Video summary
The podcast explores common misconceptions regarding eugenics, defining it broadly as any attempt to use knowledge of heredity to influence the traits of future children. While Francis Galton coined the specific term in 1883 following Gregor Mendel's experiments on pea plants and Charles Darwin's theory of evolution by natural selection, the practice itself is argued to be as old as humanity through sexual selection observed even in mammals. Early proponents like Galton utilized twin studies—comparing identical twins who share all DNA against fraternal twins sharing half—to understand nature versus nurture. This era represented a "golden age" where scientists believed they could control human traits similarly to how humans selectively bred plants and animals, such as transforming corn from a low-yield weed into a nutritious crop or breeding honeycrisp apples for superior taste. However, the conversation shifts to why modern society associates eugenics primarily with Nazi Germany's involuntary sterilizations of approximately 300,000 disabled citizens and mass murder. The speaker suggests that while these historical atrocities provide a valid reason for caution, there is also a "sinister" explanation involving radical left-wing groups who hijack the term to suppress any discussion about heredity or genetic explanations. This ideological stance often relies on a "blank slate" approach attributed to traditions from Marx and Rousseau, which attributes all social disparities solely to oppression, discrimination, or environmental factors like bad schools rather than genetics. The speaker argues that this creates a paradox where progressive movements simultaneously desire meritocracy while rejecting the biological realities implied by it, effectively hamstringing their ability to address future technological advancements in human traits. As technology advances with tools like *in vitro* fertilization and embryo selection, the distinction between voluntary genetic enhancement and coercive eugenics becomes increasingly blurred. The speaker asserts that there is no fundamental difference between "genetic enhancement" and eugenic practices; rather, using terms like "enhancement" serves as a euphemism intended to disarm opponents by avoiding negative emotional associations with history's darkest chapters. Even the decision to refrain from editing genes currently due to safety concerns regarding off-target mutations constitutes a form of shaping genetic endowment based on knowledge of heredity. Consequently, regardless of whether one calls it enhancement or eugenics, the core issue remains how parents and scientists utilize their understanding of genetics to shape children's traits for welfare improvement rather than misuse in forms like mass sterilization. The discussion concludes by highlighting an impending cognitive dissonance facing those who adhere strictly to the "blank slate" doctrine as genetic technologies become more accessible and powerful. Currently, individuals may privately recognize that heredity powerfully shapes human outcomes while publicly denouncing it due to ideological commitments; however, this contradiction is unsustainable once they must pay a tangible price for their beliefs by foregoing beneficial technologies. The speaker predicts that eventually, the false belief in the blank slate will collapse under the weight of scientific reality and practical necessity. Ultimately, the focus should shift away from semantic debates over definitions toward understanding the policy implications and ethical responsibilities scientists and parents hold to ensure these powerful tools are used to benefit their children and humankind as a whole.
Read the full video transcript
what do people misunderstand about what
Eugenics is and means
good questions so I would say eugenics
in the broader sense is any attempt to
harness the knowledge that we have about
heredity to influence the traits of our
kids and in that sense Eugenics is as
old as people and actually much older
um you know any mammal that uses sexual
selection
um ends up in such a situation where
females choose males on the basis of
traits
that will partly influence their own
welfare but will also influence the
wealth for their kids and so in a way
Eugenics is as old as you can think as
old as Humanity but the the term dates
back to 1883 and uh Francis Galton who
coined the term and I would say the
reason that that term was invented and
the concepts of eugenics in a really
explicit way made a comeback is that we
had a few things happening in the 1800s
first we get Mendel's experiments on pea
plants so we started getting to know a
little bit more about how heredity Works
a little bit more about what eventually
became called genes Gene the the term
Gene wasn't actually coined until 1905
but we we understood there must be some
unit of heredity that somehow Blends and
recombines to shape traits so first it
starts with Mendel then of course Darwin
comes up with this theory of evolution
by natural selection applied to all
animals not just plants including people
and his cousin Francis Galton who
studied the ready of specific traits
that we care about in humans
intelligence so he wrote a book called
hereditary genius but also just banal
traits like height and skin color and
hair texture and stuff like that and in
fact in fact Francis Galton was the
first to invent twin studies so this is
the idea that we now use in behavioral
genetics where he thought hey here's a
thought experiment what would happen if
we took identical twins and fraternal
twins and raised them apart and just saw
how they ended up like would they be
really similar really different and as
you know fraternal twins share half of
their DNA
identical twins share all of their DNA
and so he thought of this really cool
natural experiment to tease out what
part of our personality our physicality
is due to nature nurture Etc
so so in short what you get is this kind
of golden age in the 1800s where we're
starting to discover how Evolution Works
how heredity works and then this thought
that well maybe we can control it to
some extent in the same way we do for
animals and the same way we do for
plants and you look at what corn used to
look like three thousand years ago it's
a pathetic little weed that yields a few
calories and through selective breeding
obviously we make it more nutritious
more delicious you take those honey
crisp apples like they didn't start that
way there were these sort of bitter
fruits and now they taste like just pure
sugar you know you can amp up the
vitamin C you can do these kinds of
things
and of course it gets dangerous when you
talk about selective breeding for for
people and we'll get into that but it's
pretty clear once you understand
heredity one of your first thoughts is
going to be like okay
how does this influence like my choice
of mates what kind of children I'm going
to end up with and how do those children
end up influencing the traits of people
around us and the overall social welfare
of people
what do you think people are concerned
about when the word Eugenics comes up
obviously Nazism
um and I think this is
partly an innocent explanation it's
partly
um yeah I mean the Nazis did engage in
the worst forms of eugenics you can
imagine which has involuntarily
sterilizing their own citizens and I
mean Germans in this case they actually
sterilized about 300 000 of their own
disabled citizens of course mass murder
that Germans engaged in and so to that
extent we rightly associate it with some
of the evils in the past also American
sterilizations
but there's also a less innocent and I
think
um more Sinister explanation for why we
associate with Nazi Germany and that is
the kind of look left
so they like to take terms and hijack
them such that you can't have certain
kinds of thoughts right so for example
we all have thoughts like I really care
about the traits of my children and to
the extent that I'm engaged in a
long-term relationship I mean of course
what I really care about is the
personality of the other person I'm not
just thinking oh her genes are going to
end up in my kids
but the thought does occur to you that
your kids are going to be something like
you know a combination of the parents
and you know so to that extent like
thinking about heredity and thinking
about how our choices influence outcomes
for our kids is completely natural and a
lot on the radical left want to make
this thought almost impossible to have
and so they call almost anything that
involves genetic explanations eugenics
and so I think that's the
the uh darker reasons that we associate
it with Nazi Germany not the good reason
which is yeah we have to be careful and
learn from those those episodes in
history but it's also just the
manipulation of thought
um so yeah
it seems like an odd Paradox that occurs
especially with people from the super
Progressive left because on one hand
they want to have this sort of blank
slate approach to things which allows
for Pure meritocracy to come through but
also seem to be quite against
meritocratic systems as well because
implied in that is that the people that
don't succeed Were Somehow responsible
for their own failure but the solution
to that is well let's fold in the
heritability question Let's Fold in
behavioral genetics into this which
doesn't give everybody the same starting
point like by Design but that is so off
the table that it ends up being this
pretzel shaped loop-de-loop in a
desperate attempt to kind of zero out of
square the circle of this conversation
that is exactly right and it's
fascinating because the early
eugenicists after Galton and I mean
especially in England and the United
States were progressives
um because why because they thought
science could help us Advance our
species obviously it can right vaccines
contraception there of course downsides
to that that you've discussed on your
show but you know contraception at least
in principle you know women can now
control the reproductive choices and
decide when and whether to go to work
and that sort of thing and similarly
well the left thought we can control the
traits of our children so this does show
you because the early eugenesis were
progressives there's no doubt about that
it does show you there's nothing
inherent to the left that attaches them
to the blank slate but there is this
tradition going back to Marx and the
French Revolution and Rousseau and
especially now with the woke left
whereby they've put all their cards on
the blank slate this this doctrine that
any disparities we see for us are the
product of Oppression unjust
discrimination
deprivation in the household or bad
schools or something
and by doing that they're they're
actually hamstringing themselves because
as this technology and we can talk about
the technology now but as the technology
that's going to allow us to shape the
traits of our children
um is more and more developed and
available especially using in vitro
fertilization and embryo selection and
so on they're going to face an
increasing cognitive dissonance whereby
on the one hand they're going to have
every incentive to use this I mean
everyone recognizes heredity powerfully
shapes the traits of our kids but on the
other hand their official public
position is going to be to denounce it
because it's going to blow up their
entire world view
once you have a price on the false
belief in the blank slate once you have
to pay a price for example
foregoing the use of technologies that
might improve the welfare of your
children
what you publicly say and privately
believe I think will become more and
more different until the blank slate is
blown up and far leftists are going to
have to just publicly endorse eventually
uh the reality of heredity
that's fascinating what's the difference
then between Eugenics and genetic
enhancement and embryo selection
yeah good question I think there is no
difference
um I think it's pretty clear that
genetic enhancement is a youthful
euphemism for eugenics
and some euphemisms are useful I mean
the truth is you know it can disarm
people when you say you're defending
Eugenics um I've certainly done that to
people you're our mutual friend Diana
Fleischmann likes to get under people's
skin by using the word eugenics
um so yeah some bioethicists and others
have used the term genetic enhancement
instead and you know you might say on
the one hand that that's kind of nice
because it doesn't have these emotional
associations with it on the other hand
it's the same thing and so the idea is
look when we're talking about Eugenics
or genetic enhancement we're talking
about
um paying attention to the genetic
traits of our kids whether we're
intentionally altering them or actually
intentionally refraining from altering
them for example
um you know crispr cast 9 can
technically be used now to edit the
genes of an embryo but there's so many
off-target mutations that would be
incredibly dangerous for you to try to
do that right now and I would say that
the decision to refrain from doing that
is itself a form of either Eugenics or
genetic enhancement you're using your
knowledge of heredity and how the
technology Works to shape the genetic
endowment of your kids
so in principle genetic enhancement is a
euphemism it's supposed to disarm your
opponent so that you don't think about
some of the downsides of eugenics but
the reality is we've always made these
distinctions in philosophy and in other
adjacent disciplines between voluntary
Eugenics and coercive eugenics between
Eugenics or genetic enhancement if you
want to call it that that is aimed at
improving the welfare of your child or
improving the welfare of all children
right
so again I'm not I'm not big on
definitions it's clear why we've chosen
this other definition and we we tend to
use genetic enhancement
but as you've probably seen from
reactions to the work I've written in
Diana Fleischman as well what they're
going to do if you use genetic
enhancement is just call you eugenicist
anyway so at that point why not just say
okay call me what you want what's really
important is like what are the policy
implications of this what are the
responsibilities that scientists and
parents have to use this technology for
the benefit of their kids and for
humankind
rather than misuse it in the form of
mass sterilizations and murder which
happened in Nazi Germany what's
happening people
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