Video summary
Cameron Hanes opens his discussion with a candid admission regarding how he raised his sons, Truit and Tanner. In his twenties and lacking guidance from his own father or stepfather, Hanes operated under the belief that life was inherently competitive and brutal. To prepare his children for what he perceived as inevitable hardships, he pushed them relentlessly to be tough. This approach involved daily mountain runs starting when they were seven years old, half-marathons at age eight, and a constant emphasis on competition over fun. He explicitly stated his desire to see "floor burns" on their knees from diving during basketball games rather than letting them play casually. While he acknowledges that outsiders viewed him as an abusive or overly harsh father who was always the disciplinarian, Hanes maintained this strict regimen for years before realizing later in life that it may have been excessive and caused significant regret. The conversation shifts to a specific moment of reflection involving Tanner's decision-making process during his youth. When Tanner expressed interest in joining the army as a ranger rather than staying home as a deputy or corrections officer, Hanes initially felt proud but soon realized he had instilled an unhealthy mindset by telling his sons that "average is failing." He came to regret pushing them toward high-stakes careers because of what might have happened if they were deployed and killed; the pressure was partly self-inflicted based on his own childhood trauma. Despite these regrets, Hanes notes a delicate balance in parenting: providing children with resources and opportunities while also teaching resilience through difficulty. However, he admits that trying to replicate the toughness required by his upbringing without understanding its full emotional cost led him to question whether forcing such extreme measures was truly beneficial for their long-term well-being. A significant portion of the dialogue addresses the nature of parenting styles and genetic predispositions versus environmental influence. Hanes engages with Ben Francis, founder of Gym Shark, who built a multi-billion dollar company while raising twin boys in a working-class environment similar to his own rough upbringing. The discussion highlights that many modern parents lean too far toward "snowplow" or gentle parenting, potentially creating soft and entitled adults. Conversely, pushing children slightly further on the spectrum of toughness is often seen as a strange gift, though Hanes acknowledges he cannot separate how much their current success stems from his specific training methods versus their genetic makeup. He points out that behavioral genetics suggests there are no perfect parents; even those who grew up in horrendous environments can become perfectly balanced adults due to inherent resilience and the traits they inherit rather than solely what was taught them. Ultimately, Hanes concludes that while he may have pushed his sons too hard physically, one of the most impactful lessons comes from leading by example rather than forcing compliance through fear or competition. He argues that children learn more from observing their parents' behavior at dinner—such as showing affection to each other and treating others with respect—than from any lectures on how they should act. His own relentless mindset regarding work, lifting, running, and hunting inevitably influenced his sons regardless of whether he explicitly forced them into activities; seeing a father who never missed a day in the gym for fourteen years naturally inspired Truit to adopt similar habits. Although people often mistake their physical achievements for steroid use or ignore the grueling discipline behind it, Hanes believes that setting a strong example and maintaining a competitive yet respectful mindset is crucial, even if he regrets some of the specific harsh tactics employed during his sons' childhoods.
Read the full video transcript
We need to have a chat about Truit. What
is he built of? Uh he's Yeah, he's a
machine right now.
Um, you know,
it's it's weird cuz I I I get credit for
my kids, you know, and they're like,
"Oh, you must have done such a good
job." I didn't. I mean, I pushed those
boys way too hard. I mean, I was just I
didn't know what the hell I was doing. I
was young. I was in my 20s, so I didn't
know how to be a dad. My dad was never
around. I hated my stepdad. So, I was ne
I knew I definitely didn't want to be
like him, but I didn't know what a dad
was supposed to be. And I'm like, well,
okay, I'm just going to prepare these
kids. I know how life is. I know life
will [ __ ] kick you in the nuts. So,
they're going to be ready for anything.
Life is competition. They're going to be
ready to compete. So I had I pushed them
really hard and it was not great all the
time because So what what did you do?
Um you know it was just always a battle.
It's just
like you know it's we were running every
day. You guys got home from school.
Okay, get your stuff on. We're going to
go do Pisca. No kid wants to go run a
mountain. And I'm like, "No, this is
because the way I thought it thought it
of of it was I had a terrible childhood,
but it made me tough." So I'm like, "You
guys have everything. You have
everything I ever wanted. Your dad's
around. Your mom is here. She loves you.
You have every You have every shoe you
want. Every basketball camp you want to
go to, you go to." I said,
"So, the way this is going, you're going
to grow up to be a couple big [ __ ]
We're going to make you tough." So, I
would just make them do hard things. And
and uh I made they both did half
marathons when they were seven and 8
years old. True. Just put up a picture.
He looks like he's this tall. He was
tiny at 8 years 8 years old, but he ran
a 154 half like this tall, which is
eight something minute miles. And
um that all that to say that yeah I I
had the kids do really hard things for
many years to prepare them for what I
said was life's challenges and uh it
made
it you know if I was it reminded me did
you ever see the movie Tree of Life? No.
So Brad Brad Brad Pitts in it and great
movie but he was super hard dad there.
When he would leave it was like [ __ ]
playtime, right? mom, kids jumping on
the beds every and then when dad dad
would come home and be like, "Oh god."
So I said, "This reminds me of me when I
was when we go out of town, it's just
playtime, come back, it's like, oh
shit." So that's not great when you're
the bad guy all the time. You know, dads
are usually the disciplinary and that's
whatever. But I was also like, you know,
making them do these really hard things.
So they see now and they see all the
success, but it it wasn't great. and
anybody from the outside in would look
and say that what's wrong with that that
dad is pushing those kids too hard. You
know, it's like any basketball game, I'm
just like a loose ball, you better be on
that floor. And I said, I want to see
floor burns on your knees. I want you
diving on. I want you playing the harder
than any kid out there. So, that's a
hard that's a hard um thing to live up
to. Kids just want to have fun. They
want to play. They're not looking to
compete every day, but I made them
compete. So, it was a challenge. Now,
you see what that results in, you know,
and you know, Tanner, he was a ranger.
He's freaking badass. It's probably
tougher than Truit. And then Truit's,
you know, doing these crazy things and
getting all this attention. And yeah, I
mean, it's great. I I'm I'm glad to see
it, but um I didn't I wasn't perfect
raising this. Do you regret it?
Yeah, I regret
[Music]
um I regret I remember when Tanner went
to the army. He was a deputy back home.
Very proud of him. Such an important
job. He, you know, a corrections
officer, just worked at the jail, but
still it's, you know, a good job. It's
like paid paid the bills. I was proud of
him. We need people who need men to do
that. So, um, he said he was going to
join the
army and he wanted to be a ranger. And
I'm just
like, you know, you get deployed. And
I'm thinking, what
if, you know, he I think it was because
I would tell them that average is
failing. If you look around, you see the
average person. That's not us. That's
not what we want to be. So, we're not
Yes, I know people need to work at gas
stations and do things whatever. That's
fine. nuts, but that's not what we're
settled for. So, he he said he wanted to
quit. He didn't want to be a deputy
more. He wanted to be a ranger cuz he
had more to offer this world. And I was
thinking, was that me who [ __ ] up and
and said this at being just having a
regular job was somehow failing? And I
just had so many regrets. And I was just
like I told him he's getting ready to go
to basic training. And I'm like I said
Tanner I'm
like there's nothing wrong with with
having a regular job being a family man.
And I said there's nothing I was wrong.
I was wrong to say what I said raising
you kids. And um cuz I was thinking
about what if he got deployed and was
killed. And it's just like because of
[ __ ] I said trying to make my boys tough
and this is a result. So yeah, I was
like,
yeah, I definitely have had regrets over
how how hard I pushed them.
I
think it's such a delicate
balance
to give your kids the life that you
never had and the life that you worked
so hard to be able to afford them with.
whilst also knowing where most of the
important realizations that made you
into the sort of person who could
provide came about due to restriction
and difficulty and and tough times and
and toil uh and a little bit of maybe a
bit of resentment and a a little bit of
uh unfairness. Yeah. In childhood that
galvanized you to sort of do something
great with your life. every single I
look dude every single parent that I
know uh and even more be tell you what
be [ __ ] grateful that you had your
kids in your 20s because if you'd had
them now imagine how much of a
differential your lifestyle is uh
materially in terms of resources in
terms of uh status and and and notoriety
and opportunity and all of this stuff
you would be like floating out in space
you know you would have no the total
frame of reference would be out of the
window um there's not a single dad that
I know who has sort of crawled out from
the place that they were as a kid and
made something of
themselves who doesn't have that exact
concern about their children. I think it
is one of the most common worries. Uh
Ben Francis, he's the guy that founded
Gym Shark. Uh Gym Shark's completely
bootstrapped. He still owns 70% of it.
Gym Shark's worth over it's nearly three
billion dollar3 billion pound company.
This guy's like worth like2 billion
pounds, like3 billion, and he's 31. He's
got twin he's got twin boys, but he grew
up like as rough as they come in
Birmingham with a granddad that made him
go and work in like a clay mine or a a
pottery barn or something like that.
And I've asked him this question. I'm
like, how do you intend on navigating
this one? How do you intend on teaching
your kids the lessons that you learned
from a very working-class grandfather,
their great-grandfather,
whilst also not throwing away the entire
reason for working as hard as you did,
which was to be able to afford your
[ __ ] family the life that you never
had, right? So, you know, first off, I
think you did the best that you could.
So, you need to give yourself some grace
with that.
And
look, if this was so if 50% was like the
middle of the bell curve of how much
toughness versus easiness you could give
kids, I would guess that most kids and
most parents are too far on the easy
side. I think snowplow parenting,
helicopter parenting, gentle parenting,
whilst um noble in its intentions is
usually kind of over patatterent matched
and results in soft entitled adults,
right? Uh narcissistic soft entitled
adults when they grow up. Um given the
choice between the two, sort of being
pushed a little bit further on the other
side uh is a very strange kind of
gift. I I think what would be
interesting would be to
know how much of that is actually
because of the way that you raised them
and how much of that is just your genes.
Um the more that I learn about
behavioral genetics, heritability of
different traits, so on and so
forth like I this I this should be
comforting. As far as I can
see, there is no such thing as really
getting parenting right. There is only
getting it wrong. And getting it wrong,
kids are pretty [ __ ] resilient. Like,
they're really, really tough. And you
see perfectly balanced adults that grew
up in horrendous childhood environments.
Mhm. Uh, and I think as long as there's
no really extreme Well, maybe you would
say some of the the climbs with the rock
were slightly extreme. Um, my point is I
get the sense that if they're made out
of the same stuff that you're made out
of, they didn't really have a choice
whether you made them go up the mountain
or not. I think that there is a lot more
built into you. You know, you're talking
about consistently running for four
decades and thinking about
framing that up against what that meant
in your childhood and you know the sort
of relentlessness that you approach like
even the pod when you started that I
think that was episode 3 2 3 4 something
like that it's now like what 160 some
[ __ ] uh like even with that that's
that's not that's a level of work rate
that most people don't hold up in just a
minor little area then in the hunting
and then in the lifting and then in the
bow stuff and then in the running and
then in the so you
know maybe there is maybe it's
contributed but what I would if I could
sort of bet a couple of chips on the
roulette wheel of a couple of other
universes in which you'd approached your
kids differently Mhm. I think they'd
be probably 90% 80 or 90% of the way
there just with less experience about
how to deal with it. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and
one of the best things you can do for
your kids, I think as a [ __ ] look at
me, spouting nonsense as a nonfather.
The internet loves when I do this. Um,
one of the best things that you can do
is set a good example. You know, you can
read all of the books about healthy
attachment and child education and
socialization and all the rest of it,
but they will learn more from the way
that you and your wife show up for each
other around the dinner table than every
lesson that you try and force into them.
Like, you can top down try and tell them
how they're supposed to behave. this is
how you're supposed to treat girls. You
don't hit girls and you don't do this
and you must hold the door and you got
to be this way and be blah blah blah
blah. It's like, all right, but then
when you're around the dinner table,
you're a prick. You look at your phone
instead of looking at your wife or you
ignore her or you don't laugh at her
jokes or you guys don't relate well or
they never see you be physically
affectionate to each other or whatever
it is. It's not for me to say that you
need to like force a relationship, but
yeah, the point is I think that kids
learn by seeing a lot more than they get
learned by being told. And that's what
you're doing. Even if you hadn't made
them go up the mountain, you were like,
"I'm off to go up the mountain." They be
like, "Dad's going up the mountain. Can
I come up the mountain?" You know? So,
yeah. It's uh and and I was thinking
also too, it's not just like what you
do, but when you have that mindset about
life is competition. Um hard work is the
is the the key, whatever. That's that is
impacting how you talk and how you carry
yourself because everybody says says the
right thing. They they tell their kids
what you're supposed to tell your kids.
It's like as you said, no, you hold the
door for women. You you know, be
respectful. Everybody says the right
stuff, but how you carry yourself and
then how you how you talk. Not when
you're delivering some ultimatum or some
direction, but just how you what's your
mindset. And that's when it's not
controlled, when it's not you're not
thinking about it.
So my mindset was
always let's do more, perform more, push
harder. So I I guess to your point that
even if I wasn't m they were seeing that
of course it's
um yeah it's you know you talked about
true it you know originally but even for
him it reminded your story sort of
reminded me of his like people see him
now and they're like I mean he's easy to
he gets hate too cuz he's easy to hate
definitely um he's got a lot going for
him and that's that will build some
resentment over with some guys. But for
him, he lost for years. He He didn't
miss a day lifting weights for
like 14 years. Still hasn't. I started
them lifting when they were 14, both him
and Tanner. And since that time, he
hasn't missed more than a
day.
So, it was loss after loss after loss.
He's like tiny, not getting bit. He and
he mentioned this. We did this we're
doing this video on his pull-ups that
you know he broke the world record and
he's just like he goes I don't think he
goes I didn't realize
that Tanner was kicking my ass every day
as his older brother anytime we'd
compete me against him I would never let
the kids win. It was always like it was
always a battle always
crying. I mean, kicking the basketball
down the street because they're so mad.
Go get it. Y
Tanner, uh, I was throwing like football
as hard as I could, making him catch it
because he's a receiver. Drops it,
punches the ground, breaks his hand. So,
there's like all these losses
essentially. So, Truit said, "I didn't
know that." Yeah, I was getting beat by
my older brother. I was getting beat by
you every day. He goes, "I didn't
realize Tanner was the biggest beast,
one of the biggest beasts he's ever
met." And he goes, "And I didn't know
you were who you were. I thought," he
said, "I just thought I was weak and a
loser. I didn't know that I was going
against these these people that were
making me." So people see him now and
I'm like if you could see him back when
14 years old and you know when he's in
high school he get he was five foot like
90 lbs got cut from the basketball team
even though he was really good and the
most skilled cuz he was too small. They
don't see all that. They see now and
they're just like oh what is he on
steroids? And it's just like, no, this
is this is a kid who hasn't missed a day
in the gym for 14 years and trains for
hours every day and doesn't drink,
doesn't do anything but get enough rest
to perform every single day. This is
what you get when you're that dedicated.
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