Where are we and what is Reconciliation today?

Dambur, Marbang, Naji, Yin, Jamali, Nambry, Nurmal, Wgalu, Walabaloa, Nanowal, Warajri, Majiang, Yanibu, Jandu. My respects to Nambry, Camry, Nurmal, Walglu, Walabalo, Nanowal, Orajri, elders, past and present. And I extend my respects to all Aberiginal Tristra Islander people here with us today. Um, I'd like to welcome of course our guest speaker, Professor Pettyu, who we'll hear from shortly. I'd also like to welcome and acknowledge Miss Anne Stanley, member for Wereawa, uh who is also the chair of the joint standing committee on the parliamentary library. She's been a member of that committee since I think she was elected to parliament. Um so she's a great fan of the library and a great advocate for reconciliation. I'd also like to welcome other senators and members um Australian public and parliamentary service leaders who are with us in the room today. uh and also our colleagues from the Australian National University who are joint jointly presenting this uh this lecture with us today. Uh I'd also like to welcome all of you online. There's uh there's quite a few of you online from around Australia watching. Um, and I think it's worth noting that um, National Reconciliation Week is a time for all Australians to reflect on our shared histories, to listen carefully, and to consider how reconciliation can be pursued in meaningful and practical ways. Um, shortly, Mr. Downey will introduce U. Professor Yu. Um, and following that, Peter will share his reflections on where we're at and what rec reconciliation looks like today. And we'll then move to, as you can see, a fireside chat. um with some Q&A. Um so we'll be taking questions from within the room. We'll have a roia microphone. So pop your hand up. We'll get a mic to you. We've also got a QR code on the screen for Slido and it's also uh available to the online viewers as well through the uh through the Slido question app. So with that said, I'd now like to welcome Miss Stanley. [applause] Warmi that is the language of the Durk which is the lands that I am so privileged to have spent all of my life on. Can I acknowledge also the Nambry and Nanowal people whose lands that this parliament stand on? And can I acknowledge all indigenous people either in the room or who are watching us online and thank you and your ancestors for the custodianship of this country for 65,000 years which makes the way that we live now so wonderful and it is your shared history that we need to look to for the future. Thank you so much Steven and can I acknowledge all the special guests here as well? Uh today's event is an opportunity to reflect on the reconcili what reconciliation means for contemporary Australia and consi consider pathways to prosperity and self-determination for our first nations Australians. This is especially relevant at a time when the parliamentary inquiry is underway into racism, hate and violence directed at Aboriginal and toouristr islander people. This year's national reconciliation theme is allin. A call for all Australians to commit wholeheartedly to reconciliation every single day. And I'm proud to say that I am I agree with that statement and am one of those people. It reminds us that reconciliation is not passive and that advancing the rights of Aboriginal and Toouristra Islander peoples is a shared responsibility. I'm really eager to hear Peter's reflections, but here is an introduction first. And can I also give my apologies if I rush off uh the bells uh um deciding my day today, so I may need to leave. Uh Professor Peter U is a yrow man from the Ruby and Broom in the Kimbley and the inaugural vice president First Nations at the Australian uh National University. Peter has more than 40 years experience in indigenous development and advocacy at community, state, national, and international levels and has made a significant contribution to organizations policy reform and national conversations on reconciliation and self-determination. Peter is a member of the national leadership team that negotiated the federal government's response to the 1992 Marbo High Court judgment on native title. He was also a key negotiator in the 2010 Yarowa native title agreement which laid the foundations for the economic economic future for the Arow. Peter was appointed a member of the order of Australia in 2021 in recognition of this significant service and contributions. As a chair of the First Nations Economic Empowerment Alliance, Peter has negotiated the first comprehensive economic policy framework on the with the Commonwealth government signed on the 29th of September 2025. The agreement gives indigenous Australians a seat at the table enabling shared decisions to be made about reforms to First Nations economic policy. Please join me in warmly welcoming Professor Pyu. [applause] >> Uh thanks very much an for that uh generous and warm welcome and introduction. Um can I also uh first of all pay my respects to the uh Nanoala and Namry people uh whose country we are on here today as visitors and uh acknowledge their elders past and present uh and their connection to this land which of course long predates any institution represented here in this place. I do thank them for their ongoing because uh their ongoing hospitality and offering us safe passage and stay while we are here on their country. I think it's important to acknowledge and understand the whole um notion but not just notion of course the the nature of the welcome to country and acknowledgement in the country because I think obviously we've seen a lot of this in today's uh uh public arena about this but to understand clearly uh what its significance and meaning is uh for all of us while we [snorts] are visiting other people's country it's no different from anybody else traveling overseas we need passports to get in and all that sort of But here particularly because of the cultural relevancy in terms of ensuring that we are safe and we're protected and that our ancestors spirits know and feel and know that we're here. Most cultures uh would pronounce and announce your visit so that those spirits would hear and understand and there would be certain ceremonies conducted and that particularly of course is represented by the smoking ceremony here. I'd like to uh acknowledge my Aboriginal Trish Island friends and colleagues that are here today um and all of the countries from which you have come from. And whether you're from Canra or whether you're visiting from CRA or working in CRA, I think you would all appreciate the nature of those um those sentiments and those words. I'd like to thank the parliamentary librarian uh Liberian uh Mr. Steven Fox uh for the invitation to deliver this address and the honorable Ann Stanley for her generous introduction again. Um and um I know uh she did indicate she might be an apology to leave and I I was I was going to respond when she said she had to go division. Why so many divisions is reconciliation week? But I guess that's the way it works. Yeah. Um I do acknowledge Dr. Stephven Kennedy PSM and Mr. Matt Yenna PSM respective secretaries of the department of prime minister and cabinet and department of finance. Uh Julianne Gua CEO of the national um indigenous Australians agency and I I haven't met you Jala but I just pointed out that you are the head of the department for parliamentary services. So yeah thank you for thank you all for coming. Um and of course the um I'd like to thank my uh colleagues uh and friends and people from my office. So I brought me on merit card. He is there somewhere. So from the A&U uh and the economic empowerment alliance. I'd like to particularly acknowledge Leah Armstrong who's uh the interim director of the new center for indigenous economic transformation um but has been a key adviser to the establishment of the alliance. Uh and there are other colleagues here uh as well. So if I miss you, I'm sorry, but uh I do acknowledge your presence. Um and really thank you all for taking the time uh for coming along here. I think it's appropriate today to also um take [clears throat] excuse me to acknowledge and recognize the former Europe commissioner Travis Love uh who we will know the Kob Mara and Gajar Mara and Bondic Monik man uh the executive director of the University of Melbourne's center for truthtelling and dialogue to walked from his country some 900 kilometers away in the south to call for truthtelling healing and meaningful dialogue and all those others hundreds of others who had joined him on his walk here and they were committed uh to uh to to achieving um you know the processes to be able to establish truthtelling healing and a meaningful change arriving that arriving here at Parliament House of course and was met the prime minister yesterday and delivered that statement to him. It was interesting how um the just a couple of things I think just in in in 2026 just to remember um in this year represents the 100 years um anniversary of the 1926 forest drew massacre up in the in the Kimlies. Um it also represents 1946 to 80 years uh the Pilra pastoral strike, the longest uh running industrial action for uh award wages. Um and of course um you may recall there the um the fact that uh in in uh what is it uh 6068 the arbitration commission's decision to grant pastoral reward wages um and uh sorry 68 was the year after the referendum but uh I think quite significant from a personal point of view I recall just uh when I was I I ran the wind and welfare office in 1978 879 >> as a young 22 year old it was the size of Victoria but interestingly I worked with a group of very senior old pensionist people traditional and cultural traditional tribal people from um from the East Kimbleies and it was at a kind of pensionist camp about 20ks out of town and um I noticed an old man who was to the side and uh I later found out that in fact his name was Ernest But he was a police boy in in 1926 who took the police up the forest river and uh and he was living there slightly to his side with about 10 or 15 dogs that helped him to survive fundamentally cuz he used to hunt for him and look after him. Um and then in in 1970 later uh sorry earlier on in 7475 when I was working for the WA Museum as a traininee site recorder recording cultural sites along in the Kimbley mainly up the Gibber River road and at the bush um and on the coastal area as well um that uh I was fortunate to meet some of the senior leaders of the Pilra strike. So I only raise that because it's within my lifetime. These are these uh significant uh historical events that um have not yet diminished in terms of where we've been able to progress as a as a society, as a community to being able to understand more fully the nature of the the impact of those things. Um, also it's funny when you when you are kind of thematically looking at these uh topics or the issues you discuss today. I had to kind of suppress the dark sort of side of my my my very poor sense of humor because I was as I was coming from university. Uh it must be the kind of rubbish day at the university cuz the contractors via um the waste company were doing their rounds and and two of them drove by by me as I arrived at work this morning and and on the side it said committed to reconciliation. So I had to stop and think there for a while. But I I only say that in justest because they have made a serious contribution as a company and contributed millions of dollars to supporting Aboriginal projects right throughout the country. So, but it it was uh with some degree of um thinking and struggling to resolve how I would present today when accepting the invitation because it's a balance about the weight of historical failures in the denial of Aboriginal rights on the other side with the hope connected to opportunities before us to progress a more just and reconciled Australia. There's a lot of things you can talk about uh and I will talk about some of them here today. But I think this is the constant kind of um threat or balance uh opportunity I guess in terms of looking at where we are, where we haven't come from and what it is that presents ourselves as who we want to be and who we say we want to be. But the truth is that I need to talk about both because both are key to our shared resolve and to our healing. And reconciliation week now is now more than 30 years old and sorry day is nearly 30 and this is the actual you know formal recognition. These are obviously very sincere traditions and are important opportunities for us to reflect on our history and our relationship. My initial intention was to remind us of the ongoing failures to address the intergenerational trauma systematically embedded throughout our lives. Not for the purpose of inviting guilt, but as a reasoning for why reconciliation must fundamentally embrace truthtelling as a core responsibility. I have decided not to go through the volume of data describing our continued incarceration, our recidivism, deaths and custody, impoverishment and marginalized position in Australia. I know you are all exposed to this daily in the media and in the politics of indigenous affairs generally. But we do need to continue to remind ourselves of the lack of progress on closing any of the disparity and the inequalities between us and wider Australia. It is an important context to how we conceive reconciliation. Let's be clear and honest here. We are never going to close the gap with with the current approaches. No matter how well-intentioned it all might be, if we can't see this after 18 years of abject failure, then I think we're living in cuckoo land. It's in the structure and in the relationship, stupid. Of course, we need the ongoing investment to address those unacceptable and shocking disparities, but we also need a change of direction. The pictures you see in the town camps in dollar springs are all around this country. I've seen and been in those environments many times throughout my career spanning over half a century. The issues are structural and they are relationship based. I talked about that example of the of the um case in Windham and my first experience of the brutality of the of this reality was I I was as a I was a what call a district officer department for community welfare and entering into this little very hot iron hut was a frail old lady must have been about 60 70 but couldn't move lying on a rot iron bed with um basically ticks all over her body and like ticks up side of the wall. So my job was to try and arrange obviously to try and get her out of that situation some of the local women I took from the hospital aberiginal woman to help me to do that to be able to clean her to disinfect the nature of the where she was and to make sure that she was under proper care. I've slept in places after a full day in the bush and most of the time I slept in a swag for most of my career with people back on country and having come back and too tired to be able to and there's no hotels. I've been in places like old Mart house station which reminded me of the kind of um of Sueta the photos you see of the barbwire fences um and the and and the sheetine huts and slept on the floor with my swag with those old people who are the traditional owners taking me on their country showing me their country and for for me to be able to do my job in relation to recording those cultural sites and having uh cockroaches and things run over you in the middle of the night not being able to sleep. So I've been in this sort of situation on many occasions working with traditional owners and I only say that here because we see the images uh on social media and television but we don't understand the depravity and the and and the poverty and the impact on people. This is the and this is not 40 50 years ago. This is happening today in our society in one of the richest countries in the world, first nation OECT country economically. So the disparity is not little, it's huge. And the effort required to be able to transform that is significantly huge because the foundations of our relationship and the systems used to address our disadvantage are just currently reinforcing our lived colonial experiences and our disempowerment. Public policy and indigenous affairs has for decades focused on our deficit, not on our strengths and what we can contribute. Notwithstanding the entrenched issues we face, this creates a relationship of dependency, ensuring our ongoing impoverishment and marginalization. For our part as indigenous peoples, we have to take the initiative to not be co-opted and seduced by the system under the false pretenses of self-determination. We have to be smarter and more strategic than that. So this system does not work with little accountability and appetite in governments to change. What do we do? Not to saying there isn't empathy and people want to do the right thing. So it's a bad system. Later in this address, I will provide some thoughts on a way forward that I think can help us to better advance reconciliation and a healthier relationship between ourselves, governments and the wider community. First though, I want to speak a little bit about our context local and the broader geopolitical and economic circumstances that influences our capacities for reconciliation. This saying today, the only certainty today is uncertainty is a cliche now well worn by political media and other commentators to explain the prevailing circumstances. And in my opinion, nothing better captures the relevance of this expression than the position of first peoples in Australia in 2026. Former Senator Patrick Dodson recently said to me that there was no political agency and little empathy that the left and his quote the left and the right arteries have hardened. A few examples are worth noting. When the new Conservative governments took place in Queensland and Northern Territory, some of the earliest actions directly undermine reconciliation. They said about dismantling processes for treaty and truth telling which had been critical work to reshape in a more equitable way the political economic dynamics between indigenous peoples and governments. [clears throat] This was done with with little fanfare or resistance or resistance that this was done with little fan for resistance speaks volumes of how shallow the roots of reconciliation run in our public policy discourse. And these governments also implemented policies framed through a punitive lens with direct consequences for our people, particularly our children who continue to experience harm in detention settings, risking deepening punishment and isolation where care and restoration are most needed. And I just like to take a moment to to I've just met um Georgina and I haven't met her husband but she told me her husband's name is Michael who sitting here today and they've come along to listen from concerned Australians which has been an an organization which has been around for quite a number of many of years decades I think and I know very little of the history so I apologize for that. But I do want to thank you cuz they gave me this uh Georgina presented this to me today. um which is the truth about the Northern Territory intervention and I know a bit about that having done the review for the RUD government in 2008. But I want to thank them and people like them who continue to be genuinely concerned Australians for our circumstances, not just for Aboriginal people, but for the country, for who we are as a country and what we should be doing and where we should be. So I do want to acknowledge them and I do want to thank them and thank you for providing me with this. I appreciate it very much and thank you for coming today. It's plain to me that following the referendum defeat in 2023, indigenous peoples in Australia have been a focus of heightened bigotry and racism. Across Australia's history, the story of racism is predominant. But in 2026, how can we accept it? How can we accept it in 2026? Look, I could go on about, you know, the Royal Commission that's there that's justifiably there in relation to the postbondi situation with the anti-Semitic kind of movement that's uh, you know, emerged here. But we as a original people could say, well, we've been, this has been our lot since first footprints in Botney Bay in 1788. There have been but seven royal commissions in Australia dealing with Aboriginal issues both from the state royal commissions but also national royal commissions over the history of this country. And if you look at them um you'll notice that the kind of recommendations are pretty much significantly the same about the welfare. We've had so many Royal Commission's recommendations um and they're all very similar about and largely it's about the systemic nature of the impact of colonization and the administration systems that have been uh implemented around that. Um I'll come back to that in a more but just to I guess just to remind us and we probably don't need reminding about this but you know last year there was that explosive advice thrown into a crowd on invasion days in Perth. There was a 13-year-old Nunga girl on a train in Perth was physically bullied by an offduty police officer. On Anzac Day, there was coordinated efforts to boo and disrupt welcome to country ceremonies in all the major cities. Last month, we saw the tragic death of 5-year-old Kumjai little baby, which should have called forth national compassion and respect for the grieving family and community. And while it did scalvinize many an outpouring of sincere support and solidarity, much of the media and social media focus subject that family to scrutiny at a moment of profound sorrow. We can and we must be better than that. These incidents should not be dismissed as isolated. They reveal a deeper unresolved wound in the soul of the nation. We see currently shifting political trends towards the far-right groups, promoting racist ideology and undermining the core principles of reconciliation. If we don't confront these trends directly, reconciliation will move beyond our reach. I recall when null Pearson spoke with painful clarity after the referendum defeat, he said we are not popular and that we are not personally known to many Australians. He said, "We are a much unloved people and that Australia is a hard country." Unfortunately, these words ring true for many, if not all Aboriginal people. Most recently, a most my most recently departed close friend and colleagues used to say to me that, and I quote, "Incrementalism can make you or kill you." And I guess this is part of the thematic proposition I seek to frame my words today and proposals around it as it defines reconciliation which I'll come to later. But so far in the f 50 odd year of indigenous public policy administration we have been dying a slow death. Last week the AU hosted a meet the author forum facilitated by Frank Bongo on remembering the hawk government a gold standard question mark. A recently released publication by well-known respected contributors from various disciplines with firsthand knowledge and insight working to the h cork government from that era. As a panel member, I was asked by Frank if there was a gold standard period for indigenous peoples during that time. My response were that it was gold standard in terms of aspirations and expect expectations of what was expected by indigenous peoples but fell well short of that standard in its application and outcomes. The green branches that promised greater indigenous autonomy in the wake of the Marbo decision 30 years ago and the recognition of native title have not been nurtured. Instead of building from the opportunity for a genuinely new and more equitable relationships, overwhelmingly governments have sought to cut and stifle the expansion of indigenous autonomy. The demise of these opportunities is represented by the referendum defeat. Governments have lost some of their will and our people have had too much of our autonomy, autonomy absorbed by bureaucracy, bureaucracies and political caution. But some very positive examples such as the developments related to treaty in Victoria are cause for hope. But building on that important work requires confronting the entrenched issues I'm talking about today. My response to my friend was that without a relationship with government based on trust and with limited independent financial capacity to underpin our socioultural resilience, autonomy and sustainability, then it will be a monumental task to accept incrementalism in a fractured system as a solution to our marginalization. So what is the alternative? And here I want to talk about trust. I think this is fundamentally important and it I know that trust is a muchused word um and it can become burdened with the overuse of it as a cliche but we have to take the time to understand what it really is because it is not a bureaucratic concept. It is a very tissue of human relationships. Without it nothing holds. Without trust, reconciliation is the word ungrounded and without real meaning. Important to building trust is of course honesty. Telling truths about our fraud past and our uncertain present. The truth is reconciliation. The truth is reconciliation has not delivered the transformation promising promise that closing the gap has not led to a marked shift in our well-being or in our relationship with governments and wider and the wider society. If we are to have any hope of improving our relationship and realizing reconciliation, we need to focus on building trust and mutual respect. There are three immediate specific and immediate priorities I want to highlight which these I think can contribute to new dynamic in the relationship between indigenous people's governments and the wider community. One that contributes to meaningful reconciliation. The first is a new federal policy architecture built on trust, not programs delivered to us, but a partnership built with us. The second is a reshaped economic and fiscal relationship with this nation. This means treating us not as welfare recipients, but as equity holders, as economic actors with rights and interests in this land with great things to bring to our national economy and prosperity. And the third is the unfinished legal businesses of our peoples. The courts have moved this country further than any than many parliaments have been prepared to go and that legal work remains vital. To the first point, the National Indigenous Relationship Agency. There is currently no formal engagement pathway with the Commonwealth government to develop and consider specifically nation building strategic endeavors aimed at improving the relationship with indigenous peoples and to implemented substantive reconciliation. We have various agencies at the conlock level engaged in different policy initiatives related to indigenous Australians. The National Indigenous Australian Agency plays a central role. None of these agencies however are specifically focused on the big picture political and educ and economic transition in the relationship with indigenous peoples that needs to occur if we are to make progress on reconciliation. I have thought for some time that the Commonwealth government should separate policy and program functions of NIA. The program and service delivery functions including related to the national partnership and closing the gaps should continue to be the responsibility of NIA and other designated government agencies who also have responsibility on the national partnership agreement to focus specifically on strategic and nationally significant policy matters related to the political and economic relationship between governments and indigenous peoples of Australia. There should be a fitfor-purpose resource. A Commonwealth Indigenous Relationship Agency could be a separate independent agency operating under the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet or alongside of it. The agency would be headed up by a senior indigenous person and supported by a majority run indigenous reference board mandated to engage with the community indigenous and non-indigenous including the corporate and private sector and bring forward a new policy proposal based on rights reconciliation and building trust. Some of the key reform agenda items could include things like operationalizing UNRIP the United Nations Declaration of the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. A critical framework for substantive reconciliation which the Australian government endorses but has but has generally not engaged with. advancing national truthtelling framework, establishing a national native title compensation response, and I'll come to that as my third point. Um, it's a sleeping giant. Implementing and coordinating a comprehensive fiscal and economic policy framework for indigenous prosperity and refreshing and reinvigorating policy ideas relevant to truth and reconciliation including the national agreement on closing the gap and a more comprehensive social justice package as advised by the Keading government in 1994. Now we are to acknowledge we are in a process of of negotiating under the um uh national the economic as was mentioned by an and introductory comments the the the new uh uh partnership with the coalition of peaks and the government through under the opus of treasury and other agencies. But I am not promoting the type of shuffling of deck chairs within prime minister and cabinet previously attempted by Australian governments to address indigenous disadvantage. What I'm talking about is restructuring the National Public Policy Administration so that is better organized and capable of making positive differences in the lives of indigenous peoples and to the relationship to struggle when worked and tied to the relationship that struggle when worked with tied bureaucratic tools. A focus of a new agency would be coordinating and implementing policies that drive a national indigenous fiscal and economic policy framework as one such priority and I think the importance of this because it has a whole range I'm not going to go through into prescriptive further prescriptive details of it but you could imagine something that uh because there's a the complicated nature of our constitution and our kind of um um um the legal framework in terms of the Commonwealth's relationship with the jurisdictions and how that operates. Of course, um um I suppose you don't really get to know much of it if you're involved in looking at what its end product is in terms of the processes it needs to go through and how it affects communities on the ground. Something which I've done for the last 40 odd years. But you can imagine um something of a new national accord adopted by the new national cabinet that ties in the jurisdictions but also ties in our own communities uh to be able to better design co-design and designate the nature of responsibility um and accountability that deals with the enormous amount of investment that goes in there. And most of that's comrad money. I'm sure Steve would probably confirm that. uh but uh from his previous role but the the the nature of its uh the delivery the machinery for delivery and its distribution that the fact that you've had to create and there's nothing not arguing against the the uh a control organization they play a very big role but uh they are also a bureaucracy so we've we've got three we got federal government state government local government and And then we've got um the uh echoes. They're the real ones where the attention should be placed on and given support in terms of their contact. But we're organiz we're we're kind of missing the enormous amount of uh issue of efficiency and productivity that comes with a more proficient manner in which the public administration not only in policy but also the nature of its uh machinery of delivery is is currently not given much attention. And remember we haven't had any any major policy reform since Marbo in 1994. So 30 years there hasn't been a major policy initiative in Aboriginal affairs. Um you could probably put aside the national partnership closing the gap um 18 odd years ago when it was originally um implemented. But formally in terms of the kind of critical matters underpinning our relationship and and building the nature of um self-determination and independence for us to take the responsibility moving away from the social deficit position that continually uh undermines the nature of the investment and our ability to achieve things. So let's look at this uh national indigenous economic framework which is the second part I'll go and I'll I will try and wind up it quickly now because I know that you want to have you may want a question around some of this stuff and I'm happy to respond to it but we now have legal interest over 60% of this country post land rights postnative titles in northern Australia the figure is closer to 80 80% sent the minerals beneath that land including critical minerals this country and the world needs for the clean energy transition lies overwhelming overwhelming on Aberiginal country. I'm sounding like Donald Trump can't pronounce my words lie overwhelmingly on on Aberiginal country and yet we remain amongst the poorest Australians and just look at the hundred years of so-called mining um the mining industry and see how many rich Aboriginal people there are on their lands. and is is this and critical mineral is going to be around for the next uh 100 years to come. So this is a critical juncture in the nature of the history of our economic relationship. So we remain and I was actually in Broom just a day ago uh on Tuesday at the um Broom Chamber of Commerce and Industry um symposium conference on um on economic development self-determination and the Kimble is 97% of the lands native title lands 97%. and that is mainly exclusive possession. Um, Aboriginal interest in past releases represents about 32% that's 30 properties representing about uh 7 million hectares. Now not all those properties are viable. Some are margin most of them are marginal. Um we tried to I was the deputy chair of the indigenous land se corporation. We um David Ross was the chair after we negotiated this with ATIC and Paul Keing and we tried to implement a growth and investment strategy in the Kimbley by rationalizing the kind of non-viable properties to be able to look at developing a critical mass in herd numbers better herd management practices the basic infrastructure needed for it from transport to kind of w you know watering points to fences all that sort of stuff because we sit on the edge of the Indian Ocean, [snorts] four or five hours to to Jakarta and to um Singapore and probably 5 to 10 days by freight ship there. So we own all this land but the issue still is of course fundamentally the question of um access to capital but also but it's not just about the question of you know the access to affordable capital but it's also about the governance and other capability in manage in in in the Aboriginal PBC's and corporations the subsidiary kind of entities the special purpose vehicles whatever but here you have a critical case study of um where there is enormous potential to increase the level of productivity and contribution to the national state and national GDP in very real ways while elevating uh us out of our current um marginalized position. I mean that's it's a reality. There are other opportunities. They're developing a a data center worth $100 million just about 100 km south of Broom. the whole question of um export of um renewable energy into Asia. Kimbley's is actually economically part of Southeast Asia and China. You know, the fourth largest regional um economy in the world, the largest one of the Indonesia, one of the largest populations about 390 odd million people. And I've spoken to some people who come on trade missions and stuff and they they say to me half tongue and cheek, but what do you people want to do? you trying to starve us in Indonesia? They don't have any land. Well, they're running out of land very very rapidly cuz they um and there are those kinds of examples of where um you know considered level of uh investment could very easily move towards um a kind of uh I guess a more efficient way of using public artless. generating kind of own source revenues within those kind of communities and and providing the kind of confidence and leverage because um I think that's why this the whole question of the fiscal and economic policy reform is so critical to all of this. So, and and as an example, I mean, Northern Australia has been trading with Indonesia for like 400 odd years, and you could say in some ways um with China, mainly in fish products. And of course, the main one was was um uh beach debur or trapang as is known um they've been trading that for over 4 500 years. So and um pearling were where you know broom broom was the pearling capital of the world before discovery of um of oil in the middle east post second world war I mean we were the we've got the largest and this is not the pearls the jewelry stuff of course that's in that's probably what it is there for now but the pearl shells because of it the strength the luster and and the n itself it's was used for everything within in paints, for jewelry, for um clothes, everything. My father, in fact, was a hard hat diver. Used to dive for pearl shells uh back in the uh 50s and 60s. Um so, and um Broom is unique in the Australian landscape because they turned a blind eye to the white Australia policy because the they tried to use ex British marine divers to come, but the the conditions were too harsh. sure they had to use Asian labor to come in to do that. So we're unique in the Australian landscape, but it it it it's a model to understand because it it does represent what Australia could be if it was to embrace the nature of properly understand multiculturalism and embrace that the um the I think the um so we've been doing this for a long time um because I think one of the things to understand is that somehow we we don't see the need for us to be economic beings as Gallerin Pingu used to say we just see ourselves in a deficit position of being colonized and therefore we have to kind of try and um deal with that sort of situation but we we have to understand the whole nature of colonization was predicated on the the question of um exploitation of our resources I mean who underwrote the nature of colonization the banks the government. The way the structure was set up, the way this house was set up from my perspective, it was set up to actually um provide and facilitate the enrichment of the colonizers. I mean, if you look at the history of Australia, go back to uh when the constitution in 1901, the kind of constitutional conventions, um it was very difficult to get the the the colonies to come together to form the federated country. parks. And if you look at the constitution, you'll still see clause 25 there, which fundamentally allows the state governments to discount votes of the basis of race. But parks had to do a deal. And remember the first sitting of Australian parliament Melbourne in 1901, of course, was the uh immigration act, which we're still dealing with today. So that says something about our country. But uh the um the fact that uh you know we still have that in our constitution. People say oh we'll never use it be too you know political but who knows Pauline Hans might get enough votes to start our own party things might start to change but there are the kind of reflections and I don't make gest of that when I talk about this question because I think that we're under real attack and real threat. Um and these are my personal views not that it's university but the the question of uh we have to be um vigilant about the nature of what this means because for all of the advances and changes we're trying to make towards reconciliation that can be undone quite quickly and so we need to be very much aware of that. Um, so I'm not going to I think just to just to refer to Justice Brennan's comments um uh in Marbo the high court in Marbo 2 where he acknowledged his dispossession and he and he said and quote indigenous people had been dispossessed of their land parcel by parcel to make way for expanding colonial settlement. our disposition dispossession underwrote the development of the nation he said unquote. So this should be the priority of the government is rebuilding our economic autonomy. We have a lot to offer but we are obviously very limited capacity at the moment and that's why we need government. Native title has been important but it critically limits in its delivering us genuine autonomy and economic opportunity in relation to our traditional country and we remain constrained by restrictions on how we can use our land by those things that I've mentioned by limited access to capital the right type of capital by the terms but we are often asked to accept when others seek to use our country so Australian businesses things are happening anyway. But this is about structural change. This is about the machinery of how do we actually set up the new foundations to do this. We are growing and m and Michelle Evans's work uh at the Diller Jura Center her center in Melbourne University indicates that there's obviously significant amount of work uh businesses and enterprise being established. I think about 14 to four I might get this wrong 4 to6,000 kind of businesses or 14,000 Aboriginal businesses contributing about $6 billion to the kind of through wages and and other contributions relevant to the national GDP. So things are happening but again this is the nature of increment incrementalism. We need to jump over incrementalism. We we need what's happening anyway in in our community and building um these successful businesses, but we have to jump ahead of that. There goes another division. Um so we're a growing part of the Australian economy and we do make an important contribution at the moment to productivity and economic prosperity. On the international plane, our potential is significant and this should be a factor in international trade and investment considerations. that we have been asking for a long time for those with their hands on the policy leaders of our commonwealth to work with us to develop solutions that will improve our economic autonomy that will reduce public art outlays and create our own source revenue in the pursuit of a more equitable sustainable economic outcomes for us and the community wider community. There are examples of improved effective arrangements in our international partners in Canada. Efforts towards economic reconciliation are notable. Bestpoke statutes and institutions and a focus on agreement making have seeded the beginnings of a transformed economic relationship between indigenous people's governments and the wider communities. Loan guarantees, affordable finance, long-term beneficial leasing and support for local revenue capability. They're not utopian ideas. They are workable policy tools. The question for Australian governments is whether the will exists to build them here. what we need to real what we need to realize what we need to realize this ambition is a coordinated economic and fiscal framework and I've talked about that um I'm going to jump ahead to the last point I've mentioned I think enough to be able to give you a clear idea about uh what we need to do there uh and what's happening at the moment in our negotiations under the national economic partnership arrangement So I want to skip to the unfinished law business and the law. The courts have been a critical forum for the recognition of our rights and interests as indigenous peoples. We have since the early 1970s various arguments about indigenous rights put to the superior courts in Australia. Some of these, such as the Marbo 2 decisions, have helped to redefine the foundations of our legal relationship from a history of legal invisibility to one of limited recognition and persistence of our communities to ask difficult questions of Australian courts have been critical. In the last 10 years, we have seen an important evolution in Australian juristprudence. The Timber Creek and more recently MacArthur River, the Yinja Bundy compensation cases last week, couple weeks ago have despite various issues establish a powerful foundation for native title compensation relevant across a Australia. Decisions by the high court in love and Tomms and last year in Yunipingu have stretched conventional understanding of the relationship of indigenous peoples in the constitution. These cases have led to limited protections for indigenous peoples being read into the constitution. Acknowledgement by the courts of the deeper truth of our nation's history. Our societies were here with systems of law and economy before anyone else arrived. And we are still here practicing our law and customs and protecting our countries and our culture. Although the wheels of justice may be slow turning, our efforts in the courts will be an important will be important to lighting lighting a path for our futures for giving some definition to a relationship with Australia based on mutual respect, truthtelling and a recognition of the past. Importantly, strategic efforts in the courts may provide some momentum to take us into a future of reconciliation tethered to the substantive real world outcomes and a deeper trust between indigenous peoples and the governments of Australia. The role of government in responding to any questions brought before the courts will be important and watched closely, including arguments put against our communities about the value and the nature of our inherent rights. This is an important opportunity in this involving legal landscape for our governments to have a sophisticated discussion with our communities about settling past grievances and negotiating at a better, a more constructive relationship. This too is an opportunity for reconciliation. We are not asking for charity. We are asking for recognition, for opportunities for right, for the tools to determine our own future and our terms of our own country, for ways to develop trust. Only will those tools are generally secured will the gap close. Only then will reconciliation become something more than a word. Only then can Australia stand tall as a nation. Not despite indigenous peoples, but because of them, with them in a genuine, enduring, and honorable relationship. I should say that I forgot to say around the corner there is the 1963 Uricala Bach petition. There is also the 1960 1988 Baranga statement. And one would see in time perhaps that the Uru statement from the heart will also hang here. Now depending on your perspectives, some will see these as colonial trophies of the invading power. I see them as reminders and opportunities of what we can achieve and what we will achieve if there is the political will and the intent to do so. But they represent formally general invitation by our communities to try and settle formally the nature of our relationship between each other and to look with greater prospect of being able to define this relationship as something worthwhile not just for us alone but for the whole nation. So let us join Travis love it and the many hundreds of Aboriginal and to islander people supporters in the walk for truth for listening and national repair to reconciliation. They are principles we should be all working together. I apologize for taking so long, Phil. I need to say that, but thank you for your patience and your tennis today. [applause] I think um [applause] the one thing um is uh the Canadian situation but I think um you can look at various examples of what um has happened in other countries particularly the Scandinavian countries in terms of the nature of political representation um uh in in the parliament. Uh but also I think you can look at the nature of the um our very close neighbors and friends across the ditch as they say um through the um um m representation in parliament. I think the um but reconciliation obviously as we all say is a journey. It's not a it's a destination but we we reach various kind of in the road map various milestones that tell us we may be on the right track. It's not a an end all solution reconciliation. It's a it's obviously something we have to work for. Um I think but there are concurrent and simultaneous decisions that are made in public policy administration by way of agreements by way of um legal decisions that are made um to the things I've talked about where this causes governments in a political environment to respond to these things. We have a very poor track record in Australia of responding to any of that. And I I didn't go into detail about compensation, but um they're live issues right now. But I do think um the fact that there is um political representation, I think that there is a a sense of um based on historical treaties um where there is agency and and a legal relationship happening in Canada with the treaties there. I think that uh those things represent the forms of reconciliation and reconciliation come and they're substandard forms. That's the thing. They're not just as important as it is for each individual and family and groups to commit towards wanting to work toward that. The formality of reconciliation has to be uh demonstrated by the nature of the structural changes um the legal framework by which that operates in as well. So you know where they are happening there there are multiple examples. We we remain I think the only country perhaps except for Ireland I suppose that has don't have formal reconcile position in relation to to United Kingdom to England. I think we they were the first colony and we're the last colony. It's ironic but we're two countries that have yet not reconciled this with England but of course we try to reconcile that here amongst ourselves. So there are multiple examples and precedences you know so and I think an an example of where we have it of course is we still have outstanding issues in relation to the apology by Kevin Rudd there are still states that haven't yet addressed the redress situation with compensation every country where there has been some apology for the historical deeds have also set in train a place to not just repatriate on reparations and repatriate but also some formal um compensation payment arrangements. Some are starting to happen but in Australia but it there is no uh not all states have yet settled on that matter. >> Thanks Betty. Yeah I can I can speak with a little bit of knowledge of across the ditch. um sort of >> in terms of the the you can see in in that context albeit with a treaty um what economic independence actually contributes to to Mario particularly in the South Island thinking about Nahu they have a major investments in energy generation in ongoing capital infrastructure which um has without a shadow of doubt improved across not just economic but social um opportunities for for my target there. So there is a question from the crowd. So if we put a mic just in the middle there. Yeah. Thanks. Thank you for your talk. >> Is this on? >> Yep. You said if I recall correct uh correctly there have been no major policy initiatives since Maro. I think it must have been no major beneficial policy initiatives cuz I can think of two major initiatives in the days of the Howard government. The first was the abolition of ATSE. I had the privilege of working with ATIC particularly with Lois Loa Odonahu and it was an extraordinarily successful organization working from the grassroots up with regional councils and representation working up towards the board. They developed policy and they managed funds in my view successfully until they had one chair who was not not so successful. The other major initiative in the Howard government was of course the Northern Territory Intervention. May I ask, would you favor the reestablishment of a body such as ATS, an elected body, working from the grassroots up and managing major programs? Well, first of all, thank you for correcting me because that's just my positive side, I suppose. Um but you're absolutely right and I do recall I think that was very much a turning point in Australian history with the u election of John Howard in 1996. I think unfortunately Bob Hawk didn't stick to his curability agreement and maybe with Keing in the chair for a little bit longer things might have been significantly different. Um had his very good points there's no doubt about that. Um and uh I think the best part about that my own personal opinion was the regional councils. Um the question is that we do have a vacuous situation right now and there is no current agency in regards to uh addressing governments. Um I think that we probably have learned a lot uh from ATS in in in the period since its demise. Uh and with the advent of native title uh there's a lot more younger leaders and there's a lot more kind of knowledge base that's come through native title establishment of PBC's and their respective entities business entities [clears throat] to deal with u transactional issues on their land. Um I I'm not sure if I because I was a bit uncertain with the voice. I supported the voice but I was concerned about whether or not the voice might in fact become another ATSIC at a n at a kind of national level. I support the kind of regional bodies agencies. I think that's what's missing. I think that um there has to be some consideration with governments um obviously is treading carefully in the current political environment about developing some agency. I've never personally and philosophically thought that any appointed bodies by governments would necessarily succeed. >> Thank you. because I I'm a firm believer in self-determination and it had to be something that um organically or germinated from the community themselves to develop the kind of level of representation in agency. Uh so it is an issue today and that's why my proposal about uh a new agency and I'm I understand that there is some element of risk. But I'm not going into this naively, but I do think that that's probably a more um immediate way of dealing with that situation in terms of um with disappointing one. Now, I think you'd probably I I don't know that it'd be I would see some risk with that. I think that we would need to take this take a step back and do this a little bit more organically. But um ASIC did play a role. Uh I was an example of this was I was chair I was involved in ATIC at the local level for a little while. Um I was chair of the ainal housing board under the state housing commission WA and I know one of the processes under ATIC was um through the Chins project the community housing infrastructure needs project which is probably the most effective um program I think um um measurement tool that was available but local communities were determining their investment in housing priority and had to negotiate with the state in terms the distribution of Commonwealth housing funds to their respective zones or areas. I thought that was quite effective personally. Um I I I have I would like to see what there needs to be discussion about some national representation. There is there is discussion going on. I'm part of a board at the moment which which is called the national caucus which emerged out of the referendum. Uh that we are engaged in um communication right across Australia. We've had one national forum late last year and another one due in about 6 months time to give the community an opportunity to think about what type of representation or agency they're seeking. That's an attempt to grow this organically again from the community rather than seeing it as a government uh appointed water site. Just another question from online. Um fiscal policy reform is important but how do we also get policy that holds public companies to account to stop uh organizations blowing up sacred sites for example? Well, I think I mean the normal way would be like people who break the law, >> you know, you you you charge them to the fullest extent of the law. Whether the whether the current laws are strong enough to deter people from it or even thinking about doing it, that's another question. But why should people be outside the law? We're expected to follow the law. Are there two different sets of law, one for us and one for the rest of the community? I think um but it what it also demonstrated I think is the the lack of agency in terms of the capacity of local prescribed body corporates or relevant agencies who are responsible for the management of those areas of lands. They're they're challenged that they can meet those requirements. So they're under dual pressure from their own communities in terms of sustaining the integrity of those sites and the ritual practices that come with it >> and the expression that that provides um ensuring that there is you know the manifestation of succession arrangements for the importance important cultural traditional knowledge. So it has a the flow and effect is not limited. It it adds to the current trauma situation and that's a value. It's a bit like looking at what's happened with uh the India case and I haven't read or seen the full brief the full details. It's the judgment still to be be put out there, but the comments from the presiding judge on that in terms of economic loss, which was about $100,000$undred $100,000 I think it was for economic loss for the destruction of 200 plus odd cultural sites. I mean the it's it may well seem to be a complicated issues in how you develop the kind of formula um about that the kind of value uh as it relates to the economic loss, but the fact that you had 4 240 odd cultural sites destroyed >> just without looking at the economic side of it, but the nature of the nature of the kind of cost of that that I suppose gives you some indication what um what the challenges are >> attaching value to culture is fraught. I think uh it's very difficult to put economic value to to culture I think and yeah it's it's a difficult >> it is but there was a there was a precedent with the Griffith's case in Timber Creek you know that was um non-exclusive lands >> and um a a an impact on a cultural site um where the the the judge in the Indian Bundy case decided not to go with with that decision And I'm still trying to understand why that was. The comments he made was that it would have been you know you would have you would have probably been using that formula because the the criteria the Yabundi case of course was exclusive native title that and he made reference to the um kind of enormous amount of value under the Timber Creek decision. >> The compensation worth that would have been quite significant. So I I don't want to misquote the judge or misrepresent what his decision without knowing what the full thing is. But it's it's intriguing >> just at a superficial level to >> to understand that. >> Uh another question, uh how do you counter the voices of those who seek to disempower First Nations people? Why are we still witnessing acts of racism against First Nation people? >> Um racism is embedded in our Australian society. That's the truth of it. Racism is never and it's it's not just Australian study. It's all we have a particular form because of the nature of our history of colonization. But racism is is is kind of everywhere. I mean, you know, Mandela's entire legacy was about the sickness of racism, particularly within its kind of official form. Um and I think the fact that we don't address this in a um in a legal way because I mean there was some debate years ago about section 18 of the rest discrimination act um and the idea of question of um making it unlawful in regards to racial vilification. and the whole world jumped up and down. Certainly the white world jumped up and down because said there was an attack on freedom of speech. Uh but now we have a royal commission happening as a result of any sematic actions and thoughts. So I'm a little bit confused sometimes. I'm not the brightest person in the around the world but I mean it confused about these kind of levels of contradiction. But it's largely predicated on the nature of the kind of the the political authority and will. Um racism is embedded and while we can't stop the struggle to eliminate all forms of racism and we have international covenants in the United Nations, we have um you know the UNRIP which has um been acknowledged by the parliament here. But we haven't seen the manifestations of real efforts. But I think the best way to deal with racism is about building confidence uh through in our own people, aberiginal people, doesn't matter, people of all colors. And the fact that we um what gets me really is that we we we're such a very wealthy rich country. We're capable of ensuring there's a greater sense of balance and equity in the nature of what we purport we want to do, but we don't yet achieve it. And I know a couple of years ago the treasurer talked about a kind of well-being budget. It be really fascinating interesting to see you know that extrapolated out to what that actually means in terms of dealing with building confidence investing and building um um stable um regional and local economies and incomes. It's a battle every day. But I but I think the only way to counter terrorism is if we um are able to develop a culture of wealth transfer and generation in the Aboriginal community because all we're doing at the moment is really in the current deficit policies is is we're transferring trauma. We're just kind of intergenerational trauma and that's what our kids learn. they learn about I grew up my entire life as a young because I'm third generation Catholic mission stolen generation I would say that being fearful of authority and police because every time we were told to behave ourselves we were told the police were going to come and take us away my grandmother was taken away when she was 10 years old from fish crossing taken to a Catholic mission my mother was taken off when she was born put in a Catholic dormatory I was sent to school when I was 12 years old to a mission in the south 5 years. Um, so you grow up and I I can honestly say personally I probably didn't get full confidence till I was in my 60s till I was um nobody knows somebody's experience personal experience or history and stuff like that and most of a tural communities there's our young kids are a lot more confident which is fantastic and it's great to see that happen. But the intergenerational trauma stuff is very real. We can't ignore that. You know, when you when you brought up your whole life to be fearful of authorities, the authorities that are there supposedly for your benefit and good. Um I think so. I think in real terms, racism is about developing our own confidence, our own abilities to deal with it so that we're not reliant on anybody else so that we can deal away with the kind of the current propaganda misinformation that's out there about, you know, black fles get free motorc cars and and um free homes and all that sort of rubbish. But I think the other side of it is you got to educate the other side, the white people. It's not about us all the time. It's about the white community. You know, maybe something like an anti-smoking campaign or anti-cancer campaign where you're actually in people's face. I said that to Clive Holding in the 80s when I was in the NAC. I said because we were talking during the national land debate that that Bob Hawk had promised. as you're not going to get people across the line unless you actually go out there and educate them. But you need it on billboards. You need it on side of buses and trains. You need on the radio. You need to invest it like smoking gives you cancer cuz cuz um racism is cancer is the biggest cancer we got. If we don't get rid of if we don't deal with it and manage it in a way, it is the way at the bones and the souls of our society. It's what and and we have a natural destructive side of us as human beings in my own mind anyway because we we tend to see what the differences between us rather than what's common and and particularly when it comes to um disparity in wealth that fuels the nature of the perception f becomes a reality and fuels the nature of hate. >> I think that that's >> got another question from the room. Um this is just a a comment that that um or a question that flows on from that um comment. Um Peter, thank you. Uh I would love to hear your reflections on the changing nature of championship. So um leadership and and the courage to lead uh particularly coming from non-first nations people um people in power people in leadership positions and if you'd be able to share with us a reflection um potentially on how that's changed and where you think that's headed. Thank you. Yeah, it's a difficult question. Um, and I don't I mean I I think for me I think universities and kind of other institutions like that have a in terms of what we teach today. I think that there is not enough um thought thought leadership in leadership. I think we we're we're we're you know we're in the fourth industrial revolution. We're challenged by the nature of change as it is with technology and now that AI is upon us. I see that as a you know like everything else is a bit of a paradox because there's a kind of um an opportunity but also enormous kind of risk that happens. Um I think that um I think someone said before the problem with politics today is everybody's got a microphone. It might have been Gareth Evans um uh said that uh in in regards to social media. So the being able to corral the nature of thought processes and uh understandings um and to appreciate and understand the real values of um teachings, philos philosophical teachings about social sciences and cultural studies and things like that. I think they're a major and important part because we we don't we we we we consume what we see and we we consume so much and we see we see so little of the depth of the nature of issues. Um I think that we got to start teaching people but and social media can be good or bad. Of course, there's some really good things, but I think we it probably more my own view is it shows more the worst side of us more than it does necessarily the good. Um, so how well educated are our people today? I think is important. And I think we're not very well educated, but we can still have the nature of the ideas and thoughts that drive the nature of xenophobia and difference and racism without people taking the opportunity to enter into some portal to examine it and take the effort and time and energy and the int of the to find the intelligence of what it is. And that's I I don't know what the answers are, but I think teaching this in a discrete and specific manner in schools and university would be a good start um to giving people I I mean I didn't pass my school but one of the things I did appreciate was in fact English and drama. When I was in grade seven, we did merchant of Venice for God's sake, you know, at a Catholic nun school and we practiced every day for a year, every afternoon. Got to learn our lines and the most embarrassing part is having to wear the costumes. Um but I can still quote lines and talk with my fellow actors who were part of that who grew up together because it was it was kind of we were rightly indoctrinated about the good things about learning about that environment and I don't know if you can do that today or not but I think and and I'm at my age I'm entitled to say the good old days these days but but I do understand and appreciate you know the brilliance of of the new generations coming up I don't in any way suggest that they don't have the answers but we have to help them in making contribution I think to understanding the context of reform and change so I don't think I answered your question but I think at the end of the day I always look at at political leadership It's what sort of country we want to have and given that um the nature of our social democratic society you know it should be something that would be part of the public education system of what what do we want to see as a modern social democracy in this country I mean with all the upheaval that's going in the world you can't really say US is a kind of modern social democracy the whole world is being re reordered as they say you know as Carney talks about as kind of the European Union is talking about all of that but we have to look at that at a local level it's like the old saying from the 60s when the emergence of the the political environmental movement you [clears throat] know when they used to say um think globally act locally that came from the environmental movements the late 60s and 70s that's what we've got to do here in Australia.