The Exact Foods to Eat to Lose Fat Without Starving Yourself | Mind Pump 2931

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind Pump. Mind Pump with your hosts Sal Dphano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. >> You just found the most downloaded health, fitness, entertainment podcast in the history of the universe, approaching over half a billion downloads. This is Mind Pump, and today's episode, we had people call in and we coached them live on air. So, we help them with their health and fitness, but this was after the intro. Today's intro, 62 minutes long. Now, in the intro, we talk about diet, exercise, strength training, cardio, fat loss, muscle building. We also talk about current events, family life. Look, if you want to be on an episode like this, here's what you got to do. Submit your question to mpivecaller.com. Now, this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is ButcherBox. Today, we talked about their grass-fed ground beef. They also have heritage pork ribs, but this is a company that mails uh and literally sends to your door highquality meats for incredible prices. In fact, if you go through our link, butcherbox.com/mindpump, you can get free ribe eyes, New York strip steaks, or filet minions in every order for a year included, plus $20 off your first box. This episode is also brought to you by Ketone IQ. This is an exogenous ketone supplement. So, if you want the benefits of being in ketosis, but you still want to eat carbs like everybody else, try Ketone IQ. One shot of this puts you in ketosis. You get that clarity in your mind. You get that brain energy that you're looking for without having to avoid carbs. Go to ketone.com/mindpump. That link will get you 30% off your subscription. Also happening right now, it's buy one get one free for our top 10 most popular maps workout programs. Buy any one of them, get any one of the other ones for free. It's maps bogo.com. Go check it out. Here comes the show. >> And it's t-shirt time. >> A [ __ ] Doug. You know it's my favorite time of the week. >> Two winners this week. One for Apple Podcast, one for Facebook. The Apple Podcast winner is Cody Hasselwood. And for Facebook, we have Andrew Cox. Both of you are winners. Send the name I just read to iTunes at mindpumpmed media.com. Include your shirt size and your shipping address and we'll get that shirt right out to you. All right, you guys asked for it. You constantly asked for it. Tell me what to eat. Now, of course, there's a huge individual variance. It's very difficult to do when we're talking to tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands, especially millions of people. But we're going to try anyway. Here's what we're going to do. We're going to tell you what to eat to get lean fast. We're going to be specific on what the best breakfast, lunch, and dinner is that you could do that'll probably get you phenomenal results. Let's go. I actually really like this because uh >> yeah, we're going to get I'm sure roasted by some some talking head uh about you know this is like what about somebody who's this and what about like the obviously >> but >> that being said uh [snorts] these general guidelines or this generic meal plan pen that you wrote right here most people if they just stuck to it like real close to it >> that's right >> give or take you know a couple ounces up or north of something you know if you're smaller or bigger, you would get in incredibly great shape just eating this way. >> Yeah. And I picked I tried to pick [snorts] um foods that not everybody Okay, because I know again we're talking to a lot of individuals here, but most people would find uh good enough. In other words, I'm not we're not going to give you this crazy boring diet that's impossible. >> Yeah. [snorts] >> We're going to put in foods. Now, it's whole food based, of course. >> You put your own spices in it. >> Yeah. And these are these are foods that most people are okay with uh eating. And there's some uh options for variety within what we're saying. But generally speaking, and we're going to give some ranges here because we know we're talking to both men and women. So women generally are going to be on the lower end, men on the higher end. If you follow something like this and you're consistent with it, especially if your diet uh is like the typical American Americans diet, this will be a massive improvement >> over your current diet. And what you'll notice is this. Here's what you'll notice. in combination with a decent workout with an appropriate workout. What you'll notice is you'll get leaner. You'll also get stronger. You'll build some muscle. You'll also burn some body fat. And you're not going to feel like you're starving yourself. That's what this is going to feel like. You're going to feel kind of good. >> It's okay. So, the point I was going to make with the when I'm looking at this diet and we're assuming these people are lifting weights, right? A good follow following a good program with it. What you should expect though is not a lot of movement on the scale. >> Yeah. And this this is probably the most difficult part for somebody who's going to follow something like this is they'll eat this way because obviously the title, you know, eat this to get lean fast, right? So get lean fast is some is going to attract the person who wants to lose body fat or drop weight on the tons of weight on the scale, >> right? >> But what I know by what you wrote here, this is going to be a much higher protein diet than that that person is probably eating, which is a great thing. Mhm. >> It's going to be satiety producing. It's now going to give them appropriate amount of protein in order to build muscle. So that paired with lifting weights, what this should result in is absolutely a leaner physique the fastest way possible. But what a leaner physique f the fastest way possible actually looks like it's little movement on the scale because there's this beautiful exchange of you're adding a pound of muscle, you're losing a pound of fat, which is net zero on the scale. And so if you do take this advice and you and you follow it and you're following it to get lean fast, do not measure your results by what you see on the scale. Yeah. >> Because to your point, >> you're going to get stronger on this and you should lose body fat on this. Um which will typically show little to no movement at the beginning on the scale. >> And I'm glad you said that. later, especially if you have a lot of body fat to lose, you will see lots of body fat come off. But in the beginning, especially as you're building muscle, stoking that metabolic rate, there's not going to be a ton of movement on the scale. >> Proper pure fat loss is more of a snowball effect >> than what people typically experience when they do it the wrong way, which is an initial rapid weight loss on the scale, which includes half of it being muscle, and this really hard plateau. Uh, and then eventually you you give up. All right, let's get to the diet. And we'll start with breakfast. Now, here's the deal. I know a lot of people like to skip breakfast. I don't think it's a good idea for most people. Now, there are situations where skipping breakfast may [clears throat] be beneficial. Um, typically people with gut health issues >> uh is are the people that fall into this category. But generally speaking, skipping breakfast sets you up for the most part, this is especially true for women, less true for men, but also true for men. This sets you up for uh hormonal um uh dysfunction to now that's maybe a little strong but essentially we're not optimizing our hormonal state by completely skipping breakfast. Um and this tends to set us up for failure later on. Now in the extreme cases when people skip too many meals we start to see some thyroid dysfunction. This becomes much more common in women. Cortisol spikes in men uh less common but you'll start to see some of that as well when this gets real extreme. But you do see these swings in how people eat. You start to see energy levels swing. At first, maybe more energy from skipping. But then as the body adapts to the increased catakolamine production, all that stuff, then they start to feel dead. So skipping breakfast generally not a good idea. It's also very difficult to hit protein. Yeah. >> If you skip breakfast, like good luck hitting optimal protein if your first meal is >> you got to digest and absorb, you know, protein in really big amounts and it's a lot more difficult. So I was going to ask you if [snorts] the stuff that we are aware of that that um hormonally like thyroid stuff uh when somebody is skipping breakfast is that because uh of skipping breakfast or is that more connected uh to the fact that they're more likely eating too low of protein and maybe missing healthy fats that's causing that >> independent of the total calories, proteins, carbs, all that stuff. going for long periods without food has a uh stronger stress response in women than it does for men. >> So independent of that. So if somebody was really good still about hitting their their proteins and fats, it still has some some some ne potential negative effects. >> Yes. And I know some people are like, "Oh, it doesn't bother me. I'm okay." Um and so yeah, there's a little bit of an indiv individual variance, but when you look at generally the data and and look, I'll speak from experience. When fasting became very popular, I had lots of clients trying it. And generally speaking, women responded poorly >> to fasting. And I had male clients that were okay. Some responded well, uh, some not so well, but most of my female clients, uh, eventually this turned out to be terrible. And we had hormone effects as [snorts] a result. So, and then again, try to hit your protein >> targets when going Yeah. like a full year. And it initially, you know, skipping breakfast and just having coffee worked for me. And I had that like energy spike in the morning, dude. And then it just completely didn't work for me anymore. And yeah, like everything got slower. My energy just bonked. And so yeah, I had to reintroduce. >> I mean, I never used the uh when I was trying to explain this to clients, I I never used the argument of of a better hormone profile. It was purely always in my experience, you just can't hit your protein without it. Very few. I mean there are always exceptions to the rule when we communicate to an audience this size >> but for the most part and in my experience uh every client that I ever had when I first assessed their diet I always had to bump protein intake. They were always under they were either grossly undereating or they were less than optimal always. Yes. And so skipping bre and so skipping breakfast was never a good strategy if from that context. It was like we're already undereing uh to say let's just not even eat one whole meal in there. It would just made that more difficult and then they were playing catchup all day and all night and then many times having to have this ma if they were still able to hit the protein this massive dinner y >> that then affected impeded sleep. >> Yep. So, uh, >> I was just over a family member's house and she just started tracking and I'm looking at it. Okay. On average, on average, she's eating 40 to 50 grams of protein. That's that is that is the norm. That is the norm. And you know what? It's the normal by people who think they eat a lot of protein. >> Oh, she did say that. Oh, I'm having protein >> because they they eat meat or they do that. They're not they're not they because they have meals that always that have that. They just assume that they're >> Yeah. She like I had an egg sandwich for breakfast and then a little turkey here and I'm like that's 50 grams for the whole day. >> Yeah. >> Her highest day of protein was 100 gram and that happened once in an entire week and and that to her was like insane. Yeah. >> When ideally honestly for ideally for her it would have been closer to 130 but she was averaging 50 and that's most people. Um and if you want to you want more details on why optimal protein helps with fat loss, we've done so many episodes on it but it's very well studied. All right let's go into breakfast. Here's what breakfast will look like for you. Okay, for uh and I'm giving a range here for women to men. You want to start off with some kind of meat or eggs. You want a good source of protein. You're looking at probably 6 to 8 ounces of meat. Uh with eggs, you're looking at probably 6 to eight or nine eggs. A lot more than you think. About 30 to 50 grams of protein. You want 30 to 50 grams of protein with breakfast. The other thing you're going to have with it is two cups of blackberries. Blackberries are incredible sources of fiber. They also have some carbohydrates, but they're very low in the glycemic index. You're going to start your day off with 30 to 50 grams of protein, 30 grams of carbs, 15 grams of fiber. The fiber plus the protein is going to produce a satiety that's going to last for the rest of the day. You're going to have better insulin sensitivity the whole day because you started, and this is what the data shows, start your day off high protein, high fiber. Your blood sugar levels are more blunted. So, you're not going to have the high spikes and low lows. >> Crazy cravings. That's right. And it helps a lot with mood and cravings to start the day off that way. >> So, my favorite is to actually have a blend of the two uh meat and eggs. >> So, I don't have to have seven or eight eggs. I can have four eggs and like 3 to 4 ounces of one of those meats. >> Yep. >> Ends up being this beautiful 50 g. And they go so well together. They do. Scrambled eggs up with some beef or leftover chicken is so good. uh many obviously I'm I'm a little bit bigger guy and so I can totally afford and also an ounce of cheese on top of that too. So now with this beautiful breakfast. >> Yeah. Four eggs or three eggs scrambled with like 3 4 ounces of chicken thighs. You scramble it up. It's >> and I always, you know, this has always been a huge hack for me. If you listen to the show and heard me say it a million times, I apologize. But for someone who hasn't, um, the hack is make whatever you made from the previous night dinner, just a bigger portion size so that leftovers can be. So, it's like if you did a ground beef dish, you did a chicken dish, a steak, any of these dishes, and you prepared dinner, just throw an extra slab of meat on there or an extra pound of meat on there, whatever it is. And then that leftover now can be the next two mornings of breakfast with a couple eggs. Now, what's interesting about this, cuz I know people are listening and they're going, "I can't eat that for breakfast. That's like huge." Like, what is it? Three scrambled eggs plus meat inside of it. I can never do that. And the same people that are saying this are the same people that are struggling with weight loss. People who need to lose 40 to 50 pounds. Train yourself to do it. >> But later in the day, they have no problem eating tremendous amounts of calories. I'm telling you right now, if you make this happen in the morning, it will positively affect the rest of the day. And yes, it's going to feel hard at first. That's the point. >> It will. That's it's going to feel difficult at first, but get this consistently, the rest of the day is affected in a positive way rather than what people typically do, which is small to nothing or sugar and then the rest of the day uh is in the toilet. >> All right, let's talk about lunch. Uh this is a great easy meal you can pack. It's delicious. 30 to 50 grams of protein of ground beef. Uh you could go with really lean ground beef if you want. A half a cup to a cup of rice. Uh and two cups of well-cooked greens. So now you've got your carbohydrates, your proteins, your fats, and you've got your greens. And you can add, what's really good about this, a ground beef and rice bowl with salsa. The salsa adds barely any calories. >> It's really delicious. Like a burrito bowl. >> Yeah. You just mix all this in one thing. >> Mix it all together. >> Yeah. This ain't going to look pretty. >> No. And it's really good. It's convenient. You can bring it with you to work. It takes a minute and a half in the microwave. And you've got another 30, 50 grams of protein. You've got your your carbohydrates, some fats from the meat, and your greens, which help with digestion. >> By the way, an example of this, too, is another example of this, you know, cut in half or a quarter mixed with some of the eggs for the next breakfast next day works too. So, a lot of these what I like about this like kind of, you know, foundation or anchor meals that you're building right now is that they work really well and they're interchangeable with breakfast, lunch, and dinner, which we're always trying to simplify it for clients that like if you're already trying to train them to eat whole foods consistently, then trying to do it how we did it back in the days when we get a print off from the computer that would just tell us to like all these random [laughter] meals that you had to go out of your way to prepare and make. It's like you can do a lot of this stuff in bulk and then package it a little different for breakfast, lunch, and dinner to make you feel like it's more of a dinner or it's more of a breakfast, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. And this bowl right here, I I have yet to find a client that uh actually gets sick of this bowl. >> Sounds so basic. >> So easy to digest, though. You feel so much better after eating a meal like >> And it tastes good. It's easy. It's an easy meal. It tastes good. It's not uh hard to put down. Um and it's uh very easy to store. You put it in a container, you got it in the fridge, take it to work the next day, you're all set. All right, let's get to dinner. >> Six to eight ounces of meat. So again, we're looking at 30 to 50 grams of protein. A large sweet potato, which is probably the sweet potato you'll find at the grocery store. Funny story with this, >> when you look at macros on things like potatoes, and it says medium, it's typically a 5 in sweet potato, which if you go to the grocery store, >> the sweet potatoes are all super big. Like twice as big. Five inch sweet potato. Like where do you find the tiny little thing? I mean, I I've I've shared the story a long time ago of when I first started weighing and measuring track of food. The sweet potato was one of the first things that blew my mind because before this, I was using just like a a calorie king book that I used to have and that's how they it's either small, medium, or large uh sweet potato. And uh what I was cuz when and and then when I go to the grocery store, you can you can you can visually in your head see what the smaller ones and what the larger ones look like. the smaller ones are bigger than what the book had as the extra-l large ones. >> And so I was like I mean hundreds of calories off my estimation uh when I actually weighed them out like oh wow. And same thing for like bananas. >> Bananas are another one where it's like you know what the what the book would say is a small banana like that doesn't even exist in grocery stores. Like the the smallest banana is an extra large banana. And so weighing >> what's happened to food where they've done that? [laughter] Just everything's just gotten larger. >> It's got to be, right? The same thing. >> Selective, what do they call it? Selective farming. Selective breeding. >> Dude, it's true for everything. Get an apple like what they think is a normal size. Get a strawberry. You get strawberries like this, like the size. Get a strawberry the size of an apple now. >> And original strawberries were like they're berries. They look like not much bigger. They were a little bit bigger than blackberries or blueberries. [laughter] They weren't they weren't these giant things this big. >> That's wild. We've pumpkins now. Oh my god. >> Same thing with chicken breast also. Anyway, so 6 to8 ounces of meat, get yourself a sweet potato, two cups of cooked greens. You've got your proteins, your fibers, your carbohydrates. You've got some good vegetables that are cooked. By the way, the reason why I say cooked greens. If you want your vegetables to really help with digestion, cook them well. If you want them to hurt your digestion, eat them raw. And that's true. So, raw vegetables, not so great for digestion. Well cooked, very well cooked, uh, make a difference. But there you have it with the meals. And so what you're looking at is 90 to 150, you know, or so uh grams of protein uh per day. So that's going to that's going to cover the range. Now, here's the deal. Some of you guys are going to need more protein than this. Uh this is where shakes uh come in handy. So now you can have a shake post-workout, 30 to 50 grams of of protein, and now you're getting for most people in those optimal ranges. Now, here's what's key with what we just said, okay? Meal prep. Meal prepping is key with all of this. In fact, meal prepping is key uh to be able to eat healthy in general. What really messes people up consistently is that they're hungry, it's time to eat, and their options are are basically what they can door dash or what they can drive to or what's in their pantry or what's at the office. None of which are are are ever typically good ideas. But if you meal prep, you know, twice a week or whatever, you're set with your meals and your odds of consistency go. And it's crazy that uh we we over complicate this and we make it sound like it's this big ordeal or like you have to plan a whole day of cooking this, but the things that you chose like sweet potato and white rice, you cook those in bulk. >> Yeah. >> The chicken breast, the ground beef, cook those in bulk. Cook pounds of it at a time to last you two or three days. No different than if you were to make it a meal for just you and your spouse. You just 4x it. I mean, you just put more of it in all in all on the grill or in the in in the the the crock pot or in the oven. It's like so the the the time and effort and then the last bit is like, you know, having yourself some nice glass Tupperwarees that you and once you get this down, right, like this uh system of what it looks like. I mean, I've got my half cup scooper for my rice, my big rice cooker, and I've got all the, you know, I've definitely got a lot of glass Tupperware that I've, so I have plenty always that are the perfect size for this stuff. And once you kind of figure all that out, >> this becomes really routine, really easy to do. And to be funny that a lot of the motivation for me today has been uh to save money. How ridiculous it is to eat out or >> Oh, yeah. That's Dude, this saves so much money doing this. >> So much money. >> The whole myth about eating healthy is more expensive. Eating healthy is only more expensive if you go to restaurants that advertise eating healthy. They'll charge you more for that. >> Everything all prepackaged. >> But if you make it yourself, you >> forbid you have a dash to your house these days. I mean, [laughter] gosh, >> the the the you you spend an exorbitant amount of money eating these these these crappy processed foods uh that aren't even that good, that are way overpriced. So, yeah. And I mean you then you throw in something like a like a butcher box where you can can buy things in bulk. You can have it shipped to your house. >> I just want to add like if you try this, listen, if you're listening and you're like, "Okay, I'm going to give this a shot and you give it a shot for 30 days, it's going to blow your mind at a few things. One, how much strength you gain." Most people listening, if they did this, they're going to be like, "Oh my god, I'm suddenly getting stronger." >> Always surprising for people >> every time. Like every time I'm lifting, my weight's going up. This will happen if you go if you're the typical like I barely eat protein too. Oh, I eat high protein. A >> lot of times that's the unlock. That's the even realize it. Yeah. >> Number two, this is really going to blow you away. You're going to feel like you're getting leaner simultaneously feel like you're eating a lot of food. >> If you eat like this protein and fiber, especially protein, so satiety producing that you're going to eat this way and you're going to be like, I feel like I'm stuffing myself. What's going on? Then a month later, you're going to be like, how did my waist go down a half an inch? I feel like I'm eating so much food. you're actually eating less calories than you would have if you were eating processed foods uh and eating out. But the protein is high. >> And number three, you will fill it in your pocketbook. >> You will say and and you think it's the opposite because like you said, you're you're I mean, buy nice cuts of meat. Buy all that stuff like that and you're eating maybe three or four times a day versus what you were before two times. You'll still save money. Totally. >> It's still when you especially like again like I brought up Butcher Box. You do something like that where you you have something on subscription that's a deal. So, you get your ground beef all sent to you grass-fed >> and you cook in bulk like this. I have saved so much more money eating this way. >> That's the number one thing I get from Butcher Box is the ground beef. It's the largest of the because we we cook so much of it and we cook it all together. We cook the pot of rice. We have it sitting there. Easy meal together. And if you want to, you know, spruce it up, you salsa, you can put guac on there, cheese or whatever. I just typically do rice and meat. >> Yeah. Most consistent, easy way to handle. Their ground beef is really good. It's grass-fed. It's really good. Uh obviously easy to cook. You throw you throw it in a pan, you make it. >> Oh, we did their ribs. Uh Everett like requested them. And um it's funny cuz you know how long it takes, but like and we were like, "Okay, it's probably going to be a few hours." And uh poor Courtney was like still at it in the trigger and we were smoking it and it was like I think it was like 10:00 at night and then we all had a feast at like 10:00 at night. [laughter] We're still eating. They're so good. But it was like, man, I wish you started like >> Katrina and I each crush a whole set ourselves. So like like that we'll cook that and it's she gets one, I get a whole we each get a whole rack. >> I'll just I'll we'll I'll just eat that. >> Is it cuz it's a heritage pork, right? That's right. >> I just like cuz it's, you know, it's so much meat on the bone cuz the pork is different. >> The crepe free uh pork. Yeah. >> Yeah. It tastes different. >> It is different. everybody I know that that likes to to do ribs and I convince to to go try and let me like I we've I've been doing those ribs now for I don't know how many years since we've been working with them but for a long time now and there's been many a times when I'm craving them and and I've already cooked my butcher box and so I have to go to the grocery store and buy uh some of the ribs and I've tried all different brands and kinds and none of them are as good as the butcher box ones and I don't know I don't know if that's because it's the heritage pork Mhm. >> I don't know if it's the the perfect size. I don't know. I don't know why. All I know is that I've tested it many times. I wish I could find some a replacement for when I am out of my butcher box ribs, but uh they they are amazing. And everybody that I've got to do it are like, you're right, they taste so good off the bone. >> I read a post today that was so wild. I knew some of the stuff, but this person lists it all down and it just blows me away. And so basically these are they made a list of some of the most egregious accepted you know uh settled science that we accepted that we later realized was like killing us. So they did this over the years. And now there's way more than this by the way. So you can actually look up >> like you know uh prescription drugs that have been taken off the market. So you'll see a lot of them. >> But this person went through and these were things that people did because everybody doctor scientists were like yeah that's good. And then later we found out was horrible. So they made a list. So in the 1890s you were giving your kids the new by Bayer. Bayer made this Justin careful. >> Of course indeed [laughter] they made this new cough syrup that worked. It was uh it was heroin. Uh and so [laughter] >> they were giving kids >> stop the cough. >> They were giving kids heroin. This was cough medicine for kids. >> And in the 1900s you rub calamel teething powder on your infant's gums. >> Wow. This was to help them because they were chamomile. >> No, no. Calamel was the name of it. It's a mercury compound. Okay. So, you were giving your children uh what's called pink disease. Swollen peeling hand. >> Oh, wow. The Bayer The Bayer was actually even called heroin. >> Yeah, they called heroin. >> Not even disguising it. Just Oh, wow. >> Yeah. Let me tell you, it's effective. Your cough is gone when you take >> Was this uh What is What is um Sorry to derail you a little bit. Just just maybe Okay. In the in the movie Tombstone, she is taking an opia, but it's called something else. >> Is it lad? >> Lum. So, is is is lad a derivative from from this or like >> linum? Lotum. Yeah, you're right. That's it's something like that. And it she was taking it for like her bad uh >> linum. She got very addicted to it. >> Linum is uh it's dark reddish alcohol. It's opium. >> Yeah. >> So, it's just opium >> tincture of opium >> dust. It's just Yeah. Good oldfashioned opium. Good. >> Well, isn't that what I mean? So, >> so I mean, heroin came from opium. >> Opium was like this is like the that's the foundational. >> Got it. Got it. >> Okay. Organic. Anyway, [laughter] >> can we go into bears history? >> No, wait. We will after. Yeah. Please, please, let's go after. All right. Then in the 1910s, you start cooking with Krisco, which was launched by a soap and candle company because cotton seed oil is modern and lard is what your mom used. >> Yeah. >> So this is uh this was trans fats, right? So we were using Crisco instead of lard and they were advertising as such. >> Now they advertise anything without trans fats cuz it's horrible. >> In the 1920s, you drink something called Ratithor. This was certified radioactive water [laughter] on prescription. ratify buyers took 1,400 bottles for his vitality. Eventually, his jaw was removed in pieces and he was buried. >> In a lead coffin, they had to bury him in lead in a lead coffin. Radioactive. >> He was so radioactive. No superpowers. >> What? That reminds me of that uh those poor ladies that were um working in that factory to make watches >> to paint watches. They paint it with this >> with radium. >> Yeah. And they would lick the They would lick the tips. >> Uranium. Yeah. It was like It was just radium. >> It was just radium. It glow. >> Yeah. They would lick the tips of the of the uh paintbrushes. What watch company? Do you know? >> You can look it up, Doug. Look it up. That's interesting. >> Yeah. Radioactive watch cuz they'd lick and then they'd, >> you know, to give it a point, you know, to paint these watches. >> For some reason, I thought that that was like the envelopes or something like that. That that >> Oh, there they are right there. >> Oh, yeah. >> So, >> what was the watch company? >> They called them the radium girls. the [laughter] radio. >> They would they would they were they would all getting cancer, >> dude. >> Of course, it's freaking radioactive. >> There's a whole documentary. >> There's a whole documentary on it. Oh, that'd be interesting. I would watch that. >> It was widely used in the 20th century to make watch dials and military instrument glow in the dark. >> Notice they don't put any brand names. >> No. Yeah. That's smart. [laughter] >> That kind of bad publicity. >> I wonder what the Anyway, so there's that. Uh here's another one. 1930s30s a chemist dissolves a new sulfa drug and dethylene glycol which is antifreeze. It kills 107 people mostly children. >> Wow. >> Then in the 1940s your doctor is smoking camels in surgery. Uh and because doctors were the ones that smoke camel cigarettes apparently ash over like a over an [laughter] open Oh [ __ ] Whoops. >> You want a nice steady hand, right? So camel in one. >> Yeah. accidentally ash in the wound. >> In the 1950s, [laughter] DDT is sprayed over your kitchen, your garden, and your children at school. The man who found it or founded it was given a Nobel Peace Prize. By the way, my grandfather, >> my grandfather or my great-grandfather told me stories of this. He said when he was little in Sicily, they'd have all the kids line up outside the house and they drive a truck through and just blast >> and just blast everybody with DDT for lice. >> Yeah. >> So crazy. by old DDT commercials. You ever watch them? >> No. >> People are eating at a picnic and they blow DDT over the food and the people keep eating to show how safe it is. [laughter] >> I heard a lot of studies were tainted because they didn't factor in DDT exposure. >> Oh. >> For so many people back then. >> Yeah, dude. >> And like people getting cancer. >> Okay. So, is that it stops in the 50s? Did we stop making these mistakes? >> Uh DDT we stopped using much later. In fact, it was used for a long time. uh for very very long. >> Have we even got to asbestous yet? >> Yeah, I know. It's I don't even think it's in the list. All right, cool. 1960s. This is terrible. By the way, >> women are using called using something calledthalidomide for morning sickness because it's remarkably safe. Except more than 10,000 children are born with missing or shortened limbs. >> Oh yeah. >> Do you know what happened with that by the way? >> No. that when you look at the uh molecular structure of this drugal theidomide, if you do the the mirror version of it, if it's flipped, then it produces these uh birth defects. Scientists thought it was the same. If it's facing this way, it's the same. If facing Not true, if it faces the other way, then your kid's going to be born without an arm or leg or something. >> So, how so how did it end up being like how did that mess up? Like, uh because >> the molecule got flipped. How did the molecule get flipped? Because the way they made it, they just it was the same process. They weren't trying to control for that. >> Oh my god. >> Yeah. So you had tens of thousands of children that were born with with these. Yeah. For this morning sickness drug that was hailed >> as a miracle and that doctor said was really good for you. >> In the 1970s, uh the country puts down butter, picks up margarine because the American Heart Association says margarine is better for you. This was official guidelines. Margarine. >> American Heart Association. Yeah. They Yeah, they got a few misses under their >> belt. I know. And so there you go. And there's more. 1990s your father's produ prescribed Oxycontton. And now we have this huge uh opiate issue as a result. In the 2000s, Vio for knee pain was pulled off in 2004 because tens of thousands of excessive heart attacks. Those are just some of the examples. >> Yeah, this is overcounter stuff. >> And by the way, I was just talking with the deal. I won't say his name, the dude that cut our hair today. >> Yeah. So, um I was talking about his dad. His dad had horrible stroke and so his dad's young [clears throat] >> and we were talking about it >> and yeah, we were I was asking him questions and um I was like, you know, just I said, you know, forgive me for asking this and you don't have to answer this, sister, but did your dad ever get >> the COVID vaccine? >> Um and he says, uh he wasn't sure, but he had did you guys know he got the COVID vaccine and it gave him the heart inflammation. He had to get hospitalized for the kid that cut her hair. >> I didn't know that. And he says sometimes when he gets sick it comes back and he has to go. >> It's awesome. >> Are we allowed to talk about this now? >> No. Trust the science. >> Yeah. >> Thanks, Doug. [laughter] >> Thanks for bringing us. >> I know someone personally I know someone personally who is uh late 30s who uh through the COVID vaccine had strokes. Several. >> Yeah. >> And they linked it back to that. >> So anyway, just a little little history of >> it. What's so wild about the just the little short history lesson that you took us all down with that is the how there could be anybody on the other side that gets angry at somebody who's choosing. Yeah. Just questioning it. That's just like how dare you. >> Hey, I don't know if I want to take this examples. Hey, I think I'm going to roll the dice and try and go natural like >> to to to to shame them or to call like at all. even if they're wrong. Even if even if they're they're wrong on it, you you have the right to be skeptical or unsure about something. >> I remember my original stance. I was talking to my friend and it was really just I was trying to be like, you know, just logical about it. Like if you have full autonomy in terms of not being able to sue, I was like, I don't think that's good. I don't want to subscribe. I don't want to try. I don't want to go through that experiment process because I'm going to wait to see, you know, like uh the reports that come in and like the injuries that inevitably with that many millions of people, you're going to have injuries regardless. Like you can't >> you can't claim you're not going to have any injuries. >> Yeah. >> So, it just it was totally illogical to me. >> Uh just from that stand alone, you're going to have the government protecting it. It's like, please. >> They did such a good job of fear-mongering the side that if you didn't, you were killing people. >> Not only fear-mongering, but coercing you out of it. >> Oh, yeah. >> You lose your job. >> You You can't do this. You can't do that. >> It's so deceptive to say that you have it. You You probably have it, but it's uh what do they call it? Like it's like >> asymptomatic. Asymptomatic. That was the most deceptive marketing I've ever seen. Ever. Yeah. Like you probably have it though. >> Did I tell you guys you guys want to hear a funny story? Now in hindsight it's even funnier. But at the time I was like ah. So during in the middle of kind of co like you know during that whole time or whatever >> Jessica and I went to the truckucky house and met up with some of her friends that she uh knew from Cirto sole. So some old friends. So we had like three families meet us up there and us. And this was kind of when CO was kind of going on. Now all of them were on this side like the way over here side of that whole thing was like you better get vaccinated. Yeah. You better not like don't talk to grandma. Yeah. Like that side, right? >> Obviously Jessica and I are much more over here on this side. But you guys remember my stance. My stance was not never. My stance was I'm going to wait. I'm going to wait for >> all of us. You were you were actually contemplating at one point. >> Yeah. I was going to my my whole thing was look, I'm healthy. I'm just going to wait to see what happens. I was so glad I did. Right. >> We were never anti. It was just like whoa. Let's let's see how this >> So anyways, so we get to the house. I'll never forget we get to the house. Everybody does their due diligence or whatever. Everybody's hanging out and the conversation cuz remember this was like during co, right? Conversation starts to come up about the whole thing and they all immediately are like whoa, they're way over here on this side and and you know Jessica and I, we have our opinions. I'm opinionated. Jessica's even more so. So she just starts, you know, sharing like, "No, we're not going to do it. We're not doing it. We don't believe in it. We think we're healthy." Whatever. She's talking about all this stuff, right? Anyway, later that night I started feeling sick and I had CO. [laughter] They all left the next morning. >> You know, they were driving home going, "I knew it." >> Those two bragging about their non vaccine. Of >> course he has Cor. [laughter] >> It's going to be a long winter. >> So, you know, they felt so like justified. >> Do you know what's crazy? You know, how many years ago is that now? >> Six. >> Yeah. Six years ago. >> Six. >> Yeah. >> Isn't that wild? 2020 just >> 6 years ago. >> Those are the fastest years I think we've lived. >> It also feels like it was it feels like it was way longer than that ago. But it also feels like >> Oh, it feels like it was way sooner to me. It feels like it was just I feel like I mean even the fact that you just said right now is it okay to talk about 6 years ago, bro. I know. >> This is a long time ago, you know? It's already been a long time and like we're way past it and like everybody knows it was a bunch of [ __ ] >> Yeah. [laughter] Like of course we could talk about it was 6 years ago. That's wild that it was that that long ago. But it man it it it lingered for like two full years. Like it was the I mean it dominated our the the conversations everywhere you went. It was >> it was in my opinion the best example in modern history of mass uh paranoia and just the power >> of media. And what we did is we stoking we put don't get sick. This is what we did. >> We created this this uh this thing which was no infections ever and we made it our god and we sacrificed everything towards this god of never getting sick. So >> oh you you should just be in your house by yourself all the time. What about my friends? What about my family? No infection that gets you more sick. No infection. Yeah. Turns out when you sacrifice everything the wrong direction. >> Relationships and sunlight are like two of the biggest keys to health. than we were told. >> Do you remember people getting arrested at the beach? >> Yes. >> Surfing away from everybody >> in the ocean by wait for them to come in. They arrested them. >> Hey, let's get close. Ridiculous thing I've ever seen. >> Oh, the whole thing was >> I know. >> The whole thing was crazy. >> Or the restaurants where you [laughter] >> mask on and then you walk in and then you're like, "Okay, is it right? Is it right?" Now, [laughter] >> now it's now it's free. >> The stove only hovered at at at 5t. But when you were at 3 ft >> with a plastic separator that's just it's just one sheet at the, you know, at the grocery store. >> Yeah. We can't get this spit on you from here. >> Did you ever see the videos of the kids in band? They had kids in band and they had masks with a hole in it so they put their mouth on their instrument. >> Yeah. >> You ever seen that? >> I did. >> Ridiculous. [laughter] >> These zip up like uh plastic containers they were in in playing. I've seen that. What age group do you think uh when you think back to like uh COVID, the 9/11s, the riots, this so much stuff that's happened in the last, you know, 20 years or like that or less? What what age do you think would be like the worst age to have like been through because of what your your lens that you see the world through? Like [snorts] I feel like one of the one of the benefits that even we can have a conversation like this and we were having a conversation this when it was going on was that when you're old enough and you've been around and you've seen enough things like you can draw back to like oh well trust me there's like I mean even I remember talking to you guys when the when how crazy a lot of like the the riots were and stuff like that. It's like dude we've had >> crazier rioting time but it felt but if you were young >> LA riots back in the day >> oh dude way yeah way way way crazier times. Uh and so but I mean because of social media because of this time and everything like that like you can it feels like >> that's the difference it I think before um we didn't have a lot of media coverage and like constant media coverage and every day in your face stuff that like >> I think you're able to kind of put it off live your life come back to like the shock of like oh my god this is happening this event you know uh but it wasn't like you every day were just like being inundated with it. >> No no 100%. I think uh I I kids who grew up around my two older kids who were in really impressionable during co they suffered a lot during that period of time and older people suffered a lot cuz older people when you look at the data on you know grandma grandpa >> imagine that being your last years of your life and not being able to see your family >> it's even if it's not that that you're an older person's health declines dramatically when they're lonely fact. >> Yep. >> And I saw this with my grandparents my grandpar and it wasn't like we stayed away from my grandparents for a year. I think it was like 4 months because of all the fear and stuff and so we would drop off groceries. We >> and you in a four month period they aged so much because they were just by themselves >> like the damage we did was just unbelievable. I know. Crazy. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Hey, how was your uh uh weekend? You took the boys to the uh Laguna Secika. Yeah. >> Yeah, we went to Laguna Secika. Ethan is like a super fan now of like motorsports in general and but yeah, he's really into these like exotic cars and like um >> I [clears throat] was trying to remember the name of this type of engine of this car like he just was fascinated by it. It's got like this [snorts] uh I don't know if it's almost like a a triangular kind of turbine where it like because of that it creates this compression of its own. >> Is that rotary? >> Yeah, rotary. >> Oh, good job. >> Doesn't Mazda have rotary? Maza RX7 is the >> It was a rotary engine and I had never heard of it before but he was explaining it to me. Uh it has the coolest sound like it was very cool to see. But yeah, we saw a lot of sick cars and what was great about it was like how open it was. Like it wasn't like you know they had their own little pit that like you know you had no access to or anything. everybody like because it's kind of like hobbyists and it's people that like own a lot of these cars and then they get to drive it on the track and it was a very like kind of relaxed environment. So, we're going up there, they're starting it up, they're telling us all about it, we're walking, it was sick. >> Did you not Did you know up until that point like how much your boy was into it until like >> Oh, that's kind of cool. >> No, I didn't. Like I I kind like >> You're like, "Oh, shit." He like knows his stuff about >> Yeah. Like he obviously he you know in his own time has watched a lot of YouTube videos. He's reads a lot about all the uh you know specs and like yeah he he geeks out a lot on all these like different types of like really fast cars. I'm like cool like I dig it you know. >> I love that. >> You were up at uh >> Oh every day I was up there. Um >> what's it called? >> Uh that's Monterey Car Week. >> That's right. >> Yeah. Yeah. So and there's stuff going on all dude. I heard um uh the coolest breakdown of uh what it's like uh to be like an F1 driver as far as like what kind of athletes are they? >> Um first of all, you know, that there's only like 20some in in the world to make it to that and and he he breaks it down. It was really cool. I I listen I'm obviously listen to all this stuff and pay attention and go down the rabbit holes and I've heard stuff talked about this before like just what great crazy athletes they are, but I've never heard somebody break it down like this. And he he starts it off by talking about like how unaware we all are because every other sport like you can go pick up a basketball and play and shoot outside. >> Oh, we just have no idea. >> Exactly. And and and so and so you can watch a pro alete and like be like wow. You can feel like cuz you know >> you know what you can't do. >> Exactly. He goes but you are completely unaware. You think cuz you get in a car and drive a car. It's nothing like >> those things. >> Yeah. He [laughter] it's nothing like that. And so he's like the the le he goes they are super athletes. >> He goes their strength, their endurance, their their I like there's they're like >> they're like fighter pilots. >> Yes. >> On on that extreme level. So he starts telling this story. So he so here's an he's an amateur driver and he got this opportunity to uh to drive like a real F1 car. And before he even gets in it, he goes like they have to do all this testing with him to see if he's even capable to do his stuff. And so he goes he's he's sitting in there at one point and he's like and then they tell they tell me to uh break to to press on the brake and the guy sitting there with the computer locked up to it and he's like hard you know he's telling him harder and he goes I and he's describing like I am stepping on this brake with every ounce of as I and he goes he goes okay that'll do and he's like what do you mean that'll do and he spins the computer around and he shows him that he's like at 82 lbs of of pressure or whatever like that >> and he goes um well yeah he goes you know to give you the Average F1 driver averages 120. Yeah. >> Right. Average throughout the race. >> Average for the race. And he goes he goes I was pressing with everything I had just to register at 82. He gives an he gives an example of a a normal F1 track. He goes >> they'll do uh 17 breaking turns in a single lap and they'll do 50 something laps of that. So do the math man >> on on while also >> alone. Yeah. managing the G forces, turning change like and he's like that like just because it blew my mind. >> I had a I the first time I realized how crazy it was was I watched a video from inside the cockpit of a drag of a drag racer >> and then I then from there I watched inside the cockpit of a rally racer of a formula. >> I don't even know how they know what's happening. >> You ever seen a drag? It's >> predictive. You're turning this. There's no turns in drag racing. You ever seen what they do with their hands and what that thing looks like? >> I know. Just to keep it in the lane is insane cuz it pulls you so hard. >> Yeah. You watch it like how would you even rally racing? How does he know what's h like every turn is going to >> Oh, those ones where they have the passenger like navigating for him like freak me out cuz [laughter] they don't even know what's around the >> Well, he was talking about too like so with Formula 1 the G forces and the speeds they're going. He goes, for example, he goes, uh, they show a video of him getting like out of the out of the car from doing so only so many laps and he takes his helmet off and he looks like he was just in a 20 round fight. I [laughter] mean, just drenched in sweat. Look, like you could see him, he can't get out. Like he's so exhausted he can't get out. You have to wait before they pull him out. >> He's like, when you're taking a a turn, he goes, "Imagine you you you're going around turn." And he goes, "The the the G-forces that are pushing on your neck is like you trying. It's like you with your neck turned with like seven watermelons on it and having to like maintain that." He goes, "Just the weight of that." He goes, "It's unbelievable the amount." He goes, "I couldn't >> just like you experienced in the jet, like you can't lift your leg off the ground cuz the the G-forces." He goes crazy. >> So when you're when you're doing that, he goes, "There's so much of that geforce. Your leg is pressed against the the the the side of the the" and he goes, "You can't even pull it Dude, I got a question, Adam. Uh, do they Did you get a chance to ask them about diet and nutrition? And the reason why I ask you is because how long are those races? How long are they in the car for? >> Oh, they can be in there for hours, too. >> So, nutrition has got to play a role uh in all of that. And I wonder if if any of them use like ketone supplements. Like I could see something like Ketone IQ >> for sharpness too, >> for mental sharpness, for energy. Uh, and >> you know, I bet you're right. I bet there is uh >> cuz if you you could bonk first off driving like that you're going to bonk like if you're running or like in an >> well you know I bet they probably use very similar remember what Zack Zack Bidder came on and he talked how he would he runs he's fat adaptive but then he runs on carbohydrates >> add some in the end >> I would I would I wonder if that's a common thing if they if they try and become fat adaptive and then they run on carbs for that for that what are you looking up Doug >> yeah Doug look a Formula 1 driver diet I'd like to see what that >> I just wanted some facts I was uh the routinely experience between 5 to 6.5 G's during extreme braking which is extremely a lot of G's >> that's like straight fighter jet fighter jet >> and then uh they're 90 to two minutes to 2 hours imagine experiencing that many G's >> 15 20 times in a in a single in a single lap for hours at a at a time while navigating around other cars while taking turns where you have about a a half an inch to less >> between the tire and the >> Yeah, they they're this close to the wall. It's wild. >> And they have to for that line. >> Yeah. He He's like, "We we do a terrible job of" And he goes, "And then the the people that that uh spec or that they that um commentate it, >> he goes, "Our other F1 drivers, so when they talk, they talk like it's no big deal, >> but to the but the average people have no idea the the feeling and the complexity of the stuff that they're that they're conversing about." and he did such a good breakdown of explaining that relative to all other sport examples that you can with everything else you can kind of get out there and kind of do and go wow I can get behind a wakeboarding boat and I can ride for a little bit and go and then see the pros and go like whoa you just have no idea but that you're just there's there's nothing like it that you can you can you can draw an example to >> I saw you guys drink you you guys are doing the keon IQ before podcast now >> yeah I love doing that yeah >> it makes a difference >> oh yeah I could feel the difference and I could just feel too it's just another way that I can get that memory recall and it's just like sh >> it's it's my post caffeine drink. >> Yes. >> To keep me going through the rest of the day. And so what I notic >> it's not the same. You don't get a stim. It's not a stimulant. No. >> Someone listening. It's not a stimulant. You just feel sharper. >> So for someone that would use it, this is how I like to use it for what we do and how I would do this even if I had like a regular eight hour job. uh is and if you are a coffee and a caffeine drinker early is you always tend to have this you know after your coffee is worn off two or three hours later this kind of where you where you come down and it's probably somewhere between noon and 3 for the average person and then most people have still a few more hours where and so that's right where I take the ketone IQ and so for me it like it's then the rest of the podcasting day or whatever kind of work that we're doing whether we're shooting or doing other stuff. >> Um, it it keeps that that mental sharpness >> without the weird energy up and down crashing that I get from caffeine. It's to me it's the perfect and I know they make ones with caffeine. So, if you like to if you like both, but that's how I use it. I like the non-caffeine ones like drag my caffeine. >> Yeah. After Exactly. Me, too. I like to have my caffeine drinks >> and then when that's when I'm done with that cuz I shut that down so pretty early because I can't do past noon or it'll mess up my sleep. Then when that wears off two or three hours later or whatever, then I have the ketone IQ and then that's like keeps me for the rest of the day. >> Uh you know what's going getting kind of shared all over right now is this new study on red light and how it affects the body. >> Really? >> Yeah. So I know I mean I know you know we're not supposed to talk about our partner JW right now. It's it's not scheduled but I just I have to talk about this because it's flying every everywhere and uh it's actually one of the craziest things I've ever seen. >> Huh. >> So they compared I'm gonna read this to you. So they compared red light therapy to a group without red light. Both of them similar diet. Both of them Mediterranean diet. >> Do you know what they found between the two? The difference. >> Mhm. >> Uh the group that used the red light, everything else was the same. The group that used the red light lost more fat. [laughter] >> Oh, mitochondrial health. >> I mean, yeah, but it's actually their By the way, the >> efficiency, >> by the way, their lipids improved better than the other group. Uh inflammatory markers better than the other group. Check this out. So waist circumference in in particular, >> the group that uh the the group without red light therapy lost six centimeters around their waist. You want to know how much the group with red light therapy lost? >> 15. >> Whoa. >> More than double from red light. >> So wait. Okay. Would you how would you explain how would you explain to a 5-year-old >> what mitochondrial health is? >> Oh god. For to a 5-year-old? >> Yeah. Yeah. like it's the brain of the a cell and so like >> it's the engine or the engine. Okay, so so there you go. So that's how you say so basically >> all of your cells have an engine that help them function. The sooner the engines, the better the cell, >> the better cell function. >> So there you go. So, so of of course, duh, that if you if all your cells are used to running on a, you know, V6 and now you've supercharged it or built it to a V8 or V12, like it's just going to per you're you're going to perform better on all on all aspects. I would imagine uh strength performance would be better, endurance would be better, stamina would be better. Well, there's other fat loss would be better. >> There's other things that shows it builds muscle, too, >> right? This is the wildest It's the wildest thing cuz you're sitting in front of light. >> Yeah, >> that's it. You're literally just sitting in front of light. >> Do this on a regular basis. You lose more muscle. >> I want a bed. >> You know, at the gym I go to, they just opened a recovery room and they have these they look like saunas, but they're not. And they're just red light. So, you sit in there and you're surrounded by red light. >> Yeah. I want to I want to I want to lay in a bed of them. So either that or like the whole shower thing I've always talked about where I've like turned my whole kind of shower area into it cuz I'm in there twice a day so I could just blast it like that. That's I want to find a way to do it like that uh would be ideal cuz all the benefits of that dude. >> I saw something uh that sciences just came out with that uh it was like a hydrogel like a skin >> that actually is a healing uh so you you put it on wounds and it's apparently it heals 90% more effectively. >> Wow. which is pretty wild. >> So if you have like skin missing or a burn. Yeah. >> You just put it on. >> You put it on and and the hydrogel like acts as just like this cooling like a healing agent. >> Oh wow. >> Is it a new technology? >> Yeah. >> Let me Yeah. I want to see what Doug pulls up here. Well, another guy like commercial stuff. >> Look up the scientific breakthrough. >> Yeah. Uh moisture rich environment. Uh >> yeah. >> Uh let me see if I get Yeah. Scientific breakthrough. Hydrogel >> itself. You can do hydrogel research on burns. Let's try that. I bet we'll find something like that [clears throat] >> and [snorts] see what that looks like. Uh, >> you know, if this hosting and podcasting doesn't work, I think you could totally do the Google Googling. >> I'll be the I'll be [laughter] the Google the Googler. >> I thought that was a Batman. >> Maybe that'll be the evolution. Maybe that'll be the evolution of like as as our young team comes up, you eventually get out of this. You just just >> I'll write on the screen when I get mad. It's like say this. [laughter] >> This is what you need to say. >> Yeah. Interesting. Oh, nanozymes. Okay. >> Okay. >> All right. All right, Justin. >> Yeah, I thought it was cool. >> Yeah, very interesting. >> That is interesting. >> I have some uh I had some thoughts on cold immersion therapy or like ice baths. >> Oh, you were mentioning that off off air. >> Yeah. So, here's >> you know. Have you seen Have you watched the uh bell curve of it? I guess >> the rise and fall. >> Yeah. Yeah. It's it was like this >> everybody do it. >> No, nobody was doing it's been around forever. So, it's like this, right? And then all of a sudden it was like this huge th this is the greatest thing ever. Companies are popping up everywhere. It's amazing amazing. And then now you have the this is terrible for building muscle. It's a waste of time. It's overrated. So and that's so it's like a bell curve. Yeah. >> No. So I so one thing I hate about fitness is or I should I say fitness media uh is that everything falls under the category of lose fat, build muscle. If it doesn't do that or god forbid it reduces some of that even though it may produce all these other benefits and even though if you understand exercise science there are ways to implement some of these tools to maximize other things who cares because this the study shows that it reduces uh hypertrophy. Okay, so here's the problem. So here's where this started. Uh studies were done on people who strength train and then who did cold water immersion versus those that didn't. Here's what the study showed. People who did cold water immersion post-workout built less muscle. >> Okay, this is true. One of the reasons why this this this happens is it reduces the inflammatory pathways and kind of the this cell signaling >> that tells the body to build muscle. So part of the the the inflammation you get afterwards, >> that's telling your body to repair and build muscle. So when you blunt that, you're probably going to build less muscle. But I was working out today and I was thinking to myself, what about strength? What about strength? Now, muscle size contributes to strength, but a lot of strength is has to do with your central nervous system and just how your your strength organizes itself and how well you fire in order to lift something. Does it have a negative effect on strength? So, I looked up some studies >> and the effect on strength is far smaller than the one on hypertrophy. And just to be clear, the effect on hypertrophy is also small. So, it's not a huge effect by the way on hypertrophy. It's small. the [snorts] effect on strength is either smaller to none. So what that means is using cold water therapy might make you build imperceptible to you but if we did a study we might see less muscle but it probably doesn't negatively affect uh strength or it doesn't affect strength. So I'm thinking to myself >> this is this is a uh this could be a valuable tool for athletes >> because uh one of the things you have to balance when you're an athlete >> so much volume repetition you got to get through. >> Yeah. Like a lot of like when you go lift weights to build muscle, you stimulate, you leave. >> Mhm. >> But when you're an athlete, a lot of your practice is getting good at your your skills. >> Yeah. >> Getting good at the technique, getting good at how to hit, how to catch, how to run, how to jump, how to twist, >> you know, even if you're a strength athlete, how to do a power clean, how to do a squat, how to do a deadlift, a bench press. A lot of that is the skill of the lift. And what prevents you from constantly practicing that skill is that you can't you overtrain. your body can't heal, >> right? You know, recovery. >> You can't do football practice 12 hours a day because you would just die. So, what's limiting you is the ability to adapt or recover. >> So, your theory with that then is that you get to maintain all those like points of practice and so you're actually able to kind of keep skill training but not necessarily, you know, increase the size of your muscles. more. >> You know that you know that [clears throat] this theory that you're talking about right now is not original by any means. >> Well, they've been using it for a long time. [laughter] >> This is this is why during this whole bell curve, proathletes have never skipped a beat on how they use >> they don't listen to any of these >> cryotherapy, ice pass, and ice >> has never has always been consistent and they still you you can watch an NBA game and never once have we broken stride with a player coming off the court to sit down and instantly they're putting ice on his knees right away. And it's because they don't give a [ __ ] if it uh helps with his his bench press or his leg press or squat or they don't care if it adds their muscle. It's like he's got to perform body. Yeah, exactly. They're preserving the body. They got to perform. They got to perform at a high level and they do it multiple times sometimes in a day. >> It's not just that. When you look at the studies that are looking at ice therapy versus non- ice therapy, what they didn't do is increase the volume on the ice therapy group because they can handle more volume. >> Okay? So, if I take two groups and I'm comparing them and I do ice therapy or cold water immersion, I can now add more training stress. >> There's your there's your original theory or great point is that you could you're making the case that >> it's not Well, this is kind of like how we talk about the studies that are around uh volume and stuff. Yes. >> Is that like they they they they >> they say if the volume is the same, but the truth is if you split up your workouts, you're doing more volume because you're stronger. Exactly. Less fatigue. >> And so and so like in a in a in a in a in the real world, the study isn't the isn't a great one to use because it doesn't really apply because you're going to get way more reps in and way more practice in in which better at that skill. >> So let's just say I'm just going to use strength sport. Let's say you want to get PR in your deadlift. >> And right now when you train with your deadlifts twice a week is about as much as you could do. Maybe a heavy day and a light day. Okay? And that's about as much as you can do. And you do auxiliary work. But you find if you do more more than that, you tend to break down and get hurt and you just kind of overtrain. Well, what if cold water immersion allows you to deadlift three days a week? You get a smaller build muscle signal, but now I can deadlift. >> I know this is anecdotal, but I will tell you from experience. Um, when I was competing, I was doing all the things. Recovery, cryotherapy, I was getting massages every other night or every night from Katrina. uh the amount that I could put put towards my squats and deadlifts. I'm that's exactly what I am now. Two times a week, one time being intense is about all my body can handle because I'm I'm constantly in this kind of recovery state, but I'm not doing any of those things. I'm not doing all the things to facilitate that. So, I absolutely am not cannot handle nowhere near the volume that I was doing. And of course, those were my peak strength times. question is, why would you want to increase your volume? So you could practice more, >> so I could practice the lifts more, so I could practice my sport more. >> So if you just want to build muscle, okay, then you don't uh you don't necessarily need it. Uh there's maybe some additional value in other areas, maybe use it separately from your workouts or whatever, fine, >> right? >> But if you can gain value from practicing your lifts or your skills more often, which pretty much everybody would gain would gain value from that. Cold water immersion would allow you to do those things. So now instead of squatting twice a week, if I want to get a PR, I can squat three days a week and because why? Because I do cold water immersion. Oh, but you're building less muscle. Yeah, but I'm squatting an extra day a week. I think that pretty much negates the fact >> that I'm losing. >> I'll I'll add to this theory. Um, and it was Dr. Brink who got me to do this first, and I don't know if any of you guys have experimented with this. So you go before >> before >> you do cryotherapy or do an ice bath preworkout. >> Yeah, that's crazy. >> Those are some of some of the best workouts I've ever had. >> I mean that like so everybody traditionally >> more focused you are the more Yeah. you can recruit, >> dude. Traditionally everybody is uses them as a postworkout thing uh to bring down inflammation and everything like that. But or you might see some people that use it first thing in the morning when they wake up to try and start their day with that which I think is incredibly beneficial. Um because I've done that. >> Um but try using it, you know, 10 15 minutes before you go into a workout and watch your workout. >> Fatigue in the workout way. >> But I'll tell you, I'll give you an example, right? So, uh you know, cuz I I've been doing jiu-jitsu here and there. Um and it's totally different from lifting weights or whatever. And the truth is, if I want to get good at jiu-jitsu faster, the best thing I could do is do more jiu-jitsu. >> But the limiting factor is my body, I can't do it every single day because it hurts and my body breaks down and I need rest, right? But if I do cold water immersion afterwards, I can do more than I would be able to had I not done cold water immersion. Therefore, my jiu-jitsu skills will improve that much faster. >> And so, I don't think we should throw out cold water immersion as this tool. I just think we got to use it in the right way. Used in the right way, cold water immersion could be remarkable. If I was training an athlete, here's the deal. Every coach knows this. The more you can train your athletes, the more they can practice, the better they'll get faster. But you have to balance it with recovery. >> You're always balancing with recovery. And so, it's like, okay, I got to I got to give my my kids or my athletes or whatever more rest because we're just pushing it too hard. But >> what if I can increase the volume that they can handle through a simple thing like here jump in this cold bucket full of ice and water after our workout. Now we can do addition matters. >> Well, there's there's also the other thing that these studies aren't measuring either that we talk a lot about uh is the behavioral benefits of these things too. The mental benefits of this >> the mental benefits of committing to something that is hard. By the way, I don't care how many days in a row you do it. It's hard every time. >> Nobody wants every time. every time I was doing the bandwagon of trying to [ __ ] on it. >> I went on a streak for a really long time of being super consistent with it. And I tell you what, not one day got easier like to get in like once I got in the breathing technique got easier. Like I learned how to calm my which is also also really beneficial for you. Okay. To learn how to calm your central nervous system down like that, focus on your breathing while under stress >> while under right. So super beneficial too. Uh that got better, but it was hard to get in every single time. And there's there's got to be uh some benefits to consistently doing hard things that you don't want to do that have carryover to other >> aspect. It just annoys me because the >> Yeah. Because we teach >> fat loss or millie muscle. >> Yeah. And I said, "Well, how are you using it? What are you using it for? Um don't throw it out. Uh because there's some value for a lot of people listening right now. If you're one of those people that is trying to get better at something and you're limited by your recovery, this could allow you to train more and to practice more often, thus making you better faster. And so, I think it's this really cheap, cool tool that people should still use in the right context. >> Yeah. >> What is Dose for Your Liver? Look, dose for your liver is clinically backed liver health supplement. It's not just another capsule or powder. It's a liquid supplement. You take it daily, 2 ounces at a time. It tastes like freshsqueezed orange juice. Now, it cleanses the liver of unwanted stressors that are slowing your liver down. It promotes daily liver function so your liver can do its job. So, no sugar, no junk, no calories. Now, what does the liver even do? It's your body's filter. It processes everything you consume and it performs 500 plus daily functions. So, you want to think energy production, digestion, fat metabolism, vitamin storage. The liver helps make these processes happen every single day. And when it's overworked, you feel it. You feel sluggish. You don't have any good energy. Your skin doesn't look as good. Well, do liver supplement has been shown in some clinical trials to reduce liver enzymes. This stuff actually works. Give it a shot. Go to doseaily.co/mindpump. Use codepump35 and get 35% off your first month's subscription. Back to the show. >> Our first caller is Chris from Connecticut. >> What's up, Chris? >> How you doing, Chris? Hey, what's happening? >> Hey guys, what's going on? >> What's going on, man? >> Good, man. How can we help you? >> Oh, so uh let me just get right into it and uh I'll read my email. A little nervous. Can't believe I'm actually seeing you guys. I listen every day. [laughter] It's kind of crazy. >> Welcome to the party. >> Oh man, this is awesome. All right, so um 53 years old, married, father of two daughters, 21 and 19. I was an athlete growing up, played multiple sports, hockey until I was 26. Once I got married, had kids, stopped training, spent the next 15 years heavily involved coaching both my daughters uh through softball. My oldest played division 3. My youngest right now is playing division 1. um before realizing that my oldest uh bodybuilding was her passion. So, she left school, came home and started training and participating in uh shows where she actually placed in a in a couple of the shows. Now, my younger daughter is still playing in division one softball, so I don't regret any of the the time that I spent with them and doing that, but I did stop taking care of myself during that process. Um so, since then, I've kind of been on a roller coaster. I did a medical weight loss diet in 2007 which got me down to like 40 lbs but it came back. Then around 2010 2011 um I started caring for my dad who was dying from cancer and I was dealing with a really difficult boss which put me under tremendous stress. Um I dropped to 140 lbs. People thought I was sick. Um and then that weight came back too. Once life got more comfortable I put that weight back on. 2015 I got back up to probably close to 200 lb. So dealing with a bad back which I did from remodeling my house. Um an injury in 2000 which I tore my meniscus twice. So I had knee surgery [clears throat] twice for that. Um which took me again away from training. And then a couple years ago I thought I finally got it right. I worked with a trainer, dialed in my diet. After about 8 months I got down to my lowest body fat ever. I was about 15%. I got down to 167 pounds. I gained three l pounds of muscle. I lost 24 pounds of fat. Um, and then I developed bicep tendon. So, I tore my bicep tendon, ruptured it. I just had it repaired in May. So, since then, I've been off my diet, uh, barely training. I do legs probably four times a week. Um, and even that's like been sliding off. I walk about three miles a day, which is a pretty hilly route. So, I kind of get my heart rate up and a little bit of sweat when I'm doing that, but I feel myself just sliding back into my my old patterns. So, my wife's listened to you guys for years and she finally got on me and said, you know, you need to do this. So, um I said, "Yeah, I hear myself in your show almost every day. Every day I listen and I hear something that resonates with me in my life." So, um my question then is, you know, how do I get back on track after a setback like this? I'm 53 with back issue, knee issue, and now, you know, the torn bicep that's still healing right now. Um, instead of just ending up in another cycle, like I said, I keep going up and down for the last 15, 20 years. Um, I want to and I don't want to white knuckle it, right? I hear you guys saying that all the time. I feel like, you know, I I don't want to do that. Um, and just lose that fat and get in shape and then throws something else comes along and it throws me right back to where I was. So, I want to do something that I can sustain, give me a good approach, and maintain where I want to be. >> Yeah. Thanks for everything you guys do. You guys You guys are awesome. >> Chris, how how is uh how's your current like um work schedule right now? Because like building something uh with consistency, we want to make sure we keep in mind like what what work, sleep, all that stuff looks like right now. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, I work, you know, some days it's 8, some days it's 10, 12 hours. I work from home. I manage a team of about 10 people all over the world. Um, a technology company, somewhat sedary, but um, my company's huge on, you know, staying healthy. So, we all try to like get out in the afternoon, take a walk, step away from from the job, and do that thing. >> Good. Good. Yeah. I So, [clears throat] I I mean, the prescription or the what I should what I'll recommend is is pretty simple and easy. I think I I know exactly what would be a good idea for you. Obviously, we're going to start slow. The challenge is the cycling that you keep mentioning. [clears throat] >> And I'm going to just point to the root of that if that's okay. >> Yeah, absolutely. >> You're an athlete for 26 years. >> Yeah. >> Uh and so it's really hard to change that mentality. So what probably happens is you start working out, the athlete comes out and you get competitive and you just go too hard >> and then you get hurt and you set back and you got to rehab and get better and then oh, I'm feeling good again and then you go too hard again. >> And so we got we got to we got to train appropriately. We got to get out of that mindset. There's nothing wrong with the mindset of wanting to improve and and compete. Uh but you're in the 26-y old headsp space uh every time you get into it. >> Yeah. >> And you know, when you were 26, you were 26 and you had a background of of consistent activity and sports, whereas right now uh you're older, but also you don't have that consistent like I've been playing sports now for a while. you took a long time off uh to raise your daughters uh and get them, you know, to the places they are. So, uh what your workout's going to look like is is probably like a MAPS 15 performance. Uh it's got a it's got a good athletic component to it. It's not going to feel like a lot, but I think that'll be appropriate for you. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Uh and you're going to do that for a while. You're going to do that for a long time. When you start to feel really good and stable and strong, I love I I love for you going out and finding something recreationally that you can do with uh with other people that you enjoy, but do it for the fun of it and try to train with and and and do that with men your age. >> Okay. >> Okay. If you start going out and getting competitive and playing against the 20-year-olds, this is where you'll start to get uh you'll go a little too far. But you go with a bunch of 50s something year olds play pickle ball or something like that. I love that for a guy like you because there's that component of fun and that competitive component that I think is fine, but I do think you're going to need to be on like max 15 performance style workouts for a while before we do something like that. >> I one of my favorite parts about training athletes is um you know athletes have that competitive drive that I like. I just I just got to get you to reframe uh like what working out nutrition and how to use your competitiveness. In other words, don't compete in your workouts. Your workouts are designed to take care of your body. If you compete somewhere, compete in your consistency around nutrition. Compete with how many days you string together of good sleep. Compete on those types of things. So, use that competitive side to you of like discipline and like I can do this every day consist like but it's but take that away from the the workout. Like don't go in the workout going like I'm gonna see if I can get 10 more of these or I'm gonna throw, you know what I'm saying? Get get that out of that. I'm I'm here. When you go to work out, >> you know, and maybe you got to change the music you listen to or you just a mindset you come in with. But when you come in, it's more like I'm practicing these movements. I want to feel good through these movements. I should feel good when I walk out. It's not go crush it. like get get that get that athletic mindset out of your workout when you lift weights >> and and train to be more recuperative, which is a hard transition, but once that clicks, it's and then take the competitive side to the other [ __ ] to my diet, like being dialed on that and being consistent and competitive with how many days in a row can you eat perfect and like be so just switch that and if you can do that, you will really unlock uh this like great healthy balance of taking care of yourself. >> Yeah. Take down all those no pain no gain posters in your [laughter] garage and uh yeah, it's just a lot harder than a lot of people think. You know, it's you've been an athlete and um it's served you well. It's it's it's helped you on the field or it's you know, you've seen what it does for performance, >> right? Uh however, you know what's going to serve you going on forward here is to be able to really figure that out like how does this workout actually benefit uh my overall energy and the way that I feel. I should feel better. I should feel more energized after each workout and that's where I stop. And so the the real workout for you is to learn how to taper that off and stop >> and then wait save that for the next day then the next day then the next day. And it's it's something that I battle it all the time. So, I'm like, you know, I hear all these words and I'm I'm agreeing with them completely, but I I do know how hard that is and it's definitely gonna going to be so much better for you on the other side of that because you're going to feel good, but strong and also very much more capable to do a lot of these athletic moves that you, you know, did in the past. And Chris, I think, you know, after you follow Mass 15 performance and you finish it, I think it'd be a good idea to go, if you liked your trainer, sound like they did a good job. Be a good idea to work with a trainer once a week or so to kind of, you know, work with you for the next six months or so. I think that'd be a good idea. >> I don't know. I tore my bicep tendon with them. So, I don't know. [laughter] >> Well, let me ask you this. Were they pushing you? Were you >> super hard just like you said? Like, I didn't realize it until you just said that. So, I got locked into like, you know, they were like, "Hey, let's do this six weeks challenge." And I was probably the second [laughter] man. I was like the second workout in it. Yeah. Literally literally look at like I just told you like your workouts no longer like I don't like I know every we talk about PRs and you've been you've been working out and exercise for such a long time. I don't need you hitting PRs and squats every every couple month. Like just you go in you lift weights. You practice lifting weights. You got good muscle memory from somebody who's probably been lifting weights most of their life. Trust me, the muscle will come right back. If you put it into dieting, you're going to have the physique you want. You work on the the maps 15 that's going to work on the multi-directional movements and unilateral work. You'll start feeling great again. You'll feel really good. But >> that's the problem I'm worried about, right? Like my back and my knees. Like I don't want to mess that up. And like I know what I can get to. And like I said, when I was down that like a few months ago, I looked the best I've ever looked in my life and I felt the best I ever felt in my life. And then I just reversed it. I have this issue with food, right? It's like big joke in my house and like I'll go off the diet and stop tracking and then I just put 10 pounds back on, 15 pounds back on. So >> yeah, hit your protein targets, stick to whole natural foods, follow Maps 15 performance. >> And after you do that, I think Mass 15 Symmetry would be another good program for you. >> And that right there is going to give you a good five to six months. >> Okay. >> We I have you ever you have we have something cool that I think would he would do really good with, too. Uh, I don't know if you've ever heard us talk about our concier program, but you would be a great candidate for that. >> Just a check in. >> Just a once a month check-in. Um, >> that would be great because I need a I I feel like I need a coach. Like, I need that type of accountability. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I was able to do it for my daughters when I was training them and getting them locked in and and their teams, but for myself, if I don't have that, I will definitely start to >> I think I think you'd be a great You're a great candidate for that. Uh, so we're going to have somebody call you. uh they'll set that up with you and I think that's perfect for someone like you just to check in with you on a monthly basis. Make sure you got a plan, you execute the plan, they'll check in with you and they'll keep you paced right as far as >> alter it and modify it. >> Yeah. I don't want to hurt my back again like I deal with that. I don't my knee like I just want to make sure movements are right. That that's >> they'll also they'll also customize your workouts for you too. So like we're Yeah. We'll send over a program for you right now, but they're going to customize it to make it for you. And so that communication that you just let them know how things are going, how you feeling, they'll change, modify whatever they need to, and then uh I think you're you're going to crush, dude. We'll take care of you. >> Yeah. >> Cool. All right. That'll be awesome. >> Thanks, Chris. All right, Chris. >> Thanks, man. Thanks, guys. All right, brother. Great talking to you. [snorts] >> That that uh so I've said this before on the show, the some of the hardest clients I ever trained >> were ex-athletes. >> And it it wasn't because they couldn't move well. It wasn't because they couldn't build muscle because they can actually do that better than most clients. It was the mentality. It was like we would do an appropriate workout and they'd look at me like what are we doing? I'm wasting my time. >> Yeah. >> Because you're they're they know their mindset is set on when they were competing. It's like this this is a total mindset shift. It was very difficult. Once you get them to switch though, it's amazing. >> Yeah. I mean that that's why I brought up what I did cuz No, you're right. It's hard to take the athlete completely out. So, I just have to get them to be be identical. >> Yeah. Be be competitive somewhere else. Like I'm all cool. Like I love the competitive side. So, let me lean into that instead of like trying to take it away from you completely. Just stop being competitive with your workouts. >> Your workouts are recuperative. Your workouts are to take care of you. Your workouts are to bulletproof your joints. Your workouts are like that. You walk out of this gym and I want you to feel energized. >> Therapy, your sanctuary. Yeah. Don't mess with Yeah. Yeah. Let's get competitive on all the other aspects. And so, let's go. And that will serve him way way more. >> Our next caller is Kyle from Delaware. >> Kyle, what's up, dude? >> What's up, Kyle? What up? >> How you guys doing? >> How you doing, man? >> Appreciate you having me on. Not too bad. Uh been been so surreal just just seeing this here. Been listening since I think it was like episode 50 or something like that. So you guys you guys really [laughter] been with us for a long time. >> Yeah. I think we need to do one of those uh Justin sevenweek uh shreds again. [laughter] >> Yeah. Let's get that going. >> Yeah. Let's go. >> Very cool. Well, I'll I'll kind of get into it. Um, the whole question is, uh, me and my wife, we're expecting our first, uh, baby here in January. >> Congratulations. >> Um, thank you so much. Um, I've had a little bit of a knee issue going on for about 2 years now and and the goal really is, you know, to be an active dad. Um, being able to run around and all the fun stuff, you know, that young dads get to do. Um, so that's kind of the pre of my new goal, I guess, to kind of figure all this out. Um, I'm 30 years old, sitting around 270 right now. Um, not sure what my body fat is at. Um, I I was I was training was using Anabolic. Uh, put on I mean, shout out Anabolic. I put on so much muscle from that program it's it's actually ridiculous. But I was I was doing like a charity alumni game for basketball for my school. [snorts] And after the game, it swelled up and um kind of has been like uh took about a week or so to go down. Um I went ahead and I didn't see a doctor for quite some time. Um just thought it was just normal swelling from after the game. Went ahead and um went back into the gym. Was able to kind of squat a little bit, but still had some pain. Took another couple days off. Ended up putting a um just a knee brace on it with some Icy Hot. was able to kind of push through it a little bit. Um kind of worked for a week, but then again had some more swelling, took some more time off. Um and then kind of really started falling off, just kind of discouraged. Seeing a physical therapist, he um he noticed that there was maybe some uh under quad development on that side. Um so I kind of worked with that. I tried, you know, doing some leg extensions just to isometric it out, but um I was just the leg was really shaky. I didn't have much connection to my quad anymore. Um, so still started working on that. I had a I got like a a pop on my hip, too. So, I figured maybe there's some uh hip mobility stuff going on, but started working on that, like the mobility side of things, and it got a little bit better, but it never like really went away. Fast forward some more months go by. Um, the knee swelling's not really that bad. It kind of went down, but then we're on a hike in in West Virginia and it swells up like terrible. And my fiance kind of convinced me then to go see a doctor. So, when we get back, I kind of get that scheduled. They do an X-ray, an MRI, take out like three uh tubes of fluid, and um she didn't notice anything with the MRI. She said she maybe had some old ACL, MCL injuries. Um but that was the cause. She noticed that there was a decent bit of arthritis, though. Um, my dad has had both his knees replaced from kind of the similar things. He used to work construction, so just being on his knees and using them a lot. So I, she didn't really have much for me. She said, "I'm 30. It's either she gave me a cortisone, I believe." Um, and she and that kind of helped, but again, never I couldn't still getting back to like jogging. Like it just was too much pain. I have little nieces and nephews. Couldn't really run around with them much. So, um, kind of just fast forward to today, it's it's still kind of there. Um, anytime I do like especially I noticed like I went golfing the other week or after I wrote in and it swelled up again on me and so I had to take a whole week off. Um, the whole process too, I'm kind of not as like say kind of ate like an [ __ ] and wasn't training as much as I should. Probably put on like I was maybe 220 210 at the time. Now I'm kind of like 260 270. So I'm sure the weight has something to do with it. But um yeah, just trying to get back to to kind of being able to jog around and and squat. I miss squatting. >> Yeah. Good. Good. Congratulations on the baby, by the way. >> I I appreciate it. >> So this is I'm glad you got imaging. Uh so it rules out any current injury. Uh it sounds like classic um movement pattern issue. >> Okay. >> So the knee joint uh can move in an optimal way. It can also move in a suboptimal way and depending on how bad your movement is and this could be due to imbalance of and weakness in the quad. It could be in the hip, it could be in the ankle, might be the quad because that's what the PT noticed. Uh but it could be also connected like I said to a couple other things. But depending on how bad your your your movement pattern is on for the joint of the knee, the more movement you do with it, the worse it's going to feel. So like the hiking made it feel bad, the basketball game made it feel bad, >> golf. >> Golf. And then you mentioned your your weight and if you gained a significant amount of weight if you're pre if you're pre you know pressurizing the hinges >> at 220 you can you've now amplified that dramatically at let's say 260 or 270. Okay. >> Right. >> The the recommendation is is uh pretty straightforward. And what your babies do when in January? >> January. Yeah. >> All right. So I'm going to give you two programs. I never do that but I like you because listen [laughter] >> map Symmetry is your program. [snorts] >> Okay. >> That's the program you need to follow. And I want you to skip the last phase. >> Okay? So, it's all unilateral. That's going to help quite a bit. Uh after you're done with that, I'm going to give you maps 15 uh performance uh or symmetry, one of the two. I'll see what Justin thinks because that'll be the program you do when you have your baby cuz you're going to be sleeping crap. You're going to be need to be there for your wife. And so, it's just far less volume. It's far more appropriate. >> And in the meantime, >> you know what we talk about when it comes to diet? Hit your protein. Stick to all natural foods. If you combine that together, you're gonna do great. >> Yeah, I I kind of implemented that a little bit just I think you had an episode on uh a couple weeks ago about just cutting that out. So, I caught that down five pounds in the four weeks, just kind of not touching much, just just kind of hitting it. And again, it's it used to be a lot of body body imaging that would like kind of drive my goals. And now it's it's not really that anymore. >> Yeah. Um, I did try CE I think Symmetry has like a um a pistol squat. I wasn't able to get Is there like modifications or something? >> There's modifications. >> Anything anything in there that doesn't feel right, don't do it. >> Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Just don't do it for now cuz you do have some stuff going on with your knee. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And I, you know, in the beginning of symmetry, which is great, too, because you'll get into these split stance positions and to really kind of reinforce the recruitment part of that and and try to, you know, gain that strength stability there, especially the quad and um, you know, in the hips. Um, you know, take your time. Like really, it's about like slowing down quite a bit and feeling your way through a lot of these things. Uh, so you can get that kind of security and it get it to track a lot better. get that knee hinged to really be like securing on that um uh fluid movement kind of pattern. >> You're actually you're actually a case where you would find me actually using a machine quite a bit. A leg press would do really a single leg leg press with you would be uh a good movement. So when you're >> single leg extension Yeah. So, uh, this isam I know we talk so much about free weights and how much free weights are better, but here's an example where you're currently at right now where, you know, single leg machine stuff is is okay until we start to one, lean out a little bit, get some stability and strength in there and support and balance out. Um, and then the other thing I I would caution you is like just caution you of like, you know, when you start feeling good, get a little bit of momentum. >> Don't get too hyped up. >> Yeah. Don't get all excited and go for a jog, okay? And go do that. just keep keep progressing uh and stick with the the programming because that's where we could go set yourself back is >> going out and doing something like that when we're not ready. Yeah. If we can really like install new movement patterns for you, you're going to you're going to thrive. You're going to get to a place where you haven't been before where you're actually going to be like really strong and your movement's going to be sick. So, without pain and that's what we want, right? So, so make sure you really take your time with this. >> Kyle, do you say what do you do for work? What do you are you on your feet? You sit? What do you What do [laughter] you got going? What do you do? >> Yeah. So, I used to I used to be doing lawn care and I was lawn care. I was uh used to work construction, so I used to be moving around a lot. Then I got an office job. >> Oh, wow. >> It's I sell fireplaces now, so I'm kind of uh just sitting around. I get to go on some job sites, but it's even with my wife, we just don't we both work on offices, so we've been trying to, you know, practice walking more. It's it's difficult. Um I think I was averaging like 2,000 steps for quite some time. So kind of making a more effort to at least hit 5,000 or you know >> that's a good target. Yeah. You like that? Yeah. >> Yeah. So I mean is is is like um a movement pattern is that something that can change cuz before this game like I mean I was squatting I had like 380 was able to put down. I'm talking painfree. Yeah. >> Felt powerful. Is that was I overcompensating in some area that Yeah. But here's what's what might have happened. Okay. because movement pattern issues can develop post injury. >> Mhm. >> Okay. >> So, something you did in that game aggravated your knee, >> diverted >> and and then after that now you're moving in a particular way. >> Well, also keep in mind this too. Uh you're when you're play when you're squatting you're moving in one plane and [clears throat] so you may be you could have been really strong in one plane incredibly weak laterally. I mean this example of me, this is why I kept getting hurt doing sports and [ __ ] Like I'm strong deadlifting and squatting all day long because I've been consistently doing that and getting so strong that way. But it asked me to cut in basketball and I blow my knees out right now too cuz I'm just I haven't been training my body that way. And you know, you're 30 now. You're not 18 anymore. You used to probably be able to squat a bunch of weight and then not play basketball for a while and get out there and play basketball no problem and be fine. But, you know, welcome to getting older and and only getting strong in one plane. This is what happens. And so, we got to take care of take care of yourself. >> And to that point, that's why I was bringing up the split stance. I'd be challenging you as a trainer, uh, you know, rotationally or laterally, uh, just to maintain position while you're, you know, adjusting to these forces cuz, you know, that might be part of the problem is just like, you know, you're not introducing these types of, uh, planes of motion your everyday life and then you're just going like zero to 100. So, you know, just give yourself a little slack with that. Like, that's something that, you know, we need to bring a little attention to. >> Have you seen the video where a great movement to get to, uh, would be like, have you ever seen the video Justin doing the lateral sled drag before? >> Uh, I I mean, I've watched everything. >> Yeah. If you go go on to Mind Pump TV and look up the lateral set sled drag that Justin does and I would get to a place where I start you with like no weight like literally super light just you're just walking the sled empty >> and then slowly progress that >> teach these movements back you know like think about the last time you've really like been intentional with that stuff. So you have to like really progress it just like you're progressing weights. >> Okay. Yeah. So, do I I think I have symmetry and and when I follow that, am I kind of chasing like pushing my knee into positions that I know it should be getting into even though it's painful or am I kind of like finding the areas it's not painful? How am I >> play within find the line? >> Yes. So, play within the boundaries off a little bit. Yeah. >> Okay. You challenge the boundaries a little bit, but don't go beyond them >> because it'll get better. Yeah. Progressively >> and then copy that form and that range of motion with your strong leg. Don't do better stuff with your strong leg or you're going to maintain an imbalance >> and you and you care more about form and stability of the movement than you do adding more weight to the exercise. So be cautious of that, right? So >> challenging the range and being and slow so slow it down, pause like do mess with it that way >> and challenge the in ranges like the guys are talking about. >> Totally. >> Don't get all excited and go oh 10 more pounds. Don't go that way. We don't need to do that as much. Like it's this is more a movement pattern thing. So, when it's movement pattern stuff, it's it's it's stability, range of motion. That's the stuff that we're trying to focus on. And so, don't get all giddy and just keep throwing more weight on cuz you feel good. Think slow it down. Slow the tempo down. If it gets easier for you, slow it down. Challenge the range a little bit further this week and a little bit further next week. Like, that's the the thought process. Mhm. >> So like with the leg extensions like when I get that shaky like one of my legs coming up it starts like >> so kind of chase chase that just slow that down and kind of slow it down. Yeah. Slow it down. Squeeze and pause. So get the top of that hold it there for a second. Come down. So you that that's what you want to do. >> And that shakiness will go away if you practice that. Yeah. It'll go away once it >> So like So you think it's it'll think like the arthritis like nothing to be >> So So here's the deal. There's arthritis there. They saw it. Can it get better with good movement? Yes. >> Can it get worse with bad movement? Yes. >> Just so you know, all arthritis is is is fluid that's that's being sent in that area because it's being aggravated. It's being aggravated because we have poor movement patterns. So that can totally So I had like berscitis, which is like arthritis in your hips, right? That's that which is just fluid that gets once I fixed all my hip mobility movements, I don't have it anymore. >> It doesn't happen anymore. So if we can fix that, you can totally >> So when they look on imaging, right? So arthritis looks like deterioration of a joint. Uh you don't have uh immunereated arthritis. Yours is related to movement pattern issues. Correct those. The arthritis heals. >> Okay. >> Cool. That's that's very helpful. >> Yeah. You got it, dude. >> You got it, man. >> Yeah. I appreciate it. >> Yeah. Thanks for calling in, man. Thanks for listening. So long. Yeah. Have a good day. Take it easy, brother. >> Take it easy. >> See you. >> That's awesome. Crazy. [laughter] 18 years old. Dude, >> was he 18 when he started? >> He was 18 when he started all the way to 30. A bunch of muscle off anabolic. >> Yeah, that's pretty cool, dude. That's great. That's wild. >> If he does what we say, he'll feel so much better. But when you don't when you don't fix uh and it's cool that he got imaging cuz the imaging show there's no major injury that's going on. You're just your knee is not moving great and it could be related to a few different things, but once we fix that, it's fine. You know, we we should really do an episode on like arthritis and burcitis and talk a lot about that because I feel like a lot this is what I can't say a doctor tells you that and then it makes it sound like oh I've caught this thing that my dad had my mom had now I got it now I can't do these things cuz I have I have arthritis or I have bcitis and it's just like dude you could totally address that. It's like it doesn't just stop right there >> and and the doctor when they say I've heard I've heard them tell me that when they tell you they tell you almost like you caught you caught this disease. you caught like a disease or something. It's like >> it's a permanent diagnosis. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. They did that with one of our coaching clients for uh osteopenia young girl >> and the doctor afterwards is like how did you get your osteopenia reversed? She's like I'm lifting weights and eating more. >> Yeah. Yeah. Like dude, we can reverse absolutely fix this. Man, >> bcitis is very different from arthritis. >> Well, they're both fluid that's sent over. >> No. So bcitis is inflammation of the bersa. >> Yeah. >> Arthritis is is the joint itself. Both cause fluid to come in, but they're both different. >> Very different. >> Well, I mean, obviously there's a different diagnosis of both of them, but both of them are causing fluid to get filled up. >> The fluid. Yeah. Yeah. I hear what you're saying. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Our next caller is Michael from Louisiana. >> Michael, how's it going? >> What's up, man? >> Hey guys, this is uh it's crazy to actually be here. I'm a little bit nervous. [laughter] >> How can we help you? >> All right, so I'll uh I'll get into my question uh my letter real quick. Um I'm 65 year old guy. got back into lifting seriously about three years ago after starting TRT and my strength games and body recmp have been great, but lately I have been having some chronic knee pain for my leg routine. Um, I injured my right knee in my 20s by pushing too much weight on a Nautilus leg press way back in the day. And since then, I've been very strict about form and never tried to push any crazy weights with on the squats. So, a few weeks ago, it was leg day and I was doing squats and I felt an uncomfortable torque in that knee and uh stupidly thought I could just keep going for another set thinking maybe I had just let my form drift a little bit and even though I wasn't pushing a lot of weight, it just wasn't going to happen. So, then I tried to switch to leg extensions, but that was way too painful and had to just bail on the whole workout immediately. And then later in the day when I got to work, I couldn't do the stairs at all. Uh so I had to use the elevator like like all those old people and that really irked me. Um so my question is if squats are no longer on the table for me, what other movements can I do to safely keep my legs trained to the same degree? Just a little bit of background. I'm um 6 feet tall, 200 lb, about 16 to 18% body fat. And uh prior to starting TRT and getting back in the gym, I was a very weak and skinny fat guy at 195 pounds. Uh I've used the BPC 157 and TB500 peptide stack in the past with some success with other injuries and uh did the same thing for this knee and uh after a few weeks uh it's really helped a lot. So uh just wanted to turn it over you guys and see what you would recommend. >> I'm trying to do the math right now quick in my head. muscle. I was like, "Damn, you putting some good muscle on, dude. >> That's like 15 to 20 pound." >> Yes, dude. That's super impressive. Good for you, bro. This is actually kind of easy, Michael. Uh, cuz a lot of there's a lot of leg exercises you could do, but I think the question you're asking is, hey, I want to be able to maintain >> uh the ability to squat. Uh, which is important because you could there's a lot of machines. You could do split stance exercises. They're all good. >> Pushing the sled is great. >> Pushing the sled would be a huge >> I think that's great. Uh but if you want to keep squatting and you want to reduce the risk uh of injury or or put differently make it quote unquote safer or reduce the skill component of the squat and still maintain kind of its its effects. A box squat is where you go. I don't know if you've ever done box squats, but a box squat is phenomenal. It stops that that you know at the bottom of the of the of the squat you got to change directions. >> That shift in momentum uh is uh higher risk of injury and requires more stability and strength. with a box, you slowly sit down, you wait for two seconds, then you stand back up, and it's uh a lot, you know, quote unquote safer uh than a traditional squat when it comes to injury. >> So, you're literally going down and just sitting on a >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So, what you do is you get >> stopping all momentum. >> Yeah. So, you get a bench. A bench works good. How low do you normally squat when you do a squat? >> Um as the grass, usually all >> Okay. So, you get a bench. Uh typical bench is probably a decent height. Uh, you put it behind you. You back up with the weight. You brace your core. You slowly squat until you sit on the bench. Actually sit. Don't hit the bench, by the way. That's how people hurt themselves on this block squat. You slowly sit. You wait on the bench for two seconds. Then you stand up. What you don't do is go up and down. Up and down like cuz that's the same thing as >> the other the other good cue or key is when you sit on the bench, don't relax your core. No. >> So don't rest. So don't sit and rest like you you're still tense and but you're sitt and you're but you're sitting. So your butt is actually on there >> but you're sitting you're still upright with the chest high and core activated and then you come back down >> stand up and that's that's a squat. It's still a squat. It just takes out part of the rep uh that requires the most uh stability and control. >> Okay. Yeah. I I normally do like a 4 day split and then one day uh for cardio. I've just uh worked in spin class. I had it this morning. I'm telling you, after 3 weeks of just laying completely off leg work and then just I think the peptides help, I guess. >> Uh, and I feel pretty much back to full >> good. Yeah. >> Mobility, but I'm just being really careful. I don't want to >> smart. That's actually the one thing that I I that's a little scary about BBC and TB is you you recover so much faster. >> False confidence. And I've and I've had a couple of times where I've kind of reheurt I hurt myself because I was like, "Man, I felt so good already and then went right back at it." So, just take it easy going back. >> Yeah, take it easy getting back into it. That's I'm glad you said that, Adam. Uh, but yeah, they they work really they work really well. But it it sounds like you might have strained your meniscus. The that's a very common >> uh kind of tweak, you know, where later on it feels a lot worse uh especially with squatting. Uh maybe a little torsion on the knee. Uh maybe your ankle mobility could use some work. So that that would be something else I would look at. Would look at ankle mobility because if your feet want to turn out but they're grounded, you got twisting on the knee and then that sometimes can cause uh meniscus uh issues. >> Yeah, I believe my my ankles are a little bit pronated. I had some um um pulled muscle in in my calf. Um >> Okay. >> Uh and did some X-rays and the uh orthoped >> told me I had like some pronated joint >> and that's [clears throat] that's what happened. >> That'll do it right there. Especially going across by the way. That'll that'll make a huge difference what Sal is saying by shortening up. So here here's a crazy classic example of where advice changes per client, right? So we're always coaching people range of motion, work on your depth, get deeper. >> You have a case like that. I know just by shortening your range up and not going all the way deep will yeah is way less risk and stress on your knees because of what you got going on. And that's a classic example that so his advice >> with the box squats, it'll completely take it out. what it would look like, Michael, cuz you would do the box squats. It's a shorter range of motion. The box stops the momentum, >> but you're like, "Hey, I want to train a really good full range of motion." Well, you can challenge it with lunges. >> Yeah. >> Uh lunges take that component out and you can do that full range of motion, still get everything working, you know, the way you want it. Uh but I think you're going to love I think once you start box squatting, you're like, "This is how I'm going to squat." >> Great. Okay. Yeah, I'll give it a try. And like I I just want to thank you guys again. hear my uh my virtual gym bros in my ear. [laughter] >> Well, you're kicking ass, dude. Yeah, you're doing great. Yeah, you're kicking ass. >> I usually head for the gym at about4 till 5 in the morning and put you guys on and hear your latest podcast on the way there. So, >> see the old Jack guys are always working out the morning. [laughter] That's when I go. >> Hey, we appreciate the support, man. You're doing great. >> Absolutely. And a big shout out to Doug and all the other guys behind the scenes. So, thank you. Appreciate it, man. >> Take care. Got it. >> Yeah. So, for people listening, when your when your ankles uh lack mobility, what happens when you squat >> is your feet want to twist. Your feet want to twist to create that somehow, >> but your your tennis shoes are grounded on the floor. So, as you're squatting, there's this twisting torsion and and and it's the meniscus that takes away. >> Well, you also have this, right? So, you have this uh naturally people naturally your knees want to start to to drop in, right? when the knees drop in the the femur internally rotates too like that contortion on the on the on the knee even more so >> yeah and boy especially after he said he goes a grass >> so astigrass that issue going on like for sure that's what's going on so box squat so classic example where you know our our advice could contradict it you hear us talking about doing that but it's like that's a classic example where you take that >> you know what's wild about what we're saying by the way is if you see Olympic lifters they get that knee coming in looking twist thing and they do phenomenally Well, you're dealing with incredible hip strength, mobility, and ankle mobility. >> And so it looks it looks worse than it is. Looks >> gnarly. Well, yeah. That's like practice it forever. >> That's like comparing You ever watched what a a pitcher's shoulder looks like? [laughter] You know, that would rip all the rest of our shoulders out of his socket. >> Good point. I've seen like where they take a freeze frame. >> It's all like, oh my god, bro. Contoring a ball 100 miles an hour. Yeah. Everybody else's arm would come out of their socket doing that. But yeah. No, it's great. Great to see though. Uh I was trying to do the math real quick. >> Well, if we round it up to 200, right? 200 lb at 25% body fat is uh >> that means you got 25 lbs of fat. >> Is that 50 pounds of fat? >> 50 pounds of fat. >> He cut down 10% of that. >> Yeah. >> So he's he went down. So yeah, it's like 15 What is that? 15 pounds of muscle. >> Yeah. >> Wow. >> And he went up 5 lbs on the scale, though. So he went up on the scale. >> Wow. That's That's >> So he put like 15 20 pounds of muscle on, >> dude. That's great. He had He's got 170 lbs of lean body mass now. Before, what was his body? >> 150 >> uh 25%. Let me let me figure this out. >> So, it was 45 lbus 198 or 195. >> What was it? >> Yeah. 146. Bro, he gained 25 lbs. >> 25. I knew it, bro. Like, I'm doing the math work. I'm like, that's a good 20 lb or so of muscle right there, dude. That's bad. >> That's life changing. [laughter] >> Yeah. >> Our next caller is Ryan from Indiana. >> Hey, what's up, man? >> Hey, Ryan. Hey, what's going on guys? >> How you doing? >> No, I'm doing well. Doing well. Thanks for uh thanks for taking my call. >> How can we help you? >> Yeah. No, so I wrote in a little while ago and I actually love how I wrote it, so I'll paraphrase it, but back long backstory. Um about 66 250 currently as of this morning. Uh for former college basketball player, uh was always kind of a hard gainer. Actually hated the weight room for the longest time and luckily I was could run and jump a little bit. Um but over time you know uh crept up and you know now getting you know middle ages 30 about 37 years old now and uh got five kids so busy guy and you know really focusing on strength and really fall in love with just training and getting stronger and all things. So all that being said um really focus probably facing a little bit of what you know I hear you guys talk about a lot of uh insulin resistance got some cholesterol numbers creeping up some blood sugar numbers creeping up. I know you guys aren't medical professionals so not looking for medical advice but looking for the best way of your from your experience to really target that right everything's like oh you lose 5 to 10% of your body weight and you know that can improve cholesterol that can improve improve in insulin resistance etc but also don't want to just do that aggressively in a non-sustainable way so really looking for what you guys think about uh from your experience at you know how to go about that you know maintaining a lot of the muscle that I've been able to build uh but really the best way to kind of get after that um from a training perspective. >> Give us a give us a little bit of uh I mean five kids, what's sleep look like? What's diet look like currently right now? What does uh your workouts and and daily activity look like? Like what's Yeah. Give me give me more about >> Yeah. Yeah. >> what we're working on. >> Okay. >> Yeah. So, uh I mean sleep is uh the youngest one right now is about 18 months old, but we have a sixth one on the way in October. So, sleep's going to be [laughter] >> God bless you, bro. Six kids. building. Are you building a football team over there? What are you building? Basketball team. Building a football team. >> You already got a starting [laughter] You already got five for basketball. >> Exactly. Exactly. So, yeah. So, sleep's going to be at a premium here in about uh 10 or 12 weeks, but uh right now it's it's pretty good. >> Um dietwise been, you know, trying to dial that in. Really try to get hit protein heavy. I don't do a lot of tracking. I try to aim or at least understand, you know, the protein I get towards. I mean, even trying to get 230, 240 grams of protein is it it's a lot. You know what I mean? That's a lot in a day. So, trying to really uh do that in a whole natural way, u trying to >> recently, you know, with some of the cholesterol stuff, focusing on some of the leaner cuts and whatnot, you know, trying to, you know, get after some of that. Um, activity-wise, I would say I'm close to 8,000 steps. I'm in a I'm in a healthcare executive role, so it's an office job, but we have a pretty big building that I roam around, but I just use my phone to track. And at the end of the day, it's, you know, 8,000. So, uh, with the kids in practices right now, I have a chance to just wander around when they're out the football fields and whatnot. So, that helps. Like last night, I hit like 13,000 steps because I just long hauled it while they're in practice. So, I have some opportunities to build some of those things in. Um, but yeah, so, and then training wise, uh, I would say I've done I've dabbled with a lot of the programs. I think I the one I got through most recently was anabolic and I would say I made pretty great strength uh improvements despite some of the other habits. Diet wasn't great. I wasn't really totally dialed in. Sleep was average. You know, I've uh recently tried to cut back on some of the uh what I call celebrating life, some of the cocktails and whatnot while you know. So, cut back on some of the fun stuff there. But um so I thought I made made strides despite some of those things within it. I started powerlift and then went on vacation and had like a complete week off and every once I got back I've just kind of um dabbled with more of like I would what I would think is like maps 15 type style couple lifts a day you know 25 to 30 minutes get some steps on the treadmill sauna and get out. I've kind of started to like that because I do like going every day. It's a a morning thing morning kind of ritual for me. >> I like that for you. >> I like that [clears throat] for you. Just so you know, I would I would have pushed you in that direction anyway. So, >> you're going to live you're going to live in maps 15 for a long time. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's your program until you slow down on the >> all the different versions. Yeah. [laughter] >> Until you shut the factory down. >> Yeah. Ryan, it's going to give you the best results. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Maps 15 protocol is going to build you the most muscle and strength. >> It'll trip you out. >> And we have a lot of MAPS 15 programs. Uh do you have any of them? Cuz I'd like to send you one. I have the original one. Um, I have that one. I I just like most people that call in, I played with it for a while and I was like, "Oh, this isn't enough, right? I put enough volume. I wanted to be in there longer." >> But as I've uh, you know, really going in and, you know, not going in and being like beat up from the day before and just being able to go in and, you know, push it, but not um, I really have started to really enjoy that. The other one that I I bought and I've been really intrigued about, but of course and uh you know I would say I'm not scared of it, but it's uh is symmetry. So, I didn't know if like I, you know, because I've done a lot of I like I like lifting heavy. Um, like that's why I like when I go in and I just try to, you know, put weight on it and push it. And so, like lower reps I've tended to like and that's why I think I try to go power lift, but then it's also like I hear you guys talk about the symmetry, the performance side of things. And so, I didn't know if um >> Well, do you have any aches? >> Something like that would work. >> Do you have any aches or pains? Um, well, right now my right elbow is a little messed up from like some golfing elbow type things, but other than that, not really. >> All right. Because I could I think all the Mass 15 programs are perfect for you. If you like lifting heavy, I like mass 15 powerlift. >> I know powerlift would be >> Yeah, I could send that to you. But you're going to live in a MAPS 15 protocol for a long time. And and again, I'm going to say this because I think sometimes people think it's like, okay, well, I got to do mass 15. I'm not going to get as good results, but that's because of my life. And this is what will give you the best results right now. None of our programs will perform better for you than the mass 15 protocol. You just got to be consistent. >> I I also like this for you like that protocol and then literally like just from what you've told me already, all I want you to do is to be consistent on the protein thing and then literally just kind of and and pull back on the the drinking like you said. So whatever it was that you were kind of letting yourself celebrate for, make that be even more infrequent. So, I don't know what that looks like in your lifime. >> I was just gonna ask, Ryan, when you did your labs and that your lipids came back and the blood sugar came back, was that before you made all the dietary changes? >> Um, that was I've been more aggressive about it. That was about three and a half about three and a half weeks ago now. >> Okay. >> Uh, that I did the labs and so that was when I started to really dial it in at that point. I had I had labs done in May and they were >> similar and >> Okay. >> I didn't really give it much. You mind if I dig a little deeper? Because there's probably some big some some areas that will make the biggest impact. So you don't have to make like a million and one changes. >> When you were drinking, how often was it just like a nightly every night you'd have a drink or two? >> Yeah. Yeah. Some of that and then weekends, you know, maybe few few more than a few. >> Okay. So the alcohol, taking alcohol out will make a huge uh difference uh in your blood sugar >> and insulin. It'll make a huge difference. So, if you can cut that out or dramatically reduce it, maybe save it uh for once a week, but also don't turn that into like I'm going to get hammered. Sometimes that happens like we don't drink all week and we're like I'm going to go six drinks now. >> So, the alcohol makes a big difference. And then uh before you started making these dietary changes, were you eating like eating like like out and fast food and processed food or what was it? >> No, no, actually I've been eating pretty well, I would say, for the most part. I mean, we we do a lot of whole natural foods. I mean, with the kids, you got to, you know, you mix a lot of, you know, they they like the pastas and some of the other stuff. And I try to stay, okay, >> you know, whole natural food myself. If I eat out, like it's like a Chipotle bowl, >> you know, double meat and all the stuff there. But, uh, for the most part, it was pretty good. I mean, I think there's probably some changes, but, you know, with the I think the other thing I noticed was, >> you know, if I did, you know, if I was cooking, had a few drinks, like I would eat above and beyond probably what was necessary and, you know, push it push it in that regard. I do a lot of, you know, Greek yogurts, you know, that's how I kind of end my night, you know, Greek yogurt and some berries, those types of things. >> Um, but yeah, so for the most part, not bad, but definitely can get tightened up. >> Honestly, the the focusing on the alcohol and hitting the protein consistent, that's it. I wouldn't even I would not over complicate the the diet yet like that. Wait and see what that does. that with the paired with 15 power. >> And then if you want to add supplements, uh high EPA fish oil, uh can have sometimes have some positive effects on on some of your numbers. >> Um and then what company is it, Doug, that you you you're using for cholesterol? Why why is it do is it dose? >> Dose. Yeah. Do >> Oh, dose. Yeah. >> Yeah. You could try Dose. Dose has uh some clinical trials that shows that it actually helps with lipids. Uh, and you combine that with the reduction in alcohol, the, you know, whole natural foods, hit your protein, mass 15, three, four months from now, I bet you'll come back, you'll see some big changes. >> Yeah. >> Awesome. Awesome. That's that's great to hear. Yeah. I like the idea of the powerlift because I start, like I said, I started on that pathway with just the regular program, the regular powerlift program. Uh, but this 15 style I'm starting to really embrace and like I'm glad you like. You're starting to embrace and like it because I wanted to push you there right away. But after you told me the kids lifestyle things, it's the perfect program for you. >> I'd love to hear your numbers after it for sure. >> Yeah, you're going to see you're going to see great results if you stick with it. >> And then let me ask you a question, right, if that's all right. >> Yeah. >> How do you manage so many kids and all that stuff? What's the secret? >> Great wife. >> Yeah, that's [laughter] 100% marry a saint. Yeah. No, it's uh it's busy. We're we're we're loving it. We're It's busy as can be. We're just The oldest is only nine, too. That's the crazy part. So, we have five that are nine and under, about to be six that are nine and under. Crazy. Just >> Good for you, man. That's got to be such a fulfilling life, but also so busy. >> We We are busy, but man, is it fun. And we homeschool them, so you know, we're a glutton for punishment there, too. >> Wow. You guys are doing a great job. >> Good for you, bro. >> How many boys and girls? What do you got? >> Uh, we got two boys and going on four girls. So, >> all right. We were boy, girl, boy, girl. And then the the last two girls decided to break that chain. >> Wow. >> So, we're having like I said, we're having a lot of fun with it. And but you are you're right. We are we are busy, but they're getting the oldest is getting into football right now, which is awesome. Basketball, all the things. So, we're we're staying busy in that regard. >> God bless you, man. So cool. >> Very good, dude. We'll send you a 15 powerlift. All right. >> All right, man. Thank you. Appreciate it. >> You got it, man. Thanks for calling in. >> All right. Take care. you know, uh, when I hear people with so many kids, first off, when you have, you know, good husband and wife working together, like it's still busy. It's still difficult, but u it's it just sounds so fulfilling. You just got so much stuff going on, house full of kids all the time. And I just envision this man at some point being a grandfather. He's going to be surrounded by so many. >> So do I. I think about that all the time of like you when you have that many kids like that, one or two of them is bound to love you and come back. [laughter] your odds are better. >> But yeah, you might strike out on a couple, but you definitely get a couple of them that are going to really like you. You know what I'm saying? They'll come back and hang out with you when you're old, you know? >> But I I got to say this too for people listening, like uh for some, it's not like this for everybody, but definitely for for significant percentage of people, >> daily alcohol consumption, even if it's just a couple drinks, uh it can have some pretty deleterious effects uh that you'll measure on blood lipids and blood sugar, and you just get rid of that. I've had clients, and by the way, it's not easy to do cuz uh you know, people get attached to it, but I've had clients get rid of that and it fixed everything. >> Well, I'll add this, too. >> And you're also talking extra 400, 500 calories. >> So, to say, so I'll add this to that, too, because I've I've been enjoying that more in my life than I ever did. And one of the biggest challenges for being a over six foot dude who needs to hit protein. Hard to hit my protein intake and have a couple glasses in the night. You know what I'm saying? That's why it has to be so infrequent for me. It's like >> if I allow that, those calories end up going to to to empty calories and I miss my protein intake. The combination of that just >> screws up my training. So, it's like that's what keeps me from having that drink here or there. Even though it's not that bad for you, it's just that tough to do both of those. >> All right, I know you like that episode. If you did, check this one out. Shredded, ripped, defined, singledigit body fat. Yes. >> You want to get there? Let's talk about it. difficult and is it worth [music] it? That's a follow-up question. >> Yeah. First off, we got to say, okay, so singledigit body fat, obviously body [music] fat percentages, uh that could be represented by one digit like 3%, 5%, 6%, 9%. [music] That's uh ripped for men. For women, >> add 10%. >> Yeah. Don't Yeah, exactly. Go you go up about Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. 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