The First Mansion and Real Spiritual Warfare | Devil in the Castle Chapter 1

Gloria is strong enough to say that if you don't practice mental prayer, you're not making it into heaven. Yeah, Teresa basically said the same thing. >> Yeah. >> She said, "If you don't practice mental prayer, you don't need a demon to throw yourself into hell, you'll do it yourself." And of course, it's a sin not to pray. Aquinas is very clear about that. >> The greatest trick [music] the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist. >> I didn't know this was a fight. >> That's why you're losing. >> Today we are beginning either to domesticate the devil or else to deny him. He is most [music] powerful when he is denied. >> Welcome to The Devils in the Details. The devil may be in the details, but God is on the throne. >> Amen. >> We are now going into a second series on The Devil in the Castle, which is covering Teresa of Avila's treatise, I guess, on the Interior Castle. >> Yeah. >> Um but before we do that, please subscribe. >> Yeah. >> Please. >> Help us out. >> Please share this with people. I'm I'm a little surprised I got a quite a few messages this weekend. People saying, "I didn't know you had a podcast." I don't We do. Share it with people. If you know it, share it cuz people are finding it very, very helpful. So >> Yeah, if you want to if you want to learn about a sound perspective on spiritual warfare, all based on church teaching, nothing goofy, nothing weird, some strange but not goofy and weird. And if you want to learn about the interior life or help others to do the same, which I think is pretty vital for the healing of the church. Uh yeah, help us out. Help us get you subscribe and and tell all your friends about us. We only ask that you send this to 45 of your friends a week, and then we'll be fine with you. >> I think that's fair. Um so last show we did a introduction into Teresa of Avila's Interior Castle, and specifically the book you wrote, The Devil in the Castle. Saint Teresa of Avila's Spiritual Warfare and the Progress of the Soul. You can get it at uh Uh, what is it? spiritualdirection.com/shop. It's something you press. >> Yeah. >> If you want to follow along as we go along, um, but we we ended and I think it's worth a little bit of a recap talking about kind of the basic fundamentals of Teresa of Avila's writing. Now we're getting into the actual, I would say, journey >> Yeah. >> from the courtyard to the first mansion. >> Right. >> So you want to give like a brief >> Yeah, so so the analogy she uses she grew up around castles everywhere. If you to [clears throat] go on a pilgrimage with us to Spain, you'll see they're just they're castles all over the place. There were more when she was there. But uh, the castle context she's describing is like uh, a walled city inside of which is the kingdom of God and then outside is the kingdom of Satan. Baptism brings you in. And then uh, there's an interior castle in that city, walled city. And you it's you can conceive of that as well as having a little kind of entryway and courtyard and all of that. And we ended the last show talking about the two things, talked about authentic discipleship with Jesus. What does it really mean to be on the narrow way to get to heaven, to be a true follower of Jesus and and she indicated there are two things necessary to enter into that reality. Now, given it she assumes we're sacramentally sound, you know, Eucharist minimum weekly, uh, confession, monthly is kind of a norm for most spiritual masters, spiritual directors. Every other week is good if you're struggling with habitual sin or as much as you need to with habitual sin. And then um, mental prayer and the examine. She talked about prayer and reflection because she speaks of how in the first few mansions that self-awareness is absolutely vital for progress in the interior life, progress in relationship to God. And really just to be a good human, you know, we need self-awareness. And unfortunately, something I say all the time, the human person has an infinite capacity for self-delusion and very little innate capacity for self-understanding. And And when you add concupiscence and sin, you know, sin darkens the intellect and weakens the will. So so we have all this It's a serious problem of really actually seeing ourselves in some close proximity with what's actually true about our patterns of behavior and our sin and our brokenness, how we affect others, how we affect God. Go ahead. >> I So I want to ask you a question because I I I think I know the answer and maybe you [clears throat] have a better way to explain it. But I I'm sure there's someone out there who's thinking, well, how is the examination or what are what are the ways that I can know myself if I have an infinite capacity for self-delusion. You know, scripture says something along the lines of who can trust the heart, it is wicked above all else. >> Yeah. >> Cuz you have on one end, you have on one scale the people who say well, I know myself and I'm good and you know, we've talked about this ad nauseam on the show and you know, I don't kick puppies, so I'm going to be okay. >> Yeah. >> Which ironically is an indication of extreme self- self-unawareness, lack of self-awareness. So I guess what you're saying, what Teresa's saying, what all these spiritual masters have said is the daily examination is one of the ways, if not the preeminent way to really truly understand where you're at. Is that kind of >> Yeah, but I would put mental prayer above that in terms of giving you self-knowledge. Why is that? Because, you know, like this morning, I was reading the passage on Matthew chapter 7 verses 1 and >> through 5 I think, right? >> Yeah, following reflecting on Jesus teaching about, you know, judge not lest you be judged and you know, you got a speck, you know, you got a you're pointing out the specks in somebody's also eye when you have a log in your own. So, what's Jesus speaking about? The problem of the lack of self-awareness and the problem of our tendency to judge people when we're fairly blind and it's ridiculous. Now, so he Jesus obviously then spoke about this problem of self-awareness. So, but as I'm doing it, I'm talking to him. I'm processing the scripture and I I felt fairly convicted being critical of people, you know, cuz his point is, you know, the judgment you use with others you will be judged by and then I remember the passage from James chapter 2, I think it's verse 13 where he said, "For the one who doesn't show mercy, you will receive no mercy at your judgment." And that just caused me to shudder. It's like, "Wow." Oh God, you know, >> [laughter] >> that is one of the scariest passages in the in the Bible to me. And so I was just I was just penitent, you know, and why so what's happening in that reality? I'm conversing with Jesus. I'm being with Jesus. >> of your mental prayer. >> He's teaching me. That was mental prayer for me this morning. And he's talking to me. And then what that allowed me to do is, you know, also teach others, but that's what I'm talking about is my self-awareness was heightened. By and my by being in his presence talking with him about his words, his teaching. So, that's why mental prayer is so powerful. So, So, we don't uh, time with him, we won't So, then the second piece and we'll probably need to just come back to mental prayer to describe a little bit more of what it is. The second piece, this this uh, examine, the daily examine. I do two examines a day. And what is an examine? It's um, it can be anywhere from 60 seconds to 5 minutes. I don't think any more than that's necessary. >> Where I would argue the more that you do it, the easier it becomes. >> Totally agree. >> mine is I have set a timer for 45 seconds, and that's all I need. >> Yeah, I it's pretty brief for me as well at this stage in my life. Yeah. Um, at night, uh, Stephanie and I do the examine together. So, we begin with a simple prayer of God, come to my assistance, O Lord, make haste to help me. And then we we go through three things we're grateful for in the day, which is a very helpful exercise. Um, and then after that, a silent examination of conscience, focused on how have I loved every and treated everyone with dignity and respect that I came in contact with. And then that, but that's pretty brief. And then, um, the Angelus. >> Mhm. >> And then, uh, and then we go to sleep. So, the in the morning, my examine is more complex. In the morning, I have a rule of life, which is a structured way that every saint has lived just about. Where most saints are religious, and all religious have a rule of life. And my rule of life deter it it outlines what my duties to God and my duties to my wife and others. So, it starts with God and my prayer and Auxilium Christianorum, mental prayer, and the sort and the rosary, and and then also, uh, taking care of my body, exercise, and then um, you know, toward my wife primarily. And so then I look that morning I look over what I did yesterday. And and I and I determine what's going on. Now, in that examine, like if you wanted to have a really bad experience with the examine and never want to do it again or or be dissuaded from doing the examine, only focus on your brokenness. But we practice, you and I and possibly be a community, practice something called a redemptive examine. So at every So even when we are aware of our sin, we it's it leads to an expression of gratitude because that's the first step to our liberation. So so there have been times when I've been pretty sorrow sorrowful, but at the exact same time it's like, thank you for showing me. So I'm not an idiot over and over and over again. And you can heal me cuz he he's Every time he shows us our sin, it's not to like, you know, some people are cruel and you know, their dog does their thing in the carpet and they rub their nose in it. You know, that's where that phrase comes from. God is not like that, you know? So what what he's doing is he's saying, "I would like to be closer to you. I'd like you to be closer to me. This is in the way. Will you let me heal it?" And so and so how can we not be grateful for that kind of love? And scripture says he disciplines those whom he loves. Yeah. Which And that's what that means. It's not a discipline for you're bad, you know, spankings, you go to the corner. It's It's This is between us. I Can Will you let me heal it? So that's what the examine does for me now. And the other thing we don't do is focus on like a day. Everybody has bad days, you know, and it's not about checking boxes. It's about What are the patterns? What's the trajectory of my soul? You know, I've become convicted that I'm letting myself get a little too distracted coming into prayer. You know, I have two respons- I have two very large responsibilities and they're possibly be a community in the Avila Institute. And so, if I'm not careful and manage my thoughts really carefully cuz especially with the phone, cuz I do use the phone for some of my prayers. >> Mhm. >> Cuz we have a new prayer book coming out and I have some of the prayers that are not I've >> They're not in physical copy and >> Yeah, so so I have to tell myself, do not auto click on anything. You know what that is? >> Yeah. >> Where you where you open your phone and you just start popping around you don't even know why you're there. >> Right. >> I have to go, no, open it, go to the prayer, you know. And I've can been convicted that I have been too undisciplined. Especially with this Iran, you know, I don't know when people are going to hear this podcast, but as we're speaking, uh yesterday, I think the US bombed Iran, uh their nuclear facilities and of course that this is a global issue. Could lead to World War III. And so, you know, I think >> And we're trying to get a pilgrimage to the Holy Land. >> That's right. We're Yeah, we're trying to set up a pilgrimage to the Holy Land. So, so I and I think we're all kind of just awake to, oh wow, you know, this is this is serious. We need to pray, you know. But this morning in particular, it's like, nope. >> Yeah. >> Nope. No on non-deliberate clicking. I'm not thinking about work. I'm not thinking about anything. I'm just Nope. I you know, I had this deal with uh one of our events and Eucharist and and anyway. Serious issues and I'm like, no, they're not that's not from God. It is from God for me to deal with them, but that's like >> Not at the not at that time. >> Right. Right. So, that's and all I'm talking to you is part of the discipline and you know this as I do. The discipline of getting up early in the morning at the the exact same time, which you have to do. You have to have a spiritual rhythm. Your body will not cooperate. The exact same time, exact same amount of time. Fairly, you know, the structure the same. I wrote a book about it, Into the Deep. There's also a free film series on spiritualdirection.com. >> We'll put it in the description. >> Yeah. Um so, I won't go over, you know, how but mental prayer is you can't as Teresa of Avila says it uh uh Alphonsus Liguori says it, you know, two doctors of the church and >> Liguori is strong enough to say that if you don't practice mental prayer, you're not making it into heaven. >> Yeah, Teresa basically said the same thing. She said, "If you don't practice mental hair prayer, you don't need a demon to throw yourself into hell, you'll do it yourself." >> Yeah. >> You know, so throw you into hell, you'll do it yourself. So uh and of course, it's a sin not to pray. Aquinas is very clear about that. So and you know, look if I claimed I had a [clears throat] relationship with my wife and I never talked with her, you would say I was a liar. >> Right. >> And I I would be a liar. And I Can I just be really bold? If you say you're a follower of Jesus, you're a good Catholic, and you don't you don't talk with him and receive from him, you're a liar. You're lying to yourself. And you're lying to others, and you need to repent. >> Yeah. >> And I don't mean I don't mean to be cruel. It's just that's you know >> Well, you need you need strong language to to relay a message that is detrimentally important to someone's soul because we have we live in a time in a context in society where you know, there's all this really fluffy uh nonsense about how we engage with God. And it's some of it's good. I mean, if you're if you're just saying the you know, Jesus I love or what is it? Jesus, son of God, have mercy on me a sinner throughout the day. Yeah. That's great, right? That's really, really good. But there's a difference between that and and and that is good and I'm not even necessarily comparing them, but sitting down and purposefully meeting with God, listening to him, seeking him, you know, I I I keep thinking about how you mentioned how Jesus is not cruel and he wants to heal us and you know, at first my brain went to it reminds me that plus the exam reminds me of like a performance evaluation. You know what I mean? And if you I've had this happen where I had a perf- I wasn't you it was someone else. I got a performance evaluation and I got dinged on stuff that I was never told about. And it was painful. I'm like, how are you punishing me when I was not aware of any of this? You didn't take any effort to tell me this. This I'm completely blindsided to all of this. That's a That's a failure on that person's part, right? They're no longer here, thankfully, but it's similar with God in a way where it's God is constantly saying, I want to heal these things. I want to fix these things. I want to be with you. But we're ignoring the meeting. >> Right, we're not making the meeting. >> Or we're not we're not making the exam or the rule book. Right. And saying, cuz it's it is a gift when he reveals these things and he says, "Hey, this is where you failed." And as you said, my response is always like, "Oh, thank you for revealing that to me so that I can be better, so that I can achieve what you hope for me." Because he ultimately sees in us the ultimate of what we can become, of what we're capable of. >> Right. What he's made us for. >> What he's made us for, but we won't have that knowledge unless we seek it from him. >> Totally true. That's Yeah, it's it's exactly true. And just just for some super basic basic stuff about prayer, exact same time every day, sacred time dedicated to God. This is in my book Into the Deep. Um uh exact same duration. So, and make whatever commitment you need to make. If it's only 5 minutes, God be praised. Pray the Our Father slowly and extrapolate on the words Our Father, you know? And you can say and and multiple saints have taught this kind of prayer. Saint Francis of Assisi, Saint Teresa of Avila, but our father and you can say you're a good father and I'm grateful for you. >> Mhm. >> You know, some people can say I didn't have a good father and thank you for being hallowed be thy name. May your name be praised among all people of all nations. You know, thy kingdom come. Please make your kingdom come in my heart, in the church, in the world, you know? So, you can use the our father and Teresa of Avila in uh Oh gosh, what was the name of the book? The Way of Perfection taught that as a method of that some people need vocal prayer to help them and that's fine, but you can't just buzz through it. You got to really pray it and and consider it as you're praying. So, whether it's like that uh what I described, you know, reading Matthew 7 this morning or reading, you know, the our father or something like or praying the our father, whatever it is, 5 minutes, 15 minutes, you're brand new, don't schedule over 15 minutes, you'll you'll go crazy. >> And the enemy wants you to >> Yeah. >> bite off more than you can chew. >> But bite it bite into if you're brand new, bite into the deep, watch the free film series. Or re- set aside enough time every day to read 5 minutes of the book. Do it every single day without fail and then by the end of the book, now you have a pattern of doing that thing. Now replace it with the prayer you learned. >> Yeah. >> The approach to prayer that you learn. >> you someone can read that book in an adoration session. >> Yeah, in one after Yeah, I wrote it I wrote it I wrote it for college students, but I wrote it at like a ninth grade level. It's not pedantic or anything, but I it's not and it's and it I've been told even by or the ordained that it has some profound wisdom in it, but it's very accessible. Anyone, you know, a uh a a high schooler at the end of their high school could easily read it and put it into practice. >> So So all of these things, does that get you to the courtyard? And then from the courtyard to the first castle? >> you moving into the castle, basically. Gets you moving in. And it And it gets you on the narrow way. You know, gets you out of circling the drain, as a friend of mine used to call it. And And the narrow way, in fact, what's interesting, there's a quote from uh in the book on page 13 that's from another of Teresa of Avila's books. And uh it's from the book of her life. Why don't you read it? It's brief. >> He showeth great mercy unto him to whom he gives the grace and the resolution to strive for this blessing with all of his might. For God withholds himself from no one who perseveres. He will little by little strengthen that soul so that I may come forth victorious. I say resolution because of the multitude of those things which Satan puts before it at first to keep it from keep it back from beginning to travel this on this road. For he knoweth what harm will befall him thereby. He will not He will lose not only that soul, but many others also. If he who enters on this road does violence to himself with the help of God so as to reach the summit of perfection, such a one I believe will never go alone to heaven. He will always take many with him. God gives to him, as to a good captain, those who shall be of his company. >> So I'm just curious if you know the answer to this question. You may know just hearing my teaching regularly. What is the subject? So she's saying God God with all I love my favorite quote of all Teresa of Avila. God withholds himself from no one who perseveres. >> Which echoes scripture. >> Yeah. Just show up. >> Yeah. >> That And by the way, if you want to know the secret to learning prayer, just show up. >> Yeah. >> Sick, feeling great, feeling crummy, feeling foggy, just show up and God cuz God will be there. >> [clears throat] >> And he'll help you even if you don't feel it. He'll be there. Just show up. But anyway, uh what did I bring Anyway, what So, God withholds himself but from knowing who perseveres. In what? >> Prayer. >> Yeah, that's So, this is from the 11th chapter of the book of her life. >> Yeah. >> And that whole chapter is talking about prayer and the four stages of prayer. >> [clears throat] >> She later, of course, turned that into seven mansions. 10 She wrote that 10 years before this book. The The Interior Castle. And so, um Now, she she warns, "Why do I say resolution? Why Why do I need to to um be faith- faithful to prayer?" Because, she says, "Satan is going to come against you." Now, this is where people get wiggy. So, and it it happened at this conference that I was we were just at. Uh we had 400 spiritual directors and we were talking with them about different work, you know, formation for them. And one uh woman I was it that or Anyway, we also have a spiritual direction school I taught at recently. And it was all in the same trip but two different states. But anyway, one woman came up and said, "I'm a little I'm nervous about spiritual warfare." And I totally reverenced that heart, right? It's like I I don't want to be harsh in any way. But I And so, gently I said to her, I said, "Look, you know, you're in a battle, you know, [snorts] whether you like it or not. And And the enemy can deal You can deal with the enemy two different ways. One, he can just keep you neutral, which means you'll be weak and easy to tip pull out to to pick off when when it's time for all pressure. You know, before before you die. Or you can engage now. Either way, you're engaged. One is way more dangerous than the other. Does that make sense? >> Yeah, well, I mean, we've talked about this on one of our previous shows. I think it was the reality of spiritual warfare or something. We quoted the Catechism Catechism of the Council of Trent, you know, all these different things that make it to where you cannot argue that you are not in a battle. The church holds that perfectly clear. I think the prevailing lie that I may not have been able to articulate till just now is that people assume falsely, and I think it's from the enemy. I would I would venture to posit that this this lie that if I don't engage, I'm safe. >> Yes. >> You know what I mean? >> All right. >> It's it's this Well, if I'm I'm just doing okay, so therefore he's not after me, but if I do a little bit more, then he's going to come after me. >> Right. >> And that's a lie. >> It is a lie. >> Which is what you're trying to relate in that you know. >> Exactly. So yeah, and and what he she says here that Satan puts before So, I say resolutions. You have to be very strong in your commitment to to prayer and following Jesus. Um because of the multitude of this things which Satan puts before it at first to keep it from beginning to travel on the on the road for he knoweth what harm will befall him thereby. So, this is the interesting part. And then he later he speaks about um about the fact that you will not go to heaven alone. What does he What does she mean by that? That means the enemy knows that if you start to pray and you start to fight that you are going to be a force cuz that's the way God works. And you're not only going to get to heaven, but you're going to take many with you. >> Yeah. >> And that's a glorious thing. I mean, I love that. >> Yeah. >> So, in another place she speaks of and I can't remember if it was here or context is did the enemy put so many things in the minds of beginners, you know, to dissuade them. >> Mhm. Mhm. [clears throat] >> And it's stuff like that. It's that lie of like, "Oh, this is dangerous. You shouldn't be doing this." Or that's only for priests. Or if I fight, will they be stirred up? Well, yeah. You know, sort of like this morning you were out hunting wasp nest, you know. I've been stung by a wasp. It's no big deal. It's just not fun. Uh you know, what do you do? Do you let their nest keep building? And do you let them multiply? And you know, and more and more what's going to happen? What's you know, [clears throat] one one point you're going to get one of our guys got stung here 26 times and by hornets, not wasps. But anyway, no, you can't do that. You have to take out your spray and go deal with it. And you know, so >> to stir them up. They're going to get wiggy, but then they're gone in that area, you know. >> So, and that's by the way is a truth regarding the interior castle that Teresa teaches. She teaches the closer you are to Jesus, [clears throat] the further you are from sin and the control of the devil. If you think about attachments, which are cause sin. And if you think about like the analogy of, you know, you have a little kid and they have those backpacks with the handles on them. Some of them have leashes on them. Uh why do parents do that? So they can control their kid in a difficult situation. Keep them from running out in front of cars or whatever. Well, sin creates a bunch of those little handles on your back. And the devil just jerk and if they're mortal sin, they're big handles that have all kinds of leverage. Venial sin, smaller, you know, imperfections, two fingers maybe. >> Mhm. >> And as you get closer to Jesus, those start to drop off. Cuz your self-awareness goes up. Your penitence goes up. Your your your sorrow for sin, your resolution to fight it, your awareness is healing, is Holy Spirit in you, to availing yourself of the most powerful sacraments, Eucharist and reconciliation, um and you're getting free. So, the more you get the more you go in, the less power the enemy has over you. So, but it does it's not instantaneous. At the beginning, they have all kinds of handles on you. Why? Because you're not fighting, you're not aware, you don't understand. How many of us, like everyone listening, knows that guy in their life who has the has this very clear pattern of self-destructive behavior. Or that guy or that woman. Everyone knows that. Well, you know what? Everyone knows you do, too. >> Yeah. >> Right? >> Yeah. >> Anyone close to you knows you do, too. Unless you've been fighting this battle for a long time. >> Right. >> Well, and I was even going to say, just to kind of drive home the point, you know, for those who are are still on the fence about like, well, if I engage in this, the enemy's going to come after me more. I think that's I mean, for one, and may and maybe this is not this is not a statement of condemnation of anyone. But that means, if you believe that, that you're not being attacked right now, >> Or controlled or manipulated in some way. >> indicative it's indicative of an extraordinary lack of self-awareness. >> Right. >> Because it's undeniable. You cannot argue against it, you're in a battle. The church has made that explicitly clear. Like, there was another dogma, >> Yeah. >> It's like a dogma without being a dogma, right? It's that clear. So, if you're if you're believing, well, if I engage, it's going to get worse, that's one thing. If I engage, I'm going to get attacked cuz I haven't been attacked before, then you need to start checking yourself for those handles cuz they're already there. >> They're already there. And just ask the people who know you well enough and say how they'll be no penalty, right? But what owns me? >> Right. >> Then they're going to tell you one of the seven seven deadly sins and or their tributaries, you know, they're going to tell you. >> Yeah. >> So >> Okay, so that that that we >> [laughter] >> we've we've reached the door of the first mansion and >> Well, we're heading in, you know, we're heading in the entryway of the Yeah, we're heading in through these means and it doesn't mean we're perfectly executing on them. It means that we're just very committed to that. Right. So we're heading in. So that's the first mansion. You know, if you pop over to uh what what I did with this book is at the end of every mansion I during in the mansion I review everywhere where she gives spiritual warfare wisdom, advice, whatever. And at the end I summarize the battles of that mansion, key tactics of the enemy. Um so you want to read the demonic goal of this mansion. >> goal of the first mansion to keep you out of the interior castle and keep you from understanding what it means to be an authentic disciple of Jesus. Specifically to keep you away from daily mental prayer and the daily examine or examination of conscience that would enable you to stay awake and attentive to God's voice and his inner movements in your heart leading you to in this new journey. >> By the way, spiritualdirection.com has free guides like ebooks on examine like doing figuring out your root sin, which is usually what you constantly take to confession, you know, that sort of thing. >> And didn't we set up something in Holy Habits that has similar things? >> The Holy Habits, the app also has that that we designed. So check those out to help you just become more aware and you can do an examine through Holy Habits by the way and also be accountable. >> Mhm. >> So I can say, well, I don't I'm going to just try to limit alcohol to Sunday or whatever and then I can engage you in that commitment and then if I do it before Sunday and I'm honest, you go you might call me and go, "Okay, is this going to be once this week? Is that right?" Yes, okay, it's right, you know, whatever. Okay. So, key cat tactics of the enemy discourage you regarding your ability to follow God or live the faith. Um that is about um because when you first start to fight, you're a wimp. You know, you're weak, and you're swinging, and you're going and you're failing. And you fail a lot because your will is weak, and it can be very frustrating. And so, the enemy can say, you know, "You're a loser." Uh you you can't ever get free of this. You've tried before. You know you're not going to get you know, whatever it is. >> Which by the way, this is why discernment of spirits is so important. And if you just remember doubt, despair, and narcissism. >> Yeah. >> And if you can key in on the fact, oh, I'm being driven to despair, >> Uh-huh. >> reject it, move on, keep fighting. >> Yeah, exactly. The next one, if you would. >> Worries or fear about the things of this world in the flesh, pleasure, money, control, prestige, ambition, work, or anything in this life that may be a source of anxiety and that draws you into desolation and away from God. >> So, what that's about is and I will I wonder if you remember this when you were kind of cuz I don't know what it was like. You wrecked your marriage, you were in, you know, pretty deep hole, but you still had a decision to make. And I don't remember if you had a a point where you could recall where you said, "I'm not doing this. I'm living a different way." I don't Do you remember that? >> Yeah, um I don't remember like an exact point, >> Yeah. >> but that definitely happened. I I think in terms of distraction from prayer, what's interesting reflecting back is I I was given extraordinary graces in the beginning where my prayer was pretty unbothered uh at the start cuz I think God was just pouring gasoline on that. He was like, "Yes, thank you. Finally, >> Come on. Yeah. Be encouraged. Yeah. >> Here's a lot of consolation. Like giving a little kid candy. >> Yeah. Um now I struggle more with that that it what we just read, that distraction of the world, and I have to be very purposeful, as you mentioned earlier. >> Yeah. >> Um this is where, you know, I've talked to people and and and folks just cannot fathom how this is reality, but it is. You know, the less of the world that you consume, podcasts, secular music, secular podcasts, I'll say that, faith stuff. But even faith stuff can be distracting. >> You can have too much noise. >> Yeah, it's it's got I love uh I maybe one day we'll go through The Screwtape Letters, cuz it's one of my all-time favorite books, but uh anything but God. >> Mhm. >> Right? Anything but God. >> Right. >> And that includes >> religion. >> Right. >> Yeah, and a disordered kind of expression of religion. >> Right. >> Yeah, so the other thing is is it's is it's the enemy's going to try to get you and this is rule one of Ignatius discernment, to kind of get you to remain entangled in life systems. You know, sometimes I know a couple of people who are doing really well now who had to leave the state they lived in to disentangle themselves from patterns of sin, whether it's it's drugs or availability of drugs or friends who, you know, if they're trying to get free of a particular thing, friends who did those things, and just had to exit fully. >> Yeah. >> And they couldn't they didn't have enough willpower enough willpower to decide to move, but they cuz they knew they didn't have the >> enough willpower to resist, they're too close. >> Yeah, so think about that for those who are listening, these people picked up, moved, which is not cheap, >> Right. >> found somewhere else, >> Right. >> you know, that's the amount of this I think that's what Teresa and and I know this is what, you know, Liguori and Francis de Sales and all these other you'll come across this phrase do violence to yourself. It's >> That's what she was speaking about. >> That's what that means. >> Yeah. >> It's it's extraordinary effort and overcoming whatever you need to overcome. Yeah, no matter what it is. >> You did violence to yourself by going to a treatment center. >> Yeah. >> You know, so distraction from spiritual disciplines is another thing the enemy is going to try to get you to do, particularly daily mental prayer, fervent sacramental life. Um the devil is powerless against a humble soul to the degree that your humility increases the enemy will have less influence. So he's just going to do everything he can to keep you, you know, you'll have to learn to get up earlier to go do mental prayer. You have to learn to go to bed on time. You know, specifically in a in not stay up late. And I'm a night person and I I'm really glad I'm a night person because I'm one of those people who's sort of wired to just never go to bed. >> Yeah. >> And >> [laughter] >> no, I'll fall anytime I'm sitting still anywhere, I'll fall asleep. But just generally in terms of the attention. And I had to learn in life that if I followed that inclination, I would have never graduated from college. I would not be able to provide for you. I would you know, in our family. I would not be able to do what I've done uh because I'm more attentive in the morning. So the enemy So it doesn't matter what your inclinations are. It matters what your end is. >> Mhm. >> And if your end is disciple with disciple with with Jesus, to hell with your inclinations, right? >> Right. >> You know, who cares? You know, they'll take you to hell. >> Right. >> Unless you say, you can go to hell. I'm not doing that. >> Right. >> You know. So resisting the enemy in those things and then the last one, you want to hit that one. >> Yes, this is a huge one. >> Yeah. Inordinate focus on the sins or foibles of others and a corresponding decrease in your charity for others. A decrease in charity is a decrease in spiritual progress. A decrease in charity is a decrease in spiritual progress. Should say this 8,000 times. I've been hammering this on social media recently. >> Right. >> Uh and and speaking of which, the gospel what two or three days ago was what is the greatest commandment? >> Uh-huh. >> Love God above all else and >> Love your neighbor. >> Love your neighbor. And reading the early church fathers writing on that and why Jesus combined those two things. It's why I wrote a post if you haven't seen it, it's called most Catholics aren't going to make it to heaven. And it's specifically on this aspect of charity. So anyway, that's why I'm a little bit more intense about this. Focus on others draws your focus away from yourself in relationship with and to God and diminishes charity in your soul. >> And it's the way the enemy distracts you. And then the why it happens is when you become aware of your sin, it's now repugnant to you. You start to see it in others and their sin is repugnant to you. >> And you and but your reaction should be one of of maybe rejoicing is not the right word. >> As as um sympathy or >> Sympathy or sorrow. >> Yeah, and desire for them to be whole and wanting to wash their feet or help them. >> And listen, I I mean I'm speaking from I don't write this stuff to lambast people. It's hey, I've been here and it almost took me. You need to be aware and avoid this. >> Yeah, yeah. >> And you know, I've seen I've gone through that process of seeing somebody dealing with what I used to deal with and I'm just like, what are you doing? And it it frustrates you and she can she can or you continue, I guess. Holy zealousness can easily become angry, bitter zealotry and ultimately paralyzes you by drawing your gaze to focus on the storms, problems and challenging people around you rather than on your own role in them humbly serving God and helping others to heaven. So when you see folks who are struggling with what you struggled with and it is repugnant to you as it should be, your response should not be anger or frustration, which I have done. It should be I've been there. >> Got to pray for them. Can I help you? Yeah. >> I I remember what I That's This is another trick of the enemy is like you know, yeah, you're not there anymore. So you can say what you want to say. >> Yeah. >> It's like, no, I can go back there at any moment. >> Right. >> You know what I mean? >> Right. Yeah, it's in the lap of the >> pride. Yeah. >> Yeah. So, um what are the remedies? Daily mass frequently, you know, as frequently as you can. If you can't go to daily mass, have monthly confession, you know, minimum. >> Yeah. >> If you're habitual mortal sin, go as much as you need to go. Thank God our priest um is in the confessional at every before every mass. He's He's What a blessing. Um daily mental prayer, uh daily examine, guard yourself against the critical spirit, consider your final judgment. Uh so the she ends with spiritual encouragement, which is was a surprise to me. I think I mentioned about this book. She says, "As you commit fight the battle and deep uh fight the battle and develop foundational spiritual disciplines, you will get better at fighting. As you draw nearer to the one who conquers all, you will grow more aware of yourself, of God, and the enemy, and thus become less susceptible to attacks and deceptions." St. Teresa encourages personiers, noting that the devil is less successful with those who enter who and who are nearer to the king's dwelling place. So, that's a good uh that's a good overview of that chapter. Now, for those, you know, following along with us, I would strongly recommend you read this on your own and and journal and answer all these questions. I'm actually teaching a class right now at the Avila Institute called Spiritual Warfare in the Progress of the Soul. >> And the questions that you're referring to are questions for reflection at the end of every chapter. >> end of every chapter, like, "What tactics does the enemy use to seek to follow God? What's been the result of the temptation?" And which is we're kind of weaving into our conversation. What specific actions or spiritual disciplines can you adopt? Like if you go to daily mass, great. How often do you go to confession? Once a quarter? Okay, let's step that up, you know. There's a couple of great books for that. One is What's the Is it a fruitful confession? Confession and fruitful practice is the title. Little blue [clears throat] book published by TAN. Absolutely chock It is the most packed spiritual wisdom book in its size of any book I've ever read. Um So, into the deep we've talked about, you know, those sorts of things. If you don't have mental prayer, do mental prayer. If you don't have the examine, do the examine. spiritualdirection.com we have tons of resources to teach you to do all of that. And if you want a deeper dive on all of that, head out to apostolivia.org, which is our community. And then there All this will be linked in the description. Yeah, there's there's free courses there, overcoming habitual sin, how to practice mental prayer, um you know, all spiritual warfare and discernment of spirits, you know, all that. So, uh we're here to help. >> Yeah. >> And and >> Go ahead. >> And if this show has helped you, what are you supposed to do? >> Share it, subscribe, thumbs up, turn on the bell notifications, don't miss the stuff. >> Yeah. >> Uh and I did the narration for this. You can find that on >> Yeah, he did a great job as well as my other books. >> Someone gave a really nice review. Uh someone local gave a nice review. I don't I think it was Finding Peace in the Storm. He's kind of been wondering what it was, but anyway. Romans 16:20, "The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet. The grace of our Lord Jesus be with you. Amen." >> Amen.