up 30%, they then happen to be sitting on the committee that oversaw the law that passed. So, now they're profiting from things like that. That is happening on a day-to-day basis. Are they calling up their financial advisor or going right to their Robinhood app doing it right while they're in those committees? Mhm. I don't know. It's hard to prove, but there is sketchy stuff going on. They are outperforming the market, and I think the public is kind of pissed and fascinated with it at the same time. Yeah. So, the whole idea of uh invest like a politician, which is the the slogan of what you guys are doing, why was the response to go, "Okay, well, if we can't beat them, let's invest just like them." The story on how the Pelosi tracker started that culminated into autopilot, which is you know, again our app slogan invest like a politician shouldn't be that popular. It's pretty popular and I think it kind of captures what you were kind of getting at that if you can't beat them join them movement. But it started back in 2020 2021 where anyone on social media would see these things going on. Unusual whales is an account on X. They deserve a ton of credit. Quiver quantitative they're an account on X. They call out these politician stuff too and they deserve a ton of credit as well. But back in 2020 when everyone in their mom was investing in stocks because COVID happened and the government gave you two grand to gamble with. People started trading stocks and people started being paying a lot more attention to it. We were one of those people kind of building our app at the time which was called Iris. It was a social investing app to follow your friends stock portfolios. When I'm I'm the co-founder of it and when I was thinking about how do we grow the thing, I turned to social media and I saw that unusual whales was starting to call out some of these politician trades. And it initially caught my eye and I was surprised at it because at the time I didn't necessarily know it was legal. Like I'm 29 now. I didn't grow up studying politicians trading in 2018 when I was in college. I noticed it in 2020 and it surprised me that how can that kind of be a thing? How is that even legal to begin with? Why would it be illegal? What is the mechanism that you think is going on behind the scenes? What's crazy is it was didn't even have to publish their trades before 2012. Politicians the entire time that we've been tracking them and I honestly I think the entire history of the stock market, they've been allowed to actively trade in whatever they want. There has never been any guard guard rail saying, "Hey, you as a politician, you cannot trade that certain individual stock or that industry." The only things that have happened that have actually kind of capped this blatant hypocrisy has been the stock act in 2012 which forced them to publicly disclose those filings. And there's a story on how that all happened because they were trading on the the housing crisis, which is insane. Walk me through that though, cuz for I think that the average person does not understand how money works full stop. They don't understand the stock market or even necessarily the fundamental idea behind assets. So, what is it that triggers somebody like unusual whales to say, "Hold on a second, this is bad." versus this is a thing that's happening. I think it's two things. One is the corruption where kind of we just hinted at at the beginning. Like what caught unusual whales' eyes, what caught my eyes? I think it was just the blatant corruption of how are these politicians allowed to trade in in I came from the finance background, but how are these politicians allowed to trade in individual stocks while me, you know, my friends were all working in New York City, we can't do it. So, that I think was like the first part. Because uh so, I have buddies that worked in investment banking. They would be covering, you know, a certain sector like healthcare. They have insider information on deals. They have insider information on the broader spectrum of the healthcare industry. They, per the SEC and per their their employers, are not allowed to trade individual stocks in healthcare. And it makes sense, you know, it's like if you're working on a deal of a merger with this one healthcare company and that one healthcare company and if you know about the information, the stock's going to go up. You would want to buy that stock. The SEC though is like no, you are not allowed to do that because that would be called that would be insider information. The politicians are allowed to do that exact scenario, exact same thing. They sit on the committees though and their employer is the US government, but they can know things and they can go trade stocks and they can do things to set themselves up to benefit the news that is going to come out. And, you know, COVID COVID is where a lot of this stuff started with Richard Burr and I I can get into that story. But to answer your question too on like why what does the average American not truly understand about it is 60% of Americans right now are investing in the stock market. They know they have to do it. They don't necessarily really know why they have to do it, but you know, things like inflation, the stock market is the only really way to grow wealth. Everyone's got a 401K for the most part. They should be investing in the stock market. Once you get into it though and you realize that the game is not rigged for the everyday retail investor. It's actually rigged against you, you then start realizing and your your eyes are opening up to more and more kind of truths about market works and you got to be careful cuz it's a dog-eat-dog world. There's sharks out there. Politicians however though are living in this whole another world in the stock market where they are allowed to kind of do anything they want. Meanwhile, everyone is out here trying to kind of hold their own investing in individual stocks that they're trying to do and it it turned into like a hypocritical um opposition. And that I think is where social media kind of captured it all. So, What do you What do you think is worse? The fact that they have potential insider information or that they can influence something so like the Chips Act, which is going to essentially pick winners and losers? Uh which of those two is more problematic? I think the first one. I think the trading on insider information because the there's a really simple solution to it all. It's these politicians don't trade individual stocks, put it in ETFs, put it in the broader market. The reason why I answered that is it's hard to limit the politician from picking winners with some of these acts. You know, there was a bill that passed this morning for the sports betting industry. That obviously is going to be beneficial for the sports betting companies. The politician should not be limited on how they approach and kind of run jurisdiction over that bill because they own individual stocks. I think the individual stocks is the problem part and you got to cut that piece out and the solution is pretty simple. It's just put them in ETFs, put it in the S&P 500, or just don't own individual stocks to begin with. Go about your job being a politician, setting up regulations, making sure the American people are safe, which whole other conversation if they're doing that. Uh Give us some receipts. So, what are the the big sort of things that uh an account like Unusual Whales or your trackers are picking up? So, my morning routine, and Unusual Whales does this, too, is we have been studying this stuff for so long that we know the majority of the politicians, which ones are doing it. We know what committees they're sitting on, and we know the stocks that would kind of um what we call, you know, notable politician trade alert. It would flag it. Uh an example this morning, actually. So, it's insane terrifying. Yeah, it's what? 11:00 here. I woke up at 7:00, went through my kind of morning routine, studying the politicians, studying the trades, and I realized that uh there was a new politician named Ashley Moody, Republican from Florida. She is the politician that actually replaced Marco Rubio's Senate seat. She used to be the Attorney General in Florida. Uh back in from 2021 to essentially 2024. During that time, while she was doing it, she was very much pro getting sports legalized sports betting legalized. She would go on the record saying, you know, "Hey, this will bring 3.5 billion dollars of annual revenue to Florida. We should do this. We should get this done." She filed the trade a week ago, but the stock was originally bought on February 24th, uh 2025. That stock was a company called Genius Sports, small two-billion-dollar sports betting company. Wouldn't really kind of raise too many eyebrows unless you knew necessarily about this stuff. Turns out, two weeks after that, on March 13th, there was a uh Democrat named Richard Blumenthal. He proposed a new bill that essentially is creating legalized federal limits for sports betting. It is a path towards getting sports betting legalized for the entire country on a federal level. On that news, the stock started popping 15, 16%. Then turns out that that bill is now got reviewed twice and got pushed to the next stage of this, which is being reviewed by the Senate Judiciary Committee. Guess who sits on that committee? Oh god. It's Ashley Moody, the Republican that just bought the stock a month ago. Fast forward to today, it's up 25%. And when you we then went back and we studied is like does she have any kind of relationships in anything with that? Genius Sports, when she was the Attorney General, partnered with uh a company called um Rock um Hard Rock Sports Betting. And Hard Rock Sports Betting is the only legal entity in Florida that is allowed to sports bet to some degree. So now you then kind of come full circle and you're like, holy crap, the politician's been pushing for this the entire time in her state of Florida, just bought a stock that will benefit from this legislation if it does get passed, and now she's going to be sitting on the committee that is going to oversee and kind of pass the bill. Mhm. That's the example of rules for thee, not for me. How are they allowed to do that when you go back to the example that we were talking about with the healthcare investment banker, you know, a low-level guy that isn't going to do anything. He can't do that. Meanwhile, the politicians are blatantly doing it right in front of us. That's what irks me. That's what makes me angry, and that's what Unusual Whales, us, and Quiver Quant, the other guys in the in the space are trying to stop. Do you see it as problem solved though if the guy in the healthcare industry can also place the bets or is this a bigger problem than that? it's a bigger problem than that. I don't think the solution is uh allowing these politicians to trade the stocks. And I think it is for one reason and one reason only, it's trust. I think that there's a lot more of distrust that comes out of politicians being able to do this, whether it's shady, whether it's not shady, whether it's allowed, whether it's not allowed. Them just having that optics, I think creates a lot of problems that should not be allowed and we should cut it from the root right there. That's my solution. Okay, so I here feel a lot of pushback on this idea of oligarchy. Uh part of my drumbeat is oligarchy just means rule by the few. Uh it doesn't mean rule by the wealthy. It's a different word, but I think ultimately there's two things at play. There is rule by the wealthy, which probably would really freak people out. Uh but this feels more like a hot button issue to me of rule by the few that have insider connections, insider information, and they're using that to get wealthy. Um why do you think that strikes people as so grotesque? Yeah, I I I got a good example to hit uh to set the stage for that conversation. And it's our It's the queen of it, Nancy Pelosi. Um cuz I think like what you're describing is exactly right. And it's becoming a bigger and bigger thing now that Elon Musk is involved with the government, you know, this and that. But like let's not forget like Nancy Pelosi, you know, we're talking about rule by the few, rule by the wealthy. Nancy Pelosi's worth 280 million. She's been the Speaker of the House for, you know, 10 years. The Biden family, they're worth millions. Kamala's just signed a book deal for 20 million, you know, and Trump and them, they're not making it any better. But it's always kind of necessarily it's always been like that. Uh Nancy Pelosi, the timeline on her wealth is she got married to uh a tech investor, Paul Pelosi, back in like I think 1994, 1995. They were not wealthy at that time. Maybe they had a couple million, you know, it just for They probably were wealthy, but not not, you know, big not in 200. She has been a lifelong politician. Fast forward to the time when she became the Speaker of the House, which was the first time, I think it was around 2008, 2009, which coincidentally was when the Stock act happened. Her wealth Stock Act trading on congressional knowledge. Isn't that insane? It's literally called stop trading on congressional knowledge. That if that wasn't a sign to begin with Yeah. Her net worth when she became the speaker was around 20 20 21 22 million. Still a lot but The time of her becoming a speaker to now She's 10x that. She's gone from 22 million to now 250 260 million. It's not like she's getting paid anymore. She's been getting paid the 180 the 200,000 dollars salary consistently for the past you know x amount of years. How do you 12 13x your wealth kind of over that time period? A lot of it did come from the stock market and from her private investments and kind of things like that. And you know a good example of it is she made like 20,000% on Visa. She was able to get She was one of the politicians if you know about the stage of if there's a famous 60 minutes interview where a politician is asking Nancy Pelosi like Do you think politicians should trade stocks? Do you think it's a conflict of interest that you and your husband are allowed to get into kind of these individual stocks? And the thing went viral because she essentially was like no yeah we should be allowed to do it. It's not that big of an issue. When she was the speaker her and her husband her her husband she won't take credit for it but her husband was given special privilege to invest in the Visa IPO before it went public. So how the IPOs work in Visa you know this is the largest IPO that at the time back in 2008 2009 The bankers they take these baskets of stocks. They you know they're about to issue new shares and they go shop it around. They go to the banks they go to the the wealthy individuals the private offices to sell those shares before they bring them public. I don't know how Nancy Pelosi got access to that but she and her husband did. And they were able to get into the IPO before the actual before the shares were available to the broader public. And since that time, the stock is up 20% 20,000%. So, she probably she made probably 10 to 15 million, 20 million on that trade alone. Um so, how do these politicians get rich? A lot of it is that. And it's weird because they are only get paid a $175,000 salary, but there are countless examples of them entering office, being career long politicians, and then leaving office wealthier. Whether that's from speaking engagements, whether that's from book deals, whether that's from insider trading, you can't deny that these people's wealth does go up while they are in office, and I think that's a big problem that has gotten to the point now where you we're questioning everything and we're getting annoyed at Elon, we're getting annoyed at, you know, Elon and Trump, they have their own problems, you know, here and there, but I think it's a broader picture that uh has to be talked about about more and more. How are these politicians getting wealthy while they are in office? Okay, so let me ask, do you make a distinction between them getting wealthy off of the stock market, them getting wealthy off a book deal, a Netflix deal, any of that, or is that all the same to you? I think it's all the same to me. Um a little bit of a difference is the individual stock trading. The hard part is a lot of these politicians, their husbands and wives come are working in kind of good jobs, you know, the some of these politicians there's a politician from um Illinois or Iowa. His his wife sits on the board of a bank. And they're getting stock from that from that deal, and he the stock's up like 70 or 80%. It's called Farmers Bank Insurance. Small little microcap bank stock. They're making money on that. He's a politician, she's sitting on the board of the bank. Is that a conflict of interest? Is that Is that insider trading? Not necessarily, maybe, but they are clearly getting wealthy from that while he's in office and maybe there are things that are going on. We haven't seen any laws that have been passed to benefit that stock and benefit that bank, but they the optics again, they still are getting rich from that. Mhm. Um insider trading, they've never been proven. Multiple politicians have been investigated. Richard Burr, Kelly Loeffler, uh that trade this morning from uh Ashley Moody honestly should get investigated. Uh they've just never been proven and I think that's also the frustration around, you know, is it a problem? Yes. Is anything going to happen to it? Not necessarily. Walk us through the timeline on Richard Burr. So this is the trade that I think started the whole um microscope on them. Because it was so blatant, it was actually unbelievable. And also it was insane of what he did to investigated. fully investigated by the SEC and DOJ. Both of them. And then nothing happened. So the storyline goes on and I make kind of get the dates wrong a bit here, but this is you up, I have most of the stuff written down. Okay, perfect. Yeah. So this is 20 late 2019 early 2020. This is before the COVID scare happened. Early 2020, the public is starting to hear a little bit about COVID. What's going on? How bad is this? How kind of severe is this? Richard Burr is sat as the head of the Senate Intelligence Committee. So he was receiving kind of information. He was understanding kind of what was going on. Probably more than the general public. That's a pretty big position, head of the Senate Intelligence Committee. Oh, I think it was on March or February 7th or something around that timeline. He wrote an op-ed to the American public literally telling everyone, "Hey, don't worry. Things are going to be okay. We have our eye on this. You guys should all go about your daily business day-to-day." Pretty much telling the public not to don't worry, you know? It's fine. A week later, he is briefed as the Senate Intelligence Committee. He probably hears something that again the average everyday American doesn't know. He's now realizing like holy crap the severity of COVID is way worse than I originally thought. He calls up his financial advisor and him and his financial advisor liquidate his entire retirement account. How long after the briefing was this? Uh the same day. Yo. They all know this because of what you just said. They were got investigated by the DOJ and the SEC. So they had to publicly talk about these these phone calls that happened. He liquidated his entire retirement account. Which like you're not going off and you're not selling off your retirement account for anything. You're doing that cuz there's clearly something happening. To make matters worse he then called his brother-in-law. And his brother-in-law called his financial advisor. That first and financial advisor didn't answer. So what did he do? He called his other financial advisor. They had a two-minute conversation and then on the record after that conversation the brother-in-law and that financial advisor liquidated their 280 $300,000 portfolio all in that same timeline. So now you got the head of the Senate Intelligence Committee calling up his financial advisor selling out of his retirement. That guy then calls his brother-in-law. His brother-in-law calls his financial advisor. They sell out of their retirement account. A week later COVID kind of hits the broader public stocks fall 30% and they saved all that then and there. They then get investigated. The SEC comes in and they're like what the heck was going on? DOJ was there actually insider information? I don't know how that's not insider information. Yeah. That seems like the most obvious blueprint code of what that could be. sort of public statement the SEC or the DOJ saying They said they investigated and they couldn't find any any actual wrongdoings. And you know Richard Burr he stepped down from the head of the Senate Intelligence Committee. He's like you know while I'm getting investigated I think it's a conflict of interest the irony. It's a conflict of interest to be on the Senate Intelligence while getting investigated. He steps down. They don't find out any problems. He retires the next election cycle and he goes off into the sunset. No problems. No harm, no foul. What do you make of that? Is it that these people just have too much power? And so, meaning that somebody that's sharing the head of the Intelligence Committee, he's not the guy that you want to make an enemy of the state is he's going to know a lot of things and he could go blab about it or is it well, maybe if I looked at all the same details, walk away going, "No, no, no, it's just fine." Yeah. I think it's a big club that we're all on in. I think Republican, Democrat, it doesn't matter. They all have They all are the ones making the rules and they all don't want to change it. So, the the accountability side of, you know, why does nothing ever happen? I think it's cuz they're the ones making the laws on mitigating and having jurisdiction over the people doing this and they don't want to change it for themselves. So, they kind of turn a blind eye and they don't necessarily look. An example of this is like um the aside from obviously going to jail. So, per the STOCK Act, they have up to 45 days to file those trades. If they violate that STOCK Act, they are in violation of the law, they get penalized for it. These politicians can be trading hundreds of millions of dollars, tens of millions of dollars. And if they don't have if they can't file a trade into 45 days, like what are you essentially doing? Why is it taking so long? The fine if they don't if they break the law on that is $250. It's It's a parking ticket, you know, and why is it the fine so low? It's because they're the ones that are overseeing and they're the ones that are making the rules for the club that they're in. Why would they make it any bigger? What are the incentives that they have to change anything? And I think that is the problem and that's like why we're trying to harp on this autopilot. The reason why we're essentially doing a lot of this stuff is we're trying to get them banned from trading. We're trying to bring change back into it, to bring trust back into the institutions. And it does start with them making the rules for themselves. They should not be allowed to trade stocks, and they should also should not be the ones making the laws on them being allowed to trade stocks to begin with, too. So, I think it's a big rules for thee and not for me, and it's a rich people club that we're just not in. We'll get back to the show in a moment, but first, let's talk about a reality many business owners are facing. You understand the power of social media, but you're not posting consistently because the editing process can take precious hours out of your day. Nobody wants to spend hours cutting up videos when they could be running their business. The solution is to turn the things you're already doing into social media content automatically. That's why I'm excited about Opus Clip. Their Clip Anything AI tool is changing everything. All you have to do is upload any long-form video, and Clip Anything automatically finds the best moments and turns them into social-ready clips. Our social team at Impact Theory has been using it to streamline content creation, but this isn't just for media companies. It's for any business owner who needs to maintain a social presence without sacrificing hours to video editing. Here's your chance to try it. Go to opus.pro/clipanything, and give it a try for free right now. That's opus.pro/clipanything. And now, let's get back to the show. Okay, so, you guys are banging the drum, you're posting about this on social media, certainly during COVID. I mean, this is en fuego. This is catching fire. People are going crazy. How is it possible that in 2025, this is still going on? What Where is all of this breaking down? Because I would think that we the people could make enough noise that this would get changed, but it's not happening. Yeah, you would think. And I mean, on top of that, like this is why you kind of cool the cool thing about Autopilot is uh it's one thing to call out the politicians and like it's another thing to then kind of some put some money behind it, you know, saying you know, [ __ ] it if you guys aren't going to change it, we're going to start investing alongside it. We built an app that literally does that. And so now we have an app that lets you go and invest alongside the politicians. It's then a whole 'nother thing to have it become such a problem that there's $500 million copying Nancy Pelosi, Dan Crenshaw, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Mark Wayne Mullin, Republican, Democrat, doesn't matter. And that has turned into such like a rallying cry. And that's our biggest hope of why we think that we can kind of get something passed because it's again one thing to call them out, it's another thing to follow them, it's another thing to actually get some money and invest alongside them because it perfectly portrays like the corruption and the blatant problem with it. 2025 is coming around, we've been doing it four or five years. There are bills now that are being pushed to try and get them banned from trading, but nothing has ever happened. No politician has ever necessarily really reached out to us to try and actually get a ban across the across the the finish line. They haven't or cuz you said they haven't really. Has somebody or The only politician that we've had constant contact with is Ro Khanna. Hm. Uh and he credit to him and also credit to AOC. Um they've been pushing for it. Matt Gaetz did a little bit. Um Ro Khanna is the politician that has been pushing for four things. One, a ban on congressional stock trading, two, term limits, three, ban um special lobbyists and interests, and then four, you are not allowed to be a politician, have that job, and then be hired by you know, a Lockheed Martin or a Raytheon, mega healthcare company to consult them of how to get a lot get get from the laws. Now he's just flirting. Yeah, I know, right? Like can you imagine? Is he popular? I've heard the name, but I know literally nothing about him. and the funny uh irony of that is his um district is San Francisco. So he comes from the tech world and Nancy Pelosi, also San Francisco. So I wonder what their choices. I know, right? Um he is popular with that, 100%. Uh he's still though he's not one of the more powerful Democrats, I think. This is just me I don't fully understand the power laws of these different politicians and who's more powerful than the other. But that message that we post on our social media accounts on Instagram and Tik Tok or Twitter definitely gets a lot of attention and people do 1,000% support that. There's 86% of Americans support the politicians getting banned from stock trading. I don't know who the other 14% are, but They're related to politicians. Yeah, and if there's one thing that I think all Americans can agree on right now, you know, we're such a polarized nation, it's sad, but everyone agrees that these politicians should not be allowed to trade stocks and Ro Khanna is one of those politicians that has been pushing for these bills and blatantly calling it out trying to get a ban passed. He hasn't really succeeded with it, but we do chat with him. All right, let's talk about directionality here. So I love what you guys are doing. To me it seems very wise to say, "Okay, if you guys aren't going to change it, then we're just going to ride along." Uh but do you think Trump is a sign that we're moving in the right direction or the wrong direction? Yeah. Trump is a tricky one. Because there's never been someone that is so big, so popular. You know, he's got his whole following with him. And there's also never been someone that has been kind of so vocally and so open about what he wants. He's very black or white. He's I want tariffs, I'm going to push for tariffs. I want crypto, I'm going to push for crypto. Before Trump even started, we created the J.D. Vance stock portfolio. And J.D. Vance, because he was a senator, uh we were able to kind of see in his holdings were roughly ETFs, but he also owned Bitcoin. And he owned Rumble and a couple other smaller stocks. So, we've been tracking kind of the Trump party, you know, for the past year and a half, um since J.D. Vance was um announced as the VP. Trump though, again, does make it more complicated because of the conflicts of interest and the clear blatant, you know, benefits that he would get if some of these things do get passed. A an example is the Trump coin. Um that probably shouldn't have happened. I don't think that that did him any good. sure, or That Yeah, let me That should not have happened. Yeah. Yeah. That That one I'm as pro-crypto as you're going to get. I think people should be able to bet on meme coins all day long, but good lord, the president launching a meme coin is pretty horrific. Yeah. And I don't know if this is just bad consultation. I don't know if there's people in his party, or people in his group that didn't see the the downside of that, especially like if you come from the crypto community, you would know. Like Brian Armstrong, these CEOs are they're calling it out. They're like, "That probably shouldn't have been allowed." Um that should not have happened. And that I think set the standard and set the the landscape for bigger kind of problems that could kind of come down the path from that. Uh he has kind of backed away from the Trump coin a little bit. Really? He hasn't Well, actually, he He So, the timeline was he released it right before the inauguration. And then the thing went up to like 35, 40 billion. He didn't speak about anything until probably a week to 2 weeks later when uh a reporter asked him in the White House, in the Oval Office, like, "What do you think about the Trump coin?" And they were like, "What do you think about how your net worth went up, you know, however many, 10, 5 billion?" And he kind of brushed it off. He's like, "Oh, I didn't I don't really know too much about that." You know, playing the classic kind of keep your hands clean of it. If you study the unit economics of how the Trump coin was launched, these insiders do have a lockup period. And they have I think it was 3 months, 6 months, 12 months where after Trump launched that coin, he can't just sell it the day after because of this lockup period. Where it gets interesting though is a week ago, he tweeted "I love Trump coin." Or something like that. And then the the the coin went up again a little bit after that. Yeah, exactly. Here we go. And on Twitter, people started calling it out saying like, "Are we getting closer to that lockup period? Is he trying to pump the coin right before?" We'll have to see cuz the the beauty of crypto is you can track it all. You know the wallets he's got. You can call it out right then and there. But again, the problem with it that I run in the Pelosi Tracker kind of run into is we are very bipartisan. We call out everybody. Like even earlier today, we were talking about Ashley Moody. We haven't even really necessarily gotten into the the stuff that Pelosi is doing cuz like we are very bipartisan. Trump being so open and blatant about that coin has to be called out by the Pelosi Tracker. And we're trying to do our best to call out what is and what isn't. But with him, it's hard because there's just so much. You don't want to tweet about it every single day. Um that we are trying to balance the the calling it out but not getting too political with him because he is the most polarizing dude probably out there now, him and Elon. Um and that's kind of the the landscape, the avenue that we're working on. But the public doesn't like that he did it either. I couldn't really find too many people supporting the president of the United States launching a meme coin. Um but he did the same thing with DJT, you know. The What's Give people information DJT is the Donald Trump SPAC. You know, it's essentially like it's the company that oversees Truth Social. And, you know, I think that per their earnings reports, they have around two or three million dollars in revenue, but they're worth eight or nine billion. Yeah. And I think that That's crazy. Yeah, the multiples are insane on it. But Impact Theory is bigger than DJT Yeah, you could be uh Yeah, you could probably go off and like buy um I don't think we're going to value out at nine billion dollars. exactly. But what what's fascinating about the DJT stuff is uh the and kind of follow my path here, be curious to hear your thoughts on it, is like um the DJT is a representation of the support for Trump. He launched that. Everyone It's so public that this this company Truth Social, like yes, it might have promise, you know, it could be doing stuff that's great, could not be doing stuff that's great. But at least like, you know, you have the unit economics, they're making two million dollars. The people are still buying it though. You know, Marjorie Taylor Greene the politician, she bought Donald Trump's stock. And I see it as like a support mechanism for the stock market where when he was getting um investigated by New York for the Mar-a-Lago things like that, support him or hate him, you know, he used the Donald Trump uh the DJT stock as a got rallying cry to be like, "They're trying to take all my money. You can support me with this um with this asset." The world's biggest uh GoFundMe. Exactly. And what is fascinating though about that, and this is why like maybe he was in on the Trump coin a little bit more than I would necessarily think. This is where I put my tin foil hat on is the DJT stock is the same kind of GoFundMe style thing for Wall Street as Trump coin is for the crypto industry. There's not millions and millions of people in the crypto world lining up to buy and support DJT stock. So, what do you do? You launch an asset in that world, Trump coin, and now you can kind of sell your support to the crypto community, and the crypto community can come in and invest alongside and support that politician with the money with their own money. And let me be clear, I I think there's something to that where your dollars should support the people that you want. You know, we were chatting off air a little bit about like the whole Alibaba and uh what we talked about in the Tucker Carlson podcast. Investor values. Investor values, yeah. Is there anything necessarily wrong with Trump being open and blatant about doing these things? Yes. With the Would you think with the stock? Yes. The stock is a little bit trickier though because of that Truth Social aspect of it, where there's an actually an underlying business to it. Oh, Jesus, man. I When uh when he's not president, I love it. Yeah, yeah. Hey, we have this uh former civil former civil servant who we believe is being prosecuted, and we want to like do a GoFundMe where um we can show support in a way for an actual business endeavor. There is what I call a cover story, but I think you can paint the same picture for the whole stock market. Anyway, uh there's a cover story for why we want to do this, uh which is we believe in Truth Social, and we want to see this thing do well. But, the You You started this by saying, "Look, there's just uh there's no trust because even if they aren't doing insider trading, the optics give it such a look of that's what's happening." The growing wealth divide makes that untenable, where you just cannot be playing that game. Yeah. So, when I think about I need to lay down in my own life I need to lay down principles. So, I don't want to look at uh Trump and say, "Oh, this is how Trump should be treated." I don't want to look at Pelosi and go, "This is how Pelosi should be treated." I want to step back and go, "This is how politicians should be treated." And whatever that uh whatever effect that ends up having across the board, I actually want to be blind to all the potential things that could come in the future. Biden, doesn't matter. Yeah, literally doesn't matter. Th- This is the policy. I think about this a lot as a CEO. You put in policies. You do not go, "This person can go do this. This person can go do that." You just go, "Here's our policy." And then whatever comes of it comes of it. And if I don't like the way that it's treating somebody, I'm going to adjust the policy and now it will create a an equal playing field for everybody else if I'm trying to solve that one off thing. So, either and this is something that um I will will certainly get to today is there are two choices before us in terms of how we solve this problem. Choice number one is you just start outlawing all the stuff and you say, "No, no, no. If you're going to be the president, hey, sorry, but you are going to have to sell out of that company." So, Elon Musk, if you uh pass a constitutional amendment and one day you want to run for president, you're going to have to sell out of all your companies. And either don't run for president or sell. Those are your choices. Or we say, "Yo, I would I want the best and the brightest. I want the most successful people in the world to want to be president. This is amazing. Uh therefore, I'm going to do maximum transparency and I'm going to say, 'Dear Elon, dear Trump, dear Pelosi, dear anybody, anybody. Uh this is going to be real time. When you make a trade in real time, that's broadcast and now anybody uh a Chinese um foreign national, uh an American, anybody that goes, 'Ooh, I bet you know something that I don't.' Now I'm going to be able to trade with you instantaneously and you effectively through technology eradicate the idea of insider information. Because the second you move, everybody can make that same move. Technology and transparency of real time. Right. I have not thought through this well enough to know which of those is going to be better. Yeah. But that to me feels like the play and what I hear you guys saying is we're doing the transparency thing because we can't get you to stop doing things that we view as at least optically so grotesque that something has to change and possibly this is just outright corruption. Uh and if that's the case then I say well okay then that applies to Trump and you can't no matter how much once you're president no matter how much you want people to be able to support you no matter how good that was when we felt like you were being persecuted and having the justice system turned against you now that you're president like you just can't [ __ ] do that. Yeah, that's a good point. That's a good point in the contradiction of cuz like maybe even like on the on the policy side maybe there's argument to be made that that the president is just the next level of like that is a whole 'nother world. That is like the the ruler of the free world. Him launching meme coins him even having to your point the Donald Trump stock which is him even having interest in Truth Social which is a public company probably kind of can raise a ton of conflicts of interest. So I hear you on the the hypocrisy of the the contradiction of it. I guess the the thing that I maybe I'm kind of downplaying a little bit is my biggest belief is you're right these politicians should not be allowed to trade maybe kind of true full transparency around that kind of should come into play here. With Trump being the president that again maybe that's a whole 'nother world. Is there an argument where just full transparency into the whole thing and it turns into kind of the wild wild west of these politicians if they're all going to do it let's get rid of the guardrails for lack of a better way to describe it and make it all transparent all open and let the public decide on whatever they want to do. Right now we're at this this I think this problem and now that I'm thinking about it it's good that you're bringing it up cuz it's like on the one side you got all the politicians playing this one game where they are behind the veil of the Stock Act. They still can trade, but they have 45 days to do it. They're still allowed to essentially kind of trade whatever they want, but they can hide behind a lot of those rules and they don't have to be so open and so transparent about it. On the other side though, you got the most powerful person in the world blatantly doing it to a point where he is so overly transparent about it that you know exactly his entire game plan. You know how much money he's making. You know how much money his net worth is going up and he's on the whole other spectrum of transparency with it. It turns into just this whole crap shoot of like which way is right cuz he he shouldn't be allowed to do what he's doing, but his transparency and his way he's doing it his transparency and the way that he is kind of outlining how the whole thing is work is the way that these people should be doing it if they're going to do it anyway. So do do you do you understand where it's like the line of the president is in a whole 'nother world. He is being probably openly transparent about it. Meanwhile, the Congress, they are not being transparent about it and they are using the Stock Act and stuff to be able to kind of hide and do things that the American public aren't able to see. That's I think like we we see that on social media a lot and Trump, I think to your point, it's so tricky when your initial question was like is it right? Should he be allowed to do it? No. But he's being so overly obviously transparent about it that it's so easy to call him out for it to the point where it's like do we even call him out because he's telling the whole world what he's doing? You can't call him out if he's telling everybody to begin with, you know? I do. I think it it comes down to a fundamental question of what do we believe is the purpose of the presidency? Um I've never had to articulate this out loud, so forgive me if a week from now I say this is actually not what I think anymore, but my initial reaction is the sole purpose of the President of the United States is to make America better for the average American. Just a put a simple way to talk about it. Yep. And I have a feeling that given the truth of the statement, show me the incentives and I'll show you the outcome, the last thing in the world you want the President to do is play a short-term game. And even if you did something, cuz as you were talking, my initial instinct was, oh, this is create the sovereign wealth fund, the President, whoever they are, gets some piece of the sovereign wealth fund, some tiny, tiny, tiny piece uh of the sovereign wealth fund personally. And it's like, cool, if you make things better for all of us, then you get something. And then I just thought, oh my god, that will drive them to think so short-term. Yep. So then, uh my thinking was, okay, we'll make it play out over the next 10 years, and they get 10 years after they've left office, whatever the average return is over the 10-year period, that they get some ridiculously small percentage of that, and that's their payment. Uh and I can just see too many distortions coming even over a period of time like that, that you're probably better off going back to the system that we had with George Washington, which was effectively Alexander Hamilton going, you're the only person I trust not to be corrupt, that I can put in this position, and I know desperately wants to not be the President. And the only reason you're doing it is for the good of the country, and so you'd be willing to make all of these sacrifices. Yep. Um I think that that just is the right play. Now, we're not in that world right now. And so, my thing is, deal with the world the way that it is, not the way you wish it would be. And so, we have a rat's nest that we have to untangle. Um but just to linger on the point of a George Washington-like character for a minute, if we can create that kind of ethos in the culture, which I think the culture is probably closer to right now, they are so infuriated by rule by the few. They are so convinced that the few are either already rich and got rich through corruption, or if they weren't rich coming in, they're getting rich via corruption while they are in this as you said club that we don't belong to. Because that's where America is at right now, it's like you really have to find a way to create a scenario where, to your point, you're reintroducing trust in the government. And I think the only way you get there is by somebody who is saying, "Listen, um I'm just going to eschew all of this stuff for now." Which sounds like what J.D. Vance did, uh David Sacks did, where it's like these guys made choices that were worse for them. Like I love the idea that J.D. Vance holds ETFs. So now it's like, well, if the American economy is winning, he's winning in the exact same way that anybody else would win. It's the same companies. Uh he doesn't have any specific influence cuz it's such a large group of companies. Um so now it's just like, yeah, you're incentivized to make America better. One simple proxy would be the performance I mean GDP might be a better way to look at it, but you can't trade on that. So the thing that we can all trade on becomes the S&P 500, again just to oversimplify. So something like that I like. Um and feels like it probably just has to be that. And if you want to be president, then you're going to have to accept I can't have my JDT, I can't have a meme coin, and um we somehow, and this is way harder than I'm going to make it sound, we somehow get everybody to re-embrace that sense of I become the president as a tremendous act of sacrifice. Yeah. Not as a I expect to get wealthy. Now, I will plant one seed, which is I love that these guys then make a ton of money on the backside by writing their story or whatever. Um if they're out of office and at that point it's as an American person like I want to know these things. I suppose it can still be manipulated a bit in terms of um like the speaking circuit where it's like, "Hey, once you leave, I'm going to take care of you in this way." we're here, you know. Yeah, see there there would have to be guardrails around that. But um I don't like the idea of a president dying broke. Yeah, I mean like so anyway, there have to be something like that. I I think like cuz when we think about what are the different solutions to it, you know, we can again, this is why I love what we're building with Autopilot. It's like we are trying to create a rallying cry saying, "Hey, politicians, you aren't doing anything. So we are going to build an app to literally invest alongside you because you are not doing anything. And oh, by the way, and we now have half a billion following you and we're crushing it. We're making millions. Maybe you guys should take this kind of more seriously and like stop this. And like that's our way to get more and more people eyeballs, more and more people to see it. And it's worked, you know, we got a million followers on Instagram, a million followers on Twitter, the Pelosi tracker. We are on shows like this. People wouldn't know about this stuff unless I think like the app is a great way to capture that emotion because your money is actually involved in it. When we think about solutions though, it's like we are trying to get them banned from trading. And the ban is much more complicated because of the different nuances and I'll get into that in a second with the with the what bills have been passed or what bills are getting potentially down the line. But the three kind of main solutions and again, pre- president's a whole 'nother world. You are completely right. Uh one, get rid of the delay. Allow them to trade individual stocks, but open up that transparent layer where it's like, "Look, if you guys are going to trade, we'll let you trade. This is just one solution, but get rid of the delay." So now if you're trading, the whole American public knows that you're trading and they can copy you, not copy you, do what they want. But, the American people at least could be like, "We're making progress on this. They are at least being open and more transparent about what they're doing." Downside of that is you still have the terrible optics. People don't trust them. They still could be {quote} inside of trading. But, at least you have the ability to um uh see what they're doing. Second option is this blind trust idea where you take your individual assets and you give it to a third-party financial advisor, {quote} a blind trust. They could do whatever they want. You don't have any access to them. And to be fair, some of these politicians do have blind trusts set up where they are not trading, but it's the financial advisor making trades for them. The problem with that solution, in my opinion, is I don't think that solves the optics issue whatsoever. I still think there's going to be American people being like, "Okay, cool. You got a blind trust. You're still calling up your guy. You're still talking to him at dinner. You know, you're not just going third-party with this." That I don't think is the solution. The third solution that I like, and I think it is in agreement with you, is get everyone into the market where it's like you sell out of your individual assets and you just put it in the S&P 500 where you don't You still partake in the upside of America. You still partake in the growth, the GDP. You are still incentivized to grow us as a nation. But, you are not doing it picking winners and losers in individual stocks. When the whole market goes up, you go up, so does everyone else's retirement accounts. You know, all these people's retirement accounts, the majority of them are in these ETFs. When the markets go down, you feel the pain in the same way that every every every other individual American feels the pain. But, we're all in this patriotic kind of group together because the politicians' incentives is to grow as a country. And that I think is the best solution. The problem where it gets complicated is the kids and the spouses. So, there was a bill that was passed by Jon Ossoff and um um what's his name? Josh Hawley. They got the bill the farthest that's ever been gotten to in the Senate. The first bill that's ever made it to the Senate. In that bill, they proposed three things. One, no politicians are allowed to trade individual stocks. Great. We get that argument. That makes sense. Two, um the spouses and the children can't trade by 2027. Start getting a little bit more complex where it's like, "Okay, I'm a politician, but can my kid who works at JP Morgan, is he allowed to trade? Is my spouse that's, you know, working at Amazon, are they allowed to trade?" Like that Is it con- constitutionally allowed to tell a spouse what to do? Little bit of gray area, but still I could see the argument there. The third thing though that this new bill introduced, and I don't know if the majority of the American public know this, is and this is again where it gets so complicated. It is In that bill, they would require all politicians to divest from private individual assets. So, if I wanted to run for Congress, you know, I'm 29, I got a good little community behind me. Maybe I do, you know, maybe something changes when I'm 35 and I want to run. If I were to do that, I would have to sell out of Autopilot, which is a financial investment platform, not necessarily really anything to do with politics, but it's still a private investment in my personal kind of wealth. And with that new bill, I would be forced to sell out of that. You, if you ever were to want want to run for politics, with that bill, you would have to sell out of all your individual assets, you know, Impact Theory, this and that. Is that allowed? And should that be a thing? Because that opens up a whole new camo- can of worms because you're now forcing individual private Americans to sell out of private investments. That is, how do you get liquidity for, you know, an Impact Theory? How do you get liquidity for a family business? Is it constitutionally allowed to get people to kind of do that? And my worry with that path is you then kind of divide up this whole {quote} {unquote} career-long politician angle and the people that you get into office even where even uh on a greater scale scale. That bill was being introduced in July of 2024. At the time, if you kind of remember, you had uh Kamala Harris and Tim Walls. Kamala Harris, Tim Walls, both relatively kind of career-long politicians. Kamala was like uh I think governor of California. Not governor of uh attorney general or something like that. Um but she she never really necessarily had any She wasn't working at a you know, a Facebook or anything like that. No kind of private experience. Um Tim Walls, ex-teacher. The only thing he owned on a private asset side was a pension fund. He didn't even own a house, didn't own any individual stocks. And on the other side, you got you know, the Trump campaign and that team, the whole 'nother world. They're all business people. Trump, you know, we already talked about what he has. He's got a million businesses. J.D. Vance, ex-venture capitalist. He has his own private investments, you know, things like Anduril. He was a partner at Founders Fund to some degree. Um going down the line, you had Vivek, you know, coming from the health care kind of angle. If that bill is passed at that time, there would be no you know, there would be no Donald Trump. There would be no Vivek. There would be no J.D. Vance. There would be no conversation around these. There would be no Elons, you know, for better for worse. But you'd be turning off kind of vast large part of society to run for politics. Is that a better America where you know, you Like I I think you you probably could do a lot of things if you were to be a politician. You understand the people, you understand how social media works, you understand kind of where the direction in the the public outcry is going. A lot of people that are politicians over 70 or 40, 50 years have no idea about the experiences that you have. However, though, if you were to ever want to run against one of those people, you would theoretically have to sell out of your individual assets. Is it worth that? You know, maybe not, maybe it is, but you are turning off a massive amount of Americans from running for politics. That uh has been There's been an argument being said that that's a kill pill where it's like, "Oh, these politicians again, we're not in the room." They put that piece in cuz they know there's Americans that won't support that and that will never get passed. So, like Mitt Romney, he was ex-CEO of Bain. He voted against that bill. But, the problem is you read the headline, it's like, "Mitt Romney votes against the bill to ban congressional stock trading." It's like, "No, he supported the ban of it, but he didn't support that piece." So, this whole topic is much more kind of complex and harder because when you deal with the kids, going back to what we're talking about with Trump, Trump can put his whole thing into the S&P 500, he should. All these politicians should. That's like what my personal belief is. I think they shouldn't own the individual stocks, but I think they should have an incentive to drive growth in America. Donald Trump's kid, though, you know, Eric Trump, for example, he's the one behind all these ETFs. So, even this morning, he's talking about launching ETFs with Truth Social. Truth Social stock is up 10%. Donald Trump's individual net worth goes up however much percent because he owns it. But, how is it constitutionally right to tell Eric Trump, you can't do this cuz your dad's the president. I think cuz he's the president, it's a much much different level. There's clearly things that he probably shouldn't do. But, if you're a politician from Washington and your kid is trying to do something, should you tell your kid that you can't do that individual thing cuz your dad is a representative from from small district in Washington state. You know, that doesn't miles and miles away from DC, not the most important, you know, you're not the ones moving the needle for the the federal government, but you still are, you know, a person in Congress. That's where it gets much more complex and harder to kind of parse through and why this entire topic is so nuanced and also why with Autopilot and with the Pelosi Tracker we are trying to bring more eyeballs and transparency into it so people understand it and they can at least have a more informed way of making the decision around what they want and what they don't want. We'll get back to the show in a moment, but first tech's biggest secrets are now being shared and here is how to listen in. Whether you're tracking AI's exponential growth, trying to navigate the crypto landscape, or just trying to understand how technology is reshaping global power, you need an insider perspective. That's exactly what Tech Unheard delivers. This is not your typical corporate podcast. It's Arm CEO Renee Haas getting tech's most influential leaders to drop their guard and speak candidly about what's really happening. But one of the things that I realized was that as technology got more complex, it just became impossible for one company to specialize. You had to have the value chain split out into different companies so that you could have the specialization that made technological progress possible. Tune in to Tech Unheard from Arm and NPM right now on your favorite podcast platform. Your competition is already listening. And now, let's get back to the show. Given what you guys do, I have to imagine that a big part of your audience customer base are millennials, Gen Z. Do you feel like you have your ear to the street in terms of what their vibe is like? Cuz from where I'm sitting, it feels like there is a lot of it we're past frustration now and we're into outrage territory. We're into hopelessness. Uh we're into burn it all down territory. What do they want to see with all of this? Yeah. So J- we do. We we see a lot. So, on the Pelosi tracker that por- that account has 1.1 million followers on Twitter. X a little bit probably more conservative leaning. On Instagram, we have an account called the politician trade tracker. 900,000 followers. Probably a little bit more left leaning in that. So, we see you know, we post the same thing on Twitter. We post the same thing on Instagram. We see the two different arguments. Same here. Yeah. Yeah. The underlying truth, the first principle kind of commonality between them all is I think people are kind of just sick of the blatant corruption in front of their own very eyes where people are struggling with inflation. They're struggling with the day-to-day stuff. They can't buy a house. They can't do this. They can't do that. And they are feeling left out because they are not part of this system. Meanwhile, the politicians are blatantly doing these things right in front of everyone's face. And I think that's where the frustration starts boiling up. And they all kind of call out the the corruption and them just kind of not necessarily doing it. They do it in different ways. So, like we still obviously do see you know, the Gen Z millennials saying, "Hey, why aren't you calling out Nancy Pelosi? She's the one doing it the most." And then on the other side, you get like, "Hey, why you only calling out Nancy Pelosi? There's other politicians doing it as well." So, if you comb all that stuff out, I think the unified thing of the Gen Z and the millennials is they are feeling left behind. They are frustrated with that. And they rightly so are calling out and saying, "Why are these politicians getting rich in front of us meanwhile, I'm struggling to buy my eggs because it you know, it inflation, things like that. Shouldn't you politicians be focused on that as opposed to trading you know, your stock your stocks every 2 weeks?" Mhm. That is what we kind of see a lot of and it probably comes more from the millennials to be honest than the Gen Z. Gen Z I think grew up with it. Uh and they just have accepted that this is the way it is. And they are just like Yeah. That's terrifying. It is Yeah. How are they responding to it? Is it with an aggression, with an apathy, uh I'm going to work around it? Like what do they think? So the millennials, they go with aggression and apathy and they use our product more. So I could look at the numbers, but I think like the average person using Autopilot is actually people with money that want to invest in, you know, the corruption and be like, "Look, if you guys are going to do it, I want to get in with it." Invest in the corruption. Wow, said like that, I hate that. Yeah, I mean it's again, you know, it it's what it represents. There's no better way to highlight the hypocrisy than to literally follow along and invest alongside with it cuz if they're going to do it, I might as well join them. That's exactly That's how Autopilot has 2 million downloads and half a billion dollars invested because of that kind of problem. Gen Z though, I think it's more of like the dog-eat-dog world and for better or for worse, I This is like what I see and this is I think just my I have two brothers who are Gen Z. They see this, too. There's a lot of ways to uh make money and I think they are kind of seeing like, "Oh, these politicians make money that way. It's clearly not right. It's clearly corrupt. It's clearly kind of problems. I'm going to go and I'm going to try and launch a meme coin and kind of rug pull, you know, Yo. this other guy. I'm going to try and do this these AI apps on social media and kind of grow them like that. It's more of a dog-eat-dog world and you know, there's still a lot I think that the beauty of what Gen Z has is they don't take themselves too seriously and they don't get necessarily as frustrated. I think like they live a little bit of a less anxious Maybe the data's wrong in this, but the way that I'm seeing it around the politics is they live a little bit of a less anxious life because they like are accepting of a lot of these kind of things and just how it is and it's like I have to just figure it out on my own and I think part of that is being shown with how they treat our account, but also how how go about trying to make money on their own. Man, say more. So, how are they I don't know if I'm You're making me fall in love with Gen Z or if I'm not understanding what you're saying because I love the I have to figure it out on my own. No one's coming to save you. That's my message. My producer Drew, who's just off camera, hates when I talk like that. Uh because it is so it's certainly out of step with millennials. That is for sure. Yep. Uh who want to be seen they want to be recognized for how bad they've had it. Uh and my thing is I just want to help you navigate this well it you can no matter what. Um am I hearing you right about Gen Z or am I misinterpreting the idea of um I've got to figure this out on my own? I yeah I I think you're hearing me right. And I maybe I can find probably a bit way to articulate it better where it's not like keeping money aside. I think what Gen Z accepts and probably is in the right is uh not necessarily it's a you are on your own you have to figure it out on your by yourself. It's they have grown up with, you know, COVID. They grew up with um they weren't at during the housing crisis, but they they they were probably I don't know seven or eight six or seven around that time. So, they grew up with the fallout of that. Uh the millennials had a whole different experience with that because they were probably a little bit older. But I think what Gen Z is kind of seeing and what they're realizing is there's a lot of weight like you just have to you can either complain about it or you can just accept it have a little bit more of a carefree lifestyle saying [ __ ] it, you know, I'm never going to be able to buy a house anyway. Let me not stress about it when I'm 20. And it's also coupled with social media seeing, you know, how it works. You know the the best way to say it I feel like Gen Z feels like no one has been looking out for them. And that is a little bit of the the difference between the millennials. I'm a millennial and like the Gen Z younger brothers that I have. Me as a millennial, I know that there were things going on and I know that I'm getting the bad end of the stick, but I still don't want it to be like that. That's why I'm complaining saying like, what the [ __ ] politicians, you know, why are you able That's why I'm building an app that literally lets me copy them, you know? I don't want you guys doing this. I want to provide change. I want to kind of get this to stop so that we can kind of keep moving forward. We can bring trust, transparency back in. Meanwhile, the millennial in that same scenario is like, why are you even complaining to be Oh, yeah, excuse me. The Gen Z in that same scenario is like they have the mindset of like, why are you even complaining to begin with? You know, just accept it. Stop stressing about it. Nothing's going to change anyway. These politicians are not your friend. They're in the club. You're not. Stop trying to change it. Figure it out and kind of live your life that way. That's I think like a little bit the difference. For the Gen Z kids, they're I think really experiencing that now with We've talked about college loans, student loans for how long? Like 15 years. They've grown up with it. Their entire life has been hearing about how college is expensive, how people are complaining about college college student loans when they're 35, 40, 50 and they can't pay the things off. You would think that, okay, if you guys have been complaining about it for 15 years, you would have done something about it. Nothing has happened to it and now when these my younger brother is about to become a freshman in college, his tuition is 90 grand a year. Whoa. And it's like When I started, I I went to Villanova in 2014, great school. My tuition I think was like 55, 60 maybe. So, he saw me go to school. My older two brothers went to school and now it's his turn and he's seeing 90K. It's like, what do you do in that situation? Especially when you didn't necessarily really have the power to do anything about it. You feel a little bit not necessarily hopeless, but like you are on your own a little bit. Is he still going to go to school? I don't I don't I think he's going to go to a different school where he gets more uh loans and it's public. Yeah. But that was a private school. I mean, it was Villanova. Like Villanova is a great school. He wants to go to the same school that that I went to. Um and I think he said after room and board it had anything was around like 87 or 88,000. bonkers, man. Yeah, what do you do? You want a real answer? Yeah. You don't [ __ ] go to school. So, uh my punchline is if you can go to college if you want to go to college and can do so without taking on obscene amounts of debt, cool. I uh I have not deployed the things that I learned in college, so I won't say that it set me up like that, but it forced me to get disciplined cuz nobody was watching over me, so it was a great exercise. Um but at the end of the day, looking back on it, I walked out I can't remember if it was 25 or 35,000 dollars in debt I had between uh loans, um grants, etc. etc. That That's what I walked away with. It was manageable. It was enough that it was stressful for the first, call it 10 years outside of college, but it was manageable. Um but now 90k a year, like that that's insanity. So, what percentage of that becomes debt? I'm going to guess he's going to be six figures in debt by the time that he graduates. Uh given how much you can learn from AI, given how much you can learn from the internet, given how much you can learn from working with somebody else, uh you were just way better off going pursuing the thing that you love most in the world that you can monetize, doing it right out of the gate, and stacking those skills. Um this goes back to what would I tell myself if I could go speak to me when I was 13 or whatever, I'd be like, "Okay, the thing that you most want to do in the world, don't do some like around it try cuz my thing was I'm going to get rich and then go back and do the thing that I wanted to do." That was a mistake. Uh now that I know what I know about acquiring skills, I would have just gone into that thing and acquired those skills. I didn't have the internet, so there's nobody to tell me all this stuff. Um but that's what I would do if I were him. Skill acquisition, make sure that you keep your costs very low. Do not take on uh inordinate amounts of debt. It's just you're making it impossible for yourself to get ahead. Uh and given how powerful AI is, between that and real-life connections, that's the game. I That's I think what I told him. When he told me the 90K, I'm like, "Dude, like you Who knows what the job market is even going to be like 4 to 5 years from now, especially cuz he he's a go-getter. He likes to do things on his own, but he likes to do things with his hands. Where he, you know, he's the one starting the um the landscaping companies. You know, he's the one going door-to-door. I grew up in Boston shoveling the snow for the neighbors, things like that. Uh he isn't on social media. So, what's what's He's what? 18, 19? Yeah. And he's not on social media? on social media. Is that like a thing for Gen Z? Where they're actively rejecting I think that was a thing for my high school. My high school we went to a small uh private school. That's interesting. And yeah, he's not on social media. So, th- like he may not even necessarily see all the things that are coming with AI. And I don't know exactly how It's a good point. I'll bring this up to him. Be like, "Do you know what's kind of going on?" But yeah, so he has an Instagram account with I think like 20 followers. He's not on TikTok, not on Twitter. Just lives his life with his friends and that's probably the better way to do it, but the downside is essentially like what you're talking about. The the AI stuff. How do you learn about that? How do you get How do you stay up to date with where the whole world is going? College does play a part in that because you are surrounding yourself with people that have social media, people that don't, you people that come from, you know, they they got the side hustles. You you get exposed to a broader range, a bigger kind of pool of people in college to be able to do that. Is that worth $90,000? Absolutely not. Is that the skill set that you're going to learn in college worth $90,000? Absolutely not. Like, me personally, I was a finance major, went to school for finance, and I work in a finance app now, Autopilot, but I do all the growth. I do all the social media stuff. I have come become like a nerd, quote unquote, expert of like, how do the algorithms work? How do you dissect this one algorithm on TikTok, and how do you reverse engineer it to make content to work on that versus headlines on Twitter versus the organic authenticity on Instagram. So, I know how all that stuff plays, and I can kind of make content that will work on that. My younger brother would have no idea. And I don't think he cares. I don't think he has any kind of interest in it. Fascinating. I don't know if that's a big Gen Z thing. Or if that's just a him thing. That's just a him thing, yeah. Man, do I want an answer that question. Yeah. Uh another thing I'd like to know. So, given your interaction with millennials, Gen Z, what do you see as the future of crypto? You made passing reference to it as like, I'm going to rug the next guy. Uh dog eat dog. What what's the vibe? What does crypto mean to them? Crypto means the way to get rich. I think for the easiest way to think about it. The attention spans, the the expectations, I think, of younger people. I I'm on the cusp of Gen Z millennial. I still am millennial, but I grew up watching people get rich with crypto. I think crypto is the ticket to get out of uh ticket to get rich. Where if you were to give people an option, you know, you got a 25-year-old sitting in front of you. You give them option to buy Bitcoin, or you give them option to buy the S&P 500. I think nine times out of 10, if they're if they know the space and they know what Bitcoin is, I think nine times out of 10 they buy Bitcoin as opposed to the S&P 500. Why? Because I think they see Bitcoin as the higher risk, higher reward. And the only way to live the life that you want to live at 35, 40, it's not to go slave away and make, you know, however X money at a corporate cubicle. It's you got to do something else. Is it uh side hustles? Maybe. Is it buying Bitcoin and then Bitcoin 100 X's like it's been doing for the past 10 years? Maybe. But that is what they're choosing and I think crypto represents the get rich quick, not necessarily get rich quick might be a little bit extreme. The crypto represents the way to get out of your socio-economic path much faster and at a higher chance than stocks and S&P 500, things like that. Wow. Okay. Yes, that makes sense. So, do you guys have any sort of data on how younger millennials and Gen Z are investing their investable dollars? Is it like some massive amount is going to crypto? So, I on Autopilot, we don't have any crypto portfolios. Um Do you have crypto trackers? We So, here, let me take it back. We do have portfolios, but we have portfolios in crypto of like um you know, like Unusual Whales has a portfolio on Autopilot called the the companies that own crypto on their balance sheet portfolio, lack of a better way to say it. Like MicroStrategy. MicroStrategy, um Tesla, um GameStop didn't do this, but there were rumors that GameStop was going to add um Bitcoin to their balance sheet. And we have portfolios like that. Another portfolio is a guy by uh Wolf Financial, he's a big guy on Twitter, he's awesome. He has a portfolio called the Crypto Bull Portfolio and he created a basket of stocks that he like will benefit from crypto. Uh Coinbase, Robinhood, um MicroStrategy again, some of these mining companies. So, we have access to those and those are pretty popular to be honest. But on the actual kind of numbers of however much percentage are investing in crypto, Bitcoin, Solana, Ethereum versus stocks, S&P 500, Tesla, Apple. I don't have the numbers on that, but I mean I would I would wonder what ChatGPT and them would say, but my my intuition, my instinct is that the younger people are investing more and more in crypto. Mhm. And I think Robinhood's data on that shows it. Their product roadmap shows it. Coinbase is one of the most popular apps. Cash App has a crypto at angle. They're not These companies are not marketing coming in buy Apple and hold it for 100 years. They're coming in and marketing you can buy any crypto you want on our platform. Mhm. And Trump, you know, the Trump coin that doesn't help, you know, but that narrative I think is becoming more and more relevant, especially in the Gen Z era. Yeah, that is watching people grapple with the fundamental structure of the money system, not knowing why it feels so broken, but reaching for the things that they see be successful around them. So you watch a guy get rich in crypto like overnight by betting on dog with hat. Yep. And which I hear is way down. Yep. Uh but you see enough of that and you not only speak to the gambler that is inside the vast majority of humanity, but you show them an opportunity where it feels like the house doesn't always win, and in fact the saying got created because the house was always winning and we wanted a system where we could have a shot where it's outside of the clutches of the people in the club. Um what do you make of the meme coin phenomenon? This to me is like the like Bitcoin has great cover story. Meme coins do not, in my opinion. No, and they do get a lot of hate on social media, but I think the thing about them is um it's a lottery ticket. The They're The easiest way to think about it is I can go to the gas station, I can buy a $100 uh I could buy a $20 scratch ticket and hope to make a hundred. Or I can go to pump.fun, moonshot, any of these apps and find a trending coin, put that same $20 in and make a thousand dollars. I think that's what meme coins represent and yes, you know, they can be are they securities, are they not securities? It doesn't matter. I think they are pure gambling to the nth degree and they are a lottery ticket for people to try and get rich. And I I've experienced it. Like I I was in early on um the uh jail stool, the the Dave Portnoy coin. Jail stool? So, meme coins become representations of culture. So, if you're early on in culture, if you're cul- chronically online, you can make a lot of money in meme coins. You just have to be early and you have to be in at a certain market cap. If without getting kind of too nerdy, but I like the nerdy. Let's go. Yeah, so my take on this is uh if if you get into a market if you get into a crypto coin, a meme coin before like a million dollar market cap, you have the chances to ride that thing from a million dollars to 10 million to 15 million and then you sell out of it and you kind of get out of it. The stages of how you kind of do this and people do this on Twitter all the time. You got to be very, very careful because it's a doggy dog world in that. There are group chats that you have no idea about that are plotting how to launch this cultural meme coin, pump it up and then sell out of it while they're kind of talking to their their community on Twitter. That's so horrible. The the the And I might mess up the timeline a little bit of this with the jail stool, but Dave Portnoy, they've all wanted him to launch his own coin. He did Solana's the new network that allows him to do that. He had he talked about one coin. I can't remember what it was. He tweeted about it. The coin went up you know, 30 to 40% something like that. Maybe even 100%. He then went on Twitter and he said like, "Hey everyone, I tweeted about this coin cuz I bought it and it's up 100%. I am now going to sell it." And he sold it and then the thing falls and it kind of gets killed. So, what did everyone on Twitter do? They call it start calling him out. They say, "Hey, you're going to jail. That you just rug pulled. Like you are being so open obvious about it. You're going on Instagram filming yourself saying that you were doing a rug pull. You are going to jail." So, again, culturally relevant, people started catching on. Then guess what happens? Someone made a coin called jail stool and it represented Dave Portnoy rug pulling his crypto community and they gifted it to him and they said, "Dave, this is your jail stool coin. This is going to be the coin for you to go to jail." The whole like Barstool community and everyone on Twitter caught notice. It started getting big on um Tik Tok as well. And he started pumping that coin. So, it became like a ironic kind of thing of, "Hey, you guys are telling me I'm going to go to jail via this jail stool coin. Well, I'm just going to pump this coin up and I'm going to have this one try and go to a billion dollar market cap. That's kind of the game." He wasn't in he that coin went from a million dollar market cap up to 20 million market cap in like two or three weeks. He couldn't get it over though the 20 million dollar market cap because in the meme world, you know, you cannot hold these things forever. You got to buy it and you got to sell it after two hours. Buy it, sell it after two hours. That whole little kind of game. So, it was just funny and it caught the culture uh just people are fascinated with it because it would keep going up and down, and he would be publicly talking about it and he's the first kind of crypto person that has ever been so openly talking about trying to pump and trying to pump specific coins. Mhm. Um and again, going back to what we were talking about being culturally transparent, it's like what Trump was doing with all of his stuff. He's clearly pumping it. Portnoy then sees what Trump is doing. He's like, "Well, if the president of the United States is doing it, why can't I do it?" What's me actually going to jail versus zero? And he And he starts doing it. Um and now you know the coin is worth zero, but that is how the kind of sell? Or he's still holding it up and down? He's still holding that one. Yep. And he then started tweeting about it like jail stool two or something like that. He made a second jail stool coin where people were kind of sending stuff. But again, going back to what meme coins represent, it's culture and it is um lottery tickets, get-rich-quick schemes. Yeah. Man, this this one is beyond fascinating to me. The way that I view this is that what people are doing is essentially saying, "Okay, there's a mechanism here that I know works that I can get people excited about something and in getting them excited about it, the value comes out of nowhere and it's it is literally just enthusiasm. Now, I believe people should be able to spend their money on whatever they want. So, if people want to gamble, I think they should be able to gamble. You want to gamble on um I think I can time the excitement of this better than you. I think I can read how excited people will get about this better than you." When meme coins first came out, I thought, "Oh, maybe people don't understand that there's like no utility here." And then over time I realized, "Oh, no, no, no. They just all think that they're going to be the ones that understand this better than the next person." And so, it's a bunch of people playing like this um perverted version of the GameStop thing where it was like, okay, we're all going to hold, right? Yeah, we're all going to hold. We're all going to hold. Yeah, yeah, yeah, like we're pure of heart knowing that some massive percentage of them were not pure of heart. And of course, they all start selling in the end and it crashes down. It's like a don't stabbing your neighbor in the back kind of thing. Yeah, exactly. It's like one of those games where it's like, okay, how long can I get people to believe that I'm really in this, that I really believe in it, and get this thing going? But everybody ultimately is there to make money. So, everybody knows at some point I'm actually going to sell this thing. Uh and can I play that game well? It It is utterly fascinating. It triggers the gambling, video game playing, like all the things. Get rich quick, to your point about that. This is one that we are really going to have to grapple with because this is the you're encountering the architecture of the human mind. And this is just the way the mind works, and people want to gamble, and people want a chance, and people love getting caught up in it. It's the same reason that people gamble on a basketball game cuz now it makes the game more interesting cuz there are stakes. It's like your everyday life, you have this little thing that you can do that you can check on your phone every now and then that gives you this tremendous dopamine rush. And yeah, we're going to have to contend with this culturally because you're going to see wealth come and go. It will get accumulated into the hands at last check, and admittedly this is probably a couple years ago the last time I looked at this, but it was if these numbers aren't literally correct, they are directionally correct. 5% of wallets captured 95% of the economics. So, you're going to get the same thing again where a small group of people who maybe are in Telegram and WhatsApp groups that are pumping these things more intelligently than you, so they know when they're going to go up or go down. Those guys get out. It becomes the cascading effect of uh-oh, the real influence here is gone. Then everybody scrambles sells, and the people that, you know, had the audacity to go take a shower and didn't see that this started to collapse. Uh don't get out, they're left holding the bag and on a long enough timeline across enough meme coins, they they end up losing. And so at some point people are not going to feel good about this anymore and there's going to be some kind of backlash. I don't know. Yeah, and I mean the broader question too, kind of going back to what you first were talking about is like is that the reality is people are doing that more than investing in stocks now, too. And you know, you get say you get your paycheck every week, you you get $1,000 to play around with, you got two options. Do I put it in the stock market or do I try and turn it into 20 grand, 50 grand, 100 grand in meme coins. Uh we saw this probably like five like three or four years ago with sports betting and now sports betting has become like we we've been going towards a more degenerate world. Like it's so clearly obvious, you know, sports betting now becoming legal. You now can kind of bet on anything with these prediction markets, which is a whole 'nother world that that got big because you could bet on the election last year. Um that's only going to get bigger and that's going to become more and more widespread because it's going to uh be democratized through the brokerage accounts. And you know, you can make you can agree with it or not, but it is going to be happening. This idea of going towards a more and more degenerate world is fascinating and what we are trying to do with Autopilot and I think like I get personal about this is because I think that path is wrong. I do I firmly do not believe Define wrong. Why wrong? Because I don't think that it sets that individual up for like the long-term success of what they actually want to do. And whether it's education that solves that, whether it's regulation, I I probably don't want it to be regulation. Education may kind of help with that. My solution to it is technology. But when I say kind of what's wrong with it is I firmly believe 10 times out of 10 an individual should be taking that paycheck and putting it in the active stock market investing in something that has a tangible ability to grow with you as opposed to kind of gambling it and trying to make a lottery ticket and more chances than not you're going to lose money on it. Okay, let me run a thought experiment with you. If you knew that people would make the exact same money for themselves by yoloing in meme coins that they would make in the stock market over a 20-year period, would you care any more about which path they chose? If the end result is the same? Well, one end result is the same. They will make the same amount of money, but that's the only variable I'm going to allow you to check and then you have to make your decision. Yeah, so I mean in that scenario, I don't think this is an issue between the investing in the stocks. I think they're the same. If you're ending up at the same end goal 20 years from now, you end up with the same amount of money. Maybe not even Well, at the end at the at the end if you're making the same amount of money, I think that is fine. I think the the problem with that is the people don't make money in these meme coins to the same degree that they can make money in the other alternative, which is the stocks, the active investment. no, I get that. I just wanted to see if you have any other reason why you'd want to see people migrate away from meme coins into the stock market. So, I do. So, I am I am more and more convinced as I spend time live streaming that I I am the old man tilting at windmills, uh but I really want people to understand how money works. Here is why meme coins should be legal. People should be able to do whatever they want with their money cuz I have just an overriding thing that that is your [ __ ] money and if you want to sit in a circle and light it on fire, that is your business and nobody should get to tell you otherwise. Mhm. Uh having said that, I would still want to see people invest in the stock market, not that they should be forced, but I would still want to see people invest in the stock market because how of how money actually works. So, I don't think people understand why the public markets exist. The reason the public markets exist is companies are making a trade-off with potential investors. They're saying, "Look, I want to build this company, but I don't have the capital to do it. Often times just cash flow in and of itself." Like, you might be profitable, but the amount of time that you have to outlay the cash into the ingredients, in my case, making a protein bar, or somebody else the car parts, whatever. It's just the lead time is so long, even though you're wildly profitable, you still have to borrow money in order to cash flow out the length of time you need to. So, hey, dear public market, I'm going to let you own a piece of my company, which is going to let me actually go build this thing, and that's going to advantage us both. I'm going to be able to create this self-sustaining economic engine, and you're going to be able to make money off the back of that if if I'm able to pull this off. Now, I may not be able to, and that's why I call it gambling, but if I'm able to pull this off, then you're going to get money, and I build the thing. Now, the reason I really care about that is I think people lose sight that when a company is able to aggregate capital, they are able to make something that makes the world better. And you need only look back in time and go, "Oh, wow, we used to die really young." Even if you just grant me that, that we've figured out ways to, for instance, deal with microbes. Cool. Very advantageous. What is the mechanism by which you get that level of innovation? And the answer is the aggregation of capital. You make enough money that somebody doesn't have to go work on a farm, they can instead be a scientist in a lab looking at a thing. Or maybe you just like air conditioning, and now you can actually live in Florida and not hate your life. So, uh or you can survive a winter in Germany because you have a heater. These are all technological advances that were born out of people innovating with companies. Take coal mining. If you look at the graph of the reduction in deaths of coal mining, it drops by it drops from, let's say, 100% all the way down to like 10% of what it was before the first safety regulation, okay? So, what dropped it all the way down? It was just commercial innovation. It was like, "Oh, man, replacing all these coal miners that keep dying sucks." And so, businesses spring up creating these innovations that are then able to keep people safer as a kind of selfish act towards just building this economic engine. And so, if people understood that, they would understand the thing that I'm worried about, which is because we are inflating the money supply. And that is an oversimplification, but it is so directionally correct. If I could just get people to understand, okay, that whole thing that I just laid out, this this is how you have modern society and why moms don't die in childbirth, okay? And a whole host of other things. But, modern society is brought to you by the aggregation of capital leading to innovation. When you start inflating money, what you end up doing is you derange the system. And now, people are forced to gamble in some way. Now, if you were only forcing them into the stock market, okay, you still have wealth inequality that's going to rampage out of control, uh which is what's happening. So, wealth inequality brought to you by inflation. Mm, people think it's something else. It's inflation. Uh but, now what we're seeing with these younger kids is meme coins brought to you by inflation because they're forced to gamble, but they see all the corruption that you've been pointing out in the stock market. So, they're like, "Well, that's a little slow anyway, and it's corrupt. Don't love that. So, let me do this other thing, which is effectively sports betting with no sport. Or it's the blood sport of culture. Yeah. And I'm just like, man, now there's not that secondary effect of, oh, you're also leading to innovation. A meme coin is not going to lead to innovation. So, that makes me not just sad, that makes me extremely worried. I will be dead. I'm already rich. And yet, I'm the one banging the drum, trying to get people to understand, I get why you're mad, but just being mad is not going to make your future better. And so, now at some point, and um dear community of mine, they they need and want to be seen for the emotional distress that they are in. I see you, I hear you, I feel it, I get it. But you can do a thing now that will allow you to get out of that dark place. But to do that thing, you have to piece together, how does the world actually work? If they can build that up and go, oh, okay, cool. I get how this game is played. Then they can lobby for the right changes to uh how we handle politics. Then they can put their money in something that's slower, it's maybe not as cool, uh but it will build their wealth while allowing them to invest their values. But to invest your values, you have to know your values. Mhm. Okay, one, I'll put a period there and see if you any if you can tear any of that down, please. I want to get smarter. Yeah, I'm so I think there's two kind of pieces of that where uh I guess I'm on the other I'm not fully on the other side of the fence with it, but um the idea the uh investing is purely gambling. If you're going off of um like if I had if I have $100,000 and like I think the meme coins is kind of what I'm getting at with the difference of them. If I have $100,000 and I can invest in meme coins or maybe not $100,000, that's a lot. $10,000. Invest in meme coins or invest in stocks. That's the the markets. Um the end goal is still the same. You could still end up with the same amount of money. I think like the real the reality of these meme coins coming in as a new form of gambling is so blatantly obvious. There's no utility to it. There's it's all just scamming and it's all just doggy dog world get in get out as fast as you can. But the upside of it is it represents your ticket. It represents your your your Willy Wonka ticket. You know, you can get out of wherever you are and you can go and buy, you know, a house if you make cuz you see people making hundreds of thousands of dollars with luck. On the the stock market side like I don't the idea of it being purely gambling, I think there are a lot of elements of it that are gambling with especially, you know, some of these options contracts, things like that. That becomes more and more of a uh gambling in my opinion. But investing in, you know, the future that you want kind of going off of your argument of you know, I want to invest in this AI genetic company cuz I think it's going to cure cancer. If I got $10,000 and then I'm investing in that company and I'm investing in the future cash flows, this and that, I don't necessarily see it as gambling and I don't think it has the same kind of psychological uh framing of it as the meme coins because I am investing and I'm supporting and I want that company to win, but I also am going to reap the benefits. I'm going to uh protect myself against inflation. I'm going to kind of do this and that. How um why do you think that the pure kind of investing landscape is gambling? Are you saying it's gambling against inflation? And you know, maybe this one AI genetic company is going to crush it while the other one doesn't. That's kind of the gambling between the two. Like, how do you How do you differentiate the gambling with meme coins and the gambling with the market if it's not investing in companies that you kind of believe in? Gambling has a definition and the definition is roughly to take risky behavior for a desired expected outcome. So, the stock market by that definition is just simply gambling. It doesn't meet any other definition. You are saying, "I think this company might make it." There's no guarantee that that's true, so it is risky behavior for a desired expected outcome, which is that it goes up in price and I will be able to sell it to somebody else. This is why you're not actually rewarded financially unless it's a stock that pays dividends. You're not rewarded financially for holding it. You are only rewarded financially for selling it and the sales price is not based on fundamentals. It is based entirely on sentiment. Yeah, I understand. So, now this isn't even does this thing continue to make the amount of money that it was making when I first bought into it. It's what do people believe will be the future state of it. Even if that wasn't true, it's still gambling that the price is going to go up. I I'm I have learned my lesson that getting people to accept the notion that it's gambling probably doesn't matter. The reason that I bring up the gambling is because I think it is immoral to print money precisely because it forces people into asset purchases because you have to be in an asset yourself against the inflation that comes with it. The bad news is that there's risk. The place where there is effectively no risk, it's not you can never get to zero cuz somebody could rob you. But the ability to save money to me, I believe the government has a moral obligation to create a system in which the average person can simply not spend their money and they will be able to retire. And right now you're not in that position. Inflation, even if you save every dollar beyond just the absolute things you need to survive, uh the value of those dollars will be inflated away such that you'd never be able to stop working. That's immoral to me. Um I am so desperate to reorient the world to that immorality that they will understand that assets are just confusing enough that if you're right, 40% of people don't do it. Yep. And so once you say 40% of people are just [ __ ] um that that is not a world I'm comfortable living in. So I'll continue to be the drum. I don't need people to get on board. If people want to say Thomas not gambling, fine. I'm not going to spend my time arguing there. I just want to say, can we agree that to keep up with inflation, you have to own assets? 1,000%. Yeah, as long as people agree with me there, then I'm just like, okay, well now can we agree that that's immoral? If they won't agree that it's immoral, then I have to press the angle on, okay, but this is risk. And so all of those people could end up in a really terrible position. Anyway, but that that's I'm just trying to get people that far. Yeah, and I think like so going back to kind of what I get passionate about is like I see like what we're doing kind of even thinking about the gambling cuz set the meme coins aside, um your argument is actually valid too also in the financial world. And this is the argument of passive versus active investing. Should I take my money and gamble on these individual stocks or should I take my money and do the least amount of quote-unquote gambling and put it just in the broader S&P 500? What we're trying to do and this is again like the cultural shift that we're seeing is the majority of Americans, human psychology, they will not go off and just put all their market money in a S&P 500 passive just say hey guys this is going to turn into $2 million in 30 years if if you know we keep the same averages of growth we've had in America for the last 30 years and we grow 6% on average every year. You know there's a big kind of like everyone's just assuming that America is just going to continue growing at this pace and then in 30 years when I'm 60 and it's 2065 Apple's going to be worth $20 trillion as opposed to what it is now. And yes the argument of inflation will come in and inflation will naturally drive up the the market as well. Um the good kind of tidbit and maybe you know the information on this is if you take out inflation adjusted returns the market is roughly flat over the past like 15 years. So your argument of like even if you're investing in these companies they are not providing and they are not creating any extra value on an asset base price besides just the natural inflation that is happening with the broader monetary supply. So you have to be invested in something you have to be invested in the stock market. With what we're trying to do kind of even with autopilot it's trying to capture this like cultural phenomenon of okay you have to invest in individual you have to invest in the stock market and you personally are going to try and invest in individual stocks. You are going to try and buy the companies you like you're going to try and gamble on you know this company versus that company. The majority of it though again it's a dog eat dog world it's not necessarily rigged for your emotion to buy and hold forever cuz the majority of people don't do that. You end up buying high at the top cuz you read about it on Instagram and then you end up selling low cuz you think the world is ending and then you end up buying high and selling low and the hedge funds and the whole monetary the whole Wall Street knows this about you and they're rigging the systems to make these volatile fluctuation swings to play with your emotions, to make you buy high and sell low. What we're trying to do, and again, th- this is why the meme world is just so much harder to kind of get people to partake in it, but do it more responsibly and more uh less pure YOLO lotto ticket is, with our app, you can go in and you'll be able to and this is where the future of where I think active management goes is you can go in and say you got 10 grand. Instead of you having to go and make the decision of I have to buy individual stocks cuz I still need that upside. I still need to find the Nvidias of the world. I still need to find Apple when it was a billion dollars and it turned into a trillion. I need to find Palantir when it was $19 and now 80. I have to buy these stocks, but I don't know how to do it. My emotion drives me nuts. It makes me sad and I just am so kind of sick of it. I'm not going to try it. I'm just going to go and play the YOLO meme game. I know I should be playing that game, but I'm going to play this game cuz it's easier. I understand if you're in early, you win. If you're not, you lose. Much easier to understand than watching Palantir go from 20 to 60 to 40 to 80 to 70. It's just too hard to play that game. With what we're doing with Autopilot is we're trying to build out a marketplace of high-quality active investment strategies where instead of you making the decisions on your own, you can come in and you can find a high-quality guy. You can find someone that you trust. You can find this proven active investor and say, "Hey, I'm going to take the entire burden of stock picking and I'm going to give it to you. You deal with those day-to-day swings. I will just passively watch and you tell me the commentary of what's going on, but if we're winning together, c- let's go. Love it. We're up. If we're losing together, oh, we all lost money, but at least it wasn't me having to deal with the mental decision of [ __ ] I lost myself money instead of like, oh, I was following someone I trusted more and they lost me money. I can kind of live with that." And I think that is one of the early solutions where we're still early with this. We aren't there yet. This is a brand new market. This is a brand new category. But I think it's the next step of where we are going as a society and how to get people to do what they want in the meme coin world, but do it in a much more responsible way where they are not losing 99% of their money and they are still partaking in the system, but doing it with a uh with protection against it. And I think like so this is where again I get passionate about it so I'm rambling here, but uh the Pelosi tracker I think represents that well. Where when people were going in, yes, you can follow her the corruption. It's ridiculous. It's horrible. But if you take a kind of step back, it's you as a user, as a investor, you know you have to invest in the stock market. It sounds pretty reasonable to go and just do whatever that person does. She just happens to be the third most powerful person in America and absolutely crushes it and passes laws that benefit her stocks. That's awesome. Sounds pretty reasonable to invest and do whatever that person does. Cuz when they go up, you love it. You love it you're happy with it. But if they lose you money, you are not panic selling. You're not going out selling on the bottom saying, "Oh my god, the world is ending." because you're sleeping at night saying like, "Okay, I'm down 10%, but the third most powerful person in America, the one passing all the laws is also down 10%. That sounds much better. I'm going to hold. I'm going to keep going." And that I think is how you get to the end goal of having a less degenerate society, having more people actively invested in the stock market, and protecting against, you know, this whole world of the inflation to come because the first principle of what you're talking about is 1,000% correct. If you have your money in your bank account, you are going to lose. And you can even put it in your five high yield savings accounts, you're still going to get taxed on that stuff. You probably don't even know you're getting taxed on those monthly uh interest payments. You're still going to lose. You need to have some sort of money in asset inflating securities. That is the stock market. That's the best thing we got right now, and everyone should be doing it. That's I think like where I want us to go, and that's where I'm trying to push us as a society to say, "Get everyone get involved in the stock market." Oh, you don't want to make the decisions on your own? Perfect. We have an app that you connect your personal broker, and then you follow the person that you want to invest alongside, and you let them do the picking for you. It's no There's no simpler easier way to do this. Why are you not doing it? Because oh, by the way, if you don't do it, inflation's going to eat at your buying power, and you are not going to be able to buy your Chipotle bowl because in 10 years it's going to be worth $18 instead of $12. Yeah. So. Now, that that part of what you guys are doing I think is utterly fascinating. We live in such a socially connected world where it's like, "Hey, I'm following someone like Unusual Whale." And if that guy is able to get a vig off the people that follow him, it's basically taking the model that is historically only been available to people that have a lot of money and can get the attention of people like this. And it's like this whole new crypto class of like almost cyber punk type guys who are like, "Hey, I'm going to be doing this thing anyway. If you want to ride on my coattails, I'll be very curious to see how people respond that when their money's down, and it's just one guy that you can like look at and be like, "Yo. Yep. Uh we'll see about that. Um I want to talk more about investing based on your values. So, one of my hobby horses is we are in a cold war with China. Mhm. Uh Lord knows I hope that this never becomes a hot war, but we need to be at least prepared for that. Um when you say invest based on your values, what value set do you mean exactly? I I firmly believe, and I think you were saying it earlier, uh your money builds the future that you want, whether you like it or not. If you have $10,000, and you're putting your money in Apple, your $10,000 is helping Apple build out the future that Apple wants. If you want the world to kind of if you align with what Apple believes in, you should be happy cuz it's like my money is supporting Apple. My money is building out the future what Apple wants. Taking a step back, say I got $100,000 and I got my retirement account, I want to invest in pro-America. I think everyone in this room, everyone probably listening for the most part if you are American, you benefit, your incentives align with a better America means probably a better life for you. You know, we got autonomous vehicles coming soon. We got robots coming soon. We got AI coming soon. This is a great future if we do it right. And whether you agree with that future or not, you might want to take some of your money and invest alongside some of those companies that are building out the future that you do want. Where this gets tricky is kind of the the broader point that you're talking about with with China, with our adversaries, with even like whether it's kind of political powers or even just socio-economic things. It's if I have a $100,000 with the financial advisor or I'm investing it on my own, I can invest in Amazon, which is you know, the American e-commerce giant, or I can invest in Alibaba, which is the Chinese e-commerce giant. Which one do I want to follow? Which one kind of aligns with the future that I want? A better Amazon probably leads to a better American future. A better Alibaba probably leads to a better Chinese future. And if you are in the agreement of a better a more stronger like a stronger China creates harder problems for America, theoretically, you should not be investing and supporting that Chinese company because your dollars are helping build China. Your your your dollars are helping build Alibaba, which is making China stronger. That is like what we are trying to do and where I also get passionate about is like I firmly believe that your money should build the future that you want and you should have those investment decisions and you should make sure that every dollar that you have invested in the stock market aligns with the values in the future that you want. If you are anti-oil, you should not have, you know, some of your money investing in um Exxon and Mobile and some of these gas companies. If you are anti I don't know, if you're like anti uh topic conversation now, if you're anti-Elon, you don't like what Elon's doing, you know, you could be saying all these things, but like at the end of the day, if you are having money invested in Tesla, you are going you are helping build Tesla. It It It is in a It's not aligned with the the values that you personally have and I think a future where you can make sure that your money builds the future that you want is a future that gets more aligned with the individual and is probably better for the society as a whole. And I the thing that people don't understand is like a lot of people do have money with probably companies that they don't believe in. I don't know how you if you manage your own money, if you have financial advisors, but my aunt, for example, she has money with her financial advisor. Her financial advisor was investing in Alibaba. They had a X amount of money in the Chinese company because they believed that you know, Alibaba's undervalued, let me go make money, let me go do let me do this with it, which is his job, I guess. But if you were to tell my aunt that, I bet you she would not want that. I bet you she personally would be like, look, invest my money, manage it, but don't put it in X Y Z companies because I don't want my money to support them. I would rather have those same dollars and go support something else. You know, yes, you know, swing trading, you know, maybe you think there's a technical analysis on the Alibaba chart, you put $1,000 in, you try and swing it up to $1,500, you make 50%, you get out of it. Like that, I think is fine. Like I I don't see any problem with that. But the long-term idea of taking your 401k and having it support companies that you don't believe in and align with your values, I think is a problem and I don't think there's any product out there that is really solving that just yet. It'll be very interesting to see how popular that is, and then what that does to the landscape of whether it's American companies or global companies. It'll be very interesting. Uh I have a feeling ultimately people are probably more motivated by where can I make money? Uh and so they're going to look for the hot thing. And I hate Elon, but boy, you know, he makes a nice car. And so I expect that stock price keep going up. We will see. What do you think is going to be the effect of AI in the way that people invest? I think that AI is going to have a lot of kind of aspects in the individual trading, kind of like me managing my own money. Uh I can talk to an AI. I can have it give me insights. I can have it give me feedback into my portfolio. I can be like if I'm about to sell, you know, for example, um there's a short-term capital gains and a long-term capital gains. If you own a stock for over a year, you get taxed 20% if you sell it. If you own a stock under a year, you get taxed 40%. So if you're about to sell Apple in your mail to make a thousand dollars, but if you hold it in another four days, you're about to you could sell it after those four days, and you're good to get save 20% on taxes. Maybe AI there's an experience where AI can tell you and just be like, "Hey, by the way, if you hold it for four days, you will save 20% on taxes." And me as an individual, like I love that. Like, "Oh, I had no idea. I didn't I wasn't I'm not deep in this enough to know those nuances, be on top of this to that degree." I think AI will drastically improve the education around how to not lose in the stock market for the individual investor. On the actual kind of like broader range with, you know, deep research, things like that, I think that is going to drastically help it as well. But that is more in like the equity research, the people that are doing the active studying of the with That's going to change their industry probably drastically. But for the everyday individual investor, I think it's going to make investing easier. I think it's going to make it more um educational and probably better because they the AI will you be able to help you in situations where you would not have known if you didn't have them. Yeah, I think AI is going to absolutely change the game from uh the way in which AI can recognize all the patterns, the changes. You talk about a swing trade, like that kind of stuff, being able to alert you based on either an algorithm that somebody like I imagine world in which Unusual Whales is publishing his algorithm. And so it's like, "Okay, there's there's my base, but you can tweak it as you see fit." Uh yeah, that's going to be So, and we we have this now. Um we have we So, with Autopilot, we have the Pelosi stuff, the politicians where you can go and invest alongside them. But we are a marketplace of active investment strategies. So, you can go and you can follow Unusual Whales strategies. We have other strategies, but one strategy we have is by a pilot um named Dr. Lopez. He's an AI expert, PhD from Wharton, wrote a book on how to use ChatGPT to pick stocks. We worked with him to create an stock-picking prompt where we use uh GPT-4, 4.0. And we have it every month parse through 200 plus um stock um fundamentals, you know. The reports, things of that nature. Couple that with macroeconomic data, couple that with um the the month the prior months uh stock news headlines, use ChatGPT's API, and then have it create a scoring system where it picks 15 stocks. And then we take those stocks, we publish it on our app, and then people can go in and invest alongside those strategies. Year-to-date, that thing is actually outperforming the market by around like 6 or 7%. I think it's up 3% while the broader market is down 6% I think I checked that yesterday. That strategy has 40 million dollars following it and it's great it's popular because people are like can this thing do it it's so much easier to just let an AI algorithm do it for you. We then took it a step further and we were like Chat GPT is cool. How did the other strategies how did the other uh uh platforms do? So we now have a deep search. We did the same prompting right using the same APIs but we are now using the the AI platform of deep search which is the China one the one from Alibaba I think. And they that that we created a deep search portfolio. So now we're going to see which one of of the the platforms are smarter. We then two weeks ago launched the Grok portfolio. So now we got a portfolio with Grok. Grok is picking stocks and each of them choose different stocks. So it's really really fascinating to see and I think to your point the broader question is it's like can it pick stocks better than hedge funds? You know, we'll have to see. Um On a long enough timeline I guarantee it. Yeah and this is I get very excited with the AI stuff uh just based on that and I mean you could take it a step further like we can create algorithms where you can have it pick do everything that we just talked about but say go find the diamond in the rough companies. Go find the companies that no one's ever really talking about. Go find the companies that you know based on what Trump is talking about with tariffs and talk and working with Zelensky on some mineral deal. Is there a stock out there that will benefit from this? And it does its research and then it spits out five or six random companies you never heard of and it's like you know there's a company called ALB. Why is ALB interesting? Why does that have some um insights into what is going on with uh Trump and Zelensky and all them? Oh it's because like 60% of their uh construction and their them taking the utilities out of the ground is happening in Ukraine. So, if Trump signs a deal, a mineral deal with Ukraine, that stock clearly obviously will benefit. And you know, the stock goes up 5% once that deal is signed. I think that's also where AI will drastically help. It will find diamond in the rough companies that the average everyday person just can't find and won't have the time to do the research on their own. This is a wild future, man. You guys really have your finger on something. This is extremely interesting. Uh Chris, if people want to follow along with you, where would they go? So, on Twitter is probably where the biggest My personal Twitter is Chris J. Josephs. Uh the Pelosi tracker, Pelosi tracker, just at that. I think that is probably the best spot to see us where we're exposing the corruption. We're trying to get them banned from trading. Again, that So, any support on that is great. On uh our main socials for our Autopilot, it's all join Autopilot. That's on Instagram, Tik Tok, and Twitter. So, you can go follow us all there. And then if you want to support the cause, if you want to kind of check out the app, you can do it. It's all free. The only payment part of uh our app is paying for the subscription to get the automated trading. But you can go check it out. All the performance numbers are there. And it's just Autopilot on the App Store. I love it. All right, everybody. Speaking of things I love, if you have not already, be sure to subscribe. And until next time, my friends, be legendary. Take care. Peace. If you like this conversation, check out this episode to learn more. Trump has just come into office. Do we think, or I should say do you think, as we may see this differently, do you think that Trump is um somebody who has the elite view of like, "Hey, the right people are in power. Let's make