This Pastor Wants ONLY Christians in Power | PBD Podcast #846

This is the last shining beacon, the city on a hill of freedom. If we lose America, where are we going to go? Okay, so you said you want power. What do you want to do with that power? We do not have to wait for the next George Whitfield or Jonathan Edwards to change before we're allowed to have common sense policy. How do you get that level? What I can do is I can influence people and one of them one day by the grace of [music] God might be president. You're trying to use that same strategy of a minority idea to get to majority of Americans. >> You want to talk about who has an uncontested victory? It's the ideology of liberalism. My memory goes back more than just 15 minutes ago. I remember 2020 through 2024. Those were dark times. >> Say, "Do not worry." >> You've also made some comments about >> interracial marriage. >> Interracial marriage. Tell me about that. Every single relational arrangement you could possibly even conceive [music] of is represented immediately except for the one that produces white kids. I think they want less white people. Is there anybody you wouldn't accept to come to your church? >> Mainly black people. Just kidding. What's your position on Catholicism? I know my Catholic listeners will hear this. They'll be like, "Oh, that's so insufferable and you're being so gay." Catholics say, "Stop being gay." Maybe that's a compliment from them. God in heaven wrote a book and that book is true whether Joel Webb was ever born or not. [music] >> Divorce is a wealth killer. And that's not even the topic of discussion today. We're not even talking about that. But I like anybody that has four plus kids. You got five with the sixth on the way. Four girls, one boy, and you're going to find out what the sixth is. >> Yes, sir. >> God bless you guys and your family. Joel, >> uh I asked some friends yesterday who are pastors. I said, what do you think about Joel? Let me tell you. No, it's like, let me tell you, good communicator, but some of the stuff he says is divisive. What do you think about Joel? I actually like some of the stuff he talks about. Really? Yes. I think I think we need to talk about some of these topics. I said, great. He's going to be on the podcast. Fantastic. So Joel, for the audience that doesn't know you, you know, why don't you share a little bit about your background as well as what your core beliefs are that gets you in trouble sometimes. >> Sure. Yeah. Well, first, thanks for having me. Really appreciate it. Honor. >> Um, yeah. So, I I just turned 40 years old and I feel it in my bones. I feel like I'm Do you really? >> I feel like I'm getting older. Yeah. Um, so I' I've actually made some changes. I uh by God's grace in the last few months I lost 30 pounds and so like really so I in some ways I feel better because I'm more disciplined but I just recognize none of it comes it's no it's no longer the default setting I got to work so uh that's all right but um so I'm I'm married my wife uh Megan is uh other than Jesus Christ she's the greatest blessing that I've received in this life she has given to me five kids and a six is in the oven still baking and so we're excited about that I was adopted as a baby uh never met my biological parents. Um, so I, you know, my my biological father, all I know about him is, you know, it was a hit and run. So I, I come from, uh, >> Mom or dad, not met mom or dad. >> No, haven't met either of them. I think I think the birth mom, I mean, she obviously she didn't abort me. She she wanted me to live. She uh, wanted Christians to adopt me. I'm super grateful for that. So, I think she's a good woman. I think in her mind it was probably just um not wanting to interfere, not wanting to confuse me, wanting, you know, and I I kind of appreciate that because I don't I don't want two families. Like I have a mom and dad. I've known them my whole life. They're the ones that raised me. They're the ones that that have loved me. So I'm kind of grateful for her choice to obviously love me enough to give me up to ensure that, you know, good good family would adopt me, but then also back away. I bet that was probably hard for her. And so I'm grateful for that. Um, but my my dad, he was a pastor my whole life. So raised as a PK, uh, pastor's kid in the charismatic church. So my dad, he was never like crazy charismatic, you know. Um, think of like Benny Hinn, you know, knocking people with your jacket and they're falling over, you know. So >> he wasn't that gifted. >> He he Yeah, he he didn't have that anointing. >> That's a special gift. >> That's a special anointing he never had. Um but uh but anyways but he was a reason I would say like a reasonable charismatic love the Bible taught me the Bible great father. Um my mom and dad are actually members in my church. Um they you know every Sunday evening we do like game night they come over read to the grandkids and then me and my wife and them we stay up play board games. So uh really close to my family grateful for that. Raised charismatic. Uh shifted my theology in college became more uh reformed Protestant. um began to be turned on by guys like uh Martin Luther, John Calvin, Jonathan Edwards um in in that vein and um and so theological transitions happened in my 20s and continued to happen but a lot of them in my 20s but then cultural and political uh transitions happened in my 30s uh where I began to just look at our country and realize it's it's never anything less than the Lord Jesus Christ reformation like we need revival. It's revival or bust. We need hearts and minds changed by the power of the Holy Spirit through the preaching of the gospel, the great commission to go and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the father, the son, and the holy spirit. Um it's it's preaching Christ, him crucified, his life, death, resurrection. It's nothing less than that. And that's one of the biggest, you ask me like the controversies. One of the biggest criticisms I get is you've moved on from the gospel. You um you're it's not less than the gospel, but but this is what I realized in my 30s is I realized you don't have to have God may do it and I pray that he does. Um I you have to wear different hats. You have to think in categories. So as a as a father, as a husband, as a pastor, I'm doing the work of an evangelist. I I'm I'm seeking to make disciples. I'm preaching word and administering sacrament on the Lord's day. That's what I do in that realm as a pastor in the church. But here's the deal. I hope that God sends revival. I hope that 50% of the population of America plus one becomes regenerate and born again by the spirit. Um but the mentality that so many Christians, well-meaning Christians have that that is an absolute prerequisite in order to have a country, a functioning country, I think that premise is wrong. uh Japan is not 50% plus one regenerate Christians and yet they still have some semblance of order. They they still they have a country. So they're actually policies that can be implemented. And the thing that honestly convinced me is looking at the enemy's playbook. So when I think of LGBT elemento mafia um you know the the uh the rainbow jihad when I when I look at them and their tactics they took they it's not like they started with 75% of the population. They started with 3% of the population and in 40 years with a wellorganized minority were able to replace the American flag with a rainbow. Highly successful. Highly successful with a minority. What that proves, what Democrats have proved time and time and time again is that you don't actually have to have a majority in order to implement ideas. Okay. So, go a little bit deeper there. So, because of that, you're thinking you're trying to use that same strategy of a minority idea to get to majority of Americans. >> Yeah. I I want power. Oh, that's terrible. That's like power is not a vice. Neither is it a virtue. Power is a tool. >> You want power. >> Yeah. A hammer can build a house or it can crush a man's skull. Okay, >> power is not inherently evil or righteous. Sure, it's a tool. It depends who wields it. Is it for the glory of God and the good of his people? Or is it with evil sinister intentions? Um I and when I say I, more broadly, not just me, but I I want Christians who love the Lord Jesus Christ to have power. And I think Christians have opted out of politics. They've opted out of culture. They've opted out of wealth. They've opted out of business. They they've opted out of all these realms of power because they've been they've been convinced that power is icky and and so in order to be spiritually pure um and and to have a clear conscience before the Lord, not objectively but subjectively because they've been deceived, they actually think that they're doing a service to God by opting away from the halls of power. Part of this is their esquetology, right? That's a doctrine of the end times because of dispensationalism, pre uh premillennial dispensationalism. If Jesus is coming back next Thursday, then what's the point in running for office? What's the point in storing up generational wealth? But the Bible teaches a good man leaves an inheritance not only for his kids but his grandkids. Um so I I think all that back to what I was saying just a moment ago. Um, I think that yes, we want the majority of the population to be genuinely Christians because I I don't just want a temporal blessing for my fellow Americans, but I want their eternal blessing. I I don't want them just to have 80 years of prosperity and peace and then go to hell. So, yet it's never less than the gospel. Um, but it must be more than just the gospel. And and it's not all intertwined. We we have to think in categories. to the church as a private Christian man sharing the gospel with my neighbor um as a pastor preaching the gospel from the pulpit but but I'm not only a pastor I'm nevertheless but I'm not only a pastor so I I'm also a citizen of the United States with a political obligation and in that realm I'm still a Christian that follows me wherever I am but a Christian in politics is different than a Christian in the pulpit and so uh when I'm thinking politically when I'm thinking culturally nationally I I want to fully recognize and convince other Christians that we do not have to wait. Maybe God sends revival, but we do not have to wait for the next George Whitfield or Jonathan Edwards to change half of the country's hearts and minds before we're allowed to have common sense policy before we're like, we don't have to have the whole country born again in order to say, "Hey, you know what? [snorts] We probably shouldn't import half of Haiti. That's just like Japan is not Christian but they know not to do that. Japan can just think the light of nature. We we've God has spoken. He's written two books. We have revealed God's revealed will in scripture special revelation. But then we also have the light of nature. We have general or natural revelation. And that's why non-Christian people al although at the level of the heart um there's a hostility towards God. Romans 8 says that but um but outwardly in terms of their actions, behaviors, and even speech, they can a non-Christian can uh can can innovate. They they can find a cure for cancer. They can do build a suspension bridge. They can do incredible things because they're made in the image of God. So Japan, not being Christian, can still somehow have a functional country with common sense because they're rational beings, human beings made in the image of God. And so I want Christians in America to recognize look it's both and it's not either or it's both and as as Christians in the church in that category preach the gospel do the work of an evangelist make disciples but also as still Christians but Christians as citizens of these United States. Let's think strategically. Let's be political. We don't have to wait on a move of the spirit in order to pass common sense legislation. >> Okay. So you said you want power. What do you want to do with that power? >> I want Christian. Do you want to use that power? >> I want Christian laws >> such as >> um well I mean I have my I have my wish list. >> Tell us >> my top tier. Um I think there should be blasphemy laws. So free speech um I think that free speech is wonderful and terrible at the same time both. Um absolute free speech I don't believe was the uh the real intention of the founders. Right. If we're going to get back to the Constitution as a set document, you have to get back to authoral intent. And even looking at the First Amendment, you have to read it in the context of those who wrote it. The way that they perceived what they were writing at the time that it was written. Uh the idea of absolute free speech that you can say um that you can blaspheme the Lord Jesus Christ publicly. And >> is your main concern blasphemy of Lord Jesus Christ? That's your >> Yes. >> So you're okay if I say the N word? uh the inward should not have um laws against it. >> So meaning me personally I don't use that word. >> No no I know you don't but you don't have a so you're the the specific part about blasphemy to you is if I say God >> you have a problem with that if I say anything about Okay. Well and if I can explain that real quick here here's a simple explanation. There should be a distinction because the Bible makes a distinction between sins and crimes. So, you get plastered drunk in your home and at 3:00 a.m. you're, you know, dancing in your living room listening to, you know, some degenerate rap naked. That's a sin. >> It's a pretty good weekend for some people. >> Yeah. Oh, maybe. Maybe. But that's a sin. Yeah. >> It's not a crime. So, I don't want a police state. So, I I I don't want um coveting, right, is the 10th commandment. Thou shalt not covet. That's a sin. Uh but even the Old Testament, Old Covenant Israel, it was a sin. and it was never a crime. When is coveting punished by the state? Well, it's actually a simple answer. Coveting uh shifts from the realm of mere sin into the realm of being both sin and crime. The moment that coveting overflows into theft, murder, I covet and therefore I'm acting upon it and stealing or I I covet, you have something I want and I'm now going to act on it with murder and I'm going to kill you and take it. Well, now it's a crime. So, same kind of thing. So idolatry, the first commandment, have no other gods before me. I I don't want a police state that's going into people's private homes and rounding them up for not being Christians, right? Whether it be Muslims or Jews or or whatever. At the same time, um outside of Houston, in my home state, there is a 90 foot tall abomination, a Hindu statue. I I think that that that should actually be a crime. It should not be allowed in America. Why? Because we love America and we want it to be blessed. And God does not bless public um overt displays of idolatry. >> This guy right here. >> Yeah, that's it. >> And that's right outside of Houston. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. So, what what would you want to see the punishment of blasphemy be if you had the power? >> Yeah. So, biblically, um, this is really important for people to understand because a lot of, you know, your Reddit atheist, you know, is going to be like, well, the Bible says, you know, uh, and they don't understand the Bible. They don't understand the Bible. So, first, biblical law in the Old Testament breaks up into three categories. There's the moral law, which is binding and immutable. Immutable means unchanging, right? So, it was wrong to murder in the Old Testament. It's still wrong to murder today. Uh, God is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Uh, behold, I'm the Lord. I changeth not. so that you the sons of Jacob are not consumed. So uh moral law of God immutable. Then uh the second category there are ceremonial laws, hand washings, animal sacrifice, robes and tassels in the temple, these kinds of things. Uh ceremonial um cleanliness. Uh this is a type and shadow that was meant to uh point forward um as a precursor, a symbol to the true substance which is fulfilled in Christ. Right? So all these things about washings and and the lamb that is slain, the the burnt bull offerings, all this is pointing towards Jesus because Jesus has come. We no longer do these things. And it's not because we're lax. It's because we're no longer supposed to do these things. They pointed towards Christ. So ceremonial law in the Old Testament. I don't want to bring that back. I think that it would be wrong, actually immoral to bring it back because it would actually make a statement that that we view the the perfect sacrifice of Christ as insufficient. Right? He's the lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. Slain once for the world. And God the father saw that and said it. I am satisfied. It's enough. So ceremonial law that's done. Moral law that's immutable, unchanging. It's still uh in play. Last one is civil law, right? You got to have a parapit, right? A border around the roof of your house in Israel. Um why? Well, it's contextual. They they don't have HVAC, right? Summer months, it's hot. They're sleeping on the roof outside. Well, we don't do that. Um, so I don't think that that we should have police, you know, going and finding people for not having a border around the roof of their house. But here's the deal. When it comes to the civil laws, um, those are particular to Israel. So they're not they shouldn't be uh, picked up and dropped wholesale on America in the year of our Lord 2026 1:1 ratio. Um, but what's the general equity, right? You're reading Asop's fables and you're what's the moral of the story, right? And you're teaching that to your kids. There's there's a a a an undergirling moral principle that's transcendent. Well, what's the moral of the principle of a border around your roof? Uh the the preservation of uh and the dignity of of human life. Okay. So, we don't do the parapit around the roof, but we have speed limits because we have motorized vehicles. We have seat belts. We have I think that's an appropriate application. Right. So, three different branches of law. Moral, that's eternal, immutable, binding, forever. Um then you have civil. The civil you have to do not a one step but a two-step. The civil you got to say well what's the general equity the the the overarching moral principle within this civil code and find that and then apply it with prudence and wisdom to your context your culture today and then the ceremonial has all been fulfilled in Christ. So what do I think the appropriate uh punishment should be? All that being said about the Old Testament, when you look at not just the laws in the Old Testament, but the penalties, I believe that the only sin, which is also a crime, sin and crime that must be that mandates capital punishment, the death penalty, um, is murder. The Noic covenant, Genesis chapter 9, if you take a man's life, you forfeit your own. That one mandates, God says you must put that man to death who commits murder. Um, there's a ton of other ones like breaking the Sabbath, and you'll see the penalty listed is capital punishment, but I but not mandated. So, I see it as um all these other uh crimes, lower crimes than than murder listed in the Old Testament that mention capital punishment, some of them do, some of them don't, but me mention capital punishment as a penalty. I see that as uh not mandated, but permissible as a um it's the highest penalty that could be inflicted. So, like in the state of Texas, you'll see signs, don't mess with Texas, which by the way, Texas has fallen. You can absolutely mess with Texas. But don't mess with Texas. If you litter, it can be punished up to whatever, you know, two years in jail or a $5,000. I don't know anybody doing hard time for throwing a Coke bottle out the window. I don't I don't have any friends, never known anyone in my entire life, 40 years of living, who currently right now is in prison for throwing a an empty bag of Cheetos out the car. Right. So, it's it's a maximum penalty. It could be legally um implemented, but but it's a maximum. It doesn't it's not that it must be. So, all that back to blasphemy. Uh somebody is in a movie theater and says Jesus, you know, like in some scary part of the movie and they they take the Lord's name in vain. I believe that's a sin. Um I don't think that that should be punished. The Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence. Having some guy paint himself with fake blood pretending to hang on a cross while women dressed as nuns are gyrating in front of him on the street in front of children. Yeah, you go to jail. Absolutely. >> Jail is what the punishment is. >> I I think that that should be the pun either a steep fine or jail. >> So, I'd like to go through the next few fairly quickly if you're able to. So, >> first one, blasphemy laws. Got it. Using Lord's name in vain. Beautiful. the way you broke it down. Moral law, ceremonial law, civil law. If you had power, what else would you want to do with it? Um, so there's ten commandments that's broken up into two categories. First and second table of the law. The first four of the ten commandments deals with our obligation to the Lord. Um, Jesus boils this down as summary law as the first and greatest commandment. Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind. Well, how do we love the Lord our God with all our heart, soul, mind, and strength? Four ways. have no other gods before me. Uh uh do not make any graven images. Don't take the Lord's name in vain and remember the Sabbath and keep it holy. Um so in that regard um with with that first one, have no other gods before me. Obviously uh John Calvin said that the heart is an idol making factory at the level of the heart uh inward sin. We are constantly producing idols that we trust and treasure more than Christ all the time. myself most most certainly included. There are are constantly moments where instead of trusting in Christ, I'm hoping and banking on something else and I have to repent of that. Lord, the Holy Spirit convicts me. I'm sorry. Lord, help me to trust in Christ and him alone and not just in a retirement account or or whatever it is, right? So, that happens all the time. That's sin, but that's not a crime. Um, one of the ways to determine the distinction between sins and crimes is private versus public. private versus. So you're drunk at home. Okay, that's one thing. You're drunk behind the wheel of a car, that's another, right? You say Jesus Christ in vain at home, that's one thing. Um, sisters of perpetual indulgence in a parade public, that's another, right? So the Sabbath, uh, somebody at home is sweeping the floor. I'm not going to I'm not going to get autistic, right? I'm not going to like, well, actually, you should go to jail. Like, I'm not I'm People think I'm crazy. I'm I'm extreme. I'm actually I think a a reasonable moderate is what I how I would describe myself. So no, that that person should not be penalized. It's not a crime. Um but the fact that every business in America in the public square is open on Sunday um that that actually incentivizes the citizens of our country to forego church mandated church attendance. No. But economically setting the conditions that are more conducive to church attendance. Yes, I think that that would be positive. So that's in the first category, our obligation to the Lord, the first four commandments. That that's what I would do. Um and then graven images like the Hindu statue, things like that. Um and then the second table of law, love your neighbor as yourself. That's commandments 5 through 10. Honor thy father and mother. Do not murder. Do not commit adultery. So adultery, I'll use that one. Um I think that adultery is not only a sin. I think it should be a crime. And I don't know if you know this about me, but I, you know, one of the things that always comes up online, so everybody knows. I have no problem saying it. It's public information at this point. Um, but I, you know, when when I was first trying to plant a church in California, I was 23 years old. Uh, absolutely stupid and uh and had no business trying to plant a church. I was a laren wannabe, you know, church planter. Um, the reality is at that time I was leading a glorified Bible study for about 25, 30 people, all of them single, all of them in their 20s, and I was single in my 20s. Um, on Sunday evenings, pretty much everybody went to an established church in the morning and then came to us as like a supplemental singles ministry. Um, I dated a girl. I slept with that girl. That's sin. But it wasn't adultery. And I'm not saying that to make light. I'm saying it to make a point. Um, that sin is a serious sin. It nailed Jesus to the cross. I would There's only two ways to deal with that sin. Me in hell forever under the wrath of God. And it would be just or Jesus taking the wrath of God, drinking the cup, the full cup as my substitute in my place for that sin. So that I'm not making light of that sin. I'm simply saying that um it is still objectively true. There's a distinction between fornication, that would be the biblical label for sex outside of marriage, versus adultery in these United States, right? I'm not like, it's not like I'm saying we got to get back to the 400s, you know? We got to get back to Constantine. I like Constantine, but I'm not even saying that. I'm saying no. This is not just uh true as it pertains to Christian history. It's true as it pertains to American history. there were penalties for adultery. Um, no fault divorce and the fact that you can cheat on your spouse and having cheated on your spouse, you can then divorce the spouse. The cheater can then divorce their spouse and in a court of law get half of the stuff or even the majority. That that is not just sinful. I think it's criminal. You commit adultery. I'm not saying you should be put to death. The Bible lists that as a again maximum penalty. I don't think the Bible says it must be applied. But if someone commits adultery, I would say that that is actually not only a sin but a crime. And what it does according to the words of Christ is it doesn't mandate that the uh offended party um uh has to divorce. But they can divorce if they choose to or they can also try to work it out by the power of God and the grace of the gospel. But but they can divorce. They can do so with a clear conscience before the Lord. It's not sin. And and legally the court should say you're choosing to press charges. You're choosing to divorce. Your spouse committed adultery. It's been proven, right? Not just I have a feeling, but proven. It's not just the wife goes to sleep. I dreamed that you cheated on me. No, we don't do that. This was proven in a court of law. Two or three witnesses. Um, okay. Uh, you can divorce because that's not no fault. There's a fault. And you get everything. That dude or that chick destitute. You get the kids, you get the house. you I what would that do right so I'm always thinking of like not just what's right in the sight of God but also um when God says something is moral or right it's not arbitrary it's not capricious the right thing is designated as right by the Lord because it's also the good thing that brings about the most blessing what would it do for our country to get rid of no fault divorce and to actually have you get more of what you incentivize you get uh less of what you criminalize right what would it do for the country to say, um, we're going to incentivize marital faithfulness and penalize adultery. How many kids would not grow up in broken homes? How many, like, how would that not be good? That's not a crazy position. I don't think it's a crazy position. So, okay, I'm tracking with everything you're saying so far. Uh, you've also made some comments about um that if if I were to say the ones that got you in trouble the most. Trying to see which one it was. Something about >> interracial marriage. Interracial marriage. Tell me about that. Tell me why your challenges with interracial marriage. >> Yeah. So, this is what happened. This is the the lore, the story. Um, there's a woman. All right. That's how every uh every story starts. Um, there's a woman. Uh, that's how the book of Genesis starts. There was a woman. Um, [laughter] anyways, all right. The point is there's a woman who kind of incessantly follows me online. She's got like 80,000 followers, something like that. So, it's it's not just like, you know, somebody with 47 followers or whatever. And and she kind of um I would say, you know, couple times a week lately she I think she's backed off and I praise God for that. I hope I'm not stirring it up again. God bless her. I I I don't have ill will towards her. I don't hate her or anything like that. Um I think she's a Christian. I think she's confused about some things. Uh but I but anyways, so she's just kind of pestering me. Anything I say, you know, she's repo retweeting it and saying, you know, Joel's terrible and this is bad for this reason or whatever. Um so there's another guy he posts u under Christian nationalism. This is the post uh interracial marriage will be punishable by death. I do not post that. I don't believe that. Some other guy posts that has nothing to do with me. I've never spoken to this guy. I don't know this guy. I'm not going to name him because I I don't I don't want to do the performative denouncements. I don't I don't think that's helpful. But he posts this and then somebody retweets him, a pastor, and says, "Elon Musk, uh, can you make an exception on this one post and show us who likes it?" Because it's Twitter after all. So that post gets thousands of likes. Thousands of people come out and like this, you know, provocative extreme post. And and so this pastor, another guy, he says, "Elon, show us who like this post." And then this woman back to her, she comments and says, "Uh, well, for sure Joel Webb." And I just, you know, I probably let her get the the better of me. I probably should just left it alone. But in a moment of weakness, despite my better judgment, I'm like, "That's it. This woman's been pestering me for about two years at that point." And so I come out and I say, "Nope." Just one word. Nope. I didn't like it. I don't agree with that. And then so then she responds and says tell us right now are you for only a false dichotomy in my opinion and I shouldn't it's a trap and I fell for and that's on me but she says are you for or against only two options for that is encouraging promoting that's how I read that or against right discouraging interracial marriage and so I give a long write up now I started I I started pretty snarky and so a lot of people didn't even get past my first sentence. Again, that's on me. I say I I I started by saying, um, this is a perfect example of why the average woman on social media is I think that's how I started. >> Now, I actually stand by that, but I don't think I should have written it. And just to clarify that, I don't believe the average woman is The average woman on social media, and I'm not talking about your grandma with, you know, 60 uh followers on Facebook who's just, you know, keeping up with pictures of the grandkids. When I say on social media, what I meant by that, I could have done a better job or just left it out uh clarifying, but I mean like the woman who's very clearly trying to be a social media influencer. I think the average woman who's trying to be an influencer online is All of them? No. The average one? Yeah, I I stand by that statement. So, that's how I started. Not the best start because that, you know, just immediately turned people soured them against me and and I did that. That's me. Um but then I go on and actually actually very clearly and reasonably articulate my position and and I say this verbatim. Um I said interracial marriage, although biblically permissible. That means it's not a crime. And not only is it not a crime, certainly not a crime punishable by death, it's also not a sin. Biblically speaking, church history for 2,000 years and the scripture itself most importantly has has made it clear that interracial marriage is not a crime. Certainly not a capital crime and it's not even a sin. So interracial marriage comma although biblically permissible comma ordinarily and this is what I say ordinarily goes against God's uh normative regular I use those kind of words um plan design for nations peoples and cultures. In other words, I actually like the book of Revelation that says that the final state of the redeemed in heaven will be every tribe, tongue, and nation. Heaven will be diverse. I think that's good, right? Because if I live next to a bunch of black people in heaven, well, the black people in heaven won't be trying to steal my kids bikes, right? These are redeemed black people. It's heaven. There is no more sin. >> It's great. It's great. I I I look forward to meeting my brothers and sisters from the Sudan or from Ghana or in heaven. In heaven, however, >> not on earth. >> Well, some of them, sure, I I wouldn't mind meeting them in their country, but I don't want them all to come and live here, right? I I I believe >> So, what do you do with that? That that's already happened. >> Yeah, it's already happened. >> Yeah. So, so the the challenge then becomes the founding fathers created it in a way where that ended up happening. Whether they pictured that happening or not, they allowed certain people to win elections who maybe allowed for immigration to open up a little bit. So now we're here. >> Your ideas of what you want to do, how do you do that >> when you're already here? Do you go find a small town and live in and grow it, you know, and build it up where it's the way you want it to be? Do you go live in the boonies a little bit away from everybody to have a little bit of privacy and then build it up and build that town around you where you start off because I know like I remember Frisco used to be a smaller town less than 5,000 people. I think in Texas you need 5,000 to be able to make it official to be a city and I think 94 I don't know what the year is but Frisco becomes a city and then today they're at quarter of a million people living there, right? So, do you go build your own Frisco and gradually build it up? Is that kind of >> If you do that and and you work hard and you're successful and God blesses your efforts, then the moment you begin to succeed, then everybody will move there and it's the same problem all over again. >> So, that's what you want to do or no, that's not >> what I'm saying. You move to the boonies or you start your own town. If you're successful, they eventually come. Sauron Sauron, he will always eventually come for the Shire. There won't be a Shire. So, no. And that's that's all the way back to my my first point in in today's episode is um >> blasphemy. >> No. Um power. It has to be real objective political power. It's not enough to just say, "Well, my town's been taken over by Haitians or whatever, and so I guess now we'll move to eventually." There's nowhere else to move. It's America or bust. This is the last This is the the the shining beacon, the city on a hill of of freedom of if we lose America, where are we going to go? Everybody, a lot of people agree with you there. That's not the question. The question is your your ideas of what you believe like Okay. So, if I come to your church this Sunday, how many people will be in church? >> Like how big is my attendance? Yeah. >> Yeah. Like two two to 200 to 250. >> Okay. So let's just say I come to your church this Sunday. What will I see there? Will will it be 100% Caucasian? Would it be okay? But if it was Praise God. >> No. No. There's nothing wrong with I don't really I I but no it's not. >> It's not. Okay. So would the would the idea for you be long-term to impose to have power? So the only way you can really happen when I talked to the president and I told him who has more power billionaires you know these guys that do this is it the congress is it supreme court is it president who he says nobody has more power than president nobody so is that eventually that for you to become a president have power so you can change laws >> I don't think I would ever like here's the deal man pe people are people the most deceitful person in your life is do. So, don't ever believe your own press. You know, you know this. I'm never going to be I I wouldn't win. If I won 1% of the vote, that would be extraordinary. I'm not going to win. I mean, maybe the Overton window continues to shift and things change. Like, I'm I'm not going to count it out. But I you got to be realistic. That's a LAR. So, no, I'm I'm not going to I'm not running for president. >> How do you get that power then? How do you get that level of power? What I can do is I can influence people. So, I'm not going to be president. It's not that I would never run. If I if I thought there was a chance, maybe I would. So, I'm not saying I don't want to be president, but I'm just I'm I'm a realist. Uh, but what I can do what I can do is by the power of God is I can use what whatever influence I have to continue to influence young men and one of them one day by the grace of God might be president. So, so power is there's political power, there's monetary power, there's uh influential power, you know, and and so I'm trying to in whatever ways the Lord has gifted me, steward those gifts faithfully, faithful stewardship to influence as many people as I can in in what I believe the Bible says is the right direction. >> Joe, who do you view as the enemy? Who's the enemy or who are the enemy? >> There are a lot of enemies. >> Great. I want to hear. So, it's it's not as simple as it. So, um Israel is a huge problem. But here's the deal. Like some of these guys like all they can talk about is Israel. I talk about Israel a lot. Um but when Charlie Kirk was murdered, we can't forget it was a bunch of white people and they weren't all Jews. I'm I'm looking at the Tik Tok videos. I'm looking at the physioamy. I'm looking at the noses, the ear, and the ey line. They're not all Jews. Like, let's just be honest. There's a bunch of white people, white is the driven snow, European for 14 generations, mocking, laughing that a man who is a father and a husband is gurgling in a pool of his own blood. They love it. Who who do I see is most likely to literally kill my wife and kids? When we set out to create a shoe that blends comfort, function, [music] and luxury, we had the choice to make it fast. We had the choice to make it cheap. We chose neither. Instead, we chose Tuscan Italy. We chose true [music] Italian craftsmanship. Each pair touched by 50 skilled hands. We chose patience, spending two years perfecting every detail. And we chose the [music] finest quality at every step. Introducing the future looks bright collection. Not rushed, not disposable, not ordinary, rather intentional, luxurious, timeless. The left, liberals, white, black, brown, liberals. So the left is still an enemy. And I am not willing. So my position is a little nuanced. It's different than some of the other America first kind I I would describe myself as America first, but I'm I'm not going to forget. My memory goes back more than just 15 minutes ago. I remember I remember 2020 through 2024. Those were dark times. Dark times. Churches closed. People just all of a sudden you YouTube channel just gone. Your business done. Your grandparents, they die in the hospital alone. You can't even see them. your kids masked that literally speech impediments that still exist today because children's development was set back by years because of the policies and the tyranny. Right? So I didn't I didn't forget that Joe Biden's not Jewish, right? If he was, it'd be easy to just point that's the problem, you know? So one problem is simply the left. It's ide ideological. That said, there also are national enemies. And I do believe that Israel nationally, not just ideology, but as a civilization is opposed to the Christian West. I do believe that. That is that's just historic. You look at the Catholic monarchs of Europe. Yeah. for centuries, for centuries, the diaspora, you know, these these Jews in in various places um have have hated Christ and Christian civilization. I'm not saying it's not every single Stein, right? I you know, but you think you don't think this a little old. You don't think it's getting old? >> Of course, it's getting old. But the question is, is it true? Yeah. >> Okay. So if we go 2,000 years, >> yeah, >> go 1500 years. Who who have Christians had the most issues with war with that's caused us to unite? >> 1400 years absolute slaughter with Muslims. >> Okay, >> that's another enemy. >> But but notice that Israel came before that. Why why do you think it's becoming so popular today? And what I'm starting to realize is like, by the way, that topic Israel broke the Republican party. Oh my god, >> it did. >> And it broke the Republican party because everybody said, "Well, this is what Charlie would have said and here's where he was going." And they started speculating as if they talked to Charlie and he's dead, right? And here's what this person said. Here's what that person said. And then all of a sudden the people that are not that deep into it, they're like, "Oh my god, that's who the enemy is. That's who the enemy And then it just became and so I wonder behind closed doors who's celebrating who's actually sitting there saying, "Oh, I'm so glad we got Joe. He's on our side. Oh, I'm so glad we got XYZ and ABC. Oh, I'm so gl American conservative movement that was super united 23, 24, 22, they are falling apart. We're winning. The West is going to fall, right? They're celebrating." Mhm. >> And then the the messaging was over and over and over again. So, so far your enemies that you're talking about, number one is the left. Great. Number two is Israel. >> Who else would you say is the enemy? >> Real quick, if we're saying number one, number two, I'm not triaging. So, that's that's not a list of priority necessarily. This is the worst. You're just naming them. >> I'm just naming them, right? So, I'm not saying Israel is number two or number one or number three, so on so forth. Uh, but u Muslim Islam Islam is a formidable enemy of the church. The way that I I say it is this. Um, Muslims love a fake Jesus. Muslims are fond of Jesus, but the Jesus that they're fond of is not the Jesus who exists. It's not the Jesus of scripture. He's a prophet. He's on par with Muhammad, but he's not divine. He is not the son of God incarnate. So, Muslims um like when people say, "Well, Muslims actually uh love Jesus." Sure, but but they don't love the real Jesus. So, I would say Muslims love a fake Jesus and will often kill Christians. Every Muslim, no, of course not. Not saying every Muslim is violent, but there are still places, not just for 1400 years in history, but today in the year of our Lord 2026, there are still places where Christians are being killed, not just persecuted, not just canceled off of social media, killed by Muslims. And we cannot in our grievances with Israel, with Judaism, with Jewish supremacy, which are valid and they have to be talked about. I think they have to be talked about. Is it getting old? Sure. But I think part of the reason it's such a big conversation is because nobody talked about it at all. >> I for a very long time. >> At the beginning, I was like, "Wow, this is a real thing. Maybe this is what's going on." And then I see how small the numbers are and I'm like, "Wait a minute. So Qatar is putting $7.7 billion into our universities. They gave Cornell $1.8 billion dollars for what? To >> because they love the school and they went there or because they're trying to win political influence. And then how much is everybody else putting? I said Israel lost the war. If you if you if you're talking about the propaganda race >> Yeah. >> on any leader bulletin, Israel lost. >> Yeah, that's true. >> Israel Tell me one place that Israel won. Nowhere. Tell me, tell me what placesQatar is winning or Qatar is winning. Tell me what places China won. Tell me what places Israel got demolished. >> So either they're not as smart as everybody makes them out to be. Okay. Either they thought they're too smart and they realized putting money into congressmen and senators wasn't the way to go because you got to get the youth and they lost the youth. So they're probably sitting around saying, "Man, we got to change this propaganda plan that we have. Everybody's got propaganda. We got it. China's got it. Everyone's got it. Christians got it. Pastors got it. Business owners got it. We all got it. Everyone's got it. But my god, if if we were to score Israel on their propaganda strategy, it's an F minus, >> right? >> It's an F minus. Sure. So, okay, let me let me there was a moment where I was having a lot of conversations with Muslims and I was bringing them down because I wanted to have a conversation to see what things are we do we have in common with. Where do you see where Muslims and Christians share an enemy aside from Israel? >> Well, it depends because honestly every major world religion including both Christianity and Islam has been liberalized. Liberalism is the reign. You want to talk about who won, who's winning, like who has an uncontested victory. It's it's the ideology of liberalism. And I I describe liberalism as like if it's like a car, the engine is egalitarianism. The heartbeat of liberalism is this this wooden insistent uh it doesn't bend, it doesn't flex, it doesn't it's it's egalitarianism all the way down. All the way down. And so, you know, like if you're a conservative Christian pastor, you're like, "Well, we're not egalitarian. We only have male elders, you know, and we believe the husband, you know, in the in the context of the home should be the head of the wife." Uh, but meanwhile, you're fine with, you know, three-piece pants suit boss babes, you know, leading in political office, you know, and other forms of society. Like, Supreme Court, like, are there some some douchebag guys on the Supreme Court who are going to make terrible? Yes. Uh-huh. But part of the reason uh birthright citizenship um we'll see. But I got a feeling a lot of people have a feeling it probably is going to be upheld. Part of it is going to be because we have four women on the Supreme Court that I don't believe should be there. That's an egalitarian liberal idea. So there's egalitarianism as it pertains to race and sex. Uh that everyone's equal. Every this blank slateism, you can do anything, you can be anyone. um you know not equal outcome but equal opportunity all that's a lie all of it is a lie so that being said back to the question Christians Muslims um there's probably a lot of common ground today between some Christians and some Muslims but not because that common ground is inherent to the actual principles and tenants of the religions of Christianity and Islam but instead the reason why there appears subjectively to be so much overlap is because Both religions have been thoroughly hijacked hijacked by liberalism. Like there's a ton of Muslims that would say, "Well, we're peaceful." And one of the reasons they're peaceful is because they're kind of soft on the Muslim peace and strong on the liberal peace. It's not that they want to be converted to Christianity. >> Interesting point. >> It's not that they want to be converted to Christianity like Iran, right? Iran, you know, it's well, the people want to be li liberated. Yeah. But liberated unto what? Right? Like like God sets us free, right? The truth shall set you free. But uh Christian freedom is not a raw libertarian freedom. Freedom to do whatever you want. It's the it's freedom from bondage to Satan and sin so that you might be liberated unto slavery to Christ, freedom to obedience, freedom to virtue. And that's not what the people in Iran are crying out for. Uh they they they want a modern western liberal freedom. And you know what? So do most Americans. So do most Christians. And they don't even know it. It's like fish swimming in water. How's the water? What's water? You know, we're just swimming in egalitarian slop in in liberal slop. Whether you're a Christian in the West, whether you're the people in Iran, in the east, you know, whatever. And so because of that, sure, there's a lot of common ground we have, but most of the common ground we have, I would reject the very premise of it. I would say that we shouldn't share that in common. It it actually indicates compromise. Yeah. So, do do Muslims becoming more liberal minimize the threat of what Islamists have? Does it minimize the threat long term of what a lot of conservatives fears from Muslims? >> Yeah, I think so. I think it does. >> Right. because that that that does kind of make sense because if liberal Muslims if Iran became liberal uh Christians in Iran would be treated better. So it would be a temporary improvement for the life of a >> Christian. Why why is that? >> Because like so this is where JD uh Hull who's a friend he writes for us with NXR Studios the the media organization that that I'm a part of. He went on Tucker Carlson recently. There was like a 50-second clip. It was a It was like hour hour hour and a half interview. The the whole thing was fantastic. But he said one thing in a 50-second clip. It just that became the the headline of the story is JD Hall's being soft on Islam, you know, and that wasn't his point. That's not what he was trying to say. I know JD Hall. He has been ferocious against all false religions, including Islam, for decades. So, the dude is not soft on Islam. That said, um there's this moment where Tucker is asking a question about has there ever been a time in in in Islamic history where um where they actually have not been beheading every single Christian and destroying every single holy site, you know, Christian holy site and destroying every single church and blah blah blah. And so, you know, JD Hall's just simply trying to answer the question. and he talks about the Ottoman Empire and it's not as though they had no atrocities you know but he's just saying during a in a particular place in a particular season of Muslim history um under the Ottoman Empire you know there was uh a church I believe it was like the church of the holy supplr that uh the Ottoman Empire which was Muslim it was Islamic they you know renovated or restored or helped to fix this Christian holy site a couple of times And I looked it up, you know, and it's like you can get particular. Well, actually technically, but he was generally right, generally correct in that statement. Here's the point. Back to your question. Why is that? Because Islam is inherently friendly to Christians or is it because the Ottoman Empire was actually, believe it or not, even though very old, was a little liberal. And what I mean by that is whether it's a Christian empire or a Muslim empire or a Jewish empire, whatever, the moment that you start to get empirical, what you're trying to do is expand your borders, right? Expand power, degrees of power, influence, which means that you're going to by default have a multicultural and multi-religious plural religious plurality within the banners of your empire. And so you're going to necessarily, if you want to sustain that power, you're going to have to lighten up, loosen your grip a little bit on some of your religious ideology and allow for different religions to kind of coexist so that you can have the empire because you you've kind of sold out for the economic prosperity and the political power. So you you had to make a trade-off, right? That's what politics is. It's tradeoffs. And so you made a trade-off on some of your religious ideology. The Ottoman Empire, which was Islamic, >> was a little softer in one place at one time towards some Christians. That's true. >> One time for like 5 minutes or >> not? Not Not super long. Not super long. So, but here's the deal. The problem is that this clip >> was that really the clip? The clip was the Ottoman EMP. Is this it, by the way, that you guys You can play it if you want. >> Yeah. Go ahead. Let me see it. I want to see it. >> And their Muslim rulers didn't do that during the Ottoman period. >> Okay. So the answer is no. The Muslim rulers didn't tax churches during the Ottoman period. They were very kind to Christians. As a matter of fact, they took care of our holy sites. They had rebuilt Islamic authorities, rebuilt the Church of the Sephller three different times over the centuries. Um they had a a law protecting Christian pilgrims on their journey. Like nobody messed with the >> the Ottoman Turks, the Muslim rulers of the Holy Land, rebuilt the Church of the Holy Supplr three times. >> Three times. Yeah. Either completely rebuilt it or a major renovation. One time it caught on fire and they redid the the roof. But if you've seen the Church of the Holy Supplr, you can imagine what it took to redo that. >> No, it's in their Muslim rulers. >> That's it. >> So the criticism is is there. The criticism is that uh JD Hall is ingratiating himself with Muslims being soft on Islam. >> The part I would say the well the part I would say is the following. Here's here's the problem. Say say I kill two and a half million Armenians, Assyrians and Greeks. >> Mhm. >> Okay. Bulgarians, whatever. You know, say I do that with the Ottomans, you the Ottoman Empire, Turks, but I help 88 people with a building that I built. Guess what story I want to be told more? >> You make the footnote, the headline, and that's dishonest. I I agree. >> That's what probably upset a lot of people here. >> I understand the frustration, but I also knowing JD personally, >> I don't know, this is this is this isn't even towards JD. I'm sure JD's a nice guy. I don't know JD. JD's great. you tell me he's a very good writer and he's done great work with you guys. So, uh I trust that. No, I I but again the cherrypicking part of stories to me when I would sit down and I would talk to Muslims, I'm like, "Tell me where you at with LGBTQ. We're deeply concerned about it." I talked to Media Assan, he's not. But your point Media Assan is probably more a liberal than he's a Muslim. Exactly. Okay. Yeah. So, so to him, when I asked and said, "Would you vote for a conservative Muslim?" He said, "No, I would vote for a liberal Christian more than I would vote for a conservative Muslim like James allegiance is to liberalism. >> Yeah. So, so then so then if that comes back to us, what would we say though? If you ask that same question of a conservative, would you would you vote for a conservative Muslim or a liberal Christian? >> I would not vote. >> Yeah, that I would abstain. >> You would you would stay out of it. Right. So So then that becomes the challenge there. But um yeah, I mean that story right here on on what JD's talking about, if you cherrypick, Tucker's cherry-picking a story because he knows and he probably got JD in trouble with some of the ways >> he definitely got JD in trouble, but I got to say publicly Tucker has said some things. Little soft on Islam. Not my fave. >> I talked to him a little bit about that, >> but let the record state I love Tucker Carlson. >> Yeah. No, no, I get I get that. I get that. The fact the market is filled with a lot of different voices. >> Yep. >> Uh let me let me ask, right? Is there anybody you wouldn't accept to come to your church? >> Um mainly black people. [laughter] I'm just kidding. So we like So back to the interracial marriage. The irony is that because we live in the world as it is, right? So that's how you can tell a serious person versus somebody who's who's just pretending. Um, real politics is the realm of the possible, not just the ideal. What can I do given the lay of the land today, right? The circumstances that actually exist dealing in in in the world of reality. So, I live in, you know, outside of Austin, Texas is incredibly diverse. Incredibly diverse. Uh, the gospel is for all people. Now, I think that a lot of people who are within a vicinity of my church that that politically speaking, so there's there's categories, right? Two kingdoms, right? the kingdom of grace and the common kingdom, right? Church, which is word and sacrament, those things higher uh those things which are eternal, the our highest good, our eternal good. And then the temporal world and we have to as Christians think um not in ways that contradict but in ways that are still distinct depending what category we're operating in. So in the political category, there's a lot of people in my area who should not be there. They shouldn't be in our country. That said though, I don't have much control over that. They are here. And so, anybody within a driving radius of my church, whether they should legally be here or not, if they want to come to my church on Sunday morning, they're not going to be disruptive. They're not going to be a threat. Then, of course, they're welcome. So, my church has multiple interracial couples. They know my position. They watched the debate. They saw all the controversy. They agree with me. They've come to me and said, both husband and wife, and said, "You know what? Yeah, our marriage marriage is hard no matter what because you're taking a man and a woman who are very different and telling them to share the same bed, right? That's a marriage is a challenge. It is a challenge. My wife is so different than me. She thinks different, emotionally like it's not just we're physically different. We are psychologically different. We are emotionally different, mentally different at every single level all the way down. Egalitarianism is a lie. Liberalism is a lie. my wife and me very different. So the differences are already going to make marriage a challenge to add and voluntarily of your own valition. Let's let's add even more differences, right? Like in a racial and when I say interracial by implication, I'm saying there's uh distin extra distinctions culturally, even language. Like one of the men in my church, he cannot speak to his in-laws because they don't speak English. And he's like, "Yeah, Joel, this has been a challenge." And and if you look at that man say, um, do you regret it? Say, 'No, I love my wife. Of course, I love my wife and I love my my biracial children. I would I would die for them. I love them. But he agrees with me in saying, "Yeah, but here's the deal. What you said, Joel, it's biblically permissible, but it it it shouldn't be the ordinary normative pattern, God's design for peoples and cultures and nations. That's a perfectly reasonable position. And why did I feel it necessary to even say that? I've already admitted one of the reasons. One of the reasons is because I allowed myself to get trapped by an annoying woman. And that's on me. Moment of weakness online. I fired back on Twitter. Probably shouldn't have. But here's the second reason that I regret. But I don't regret it all the way because here's the second reason. If we lived in a culture today where where there wasn't you you just spoke of propaganda where there wasn't this like full incessant a fullcourt press of constant propaganda from media academia um politics constantly pushing people towards marrying with other people diversity diversity diversity then I probably wouldn't feel the need to ever say a word about the topic. You watch television, Patrick, and just watch the commercials. Do you do you ever see a commercial with a white mom and a white dad and white children? >> No. I mean, you know what they're doing. By the way, these are stats. US National Survey of Family Growth found that after 10 years of marriage, interracial couples, 41% had separated or divorced. >> Same race couples, 31% had separated or divorced. If you go a little bit lower, it says black husband and white wife tend to have the highest divorce risks. among the combination studied. >> Shocking. >> And then white husband, Asian wife tend to have the relatively lowest divorce rate. So maybe marry an Asian. >> I believe I might be an Asian supremacist. I don't know. I'm open to >> Hispanic white and Asian white marriages often had divorce risks similar to those of the higher risk groups impairing ones other factors were taken into account. Interesting. Interesting to see that >> because because here's the deal. We can't just live in the ideal. We we are both body and soul. So there's a spiritual reality, right? And we have to as Christians. It's never less than that. But we are also we're not gnostics. One of the earliest heresies in the church wasnosticism that that made it as though the spiritual and the eternal was all that mattered, the only significant thing, the only true thing. And that the body was not just of less account, but of no account. That the temporal world and our temporal physical lives um were were nothing. that the body was actually just functioning as a prison containing and restraining the soul and to be freed of the body was the ideal which actually uh flies in the face as a contradiction to true Christian theology that our final state will not be as spirits floating in the 17th dimension with Jesus. The final state, right? To be absent of the body is to be present with the Lord in spirit. But the final state is that Jesus will physically bodily return and there will be the final resurrection and my soul will be rejoined with my resurrected now glorified body so that I will have both a spiritual and physical eternal existence with the Lord and his people forever. That's Christian historic orthodox doctrine. So as Christians, we can't be gnostics. We can't despise the temporal world. And when I speak of the tempor world back to interracial marriage, here's one of the acknowledgements of the world as it actually exists. The world that God made. Similarities are helpful, right? How do you have a high trust society? Well, one of the ways that you have a high trust society is you share more in common with your neighbors. You you you speak the same language. You have the same ideals. You even look similar. That helps. And if that helps at a societal level, would that not help in marriage? Does that mean that interracial marriage is therefore a sin? No. But but to say that it should be the norm in every commercial on TV and like that's where I'm like that's enough. That part's too much. Can you can you pull up the chart you just texted me guys? This is pretty wild. If you look at this chart, it shows spouse ethnicity, who they marry. Okay. And they got a bunch of different races. If you make it bigger to show it, it's actually very interesting. So the red, if you look at the right, red is white, ethnicity, black is blue. Then you got Hispanic is green, Chinese, you see the whole thing. And then on the top left, it shows white marrying a white male. Okay, guess what? 86% of the time, a white male marrying a white female, they go for a white male. 88% of the time, 12% time, they don't. Black to black, you see the blue is blue. Okay. So, black male marry 21% of the time white females, but black females 19% of the time marry white males. Hispanics is Hispanic except for 22 to 28% 26% they marry whites. Chinese is majority Chinese. Many Chinese male do not marry white females only 11% of the time. But the Chinese female 29% of the time will marry a white female white male. Then you have the Indians predominant predominantly with Indians. Although Indian males will marry white females versus Indian females won't marry white males as much. Filipinos is Filipino. Filipino female is actually the third uh highest of what white males will marry. They'll marry white males. Filipino and then you have Japanese and then you have Hispanics. So Latinos are the highest. 46% of the time they will get a white husband. The lowest one here is which you may actually get excited about is Pakistani females don't marry too many white men. Although you may want that you may want a lot of inter interracial marriages with Pakistani female. Not really in your church particularly. >> Not particularly. It's interesting when you see this. I I married a white girl from Texas and I'm obviously you know Middle Eastern Armenian Assyrian and >> but you're Christian. >> But I'm Christian. I mean and >> that's I'm not a race essentialist. I'm a religious essentialist Christian nationalist. >> Yes, sir. Right. So, so religion comes first. Race is not everything. But it's also not nothing. And that's where liberalism lies to us. >> Right. Right. Values, principles, understanding, culture, all of that matter. And when you see a lot of these commercials, every commercial is a white man with a black girl or a black man with a white man. And they're they're trying to do that a little bit too much. By the way, I want to show you a clip of Seth Rogan who was >> real quick. Can I say the what I think the point of that is cuz they'll they'll do uh black man and black woman and they'll do Hispanic man and Hispanic woman. Uh but if it's white, it's black, you know, black man, white woman or it could be two white people but they're both dudes or they're both chicks, right? It's gay or lesbian. To me, I can't help but think like when I think what's the purpose? Um, every single relational arrangement you could possibly even conceive of is represented in television, in media, entertainment, except for the one biological, right? Not just relational, but biological arrangement that produces white kids. I think they just hate white people. I think they want less white people. That's what I think. Yeah. I think white or conservative white. They don't mind the liberal white. >> That's true. >> They don't mind the liberal white. They mind the conservative white. That That's where the problem. They love Telerico. He's white, but he's a liberal. That's their hero. That's their next Obama, even though he's not black. >> I'm in Texas. I see the sign. >> He's everywhere. Yeah, he's everywhere. We'll see what happened there. I want you to watch this clip of Seth Rogan with uh Steven Bartlett from Diary of CEO. And in this context, they're talking about having kids. And as they get older, did they regret not having kids or, you know, do they sit there and say, "We made the right decision and you're someone who's got five kids, four girls, a son, and one on the way is going to be the sixth." I want you to watch this clip. Go for it. >> Reference, you don't have any kids. >> I do not. That has helped me succeed as well. [laughter] >> Definitely. >> Really? >> Oh, yeah. There's a whole huge thing I'm not doing, which is raising children. Would [laughter] it people obviously someone would be listening but yeah but it would make you happier you know someone might say that I'm trying to rebuttal I don't think it would I've been around obviously a lot of children I'm not I'm not ignorant to what it's like to I've I've seen everyone I know has kids I I see I'm a you know I'm 40 again you know like it's not I I know you know I've I've some of my friends have had kids for decades you know um some people want kids some people don't want kids I think a lot of people have kids before they even think about it. From what I've seen, honestly, you just are told you go through life, you get married, you have kids. It's what happens. Um and and me [clears throat] and my wife were just neither of us were like that, you know. And um honestly, the older we get, the more happy and reaffirmed we are with our choice to not have kids. Like, it was something we kind of talked about more and we're like, have we made the right choice? Are we sure now if more than anything the conversation is like honestly thank God we don't have children? >> Yeah. >> Thank God. I mean do you even think he believes in God? >> Of course not. So uh first Jarvis pull up an early life check on Seth Rogan. >> Okay. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Of course. Uh but then second um here here's where he's fundamentally wrong right out of the gate. >> The whole conversation has to do with his own personal happiness. Screw your happiness, right? Screw your freedom, right? We shouldn't say that, Arnold Schwarzenegger, but screw your happiness. Here's the deal. Everyone is living their lives as though their happiness is somehow the goal. Forget this is where I think even America, and I love our founding. Um, but I do think that one of the things that was baked into the pie from the beginning that did allow for some of the problems we have today is the exaltation of liberty above duty. Virtue. It's not about I did not have children because I thought they would make me happy. Here's the thing. God is so merciful and kind. Turns out I was wrong. And so is he. He would be happier. And I am so much happier having children. But before I had kids, it terrified me. I didn't I didn't say, "Babe, we've got to have kids as soon as possible because I'm not happy and they'll make me happy." No, no, no. I was under the delusion. I was deceived. I thought, "This is going to be so hard. It's going to be so much work. It's going to cost so much money. Even Even as a Christian, the other way around." So, your concern was how hard it's going to be. >> That's right. That was my concern. But he But then why did I do it? Why did I do it? Because I knew it was right. It wasn't about my happiness. Now, here's the thing. I was wrong. It actually made me happy because the right thing that God requires also ends up being the good thing that makes the heart of man glad because God is not capricious. He's not arbitrary. He doesn't just randomly randomly say these are the tenants of morality and they also consequently conveniently are the the very things that will make you miserable and sad. No, God is a good God, a kind and loving God. The things that he says these are holy are also the things that make us happy. But I was delusional. I was deceived thinking this is not going to make me happy. But I did it anyways. Why? Because duty trumped delight. Because because virtue trumped liberty. I knew that having children was important for the world, for society, for the kingdom of God to raise up godly offspring. The Genesis commands be fruitful and multiply. I understand some people biologically can't have kids, right? So I'm not saying that they're in sin, but but ordinarily speaking in norms, ordinarily it is good and fitting and right and even obligatory if we're Christians reading the Bible that we seek to make disciples and our first disciples are the little disciples in our home. That we seek to be fruitful and multiply with the wife of our youth. that that the overflow of our love produces the fruit of the womb and that we raise him in the fear and admonition of the Lord that they are arrows. The psalms say the children are like arrows that that a man a father will one day shoot out the greatest arsenal, the greatest weaponry going all the way back to the topic of power. The most powerful thing I have that will ultimately conquer my enemies are my six children who will be raised in the fear and ammonition of the Lord and will do immense damage like arrows, like a battering ram up against the gates of hell. So, I had kids because I must have them, not just because I wanted to have them. And now I can't imagine life without them. Seth Rogan is wrong. He's he's wrong because he's selfish, because he's arrogant, because he's a pthead, right? All these reasons. We know this. But but he's also wrong because he starts with the the wrong premise. I don't know if kids would make me happy. Who cares about your happiness? Somebody may say, "What do you mean who cares about my happiness?" God cares about your happiness. >> Yeah. Yeah. And the liberal argument may be like, "It's my life. I get to do what I want to do my life. I don't want to have kids. I want to spend time with my wife and I want to be doing my thing. Why should I have kids, Joel? This is exactly why I don't like the, you know, Bible thumping pastors out there telling me to go have kids and live for somebody else and not for myself. I don't want to do that. Why is there anything wrong with that? Because God wrote a book. This isn't my opinion. I have lots of opinions and we've talked about some of them today. This one ain't one of my opinions. This is not subjective. God in heaven wrote a book and that book is true whether Joel Webbon was ever born or not. And in that book, one of the first commandments he gives to his image bearing creatures is to be fruitful and multiply. Because one of the the endg games, the escaton of man here on earth and heavenly life in eternity is that God's imagebearing creatures would so fill the earth imaging emulating Christ to all of the cosmos to the world that they would be born and multiply but also shaped and forged more and more into the image of God through catechism, disciplehip, gospel, all these things. Uh why should why should you do it? Because God says so and that's a good reason. That's an that's a sufficient reason. God wrote a book and he said so. >> Yeah. Well, let's see if anything will happen. He's Can you pull up Seth Rogan's wife? Do you know who his wife is? No, I don't know who his wife is. >> I don't really follow actors, you know. >> I thought for I thought for a second you were like a big Seth Rogan guy. I was maybe speculating. >> No, I I'm usually not big on potheads. [laughter] Lauren Miller. Is she Is she a Hollywood person? Is she an actress? I don't know if she is. Maybe she is. Oh, she was in Super Bad. Okay. And Zach. All right. So, they're in the same world. They're both coming from Hollywood. And >> that's their life. So, the chances of them having kids together, by the way, they've been together. Respect to them. They've been together for 23 years. >> That for Hollywood, that is unbelievable. No, that is that's that beats the odds. So, if you're together 23 years and 23 years later you still >> decide not to have kids. >> I think you're wrong. I I I still think they're wrong. But you are right. The fact that they've lasted together for 23 years for Hollywood. That's pretty good. >> Have you watched the recent movie Citizen Vigilante? >> No. >> Have you seen this movie or No. Okay. >> It's it's out of it's lowbudget movie. Couple million dollars. U makes this movie. It is officially the number one movie I believe on Amazon and Apple. >> Really? >> And it has created so much chaos. We don't even need to play the clip. We It's created so much chaos. If you get I just thought maybe you had watched the clip. >> Lots of controversy behind this movie. When you get a chance, I'd love to hear your thoughts on on what you what you think. >> I watched that movie another one that was like kind of made um from scratch. YouTuber, the the one with all the back rooms. Yeah. >> What did you think about that? >> That was fascinating. That was really fascinating. I uh >> I'm glad I watched it as an experience because it was creative. >> Yeah. >> Um but it was it was a different kind of terror, >> right? It wasn't just the jump cuts, you know, and like like a saw grotesque kind of it was a psychological >> for sure, >> but but not just terror, but like absolute hopelessness, despair. >> So I would never watch it again, but not because it was it was a great movie, but miserable. >> Such a miserable experience. What's what's your position on Catholicism? >> I have many Catholic followers and absolutely would consider them to be friends. So grateful for them. Uh Calvin Robinson, he's on our network uh with NXR. He does a a weekly show on Thursdays. Now, he's not Roman Catholic, but he he's he's basically Catholic minus the Pope. And he's, you know, he appreciates a pope. He just thinks he should be a first among equals, right? a bishop who's going to settle disputes among other regional bishops but not speaking ex cathedral and having you know authority over all the other bishops. So anyways but but Calvin is, you know, a close friend and he's mostly Catholic. Nick Nick Fuentes, you know, we did a 10- part series with him. I consider him a friend. I appreciate him very much. Um don't agree on everything, of course, you know, because I'm my own person, but I think Nick does a lot of great work. He's a Roman Catholic, very very much committed to his faith. So I think that Catholics are natural allies. Uh this is where I kind of woke up in my world, the reformed historic reformed Protestant world when reformed pastors started uh getting on to me about my willingness to participate with Catholics, work with Catholics, not in the local church. I would never have a Catholic elder, right? I there's again you have to think in categories, right? So in the church, I'm not going to have this ecumenicalism. U we need to be theologically aligned aligned. So in my church, um the leaders of my church, they're going to be Protestant. They're going to be reformed Protestant. It's not diversity of thought. Theology is not a strength in a local church setting. Out here, as I'm seeking to do things political and cultural and and larger, broader influence, you got to have numbers, right? You can't just shoot your own teammates, right? So linking arms, co-belligerants, and and when reformed pastors start turning against me and saying, "Well, you're getting too buddy buddy with the Catholics, but meanwhile, they're perfectly willing to be buddy buddy with Dennis Prager, Ben Shapiro, and and again, right here, I'm not trying to the Jews, but this is actually just a good example, just religiously speaking, not ethnically, not nationally, religiously speaking, who's closer to Protestant Christians, Catholics or Orthodox Jews? Catholics, of course. So, what do I think about Catholics? I love them. Do I wish they agreed with me? Of course. Of course. Do I think they're wrong theologically on some issues that are not just benign but significant that it matters? >> Such as what? Such as what? >> Um, okay. So, I prefer the Catholic to the Eastern Orthodox. One big reason. Um, penal substitutionary atonement. Chris Victor is one of the views of the atonement and it's true. It's a historic position. It's not less than that. Christ conquering over the prince of the air and demonic princes and principalities. It's true. He held them to open shame. Colossians says this is awesome. Christ through his death and resurrection victorious breaking the chains binding the strong man Satan. Um beautiful. I hold to Christ's victor. Um but penal substitutionary atonement substitutionary substitute Jesus did not just die as a moral example of sacrificial love. Um greater love Jesus says greater love has no one than this that a man would lay down his life for his friends. Jesus sacrifice is an example moral example of sacrificial love that we should seek to follow. But if that's all it is we have Jonavar we've got William Wallace. There are plenty of good, virtuous people throughout all of history who died a brutal death out of sacrifice, love for their country, their kin, whatever. But Jesus died as a substitute, penal substitutionary atonement. Meaning he died as a lamb of God in my place. He didn't just die as an example of sacrificial love. He died um he who knew no sin became sin on my behalf so that I might inherit the righteousness of God. My sin, double imputation. My sin was imputed to Christ. His righteousness through faith imputed to me. When God sees me, he sees the very righteousness of Christ. And on the cross, when God looked at Jesus, he saw the most vile sinner in all the world, bearing all the sins of the elect. And he poured out his white hot wrath. Father, why have you forsaken me? Because Jesus was the most disgusting sinner in that moment who has ever lived in the history of humanity. He didn't just die as an example. He died as a substitute. He died in my place. That's the heart of the gospel. EO Eastern Orthodox, they deny it. Catholics agree with that. So I have more in common with Catholics also. They're western. They think in terms of substance, rationale. Eastern Orthodox, it's Eastern. So it's more mysticism, experiencing God. Whereas the Western tradition, right, Augustine, Aquinus is knowing God. The goal is to know Christ. Whereas, you know, for the Eastern guys, there's more of an emphasis on on being one with God and experiencing God. Uh but one of my big disagreements [clears throat] uh wi with Catholics is even though they hold the penal substitutionary atonement, praise God, um imputation, double imputation of righteousness imputed, right? So Abraham, he believed God and it was accredited, transferred like a bank transaction. Accredited, transferred, imputed to his account as righteousness. Whereas the Catholic is infused righteousness that through sacraments, right? Through these different practices, the eucharist, uh, confession, all all of these things, good things. But there is an infusion of grace that comes again and again and again all the way up until your death, right? Last rights from the priest, one more infusion of grace. Get the get the the bread down the gullet, you know, and and a sip of wine. um because we need one more um transfusion of grace, you know, to to lift the soul to make sure this guy doesn't go to hell or he goes to purgatory, but maybe, you know, he'll be there for a hundred years instead of a thousand. Um I I just don't believe that's what the Bible teaches. I believe it's this once and for all righteousness of Christ, not just infused, but imputed to us, not by works, so that no man can boast, but by grace alone, through faith alone, and Christ alone. I am at the end of the day. And I know my Catholic listeners will hear this. They'll be like, "Oh, that's so insufferable. Ah, Joel, we loved you and you're being so gay. Here I am. Here I stand." So, God help me. I I am a Protestant. Catholics say, "Stop being gay." [laughter] Maybe that's a compliment from them. Maybe, but I love I love my Catholic friends. >> It's great. I love it. Joel, great having you having you on. How can people find you? Where could we send people to come learn more about you? >> Um, first, thank you so much. A huge honor. I I know that I I have the reputation of being a radical. You hearing me out, giving me a chance, it means the world. Thank you. >> Anytime. >> So, NXR Studios, you just search it on Rumble or YouTube or whatever. >> NXR. >> Yes, sir. So, NXR, it's just our way of saying New Christian right, that's what it stands for. The new Christian Right. So, New Christian Right Studios, NXR, Rumble, uh YouTube, and then you can just follow me on Twitter. It's Joel Webbon. >> And you got an event that's coming up in December as well if you want to let the audience. >> We do. Thank you. Yeah. So, uh, this was >> Can you zoom in so we can see the speakers at this event? >> Yeah. So, this is Christ is King. >> Okay. >> Um, that's the the main title and, uh, can we play this trailer? >> How long? 34 minutes. >> No, no, no, no. One. Uh, oh, that's an episode. It's one minute. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> If they just play the first minute. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. >> Is that okay? >> Where is it at? >> Oh, they could just That was it actually. >> Oh, can they go back to just play the first minute? >> Yeah, just play the first minute of that episode you were just on. I >> was going to say 34minute trailer. That's a scary, >> but it's called Christ is King. America after Trump. >> Okay, here we go. America will either have Christ or it will have chaos. For years, conservatives believe that Trump could reverse America's decline. But after Trump, the right is now fractured, exhausted, and losing ground. Endless infighting and electoral losses have exposed a deeper problem that politics alone cannot solve. A nation that rejects Christ cannot be restored by mere personalities, grandstanding or Christless conservativism. So, NXR Studios first annual conference, America After Trump, brings together pastors, politicians, commentators, and Christians that are committed to strength, cooperation, and adurable future for the American right. Complaining [music] is not a strategy, and despair cannot be an option. Christ is king. Let's live like it. Save 50% off your ticket only by registering before May 31st at newchristian.comconference. That's newchristian.com conference. >> There you go. So that's it. >> Fantastic. Very excited. And again, NXR Studios, go look them up. Joel, great having you on. I'm always fascinated by these different personalities to see what makes you guys tick. I learned a lot about your story today and uh I was glad I invited you. I'm glad I was glad we sat down, we spoke. So, I appreciate your time. >> Take care everybody. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. When we set out to create a shoe that blends comfort, function, and luxury, we had the choice to make it [music] fast. We had the choice to make it cheap. We chose neither. Instead, we [music] chose Tuscan Italy. We chose true Italian craftsmanship. Each pair touched by 50 skilled hands. We chose patience, spending two years perfecting every detail. And we chose the [music] finest quality at every step. Introducing the future looks bright collection. Not rushed, not disposable, not ordinary, rather intentional, luxurious, timeless. [music]