MASTER NETWORKING: 7 Steps You NEED to Know to Connect with ANYONE | Christopher McDonald

What is up everybody? Welcome back to the 24-hour live. I am here with Dr. Finesse and we're going to be going hard on that networking. And it's so fascinating that you of all people are so good at networking because I consider you like wanting to be at home. I mean you're sort of self-professed not somebody that would love to be out and be partying, but you were inhumanly good at networking. So that. I appreciate that and you are very very right. I love to be home. Uh I remember one time, I'm going to say this is about 3 months ago. Uh we didn't have a babysitter and my wife Brenda stayed home with my son Allison and I was out and about and I was talking to some friends and one of my friends came up to me and she goes, "Oh man, so Brenda's home?" I'm like, "Yeah, she's home babysitting." She goes, "So how do you guys do that when you can't get a babysitter? Do you guys flip a coin to see who gets to go?" And I was like, "No, we actually do the exact opposite. We flip to see who gets to stay home cuz they're both like the biggest homebodies." Like we just don't like get a babysitter and stay home? Uh actually we've done that before. We've gotten a babysitter and we're like, "Take the kid out the house. We just want to stay home and watch our stories." Nice. Um but yeah, I know you and Lisa are also homebodies so yeah. way. We're exactly the same way. It's interesting because so the reason that we wanted to do this segment is it has become very clear to me over the last couple of years that networking is really really important and when I was in my 20s, you know, I'd hear things like your net worth is your network and I don't know, like it it didn't click. It didn't make sense. I knew enough people to like get going. My partners and I were very a very tight-knit group and so it felt like I sort of had everything that I needed and didn't really think about it and then I I we had this employee that was working with us and he ended up getting like this really awesome lead on either a bank loan or investor, I don't remember which it was. And I remember going like, "How do you know that guy?" And he was like, "Tom, when you're my age," cuz he's a little bit older, "Tom, when you're my age, you're going to have a Rolodex like this, as well." And I remember thinking, "Well, not with my current behavior, I'm not." And so, like cuz I just always want to be at home. And that's my natural inclination. I'm introverted. I'm not like paralyzed. I'm not shy. I think that's important. But, I am introverted. So, it's like never like this compulsion for me to go out. And then, on top of that, you put my wife, who once she started working, now never wants to go out. And I have everything I need, like the woman I love. So, I I don't have the compulsion, but several years ago, I started to really understand the value of meeting other people, of meeting people that are like-minded, of getting fresh ideas from the outside. We were growing so fast. I was meeting all these incredible people. And I just thought, I should really start to be more strategic about this, more systematic about this. But, I was just kind of fumbling my way through it. So, what are One, how did you end up being somebody who's introverted and a homebody? How did you end up in the the job that What In fact, tell people what your job is here. What you do, what you've been doing for a very long time at this point, and how you ended up there. Well, here I'm the director of talent relations. All the guests that you see on Impact Theory, even people that I connect you with sometimes, and uh you know, just getting you out there into into the room, cuz Tom always says, "Get me into the room." Cuz although he says he is an introvert by nature and staying home, if you get Tom into the room, he's going to do what he's going to do. He's going to work it out. So, um so, yeah. So, me, I book all the guests that you see on Impact Theory. And for Tavis Smiley, Arsenio Hall, and many it for a while. I've been doing it for a while. Just to give you a quick summarized evolution of my title. I went to college for a journalism. And I was gung-ho journalism. This is what I wanted to do. It was a very, very, very strict curriculum. They put us out there and we had to just write daily and write the the biggest papers, like 50-page papers that were due every week and we could have every single week, single-space 50-page papers and we couldn't have a single error. What? Yeah, a single outstanding error cuz if you did our professor was like, "That's how you get fired from a paper. That's how an editor would get rid of you." And it was just something like is 50 pages? God, I don't even know, but I just remember I got so fast at writing because and it had to be a story that existed in the news. We had to take it and and sometimes it was an it was one week it was an op-ed so we had to add our opinion. Another week it had to be as objective as possible, which was was very tough to do. It was just a tough curriculum and the whole thing was as a journalist they she wanted to get you out there, wanted to get you writing. And you had to go out and interview people on the street. It was it was either people on the street, people at the state house or people at the police police station and that's how it was in Boston. It was always related to those three. And but doing that I remember right away that was the most important lesson that she taught us was as a journalist your network is just your every element that's out there. You've got to put yourself out there and put yourself in the faces of people. You got to be inquisitive, you got to be curious and it kind of set the stage for the beginning of networking for me. So I did that curriculum. I came out here straight from Boston and I got a job at CNN. And actually the funny thing is I got a job at CNN. I mean I will say I interned there first, but I went back to graduate and I walked in the CNN and I walked into a department. I didn't even know the guy. He didn't even know I had interned there. I just walked off the street and this was in the 90s when you can actually walk into a building like that and Uh, right now it just would never happen. And I walked into the building and I basically just asked for a job. And the timing couldn't be more perfect. I asked for a job and he was just like, "Who are you?" I was like, "Ah, my name is Christopher. I used to work upstairs or intern upstairs in the entertainment division." And he was like, he picked up his phone. "I got a Christopher here. Did he intern up there?" I was like, "Oh, is Chris here?" Yeah, he's here. And he And they came downstairs. And someone vouched for me and he gave me a job on the spot. He said, "Can you start today?" I was like, "Perfect." start today? Can you start today? And I remember I called my girlfriend at the time. I was like, "I'm not coming home. I'm working at CNN." And I remember just thinking I was like, "Wow, I put myself out there. I just walked in there, introduced myself." And uh, from there I started working at CNN and I worked there for 4 and 1/2 years. When I was at CNN I did everything. Uh, this is where I got to put my journalism skills and my networking skills started to grow because they would put me out uh, although I was a researcher uh, I was well adept writing and uh, speaking with people. And uh, although they didn't have a spot for me to be a reporter, they actually let me go out and report. I wasn't on air but you would see my thumb holding the mic. Which is crazy. I'd be like, "That's my thumb." And And to this day you can still see my thumb because a lot of times if like say if there's an obituary, a video obituary on CNN, someone passes away and they show stock footage that CNN had accumulated over the years. Mhm. And they would mostly, you know, show footage that they have. We need to do like a montage of Christopher's thumb out in the wild. That'd be amazing. Exactly. Yeah, and you would see my thumb in a room somebody and it's crazy. Um, so through that I met more and more people and I remember I started taking advantage of it. I had a mentor which is very important in networking as Tom will tell you. In fact, how'd you get the mentor? The mentor was uh, the music producer at CNN, Denise Quan. And you guys connected first just like connected or was it formally she's your mentor? Uh, I was an intern for her and then when I started working at CNN, um, I went up to her and I told her I said, "Look, and actually this is how it happened. I was like, I I'm a researcher obviously, but I want to get back to what I was doing when I was interning for you. Look, I have this amount of hours, but afterwards, I I just want to follow you, go to your events with you. I will write and label the tapes all the interviews that you do. That's all I need to do." And we were out and she actually decided, "Hey, do you want to do this interview?" I was like, "What?" I don't even remember who the first person was, but I remember actually I got to do vaguely. I want to say it was someone like Ron Howard or something. It was like we were on the arrival line. And I did it. She was impressed. The producers were impressed back there. And they started sending me to so many events, like a lot of the award shows. But I mentioned this to you before. It just so happened to me while I realized this, but I was going to a lot of the the black oriented award shows. Right. Which is cool. I was cool with it. why. Yeah, so I was getting myself out there and meeting folks. And then I eventually got a job at Tavis Smiley. I just happened to be at a party. And I was playing guitar and this just a bunch of us jam banding at the at my friend's house. And this other guy is on the piano. This other guy is on the bass. And this one guy was on the drums. Never met him before in my life. And he goes, "Hey, is everything all right, Christopher?" I was like, "Yeah." He goes, "I heard you work at CNN." I was like, "Yeah, I do." He goes, "Hey, I'm starting up this show with Tavis Smiley. Are you familiar with him?" I was like, "Hell yeah, I used to watch him on BET and I listen to him on NPR." He was like, "Yeah, well we're starting this new PBS show and I'm trying to recruit people from different news outlets and collectively come together and create something of our own. Would you be into it?" I was like, "Yeah, man." And I remember I did a riff. I was like, "Yeah." I was like, And then he gave me his card. And the next day I called him. I was like, "Hey, what's up, Neil? It's Christopher McDonald." He was like, "Who's this?" I was like, "Ah, you gave me your card yesterday. You said to I was like, "Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah." I said, "Hey, so who do I talk to about the job? Where do I send my resume? Do I meet with you?" He was like, "No, I I gave you the job." I was like, "What?" He goes, "Yeah, I thought you said you wanted to do it." I was like, oh, shoot, well, can I give two weeks? He's like, yeah, that's perfect. And I mean, and that was just per chance, right? Wow. So, I started working at Tavis and Well, let's actually back up. So, you have the most outrageous group of friends I've ever heard in my life. I won't name drop, but it's ridiculous. And these are people that are like your friends. Like, most of them you knew before they got famous. So, I want to know how did you end up up at that party? Who was that friend? Cuz you're like, oh yeah, yeah, sorry, I didn't mention that was Bill Gates. Yeah, my bad. Like Actually, that's funny. So, the friend who's house it was, uh actually it was two of them. Two of them were living in the house. One of the friends, um actually I do a book club with her and she has it at her house uh every month and Casey has just joined the book club and Courtney's going to join. Nice. But, um the other friend who lived there, she was Carrie Fisher's executive assistant. Which was cool because she would always invite us to Carrie Fisher's house for these cool parties. I'm completely name dropping and I'm going to go for it. Um go all in. And it was really And Carrie Fisher would have the most eclectic parties. I'm talking about there was no discrimination about age or or anybody. Like, in this corner you'd see like a young starlet and then over I mean, and I'll name like somebody. They'd be like Scarlett Johansson in this this corner. And then over here, Richard Dreyfuss and Tom Berenger. And you're like, wait, this doesn't make any sense. That don't make no sense. Tom Berenger and Richard Dreyfuss hanging out at a party with Scarlett Johansson. And then Nicole Kidman over here. And then like, uh you know, what's his face, John Lennon's son, Julian over here. And I'm just like, wait, wait, this is crazy. And she would have these just bunch of people getting together and just eating her food and hanging out and having a good time. She was like truly a great person and she knew so many people. Speaking of networking, you would go to her party and all of Hollywood would be there. And especially cuz her mom was Debbie Reynolds, so you would see these old classic uh stars there also. And it would And people would just get together and network, and you would just meet the most amazing people. And and through that, you would meet more people. Were you going intentionally because you're like the classic example of put yourself in danger of something amazing happening, right? So, you show up at the party, which is like step number one, and was that intentional? Like, I never know who I'm going to meet, so you know what? I'm going to go. Uh actually, no, it was uh okay, I'll be honest. I'll be completely honest. Um especially when I'm in my 20s, when I was in my 20s, if someone invited me to a party, the homebody me would want to stay home. The natural inclination, like, I want to stay home. But, they would taunt me with a certain thing, it would always get me. Or I would ask a certain thing, and it would always get me. I would always ask, is there going to be food there? And if there was food there, I would be there in a heartbeat. For a free meal? For a free meal, I would show up to your party. That's how it was in the 90s. So, this is an empire built on free meals. That's That's what I'm hearing. I'm telling you. I'm telling you, if there was a free meal, same thing with uh uh events and parties, if like, if I if it was just open bar, like, that's it, open bar, and especially in my 20s, I didn't drink at all, like, I No, I I I don't want to go. But, if there was food, I would go. And I'd pop up there. And circling back to my friends, um it just so happened the school I went to and the school my brother went to was a school that involved um you know, either working in the arts, uh film, um journalism, and television and media. So, almost everyone you come out with are at least everyone like 95% of people who went to my school, Emerson College, came out of here for the industry. So, somewhere along the way, we're all hustling, we're all bustling, and someone's going to break. Someone is going to break and become somebody, you know what I mean? Yeah, and hit. And then you look back and you're like, holy crap, you know, and people will ask, like, well, how do you know that person? How do you know that celebrity? I'm like, actually, that was just someone I went to college with. So, that's how it happened. And then the more that happens, the more people you meet, because suddenly, I mean, you see it all the time. Celebrities get invited everywhere. It's kind of unfair. It's like they get crazy swag with watches and Rolexes and iPads, and and we get like wristbands. And it's just like, come on, man. Like, hook me up. But, because they get to go everywhere, you know, sometimes they take you along. And you meet the most insane people. And that So, yeah, circling back to that party, that's how I met that guy at the Tavis. So, when I was at Tavis, I had decided um there wasn't a focus, a full focus on the music guests. Cuz Tavis would interview politicians and celebrities. Celebrities could include musicians, but not necessarily We didn't have a music segment, so to speak. Right. So, I went to my executive producer, and he was so open-minded. If you had a great idea, I loved that about him. And I went to him and I said, "Hey, I think we should have a music segment." I was like, "I don't care if I don't want I don't want you to pay me more, nothing. I just want to be the music producer. I want to show you that I can create a music segment, because all these other late-night shows at the time were only letting artists perform. And at the end of the show, when everyone tuned out. Like, the numbers are there. People tune out at the end of talk shows. They just do, cuz they're late. And uh music is so polarizing that people tend not to watch. But, I was like I told him, "I can bring musicians here, and I believe they would love to talk and have the opportunity to present themselves. And that would separate us from the rest of the other uh the other late-night shows." And he was like, "Okay." And I was like, "So, I can do that?" And he said, "Yeah." So, I had something to prove. So, this was my first step of really getting out there and becoming a networker. So, I'm Did you did you understand cuz when you break down the process now of booking and what it takes and the way that you have to understand the different people, what they look for, who their clients are? Like, did you understand any of that then? Or does Is this the beginning of you really sort of understanding that world? Uh there's a phrase uh that we all know, especially in business, I guess, uh and that I love and I and I live by, although it's a little scary, is to fake it till you make it. Right. And and all I again, I like to be home, but I know when I'm out there, there's something about I thrive This sounds corny, but I Ooh, look at that. You got yourself a meal. Right. Thank you. Yes, yes. I could I could smell it for like the last 15 minutes. I'm like, "They never bringing the [ __ ] food?" Like, "Are you messing with me?" Yeah. So, real quick, I'll I'll take a moment to give it up to this man for being for This is like my second hour and I'm tired. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So, yeah. So, fake it till you make it and I knew that I thrive off the energy of people. I could be dog tired, but uh just to throw this in there, I grew up in an army brat and I moved every three or four years, so to speak, around the world. And one thing that helped me do was reinvent myself and uh and find a way to talk your way out of things, to find your way to to meet and and uh you know, just associate with all types of people. Uh because I would always move and every time you moved, you had to make new friends, regardless. You had to make new friends. I would leave one school, I would leave Japan and then move to Kentucky. And talk about a culture shock. Woah. Is that a real one? That was a real change. Japan to Kentucky. And I remember thinking right around that time, that's when I really had to figure out a way to get myself out there and talk to people. And everyone was doing it. Everyone I grew up with, they all moved, too. But it helped me uh warm up to people and appreciate people. It wasn't just like, "Oh, I'm just talking to people cuz I'm talking to people and I and I want to be that guy." You just learn to appreciate people and you see all different types of cultures, all different types of people in different situations, but you realize everyone has the same common denominator. You know what I mean? That they just all want to relate in some way or or fashion. And then you just start to learn how to speak with people, how to connect with them, you know? And not to say that I'm an expert on connecting with people. People and people. So, let's act like you are because I think you are, certainly from my perspective. So, what are some of the like have you codified what those lessons are? Yeah. Yeah, I I I really have. Um so, I actually have a top seven do's of networking which I can get to. Let's get Let's get on that camera. Hey! Yeah, camera ready. So, we've got the the seven What were the seven what? The top seven do's of networking. All right, let's hear it. Yeah, okay. So, I'll break them down. And I'm going to cuz I have it on my phone. Uh step away from the computer and hit the pavement. All right? Uh we're in a world and again, let me preface by saying these are my do's. They're not applicable to everyone, but I highly suggest them cuz I've put them into action uh for almost 20 years and they work. Uh so, we're in a world of uh computers and our phones and being able to communicate with people, the age of information, through our computers and phones. That's just the world we're in. So, it's made it really easy to meet people, but not having to physically meet them. And I've actually had that happen. Like there are publicists uh that I've worked with for years. For years, I've been I've been communicating with them. I've booked with them since 2003 and I've never met them in person. Whoa. Ever met them in person, but in most cases, those are people who either on the East Coast uh cuz I deal with a lot of people on the East Coast and we just never uh paths never cross. And then there are people I I just met recently after knowing them for about 20 years. Uh and it's crazy. So, but if they're local, it's still easy to just Oh, you know, I'm communicating with this person. I'm pitching them something or I'm asking something of them, uh but no, just step out and meet them. Uh and this will correlate to the story I was talking about earlier uh when I wanted to be the music producer. So, I I tried to figure out I was like, "How am I to do this. So, my first attempt was to send this email blast. I just found out who every major label publicist was. At the time, there were many cuz the music industry was slowly fading away or fading into what what it is now, but they still had many publicists working at each uh label. So, I did an email blast. Some of them bit, some of them got back to me, but it didn't quite fully work. And I crafted like the nicest email. I just didn't want to cold call them whatever. And then I finally decided I was like, "You know what? No, you know what? I do better in person talking to someone. And then no matter who you are, if you speak to someone and just present yourself, it'll man, it's it's going to go a long way. So, I actually started inviting all these publicists individually out for drinks. And that's one thing I learned especially in the music industry, these music publicists, they love to drink, you know what I mean? Uh not that they were alcoholics, but they had a really tough job to do and they have a really tough job to do. So, if you can just invite them to wine, not to get drunk, just to hang out, they would come out. So, just face face time. And you'd be amazed at how far that goes. I mean, that sounds so cliché, oh get up get off your butt and don't communicate over the computer, but so many people are guilty of doing it. I have people talk to me all the time uh who are getting into booking or getting into networking and they're like, "Oh yeah, I hit up this guy and he I I I can't get him to really get back to me. Have you spoken to him at all on the phone?" Yes, I have. Have you talked to him on email? Yes, we've spoken on email. Have you invited him out to drinks? No, I haven't done that. Is that weird? LIKE, WHAT? NO, THAT'S NOT WEIRD. SO, although it seems so common and so uh you know uh matter of fact, uh people don't do it. People don't get out there. So, that's my number one like hit the pavement cuz if you're not getting out there and hitting the pavement and getting the face to face like just You haven't even started. You haven't even started. Uh my second one is just being a good salesperson. And that sounds so sleazy, a salesperson. I never forget the first time someone asked me about booking and asked me about my network And I described it, and they said, "Oh, so you're a salesperson." I was like, "Oh god, no." I was like, "I'm not a salesperson." I know. I was like, "What did you say? What did you call me? What did you say about my mom?" It was basically that. I was like, "Don't call me a salesperson." But, uh they broke it down to me. They were like, "No, you're a salesperson because for you specifically, you're selling yourself as a person trying to get their product, whatever, right? Or trying to And then you're also selling the show that you work for. And you're also selling the host. You know what I mean?" And I was like, "Man, holy crap, I am a salesperson." And he was like, "Don't look at it really badly. Like you you know, you're you're being a salesperson, so you should actually take a cue." And And he gave me this advice. He was like, "See what, you know, some of the great sales people do and what they did. I mean, you don't have to emulate them completely cuz it's not uh fully what you're doing, but check it out." So, I started paying attention to great sales people. And not this person, for example, but you know, you you interviewed one of the greatest sales people that we know uh in our business history, and that's John Paul DeJoria. Like you can't get any better than that guy. That guy like actually went door-to-door and built a business, a billion-dollar business. Like how many people can say they did that? So, I mean, he obviously knew the value in the sales pitch. So, so when you become a great salesperson, you're not just being a salesperson, you're practicing the sales pitch because that is probably the number one thing of networking. Cuz even if you're not trying to sell somebody something, when you're networking, you're selling yourself. All right? You're selling your personality, you're selling just your connection. And it's your sales pitch. And uh and when you're speaking with someone, you don't have to be sleazy and be systematic and have a sales pitch, but just keep it in mind. Keep it in mind what you're saying. And all of a sudden, it becomes second nature, like you're breathing to them who you are, and you're not just It's not diarrhea of the mouth and taking over what they're saying, but it's a sales pitch. And uh and it just goes a long way. I mean, it's a big thing in networking. It's a huge thing. Um so, my number three is to be bold, but not pushy. Yeah, get out there. Be bold. Don't be afraid. I mean, you see it all the time. It goes back to the high school dance. When you're standing around I never had a date to the high school dance except for prom, but you're standing around and I just remember standing around and looking at you know the girls across the way and the guys are all standing around and some guys are just going for it and you're just trying to figure out how to approach. And I just wasn't bold then. I just was not bold. I'm still not bold. God, if I if I was single now and I had to go to a dance, forget it. I wouldn't do it. But, it's the same thing with networking. How many times do you go to a party and you're like, "Oh my god, this feels like crap." Like there are people over there I just you know Every single time. Yeah, yeah. I and I I I'm even guilty of it. Sometimes I'm with my wife and we're just with each other in the corner of the entire night. The entire night. But, if you're trying to network, just go up and be bold and introduce yourself. And again, it's some people are like, "That's not being bold if you introduce yourself." But, it's bold to so many people. Just introduce yourself. Don't be afraid to slide into a conversation. Don't straight up interrupt. Gauge it, but you get better at gauging what they're talking about and knowing that you shouldn't insert yourself. But, don't be afraid to do it. People are especially at a networking gathering or business gathering, people are very welcoming to that. Right. So, be bold, but not pushy. Don't push yourself in there. Know when to step away or just even you know when you're trying to sell someone on something, just don't be pushy. It's just gross. It's gross. In booking, if someone and I actually got this tip from Oprah. And I'm sure Courtney Say what? I'm sure like Oprah directly? Yes, yes. I actually I did a show with Oprah. It was a short-lived show. It was a show with Tyrese Gibson from Fast and Furious fame and the singer and Rev Run from Run-DMC. And it was a show about those two giving advice to women, but not like, "Oh, you should do this." But, this is what we how we think as men. So, take that nugget and you know, and you can get you know, what's going on our mentality. But Oprah uh during the whole process, we would uh have these meetings with her where we were developing The show was already greenlit, but we had to develop the segments and we would meet with her. And we had this one big meeting where we were sitting around this big long table with Oprah Winfrey. And I remember uh they had a whole spread of food in the other room. And it was a it was a make-your-own salad, and they capitalize O W N your own salad. And I was like, ooh. And they had all these ingredients. I was like, oh my god, oh my god. And I was like making this I made this big-ass plate of food. Again, it's free food. I'm going to be there and I'm going to eat that food. I was going to ask if that's why you were at the Yeah, I was like, wait, Oprah's having a a little gathering? Is there going to be food there? Okay, I'll be there. So, so pretty much no, but I would have gone regardless. So, I made this big plate of food and I went into the room and I everyone was already seated. And when I get there, for some reason, out of everyone in that room, cuz there were about 25 people in that room, Oprah and then uh a good chunk of her staff, and then me, my executive producer, the co-executive producer, and Tyrese. And Tyrese's manager. And I sit down and across the table is Tyrese and Oprah, and there's an empty seat across from them. And I'm I'm like, what? How's this seat open for me? I'm like, I'm nobody. But I guess no one wanted to sit in their eyesight. So, I sat down with this big-ass plate and I looked around and no one has a plate. No one. I'm like, why isn't anybody eating? No one. And I was starving, Tom. My stomach was growling. And I was like picking at my food. I was eating my food like this. Cuz I didn't want to be chewing loudly while Oprah was talking. leaning away from the mic as you're telling this story about wanting to eat carefully. So, I get it. Yeah, it was terrible. And then but I remember we got to the point of booking. And all the attention came on me. So, let's talk about guests and who we're going to get for this show. My executive producer was like, oh yeah. So, we have all these ideas. He's talking about like he's throwing out all these big names like Will and Jada, Bradley Cooper and so-and-so, and this person and that person. Like all these big names. And I remember Oprah was like And I was like, why is she making that face? And she goes Good luck getting those people. I was like, oh wow, she's talk taking a dig at me that I'm not going to get those people. And then she goes, no, no, no, I'm not saying that. It's it's just tough getting those folks. And then she said Um you know what? Don't be disappointed if some of these people don't want to do the show and just move on from it. She was I come from the school of if I found out no one wanted to do my show when I was doing my main stage show. If someone didn't want to come, that's fine. I don't push on it. If they don't want to be here, why do they need to be here? Don't push. So, that was a huge thing for me. That was a huge thing for me. I was like, well, you know, if someone doesn't want to buy your product or someone want to doesn't want to buy what you're presenting to them, don't be too pushy. You know what I mean? Step away. And understand there will be an opportunity where they'll figure out and see that you're the bomb. Just like how people I can't believe I said the bomb. I don't think I've ever even said that. I don't think I've ever said that. This is a first. The bomb? I hope my wife's not watching this. God, that's crazy. Oh my god. So, yeah. This is Dr. Finesse, everybody. Dr. Finesse. So, yeah. So, I mean cuz there were I mean I can't tell you enough and I know you know this more than anybody. There are people who have passed on Impact Theory. There are people who have passed on News the Host, Tom Bilyeu. Cuz they're like, wait, who's this guy? And but and I push a little bit cuz I'm tenacious, but not too much. Because deep down I'm like, you know what? There is going to be a time and I've seen this happen so many times where you're selling yourself, you're networking, and someone's not giving you the time of day with the network. And they just kind of move on from you. But you just stay the course, keep your confidence cuz there's going to be failure in networking, and there's going to be people who don't want to network with you, or don't want to be a connection with you. Uh and they're going to figure it out. They're going to be like, "Wow, somewhere down the line, this person is someone I should know." So, that's just not being too pushy. Um the fourth one I actually have to learn myself, but this is big, and uh this is one thing that we're all learning here, one thing that Gary V always pushes, is be social media savvy. Because, look, we are in a new age. I was one of those little people that held out. I was like, "I'm not on social media. I live in today. I don't need social media. Get that out of my face." And I didn't have anything. People couldn't find me anywhere. I was on Facebook years ago, but I quit years ago. And I didn't have anything. I didn't have Instagram at the time. And I just remember just being a holdout. But, I was seeing people network that way. Like, "Hey, how'd you find out about that event? How'd you find out about that person?" They're like, "On Facebook." I was like, "What? Facebook?" "Yeah." They're like, "On Instagram." I'm like, "Instagram?" And to me, that was foreign. I was like, "Wait, you didn't just call them, or show up?" They're like, "No, this is like there's like a network of folks, or there are pages where people talk, and meetings of the minds online." And it's And again, like to to our viewers, I'm sure they're like, "Of course, you got to be social media savvy." But, there are there are ways to be more social media savvy, and put that into action. And And I say that to the folks who are I guess our age, who are bicentennial babies, and who Didn't grow up with it. Didn't grow up with it, and and use the power of actually knocking on the door, or going to the network. Uh and it's kind of a juxtaposition of what I'm saying about stepping away from the computer, but you there's a time and place for it. You've got to take advantage, and realize uh adapt or die. So, be social media savvy. That's big with networking. Uh number five, this is although this is number five out of seven, this is my biggest one. Really? This is my most important one. Maybe cuz it's an even number. I'm sure Jared likes that I have a top seven, instead of a top five, or a top 10. A little odd number out. And cuz I I a top five at first, and I was like, "Jared's going to like, cringe if he sees that." So, top five don't burn any bridges. That is a no-brainer, best good advice. Yeah, but I mean, we all know that people get angry when it comes to people people people to people relations. People lose their mind and get angry and they see red and they're like, "Man, screw that person." Like, not to put out any names, but you were just in a situation that you talked about briefly here and there where things didn't go as you like. Yeah, and it wasn't as favorable as you like. But, you handled that like a champ. We had a networking gathering, the Impact Hour. Next time you guys next Impact Hour that Cindy puts together, you guys have got to come. Even if you're not in Los Angeles, come. It's you meet great people, you know what I mean? As viewers, all the viewers here are great people. And we've met some great viewers, so Impact Hour. But, you were at that Impact Hour and you had just done that shoot and you're so gracious about it. And you realize that. You're like, "You're not going to burn a bridge because somewhere along the way he may figure it out, you know what I mean?" And he may figure out who you are. And believe me, I know for a fact he's going to come running. He's going to come running. And I and I see it all the time. I remember I learned that really early. When I started at CNN, I interned for a lot of older folks. And there was one guy who always used to joke. He's like, "You're going to be I'm going to be working for you one day." Yeah, "I'm going to be working for you one day." That was his joke. To the point where I was like, "Oh, this guy and his joke." But, I was like, that was always his goodbye. You know how some people are like, "Hey, goodbye. See you later." Some people are like, "Hey, I'll catch you later. Going to be working for you one day." That was him. And I was like, "Man." But, the funny thing is later on down the line, we ended up being producing and booking partners at Tavis. I interned for this guy at Entertainment Tonight and CNN. And we ended up working on the same level. Lisa, for her show Sheroic when Cassie Ho was here in Access Hollywood, came here and covered her. I'm sitting here on the couch over here at my computer and Access Hollywood shows up. And the reporter walks in, the on-camera reporter walks in. And I look at her and I'm like, "Alex?" And it was this young woman who used to intern for me Really? at Tavis Smiley. And now she's an on-air personality and is doing so well. And it blew my mind. I was like, "Wait, what? You're You're on Access Hollywood?" Mhm. And I remember she came to me and she told me, she's like, "Wow, you were always so so nice to me. Always so nice to me. You were the only booker and producer over there who didn't treat me like a minion, who wasn't cruel, uh who didn't like think he was holier than thou." And I was like, "I I don't understand why people think that way." That's so crazy. Cuz in any industry, Mhm. especially where we're you know, the way things are going now. I mean, there were so many young people with grand ideas. There were so many young CEOs. They will be your boss someday. So, don't burn a bridge. I don't burn a bridge anywhere, up or down, whatever, cuz people think that it's just this directory is like this. Oh, no, it's all over the place. Right. It's like time. So, I don't understand why anyone in their right mind burn bridges. Uh okay, so number six, have personality. Uh plain and simple. Uh I don't mean like be like, "Well, you know, like a a town crier" or anything, but just have some personality. You know, we all go to networking parties and sometimes I meet people at networking parties. And whether it's their true personality or not, I'm not saying to fake it, but and my next point goes along uh these lines. Just open yourself up. And I feel like it's so hard for people and they're so afraid to open themselves up. Even if your personality is like, "Hey, I'm John Smith. You know what I mean?" Just Just try to open yourself up a little bit. So, you're famous here at Impact Theory for being just an unbelievably good storyteller, as evidenced by the fact that I almost spit my burger on the floor a few minutes ago. Um is that something that you've practiced? No, I I I think I get it from my mom. I have two I think so. to start inviting your mom to like team lunches cuz your stories are epic. can invite my mom here, I'd be really excited, cuz she's passed away. And I mean No, no, I mean that's fine. Like, cuz she is hands down she was like, when she passed away at her funeral, there were people showing up at her funeral. I was like, "Who in the hell is that person?" I was like, and my dad was like, "Who is this?" And she That was a testament to her character. No matter where she went, she made friends. Cuz she was such a great storyteller. No matter where she went. I even got a call uh last week from this guy crying. I was like, "Who Who is this?" He goes, "This is the first guy." I was like, "Yeah." "Uh I'm a friend of your mom's. I knew her for years. I just found out she passed away. I decided to Google her." And I'd never heard of the guy in my life. And I remember there was a point where I was like, "You knew my mom?" And then, you know, we'll get together for dinner at some point. I'm going to get to the bottom of that. But, yeah, so it's just like But, she was a great storyteller, and she was so funny and charismatic. And everyone has an idol, you know what I mean? Everyone has an idol, and I have tons of idols. But, man, my biggest idol, hands down, was my mom. Like, I would watch how she would talk to people and watch how fascinated they were, and how she would just genuinely be interested in what people were thinking and what she was saying to people. And I mean that by saying it wasn't calculated, but she would pay attention to what she was saying to people and seeing what it was evoking. Right. She's not phoning it in. She Yeah, she's not Yeah, exactly. She's very present. Like, if she's saying something and it was evoking some type of emotion of happiness, she would stick to it. If she said something and she saw that it was turn people off, she would kind of pull back or even apologize, you know what I mean? She was very in tune, and I would study my mom. She was just that person. My dad was the exact exact opposite. Military guy. He's probably said one and a half words his entire life. And he And it was probably like, "Fuck you." That's probably his words. But, he just doesn't say much. And my two older brothers are the same thing. They don't say much. Like, uh so I just got that from my mom. And it wasn't even like I'm going to try to be like my mom. It was just exciting and I I just got my personality from I would say and so yeah so my personality I guess um I know it's not everybody's personality but just when I say have personality again don't fake it but just open yourself up and realize that if you're just hanging your head and keeping your your brow low no one's going to be receptive. Just open up even if you're the most the biggest you know introvert it's not going to kill you. Now all right before we get to seven I want to say we've got our giveaway for this segment. We're giving away books Captivate. If you guys haven't read this this is absolutely amazing. We're giving a bunch of copies of that away and the question to win the books is what are the five love languages? What are the five love languages? All right so drop that answer into the feed and later in this we'll announce the winner of that. All right now drum roll number seven. Number seven so you have to have personality I say but but most important and it may this may sound like a it's contradicting the other one but just be yourself. Just be yourself. I mean I see it time and time again when I go to these networking events or when I'm you know sometimes I get bamboozled in the network events. That happens a lot. By free food? By free food. Yeah oh my god I was about to So this example does involve free food. This is like I'm not even thinking about that. But I mean there's so many times like where a publicist say hey guys let's get let's have dinner and talk about my clients in your show whatever. I'm like that's great and I'll get to the dinner and it's it'll be this huge table. I'm like wait what are we Is this the last supper? Like what are we doing? Like why is it it's just you and me and then all of a sudden a bunch of other bookers would show up like the booker from Fallon the booker from Kimmel the booker from so and so booker from this radio show and we all have the same look in our face like what the hell just happened. And she would speed bamboozled but we'd all end up being forced into networking with each other, right? So, but you just learn to be yourself. Like, you don't you don't you don't have to fake it. And you're sitting down and you see it all the time where someone is just kind of robotic and it's hard. I get it. Meeting someone and you know, they just start asking the very systematic questions. No, talk about your day. Don't be afraid to talk about your dog. Don't be afraid to to talk about, you know, your mom. You know what I mean? It's just like don't just be yourself because I mean, again, moving around all my life, that's the one thing that I've noticed that the people who were always genuinely themselves and who were honest with themselves and honest with you and opened up, cried if they had to, or whatever, those are the people who not just me who I was receptive to, I've noticed uh who other people were receptive to. Cuz that's the one thing There's I mean, if there's one thing I've studied growing up was popularity and how people became popular. Not You studied that because you were going from school to school to school. Going from school to school to school. I was fascinated with it. Cuz you would go from one school and this person be popular. You're like, "Wait, what? That guy's popular? Oh my god, in my last school he would be getting his ass kicked." You know what I mean? And it was just always that. And there's a story I always tell about when I went to uh middle school in Kentucky, there was a kid in my class. He was short. You know, he just had that kind of traditional goofy look. Mhm. Uh people didn't pick on him though, but he just was not you know, he wasn't the popular kid. Uh and but I you know, we were cool. And I remember I felt so bad because he in class he sharted. Now, uh for those who don't know what a shart is, it's I Sorry we're getting into this, but it's when you uh fart and [ __ ] your pants. And he did that. And I remember feeling so awful for him. And everyone like I forgot exactly what his last name last name was. Actually, I wouldn't say I won't say it. But they combined his last name with the word shart and it just was just sad. And and I remember uh I moved to Germany years later. I was a sophomore in high school and I moved to and there was this kid who was the most popular kid in school. He was like 6'4, handsome, he was the tight end and I was like, man, that guy is cool. I could just tell. I remember I looked at it and I was like, why does that guy look familiar? I know that guy. I was like, oh my god, it's the kid who sharted in sixth grade. And he had moved to Germany and reinvented himself and became the most popular kid in school. And I remember thinking like, oh my god, that's crazy. And then and I became so obsessed and fascinated with that. But the one thing I've noticed in the in but coincidentally, there's an article, I think it was like Business Journal or somebody just put out an article recently that basically said, uh God, I have to go you can go get uh something about the most popular people in school tend to be I mean it was in the captivating tend to be I might have been captivated tend to be uh people who are nice. You know what I mean? People who are genuinely open and genuinely friendly and people are receptive to that. So, that comes back to my point. This guy, he was a genuinely nice guy when he sharted his pants sixth grade. And he was popular and like an all-star tight end and everyone loved him and he was still genuinely nice. That's it's so interesting. So, being genuine is something that I think it's actually hard for people to do and when you look at people that really become successful in acting or even like in my own small way, I think Inside Quest started getting good when I stopped trying to hide the things that I found interesting even if they were weird and I stopped trying to hide my enthusiasm and if somebody said something that made me go, oh, like I would actually do that, right? And that was when like but that's real, right? That like I when I was first doing the episodes, it was like, oh, that's excellent. Thank you for coming on. You know, and it was like I had this vision of what an interviewer was supposed to be, right? And so, I wasn't able to bring anything unique because I wasn't being myself. And when as you're explaining this, and admittedly I've never really taken the time to break down why you're so good at what you do, and hearing you talk about it, I realized you're insanely likable. And there's a reason like if somebody came and watched our team lunches, it it would just be like, "Oh, well, that's the the center of attention in this universe." Because everybody is is paying attention to you. Everybody wants to hear your stories. Uh we've learned not to put the pressure on you to like start the stories, but you know, you're so charismatic and everybody's so captivated. And it's like if you're not there for a team lunch, we'd be like, "Oh, like there's no Christopher to like tell the stories." And so, it be it really does become clear as you're going through your list of the things that being able to be what I call in my words defenseless. So, when people aren't being themselves, they have defenses up. They're They've got pretenses. There's that armor that makes them feel comfortable. And but you it's such a bad strategy because you don't respond to it in other people. What you do respond to is the guy that's totally real. Real And it admittedly you become a filtering mechanism. Not everyone is going to respond to the real you, but the people that respond are going to respond hard. And I don't think it's a mistake or an accident that of everyone here, and I'd be curious enough everybody agrees with this. I think they will. That you seem to have the the broadest number of friends that you've been friends with for the longest period of time, and they seem like really real relationships. Now, we all obviously only get your side of the story, so secretly all of these people may hate you and be like, "Fucking Chris for stopping me again." Um that's certainly not how it reads. Yeah, I if there's one thing if God, if I were to add a 7.5 to being yourself and the seven do's of networking, it's just being loyal. Cuz loyalty goes a long way. you're you've got a hardcore definition of that. Yeah, loyal to me is I'm as loyal as it gets almost to a fault. Um and when it comes to my friends, since you mentioned my friends, if you're my friend and I consider you my friend, man, I'm so loyal. I don't It's like you would have to kill me for me to stop appreciating you. You know what I mean? If I got to a point where I deemed you a friend, like I understand human nature. People make mistakes. People make really big mistakes and you've got to understand at some point it's human nature. Now, there may be you got to just gauge how many people how many times they've made the mistake and how many times they've wronged you. Of course. But if it's just one wrong once cuz I see friendships fall apart all the time over a trivial wrong. And I'm like, "Oh, no, no, think about it. Think about what you guys have gained and what you everything you've been through." experience. The shared experiences and I'm very loyal and I apply that to my networking, too. Oh my god, like it's Here's a big thing. Another reason why it's hard for me I don't commit to too many things because if I say yes to something and I know you're this way, too. Yes. You show up. Like that one time flu gate that ran through the house and everyone got the flu and we had Jim Quick here and another guest and you had the worst flu and I was like, "Is Tom going to Is Tom going to do this show?" And I remember Lisa was like, "Tom, you should uh you should cancel." Yeah, we'll cancel or reschedule. like, "What?" And because you're loyal to your guest, you're loyal to your show, you're loyal to your staff. And you always say this and I love this. You're like, I will show up to you. And I love that about you. Thank you, man. And I think you completely get that. Just being loyal. That's my definition. I mean, I'm curious to hear yours. Yeah, well, so it's interesting. I'm I am insanely loyal, but like you, there's a ring. And if you're on the outside of that ring, I don't I don't feel an obligation. So, I'm not going to [ __ ] you. I'm just not going to show up for you. I'm not going to go out of my way to make sure that the world is right for you. But once you get inside that ring, then it's like it's do or die. And there's got to be a group of people that really know to the core. And this is the key. They have to feel it, right? Not be able to recite words. They have to feel it that you're going to show up. And that's you know, one of the things here, so by nature I like team building a lot. And there's a reason that I have absolutely, when I say zero hunger, zero hunger to be a founder. I like to be a co-founder. I like to do things as a team. I like to have a group of people that like we're all together, we're in this together, a shared experience. That's really, really important to me. But it's it is so like key to who I am and important to my code that I live by that the team feel that I'm going to that I would suffer for them, lead from the front, I'm always going to show up, I'm going to play to win, that it's like no man left behind, like all of those things. But not that they can repeat that I say it, but that they feel it like in their gut. And that's hard. And one of the simple steps is if you say you're going to do it, do it. And I remember Lisa and I had committed to something. And in my defense, she committed me without talking to me. And she was like, I am so sorry. I had no idea. I thought they were just asking me, but I find out that they're asking both of us. and so I'm like, "Well, here's the great news. There's no universe in which we don't show up. So, like you're, you know, for better or worse. So, it's like if you've gotten us into something, even though I wish you hadn't, uh if we're in it, you told them that we're coming, then it it's just that simple. And the clarity that comes with having that code and and being centered by that, I think is is super critical. It goes the longest way. It's like you've got to show that you're supporting the person you're networking with, because if you don't, they're going to think you're just out to get something from them and not reciprocate. Reciprocation is a huge thing for me. And it's a huge thing in booking. I'll speak in terms of booking. You've got to scratch someone's back. Like again, when I was at Tavis, and I had to get out there and meet with those publicists and say, "Hey, I'm doing a music segment, and I want to bring musicians to this show." Um I had to do my due diligence. I couldn't just be like, "Hey, give me, uh you know, Jay-Z, and I won't take any of the other clients." You know what I mean? Uh you It was tit for tat. Obviously, you you couldn't compromise with the show was, but you had to I mean, it went a long way. It showed your loyalty to the person that you're networking with. Because if you show that you're supporting their needs and their cause, man, they will die for you, too. It's And it it you know, of course, some people will stab you in the back and and not reciprocate, but I found that if you're genuinely showing that you're loyal to them, and you get that out of the way really quickly by saying like you meet someone and say like, "Hey, let's get together." And one thing that I always did, oh my god, it's like one of my favorite things to do, and it happened on accident the first time. Um my wife has this thing. She always laughs and say says I talk too much. And my son, I I just sometimes I want to just blow my brains out, cuz that kid talks too much. And it drives me insane. My mom's like I'm not my mom, my bro My brother I'm like, "Am I drunk? Am I what?" My wife says, "Where do you think he gets that from?" And like, "Oh my god, and it just would drive me insane. But, so this first meeting I had, I remember one of the first meetings I had, I was out and I met with this publicist and I wanted to see what she could do for the show I was working for. So, we're having this network conversation, but we never really quite got to the meat of the networking. It was mostly me finding out about her cuz I have this crazy curiosity about people. I think it's because I moved around so much. I want to know where someone's from. That's why I always ask people, where are you from? Cuz it kind of defines them. It really does. People act the same in different areas, so to speak. So, I asked that and then I started hearing about it. I was like, oh my god, you're from there, tell me about it or this and that. I used to live there or so on. And at the end of the dinner, we were out of time and she had some place to be and I remember her being like, oh, you didn't even get to talk you didn't tell me about the show or, you know, and and I remember I didn't get to sell my product to her, so to speak. I was like, no, that's fine. I'm glad I got to talk with you and got to meet you and and I moved on and I remember she was so excited, sent me an email the next day. It was great to meet you, let's hang out again, that was fun, let's have drinks. I ended up again the next time it was her and another publicist and we hit it off again and I was like, oh my god. And it just made me realize you don't have to be selling the product every time you're networking. Take advantage of the networking and be on a level person-to-person. And it was like the one of the biggest lessons and that became a tactic. I will admit I became tactical when it came to that. I turned that into a tactic. I was like, oh, yeah, let's get together and I, you know, let's just talk shop and then I'd be like, so, tell me about yourself. And suddenly like we hit it off, but it's and I it wasn't just a tactic. I honestly did want to get to know you actually engage and you be sincere and authentic and all that stuff, but I don't think there's anything wrong with that being also a tactic as long as the way you engage in it isn't gross. And so, that to me is really smart because that's a classic example of playing the long game, right? So, never go for the sale, always go for for referral. And if you treat them well, and you actually care about what's going on, like it's going to come back. You know what I mean? Like this is one thing that I love about humans is just when you take them on average, not any of any individual, but when you take them on average, they're very predictable. So, if you want to be interesting, be interested, right? So, just asking about her, finding out which I made that up. But yeah, if you want to be interesting, be interested. Ask them a lot of questions. Really engage. Actually, like people love to talk about themselves. And look, I'm more guilty than most people. I mean, they have I'm literally on here for 24 hours. Like, "Hey, hey, hey, let me tell you all about me." People love to talk about themselves, and it's it's just a trait. And so, when you can go, "Look, this isn't going to pay off for me tonight, but if I do this over 100 people, and if 40 of them end up becoming something because I put in that work, 5 years from now, I'm unstoppable." And that's why And I think one of the reasons that sometimes people think that I have hubris when I say that we're going to build a studio bigger than Disney is because they think I think it's going to happen in 10 years. It's not going to happen in 10 years, right? So, thankfully, it's not going to be binary. We're going to make progress every day, and we're going to be doing stuff and building momentum and all that. But I mean, this is a 50-60 year endeavor. And when you can think along those lines, when you can think about, "Okay, this is you're really starting something grand." You have to be able to execute in the short term, but if your plans are to go all out I mean, think about what we can do, man. Like imagine for a second that we become the YouTube of like companies, and we just stick together. And this isn't like the the average right now for millennials is 1.8 years. They spend 1.8 years at any one company, and then they move on. So, the the way that you have to like retrain, and you lose all that historical knowledge and all that is just really, really a travesty in terms of creating efficiencies and trust and moving fast. So, U2 said we were never going to go solo, right? So, for sure Bono could have gone solo, maybe The Edge could have gone solo, but they didn't and they said specifically our career is about finding out what happens when this group of people stays together forever, through thick and thin. And now, how long I'm 30 years? I mean, it's It's been longer than that. Crazy. Yeah, cuz I mean, they were like playing the roller rink in Van Nuys like even before they hit it big cuz one of my friends used to kind of manage them. Really? Our manager maybe the roller rink and they would always play this roller rink in Van Nuys. Like, what? Like, in the It was like '81 or something like that. It was crazy. Oh. Something very early. I'm I'm I'm probably getting the date wrong, but yeah. But they they've been around for a very very long time. So, when you see them stay together for that long through thick and thin. I mean, they're just they'll be one of the bands that are remembered forever. And so, you know, I think about that and I think about what does this look like if we can really be long-term, right? Which is one of the reasons Lisa are so committed. Not only equity, but if we never sell, that's not important. What becomes important though is enriching people through profits and making sure that you guys are incentivized like that, which is [ __ ] fascinating to me because cash flow is the exciting thing, right? When it's I remember there was a time where I was very wealthy on paper, but I was like, "What does that [ __ ] matter, right?" Like, until you're able to liquidate some of it, it literally is meaningless. And thankfully, I'm so dumb when it comes to that stuff that in in some of the things, I see straight to the truth because I'm I am literally too undereducated to get lost in the trappings. So, I remember thinking being rich on paper isn't anything. Like, until you sell it, it's totally meaningless, right? I remember thinking that like these before they IPO, they're actually broke, right? So, I was like, "No, no, no. Like, they're so wealthy on paper." I'm like, "I didn't spend so wealthy at the grocery store." And let me tell you that that is the truth. So, you know, really like looking at how we can enrich people, how we can keep this team moving together as a collective to see what we can really do over the long run. That to me is very interesting. Um, is that flashing to to do this? Oh, do we need to wrap? What? Has it been an hour? Put wrap. Oh, sorry. I didn't I just The screen says, in my defense, it's got like a headline and then it says tease grand prize again. So, I just kept looking at tease grand prize. I apologize. Totally my bad. Uh, so, wrap segment. Thank you for the flashing light. Which by the way, I'm not This is so cool. Look. Look. Look. Look. Like, it's like everyone gathering around the campfire as it's gotten darker and darker out there. Like, everyone's moving closer and closer. It's it's so cool. Um, but don't don't be afraid also just to to speak up. Like, I'm not tense about that at all. So, if if I'm not seeing something, flashing the red lights also great, wiggling the the mouse, all that stuff really helps. Um, and I was specifically not asking questions, by the way, just cuz I wanted Dr. Finesse to be able to get in his flow. Um, So, all right. Sadly, we're out of time. Dude, the Every time I get you on camera, I'm super stoked. This is always a lot a lot of fun. exciting to me. So, thank you for sharing us that. Giveaway, uh, the giveaway winners are Caitlyn Skisco Skisco-ee. Wow. Okay, we're getting we're getting in the later hours here. Uh, Noah Bell, Andrea Zacharias, Brady Pureyear, Abraham Rivera. All right, so those are the people that won Captivate. Pick it up. Pick it up. Pick it up. And to Dr. Finesse, once again, thank you, my friend. Always a pleasure.