Valley Green Energy Working Group Sep 17, 2026

are now recording. Um this is uh the Valley Green Energy working group meeting pursuant to chapter two of the acts of 2025. This meeting will be conducted via remote means. Members of the public who wish to access the meeting remotely may do so via Zoom or by telephone. No in-person attendance of members of the public will be permitted, but every effort effort will be made to ensure that the public can adequately access the proceedings in real time via technological means. So, as I said, this is the regular meeting of the Valley Green Energy working group and we're joined today by Marina Patton of Mass Power Choice. Um going to start the agenda with a few items. Um the first is public comment. I don't think we have any public. So, yes, we don't have any public. So, we'll go on to the next agenda item, which is the minutes um review of the minutes. I can throw them on screen if I have to, but um I did make I did find some errors uh myself, which was the date at the top of the minutes. Um I also spelled my own name wrong at the end of the document, which I changed. And there was a parenthetical character that I removed. So, um if you don't have additional changes, then we can go ahead. >> A motion to approve the minutes. >> Seconded. >> Okay. And in no particular order >> I >> Yes. And I'm I and um for everybody's um benefit, I'm going to my for a minute and ask Marina, can I just ask you to talk about some of the materials that you recently sent us uh regarding communication about the um the changes to the program? >> Um sure. Why don't I just give a general overview of the the outreach stuff? So big picture, the um the price change mailing is scheduled to drop on September 28th. That's the same day that um we'll certainly know later than that. The communities will want to put out their price change announcements due that publicity. And it's also the same day that we'll update the Valley Green Energy website with the new prices. So the price change notices have been reviewed and approved by the communities. Draft announcements have been sent out to the municipalities. Then I saw yours is finished and it's over with Direct Energy. Um Stephanie and Bob, I just need to get your edits or sign off and then I'll send that one over to Direct Energy as well. Um and Darcy and Adele, just for your reference, um it is typical in a municipality's contract with an electricity supplier that if a press release goes out about the program and it includes the name of the supplier, the supplier is given three days to review the press release. They don't get to govern what goes in it. The municipality has the discretion to accept or not accept their edits. And even if they don't reply in those three days, the municipality is free to send out the announcement um at the end of those three days just regardless of of what's happened. So um we just have to check that box. Um and Direct Energy takes this very seriously and sends everything through their legal team. So um we'll get that finished. Um and I've sent you guys I think I sent you the link to the website too and what the prices will look so you can see what the prices look like on the website. And then um we're working on updated handouts as well and we'll have those available for you a little bit later and we'll ship those to you like we did at launch, printed copies so you can hand those out and we'll have a social media graphic or two for you as well um near the end of the month so you can use that for your publicity outreach. Marina, >> I don't think we've um received the link to the website. >> I was just going to ask Marina, I haven't I haven't sent it out yet. Would you mind just um maybe sharing your screen showing sharing that so we can >> if it's possible? >> Yeah, let me see. It's a password protected site. So, let me just see if I'm logged in to that. >> Okay. >> Site right now. Do do we have to do something here? I don't know if I owe Marina some kind of a I don't know go ahead or something. I thought I already that. >> So I had So what we originally it was going to be one notice for all the same for all three towns but >> and Ben wanted to break it out. Yeah. >> So I said you and I could you know or you and I meaning Emerson. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Could have the same. So, um, it's just a general notice about the prices. >> Yeah, I know. But is there anything I need to do? >> No, just make look at the language and make sure it's okay. We don't have it. I have no edits. Um, I >> I didn't either because I looked at it back when. >> Okay. >> So, are you guys planning to send out one combined announcement for Ammerst and Pelum or two different ones? Because that will govern whether I send one to Direct Energy or two identical announcements, just one for Ammerst and one for Pelum. >> Right. I guess the question too was for the mailing. Um, are you all doing the mailing? I I wasn't clear about that. >> Yes. So, always just like at launch, right? >> And just like with the refresh mailings that happen periodically to new customers, the supplier covers the mailing. >> Yeah. >> Uh covers the cost and executes it. Yep. So, that's going to be all taken care of by direct. Yep. >> Okay. That's why we just have to get the language. So, I think Yeah, just one that goes to both. We can just have it say Ammerst/Pellum. >> Yeah. >> At the top. And that's the only change that we would make. >> Okay. And just to be clear, so the notices are the are not what we're what that is. That is the press release. >> The notices you guys approved previously. So the words get confusing. >> The notices go in the mail. >> Yeah. >> And those are going out on the 28th >> and you guys approved those a long time ago because they had to be approved a long time ago. and Direct Energy will send those and they go to everybody that's active in the program and the one you get is based on what price you have now because it says this is your current price and this is what it's changing to. Then separately there's an announcement that you guys that all the municipalities have to do. That's a DPU requirement. >> So that's what we're talking about now. >> Right. Right. Okay. And so that's not getting mailed to people. That's just release that's going up. That's a press release. That's kind of why I was getting the language confused. Yep. >> for the press release. So again, um so so I guess again, um Ben, I hear what you were saying about the pricing, but it seems weird because if we're both sending press releases to the Daily Hampshire Gazette for the same program, I understand there's two different sets of pricing, but why would we send two separate press releases about the same program with two different sets of pricing? It seems to me even more confusing than if we and this is what I thought. That's why I think the language in in what I originally said got confused. >> Press release that gets released by the mayor goes to lots of outlets um and including just gets picked up and and emailed around by residents. Um, and yes, the Daily Hampshire Gazette has a responsibility to take information and present it accurately. And that means saying here's the price that Pel and Emmeris pay and here's the price that Northampton pay and that's fine and that's going to you know like that's fine to to share that and and we should um but but because like this is an announcement from the mayor that says hey I'm I'm on your side doing good things for you. I mean, I had to compromise and screw you over because we wanted to be nice to people from Ammerst and Pelum who you may or may not know. You know what I'm saying? It's like I mean, we did do that, right? I you know, in a sense, hey, it's a public meeting. This is being recorded and I could say I didn't do my job by saying, oh no, I am going to stick to my guns and just try to get the lowest possible price for Northampton and not care what happens to the, you know, to to the others, right? But we felt that it would be fair to split it because they have different utilities and it's complicated and it's still the case that it if you highlight for somebody I mean yes people read it in the gazette I'm going to trust me I am going to be getting so many angry phone calls that I'm going to have to deal with because of whatever's in the gazette because they'll report it accurately. But if I could cut that number of phone calls by two, uh, you know, that would be great. >> Yeah. >> Do you have a >> I hear you. Go ahead. >> Do you have a take on this? Um, I just I would just be curious as a professional communications professional. >> I mean, I think it's complicated because you guys are three communities that are all in the same area. So, it's I think it's tricky to send out different messages, but it's also I think Ben has a good point that I don't know. I can see both sides of it. >> Yeah. So, what are you suggesting, Ben? >> I'm just suggesting that you send out the the two press releases that have important information for residents in these different communities. You let the Daily Hampshire Gazette write an article that they're going to write. You know, they're journalists. They've put things together with press releases. Meanwhile, at least the things that are heavily targeted just to Northampton residents don't rub their noses in it. >> So, I think the the challenge here is that obviously we have two different utility areas. And when we did the initial pricing that we did with First Point. Ammerst and Pelum were often always other than the very very beginning of the program and at the end when we intentionally changed it by removing the the adder >> credit or applying that more to the pricing for everybody. Um the problem was that because of the disparity in the two pricing structures from National Grid and Eversource. >> Yeah. >> The Pel and Ammerst residents were completely most of the time paying more. >> I understand. No, there's no >> I'm explaining this for everybody and I'm explaining this for people who might watch this. I'm trying to explain what happened was that so National Grid's pricing tends to be higher than Eversources. So what happened was because we were trying to balance those two things, it was to the detriment of Ammerst and Pelum. So when we went out to bid for this next time, the point, you know, what we had the option to do was to split it out by utility. So, the pricing for I wouldn't use the language necessarily, Ben, that you're doing something wrong or Northampton's getting screwed. >> I think I'm not saying that's true. I'm saying >> I'm I'm just explaining this. I'm not This is not directed at you or for you or anything. This is just a general explanation. >> Right. So I think the thing was this time when we had to go out to bid we we separated them out so that it would be more fair and equitable in terms of what the discount rate is. So really the percentage rate if you are a national grid basic customer or you're an Eversource basic customer the percentage by which you're saving in this round is essentially the same. The percentage, I'm not talking about the rates you pay. The rates you pay, there's a difference because they're two different utility ter territories, but the percentage that you save is basically the same for residents in both those utility areas. So that's the point that I want to clarify for people to understand. So it's not like national grid customers are getting screwed this time or there's anything that was done on your behalf, Ben. The idea was just to make it more equitable for everybody and that was the way to do it. So I just want you don't have to say anything or defend or anything. I'm just explaining >> but I just want to point out I I was didn't wasn't running a stopwatch but that's what I will have to do. >> Mhm. >> Many many many times on the phone. >> Yeah. >> You can just send them this link. >> Yeah. And but but you understand like that's so that's what I'm just trying if I'm I'm I know I won't be able to avoid it entirely but if I can reduce it >> by a few phone calls. >> Let me let me just let me just say this a a different way. I think that what we the decisions that we made managed to make Valley Green Energy's rates competitive. >> Yes. >> Competitive in both markets meaning the Eversource market and the national grid market. um because they're two different utilities, because they have two different rate structures, um we had to make adjustments to our rate structure so that it was competitive in both markets to the advantage of um our our our users, our our clients. So that's the way I would talk about it. I mean, we have a we have a responsibility to make sure that our rates are as competitive as they can be. Exactly. And so we've done that. Some people might argue about the decisions we made in order to make them competitive in both markets. Um, but you know, we can defend that. >> But why don't the the press release that comes from the mayor, why doesn't it explain that? >> We could add to the press release with an explanate, right? we wanted to do a single press release that says here are the prices in, you know, in Eversource territory, here's the prices in in North in National Grid territory, and here's why. We could do that. And maybe I I mean, I'm happy to take advice and say actually no, the better choice is to do that upfront. Um, you know, there's the other side of it, which is if you're explaining, you're losing. And um and people are often um the more information that you add the more confused they they get and and the more angry they get. I don't know the right answer. Marina, if you have if you have advice, I will gladly >> Well, let me just add one thing before Marina goes in there. So when that whatever whatever we do two press releases, one press release, >> um the information is going to be here's the valley green energy price, here's the Eversource price, the national good price. So if I'm a if I'm a customer and I look at that and I say, "Oh, Valley Green Energy's price is lower. I'm an Eversource customer." Well, that's great. I'm happy about that. Or I'm a National Grid customer. Oh, Valley Green Energy's price is lower. You know, I'm happy about that. Um I hope Exactly. >> And yes, will I will I know enough to understand just in the reading of that that um well, why are the prices different? Well, they're different at National Grid and Eversource. So, you see that in the chart. Um you know, I I I don't know that this is going to generate as much heat as um as you think. There may be some very sophisticated people who understand that we could have made a different decision, but if you're looking at it on its face, the rates are competitive in both territories. >> Yeah. And well, so that's true. And I'd say reasonable people will look at it exactly the way that you did. >> I'm sorry. No, you were you were going to weigh in. >> I mean, I don't I don't have any great pearls of wisdom. um we don't have any other communities or any other programs that have you know multiple communities and in two different service territories. So you guys are a particularly complex scenario. I I suppose one option would be to send a unified press release to that one media outlet you mentioned and then for community specific you would have you could have community specific information that is sent out within the community knowing that this one combined um announcement is out in the world there's multiple cross media outlets right so it's not just the Gazette, it's the Republican, it's >> the reminder. >> Sorry, >> the reminder Facebook. Yeah, there's just Yeah, there's like a whole slew of um news outlets, you know, as well as like the, you know, channel 22 and 40 and, you know, >> when when these press releases are out in the world, um will people have already received their individual letters and notifying them of what's going on? >> No. Um typically the announcements are going out. What we recommend that the community send the announcements out the no later than the day of the mailing so that the announcements are up when people get the notice in the mail because what we find happens is people receive their notices and they question whether they're legit or they're marketing because we're getting so much other garbage in the mail and if you have an announcement out it provides some kind of validation for this piece of mailing. Um so but that's not a requirement. Um, it used to be a requirement that the announcements had to go out 30 days before the prices took effect. That's no longer a hard requirement. It's more of a best practice now. So, if you guys wanted to wait and send the announcements out after the mailings landed, you could do that. It feels weird to do it that way. Um, to be honest, I that that seems very weird to me. Um, >> to get something in the mail and then like a week later the city does an announcement or the town does an announcement. That seems weird. Um, so I would I would say that generally no, the announcements drop first and then the mailings land. >> Okay. So >> So go ahead. >> I do hear the argument that if you if you don't give them the specific story, they will people will be able to make up a different one. Right? So like that would be an argument for a unified press release that actually spends the time in the press release to explain that um because of the two different territories and the two different basic service prices, the two the different communities have different prices so that Valley Green Energy is competitive in all and you know um there there is some sense in in putting that out. Um, >> as a matter of fact, Ben, now that we're talking about it, I must admit that I thought that your argument was cogent when I first saw it, you know, on emails and all that, but now that we're talking about it, I'm realizing, my goodness, if we sent out two different press releases, then the question is, I was receiving them, wait a minute, why is this two different press releases, Valley Green Energy? Yeah. might it raise actually more questions? >> Yeah. >> As a result of doing it that way. >> And I do Marina is right that you know if we're gonna >> if each of our communities what we're going to post on our website for example you know that can be relevant to just our community if we want it to be um or whatever. But I I I just it just occurred to me that if we sent out two of them it it could raise questions. I can imagine getting calls, maybe not to me because Pelum is so small, but one of you guys, hey, why are there two of these releases? How come you didn't make this one release? What's going on, you know? >> Yeah. >> So, I'm going to I'm going to be uh like Bob, because when we did this originally, Bob, you were very adamant about having one press release. >> You were very clear. You said we should be three unified towns with one message. And so, I'm going to be that voice this time. I really think it should be one unified press release and yes it does need I think more of an explanation probably then why we have the little bit >> I think I clarification >> I I agree. So let's I'm sorry Marina for wasting your time with the the Northampton only press release. Uh I mean you understand why I was trying to do that but yeah I do see now that what we need to do is get the explanation out there in front. I I think I was confusing it with them. I was confusing that this was sort of the press release and the language in the letters. I just for some reason was mixing the two up because it said announcement. >> Yeah. >> So because I for me press release is a press release. So I wasn't thinking of it that way. So I agree that we go with Yeah. I So it sounds like we're all in agreement. And Adele and Darcy, do you sort of think this is a good approach? Okay. So yeah. And by the way, I think the headline of this press release quite frankly is Valley Green Energy announces competitive rates >> with the utilities in their respective communities. I know Marina will do it much more nicely than that, but >> um I think that's the headline. It's it's the competitive rates and and we're doing it. We're we're competitive. >> Yeah. None. Nonetheless, in in this unified press release, there was some language that Marina edited for me that she did much better than mine to let our Northampton commercial customers know that it's not competitive for them. And I think we do need to put that language in there for Northampton >> commercial customers. Um, but yeah, it I >> I don't I don't know. So, in other words, commercial customers with national grid have a different rate. Is that right? >> Yeah. >> And it's lower. >> Um, not by a lot, you know, and it could go higher in February. >> Okay. >> Marina, um, I'm assuming this is probably really good feedback for you. Um, would you be able to take a stab at some language for us? Um, and maybe resend a draft and maybe we can just have the one then. >> Sure. Yeah. >> Okay. And then and I think last time Ammerst sent it to the larger um media outlets and I think I sent you that list, Ben. I think that's how we did it last time because we're the lead community and I think Sam as our communications director sort of took that on. >> It's fine. >> Um, so that's okay by you all. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And and we'll just so what we'll do and I think we did this last time. I think we just had pictures of you know screenshots of who it was sent to. So we can share that with you so that in case there's any outlets that aren't covered by who you typically do locals outreach to that that gets covered. You know like we have the Ammerst Indie that'll probably be included in our press release too. But um it might be too that maybe we could add the ones that you all might do separately and we could add it so that it's just one big uh notice rather than So if you if you have like a newsletter or something that you guys >> send Oh, I see what you're saying. >> Yeah, you could send that >> to us and we could make sure that we have everything go out at once. >> Up to you. I don't know. However you want to do it. I'm just thinking, >> you know, >> I think if if if Ammerst just just sends it out to all the media and we get a copy that is meant to be a press release from the mayor's office here, they'll do whatever they do with it once, you know, once they have a press release, they'll just it's their deal. >> Okay. >> So, you're saying just copy your >> copy the unified press release. Don't I have been persuaded by you guys that multiple press releases is a bad idea and that I just need to set aside essentially a month for phone time. >> Hopefully hopefully like Bob said, it won't be as much as you think. >> I'll give you a call, Ben, and just say hi Ben. >> We'll call you and say nice things. >> Yeah. >> Um Okay. All right. I'm making a note of this. So, Elena, you're you're clear now what we're doing, right? >> Yep. I'll come up with I'll revise uh the unified draft and send it back out to you guys. >> Thank you. >> Okay, great. Thank you so much. Um and are there other updates, Marina, that you wanted to share with us? >> You wanted to see the website? >> Yes. Oh, yes, please. Thank you. Forgot about that. >> I can do that. So, this is the homepage. you guys are familiar with it. Um there's a little announcement at the top. Once you guys have a website announcements out, we will provide a link or links here. >> Yeah. >> Um and then the new prices are going to be divided visually by communities on the homepage. The rest of the homepage is the same as it is now. But if we go to the page where we go into more detail, you can see that we've got Ammerst and Pella prices. New was the current price and then new is the more dominant one and the same with Northampton. Um, so it should be fairly straightforward for people to see which price applies to them. We did not do a table. Tables are really different difficult for people that use assist of technology. >> Yeah. Um, so we've done it this way because this is far more um, coherent for anyone using assist of technology. Um, and then on the renewable energy page, which is where you get the chart that shows all the detail about the renewable content, we have this content, which is, I think, on the current site already. Um, but there's a link right up at the top of the page. Read about Valley Green Energy's evolving renewable energy strategy. Um, and this talks about kind of the language that has already been put out to the public about the change in the renewable content. Um, so this is also on the site, but the rest of the site is is basically the same. >> Nice. >> Can we go back to the the kind of the front page or the page? >> The homepage. >> Yep. So, you know what I'm gonna want to see is could we get the Evers Source and National Grid prices? >> Yeah. >> Flanking these. >> I was thinking the same thing, Ben. >> I was too. >> Okay. It's going to be a lot of circles. Um, >> six. >> Yep. It's a lot. And they'll probably need to go below them because they're not really going to be very easy to read if we do six straight across. But let us let us see what we can do. It would be good, I think. >> Yeah. >> Um, and Darcy, you have your hand up. Go ahead. >> Yeah. Uh I had asked um I don't know if you have changed the website but um it seems like it's still relevant to let people understand about the standard previous standard option that was temporarily retired. I mean, we put a lot of discussion into the fact that that was only going to be temporary. Um, >> right. So, that is that does say temporary on the new on the current site on the live site. >> Oh, >> I think it's going to be confusing if I'm honest with you if we have a program option >> that is not available, that does not have a price, that does not have renewable content. >> Yeah, >> that is because we already have so many options now. We have six things for people to navigate. And in our experience, people do not navigate a lot of information visually very well at all. And I would actually not recommend having a pricing circle or a circle that has an option that isn't really an option. Yeah. But this is why we still have this renewable energy page up in the global navigation and a statement on this page like with the link up at the top about the evolving renewable energy strategy. So that's something that people can access >> when it goes out of retirement or out of out of temporary retirement and we have something new that's a real thing. We put it back into the >> Yeah, just >> on the web page. >> Yeah, agreed. I think so too. I think there's a lot here for people to digest and that would just be more. >> Yeah. >> So it is there now? >> Yes. On the current live site, what you're looking at is a staged site. So the live site still has it. Correct. >> This is for November. This will go into effect uh in in wait >> at the end of No, this is this will go up at the end of the month when we need to put the new prices up. >> Right. So, but the but the pricing doesn't go into effect until November. >> That's correct. >> Just is just just letting people know. >> That's correct. >> Right. >> Yeah. I would uh I guess I would disagree with taking it off even if it is a little complicated because of the fact that it's if it isn't in writing somewhere, it's likely to be dropped. uh or more likely more likely. So I guess I just would feel a lot more secure if there was reference to what had been there in that graphic way on the website. >> Well, it is just for your reference. There is continued reference to it here about this BGE standard green option. So that is right here in this evolving renewable energy strategy section. Mhm. >> It's specifically noted there. >> I can't read it. It's too small. >> When the program launched, Valley Green Energy offered VGE standard green option which included 10% voluntary purchase of renewable energy from our region over above a minimum required by state law. Until recently, the impact of purchasing extra renewable energy from our region was an increase in demand for more renewable energy on our local grid. Renewable energy developers saw that demand and built new renewable projects to meet it. However, recent shifts in federal policy, etc. >> And then at the end, there's the statement that the communities remain deeply committed to accelerating renewable energy develop and will continue to explore new, more effective ways to support a cleaner, greener grid through this program as market conditions evolve. I guess I would also say that the purpose of the website is to make the information clear to the general public. It is not the guiding document or the guidelines for the program. That's something you guys get to decide. This is just to try to make the information make sense to the public as the program currently is. So I I don't think that removing the circle means that you guys, which are the deciding body, will forget about this commitment to renewables. >> Yeah, >> Adele, you have your hand up. >> I was wondering whether um 30% is the current rate of uh Class one renewables required by law. >> Yes, that's for 2026. Yep. >> Thank you. >> Uh my personal feeling is that I I don't think we should add an additional circle. I agree that it is we are the deciding body. I'm not sure about the concern about forgetting about it. I don't think any of us are going to forget about it. I think it's very much on our minds, but we just want to wait until it actually is going to do some some benefit in a way that we can actually apply. And right now, we're not set up to do that. >> I'm in agreement with that. >> Yeah. >> Why are we still offering the 100% renewable option? It's >> a very good question. >> Yeah. Yeah. And well, you know, I think because there was a request that we do so and I think we felt we were going to already sort of do away with the standard and I think because quite honestly there was advocacy from from you all that we should include it and that's why we did. I think personally I would have been fine not to. I think we just wanted to honor the request and so we did. That was sort of our compromise was like, well, we want we think we should not do this with standard and give everyone better pricing for now. And if people really do have the wherewithal and the means and they still want to do this, then they can. So, we were still leaving it as an option. But I think Darcy, you specifically requested it and I think we were trying to honor that. I my recollection is that mass power choice um suggested it and um >> guess so. >> Oh well, it's pretty easy to go back and look. >> Yeah. >> Um but uh yeah, it's I know both Adele and I have dropped 100%. Um and we would recommend to other people that they do it. So, um I it doesn't if our if our thinking is consistent between the the option that we dropped and 100% seems seems kind of iffy to be offering it. >> Exactly. >> I mean, it without actually taking the poll, I bet everybody on this call is in agreement with that. So the question is given that we negotiated an option or we you know we um had had the company bid on an option that we actually maybe don't want to offer. Is it too late to change that? >> Marine is pulling her hair out about now. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. >> Well, so there's a few different things to consider here. I don't think it's a big deal if you have an option in the contract that you're not publicizing. Although the contract is public and people can see that, >> right? >> Um but I think that's not a big deal. The bigger challenge is this mailing um which is already the prep for it is already pretty far down the road. Um we would need to stop that possibly change the timing on it. we would need to draft a new notice for people in the 100% green option telling them they're they're getting to the basic option, which we can do. Um, but I'm just not sure about the timing on on all of that and when the mailing would actually drop. So, I would need to check on that. >> But let me just make a counterargument for why we should leave it as it is. >> Um, and that is I think when we had this discussion, this is my memory now of course. I think when we had this discussion, we um of course were concerned about the changes that have been made in the regulatory environment. Um but we also wanted to ensure um our public um that we continue to be committed to going as greener, greener, greener with electric supply. And you know, um, if you are a customer of either of these utilities and you wanted to be 100% green and you were not in Valley Green Energy, you could find a supplier and you could contract for it with with a supplier. Um, and so we'd write we'd rather be that supplier. If there are people who despite the regulatory changes want to be 100% green, I would rather they be with Valley Green Energy than to be with some third party supplier that's on the list of 50 suppliers that the utilities are required to provide. So I I'm comfortable with the fact that while I agree that you know I I would I would have gone with a single a single uh rate to just have one but I also see an argument and uh for leaving it and having 100% green because there are people who will do it um and want to do it um and and and have the means to do it and so by God let them be Valley Green Energy customers rather than saying wait a Valid Green Energy is not offering this option anymore. I'm going to go over here and I'm going to sign up with whoever it is, Greenworks or something like that and do it there. So, so for that reason, I think it's a great idea that we continue to hold on to it at this point. I'll offer if it's of any help that for other communities that have gone through a similar thought process. There are we are finding there are customers who choose the 100% green option not because they're trying to change the grid but because they just feel better knowing that the electricity they buy is 100% renewable. So it's not so much about trying to build new projects. it's just this is what I want for myself and this broader context is less important to them. So we have found that already to be the case in other communities. My guess is that is likely the case that those customers exist within the Valley Green Energy >> I agree >> constituency. >> Yeah. >> Definitely true >> and I think we made our I mean I think we made our decision at the time based on a conversation. So, I don't think changing it now >> really makes sense. So, we just leave it as it is. And sorry, Marina, if we gave you a moment of panic there. Um, but, you know, I I just think it's reasonable to leave it where it is. And at some point, hopefully, we could only hope that things will change. >> Yeah. In about three years, >> maybe possibly sooner if you know we have successful midterms. Maybe Whatever this >> I'm just >> We all have our dreams. >> Yes, we all have dreams, right? >> Um, so is there anything else regarding this the website at least? Are we are we good? >> Okay. All right, Marino, anything else? Uh, any other updates or anything else to cover with us? >> Nope, I don't think so. I think I've got my marching orders on the uh announcement, so I'll get back to work on that and get a new draft over to you guys as soon as I can. And then I I told direct to hold off on reviewing the Northampton one um just now. So um yeah, we'll get that moving. >> Okay. >> Thank you. But we'll definitely have it to you by >> you know approval by next Wednesday for sure. >> Uh it needs to be we need to have it signed off by Tuesday. We have to send it to direct by Tuesday of next week. I think it was the 22nd, right? >> Yeah. >> As soon as you send to draft, I will turn it around. >> Okay. same here. >> And I am sorry about wasting your time on the other draft. >> Well, it's not a waste of time. I mean, you guys have a particularly complex program. So, it all as you can see, there's always a lot to talk about and there's a lot of different points of view and a lot of different ways to think about things. And sometimes we have to actually see something before we know whether or not we we like it or not. So, that's fine. No worries. >> And it was good to just hash it out, I think, to have a conversation. So, >> we'll end up with a better press release because of it. So, >> yeah. Absolutely. >> So, >> all shall be well. >> Thanks, Marlene. I really appreciate everything you're doing for us. We value you greatly. >> Yeah, >> sure. Nice to see all you guys. >> Nice to see you, too. >> See you. >> Bye. Um, okay, great. Uh, well, we've got that squared away. Um, I guess there were some Valley Green energy updates I wanted to share with you all. Um, one is that I finally did hear back from Samuel, which was very exciting. um I wasn't really hearing from him, so I reached out to Henry and said, "Is there any way you can maybe help us along here?" And then he got right back after he heard from Henry. So that was really nice. Um so he's going to be away um until like October 16th, and I don't know if he'll make it to our October 22nd date, I think, is the next meeting date. Um but he is willing to to meet with us. So I think probably um if not that October date then certainly the November meeting date he'll be available to meet with us. Um so I think that'll be a really interesting conversation. Um Darcy you asked about the status of the RFP. Um, I think especially after our conversation with Henry, um, I did have someone to contact, but I've actually am holding off because I think we should talk to, um, to, uh, Henry first. Not Henry, I'm sorry, to Samuel. I'd like to hear what he has to say and actually have him review the RFP to see what he thinks about it. So, uh, because that was to develop the business plan. So, I think I'd like to wait um and have that conversation first. I don't I really don't think especially right now that there's like an absolute dire need. So, I I would like to wait personally till we talk to Samuel before we try to reach out to get someone to develop a business plan. So, uh that's that update and I think >> where is that Stephanie? Is that in procurement or >> what? The RFP. >> Yeah. >> Or the BIS. Um, it didn't go out. Uh, it was drafted. You all had it. You all saw it. Um, it it hasn't changed. Um, so it we were waiting to because we didn't have a procurement officer for for a while. Um, we got somebody new. Um, but it hasn't gone to her yet. And in part now I'm waiting because I want to make sure that Samuel reads it first because there might be something we missed or something that you know we might be guided to tweak a little bit that might work better for us. So I'd like to have um have him look at it. I think he can be very valuable in sort of maybe helping us move this along. So I'd like him to take a look at it. So it hasn't um procurement hasn't released it. And didn't we when when we had the presentation um that we had at our last meeting, I'm trying to remember the man's name, but I >> Henry >> Henry, >> one of the things that I felt uh that I took away from that was the need for us to perhaps um before we move forward with an RFP, see if we can become bigger, meaning joining with some other um aggregate aggre aggregation programs um and have it be this bigger thing than just Valley Green Energy um our three communities. Um, so it seems to me, I mean, I thought that was that was a big takeaway for me that, you know, the what Henry was was presenting was this multic community thing um that had a certain mass um that I think was much more desirable than trying to do something for our three communities. Now, I could be wrong, but that was my takeaway. And when we have Sam, when we talk to him, I want to test that on him as well. Like, would this RFP be a whole lot stronger and better um if in fact we could um collaborate with some other aggregations um because if that's the case, I think it changes the game a bit. You know, >> Adele, >> my perspective is that um why would another community want to join if there weren't a JPE >> to create it with us to become part of a JPE that we all create together? >> Yeah. >> I don't think we want to. To me, I think it's complicated to become a JPE and have people join on than try to get everybody in the beginning because I think it makes more sense. The the process of adding people is going to get more challenging. I think it's just going to be easier if we have a group of people at the beginning >> and also we have to rewrite theou. >> Oh, probably. Yeah. I I but I again this is I think if we want to do the things that we were talking about doing this seems like a reasonable strategy to me. I think there's more power in more communities joined together. I mean I think that's why community power of New Hampshire works. It's like a statewide thing you know. So if we can get and there's so I mean I think there are a lot of communities especially I you know I'm now connected or well I've been connected with the New England Municipal Sustainability Network which is New Englandwide so it's regional but there's a lot of Massachusetts communities involved in that group. So there's already some connection and and uh access to other communities that are sort of already doing the kind of work we're doing and want to do the work we're doing. So there might be if if we can flush this out in a way that becomes more solidified. Um, and I know I I know we've spent a lot of time on talking about how we might want this to to look and basing it on other models, but I think the important piece is if we're going to work with other communities and if we want this to be bigger, I think there has to be more conversations. Like even our conversation today about a press release was complicated. There's different viewpoints. So, I think to bring other communities in and to do this bigger thing, I just think there's going to be nuances that we're not aware of right now that might be relevant as we sort of talk about forming this bigger thing that whatever it becomes. Adele first and then you Darcy and then you Ben if you had your hand up. >> Um, Darcy is next. >> Okay. I've I've already said what I had to say. >> Okay. I thought your hand went up again. Go ahead. Just um to give a little historical perspective, one of the reasons why there was a decision made at one point to remain the initial three communities because of the fact that we wanted to be able to be have control over the joint powers entity language. And then our thought was bring bring in other communities after that because we would have sort of set the criteria that we wanted as far as you know uh working on environmental issues. Um and because you know cost reduction is obviously attractive to any community. So um and if you read the original JPE that we wrote a few years back, you know, there were processes set up for how how communities would join, what they would have to pay and agree to and there was a there's a whole process in there. So just you might want to take a look at that. I think part of the thing about the processes and and the payment um first of all would will have changed by now. >> Oh yeah. I think you know I think that was the reason that that became the the big sticking point for us is that we didn't have it exactly uh because it at one point we were maybe ready to move forward with signing and it sort of stopped because it wasn't defined properly or enough. um it had to be more explicit to the to the exact amounts and so that was a challenge for us at that time from one of the communities. So I think you know I I think all of that is still there and that may still work but I personally don't see the benefit in just being the three of us any longer. I I think especially if we want to launch this I'm not so worried about controlling the narrative or what it is. I think we're very clear about what we want this to be and if people want to join, then they're on board with what we're trying to do. So, you know, if we want to bring people in, I think advocating for the environmental attributes of what this would be is its, you know, its primary focus. And I think that will be attractive to many communities that are already thinking along these lines. I don't think, you know, we're not the only ones trying to do something, right? So, I think there's plenty of communities that are going to want to join us, and I don't think they're going to be in it only to get a better price. Some might, but I don't I think a lot of them will get the reasoning behind it. >> And and Darcy, just to speak for myself, um I was greatly affected by the presentation from Henry in terms of my thinking about this um and realizing the scale uh you know, what difference a larger scale could make. Now, um, you know, maybe that's maybe it's wrong. Maybe the way we decided to do it, create the JPE and see if we could then invite others in is the way to go. Uh, but I kind of I kind of move my thinking after hearing what Henry had to offer. And a lot of what they do um or and are doing um is based on the scale that they have. I mean, it's incredible. Um and you know so anyway that's just just to say that um the commitment is still there. the thinking about how to go about it was affected by this presentation and I'm anxious to hear a followup with this other person who I don't know uh Sam um I'm I'm anxious to hear more about that and to test that thinking you know do we do it this way first or do we do it this way first which which is the better strategy that anyway >> I I think um I I agree with Bob and I think that this idea of testing what it does seem to be the benefit of scale. So just if you think about it um if we're this little union and we're asking people to join us we have to demonstrate the benefit to them first before we become attractive. Whereas if we're saying come be part of something with us, right, and create something, they have to be invested in the idea of making something work and be attractive as opposed to waiting, you know. Um it it so um you know and there are certain things where scale is going to make a big difference like let's say we were able to somehow finance or you know become the the offtaker for a a utility scale solar uh project. Um but that price actually wasn't super beneficial. In other words, it wasn't better than what we can get from the uh the from First Point or whatever, you know, whatever company. If we spread that out across a much bigger group of people, we're still creating this project. We're adding to the renewables on the grid, but we're spreading the cost so that basically nobody notices that we're paying a tiny little fraction more to get this one, right? and then you generate more capability and maybe the next one's actually developed at a lower cost. >> I think people will also I mean just having the community power of New Hampshire model available to to people is um an incentive in and of itself, you know. Um yeah that that um presentation was >> pretty remarkable and yeah it was very eye openening. I think what I said before was it was both inspiring and daunting and I still feel that way. So um so I think you know um it'll be very interesting. I'm really really looking forward to meeting with Samuel and hearing uh what he has to say and what he thinks and >> um you know especially being a main architect of what happened in New Hampshire. That's pretty wild. I'm curious why it happened in New Hampshire and not here and maybe they were just more situated to be able to do that at that time. I don't know. It's interesting. So, >> okay. >> Um, okay. Um, I don't have any other valley green energy updates. Um, those were it. Uh, are there any LEA updates? >> I have a question about LEA uh about Valley Green Energy. Uh, how long is the contract for? >> Two years. A >> two-year contract. Okay. And um I've been wondering maybe this is a a very basic question but um it would be really uh interesting to get more of a uh an idea of where all the power is coming from. like it would be really nice to know specifically, you know, if we have x% of renewables, where is it coming from? Um, sort of like the way ISO New England will show people the mix that day of where we're getting all our energy from. So, >> so reality though is what ISO New England is showing you is what where your energy is coming from. that that's that is where it's coming from. Whatever whatever it is that day or that hour, that's the reality of of where it's coming from. >> So we And is that does that amount to 30% renewables? um on average over an entire year. >> And if we're if we are telling people in our group that they're getting 100% renewable, do we have a higher percent in what we're getting? >> No. >> No. It's it's problem because wrecks are an accounting fiction that allow the creation of a market that when things were working right incentivize uh um developers to develop more renewable energy so that because they can get the value of those racks. But moment to moment, the electricity grid is putting out whatever it's putting out. And that price is set on a 5minute auction and a day ahead auction. And natural gas drives that unfortunately. Um and but like solar energy is available when it's available. Wind energy is available when it's available. And you can't choose to get all of you know to suck all of it from one place. It's just in the grid and you get what you get. So yeah, the Rex when we tell people they're getting 100% renewable energy, I mean technically it's a lie, right? Technically you plug in, you get whatever's on the grid. What you're saying is that I am taking I'm participating in the market for the renewable attributes of that power generation and I am taking those attributes off the market. And because there's a regulatory demand for those attributes in the forms of of Rex, somebody else should have the incentive to build more renewable energy to be able to sell Rex into that market that by buying it I raised the price of it. So do we know what do we have a picture of in Massachusetts for example what facilities create renewable energy? Yes. >> Where are the class A facilities? You know what do we have that? >> There is a map. You can go um look on a map. I haven't checked recently if EIA keeps it up or maybe they've took taken it down because they don't like it. Um but there are a variety of maps where you can go and look in your region and ISO New England has quite a bit um where you can actually look at specific power generators. GE geographically and you can find out what they are. Um at any given time any one any of them or you know some selection of them are putting energy onto the grid often depending on what the clearing price was for that five minutes. >> It's really it's really clear isn't it Darcy? >> Yeah. And that was a really good explanation. >> Yes. Yes. It's the first I think I've heard. >> H Thank you. Thank you, Ben. Yeah. I'm looking forward to the day that we can just directly get our local energy from a local source. >> I mean, probably you and I are not going to be alive for that. Um, and it wouldn't necessarily be desirable because it would be so much more expensive. We I think that we will live to see to see a grid that is so dominated by renewables that it is renewable energy, but to make it cheap, some of it's going to be coming from much farther away. In fact, the more we have transmission, the more renewable energy we can have. if you know now that we have transmission uh to Canada before the tariffs um we uh we have a reasonable plan we're not doing it but if we were to build more of that offshore wind right because that's our big opportunity here on the east coast we built more offshore wind the stuff that was planned but has now been cancelled um when it's super windy we could actually be taking electricity and sending it to Canada for the purpose of taking the pumps and filling the reservoirs, pumping water uphill and storing it. And then when we have a demand, the wind has stopped blowing and we have a demand, they actually produce hydropower using our stored energy. They become a a giant battery basically for the entire New England and Quebec region. Right. So the more transition we have, the more easily we can integrate renewables from all over the place. So I'm I'm not sure that localess doesn't make it cheaper or greener. It just kind of makes it more expensive and slows it down. >> Yeah. But that's what we need to be more resilient, you know, like that's a separate thing. >> Well, that's a very >> micro grids. Yeah. And so I mean so that's the other thing is is to the degree that we can develop micro grids right or even islandable grid segments um neighborhoods can survive and again those don't have to be driving all of the functions at the highest power everywhere all the time. Right. So you can have a resilient grid that is basically batteries plus solar, right? And and a distribution system um also at a lower price if you don't demand that it does everything. >> Yeah. >> Once again, so clear. Well, and there has to be, you know, I mean, as much as we talk about having local micro grids, there's also real push back right now about technology. Um, you know, there's fears around technology, >> around battery storage especially. So, you know, there are some barriers too that I think require a lot more education as well. >> One of those things I this is one of the >> Yeah. >> I don't know the way I perceive it to be is that you know part of the problem is and someone said this to me and I agree that sometimes we have technology develop and it happens so fast that the regulatory process doesn't necessarily keep up with the technology and then there's problems but then they create mistrust. um in the technology even though that's not necessarily founded. But now there's this mistrust and it becomes this sort of quagmire of um challenging public opinion to adopting the technology and then it becomes also easy to um create misinformation about the technology and also demonize the technology as just a problem. Um which is how I'm seeing it's going on battery storage. Um, and we just have to sort of rein it in and sort of really have more reasonable conversations about the technology. I think the regulatory part is good. I think it's needed. Um, so I I think that's a good thing. Um, but it unfortunately now I think there's a lot of misinformation that needs to be debunked and a lot of education that needs to happen in order to be able to do this kind of micro grid placement. because I think it's going to be a challenge when you say to someone in their neighborhood, we want to put a solar battery storage, you know, in that big field be, you know, behind you. Um, there's a lot of push back on that kind of thing development. So anyway, but I think it's all this is all good work. I think trying to stay positive and I think um you know I I think also with this effort it's slow but I think we'll get there. I mean we didn't even think we'd have an aggregation at one point. So you know I think eventually we'll get moving in the direction we want to. It may take some time but I think we also want to do it right and I think we want to do it successfully and scalable. So, you know, I think it's really um exciting that Henry, you know, came across our path and we can have this conversation with Samuel. I think it'll be enlightening if nothing else. >> Okay. Is there anything to Stephanie? >> Sorry. >> Is there anything else we need to do at this meeting? >> No, I don't think so. That was my my last cheerleading bit of of my diet tribe there. So, um, no, I don't think there's anything else we do. Let me just see if there's public. There is not any public for public comment. Um, next agenda will maybe be Samuel. If not, um, maybe just updates. It might be a shorter meeting if we don't have Samuel. Um, might just be a quick one. So, I think the next one is in October. I think I wanted to say the 22nd. Sorry, just give me one second here. October. Yes, it's Thursday, October 22nd at 1 PM. So, um, until then, if if anyone does think of an agenda item, just send it to me. >> Thank you all so much for your time. >> Thanks a lot, guys. Bye. >> Bye.