The Grooming Gang Report Was Just The Start...

In London, as of 2024, 60% of children were born to an immigrant mother. In Brussels, the shift is even more profound. A full 78% of residents are now of foreign descent. Shifts this rapid, are playing out all across the West, including in the US, which is why immigration and cultural [music] change, more importantly, will be one of the most important debates of the next 10 years. Now, I expect that debate to be extremely contentious, and I'll be shocked if it doesn't get more violent. But no matter what side you land on, you'll be loved by some and reviled by others. But the one real mistake would be for us not to have the debate at all. In that spirit, I traveled to London for Tommy Robinson's Unite [music] the Kingdom rally. I wanted to see it for myself. Would it be a sething pit of vipers, a nothing burger, or ground zero for [music] this critical debate? What I found surprised me. The scale was massive [music] and its figure head was not at all what I expected. I won't tell you what to think about him, but by his own admission, this was not like his other interviews. I hope you'll watch it till [music] the end and tell me what you think in the comments. And now, without further ado, I bring you Tommy Robinson. you have become uh a central figure of something that is very controversial but I think it's going to be one of the most important questions of the next 10 years partly around immigration though I map it a little bit differently but if you had to explain what exactly it is that you're fighting for how would you explain it >> a multitude of things British culture identity um our country safety family. All the things that I feel have been intentionally attacked by a agenda. I'd say the far-left have had a successful revolution for 20 to 30 years. Open border mass immigration, breakdown of identity, breakdown of nationalism, breakdown of the family, breakdown of the church, breakdown of the value system. And there's been a void left. And into that void has become [clears throat] whether it be Marxism, communism, LGBTQ plus, many Islam, many different ideology ideologies have filled a void. And people are understanding that they've lost something. They're missing something as British men and women. And we feel like our ch our country is changing beyond recognition. And it doesn't ch it's not changing for the better. It's not changing to become safer. It's and it's our duty. It was my duty as an Englishman, as a father, to hand down a safe and prosperous Britain to the next generation. I don't think there's anyone you could stop in this country and ask is Britain safer or better than it was if we could rewind [clears throat] 20 years ago, 30 years ago. The statistics don't lie. So, we're worried and we're trying to I've I've tried to highlight it. Obviously, I'm from a town called Luton, which is 30 mi north of where we are now. And I've seen all these problems. I've seen them 15 20 years ago. I've seen them from my whole life. So, I know what's coming. I'll say see Luton's a blueprint for every town city in the UK. What happens when you become a minority? Why English are a minority in Luton? What happens with the expansion and the growth of Islam as an ideology and as a culture? It's not good. >> Okay. So, we've got a very wide problem set and there are things in there that I I know will trigger people in terms of things that make somebody who has a predefined notion of how the world ought to be. if they hear something that's anti-immigration or something that sounds like racism, they're going to trip uh and then immediately take the opposite side. And obviously, you live that every day. You see that push back. My goal in all of this is to actually dive into what those problems are, figure out which problems um have a solution that we can put on the table and say, "Okay, this is the the cause of the problem. This would therefore be the solution that that predicts." and see where this stuff does or doesn't spill into this either is racism or it isn't racism, which is the easiest way to go after you is to just say, "Oh man, this guy is a religious thug and and that's that or not religious, but um racist thug." So off camerara we were talking about identity and so we have this hollowing out of identity. People don't know who they are, therefore they don't know what to fight for. So given that the the sense of there's a lack now of British identity rather than let that be nebulous what is the British identity that you want people to rembrace I want to remrace so say for example myself growing up I found my identity in football because I was the son of a my mother was an Irish immigrant I was born in Lutontown um in Lutontown we had St. Lucian day where big fairgrounds and parks where St. Lucian celebrated their identity we had St. Patrick's Day which was where the Irish celebrated for three-day festival >> when it's Eid we had big fairgrounds we had everything yeah when Pakistan won the cricket or any celebration massive celebrations when it comes to St. George's there as banned and they sent out letters at schools to not bring in the emblem of St. George. Now, what this does, which I tried to point out at the time in in my hometown, is it sends a message that we should be ashamed and embarrassed to who we are and every other culture and identity is allowed to celebrate who they are. We weren't. Yeah. And that has become a factor across the UK that people don't feel they've been allowed to celebrate. They're deemed or they're looked down their nose upon or or the racist label is attached to the flag or the history or the culture. And that's continuously happening. So I I started going to football. I started going to England away. I I found I think I found my identity through a football culture. >> Did you think of football as a religion or did it serve that kind function? >> It served the function of it gave me the sense of identity and I'm I'm quite tribal. >> Mhm. >> I think many of us are. >> So let me define what I think identity means and then you tell me if we're doing something different. So for me the reason that I think religion is so powerful is it actually tells you how to live. And so when I think of a culture having an identity, it is a shared set of values that tell you what is acceptable behavior, what is not acceptable behavior. And you can articulate it out loud and you can say around here we don't do this and we do do this. Uh and that's why whether Christianity, Islam, doesn't matter. They're able to give you a very articulatable set of dos and don'ts. And so when I hear you say we've lost our identity, what I hear is we've lost our set of dos and don'ts. But when you explain like football stepping into that void, I still I I don't know that it carries the value system in the way I think of it. >> I think when I say identity, I mean community as well. I mean sense of community. Islam is a strong sense of community, you know, real strong sense of identity. It's a brotherhood and it welcomes everyone in. And then I used to sit sometimes and I'd be jealous of the Islamic community in the way they have their sense of community. They're all together. They they've got everything together. Um we don't and ours has been broken down and I I'll explain it like say for example and [snorts] I try and look at the educated uh there was a gentleman called Tom Castello. Tom if you're watching this I'm still upset with you. There's a gentleman called Tom Castello who was um he got the best grades at Oxford University. Yeah. And he went on to become a film producer and he he made a documentary on with me called Proud and Prejudiced which was in Luton. And I welcomed him into my life. I said, "Come on in. Experience my life so you can actually see my life, not so you can report and do this film." When I met him, we went up to the local shops and after we went to the shops, we went to the local pub. We went and he sat down and he said, "I've never experienced this." I said, "What do you mean?" And he said, "The community, you all know each other. Every one of you are hugging each other. Everyone, you know everyone. Everyone knows everyone." I said, "Yeah." He said, "Well, he went to a boarding school, so he didn't know everyone where he lived. He then went to a university. Yeah. In another town, so he didn't know anyone there. He's now living in another town. He doesn't know anyone there." And I try to explain to him said, "Do you do you understand, Tom, when you see what you've just witnessed with us? When someone in this community is affected, i.e. a girl is raped, do you understand why we all feel it? Cuz it's a it's an attack on all of us." So that is our sense of community. But then I've also I can explain that mass immigration come into the community and we've got a community and then all of a sudden it's changing with Afghanis, Pakistanis and Somalis >> who are hostile to us who are different who are put into the community who very quickly are having five or six children. So although there's not that many in the estate, when you then look at the lowest school, the primary school, which is happening now, it's a majority Muslim school like that within years like that. The place has changed. And as that happens, whether it be for through hostility or just change, people want to leave. So the community we had is now broken. It's been broken and people are leaving and they're moving or they're coming under attack. And I I gave a presentation at Oxford University about this that showed 66 violent attacks on non-Muslim homes in one area before the police acted. That's an attack and it was coming from the Muslim community, members of the Muslim community because they didn't want non-Muslims in the houses. And I've seen all of this growing up. Yeah. So I see that our sense of community that we had and I do accept identity comes from Christian values which is where we're now looking back. We're now years I didn't I never used to look at this. I'm now looking back thinking, where do our value system come from? What's right and wrong? Where does it come from? >> So, there's a few things that we're going to have to tease out because from the outside looking in on why people react so strongly either with you or against you. Um, I think it comes down to the difference between identity and community and belonging. So if identity carries with it a set of values but community and belonging the values is it's riding in the background but it's really the reason that you could feel a sense of community and belonging with a football club as quickly as we all grew up in Luton as quickly as um Christianity is that that is oh you're inroup versus outroup. So just being in the inroup and they've done tests on this. It's like, oh, we're the people that wear blue shirts and so we're on a team and you can get the kids to treat each other differently just based on the color of the shirt they wear. So we have this algorithm in our brain that says, "All right, is this person in my group or out?" Exactly. >> So I I want to make sure that we're careful to separate these different things because I certainly understand why you would be why anybody would be frustrated that they have a community, a sense of belonging, and then something comes in to disrupt that. But I think there will be much less empathy from the world for just disruption that people move and all of that. But if a there is a collision of values to me, we have shown historically we will kill over values. And that's where this makes me nervous both for you guys and for us in the US. And as a maybe neutral example to explain to people, Catholics and Protestants look exactly alike and yet we're killing each other in droves. So that's what happens when values collide. So I want to understand I get it's multi- there's a bunch of things, but is the main complaint before we get to some of the change in crime statistics and stuff like that. Is this a complaint about um we have people that are coming in and breaking apart our sense of tribal belonging or is it we have people coming in that don't share our values and that's creating >> it's our values because their values are the total opposite. So, for example, Luton, if you line all my friends up, say 30 of my main friends growing up, most of us are sons of immigrants and many of us are not white, but we've all shared the same value system. So, we had one part of the town that didn't share the value system and actually was hostile to the rest and didn't integrate or assimilate in any way. Yeah. So, and and we didn't create that environment. So, as children, when I went to high school, as an 11-y old child, there's the Muslim playground and the non-Muslim playground. We didn't create that. Why did they do that? >> Because they don't integrate or similate. They don't play with you. >> But was the goal we need to protect? >> It wasn't the school doing it. No, it wasn't the school doing it. It's just all the Muslims were on one playground. >> Got it. So, >> all the non-Muslims are on >> nonofficially officially divided. Got it. Got a school of fish. >> So, go into the dinner hall. go into the dinner hall at school and you'd have white children mixed in with black children mixed in with Chinese children mixed in with Hindus, Sikhs and in the corner you love 10 tables of Muslims. So I learned very quickly when I went to high school. Well, this lot are very different. The Pakistanis >> there's something real different about them. When we were growing up, you'd have a punch up, you'd have a fight. Not with them, you would. Cuz 20 of them would jump you and kick you all over the floor. And I'd never seen that. I'd never understood that. And all of a sudden it's like you mess with one, you've declared war on the whole tribe. Something different here. Yeah. So this the value system. Yeah. Where the way they spoke to women, the way they'd beat up women, girls, they'd beat up girls. We had a rule at school. You don't hit a girl. Yeah. Muslim boys will beat up girls and that's it. They don't care about whether it's a girl or not. So I saw a level of aggression, saw a level of hostility and saw it was like mixing oil and water. You're mixing two things here and we're all children. Yeah. And I never understood it. I never understood it. I just knew, Jesus, this is something very different going on here. Yeah. And then I'd experienced it growing up. I'd knew girls who were victims of grooming gangs. My cousin was one, 13, 14. She woke up being raped by multiple Muslim men with beards. Um, I knew so many girls that were just lost and disappeared basically into these gangs. And the the Hindus weren't doing it. And the Sikhs aren't doing it. No one else is doing it. The black lads ain't doing it. This is something so different. A value system that believes you can do this. You can treat a girl like this. You can take them and they are worthless. And all of these values are alien to us. But every other value every if it was just people coming into the community then when my best two mates growing up were from Dad and Po. Yeah. Daniel and Dean. When they come in, there wasn't a problem. We got on. We become best friends. We become like family. Yeah. But that wasn't the same with the Islamic community. And that isn't our fault. None of this is our fault. Yeah. As youngsters. And I challenge I challenge you, Tom, while you in England. Yeah. Go [snorts] to Luton, take your cameras, try and find a Muslim with a non-Muslim. Just try and find one in the town. You won't. Unless I send them drugs. That's And I say I used to say to most journalists when going to town center because I used to do walk through with the journalist to show them my town. Yeah. And I say just find me one. Find me one. You might when they're work colleagues having lunch. Yeah. Outside of work, outside of the school gates, you find me a group of Muslims with a non-Muslim. You just won't find them. Okay. So, we have a problem of integration. So, by way of um parsing out how your personal value system works in the world, every time somebody puts forward an idea, a hypothesis, it makes a prediction. So, what you're saying is this is about value system for me. Now, if that's actually true, if a Muslim person came in and was like, "Hey, I actually feel more aligned with you guys. I want to hang out. I want to chill." Um, that wouldn't be a problem if they're okay. >> Um, listen, when when I'm saying this, you have to understand that [snorts] some of the best lads I knew are Muslim lads growing up. Yeah. So, I'm not saying every Muslim here because one of my best mates, Sully, who's whose mom's black Kenyon Muslim, Yeah. is as integrated and assimilated, but he doesn't follow Islam. Yeah. He's a great British lad. Okay. But he doesn't follow Islam. So I I never understood what this was about until [snorts] 2011. I'm sat on solitary confinement for 22 weeks and a Muslim outreach group sent me in the Quran. Yeah. And I'd never read the Quran or got my head into the Quran. I just knew Pakistanis were a problem here. Yeah. Big problem. Right. But I hadn't gone down the Islam route. I'd [snorts] looked into I'd looked into terrorist organizations, but hadn't when I got the Quran, I thought, right, [snorts] let's try and make sense of this book. And again, I'll challenge anyone to do it. open the Quran and every time there's a reference to not be friends with Christians or Jews, write down the verse number. And within 20 minutes, I had pages and it all made sense. It was like a jigsaw just fell into place. My whole upbringing fell into place. I was like, "Oh my god, if you're getting taught this from the age of four or three or four, you're being told you can't be friends with Christians, Jews, no wonder they weren't friends with us. This is everything to them. This is the teaching of God. This is what's perfect. This is how they have to live their life. They're not [snorts] allowed to be friends. They're just not allowed to." So of course if as a white family if we were bringing our children up and I tried to explain this to Muslim leaders in the town when it all started kicking off in Luton in 2009 that's when all this hit like it all come together with the formation of the English Defense League and lots of things happened. Thus if we were bringing our kids up from 3 years old or two years old and teaching them you don't be friends with blacks you do not be friends with blacks you're superior to blacks you're better than blacks blacks are all going to burn in hellfire. Blacks are evil. Blacks are cattle. Blacks are this. all the things that the Quran says about us, there would be an explosion of racism. And what we're seeing is an explosion explosion of religious intolerance towards us. Now, Christianity is not telling us that about Muslims. It's not telling us Muslims are specifically evil. It's not telling it's not it's and we're not embedded in it or weren't I was brought up a Catholic. My mom was a Catholic. Yeah. But we're not embedded in it the way that Islam is. And so, I think that that that was the foundations for for me. I can only I can only talk about my life experience of what I've seen, how I've seen it, how things have developed, the differences and I saw and then also the the surrender by you could be a victim and we've just seen I've spoke about this so many times. I've given an example. I'm out in Luton Town Center. My cousin's wife rings him and says get home. It's all kicking off up on the estate. So we fly up to the estate, get up there. Muslim men are there with baseball bats, poles. They're fighting the kids on the estate. The kids are like 14, 15 years old. All hell is going off. Police come screeching up in their cars. [snorts] They jump out. They run and jump on the on the white kids. They're holding the white lads on the floor while the Muslims are standing with weapons. And I'm like, what the hell are you doing? But that that I've seen that you're the victim and you're the victim again cuz the police don't jump on them and they don't attack them. And Henry Noyak, you know the case we're looking at now of the boy who's just been stabbed. He was stabbed five times. The seek claimed racism. Yeah. >> The police jumped on the white boy, handcuffed him, even though he's telling them he's been stabbed. They ignored him. They didn't jump on the free Muslims. There was one white boy, three Muslims, uh, free Sikhs, one white boy. They didn't jump on them. They didn't handcuff them. That same surrender to political correctness and the accusation of racism is what I've seen my whole life. So you can dig up leaflets from me in 2004 that I've I've showed at Oxford University where I spoke I wrote a leaflet in 2004 and I went around my town given these leaflets out basically saying that whites and blacks are being religiously and racially targeted in the town. Yeah. By by Muslim groups. The Muslim groups are not treated the same. We know which shops they use for heroine and grooming children. I didn't call it grooming. I said what they do is they use drugs as a weapon to entice young children on to to get them hooked on drugs to then prostitute them to pedophilic gangs. That's now called grooming. I spoke about this in 2004. Now when I done all these leaflets I said how how aren't the police doing anything? How do they crush us but they don't crush them? How do they attack us but they don't attack them? Now that same braveman spoke about two years ago two-tier policing. It's now become part of British vocabulary. Two-tier policing. Since October 7th, the whole world has been able to see exactly what I'd seen my whole life. And that surrender comes because of the fear of the Islamic community. Because of the fear of the way they mobilize, the fear of the way they cry racism, cry victim every time for Islamophobia, whatever word you want to use for it to shut you up. They cry these words and they're and they're extreme prone to violence like that. What's your when you think about how on earth it came to be that the government is stepping back and saying, "Okay, we uh have a default assumption that the when the SE guy says that there was racism here, that's we need to deal with that right away. We'll get to this guy in a minute." What do you think drives that belief system, that reaction? >> Uh institutional racism against us. >> Okay. >> And how do you think we ended up? because it it presumably if the cops were white, it is a type of self-loathing. So where if we so your argument is uh the Quran teaches you from the beginning not to associate with Christians and Jews. So that I think is you do become what you repeat what's reinforced. So when did we start reinforcing this idea of okay, white people are bad or whatever. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but that would lead them >> critical race theory. Um, I'd say that I'd say that the Metropolitan Police Force was found to be institutionally racist after Steven Lawrence murder. Yeah, that was fantastic. >> Yeah. But what I want to know is how does it become that? Because my takehome is for you to be effective and for you to get a um an honorable world. And we can debate what that looks like in a minute. But if if I for now just assume you have honorable intentions and you're trying to get to an honorable end state, which I'll give you a second to define in a minute. But with that assumption, then there's like we have to parse out how did we get here. And if it's just a default, everybody's evil or whatever, then this will become a a battle that I think turns negative no matter what. If instead it becomes humans are frail, humans can be um intellectually trapped by things, whether that's religion, critical race theory, whatever, then the solution becomes one of like let's agree what our values are, which I think is the biggest problem. I don't think England or America in my case knows what their values are anymore. Uh as they have left Christianity, which I'm not Christian, but at least it gives people a set thing that we can point to and go, "This this book tells you what we're about." And so it becomes easier to put that forward. And so I look at America and go um most people have never thought about what their values are. They are growing up with religion less and less until recently that's turning around. And a certain ideology has worked its way through the educational system. So oh, I get how we've ended up here. And so if I'm going to focus people on a solution, it isn't going to be us good them bad. It's going to be ooh this system is educating people with something that is creating this problem. >> Yeah. I'd say that political correctness and the fear of being branded a racist and the power of the word racist and the fear of losing your job and the fear of getting a black mark against your name has created a situation where automatically you don't have that fear when you're dealing with a white kid. You can you can beat the white kid with a baton. You're not going to lose your job. You're not going to be accused of racism. that accusation of racism and we have to say how powerful is that accusation. Well, we now know which we tried talking about since 2004. We now know that it was that powerful and you have to actually say this out loud to make sense of where we were at that entire police forces in every town and city let children get raped rather than be called racist. That's not my opinion. That's come out in the government investigation. >> You know, it's wild. Well documented, completely freaked out. >> That's how powerful. So when a when a police officer turns up for example to Henry a white boy dying and three seeks standing with knives. Yeah. He there's no flack for jumping on him. He hasn't even lo they haven't lost their jobs. He's dead. Look at the news reports of George Floyd and compare them to the news reports of of Henry who whose death is far worse. Far worse. But there's been a system that's embedded to glorify or to use these ones manipulate this system. Yeah. in order to silence the public, in order to scare the public. It's all been done intentionally. The accusation of racism has been used as a as and Kiama tried it this week again. It's used to instill fear in the public from speaking their open mind. >> By who and for what reason? >> By the establishment who have been intent on mass open border immigration to bring in lowkilled workers and and people who can be relying on the state. They have opened the borders and if you were allowed to talk openly about the problems, you'd start looking at them because >> them being the government >> them being the government and I'd say the corporations who are in control of our governments who are open to mass open border immigration. The European Union are quite clear. They want to break down the nation state. They wanted a European Union. Yeah, that's what they wanted. Mass. >> So they want a breakdown of the state. >> The breakdown of the state superstate. >> They want a super state. So the breakdown of national identity. They've been intent on it. They don't want your English, your German. They want your European, your European Union. That's been their intention. The United Nations are pretty open about their intentions. They're all pretty open about their intentions of of in of flooding our nations. Yeah. Flooding them. >> But just so let me track the logic. So we have corporations which are actually above the government. Then we have a European government that is trying to hoover everyone up into a bigger union so that they have control over more people. And since the corporation is after cheap labor, they want to import a bunch of people. As they import it, these are going to be people more likely to be reliant on the state. So the state loves it as well. >> State gets more power. The state gets more control. And then and then they then they bring in laws to deal with these problems. They they bring in the problem and then they bring in the law to do for example I just we just held a demonstration last week now just stop oil just stop oil were protesting in this country enraging the British public. Yeah. And whilst they were blocking roads and blocking ambulances the police were handing them bottles of water. [snorts] Now the reality is if I go block a road or my supporters the police will drag us out and beat us. That's the reality. The police were stood down. They were stood down in order to allow the public to get so furious which is what happened. People were that outraged with just stop oil. The government then bought in new laws just recently. They say to deal with just stop oil. Yeah. Well, I've just held a demonstration recently and we got given the the the there was talk of us doing a three-day camp outside our government and then the police gave us the new laws that they've got. I get 10 years. So, they've took our freedom. Our right to protest has been taken by creating an atmosphere through just up wheel. Yeah. in order because just stop oil weren't the target. We were the target or the the the wider public were the target. So they allow and just stop oil if you look at who funded these organizations, they're funded by the mass corporations. >> So they come in, they intentionally cause ma mainstream problems in the country that the the public get fed up with. The public then are demanding you, the government, please do something, please do something. They then bring in new laws and they get them passed cuz the public are so angry. Yeah. They get them passed without anyone really realizing what they're passing. And then those laws are used to now control us and stop us from protesting over issues which we feel upset about. >> Okay. So let me walk through the stack. Uh this is me trying to articulate what you're saying. So if I go astray, definitely tell me. >> Uh above everybody is the corporation. So the almighty dollar. Below them is this European Union that's trying to gather more people up to create a bigger state so that they control more people. there's collaboration between the money and the state because by bringing in all of these low-skilled workers that are um beholden to the government because they need government subsidies now we're able to get cheap labor. The problem is that we have a British identity in this case that would otherwise stop us from bringing in all of this cheap labor. So we have to destabilize them. You're calling it racism, but it sounds more to me, and now this is me using my own words, like those are just the people that are standing in the way. If it was black people standing in the way, then, and forgive me, between England and America, I never know what the right phrase is. Uh, in America, we say black. So, uh, that it's, if it were black people, then they would just say, "Oh, go after them." It's anybody who's trying to disrupt the consolidation of power. And so the thing that I would ask you is I understand given that you grew up in Luton that you've seen all this stuff firsthand. You're you're making contact with Muslims on the ground, grooming gangs. It it is a freak show. It it's horrible. It's more horrible than people can imagine. But by your own pyramid of tyrannical behavior, >> they're just a weapon of the of the state. Right. So given that it creates this vulnerability to just go Tommy Robinson's a racist [ __ ] why do we spend all of our time there instead of and this is now my thesis which you may reject, but my thesis is this is an entirely economic question and if we don't deal with the economics of everybody, but we'll just keep it to the British right now. the British are being stolen from and cheap labor [snorts] from anywhere for the reasons that you have already expressed is the perfect way to maintain power for the state in a way that allows them to deficit spend, print money, and extract the wealth from the working and middle class and give it to the wealthy. And I'm on a mission. Uh I I'm not as good at getting people to pay attention as you are, but I'm on a mission to get people to understand, oh, you are being stolen from, you are being manipulated. There really is a problem. Uh but that problem is economic and all the other stuff. It is important, and we'll get to why I share concerns about immigration, but mine are entirely around assimilation. And how does that breakdown feel? Do you feel like, oh, I get it. I could I can focus here at the ground level where me and my family are dealing with the guys that show up with baseball bats or I could be up here at the people that are actually pulling the strings. >> So a lot of these what we're talking about now is which I see as a matter of fact was a conspiracy 6 7 8 years ago. Yeah. >> Fair. >> So it wasn't that we were 100% certain this is what's happening and this is why they're doing it. So my mindset has considerably changed. For example, after September the 11th, I believed what they told us. Yeah. I believed it was a just war. I look back now and think, you're war criminals. >> You invaded the country and killed a million people, you scumbags, and then left us to deal with the radicalization dealt with. So, I sympathize with and question a lot after. But that wasn't back then. That's come with time. When I saw the lies on Ukraine, which I think is the European Union expansionist ideas, wanting bigger countries, more power, more wealth, more money. I see that as the problem. So my question and my mindset has changed a lot from where I was to where I am now. >> So where I am now, I'm looking thinking, well, and the reason why they wanted everyone silence was because if we were able to [snorts] talk about these rates or talk about the statistics, then we start questioning them. Well, this is policy failure. You've done this. You've all done this. And we'll start looking up at them. And they don't want us looking up at them, which is where we're at now. Whilst I sympathize that I believe the Islamic um immigration has been used and they've willingly and openly opened our borders, they know full well what Islam inte bringing it. Look what look what Catholics done with Protestants in Northern Ireland. Well, you don't think they know what bringing five, six, seven, eight million Muslims into Europe in into Britain's going to do with a value system totally alien. A value system that doesn't integrate. There's 45 countries in history we can look at and learn of what Islam does when it comes into a nation. That it's this isn't a mistake. It's not a mistake what's happening and every border in in the entire western civilization was opened and it's not like there it's not organized as in the European Union fund NOS's Germany specifically fund NGO organizations they literally go to the coast of Libya which wouldn't have been able to happen unless they took out Gaddafi and there's there's they they knew by taking out Gaddafi they're opening the borders they're opening they're opening the floodgates you Gaddafi used to hold it there yeah they removed Gaddafi intent eventually was that the right thing to do now was any of it Saddam Hussein was any of these things right to so they destabilize all these countries they then flood our country so I believe there is and and sitting here now I wouldn't have had this for you six years ago sitting here but I'm looking at it now the evidence the evidence is you know what you're doing you know what you're doing and as we clash with each other or we and then they bring in new terrorism we will end up in this country because of the level of violence we will end up begging them for more CCTV begging them and then they want to bring in now the digital ID to keep you safe from all the illegal immigrants that you've brought in. So, you've created the problem again. Then you're going to bring in a digital IG to take all of our freedoms that we'll end up begging you for. We need more CCTV. We need more cameras. We need more this because we're getting murdered, massacred, and raped across the country from the people you brought in. Again, every problem they've created, then they come in with their solution, which is to take more freedom and to implement more control. We end up like China, which is where we're heading anyway. We don't have free speech. We just don't do not have it. There is no free speech in this country. 12,000 arrests last year. We had two people arrested at our demonstration this week for having a sign saying [ __ ] Islam. >> Yeah, we we'll get to free speech because that's my particular thing that I get psychotic about. But >> um first I want to understand um when it comes to bringing people in. You said they know exactly what they're doing. We've touched on it a little bit, but why would they want to use specifically people that they don't think are going to integrate well to destabilize things? What's the point? >> Well, I'd say there's and not even just destabilized, but even the feminization of men, the weakening of men, the testosterone levels of men. >> Yeah, but that's not bringing in Muslims. That's not >> But I'd say I'd say all of that is to create a population that's controllable. is control to to control because whilst they bring in >> So are you saying that the bringing in a population they know won't integrate is simply about creating controllable people. >> No, I'd say bringing in No by feminizing men, they're creating controllable people. But I'd say where men where we're clashing with the Muslim community, which is what's currently happening. Yeah. While we're clashing with the Muslim community and we're looking at each other and we're waring with each other or whatever's going to happen, they're taking all of our rights. They're going to use all of this as an excuse to come in and seize rights and everything they've done. If you look at the amount of new European laws, >> meaning so just to put a very fine point on it, um, Muslims are brought in specifically because they do not integrate. We know you will fight as you're fighting. That justifies the surveillance state, which allows us to have more control. >> Yep. Total control. >> Got it. >> Total control of every single second of every single aspect of your day in life. Every aspect of it. >> Now, you're so at the forefront of this, you know that there's a huge percentage of people that think your interpretation of this is absolutely crazy. If you had to steelman their argument, like literally make the best case you can, what is it they see differently than you? We can get to why they're wrong later, but first >> I'm about to sit at the Oxford Union on a debate panel. Yeah. >> Respect. >> On this side, which has come a long way cuz I last was there in 2015, then I got banned from every university because they didn't want people listening to what we're saying. They realized if if if people allowed to listen to what we're saying, they probably think he's quite reasonable actually. He's not the big farright Nazi thug we were told he is. Yeah. But on the opposition panel to me it should we be suspicious of Islam is Peter Oorn I think his name is is Jacob Ree Mock. Jacob Ree Mock lives in Somerset. It has a 0.6% Muslim population. He couldn't find a Muslim if he tried. So of course he doesn't have to be suspicious of Islam cuz he doesn't live with it. >> The other gentleman lives in one burrow of London, Chiswick, which has the least Muslim population of any other bur in London. So, of course, again, you don't have to be suspicious cuz when your daughter walks to the shop, it's not happening, is it, mate? But you're going to tell me that I shouldn't be suspicious when there's 45 mosques in my town when my whole town's gone. And and this is the problem with many of these ideas. And I say [snorts] many of these ideas cuz you see this liberal leftwing sort of mindset, this woke ideology. I don't know anyone who had that ideology growing up. We we all think the same in Luton cuz we're we're embedded with it in the working-class community. We get it. Yeah. Same in Rodale, same in Olden. Same in these towns. So, for example, you you know, you said it's about the economy. [snorts] Like, do you think the Brexit vote, what do you think that was about? Because no one cared about the economy. I'll be honest. No one voted for Brexit. People weren't thinking, "We'll have more money if we do this. We'll have more money if they didn't care. We'll have less money." Yeah. We want our identity back. We want our country back. Yeah. That's what the vote was about. And I'll give you an example. I've got a friend who's a very high ranking in a top company. and there's their board and he's with their board and he's sitting down talking to their board and he told me this story and he said they're all laughing about the Brexit vote thinking you got no chance. Yeah, you got no chance. This friend has done exceptionally well. Yeah. He said lads I just want to point you. I've just been on stag with 30 lads from Luton. Every single one of them is voting Brexit. So your world what you see and what we see two totally different things. I don't blame you. Yeah. And I don't blame you. And so when I went and I went on a a Brexit rally in London. Um I went on the Europe pro- European Union rally in London and I remember getting on the train. Do you know where they all got off? St. Orbins. >> Do you know St. Orbins? No. >> A beautiful little market town. Beautiful. It's got no problems. It's got no problems. So all the protesters, none of them got off at Luton. There was no one. And look at the areas that voted for Brexit. Luton, Birmingham, Brad. All the areas with the Muslim populations that are affected come out in their numbers that shock shocked the entire establishment and voted for Brexit and it wasn't a vote for economy economics. It was no one cared about it. We'll have less money. We'll have less money. We want the country back. We want control of our nation. Let me steal man argument so I can get to what I'm trying to do and then you can tell me what the argument is against it. Um but if I were going to take the side that looks at you and they're just like this guy is going to ruin England. It goes something like this. Um, England has been unjustly rewarded for empire. We went around the world and we raped and pillaged our way around. we at one point 25% of the world um was under our thumb and we extracted their resources and what we left behind was a system of extraction that even to this day as much as the people in the city of London meaning the the financial center want to hide and pretend that this isn't true we have corrupt elites that have created a central banking system that allows us to destabilize and impoverish uh resourcerich countries ries and we extract those resources with the help now of America. But that wasn't the case before. And now with America, we go around and we siphon all this wealth off of all these other places. And so while I may be empathetic to certainly the grooming gangs and things like that, yeah, my default assumption is that this poor person who has come from a country that we have destabilized and done these horrible things to, um, they're here and I would like to atone for the things that we have done and make sure that they have an opportunity to get a leg up. um just as we were able to generate such tremendous wealth on the back of their resources. >> I'd say that which culture or which country didn't do that? If we look at the Barbrey Pirates with the slave trade, far more slaves than in the black slave trade. We were victims of that slave trade. Are we do we want repatriations from that? I'd say that where we're at now, what's happened in history is happened in history. We ended the slave trade. Our military ended slave trade while the Muslims were still trying to continue it. We had to send the Navy out to stop them. Yeah, we have only just finished paying our tax as taxpayers. Now, me, you, anyone in this country, to free the slaves cuz it got charged to us, the people. Yeah. So, the British public have done our part to pay that. I would say when you look around the world, any we can pick fault of any culture, any history, any country, find the wrongs. But why don't we look at the great it's done as at the same time? We've gifted so much to the world. I'm not going to apologize for the history of our nation. Every country's made mistakes. Every country's got a bad history. Everyone. Everyone. And by people who think like this, I understand well-meaning liberals. I'd say a liberal is someone who with great intentions many of the time. Yeah. Some of them ideological Marxist, communist, they want destruction. They want to destroy the system, end capitalism. But a general just liberal who sees the best in people and wants to help people. They're naive to what they're helping. You You want to destroy our country. So to save these people, you want to bring people in that that are going to cause destruction in our country. You're not saving the world. Well, you let 100,000 Afghanis in, you're not saving the people of Afghanistan. You're not changing nothing. You're just going to bring that that war mindset into our nation. So, that's why that's the the point I'd make. And I'd say that um [snorts] I'd say that it's not to to to argue with the people about you just haven't you know, 15 years ago, I used to walk the streets. I was hated. I was hated. Yeah. And I've seen I haven't shifted one bit, Tom, in what I say. Not one single bit. Yeah. Do you know what shifted? public opinion. >> So why shifted? Because they've all seen what I've seen. They've all realized years on, whether it be through my journalism, whether it be through experiences themselves in their own towns and cities, whether it be Islamic community, whether it be rapes from the men in the hotels, whatever it is, the terrorism, the jihad, whatever it is, the public shifted. I haven't shifted one bit. So to straw man the argument, I don't need to cuz time will prove everything I've said is true. Time will prove that those people will end up apologizing to me and understanding you were right. And that doesn't mean we have to be horrible to to every single person. It doesn't mean that I say deport every single Muslim now. Yeah. But non-integrated unassimilated communities which are not going to integrate or assimilate, they're a burden on the taxpayer that are costing our country. For example, my local imam has 14 children with three wives. Why am I paying for those free houses? Yeah. This madness has to end. The benefit system now is it's gone the wrong way. We're paying out more in benefits than than as as a country we're earning. And that that can you can only sustain these sorts of figures when you have a 1% 2% population. But as that keeps doubling every 10 years, the Islamic community for example, we have 40,000 Muslims on a terror watch list. Do you know to monitor that 40,000? We only we only monitor the top the top 3,000 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. 9 billion pound a year. 9 billion pound a year. When that 40,000 when the population doubles because it's just a numbers game, it's going to become 80,000. We have 70,000 members of our armed forces. You can't sustain it. It's unsustainable to continue the path we're going down as a nation. Now, we either get brave, we get courageous, and we come and confront this head on. And to confront it head on, we do in a balanced way, but we start encouraging people, maybe you shouldn't be here. Maybe we can help you to leave this country because if you don't love this country and you hate it and you, for example, 2 million British Muslims who want Sharia law, you need to go. You need to go. And that tough conversation and that tough reality, which is where this is heading. It's heading in America. I've gone and looked at the statistics numbers of what they're doing in America, the Muslim Brotherhood, the control they have here, what they're doing in the United States. This is all coming to an almighty clash at some point. It either comes to a clash whilst we can still survive as a nation or we just surrender and lose our nation, lose our culture, lose our country, lose our identity and we give up and put the white flag up to the Islamic community and say, "Okay, you have that town, you have that town, you have this town, you have that." And I'm sorry, there's a thousand years when you actually start looking deeply and thinking about where we are right now, which I think about where we are as a country. And then you look at previous generations [snorts] who run, bled, died, every emotion, every pain, every suffering you can think of, they did it for us. They done it without a question of a doubt because they saw there was something greater than them. Yeah. We have now created a generation of selfish, selfish people who don't see anything greater than me. Me. Yeah. And I I experienced this. I talk about Israel. I was in Israel and I met 10 lone soldiers. Now, a lone soldier is someone who has no family in Israel, but they're Jewish. And their family and and they go and and they serve in the IDF to fight for Israel, to fight for the Jewish state. And I met these 10 lads and thought, "This is what we're missing. These young 10 these 10 young men. No one here is signing up. No one here wants to fight for to save Britain. They're not going to give their lives. These realize there's something greater than them. There's the future of the Jewish people and the future of the Jewish state. We've created an entire population that doesn't really give a [ __ ] about anyone else. That's what we've become. And I used to sit there and say to my mates when I started the English Defense League, I say, "Don't you care?" Right? I'm all right. I'm all right. I've moved out of Luton. I've got a nice house. And that's and by getting everyone financed up, you either don't care or you can't say anything cuz you're financed up to the top. And you know with with one month's paycheck loss, you're done. Your family's done. The ability to eat, the ability to live, the ability to succeed, it's all done. So they've created an entire generation that's relying on their money. Yeah. That they can't even step out. And I see and and we I think that dam sort of bursting now, but it took a long time to get it to the position. So on culture or on protest, I started protesting and I've learned a lot. I'm sitting here now. I'm 43 years old. When I started, I was 25. I was a young angry man. I was pissed off and and we were pissed off. Pissed off with the rape of our daughters. Pissed off with all these problems. Yeah. And we knew no other outlet than hit the street. And when we hit the street, I look back at some of our actions and the way we behaved and totally questionable, totally um wrong at times >> because it was physically aggressive. Uh we were a we were we used to have a saying prepare for peace ready for war as a movement of young men. We you death, prison or glory. We're not submitting. You're not going to beat us into submission. That was the mindset. >> And the mindset was bringing young men who were willing to fight because we had to be willing to fight. If you're going to go out on the street, and I try and explain it, >> female nurses and doctors, I say this all the time, we're not going to stop jihadists on the street. They're not going to come out against them. Yeah. It's going to be a man of a certain mindset. So what's the part of that that you disagree with now? >> Um we we were a pressure movement and I felt it was my job to put pressure on the Muslim community. I remember sitting in a hairdressers in Luton and there's a Muslim girl in there and she was talking about getting home because the English Defense League are coming. I didn't feel good. I s thought wow like really you feel like cuz we were going into the city center but the English fence league was a woman could walk through a hijab. No one's going to attack a woman. That's the reality. Yeah. If someone attacked a woman in a hijab people probably hit themselves. English men. Yeah. It wasn't the way it was, but the way it was envisaged by members of the Muslim community, they're under attack. Yeah. And what that actually done, which I watched it do, it was led susceptible. Um, it led to a position that was very easy for the jihadists or the extremists that we're meant to be opposing. It left them fertile recruiting recruiting ground. So fast forward, I realized 2014 at the same time I left the English Defense League and I thought we we we're lucky no one's been killed in a major way. Five Muslims were put in jail. They got caught with guns and bombs, suicide vests on the way to kill us. If they'd have been successful, I think the sectarian conflict had hit would have hit off at that point in Britain. >> You blow up an English fence demo that things are coming back. That's what how it was at the time. Yeah. So I I had a lot of time to I sat in jail for years. And a lot of times think where's this headed? Why are we going? What do we want? How do we get where we want? Yeah. So I decided that you used to have to get on the streets and when you get on the streets you'd have 10,000 men in women mainly men. It was it wasn't women and there was a few but it was a ma male-dominated movement and you'd use that position to talk and highlight your your problems. Then [snorts] come these and then come Facebook and then come social media. And then I realized and Ezra Levant contacted me when I come out of jail 2014 and I'd left the English fence league and I was turning I was going back on a new life. I was going back to trying to earn money and and he said uh you need to show the world what you know, what you've seen, what you've experienced, what women have experienced. Show them using journalism. And that and [snorts] that was the point I become a citizen journalist. And I started and I devoted my my life then to becoming a journalist, understanding being a journalist, telling stories, making sure people can see what I've seen. And I become a journalist. And fast forward then to and I went to a demonstration in Germany, Pageda it was called. And you know, English Defense League was so difficult for them to stop because it was such a good day for men. Like it was like England way but better. Yeah. For young men it was. And it happened >> because they were standing for something. >> Standing for something. Camaraderie, brotherhood, and excitement. You're going into a city where Muslim gangs coming out to fight you. It was it was chaos for young men full of testosterone that didn't mind that cuz men do that on a Saturday. They go to one city to fight the other football club. Those sort of men were coming together. So, and the reason they couldn't break it was identity. It was a strong identity being a member of the English league. Men had tattoos all over, medial tattoos. So, that was an issue for them for them to try and stop. And they couldn't really stop it. and and it was because of those senses. But I remember my mate who I become friends with, he he started following me as a journalist and he he was opposed to me. I'm still good friends with him now. [snorts] He was making a documentary and he was opposed to me and there was a demonstration in East London we had and he went up to 10 people afterwards and asked him what was the best part of what I said. None of none of them even knew what I said and he showed me afterwards. He said, "I'm not even listening to you." Right. And and what I used to look at is after people go to the pub halfway through after people would be there to throw things. So then I went to a Pagida event in Germany 2015 this new movement hit off in West Germany in Dresden and then when I went there 40,000. So I sent someone I was on license from from jail so I couldn't leave the UK. So I sent someone to see what they're about because I' I'd left the English fencley behind but I saw what they were doing as important. So I sent someone to see were they Nazis, what was the score? He come back said they're not Nazis, it's normal people and and [snorts] they're So I went to the event >> and just really fast for those watching at home. If they had been Nazis, would that be disqualifying or >> disqualifying? I'm from Luton. I hate them. I hate Nazis. I hate I hate racism. I hate racism. Yeah. I'm I've never been a racist. I have a problem with Islam as an ideology. Yeah. Um the the real racist or the real extreme right, they hate me. I'm a race traitor. I'm a Zionist. I'm all these different things. Yeah. I'm hated by all of them. All the groups, whether it be the jihadists, the far right, the far left, they all come together. But so I went to Germany and I remember watching as they stood for three or four hours. We're there now. They stood for four three or four hours listening to every word of every speech. [snorts] And when they left, they went one bit of litter and I felt so embarrassed of how we'd carry conducted oursel. I learned a lot just going there because I thought if I ever do this again and then but I didn't because I felt I felt I remember when when I left the English fence league people were calling for us to march back through Luton that's my hometown we've done two marches there I [snorts] felt it would be wrong to bring the English fence league back to my town cuz we we highlighted a lot of issues but I felt the negative effect of what another demonstration might do >> what exactly would be the negative >> just the clashes the clashes the divide >> the clashes or the way that it would make them feel because you said something interesting where you said >> I left because I didn't like that they were afraid of us. That's me putting a slightly different word to it and like that they were afraid of us but now you've also said that we need to make them feel again my words but unwanted. >> Yeah. Not afraid. Not unwanted. No. So with the English fence league that was my job. My job I was a pressure movement. My job as a pressure movement was to put >> pressure. But the interesting part is when you decide to eject out of that cuz you don't like that. >> Yeah. I didn't think it would be right for things come back to my town. So, who am I to bring it to another town? That's how I felt at the time. I was and I was weighing it all up thinking >> because you don't like the way that it makes them feel. >> No, because I felt that we'd highlighted a lot of the issues. We'd got them to the forefront. >> Yeah, but you said it wouldn't be right. Why wouldn't it be right? >> Uh because it could potentially end in mass conflict on the street. >> But that's it. If they feel terrible, they feel like we want >> terrible. What I'm trying to explain to Muslims is we feel terrible. Our daughters ain't safe. Do you think there's any parent who lives near a Muslim community who thinks their daughter's safe walking down the street? We don't feel safe. So whilst you don't feel it every day, without being rude, none of your daughters are getting raped. I don't think there's one single case of of non-Muslim men who have raped a Muslim girl. I don't think there's one. Find me one. Find me one. Yeah. There's 1,400 in one town called Roam. There's 1,000 victims in one town called Telford. So our daughters are being raped across the nation. Yeah. So when we're talking about you feeling safe, it's us getting attacked. It's us. It's us that aren't safe. Yeah. As non-Muslims. >> How do you address Because just from a statistical standpoint, they are way more likely to be raped by uh a white person and likely somebody that they know [snorts] >> who are any woman. >> Um okay. So I'll address that in the sense that pedophilia, the majority of pedophiles in the UK are white because the majority of the UK is white. But Muslim men make up 3% of the British population. They're responsible for 90% of the convictions of groups of men that rape kids. 90% from 3%. 30% of the men convicted are called Muhammad. [snorts] Got a problem here. And you got to be able to talk about it. But you weren't able to talk about it. Remember they they they went for me when I started talking about this in 2009. I got the full weight of the British state. They smashed me. They smashed me. They targeted me. They froze my assets. They closed my companies. I had two successful companies, seven properties. I was a successful young businessman at the time. They went for me. And they went for me because they've all got dirty hands because the level of cover up across our nation has been in every town and city coming from the top. It's come from government level, >> I'd say royal level. Yeah. To cover these crimes to cover up these crimes and hide these crimes. And they successfully done it. Remember, [cough] say out loud, 30,000 children in Telford, [clears throat] where I focus my investigations and my documentary work in a series called The Rape of Britain. There's 1,000 victims in that small town. [snorts] Now, if there's 1,000 victims, that's 1,000 families and they covered it up. 1,400 children in Roam. If each one of those children have four family members, that's 10,000 people directly affected in small town of Roam and they covered it up. They covered all these crimes up and they successfully done it through fear, for intimidation, and then come along us with the English Fence League, which without sounding rude, we weren't fearful and you weren't going to intimidate us. So, but [snorts] but as I said, I was 25, 26. I'm now 43. If you look at what we've done now, we fast forward now. Um I was deplatformed, censored, deleted, erased, invisible, imprisoned, every attack, every everything you can think of. And then Elon Musk bought X. And when he bought X, I believe now most of our problems come well, they come from the Islamic community and their and their values, but they come from our lack of values. I I sat with a group called, and this is it was pretty embarrassing. There's a gentleman called Martin Selner who has been labeled every word under the sun. Yeah. Very intelligent guy. Be great for you to have a podcast with. Yeah. Demonized far worse than I was as an extremist because I think he did lean further to the right back then. And I sat with him and he talked about his movement called generation identity and their value [snorts] system. They don't drink. They don't do drugs. They're faithful to their wife, their woman. I sat and felt, God, we've lost all our morals as men, which is where we're at now trying to address these issues. Because I look around all of us and we don't have any values. We're pretty immoral in every sense. Most men now in compared to 30, 40, 50 years ago. Yeah. >> That's what we've created. a system. And so Elon Mus turns back on my page and I contacted I don't know if you know Lawrence Fox, Katy Hopkins, um Mayor Tusi, um Jeff Taylor. I contacted 10 12 [snorts] people. Um we uh Jordan Peterson flew in at the time for the meeting. I contacted them and said, "Can we set up a meeting? Um I'm coming back to UK. We've watched October 7th and we've seen the alliance of the far left and the Islamists coming together across the whole West and the whole world had then seen two-tier policing. You can call for the gas and the Jews, no one gets arrested. You can fly the al-Qaeda and h and ISIS flag, no one gets arrested. Yeah. If you're a patriot on a demonstration, you get smashed by the police and you get nicked. Yeah. So, everyone had seen all this two-tier policing. So, I flew back, set up a meeting and um basically we sat together and said, "Right, do we all agree British culture is in danger?" "Yes." How do we change this? We as as whether you call us influencers like say like you were brought to the table, you got 5 million subscribers. So we I bought people. I looked at subscriber lists and thought you got a million, you got 500,000. I only hadex at the time. I didn't have YouTube banned on all other socials. So we needed someone who had Facebook. We needed someone who had Instagram. [snorts] So we brought all these people together and we sat for two days and we worked on a board and [snorts] said give us the 10 most important values that you think or let's so we we all went through we got it down to five that all of us agreed on. We were calling it the pledge. It was going to be called the pledge. [snorts] So we all wanted to pledge to these values and this as a cultural movement and the idea was that it wasn't my cultural movement because if I just come and said here's our VI values then none of these people feel part of it. So the fact that we sat for days and then months negotiating are we a Judeo-Christian country or are we a Christian country? Is our value system come from Judeo culture? Judeo-Christian culture or is it a Christian culture in England? Yeah, it's Christian. So with the thousand years of of Christian history. So we went through all these things and we we we wrote down that we stem from a Judeo-Christian culture and we need to get back to that. We need to understand the value system that built this nation. We're all totally for free speech. So we need to defend that. And the idea was that people take a pledge and if and our idea was to build such a movement that we want politicians to agree with these five values and if they do agree with it we'll support you as a movement. We'll be activists. We've got more activists than any and people can see this was two 2024 goes actually put these forward. >> We put we put we we come to these five values. So free speech Judeo-Christian culture we're against mass immigration we're against Islam and we're the Islamization and we're against LGBTQ plus indoctrination of children in the education system. And that's the five things we agreed on. We don't agree on Israel, Palestine, not all of us. We don't agree on this conflict, that conflict, the European Union. We don't agree on Ukraine. We don't care what we don't agree on. Let's look at what we agree on. And then our idea was that that politics is down river from culture. If we can't set up a political party, we can't. Yeah. You need 20 million, 30 million, 40 million pounds. You need 10 15 years. You need the influence. And then you need to the backing of corporations and mass money. and then they influence. That's what happens in every every political movement. Yeah, it's happening now even I believe of a reform. So, but politicians will simply ride the wave of success and if culture changes, they'll change. So, we had this plan and I'd say we've been incredibly successful and you look at where we're at now and and the over and window and the discussions that are now being had across the UK on TV. They were unthinkable to have these discussions two years ago. The talk of remigration was it wasn't it wasn't a thing. You couldn't say that 24 months ago. So we we met up and we agreed that overnight if we work together all of us here at a click of a button we've got a larger reach than the BBC World Service. We can reach the world. We can reach the country. >> So in a world where you guys win, what what's the message that you put out? What does the world look like? >> So this message and this this message was to stop talking about what we're against what we're against in the sense of if we're going to have a cultural movement, it just needs to celebrate British culture. We need to get back to who we are. We need >> those five things. >> Those five things were the values. But on the street when we go that we agree on so we agreed we all agree on this. Let's work together. Yeah. Now when we hit the street [snorts] I've learned a lot. I know how to demonstrate. I know how to not not demonstrate. I know what works and what doesn't work. I've seen infiltration. I've seen we have a government body called the special demonstration squad. Now their job was to infiltrate peaceful. And it's not just you have to understand that or the public have to understand whether you be an animal rights organization or an organization against Islam, the government don't like you and they want to control you. Yeah. Anyone who can embody people together and change minds or bring people out on the street. They want to crush. You're a threat. Yeah. Whether it be on animal whatever rights it's on, whatever protest movement it is, they want to infiltrate here and they want control of it. So we learned that no face covering. So I went for my I flew back and I had a meeting with the police after after our meetings. I called a meeting with the police and I sat down with the police and said right I had held a demonstration since English Defense League. So all they know of our demonstrations is chaos. >> So when I met the police I said lads like we want to start a new relationship because we've clashed with you for the last decade as English men. Yeah. Every time we have a nationalist rally or a patriarch rally you come out and riot shields and you end up beating us and we end up beating you. That's what that's what's happened. Yeah. We don't. And also since my last protest in 2015, it's now 2024. I'm a I've learned a lot. Yeah. I've fought a lot. And it's 9 years later, 10 years later, a decade later. So I said that what I've done is here's how Black Lives Matter were allowed to protest. I'm just showing you and here's what you wore as police officers and here's how you treated them. Here's the pro Palestinian demonstrations for the last 12 months. Here's how you treated them. Yeah. Now, I'm going to organize an event, and if you know, if I want to, I can organize an event in East London. Yeah. But I'm specifically not going to do that. If you agree to respect us as a as a as a country's people. Yeah. We want the same rights and respect that all these other groups had. And we will police oursel. You won't have to have right shields because if anyone steps out of line, we'll deal with them oursel. So, we don't want you to police us. We're going to police ourselves. And if you don't if you if you go back on this first agreement, then I promise you I'm going to hold a demonstration on the same day as a Palestinian rally and I'm going to do it in East London. Yeah, I don't want to do that. But unfortunately, it's the only language I've learned through the English fence league. The only language they understand is when they're worried. So I said, "We won't do that. We'll work with you." And then we set our first event up. We had a girl on the piano. We had Jerusalem. We had Land of Hope and Glory. we get and you know what the the purpose of the movement was about giving people back the sense of identity to celebrate who they are and the sense of community. So on the first event I said look at the man next to you look at the woman next to you hug them. These are your country's people and they're the people that going to be standing next to you in this battle that we're going into. Yeah. And we're here not as a threat, not we're here to celebrate who we are and we're here to control our emotions and to direct cuz I believe we are heading to an almighty clash unless we solve this problem democratically >> because there is no assimilation that you see on >> it's not going to happen. It's just not going to happen. It can't happen. Islam doesn't allow it to happen. So Islam doesn't allow it to happen. So, but but we didn't want to focus on the Muslim community in our in what we're building because most of this wouldn't have been allowed to happen if we were strong in our own values anyway. If we had strong sense of community, strong sense of identity, men were strong, what happened in Reverend would have never happened. It happened because we're lost, we're at football, we're fighting, we're taking drugs, it happened because of the destruction of who we are. That's what's happened. So, we need to rebuild something from the bottom up. And I contacted Jordan Peterson in the sense that I looked at ARC at what they do. [snorts] And they're basically creating a cultural revolution, but a cultural revolution can't come from the educated. So which is why we invited Jordan in. He come it has to come from the bottom. And we want to create a bottomup movement that gives people back their voice in a in a in a and I think that if you look at the success of where we're at even last weekend even against provocation and what we what we've entered into now and I'm very grateful to the Metropolan Police Force and the Metropolan Police Force was the best police force in the world and they become a laughingtock on the world stage because of two-tier policing because of political policing [snorts] and there I've watched an entire battle within the Met Police Force myself. I've seen them change how they treat us, how they view us. I've seen them go to battle with the government over our demonstrations. I've seen the government try to use them again in our last September 13th. They wanted us to clash and riot with each other. They knew it. We knew it. I sat down with the police. We both knew it. They want us to fight. Yeah. We don't want to fight, lads. And they said, "We don't want to fight you. We just want a safe a safe event for families." Well, that's what we're here for. Yeah. But for a decade, 20 years, they've been used against us. We've stupidly walked into a lot of it through anger. So, we're where we're at now. And I think anyone who watches our last event on Saturday, it was beautiful. And it's giving people back that hope and not just that hope, but confidence as a nation. You're not alone. You're not a fringe movement. Your thoughts aren't fringe. You're mainstream. The mainstream are against these values. The mainstream are against mass immigration. We've tried to vote our way out of this. They're not listening. But >> let me ask you, what would you um consider a win if you had to rank order these? So one what you're describing now we there's some uh reverse immigration people are leaving the country you obviously close the borders you stop the small boats all that or there is something happens and we get a secularized Muslim community that gets real influence and they really start becoming British. >> Yeah. Um unfortunately okay and I've gone log ahead with this and I've searched for that solution that you're saying the second solution. It's impossible. It It won't happen. And essentially the radicals, if we look at what's happened in Iraq, if we look at what happened in Iran, the peaceful majority, who I'd say are secular, I'd call them cultural Muslims, cuz many Muslims don't follow Islam. Yeah. They're just decent Muslims. If you pick a decent Muslim, you go down to the local betting shop now, if we go outside, there'll be loads of Muslims in there. They're not following Islam. Okay. But I call them cultural Muslims. But the extremists and the radicals have control and the the peaceful majority if you want to call them that. I wouldn't say the majority because the majority of Muslims worldwide want Sharia law. Um the figures show that I think 91% of Pakistanis believe stoning for adultery is acceptable. 91%. Yeah. It's not a minority. Okay. 99% of Afghanis want Sharia law. It's not a minority. 87% of Palestinians want Sharia law. It's not a minority. Yeah. So these are not minorities that have a totally different value system. If when you get a 99% Afghani rate of wanting Sharia law and then you bring them into the UK, they don't leave that value system at the border. We're in Britain now. Let's crack on. They bring it with them. And we see that influence and that's what we're experiencing. So I wish there was a solution like you say for reformation within Islam. But there's not. The last time someone tried to reform Is Muslim was after Wahib and we created Wahibis Wahhabism because Muhammad Muhammad was a not a moral man at all. He murdered, he pillaged, he raped, he had sex with a child. These are the value systems of some of people who are taught to believe this is perfect in all of time at all of time. Not there was perfect 1400 years ago that whatever he did then is acceptable to do today. This is the value breakdown. This is the system that it just you it's oil and water and if you want these value systems and you want to live in Afghanistan, you want to live in >> but out of curiosity. So [snorts] obviously we've watched it happen to Christianity. So the Old Testament has some crazy [ __ ] in it. Uh but we went through a reformation even in the 1400s. We were running the crusades under the banner of Jesus Christ which is wild. I think Jesus would take exception to that. Uh but nonetheless we did it. But there was a reformation and we were able to get on the other side of that. When I look at the UAE, when I look at Saudi and the Abraham Accords and the way that they're >> moving, >> yeah, they're trying. >> The new king of Saudi. Yeah, it's moving. >> So, um, given that, is there not like if you were going to dual track something and say, okay, listen, the Brits, we have to understand what our identity is because we've got people that have come into our country. They have to know like what it means to be British, what it means to assimilate and expecting that road of change, but you you've seen it happen to Christians. You see it maybe it sound like you acknowledge it's happening in some of the Muslim countries, but the same >> you see is not being applied to the people that have >> you see those Muslim countries for example, the ones you named United Arab Emirates, the Muslim Brotherhood's banned there. It's not banned here. All the push for that his but to hear. Yeah. But it's I'm not willing to play the lottery with my kids future or my nation's future. >> I'm not willing to. And I [clears throat] don't think any of us need to be now. And I think we're at the point now it's like enough is enough here. We're not going to become a minority. We can't. Is it right? I to the Is it right that blacks become a minority in Nigeria? It's not. Is it? Is it right that the Japanese become a minority in Japan? It's not. Well, the city we're sitting in now is 33% white English. It's not right. It's just not right. And it shouldn't We shouldn't accept that. And we shouldn't tolerate the rest of the country going down that path because with the demographic change comes the cultural change comes the national change. It's a different country and we want this country to resemble the country that we bought up in that my parents were brought up in and that a thousand years of English thousand years of history have sacrificed for. >> Okay. Let me ask the hardest question. So, >> um [snorts] I'll agree with you that every country has the right to say we're not going to become a minority in our own country. And watching the way that Japan is playing this is very interesting because they're like this place is going to be Japanese. >> Uh and as somebody who is just an I am completely enamored with Japanese culture, so I love that. Um, and then at the same time, it's a very different thing when you say your government did let a lot of people in who have come and they're making a life for themselves here. And the level of disruption that it would be to um kick them out of the country would be massively disruptive. And so I do think that there's >> Yeah. But I think that there is a conversation that has to be had around what does our value system permit and not permit. And so to me, there's a big difference between not letting people in and then forcing people out. Now, if you if you came legally, illegal is a totally different. You're here legally, we have the right to boot you out. That's for me that's easy. >> Okay. >> But the legal immigrants becomes the hard question because I think that there is a moral thing that has to be faced there. >> Yeah. I'm not saying go round up legal migrants and kick them out. I'm not saying that. I'm saying they're legal migrants, criminals, jihadists like the 40,000 on terror watch list with dual nationality. any of the criminals um they're the first that need to leave. What I'm saying is that you could encourage people who are non-integrated, non similar. >> When you say encourage, what I hear £100,000, see you later. >> Okay. So purely financial >> financial just financial just financial but stop surrendering everything. What Japan has just said is we're not going to cater for halal in our schools. We're not going to cater for halal in the prison system. Why are we catering for all this? Why are we changing everything? Why are we not just changing it for them, but we're changing it for us? I've been in the prison system. Everything's allowed. You are getting nonhalow. Why am I Why is that happening? Why are any of these things happening? So, when I'm not saying make it difficult, but you could just have some foundations of who you are and stop changing everything for a minority minority of the country and stop changing it for a different culture or a different idea. But when I say economically, so there was a study come out of Holland and what it showed is Muslim immigration. The first generation that come here were dependent and a burden on the state. The second generation were dependent and a burden on the state. The third generation were dependent and a burden on the state. This isn't going to work. So at some point you're going to have to make a decision because you can't pay for everyone as the numbers increase. >> And [snorts] I'm not saying go round and forcly I believe you could quite easily encourage people with financial benefit to go home. And when I say get home, they've got a home to go to. We haven't. Where are we meant to go? When this country changes beyond belief, where are the English meant to go? This is England. Yeah, Afghanis can go back to Afghanistan quite happily. They do. They go back there. They come here and they continue to go back there all the time. They continue to go back to Pakistan all the time. But when we look at migration and those who have claimed asylum, you went through 16 safe countries to get here. This isn't asylum. You're an economic migrant. You illegally entered this country. You lied on your forms. And you'll hear, I'd say, unlawfully. Many of them. Many, many of them. And if you're going to be here as a Somali family who don't speak English, who have six children, and you don't work, go home. I don't think that's outrageous at all. >> Do you have policy prescriptions that you would put in place? >> I wouldn't I wouldn't benefit anyone, which I I was looking at certain political parties now. I don't think no one should gain political benefit based on race. Yeah. at all. [snorts] I just I don't believe they should. And and I believe that I believe which I get a lot of criticism for is because of my best friends that I've grown up with. They might be black, they're British. I don't give a [ __ ] Yeah. They're second, third generation, integrated, assimilated, hardworking. I'd [snorts] fight against anyone saying they have have to leave. And and it'd be the same for anyone who's integrated, assimilated, and working hard. But why are we paying benefits? Why are we all going to work British people to pay for the percentages speak for themselves in the United States? Look at the Somali community, 90% of them on benefits. It's not going to work. >> Do you want to put uh blind means testing or do you want to say Muslims can't have it and British people? Yes. Muslims, no. >> I believe there should be a benefit cap on children um for everyone. I don't believe a white family should be able to have 10 children, sit there and everyone pay for it either. Yeah. It's like get up and go work. get up and go work in world. >> So you're perfectly fine with whatever policy you put forward. It is going to be blanket. >> It'll be blanket. But what I would do is stop Saudi, stop Qatar, stop Iran funding any Moscow or Madras. We can look I understand the national as a country. We need their money. Yeah. They we've sold out everything for them. Qatar own more property in this capital city than the royal family. >> So do you want to put a moratorium on capital from outside from Islamic Sharia driven nations? Full stop. So even if that's buying property, investing in a sports team, sorry, no more. >> I I don't I don't believe that it brings a negative influence for those nations. They then control entire institutions. They control Barclays Bank, Sains, half of Sainsbury's, every port in this country. Of course, they got the government by their balls. Of course, the government can't come out against them. They've got the they've got the economy and the infrastructure of the nation like that. Look at the universities, the funders of the universities. >> And you'd rather just not have the money? rather have less money as a nation but have control over our value system and and who's good and who's bad. Qatar is the home of the Muslim Brotherhood. Qatar without [snorts] Qatar we wouldn't have had Hamas. We wouldn't have had the Muslim Brotherhood. We wouldn't have had Alqaaida. I don't believe without Qatar. Qatar is the base for all of this. Yeah. Yet our country are allies with Qatar. Why? I went into Qatar. I went into Alazer and when [snorts] I went in there it was after the Paris attacks. I had to go through airport style metal detectors. And when I sat down, I said, "You cheeky bastards, if I'm honest." Yeah. You cheeky bastards. You got all this protection. You you you're the cause of it all. You you you're the cause of it. Your funding is the cause of all this. Look at what Qatar has done. They spent nearly a billion pound in Islamization of Europe. They're changing our town. Who's funding the mega mosque epic city? Who's funding all the things that happening right now in the United States? Qatar. Saudi. Why are we letting them? Why? They won't be letting us. Why are we letting them? We shouldn't be letting them. But again, we've lost our value system or we've surrendered to the financial benefit as a nation. Our politicians have surrendered to them. Prince Charles has certainly surrendered to him. So I think there's so much we could be doing. And I believe that without doing these things, when you don't see light at the end of the tunnel, I can tell you now from September 13th of last event last year to this event May 16th, the temperature of the nation has risen so high. Do you know the work that we had to put in to this event to make sure it's peaceful? >> Because people don't see peace peaceful solutions. I'm hearing it from so many men around the country. Peaceful protest doesn't [ __ ] work. It doesn't work. We got to do something. You got 30% of the British public believe we're heading to civil war. >> What do you think would be the tipping point? >> I I believe that a defining moment's changed the direction of a nation in history. Bloody Sunday changed the direction of Northern Ireland. Who knows what the moment's going to be for Europe, but there's going to be a tipping point. I think it'll be a school and I think it's coming. I think they'll hit a school. Like the be my awakening moment in my life was the best school massacre. It was a moment that made me start look looking into Islam when I saw dozens of men sharing an ideology that told them they could go and execute children in a school. And I can see the mums dropping on the floor out. >> What year was this >> I 2002 three? I was young. I was 20. I say I was early 20s. And I remember watching it and I watched it and thought this isn't one madman here. These men share a share share a belief that this action is justified against children. And I remember watching the parents and just thinking, "Wow, man. They're outside the school. The police have locked them all off and they can hear their children being butchered." >> Whoa. >> And you can and the moms are on the knees and they're all screaming and crying and they don't know what to do. and like and for me I went and then two weeks later I saw the leaders at Sa Islam is a is a gentleman's name translates as sword of Islam he was second in command he's my age from my hometown he was a number two for almashadin who were now prescribed but they weren't prescribed terrorist organization he sat in a chicken shop in Luton and he his words with his mates with a on a camera where an attack like that would be justified in in the UK that was when I launched um against them essentially as as a young football group. I looked at them and said, "Who who the who the [ __ ] are these men in our town?" >> Did he say why it would be justified? >> Because of British foreign policy and you have to like even least murderer, Michael Balajio, do you know he handed a woman in the street 52 verses from the Quran that he says forced him to do it. So scripture and teachings always you have to it comes back to it every time. And when when the judge said he betrayed Islam, he went mad in court. I don't know if you remember because you have to look at in the teachings of Islam. Now, one of the verses that Nick Cleg after that terrorist attack, Nick Cleg stood on our TV the next day, and this is where we're being absolutely fooled. Yeah. Nick and and you can't even you couldn't have the discussion, but Nick Cleg stood on TV and said, "In the Quran, it says you kill if you kill one man, you kill all of humanity." It does. Yeah. And then I I've had this debate multiple times and said, "Cry on reading that verse." If Nick Le would have carried on reading that verse that he stood up to justify that it had nothing to do with Islam. It says unless you cause mischief in the land. Then you have your hands and feet cut off you're executed or you're exiled from the land. So the exact verse that Nick Cleg misqued is the exact verse that Leewig be because when you say mischief in the land say Iben Kair is one of the world's lead scholars on Islam historical scholars the lead in the world for the majority of Muslims. He's the lead. Mischief means not believing in Islam. Now, if you take it at that sense, we're all causing mischief. But did Lee Rigby in an Islamic sense cause mischief by entering as part of an invading army into a Muslim land? So Lee Wiggby's murderer horrifically was following an instruction manual that he says forced him to kill Lee Wigby and target Lee Wigby because he believes Lee Wigby cause mischief or the British army will cause mischief. So there's so much and I I just look at all these different things and think where are we heading as a nation? Do we want to solve it? to solve this problem, feelings are going to get hurt. Our feelings are hurt every day. No one cares about our feelings. We're fearful every day. So, unfortunately, Muslims feelings or followers of Islam's feelings, we've got to have this out. And that doesn't mean we want violence. It doesn't mean any anything like that. But it means at some point you're going to have to look at your own community. And do you know how many Muslims in the years of the rapes, all those 30, 40 years of the rapes, how many Muslims reported on another Muslim for raping? Not one. How many Muslims testified in court against the other Muslims work colleagues or not one? We've just seen the police officers the attack at Manchester airport. We've just seen them get hung jury. They I believe there are three Muslims on their jewelry. Muslims if you understand the teachings of Islam are not allowed to side with non-Muslims over Muslims. So the whole jewelry everything breaks down with this ideology that's so powerful and so strong. >> All right. So paint the picture for how we get out of this. Is it Rupert Low and Restore Britain? Is it you stepping into a far more political role? What is the >> I don't believe my position. I I want to just I believe we have to vote. Kan was elected off 9.7 million votes. 20 million didn't vote. That's the apathy and we and that's when we get what we've got now. You get a tyrannical leader who hasn't got a mandate voting off less than 20% of the population. the other 80% was sitting there but 50% of us sat at home when we need to understand your vote matters and you and and what my direction on Saturday was go join a political party whether it be restore whether it be reform whether it be advance go and join a political party and get politically active and at the same time something organically has happened with Christianity I'm watching it over the last two years but organically happening with young men outside of politics so I invited a group to come and talk at our event on Saturday who are not political I didn't even know if they vote Labor or not yeah and then I don't care cuz what they're doing is bringing men out to physically train and practice and pray together and this is happening across the nation and that's not happening under the influence of me. Yeah, it's happening outside of any influence or organic influence. But that value system of men helping men, supporting men, becoming tough and strong again in a value system and a community spirit, it will be a step towards solving all of these problems. Now, somebody reading that casually might say, "Oh, because you want this to get violent, you want them to fight more." >> Not fight more. I want them to be strong men. I I just know from my own situation, I've been in I've been in dark places many times over the years. Really dark. I I went into prison one person in 2017, come out another. I was a mess from solitary confinement. I was a mess coming out last year. The only solution I found, which I wish I found years ago, is physical training. physically but physically training myself which then helps me mentally my my whole if I don't go to the gym for four days everything starts spiraling for me I've seen it myself so I believe that men [snorts] which look at the suicide rates of British men and compare them to men in other countries especially Islamic countries ours are really high yeah in comparison to anyone else we're lost we we've become frowned upon that we don't have a value [snorts] and I think that Men need to support men and they can do that without politics, without race, without any of that. Yeah. Just men coming together, which I've organically watched happen and been so impressed with it happening because I know that that's a solution that helps. And I think that there's so many different problems that we face and that have caused a weak nation. We are now a weak nation. We are now a nation of weak men. But Poland's not. Poland aren't weak men. Russians aren't weak men. We're weak men and unless we find back who we are and that doesn't mean you're getting ready to go out and kill at all, it means that you're building a strong sense of community again and you're there to help the community and help each other. Jordan Peterson had a really interesting definition of the meek shall inherit the earth. I don't know if it's real. He believes it. I just don't know if he's accurate, but it's still brilliant, which is that he says in ancient Greek, meek is best described as somebody who is strong and knows how to use their sword, but chooses not to. And I always thought that made sense. That person who's disciplined, emotionally in control, but incredibly strong, and can fight should the moment call for it, is the right way that a man should be. And I aggressively agree with that. boxers, you know, most boxers, they're tough, but they're not aggressive. I took my son to a boxing gym. Most of the toughest men I know will be in boxing, but they're not out beating people up. Yeah. Cuz they're disciplined because the gym and the system gives them that discipline. >> But they can fight and they are strong and they're powerful men. And I think that that's I think that's such an important thing in refinding. And also Christianity is such an important role. And I've seen something just hard to describe what's happening. You you would have seen it anyone who our event on Saturday the revival >> I was there >> the revival in Christian faith the revival in Jesus some the numbers don't lie in America and here in young men going to church or finding church and finding faith so something huge is shifting and I think that's coming when your back's up against the wall and you're looking for where you come from [snorts] >> and you try and when you and we're further ahead than America so our backs are against the wall you're searching for what what is it that built this What is it? Who are we? And for for so many years now, prior to the last two years, men were converting to Islam, British men, because they were refinding that sense of identity and belonging within that. And now there's a movement happening where men are finding it again in who they actually were. >> And if you look at boxers now, something huge like most boxers were converting to Islam. Now they're coming out to gospel songs of Jesus and religious songs of Christianity. So there is a shift and all of these things I'd say we put together a three four year vision for how we get to where we want to be which is culture media and politics and all three run separately but complement each other I think my job as I said I don't want to be in a political party I don't I don't want in-house politics leading the English fence league was the most difficult bloody thing I've ever done because you have to have this division that division they all hate each other they all fall out of each other you get infiltrated your entire time is spent trying to deal with this, >> right? >> Rather than [snorts] doing what you should be doing, >> in-house problems take over your life. >> I never want that again. >> As an entrepreneur, I understand it well. Yeah. >> Through business. Yeah. I I never want that again. Ever again. So, what we do, we have a team of six. Look at what we pulled off on Saturday. >> There's a team of six. >> My bad. >> We have a tight tight team. And we will go on now this year to make three three four successful documentaries. And I believe our role is to awaken people. But I leave it to the political parties to to it's a the politicians to to solve this because they will all ride the wave and we're seeing them ride the wave of of nationalism and patriotism already. Things have shifted hugely shifted and they're not going to slow down. >> I'll speak to you because you're here with me and by all means if what I say um seems weird, push back. But uh I'm actually trying to address the American people when I say the following. as we deal with the the question that a collision of values asks which the most relevant one being Muslim immigration we need to find an honorable solution forward to do that people have to figure out who are we so for us what does it mean to be an American so we are a country built on immigrants but we're also a country built on immigration where when you rolled up to our shores it was like good luck There was no social safety net. And so for us to go back on the things that made us us, hard work, discipline, puritan work ethic, outperforming other people, uh wanting to be the best, understanding no one's coming to save you, you got to till your own land, and hey, if there's people you got to fight along the way, that you got to do it. Um but it it really is up to you. and the desire to be a good and kind and honorable person uh is a part of the story we need to remind ourselves of as Americans. And so as we look at this collision of values rather than just saying, you know, stranger, get the [ __ ] out, this has got to be something more like um hey, we welcome people that align with these values that understand what we're trying to do. um we have a zero tolerance policy for [ __ ] And so if you're not here to join the fabric of America and to make it better, then for that reason, yes, you're not going to be welcomed here. But um I believe in foreignb born Americans, people that weren't born in America, but they have that entrepreneurial spirit, that can do attitude. I want to get better. I want to push my skills. I'm not looking for a handout. Um that kind of attitude I want to see us rem. to lose sight of love, to lose sight of caring, to lose sight of I'm not right, it's just my way. If we lose sight of all of that, um, we will give something of ourselves up. And I'm a big believer in Nelson Mandela, who had a a great quote, which was when he got out of prison finally, um, his party was like, "Okay, we're going to oppress the white people now, right?" And he was like, "Nope." because the person who does the oppression actually forfeits a piece of their soul and I thought damn like that is so true and I he was in an impossible position and unfortunately since his death the place has gone to hell in a hand basket but >> you just tripled the amount of refugees you're going to allow into from South Africa today I think >> yeah that's a whole another story but his idea of finding that third way of saying okay look we've got people that believe one way people believe another and we've got to find a way to to bring them together and march forward. And so you have to do the truth and reconciliation. You have to be able to speak freely. You have to be able to say what you believe to be true. Um you can't be silenced. You shouldn't want to silence people. There should be a rule set. You integrate or you leave. Uh and then at the same time, you've got to want everybody to win. And that's where I worry that this will devolve into outgroup tribal warfare. It feels good to be young and angry and so I do want to be on the streets fighting and when you're being again for me this is all in an economic frame when you are being stolen from from your own government but you don't understand what's happening you just know that the pie really is shrinking I'm mad at somebody and then somebody says cool you're mad at the person who is out group um that's where we get into the dangerous territory that allows us to be controlled by people that do not have our best interest at heart that are trying to extract from us. And so I am deeply concerned for my own country that we will get confused by race, not understand that this is values, not understand that we have to stand for something, that we must be the meek as defined by Jordan Peterson, uh who are strong, who know what we stand for, who are honorable, uh who also understand that love is the greatest thing we have to offer. And if you're going to find it in Christianity, yay, I'm all for it. Um, if you're not, which I'm certainly not, then you still have to find it. And with that, then to march forward along those lines, but to have policies that are blind, that you establish them not knowing who they're going to impact, and so you come up with something that's far more universal. >> Do do you agree that immigration has to benefit America? >> I do. >> Do you think Somalian immigration into Minnesota has benefited Minnesota? I think open borders are suicide >> because even say say like the Somali as an American [snorts] it's the hottest place on the planet is Somalia. >> Do you think they chose Minnesota the coldest place in America? >> I have not researched this so I don't know the truth. I know your answer and there's certainly logic to it which is that there are extra agencies that are like pulling these people and saying we're going to put you here. There's certainly logic to that. So what about so so say so say for example if you look at immigration and [snorts] you're America or your brim in 2023 the Japanese 40,000 were allowed into Germany four were convicted of violent crimes in the same year 25,000 Algerians were welcomed into Germany >> y >> 1,794 were convicted of crimes and that simple statistic would tell you stop Algerian immigration into Germany >> agreed >> it's just the statistic 16 times more likely in Afghan and he is to commit sexual rape in >> I've got no beef with stats like the numbers are clear. >> If you've got stats that show that the stats will show you that Islamic immigration top 10 countries where the problems are coming from >> in all crime statistics in every European nation is coming from there. So it's just on stats and it's not just stop Islamic immigration like yes American needs immigration but why why not have Christian immigration which we know works. We know the value system is very similar. I don't understand the intent in mixing these two total foreign ideologies to each other or foreign value systems to each other. I just don't get the intent and and the and the pull for it. And I think the nation should be quite comfortable in saying that it doesn't work. America can look to Germany. It can look to France. It can look to Britain. It can look at all these nations. It does not work. So you can stop it now, America. You can you can beat ending up in the mess that we're in. And again to people sitting listening that doesn't of course mean look you know you all know great Muslims I know great Muslims. Yeah but per se this isn't going to work. That doesn't mean that the great Muslim has to leave. Yeah. It doesn't mean it just means we need to stop adding to a problem that we already have and start trying to address that problem. >> Yeah. And I would say people need to assimilate. Like you need to bring people in. Make sure they assimilate before you just keep bringing more. This will be very controversial in America, but I also believe in if my advice to all countries is compete for the best, the brightest, the most economically uh likely to contribute. >> And yeah, so for me it's it becomes very easy to find people that are likely to be economic contributors and it also becomes very easy to say you have to earn your way into the system. You don't just get it by rolling up >> and uh but again that's how is my country. >> How is that even controversial? Well, I so I think evolution gave you the left and the right for a reason. I just happen to slightly lean right by temperament. Um, meaning evolution has gone, "Hey, Tom, uh, I need you to watch out for freeloaders and to get people excited about personal responsibility, to want to shoulder their load, to make that a cool thing, to be proud of like I did my part. >> I got here for my own benefit, >> right? But I I have all these other people that I want to make sure that they are loved for who they are and wounded and fallen creatures though they may be that there are people whose temperament is to look after them because and listen I'm very close to the middle but we need both and it is the the thing I think you felt now this is me projecting on you so by all means if this isn't accurate but when I hear the story of you being the quintessential what I call pub brawler uh which is a uniquely England English phenomenon uh you know puber going out into the streets uh and all of that. I see you finding a path out of that because it's like okay effective strategy but it has these second and third order consequences that I don't like. I see a better path over here. And to me, in some ways, not small, the dynamic between men and women always kept that tension because a woman wasn't going to be impressed that you're out in the streets getting in fights. She'd be impressed if you stood up for her, but she's not going to be impressed you're just going around scaring people and being an ass. And so, as the relationship between men and women have broken down, you get the hyper feminization. You get men not realizing that they have to step up and be quote unquote men to impress a woman to gain sexual access. Start a whole another podcast if I go too far down this road. But um yeah, I think that there are a lot of things breaking down that we do ultimately have to focus on to get people back in line. Um it's an important question that if somebody tells you you can't talk about it, they are the enemy. And that's where I start. Now, we may not agree on what the path forward is, but just because I disagree with someone doesn't make them my enemy. If they tell me I can't talk about it, they're my enemy. >> Kais was your enemy. >> Oh, of this. I have no doubt. I was a little surprised in. >> So, yeah. Well, Tommy, um, if you had one final vision that you wanted to leave people with about where this goes, keeping in mind my audience contains at least some people that are in the persuadable middle. And so knowing that some people have a knee-jerk reaction to love you. Some people have a knee-jerk reaction to hate you. And um some people are like, "Well, just tell me what world I get if I listen to you." Hit those people with where you want to lead them. >> We called our movement United the Kingdom. And our focus has been Janine, what you spoke about earlier. [snorts] I can see over the last 12 months, 24 months, the anger, the resentment turning on decent people as well. I can see it. I can read it. Everyone's got to go. Um, they're all a problem. They don't belong here. So, our movement has been focused on unifying everyone from any background. Like, [snorts] if a Muslim turned up on Saturday, great. They want to be there. They're proud to be British. Um, in fact, there was a video of a Muslim girl, a couple of videos at the last event, who went to see what it was like and then come out saying, "Everyone love me." So, our movement is about unifying people. Um, I know many of you may listen to what I'm saying thinking it's pretty divisive or polarizing. The reality is polarizing. Where we're at is polarizing. So, unfortunately, we've got to go down this path. Um, I want to unite people. I want to politicize people. Unfortunately, as workingass people, we're not political. We're not encouraged on politics. Many of us don't understand politics. I had never voted. Most people I don't know have ever voted in their lives. Uh, not rich enough, not poor enough really to make a difference probably people think as they're growing up. and [snorts] don't think their voice matters. So, I'd say that's my where I want to sit and say is I want everyone to be political and understand that they have to get involved in politics. And when I call it the battle for Britain, which I used this phrase on Saturday at the event, I'm not talking about a physical battle for Britain. We Kasama talked about the battle for the soul of our nation, he's totally right. There's a fight for the soul of our nation. It's not a fight he's going to win. It's a fight we're going to win. Um, and this battle is about winning the hearts and minds of the public. Um, that's what I believe that as a movement we're doing and going to do. And I believe that anyone who gives us the opportunity to listen to what we're saying will realize there are problems and there we have to confront them now. We can't continue until the Muslim population of 6% becomes 12%. We just can't. And the 40,000 becomes 80,000 and the terror watch list becomes this and the rape figures go, you know, the rape figures. Like it's it in 2003 we had 8,000 rapes in Brim. In 2023 we had 80,000. We meant to wait till there was 800,000 in another 20 years. So, and this isn't just Brit. Sweden 1975 360 rapes. Last year 32,000. Do you know where the rate figures haven't gone up? Poland and Hungary. Why? No mass open border immigration. So you can either be upset or you can protect women and protect your children and work for a safe country. But to get that safe position where we need to be and to get the the the next party that get elected in three years time, you said Rupert Low, you said Nigel Farage, who whoever it is need a real mandate. You had four years of Joe Biden and you needed it as Americans because you needed to see what it was like. You needed to see that to then come in with a mandate for mass deportations. a mandate for change that gives the new leader the opportunity to implement the change knowing he's got support in the nation. So unfortunately all of these problems that we face we're facing have to happen. We had to get this low in order to elect awaken spiritually, culturally awaken as a nation to then elect in three years time a government and give them a real mandate say okay we've decided as a nation people have to leave we've decided now we are a Christian country we're not going to surrender these values anymore we're going back to where we come from we're focusing back on ourselves so all of these things had to happen and [snorts] unfortunately that's hard for some people to hear um even commit even October 7th that was a mass awakening for so many people watching the watching the inability by the government in any western nation to deal with this. Like they're here. The enem is here. They're here and they're celebrating and they partied on the streets of every capital city about the rape and torture of 1400 people. What more what more wakeup call do you need? They're laughing in the streets. [snorts] Um yeah, >> there it is. >> There it is. >> Where can people follow you? >> Follow me on X. Thank you, Elon. Uh T Robinson, New Era. Follow me on YouTube back on there that to Americans if there's you have a large American audience when you voted for Donald Trump it wasn't a vote to save America as a vote to save Western civilization. Do you know the ripple that's come out of America? I would not if it wasn't for Elon Musk, the scenes you're seeing, our development as a nation or as people to confront these issues wouldn't have happened. Rubio or JD Vance lecturing the European Union, we know and it gives us hope that we the superpower of the world share our concerns on on our culture and European culture. So yeah, it given everyone on a lift. When you elected, it gave all all of us a lift. So, you can find me on T uh Tommy T. Robinson online is my YouTube, but yeah, that's my mainly I find me on X. That's my home. >> Sounds perfect. All right, everybody. If you haven't already, be sure to subscribe. And until next time, my friends, be legendary. Take care. Peace. If you like this conversation, check out this episode to learn more. >> If you look at pictures from these Middle Eastern nations, you will be amazed. If you look at a 1920s picture, you'll think you're looking at Europe. There feels like a sense of a warning that you're giving the west about Islam that we're not taking it seriously enough. most of what we call the Muslim world which again North Africa