What Really Happened To Nolan Wells? Warren Hudson Officer Tatum Interview Breakdown

Today we're going to talk about Warren Hudson. Now, there's a case that's just played wide open about a fellow named Nolan Wells who's who uh passed away. And a lot of people think this guy Warren and his friends may have had something to do with his death. This happened out on the water. Greg's getting ready to give you all the details about it. Greg, tell us about the videos we're going to watch. >> This is a good opportunity because Brandon Tatum, who is interviewing, is an ex police officer, so his questioning style is going to be more like ours would be. And that's good news. On July 4th, 2026, 18-year-old Nolan Wells went missing after attending an Independence Day gathering on Horn Island about 5 miles off the Mississippi coast. 2 days later, they found him at the shoreline. And as of September 3rd, investigators have not made a determination on his death, but they initially reported there was no evidence of foul play. The drowning was suspected. This is one of his friends, Warren Hudson, a guy who self-proclaimed as one of his best friends. Let's see what we think. And then when was the last time that someone reported to you that Nolan was seen? If that makes sense. Like you saw him at a certain point, but then >> someone else saw him a lot later when you guys were gone. >> Right. Okay. So, the last time I personally laid eyes on Nolan was at like 3:00, you know, and uh he was, you know, front of the boat with the girl, and that's the last time I saw him. But there were, you know, I've talked to somebody personally that saw Nolan at six o'clock and someone, you know, we weren't even the last people to see Nolan. We, you know, once we left, there was still dozens on dozens on dozens of boats around us. And I mean, clearly we were not the last people to see Nolan. >> So Warren, I'm going to ask you some very pointed questions. I mean, just straight out. >> Okay. I didn't come down here to, you know, do anything other but to get the truth >> and for you to have a voice in this, >> right? >> And the first thing I want to ask you is, did you kill Nolan? >> Of course not. >> Did you have anything to do with Nolan's death? >> Of course not. Absolutely not. >> They say that you guys deleted stuff out of his phone. Did you delete anything out of Nolan's phone? >> No, of course not. [snorts] >> All right, Mark, what do you got? Yeah. So, let's put forward some things that might raise some red flags for people around this. Will he's barriered right from the start. I mean, he's really cutting himself off from the interviewer. We're going to want to see whether that changes for him. Does he get more barriered? Does he get less barriered? Does he gesture more? Does he open up? Does he close down more? Because maybe we should take this as a bit of a a baseline. Uh certainly that question. look when when when did you last not when did he doesn't ask when did you last see him it's more when did you hear about somebody else last seeing him. So the interviewer here does open up with the idea that he isn't the last person uh to to see um the the victim here or the not necessarily victim the person who's who's deceased. Um, and so, uh, he is offsetting the last sightings to other people, but that's what he's asked to do. He is asked to offset them to the last sighting to other people of, of course. Look, the red flags that that we that we often bring up within context of other signals as well is the of course not, absolutely not. They're more rhetorical answers. The the obviousness of of course not. I mean, isn't that obvious? Okay. Why is the emotion needed on this? So, we're going to need to see. Does he come up with these kind of answers uh perpetually? Is this a one-off for him? Absolutely not. Um, you know, it it modifies the likelihood of it. Well, we we we just really want a yes or no answer to these. and he has to modify it in some way and discount the asking. So, look, is that because of uh he's he's a perpetrator of something or is this usual for him? We're going to maybe need to see more to find that uh out, but a no would have been a much better answer right at the start there. Uh Greg, what do you got on this one? Yeah, Mark, I think we're going to point to baseline a whole lot today. You guys know how obsessed I am with that. So, I'm looking for is this normal or is this just something he's doing because he feels awkward. And we always say what we're after is understanding where the person is telling the truth, going doing their best story and the stress that that causes or they're trying to hide something and running two tapes and that's causing something. What I see here that's interesting is he he's first of all when Tatum goes after him, he's good because his congruent questioning and hands and all that make it easy to understand even a complex question. That's an important part of what I mean by brain, mouth, and body. When your brain and your mouth are telling the same story, your body punctuates. That's a beautiful example. Asking the question and going here, here, here. I think this guy's brain, mouth, and body are punctuating the same thing as well. He uses Nolan's name. That's a good example. He [snorts] says Nolan more than one time. He illustrates the front of the boat where he last saw him. He breaks eye contact and comes back about 50% of the time. That's good. When when people say, "Well, he's looking away, so he's not telling the truth." Well, if people stare at you, you should be concerned because they care what you think. And if you don't care what somebody thinks, you look away, think about what you want to say, and come back. So, that's good. Cross legs are for a lot of young guys, especially a sitting style. So, I don't read anything into that as more than what it is. It could be a barrier. Could just be simply his legs are crossed. But when he's talking about we weren't the last people to see Nolan, listen to that voice, tone, pitch, and volume all come together to illustrate exactly what he's telling. He's got an increased volume. His illustrators at dozens of boats, his hands showing all these boats out across the water. It means he's telling you what he thinks. When his hands are relaxed, his fingers are separate and extended. That's a good sign, too. That's confidence. When we get to the pointed questions, he's warned you're getting pointed questions to come to you. his respiration increases before he answers. Red flag most of the time for us. There's also a quick spike in blink rate. Chase, I'll pass this to you after this because you talk a lot about processor versus blink rate from stress. And I think this is processor. I think it's just processing the question and moving on. There's no change in barrier. His head nod go shakes no. And then Marky does that absolutely. And of course I have the same thing. That's a conditioning question. But his mouth stays open. He doesn't quickly close his lips afterwards. when he's asked, "Did you delete anything from the phone?" he responds, "No, of course not." And that's goes back to his baseline. The one place I see a red flag that I would want to ask the next question is after he says no, he turns his head and does [snorts] a counting coup sniff. That's over. I would say, "Did anybody else?" That's the one thing I think we missed here that you know of. Chase, what do you got? >> Yeah, I agree with y'all. It's the same story. There's different ownership. So, he passes ownership. other people saw him and stuff like that. I don't I don't think that's a shift off of responsibility. I think it was you have to understand the questions that were asked and this and the path that he's traveling down. You can't just say he's pushing it off on on other people or anything. Um but the host here, Officer Tatum, >> y >> softens him up a little bit. He says he wants the truth. He wants him to have a voice. So he kind of he prefaces the hard questions. Um but the these answers are instantaneous and they have zero of the hallmarks that we look for for rehearsed stories, scripted stories. Um it's very good. And somebody saying like, well, I want a hard no. I want them to say no. I want them to say yes. Our sponsor, Cloaked, dared me to see how exposed my information is. So, I put my phone number into their site and I was shocked with what came back. 876 exposures. My private details out there for anyone to see. My behavioral response, I'm angry. The system is rigged. 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You'll get a free security scan to see how exposed you are right now. The longer you wait, the more of your life gets sold. So, use the code TBP for 30% off any plan. Now, let's get back to the show. In many cases, when when we see even like extremely guilty people, they'll say no. like did you do this? No. Like so just just the wording by itself is it I don't think is indicative of anything. Uh but he says of course not, absolutely not. No, of course not. But he's calm. He's leaning back. But one thing in this clip is a like a behavior person's dream. Uh, and a rule of thumb, I don't know if I don't I don't think you us four have ever discussed it, but a rule of thumb I subscribe to is the further a body part is from the head, the harder it is to control during anxiety. Uh, and this may have come from Ecman or something like that. >> Desmond Morris, I think. Yep. >> Um, his foot is in camera on frame and is with a flip-flop, which is a measuring stick, hanging off of it the whole time to show any like little toe curling or anything like that. There's no movement during this. It's totally relaxed. So, when we start fidgeting and stuff, it's typically fingers and toes are the first thing start moving around and we don't see that. Um, it's harder to see his eyes a little bit just there's some shadow on his face, but the interesting door is always going to be language for me and and how people use language. So, this absolutely not thing. We're going to see in just a second whether or not that's baseline. Something's going to reveal itself here in the next one. Scott, what do you got? >> All right. I've already watched this entire uh interview because I did a video on this on my channel and I can and so I'm going to go against some of the things y'all are saying because it's out of his baseline that you haven't seen yet because the video that we're watching starts um I think a little while after things start I believe and the sniff there is he does that constantly through there. He's odd time sniffing so we can knock that out of the way. The part where he looks where his sitting position is odd, Mark. That's because it's for the for the camera because officer Tatum, man, he's all relaxed and got his arm up and stuff and then um what's his Warren's trying to talk to him and and and all that, but he he has to sit at an odd position or it would be weird to set things up. So, those two things are kind of odd. The the uh absolutely not or of course not does that the whole time. Every time there's a question that comes up and yeah, he said he says, "Of course not." Every time there's a yes or no question, yes or of course not. One of those. So, and he really likes this guy, Officer Tatum. He's a big fan of his. He's he was he's watched his stuff before this came up and then and he met with him. Not Not because he met with him, he watched his stuff. I think his friends watch his channel. So, that's another reason I I think he may seem like he's trying to sound like an adult and and his vernacular may sound a little bit out of place because I think he's trying to sound a little older than he is or smarter than he is, which you want to do. You want to try to impress the person you're talking to. If you're talking if you're talking to somebody that you really like, somebody you know from YouTube or movies or something like that, you want to do that. So these a lot of this stuff we're talking about is isn't his baseline. You all nailed it because walk's like if this doesn't keep happening. So it it's we'll we'll see all these things happen over and over again. All right. Uh all right. That's all I got. [laughter] >> Now you know why you're last. And if anybody's watching Titanic tonight, it sinks for seven minutes. >> And then when was the last time that someone reported to you that Nolan was seen? If that makes sense. You saw him at a certain point, but then >> someone else saw him a lot later when you guys were gone, >> right? Okay. So, the last time I personally laid eyes on Nolan was at like 3:00, you know, and uh he was, you know, front of the boat with the girl and that's the last time I saw him. But there were, you know, I've talked to somebody personally that saw Nolan at 6:00 and someone, you know, we weren't even the last people to see Nolan. We, you know, once we left, there was still dozens on dozens on dozens of boats around us. And I mean, clearly we were not the last people to see Nolan. >> So Warren, I'm gonna ask you some very pointed questions. I mean, just straight out. >> Okay. I didn't come down here to, you know, do anything other but to get the truth >> and for you to have a voice in this, >> right? >> And the first thing I want to ask you is, did you kill Nolan? >> Of course not. >> Did you have anything to do with Nolan's death? >> Of course not. And absolutely not. >> They say that you guys deleted stuff out of his phone. Did you delete anything out of Nolan's phone? >> No, of course not. The mom acts like or at least she portrayed on television and the rumors are that you you weren't really good friends with Nolan. Is that true or not? >> Absolutely not. I hung I hung out with Nolan probably like three days a week. I mean seriously at least some days my friends want to hang out every single day and Nolan was always there. And obviously people may see this and and know the facts later >> that you weren't able to go >> um to the funeral >> or the memorial service, >> right? >> Why Why didn't you go? What was that? >> Well, I mean, with everything going on on social media right now with people saying the crazy things that they're saying, I would never want to take the attention off of Nolan and his family. They don't deserve that. And you know, for own personal reasons, I mean, I've I've gotten thousands of death threats. My family's got thousands of death threats. And, you know, for my own safety, I I I'm not going to put my my own health and safety at risk. You know, it breaks my heart that I can't go. And it hurt me more than anything because I, you know, obviously I want to say my last goodbyes to one of my best friends, but I mean, if I'm getting thousands of death threats of people saying they're going to kill me and do crazy things to my family and I, I just I couldn't bring myself to go because, you know, I I got to put my own safety first. And even if that means, you know, missing my friend's funeral. I mean, it's it's it's horrible. And I wish I could have been there, but you know, that's what's been going on, you know. >> So, he's in data intake posture. I always talk about people's data intake posture. He's comfortable. He's relaxed. There's a head tilt. A lot of times when people are listening, they'll tilt their head to try to get information. He's just as crossed up as he was before. This is just baseline in the second interview. Um, in case anybody wondered, there's no increased respiration [laughter] as he's as they're accused of not being friends. And if he really felt like he wasn't his friend, you would see an heart rate increase in those kinds of things, unless he's just really calm, which we don't suspect a guy that age would be. Um, he's got an immediate natural smile when he starts talking about Nolan and his brow goes up as an illustrator as he breaks eye contact. This is this is just pretty standard looking to me from a person who has got no increased fight or flight. And we expect fight or flight when a person is nailed to something. Words like always and never are most often exaggerated. He said he was always with us. Well, you could find evidence that he wasn't always with him, of course, but that's hyperbole. People talking all the time. What I really found interesting is when he's questioned about the funeral, still no substantive increase in breathing or blink rate, which you would expect him to ramp up if he had a had guilt around that. I think he doesn't see this as a threat question for obvious reasons to him. He's got still good 50% eye contact, 50% break, and he [snorts] has a smooth cadence to his answer. There's congruent verbal, vocal, and non-verbal. As he pauses to appropriately think, you see him look down and to his left. I think this looks good. Looks like congruent body language and is believable. Scott, what do you got? >> Yeah, I'm not seeing any cues of deception either. And [laughter] uh and uh everything seems to be flowing right along. This seems to be so far from what we've seen, this is his natural flow of behaviors. Nothing's really uh popping off anywhere, you know, looking odd or anything. He does break eye contact a lot, but that's normal. If he didn't, it would be odd. And the reason that people do break eye contact is like Greg was talking about, they're thinking about what you said. They're structuring their sentence. They're doing something else. Because if you kept looking at the person, if you ask them a question, they kept looking at you. Be weird. So, if that happens, most likely we know from the studies that that suggests that person's most likely the one being deceptive with you. But the person who looks away is just thinking they're not worried about what you look like. But the person their the person who is being deceptive, their brain wants to keep an eye on you. So if you start making faces or doing that, they'll start adding qualifiers to their their story. And in this situation, he's just delivering information. He's not he's not defending or creating things to make you believe it more. There's no performance there for any of that. But he at the same time though I think his vernacular is a little bit odd, a little bit off because he's trying to impress this officer Tatum which makes sense because he likes him and he wants the him to like him. So Chase, what do you got? >> Pretty much same. Everything looks good. All the body language is congruent. Everything lands on specific words and phrases like I did just then. Everything looks as it should. [laughter] Uh but pay attention to the language here. There's two reasons somebody's going to say he had these two reasons for the funeral. He has this moral reason. He doesn't want to like take attention off of Nolan and his family. They don't deserve that. I think he says then there's a safety reason. I've got thousands of death threats family. Uh both of those can exist at the same time. So, and and watching the interview uh is is not going to tell us like which one was his actual reason or whether one reason was true or false. I think they're both existing at the same time and they're very probably very real. So, always listen for that in anytime you're talking to somebody if they have multiple reasons for something, listen for the weight. Where's the weight sitting on on those things? And the weight for him was very much on these death threats and his personal safety. Uh there was more weight put on that statement. So, um, and keep in mind he was answering an identity question like basically what kind of person are you, but he did it with facts and he did it with numbers. And that's something worth paying attention to that he didn't like get into an identity argument of I'm I did this, I volunteered at the local church and like all of these like resume uh kind of statements. It's not that he had to avoid doing that. This was just a natural behavior of somebody who doesn't automatically feel the need to justify who they are because they probably there's some innocence just internally. He knows that. So, always avoid uh label stuff, identity labels. When anybody's talking to you, never respond directly to the identity thing. Always go to the facts. Mark, what do you got? >> Yeah. So, look, if I was wanting to make him a bad actor in this situation, [clears throat] and that's all I'm left with now. I can't tease it out uh any [laughter] any longer. Uh to your point, Chase, I would start to go, look, hang on, I I would start to play off the romanticism of attending the funeral against the pragmatism of not attending it. Cuz he's in a bind here. He could be a romantic and go, "Man, this was my best friend. I'm going to go in the face of danger and so are my family and we're going to attend this funeral and put on the fa because nobody is going to stop, no social media is going to stop us, going to threaten us. We're showing up for my friend." That would be super romantic. Yeah. Well, there's the pragmatism of like, I'm not putting myself in harm's way. Some guy's already dead. I don't want to be dead. I don't want my family harmed. Okay. And if I was looking to make him a bad actor, I'd go, "Oh, come on. You know, you've got to attend your friend's funeral, and you haven't, so you must be a bad person. There's something up here." Okay, but you're right, Chase. Like, the logic of why he doesn't attend is fine. It's absolutely fine the logic of why he doesn't attend. And he tells that story in a calm and assertive manner. And it has a a moral reason and a pragmatic reason to it, a safety reason. And both can exist at the same time. And he and he gets that across in a really clear, calm, assertive way. Again, if I was looking for something to to to pin him on, um, there's the question, you weren't good friends with Nolan at that time, true or not? That's a very complex question in case you didn't know. There's because there's some double negative in there. And he goes, "Absolutely not." Well, what is the not to like? Is it is it not good friends or not true or not not true? Like which is it? And now we've got the absolutely. So I would go well that's very ambiguous, isn't it? An unambiguous answer would be that is that is um uh no that that is that is not true. Nolan and I were very close friends. That would be an unambiguous answer. But look how long it took me to even read that. I've got to write that down to do an un an ambiguous answer to a quite complex question which is probably quite complex on purpose because it causes some neural load to untangle it and you're going to get in if there's a tangled story you're going to get into a tangle there. So look those are two reasons why if I was looking in the raw shack test to see a devil not a butterfly I could find the devil uh in there. Uh but the reality is is just like you guys actually the truth is it all looks fine to me. All looks absolutely uh all all looks absolutely fine. But maybe there'll be something in the next video. Who knows? >> That was a great simile, Mark. I've never heard uh the Roarshack test be used in a simile like that. >> I think we've used it on this show a number of times. Really? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The essentially body language is a raw shack test. >> Oh, yeah. But I'm [clears throat] talking about like you de we've got the metaphor. Oh, I see what you mean. I extended the metaphor to the devil and the butterfly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. That is the first time we've done that on the show. >> Yeah. >> The mom act like or at least she portrayed on television and the rumors are that you weren't really good friends with Nolan. Is that true or not? >> Absolutely not. I hung I hung out with Nolan probably like three days a week. I mean, seriously, at least. Some days my friends want to hang out every single day and Nolan was always there. And obviously people may see this and and know the facts later >> that you weren't able to go >> um to the funeral >> or the memorial service, >> right? >> Why Why didn't you go? What was that? >> Well, I mean, with everything going on on social media right now with people saying the crazy things that they're saying, I would never want to take the attention off of Nolan and his family. They don't deserve that. And you know, for own personal reasons, I mean, I've I've gotten thousands of death threats. My family's got thousands of death threats. And, you know, for my own safety, I I I'm not going to put my my own health and safety at risk. You know, it breaks my heart that I can't go. And it hurt me more than anything because I, you know, obviously I want to say my last goodbyes to one of my best friends, but I mean, if I'm getting thousands of death threats of people saying they're going to kill me and do crazy things to my family and I, I just I couldn't bring myself to go because, you know, I I got to put my own safety first. And even if that means, you know, missing my friend's funeral. I mean, it's it's it's horrible. And I wish I could have been there, but you know, that's what's been going on, you know. >> Was this about race? Did this have anything to do with race as far as from your perspective? >> Absolutely not. I mean, Nolan's been a great friend of mine since 8th grade. Nolan isn't my only friend of color. And, you know, I have I have plenty of friends through high school and friends I have now, not just Nolan, who are black, Mexican, you know, I've never looked at that. And none of my friends ever have. Like, and if you do, you know, that's disgusting, you know. And if you had a chance to, you know, tell the the world that have painted this picture of you and your friends as being potential murderers >> of Nolan, white supremacists, racist, what would you want the world to know if you can summarize to them in a very short uh paragraph or a few sentences? >> Yeah. >> What would you want to say to them if you had the opportunity? Uh, I would want to say to them that my family and I are praying for y'all. You know, I can never bring myself to tell somebody that I'm going to kill them and that I'm going to, you know, I've I've received and my family's received absolutely horrible threats about this. And, you know, I just I want people to know that our faith with the Lord is stronger and means more to us than anything. And we all trust in the Lord, the Lord, and for the Lord to reveal the truth. And I know that's what will happen cuz I have faith and my family has faith. But I want people to know that I'm praying for them. And if they want to speak hate and and speak, you know, these horrible things, and I mean, you're obviously not in the right state of mind, and you you need to work on yourself. It's a horrible thing. And you know, but race was never a thing between Nolan and I and my friends. I mean, I have friends in my friend group that are Mexican and, you know, mixed black. I mean, that's never mattered. And I think it's just absolutely disgusting that people try to make this narrative out of something that it's absolutely not first off and out of something that they have zero facts about. Jackson County hasn't released any facts there. There haven't been any facts about this case other than that, you know, just timelines. It's, you know, stuff like that. But it's horrible that people have made this out to be something that it's absolutely not. And it's it's disgusting in my opinion. >> All right, Mark. What do you got? >> Well, there we are again. Absolutely not. Absolutely not. It's becoming quite a pattern, [clears throat] isn't it? Well, maybe because it's a pattern with him. Here's what I'm going to gamble. You know what? I'm going to gamble. I bet his friend circle use that as well. Absolutely not. I [snorts] bet that's that's colloquial for that inroup potentially. I could be wrong on that, but I I reckon I might win that bet that they use uh absolutely not and of course not as a as a friend group. Um look, clear, calm, assertive with this. Look how many times you said I think you said it Greg early on but look how many times he uses the the the deceased's name Nolan has no problem delivering that uh name. Uh, look, I will say this. It's really good spin that he's using there of uh of spinning back on the the accusers. Goes to faith, prayer, and praying for the accusers and then accuses them of hate. So, if this were political spin, I'd be like, fantastic. Like A1 political spin. Go to God. Go to faith. take the thing that they're accusing you of and play it back at them tenfold. Um uh but look, he is passionate with it as well. When he's accused of uh white supremacy, we see that look away. We see the lip tightening on him. I think he's getting angry about this one. I think he's doing well to hold that anger back. I'm starting to think actually he's probably quite a nice guy actually and quite quite a decent guy. He's doing well to hold that back, but this is starting to get him angry, especially this white supremacist piece. And again, like we could go, okay, well then, you know, he's he's kind of hiding that. Well, we don't see other don't see other elements in there. One last thing I'm going to say before I hand this to you, Scott, is >> we've got what somebody who I'm expecting must be quite a seasoned interviewer here. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Great. >> I mean, that's my expectation. And and also, he's trying to make a show as well, so he needs some drama. >> Okay. And he is staying very relaxed through this. He is not jumping on anything. Yeah. uh a seasoned interviewer if I would say if they were seeing things to jump on, they would be jumping on them. Not necessarily getting overexuberant about it, but we would start to see him follow a certain line and inquire more. And we'd start to see him subtly, I think, turn the heat up on this. And also, as an entertainer, we'd start to see somebody going, "Oh, hang on. We got a we got a live one here. We got a drama here. Let let me try and pull this out because there'll be a better show. Yeah, we're not seeing any of of that from a seasoned interviewer and you know play a seasoned entertainer, you know, with this and we're not seeing any of that, which probably makes me think he's not seeing anything there, you know. Uh Scott, what do you got on this one? >> Yeah, I agree with you and I I think that's probably why everybody likes this guy. That's why he gets so many so many subscribers and views because he's just being I think he's just being normal. He's not saying you did, you know, now the big I think that kind of thing is old now. You know, people are over that because they can see it coming. And I think but I think he was into that long before that into the way he he's behaving here or um portraying himself here. I don't and again I don't think he's portraying himself. I think that's him. I think it's probably why people like him because you're seeing him be himself. So, that's what it looks like to me. But, I'm not seeing anything that shows deception here at all. Everything again seems to be a a like a flowing uh set of behaviors. Nothing's really changed much. Um, we don't see a whole lot of, you know, he's never gone to the big huge illustrators. I don't think there's anything big in there anywhere for something like that. They're they're small. He his voice tone, uh, volume, everything s just pretty much stays solid throughout the whole thing. So, I'm not seeing anything that any red flags, anything popping off. He's not adjusting in his seat a whole lot. Even though he's in an uncomfortable position a little bit, I would think there the way he's having to sit. He's not scooching around a lot. He's not doing a whole lot of movements. He's answering questions. And I think they're from the heart. And I think that's that's maybe a reason in the in the volume up and down sometimes because he's in that one question earlier, he was angry because, you know, he's dealing with that every day. he's probably over it. You know, having to answer that thing that those same types of questions all the time. So, this is I think this behavior fits the situation because when you're looking at body language, you have to take in to consideration and put into context everything going on, not just in that situation, but with that person and the environment and and all that as well, obviously, but I think once we take all that in consideration, this this looks like some guy he's talking to. Officer Tatum's talking to some dude. So, it looks all normal to me. Greg, what do you got? >> Yeah, I agree with you. I think it does look all normal. A couple of things. If a person had done something, there's an open-ended question that that um Tatum asks. He says, um, "Is this about race?" Well, is what about race? Would be the first person that guilty person would say, "Well, what are we talking about?" I'm not going to deny something I don't understand. But he doesn't. He's like, "No, it's not about race. This is stupid." And it's funny because we don't see any threat body language when he asks that question at all. He's cautious one time with language. Let let me tell you, I'm a southern boy, grew up in the south, back here now. I can tell you there's two kinds of racist. The ones who are blatant, out loud, calling you names and making up, you know, derogatory things to folks who aren't like them, and those who mask it very well when they're confronted. The ones who switch and start using proper language, he doesn't. He says black, Mexican, that kind of thing. That's usually a good sign a person feels comfortable with the language you're using. So, I would be less likely to think he's racist than I would a person who came in and every other word was African-American, Hispanic American, and all that kind of thing because I think they're being very cautious because they're afraid. We don't see any of that. >> This religious thing, Mark, this is from a southern boy. His mama or his grandmama said, "Now, son, don't you get down in the mud where you where those other people are. You keep it up high where God would want you to." That's what I hear right there. Because when he does it, you can see he's navigating how to say it exactly right because he's a kid. He's not an old man. He's not you his grandmother. And that's a good thing because it shows us what he has to do to deliver that message versus when he's asked a fact question. When he's asked a fact question about what would you want to say to them, you can see then something changes. Now he he also says, "I don't want to have to do this. I don't want to deal I don't want to call this person out or that person out." Um hold on one second. I think I lost my place here on a note. But I I wouldn't have advised him to do that. But when he gets to where this isn't about race and he starts saying this isn't about race, his cadence changes and he goes back to that normal baseline and he's freelancing what he's saying. We can hear where the mechanics of his story are when he's talking about the religious piece and trying to take moral high ground. But the minute he gets back to talking about are you racist, it's free flowing and it's smooth. One of my favorite things I've seen ever in a video is in this video when he says disgusting. back up the video 5 seconds or less and look at that. Pay attention as you're walking through this is he gets to this point where he says when people say it's about race that's disgusting. His nose wrinkles in disgust before he ever says the word which tells you that's his mouth saying what his brain is thinking. Ecman before him Darwin pointed out that people could recognize those emotions and musculature makes a difference. The shape of his face will make it very difficult but watch for that crinkling of the nose and that disgust before the word even comes out of his mouth. And we'll see it again one more time. This looks congruent. This looks trustworthy. This looks like baseline movement with a can delivered message to stay out of the mud. My opinion. Chase, what do you got? >> Yeah, you all covered it. And one thing I was looking for when he says, is this about race? Is this eyebrow flash to like let me sell you something? And this is how like we develop rapport with other people like we show that we we're not uh angry. This is the opposite of anger, right? So, uh, it helps to make people like you and our body does that without us thinking about it. You don't see any of that. It's an honest reaction. Uh, and if I was training somebody going into any situation like this, someone calls you anything racist, cruel, fake, uh, immoral, uh, especially in a group, right? You can own it without becoming some preacher. You can own the question. Um, so the best way to do this is clean denial. Once you say like, "Nope, that's not what this was." And then a rel one relationship fact, which we see in here. We've been friends since uh what do you say the eighth grade >> and then a boundary line. Uh so short boundary line. If someone assumes that, that's on them. So that's a boundary, right? And then redirect something missing or the next thing that's actionable to get that person on to the next thing. So like uh what we don't have yet is X from the county. Ask me about what I actually saw. So you don't want to give like a TED talk about your purity, which we're not we're not seeing here, right? So uh don't ever let someone say zero facts and let it and let it uh end every question. Right? Zero facts doesn't mean we have zero information. There's a lot of information in there. So that's all I got. Nice. >> Wait a minute, Greg. What' you do to your thumb, man? >> Uh, I set a 400lb generator on it. [laughter] >> Why? >> It felt good. That's the reason I No, [laughter] no. I was I was maneuvering this thing using a lever and it slipped and caught my thumb between it and the frame. >> Oh, wow. Ow. Ow. >> Where are you doing this? >> On a horse trailer. >> That's okay. >> That's gonna hurt. Makes me think, Chase, TED talks, those people giving TED talks, what are they guilty of? >> It's good good way looking at them. What are they guilty of? >> 90% of them it's pretending is the biggest thing, >> right? >> They're up there with a big costume on. [laughter] >> It's a good thing. You know, people giving Why are you giving the TED talk? Because it's a TED talk. No, but what are you guilty of? I'm going to go back and watch some TED talks and go, hang on. >> What are you What are you really What are you making up for? [laughter] >> Was this about race? Did this have anything to do with race as far as from your perspective? >> Absolutely not. I mean, no one's been a great friend of mine since 8th grade. Nolan isn't my only friend of color. And you know, I have I have plenty of friends through high school and friends I have now, not just knowing, who are black, Mexican, you know, I've never looked at that and none of my friends ever have. Like and if you do, you know, that's disgusting, you know. >> And if you had a chance to, you know, tell the the world that have painted this picture of you and your friends as being potential murderers >> of Nolan, white supremacists, racist, what would you want the world to know if you can summarize to them in a very short uh paragraph or a few sentences? >> Yeah. What would you want to say to them if you had the opportunity? >> Uh, I would want to say to them that my family and I are praying for y'all. You know, I can never bring myself to tell somebody that I'm going to kill them and that I'm going to, you know, I've I've received and my family's received absolutely horrible threats about this. And you know, I just I want people to know that our faith with the Lord is stronger and means more to us than anything. And we all trust in the Lord, the Lord, and for the Lord to reveal the truth. And I know that's what will happen because I have faith and my family has faith. But I want people to know that I'm praying for them. And if they want to speak hate and and speak, you know, these horrible things, then I mean, you're obviously not in the right state of mind and you you need to work on yourself. It's a horrible thing. And, you know, but race was never a thing between Nolan and I and my friends. I mean, I have friends in my friend group that are Mexican and, you know, mixed black. I mean, that's never mattered. And I think it's just absolutely disgusting that people try to make this narrative out of something that it's absolutely not first off and out of something that they have zero facts about. Jackson County hasn't released any facts there. There haven't been any facts about this case other than that, you know, just timelines and, you know, stuff like that. But it's horrible that people have made this out to be something that it's absolutely not. And it's it's disgusting in my opinion. >> Was Nolan the only black person on that island? >> Absolutely not. I saw a lot of black people. And like I said, I mean, you know, it's not pointed out or anything. I mean, I wasn't looking at that, but my like we my buddy Trac was out there and you know, he's mixed. Javon was out there. He's came out. He's mixed. I know a bunch of my friends that are black that were out there that day that I haven't even mentioned. I mean, there was no one was not the only black person out there by no means. I mean, like there was thousands of people out there, white, Mexican, black, you know, every, you know, everyone, you know, >> and in a friend group, is Nolan the only black person in the friend group? >> Absolutely not. My buddy Trac's black. Um, you know, I have other friends of color. I mean, our friend group's very tight and, you know, we have a small, not a small group of guys, but we have a, you know, we have 10 to 12 guys in my friend group and, you know, we're all from Ocean Springs and, you know, we grew up together, but Nolan is not the only black guy in my friend group by any means and everybody knows that. >> Uh, Chase, what do you got? So there's a book by this guy uh George Leoff is his name and the book is called Women, Fire and Dangerous Things, and it's about categories and how when you you speak in categories, you can restrict or open up or change a topic. Like if you say, "I had a fight with my wife last night." The goal of a fight is to win. And if you think in that category of fighting instead of arguing or disagreeing or having a conversation, uh it it means different things. If if you say, "My wife and I are battling each other right now," that's a whole different like instate. So you'll see you'll start seeing categories everywhere and you'll see the media kind of weaponize those to make you feel a certain way about events. But this this is called a category question. and what he kind of gets asked like you're the one who or people like you always. Um just just always listen for that that when you hear categories it proves what box that someone's wanting to put you in or someone wants you to answer inside of. So you never have to answer inside of a category that you're given. So, anytime somebody says everybody knows or that kind of thing, you're you're in category or you're getting put into a category. And if someone tries to trap you in a category, uh whatever it is, villain, outsider, whatever it is, use a list that's calm and name and named. So, you deny the box like I I don't want to answer. So, you call the box out every single time. Then you give clear things just like he did here. Trevor or Trayvon was there. Uh Jay Javon was there. There were these other guys that were there. And then uh give the group size a little bit. Give a a factual number. You know, it went to about 12 of us. We grew up together. And then stop. So what people tend to do with category responses is I'm going to audition myself to be outside. I'm going to audition and persuade you to be that I'm outside of this thing. So names will always beat adjectives. So if you're ever on trial, you're ever getting interviewed, names beat adjectives every single time. So and three solid facts will beat 12 vague ones. And he he did that here. And I think he did it completely unconsciously because it was just truthful and it was from the heart. Scott, what do you think? >> All right. I'm not see the the stress we're seeing here. I think is coming. This is not not a question he's been asked often. I don't think so. That's why we see all that stut the that flow I was talking about earlier has changed. He's got this this almost stuttering stops when he's talking because he's thinking about what he's going to say. He doesn't have that flow. He hasn't been asked this question a thousand times since this thing happened. So that's why the the flow has stopped and we're seeing that the jerky stuff. Other than that, I don't see any stress outside of those. And the stress we're seeing on that is just as the engagement in the brow. That's just him thinking is all that is. Now, another thing is that smile. A lot of people go say, "Oh, that's duper delight. I know what that." No, it's not. A lot of times somebody will smile when they find something ridiculous and it's so ridiculous, it's almost funny as you're reassuring somebody of that. So, that's what it is. Plus, dupers delight doesn't last that long. It's not that big most of the time. Sometimes it is. Sometimes it lasts a little longer than than normal. Usually it's just a little pop of something or you'll just barely see it go up, but not here. It's it's for a long time, but that's not duper delight. So don't don't go down that road. I don't see anything shows deception here. So I'll throw it over to Mark. Yeah. Uh so look, there is some stress. There's certainly a stress on by no means. And so I think at this point he is we're starting to see the emotion, the potential anger at the absurdity of the idea of that that uh the um the deceased uh was the only black person there, the only person of race there. That is absurd to the person being questioned here. And the absurdity of it is raising anger in him, I think. And that's a good sign because he's not wanting to deviate off and given reason for uh the the deceased being the only person. Well, of course, he was the only black person. Of course, if so, if there was a if there was culpability there, we would expect number one, that might be true. If that's a decent accusation, that might well be a true reality. And so therefore, if you're being deceptive, you're going to have to weave your way around that. No, what he does is just go, it's just by no means true. It's just absurd. It's just, let me give you the list of of, you know, different races, different people that were out there. It's absurd. And we also get these great bat-ons throughout. They're delicate. They're small because of the sitting position, but we're getting really great batts as to, you know, uh, who was there, you know, what race you might put with them or whether they're a combination. The bat-ons are good. So, it's an absurd situation for him. Uh, Greg, what do you got on this one? >> And Mark, I think you just covered why I I believe that stress in the first part. Look, if you ask me how many black people were at a party, and I give you I say 19. Something is wrong with me to be counting how many black people are at the party, right? And when you're sitting and somebody says, "Was he the only black guy there?" No, I saw a lot of black guys there were, "Hell, I don't know how many is what we're seeing. We're seeing that pause. I don't know." That's a good sign actually because inherent in this line of questioning is, "Are you a racist?" Period. Are you hanging out with people who don't hang out with black people? And then again, he uses the word mixed. That's not a word that guys who are not comfortable around black folks and folks who have families [snorts] that are black and white are going to use. I I can tell you from rednecks in my family who's have grandkids whose one parent's black and one is white. They called them suddenly biracial. They come up with words that they've never you would never hear from that person in their entire life until this happens. So it's kind of an interesting mix of that. Now you the other thing is when he goes to to by no means he's overpron pronounced and I think it's emphatic mark to your point. It's emphatic. His whole face, everything does it. His hands are illustrating behind his legs, just like you pointed out. And I think all of this is because this is such a complex situation. He understands that he all of these things point to racism. And I don't think I don't think he feels that way. And when he goes to I'm going to throw my Illuminati sign. When he talks about ocean, what's the name of the town? uh growing up in Ocean Springs. He's drawing a box around his friends versus people from any other race, ethnicity, or any other thing that might not have grown up there. So, he's putting a cluster around the people that he knows versus whoever else he saw there. Look, this is 5 miles from the from the shore. Who knows who was there from which other towns and all that kind of stuff. So, it's really interesting. And he's using the name Nolan is, not Nolan was. This is all pretty good stuff. You think about it. We this deep into the questioning, he's still using the present tense and using his friend's name. How many times have we seen people say she was immediately we get to this point? I think it still looks really good. >> Was Nolan the only black person on that island? >> Absolutely not. I saw a lot of black people. And like I said, I mean, you know, it's not pointed out or anything. I mean, I wasn't looking at that, but my like we my buddy Trac was out there and you know, he's mixed. Javon was out there. He's came out. He's mixed. I know a bunch of my friends that are black that were out there that day that I haven't even mentioned. I mean, there was no one was not the only black person out there by no means. I mean, like there was thousands of people out there, white, Mexican, black, you know, every, you know, everyone, you know. >> And in the friend group, is Nolan the only black person in the friend group? >> Absolutely not. My buddy Trac's black. Um, you know, I have other friends of color. I mean, our friend group's very tight and, you know, we have a small, not a small group of guys, but we have a, you know, we have 10 to 12 guys in my friend group and, you know, we're all from Ocean Springs and, you know, we grew up together, but Nolan is not the only black guy in my friend group by any means and everybody knows that >> there's controversy around the STO, >> right? You guys called it in, >> right? they have that uh record of you guys, you know, making that emergency call, right? >> But then there's this, I guess, uh graphic of you guys traveling at a at a at a slow speed, then all of a sudden you accelerate, >> right? >> People are saying that that's an indication of something a foot or foul play going on in that in that timeline. What what do you have to say to the naysayers who are mentioning that something must have happened that you guys were going slow then you accelerated all of a sudden? >> Yeah, I mean absolutely doc. We got towed probably a quarter mile like I said my buddy Bart drove his boat up next to ours after he pulled us out away from the island and then he towed us a little more while we were trying to get the motor figured out. I mean the motor would would trim down. So then eventually and the motor wouldn't trim down. And so eventually we figured out if you held the manual trim on the motor, the motor will stay in the water even when you start to acceler accelerate cuz when my buddy would put the boat in gear in forward, the motor would come right back up. So it trim down, but then it come right back up when you went to go put it in forward and drive off. So yeah, we stopped at one point. My buddy pulled the plug out the boat, got back in the boat. The captain of the boat got in the water, pulled the plug out the boat, got back in the boat and hit it. And like I said earlier, we all moved transferred our weight to the front. So, cuz there was so much water in the back of the boat that when we my buddy had it pinned out all the way trying to go as fast as we can and the boat was still sitting like this on the water, not wouldn't even plan out. So, we had to move all the way to the front of the boat. Everybody had to get on the bow and eventually we plained, everybody got sat back and when you're on plane and you're and you're, you know, you're going, water starts coming out the boat. Like that's the whole reason he pulled the plug cuz when you when you come out the water and you and you're on plane and the boat's level, water starts coming out the boat. So, I mean, that's why we came to a stop so he could jump in the water, pull the plug, and then we hauled in. You know, there was no stopping because if you do stop, the water starts coming back in the boat because the plug's out. So, >> all right, Greg, what do you got? >> Yeah, we see his data intake face again. See him listening to Officer Tatum as he's asking questions. And we're now away from concepts. The last videos we've looked at, they were concept about racism and that kind of thing. And his navigation of language was as he was talking through thoughts and ideas. His hands were moving behind his behind the scenes, but not nearly to the degree when you're asked factual things. Go back and look at video one where he was saying the last time I saw him and his hands were big. He was at the front of the boat. We're back to that. These are tangible real memories. This is not about thought inside the brain case work. This is what happened. That makes what he said in the beginning all the much more believable because all the details he gives here. If you know anything about boats, what he describes can happen. If you don't understand boats, you think he took the plug out, it'd sink. Well, yeah, if you're not moving. That's part of the whole concept he gets in here. So the baseline, this is about something that happened. It's not notional, no idea. So this is a good wrap back to video one to make me believe him even more there. Mark, what do you got? >> Yeah. Uh, so look, exactly the same, Greg. Great bat-ons. Great. Uh, which is, you know, when your movement is along to the rhythm of your speech, that suggests low neural load, like the body and the mind are aligned. Uh great descriptors as well just as you were saying there Greg when he's when he's telling the story of why the speed up why what was happening with the boat the descriptors are good again they match the rhythm and they seem to match the story that is telling for me great internal logic of the story like I can follow the logic of it now uh I don't know the external logic of of the story Greg you're saying sounds Good. From your point of view, I've rarely been in boats and other people are, but I know somebody who's been in more boats than >> Chase is going to cover this, but the boat's [laughter] chasing a dog in the back. I mean, you know, so so Chase, from my point of view, seems good internal logic. The story seems to make sense the way he's describing it from somebody that doesn't know boats. Uh Chase, over to you. You know, you've been in more boats than I've had hot dinners. Uh is there an external logic to that that makes sense? >> Absolutely. So on the back of smaller boats and this is called a center uh console boat that they're on. So there's there's not like there's cabins down below where where somebody can get lost on the boat. It's all just an open deck pretty much. And on the back end of the boat, which is called a transom if you wanted to know some facts, there's a little screw, like a uh a plug, but it screws in. And that's so you could drain the boat out. You know, when you get the thing up on a trailer, you can get any water that came in, it'll come out. That's the biggest mistake most people make is forgetting to put those in. Um and and then like you'll be boating for 30, 45 minutes, everything's great. It doesn't like it's not like a cartoon, but it comes in like you're just riding really heavy. It's not you're not getting the the nose of the boat down, which what he's talking about on plane. So that when you initially speed up on a boat, it kind of goes up and then you reach an area where you're kind of flattened out and making a much greater speed. So they're trying to throw that throttle forward to get that water back to kind of push it out of the transom. Should have been a BGE pump in there. I don't know how tiny boats work. Uh but definitely should have had a billagege pump. You always want the billagege pump in the back of the boat. Uh if if you only have one, but that's what he's talking about. So that makes absolute sense that the you would suddenly speed up uh for that reason. Like I need to slow down to figure out trim. And trim is like if your engines on the back of the boat is moving the engine kind of up and down to help kind of maneuver the boat's attitude is what they call it in the water. Uh, yep. That's the boat knowledge. Everything else look congruent. >> Uh, Scott, what do you got? >> All right. Now, in the in the whole interview, and there's another one as well, they talk about what happened on what was happening on the boat. And because the Warren makes a phone call from the boat, he does the 911 call where he calls the uh >> Yeah. So, the the people who come get you when you're stuck out in the middle of the water. And people are taking this this and I I put it on again I put this in my video and broke it down why it doesn't say these things but people are in are doing whole videos on how saying uh you know Nolan's dead you killed him all kinds of things like that. It's crazy what they're and you can hear them saying some things and what other things are saying you just can't. I cleaned it all up so you could hear what they're saying as as well as you could. Unbelievable. I mean it's unbelievable how people are taking this and saying all these people on his boat killed him. they knew he was on the boat and they all had something to do with it. It's bizarre uh seeing something like that. But to this video, I think this video is similar to the one we saw just before it. Again, we see that those choppy statements. He's he's trying to to structure what he's going to say as he's explaining that problem. Maybe he hasn't explained that a whole lot before. So, I think it's very similar to the one like Greg was saying, goes back to the first one. Yeah. And he goes back to this one before this as well. So, you guys covered everything, so I'll move on. There's controversy around the CTO, >> right? You guys called it in, >> right? >> They have that uh record of you guys, you know, making that emergency call, right? >> But then there's this, I guess, uh graphic of you guys traveling at a at a at a slow speed, then all of a sudden you accelerate, >> right? >> People are saying that that's an indication of something a foot or foul play going on in that in that timeline. What what do you have to say to the naysayers who are mentioning that something must have happened that you guys were going slow then you accelerated all of a sudden? >> Yeah, I mean absolutely do. We got towed probably a quarter mile like I said my buddy Bart drove his boat up next to ours after he pulled us out away from the island and then he towed us a little more while we were trying to get the motor figured out. I mean the motor would would trim down. So then eventually and the motor wouldn't trim down. And so eventually we figured out if you held the manual trim on the motor, the motor will stay in the water even when you start to acceler accelerate cuz when my buddy would put the boat in gear in forward, the motor would come right back up. So it trimmed down but then it come right back up when you went to go put it in forward and drive off. So yeah, we stopped at one point. My buddy pulled the plug out the boat, got back in the boat, the captain of the boat got in the water, pulled the plug out the boat, got back in the boat and hit it. And like I said earlier, we all move transferred our weight to the front. So, cuz there was so much water in the back of the boat that when we my buddy had it pinned out all the way trying to go as fast as we can and the boat was still sitting like this on the water, not wouldn't even plan out. So, we had to move all the way to the front of the boat. Everybody had to get on the bow and eventually we plained, everybody got sat back and when you're on plane and you're and you're, you know, you're going, water starts coming out the boat. Like that's the whole reason he pulled the plug cuz when you when you come out the water and you and you're on plane and the boat's level, water starts coming out the boat. So, I mean, that's why we came to a stop so he could jump in the water, pull the plug, and then we hauled in. you know, there was no stopping because if you do stop, the water starts coming back in the boat because the plug's out. So, >> so after all that's been said uh in this interview, do you have any theories about what it what could have possibly happened to Nolan? >> Um, you know, my buddies and I have talked about it and like I said, I mean, I've been on the water my entire life. My friends have. It's not like we're unexperienced in this, but Nolan was my best friend and he was my friend's best friends and he was like a brother to me and more than anything and the thing that's most important is what happened to him and I I mean I want to know just as much as anybody else. I mean that's all like my friends haven't stopped talking about that like what what happened and you know like just trying to figure it out but I would never want to put it on somebody else because of the hate that I've received for just being out there around them and my name getting brought up because I called the Coast Guard. I was the first one to call the Coast Guard. I mean, I I don't I don't know. And I want to know more than anybody. I mean, I just my friends and I are like very like have been wondering this for a while and you know, we just want to know as much as anybody else what happened to him. But I I would never want to sit here and blame anybody else and put this on anybody else because of the hate and death threats that my family and my friends have received. It's horrible. And I would never want someone else to like experience that, you know. >> Yeah. Especially if if if there's no evidence to it. >> Exactly. >> So, I got two more things I want to address directly. >> Um, it's been said out there that you guys immediately delete your social media, lore it up as if you were in some type of fear that you would be implicated in this. What do you say to that? I mean, of course, we lured up and of course, you know, I deleted my social media. I was getting death threats before anything ever came out because I was the one that called the Coast Guard. I mean, people put this all on me because I was the one that called. I was the one that that was, you know, worried. My friends were just as well. I mean, of course, I delete all my social media. I was getting insane death threats, like stuff I couldn't even believe 2 days after. And you know, we went straight to the police. I wanted the police to come and ask questions. I I wanted them to know and have all of my information. And um I mean, people were accusing me of murdering my best friend. It's sick. I mean, like just because of a just because of race. I mean, it it's disgusting. It makes me stick like sick to my stomach. I mean, there's I I've obviously I delete I I got off of social media because there were people saying insane things to me and my family and I just couldn't sit there and look at it. I mean, that's it. >> All right, Greg, what do you got? >> Yeah. So, Chase, I'm going to hand this to you next because you always talk about not injecting ambiguity. Great example of not injecting ambiguity. I don't know what happened. Hell, I want to know, too. I'm trying. That's great. His illustrators that my best friend and my best friend's friend was like a brother are all good. He's using his hands. He's illustrating large and you always point out Aldred Frey Scott. You always point out the large use of of illustrators usually is an indicating truth. He also does 50% baseline just like his baseline 50% eye movement away as he thinks 50% contact which is about normal for Americans. Most Americans think we eyelock. Not true. Most Middle Eastern people have more eye contact than Americans. Most Asian cultures less eye contact than Americans. But we think we're looking at the person because we're looking away at the same time. So there's that. Here again is that same exact telegraph before he says the word disgusted. Desh Desmond Morris first Charles Darwin first discovered the seven universal emotions that we could all read unless we have Asberers or something similar. And then later it was reinforced by Paulman. Disgust is one of those where everything goes to the middle of the face like sour milk or one of those kinds of things. That whole what is disgusting. You can recognize it without seeing it or without hearing it. But if you were to go back right now and watch him, it's split seconds, maybe a couple of seconds before he says the word disgusted, his nose rises in disgust around racism. And he lawyered up. Well, guess what? His stepmother's a judge. What do you think's going to happen? If I always say, if there's any chance you got any kind of legal problems, get a judge. I mean, get a get a lawyer. What do you think a judge is going to advise you? Chase, what do you got? >> Yeah. And Greg, to your point, this what I was going to talk about first. When you hear people that are guilty of something and they want to add ambiguity to the crime, to the or to the whatever happened. >> So little statements that might have come out of his mouth. What I was actually listening for today is is he going to say, well, you know, there were thousand people out there. Anybody could have done anything. People were drunk. People were drinking alcohol. They're driving boats while they're drunk. people bring guns out there, you know, just kind of adding in all these little possibilities to send your mind in as many directions as possible. Uh, I didn't see any of that. None. Zero. But I want to know like if you're watching this right now, put in the comments what what's a detail that you would want to get under oath right here uh that that we didn't get in this video. what's a question that you would have asked uh to maybe ascertain something different. So when somebody asks a hard question like this um if if someone asks you um any of this like for a theory that you don't have because a lot of people will inject a theory uh especially when they're uh guilty of something because they'll throw they'll want to throw somebody off the scent, right? Somebody says, "So what happened?" And you don't know the pressure is massive, right? And amateurs, especially people that are really stressed out, they want to fill that. They want to fill the science uh silence with like loyalty or speech or blame. But you own it exactly like he did. And I don't think that he did it with training. You admit the blank without any kind of theater like I don't know what happened to him. Number two, you separate what you know uh from what you refuse to event uh invent. So I know I called the Coast Guard or the SETO. I know uh there were threats afterward. I won't invent this theory to make everybody happy who's who's watching this episode. And step three, offer the next real step. So here's what I personally saw after after we left. Here's what I didn't see. So four, if you if you locked kind of lock down your life, say why in one sentence. I shut my socials because of death threats. It's not because I needed a a hideout for a story. One sentence. Uh and you kind of hear that here. There's a probably a few sentences there, but um that's the big thing here. I'm not seeing any of the things that that I've seen in every other time that we've seen somebody and thought that they might be guilty. Uh there's none of that here. And the big thing that I look for that we haven't talked about yet is TDS, a transdererational search, where the eyes are moving in different directions and he's comfortable with pausing for a second to think about something. So eye movements in different directions. He's actually processing. He's not like pretending here. That was the big one for me. Scott, what do you got? >> All right. I agree with all that squished a lot. I was going to say, but we're seeing all the things that let you know he's angry, he's frustrated, he's afraid, and that whole thing is at that situation has made him feel that way. And again, like you guys were saying, why not get a lawyer? Yeah, get a lawyer. I, you know, that's the first thing you do in a situation like that. If people are saying all this bad stuff about you and and you know, telling you they're going to do stuff to you and your family and and all that, man, that all that what he did makes sense. That's what you do in a situation like that. You don't want people coming in on your social saying all that all that stuff and making it even worse because they might fire somebody else up to do something. So, I think everything on there, all that looks normal, sounds normal. He's approaching this like you should. Um, again, you've got to take into consideration when you see something like this and put into context everything that's going around, not just in what you're seeing, but what's happening out in the real world. and you have to put that in in in context what's happening in real time. So that's the that's why we're seeing what we're seeing when we get these answers and that backwards claw that he's doing. You know that that's his way of saying I'm telling you I didn't you know that's just another way of confirming his answer and making you you know I guess illustrating how much he believes in it and is is frustrated with it. Mark, what do you got? >> Yeah. So he says um we want to know as much as anybody else and he batons on his leg. It's audible during that you know it's in time with what he's saying. It's not a loss of buoyancy at the end we want to know as much as anybody else and then at the end which that would be but he's even saying we want to know as much as anybody else. He's not saying well I guess we'll never know. I mean I guess he's not putting accusations on uh the deceased here. Well, you know, Nolan, he could get into a lot of trouble, especially with those people over there. Oh, and he did have an argument with his family that day. He's not casting aspersions anywhere else. He's not distracting us anywhere else. He's going, "Look, we want to know what happened." And that is really good news for somebody who is being honest about their relationship with this person and wants to know what went on rather than saying, "Look, forget about it. No need to search anymore. You know, what's done is done. The guy's gone. We'll just never know." It's all um it's all really good. And you're right, he does start to get angry around this social media piece. It's got to be pretty hell. I mean, you make, you know, you make a you make a show where you're where you're doing your best to do something good and nobody nobody's dying uh out of it and and you get a lot of heat just, you know, making entertainment. Imagine Imagine somebody's died. Somebody's died and you're in the frame for whatever um you know, bizarre reasoning of other people. Like, it's got to be hell, you didn't ask for it. At least we're kind of asking for it. We're going, well, you know, come and have a go. We're making a show. You know, if you got nothing else to do, write a write a bad comment there >> or a good one >> or a good one, but write a bad one if you if you if you like if that's you know what you got time for today. No, he hasn't asked for any of this. So, I imagine it's absolute hell and he's angry about that and he probably has every right to be angry about it. He didn't come asking for attention around this. In fact, he's putting the attention on his friend, which is we want to know why. That's good news. So, it's looking good as far as I can see. >> So, after all that's been said uh in this interview, do you have any theories about what what could have possibly happened to Nolan? >> Um, you know, my buddies and I have talked about it and like I said, I mean, I've been on the water my entire life. My friends have. It's not like we're unexperienced in this, but Nolan was my best friend and he was my friend's best friends and he was like a brother to me and more than anything and the thing that's most important is what happened to him and I I mean I want to know just as much as anybody else. I mean, that's all like my friends haven't stopped talking about that like what what happened and you know like just trying to figure it out but I would never want to put it on somebody else because of the hate that I've received for just being out there around them and my name getting brought up because I called the Coast Guard. I was the first one to call the Coast Guard. I mean, I I don't I don't know and I want to know more than anybody. I mean, I just my friends and I are like very like have been wondering this for a while and you know, we just want to know as much as anybody else what happened to him. But I I would never want to sit here and blame anybody else and put this on anybody else because of the hate and death threats that my family and my friends have received. It's horrible and I would never want someone else to like experience that, you know. >> Yeah. Especially if if if there's no evidence to it. >> Exactly. >> So, I got two more things I want to address directly. >> Um, it's been said out there that you guys immediately delete your social media, lore it up as if you were in some type of fear that you would be implicated in this. What do you say to that? I mean, of course, we lured up and of course, you know, I deleted my social media. I was getting death threats before anything ever came out because I was the one that called the Coast Guard. I mean, people put this all on me because I was the one that called. I was the one that that was, you know, worried. My friends were just as well. I mean, of course, I delete all my social media. I was getting insane death threats, like stuff I couldn't even believe two days after. And you know, we went straight to the police. I wanted the police to come and ask questions. I I wanted them to know and have all of my information. And um I mean, people were accusing me of murdering my best friend. It's sick. I mean, like just because of a just because of race. I mean, it it's disgusting. It makes me stick like sick to my stomach. I mean, there's I I've obviously I delete I I got off of social media because there were people saying insane things to me and my family and I just couldn't sit there and look at it. I mean, that's it. >> I won't get into the details on that. I'll just throw it right to Mark. Mark, how's it looking to you? >> Yeah, look, here's what I'd say. Uh, leave the guy alone. He's He's done. He's lost his friend. Leave the guy alone. If you want to have a go at somebody, have a go at me in the comments down below for me saying to you, leave the guy alone. He's he's, you know, he's lost his friend. He's nothing to do with this. Chase, what do you reckon? Yeah, this is a a life-changing thing. And it's not just the death, it's just the social consequences of everything that that he's undergoing right now. How that's going to affect his employment employment and everything in the future of his life. Um, I hope they find out who did it. Um, and everything here looks honest. It looks genuine and it looks like somebody who who lost a friend. That's what it looks like to me. Greg. >> Yeah. I think we don't even know that someone did it. I mean, we'll just assume that the medical examiner was right or they will come back out and release something. I've read that they would release whatever information they have to a grand jury to see if there's anything to go after. If there is someone guilty of doing something, let's hope they find them. And you know when you have thousands and thousands of people around during a day, people can't keep a secret about anything. So usually the truth will come and that'd be good. I think what we see here is a guy who gave us his baseline upfront. And look, there's a lot more. Go watch Officer Tatum because this guy does a great job of interviewing people. There's a lot more interview. We just took a couple of clips to come and look at the story and see what we believe. He was faced with racism, accusations that he may have killed and removed information from the guy's phone. pretty poised, not in a poised way, just a natural response to every one of those questions. We saw a pretty comfortable place. We saw places where he's forced to contemplate and he had to contemplate and think out loud and say words that he probably hadn't even ever put together in his life. I think I agree with Mark. Leave this guy alone. If you want to come after somebody, come after Scott since he can't get in the comments anymore. It'll be fun. Scott, what do you got? >> Yeah. Uh, I really like this one because we get to see somebody who we're under the impression didn't do this. Has no nothing to do with it and he's still and he's having to defend himself. But luckily he got somebody who who knows how to do this. So it's not like some interviewer somewhere that's like well tell me about the whatever it is like we were talking about earlier. So he knows how to ask questions so it it goes smoothly and if it were to go off a little bit I know he'd be I we all know that he would he would have been right on it. He may not have been aggressive with him, but he may have been as aggressive as he needed to be with him and not aggressive for views and all that. So, I think he did a good a really good job with this. He stayed relaxed, which kept Warren relaxed. He wasn't leaning forward with that. So, what happened with the whatever it is? None of that. You know, that sound kind of weird. None of that stuff. So, I think he did a fantastic job with this. And we and again, we're seeing somebody convey information, not try to convince someone of something. Just tell them what happened. All right, fellas. Things another good and we'll see you next time. [music]