Lawrence Jackson Jr. Talks Fantasy Football, NBC, Matthew Berry

the perception of fantasy football. It could be seen as you don't see the players as human. Don't feel like this player suck just because you ain't hit your little weak ass parlay. >> More and more people are trying to watch the game for fantasy and betting. >> Fantasy betting is the great gift [music] and curse of it all. Really, the first articles I started writing that was published to the public was at NBC Sports. Barry had seen me on Roto World while he still was at ESPN and he sent me a DM. Is that like the moment in your career that you realized, man, I made it? Nah, I don't feel like I made it still. >> Well, I'm excited about this one. Uh, this is someone that I've been wanting to bring on for a very long time. Uh, Lawrence Jackson Jr. >> at Lord Don't Lose. >> Yes, sir. >> Uh, an Atlanta native. We were actually out here in Atlantic Station, >> Lake Co. Clayton County to be exact. Yeah, man. Yeah. >> Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So, South Atlanta, we got East Atlanta right here. >> Right on. >> Uh, and we're actually here in Thank you for opening up your Airbnb. >> Yeah. No doubt. >> And, uh, Atlantic Station. You know what's funny is Atlantic Station a few years ago, I had to for a gig, like film something. >> Mhm. >> And they were like I asked them, "Oh, where's it at?" They said, "Atlantic Station." >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And I was like, "Where?" And they were confused when I was asking where. >> It's confusing. It could be that way. >> But like I don't understand why they were thinking like >> we couldn't even get the damn key. >> But am I sitting am I standing in the middle of the lawn? Like where like am I going to the like the freaking it was ended up being where they had like the circus and everything >> right. Right. >> Set up. But um no cool spot. But we just wanted to get to know you. That that's really it. So, um, tell me a little bit about your upbringing, uh, growing up in Atlanta. How did you get into content creation? >> Oh, well, shoot, man. It is growing up as a kid, I didn't really think about it at all cuz back then, it wasn't a thing like that. We talking about the early 2000s here. So, you know, basically for me, man, just growing up playing sports, uh, kicking it with my folks, man. And that was really it, man. Sports is life. Whether you know we growing up playing football, basketball, some catch played baseball, you know. Um that was our thing, man. Young boys, we like sports and girls just like mostly anybody else, man. >> Yes, sir. Amen. Um and so then I kind of re read up a little bit about you, but there's not a lot of info. >> Yeah, that that might be by design, but it's also cuz I ain't really like known like that like that, you know? But yeah, >> I was going to say like I need to get tips from you. Like I I would love to just be like not well known. Like I would but like with the nature of the job, >> it's really fun to be able to do some of the things that I get to do and not be well known. Like you know, I can just walk down the street. I'm really just the regular Joemo that got a job that I think is cool, you know, and I just roll along like that. >> That's great. Yeah. We're just like well known in our little world online but like on the street. No, I love it. I love not getting recognized sometimes. >> I got recognized once >> but it was a great feeling but I I would love to stay low profile but >> uh you also trying to do research on you. You played football as well. >> Indeed. >> And how far did you get in in your playing days? >> Yeah. So uh I I played college four years. um you know little D2 school in North Carolina. Um so I did that. Got a lot of experience there. That's really where I really learned the game of football. You know, you learn to watch film just watching the opponent. Um you learn the offenses, the defenses cuz obviously you watch the opposition. um you learn the drills, learn a practice, learn really what it take to just kind of work as young adult men together because it a lot of that stuff kind of set you up for the real world. So, I'm really happy to, you know, have experience playing college football cuz not a lot of or college sports in general, there's not a lot of um student athletes who go on to play in college. It's a real small experience, but I would definitely tell like any young athlete coming up that if you have the opportunity to do so, I don't care you like you ain't got to be FBSD1. It could be D3. You get almost the same experience cuz it's about, you know, learning some discipline, the camaraderie, and kind of helping you go into the real world. So, I would definitely recommend it if it's possible for you. And uh you have that football experience so you can talk about content and football. Yeah. >> Ryan Clark. >> So don't come at him. >> Yeah. >> So that experience and like you were saying it just builds it builds young men to be the people that they are. >> Yeah. >> Um how have you taken that and shifted into content creation? Like what values, what morals uh even like the knowledge of football like how have you taken that into content creation? Yeah, definitely. I I definitely I think it come naturally in my lingo, right? Um because I'm in heavy in the fantasy football and betting world. That's what I uh do now, right? But a lot of the times uh a lot of fantasy football content creators, they have certain words that they use that it just simply doesn't apply to me. And that's not to say that they shouldn't or or can't use that. It just doesn't apply to me. So, I find that as an opportunity to differentiate myself. Um, you know, uh, if somebody if there's a player right now that unfortunately gets hurt, you know, training camp, injuries going to happen, you're going to get the next player on the depth chart in a rocket emoji to the moon. That's just not my lingo. That's just not how I personally talk about football. >> Not to say it's bad or that I'm against it. I'm just happy that's not me because it just gives me an opportunity to be organically and naturally different in how I explain the game. >> I'm so glad you brought that up because I kind of cringe when I see that. And again, I'm not judging anybody. Um, I get like sure, uh, Zack Sharp is hurt right now, so Judeian Price to the moon, whatever. But yeah, that's not my style and I actually respect that coming from a fantasy football guy. Yeah. >> Um, >> and when I made I actually used to make fantasy football content >> and >> why you sty my gosh, it was a couple things. The main thing I will say, so the main thing was I was getting building relationships with players and coaches and agents and unfortunately the fantasy community, the fantasy world, a lot of people within the NFL, they don't really I don't want to say they disrespect it. >> Um, but they just aren't really fond of it. So if I wanted to >> Yeah. Because it look the the reality is the perception of fantasy football like it could be seen as you don't see the players as human like you just see them as numbers like a man did he get my points. I um you know shout out to Kendrick Bourne who really one of the best NFL personalities. He one of the first people I interviewed I think it was back 2024 uh radio row and uh I remember I knew he was coming off of ACL and as I'm walking up to him before we go on the set I see the scar on his knee so I just was like damn man how your knee doing you know what I'm saying and it was just I just wanted to know cuz you know that [ __ ] hurts right >> so and then he was like hey man you know I appreciate you saying that and then we went on had a great interview and it was fun and and I just think the fantasy football when you talk they're always about a man this guy got hurt well what is the next guy that so I think it's like it's seen is that like people like the real football people don't see them as actual humans in some cases that could unfortunately be that way for some of these folks >> yeah it's um they they kind of just look down on it cuz you got people in their DMs saying, "Hey, well, thank you for costing me my week four matchup because you broke my crazy right there." That's crazy. >> And so, >> but them them people that do that, >> them not really your your fantasy football creators, that's worth a damn. Those people that's in the players DM is the them the lowest of the lowife folks out there. them them folks that they too scared to put their own picture on their profile like th those are the the coward folks of the world. You know what I'm saying? But they out there. >> Yeah. Which actually leads me to the second reason why I moved on from fantasy content was one I wanted to be respected more. And I'm so glad I did that. >> Um but also the second reason was just just so much negativity man. It's like >> I I don't know. I got treated like in the comments like I was a salesperson >> and like, "Hey, answer my question. Who do I start?" >> You just don't answer. >> It' be the stupidest questions, too. It'd be like, >> uh, pick two. CD Lamb, Justin Jefferson, uh, Malik Washington. It's like, dude, I >> Well, well, I will say this. I always say because there's I always say in fantasy it's no stupid questions because there could be somebody who doesn't they really don't know >> it's fair >> like you might get the beginner that's like just trying it out and to be honest those are a lot of the people that I want to reach like those those guys and gals who are beginning in fantasy football. So there is a small percentage some people like to mess with you but it is a percentage of people and I had to learn that early too like you know um on fantasy football happy hour we would get all type of questions like the most >> I'm talking about like he'd be like choose one and then it's eight guys. Yeah. >> You know what I'm saying? But then there's the next one and it's just like you you got to you treat them all the same and be grateful that people even think enough of you to ask you that question which I am grateful for stuff like that. >> Well, there are those I would say 10 to 20% that probably don't know a lot about fantasy. Like they just oh this is my first time playing someone at work just invited me whatever. I'm just watching content just to get ideas. But 80% of the time I feel like it essentially being a fantasy content creator. The way I saw it was it was therapy for people because it's like you know who you're going to start. You know who's >> Yeah. You want that peace of mind. Exactly. >> You just want that peace of mind, you know? >> Dude, you can make bank just from doing that. Just from like we already know who's good. But yeah, let me just reassure you. Let let me make you feel good. Yeah, >> I made a lot of money from it, dude. I miss that money. But >> get it back. >> Uh I don't know. I'm in a much better spot now. But, um, I love fantasy football. I love playing it. And we were talking off air how I just play in one. You know, we were talking about how people like Matthew Barry, which we'll talk about here in just a second, uh, plays in like 30 something leagues and it's like I can't keep up with all that. But, um, no, I still love fantasy and I, um, I make content that appeals to fantasy football people. So, for instance, right now I'm projecting to all 32 teams. I'm doing stat projections and so like from that that also helps me in like my personal league of like oh yeah this player he's actually going to end up doing really well and like the fantasy audience sees that it's like okay yeah he's going to score a lot of touchdowns this year or whatever >> but with Matthew Barry also comes NBC for sure >> and so I wanted to get into that portion about your career. >> How did you get discovered by NBC or does it is it something that you reached out to NBC? Yeah. So, um, in 2021 they was hiring for like a full-time fantasy football creator position in 2021. I ain't get it. Um, but >> who ended up getting it, do you know? >> Uh, it was my former colleague Pat Karine. Shout out to him. He won the best ball joint a few years back. He got that 2 million and then he went and started his own thing. Um, but they said, "You know what though, man? You doing something different. Can you come on and do like maybe some freelance writing and we want you to we want to use your videos?" And I was like, "Yeah." At the time, I was still working uh my regular job. So, the whole 2021 season, uh, I did that on on a part-time basis. But at that time when I got that position, I was like so happy to even be doing it just part-time freelance. I wrote like one article per week. Like the ve the first really the first articles I started writing that was published to the public was at NBC Sports, which is crazy. Um, you know, uh, again, a lot of folks don't really get that opportunity to just jump out there first like that. The 2021 season ends and then 2022 roll around and uh, John Deel, who used to be on the Roto World squad, he left. So, it was another opening. This time I got it. So now I'm with the Roto Pat and Denny and them Kyle Devor Pat Karraine in the meantime 2021 Barry had seen me on Roto World while he still was at ESPN and he sent me a DM. So I knew him before he was at NBC. >> Oh wow. So, I start doing a little bit of content for Fantasy Live and Road at the same time. Like week six of the 2022 season was first time I was on uh was on happy hour and be prior to that, like the week before, him and I had did a social video. We acted like wrestlers or we got two belts and we was like, "Do you get Kyle pissed the ball?" Tight and [ __ ] like that. Um, and so I think that helped me because I was like, "Oh, we see you could be uh we see you have some chemistry with him." And so then, you know, I did 15minute segments to start out and then that over time turned into like full shows and I became a full member of the pregame show that we did for the past few years. Um, and that was that was a great fun show. We got to do it on the road sometimes. So, that's kind of how all that came together. >> Happy hour though, uh, with NBC. Connor Rogers, great guy. Had a chance to meet him at the combine. >> Yeah. >> You're building this chemistry with a lot of people. Um, is that like the moment in your career that you realized, man, I made it? >> Nah, I don't feel like I made it still. Uh, I'm still going, man. like it's it was it's a great opportunity especially like you said to get on with people like Connor Rogers and Jake Croucher as well is Matthew Barry. Uh but uh no man it's you know it's I think it's a it's a great moment for for me and a great opportunity it it was to start that to start doing that. I think it's more so it told me like, oh yeah, you could you could do this and if you could get to this point, ain't no telling where you could go. You know, if you're if you're um you know, if you're doing shows on the on the Dallas Cowboys football field, you know, if you could get to this point, then where else could you go? That's kind of more how I see it. >> I love that mentality. Uh that's amazing. when it comes to making rankings for fantasy football like for fantasy football happy hour. I know that Matthew Barry is always on there. He's like, "Yeah, he's my tight end three. This guy's my wide receiver 23, whatever." How what what is the process of making those rankings? Because I know that like a lot of content creators that aren't like more professional or don't do this full-time, don't have the time. They just take other people's rankings and they're like, "You know what? I actually like Puka Nua more than Jamarce. So, let me just move them up. And like they just kind of steal. It's kind of like like a mock draft. >> They they just Yeah. They take the the consensus and just shift a few to make it their own. >> Exactly. Yeah. So, like that. And you see all these rankings and because they only shift like people up a couple of spots here and there, all of them seem like they're the same. There's not like one guy that you're like, "Oh my gosh." Uh, like for instance, for me, 2021 when I was making content, um, I had the time and I would make rankings based off of like just doing research and stats and I was like, there's no way Jamar Chase is not like a top 10 wide receiver. This is his rookie season. Why is he ranked so low? And so, like, he was being drafted in the seventh round, but I was like, dude, I think he's like a second or third rounder. And so, I don't care what anybody else says. What's the process with you making rankings or Matthew Barry or whoever else? Like, do you do that? >> If we're talking if if we talking weekly, well, see, that's the thing. Most guys and gals, you're going to research the stats. You're going to research the trends, and that's good. You should, right? But, um, how is a defense going to cover this specific receiver? How are they going to defend this specific offense? Are they going to change their look? cuz offenses and defenses do different things every single week. Like they're learning new things every single week for a different opponent. So, a lot of times you don't even you don't there's certain instances where you don't need to look at no numbers. You look at the matchups and it's easy to say, "Oh, well, this receiver is going to go against Pat Certan this week." you know, you should be a little worried. Any cornerback could get got, you know, uh that's not going to make me not or make me think about not starting my receiver, right? But there are certain matchups at every level, first, second, and on the back end that you think about. So, I think about that stuff. Um, I think about um just how has that player been playing and how has that defensive front been playing? How how have those linebackers like does that does that front seven have good chemistry uh you know recently? Can is this the type of opponent they could bounce back uh against despite how they've looked? you know, because you win, you know, because you win 10 games in a row don't mean you going to win 11. You know, stuff like that. Um, you know, if you know certain court, now this is something similar that I would do with with another fantasy analyst. If I know two are going to arrowhead, you know, in January, it's just the facts now. You know, they're going to they going to keep it short, right? It's going to be frigid. We know KC KC Divas could play tough in that type of weather, especially at home. You got a tempered expectations for Dolphins players. Well, former Dolphins players in that sense. So, those are the type of things I would that I would consider. And I will say instead of me bringing up right now something that I a a a call that I succeeded on, I'll tell you one that I didn't succeed on 2024. Anthony Richardson quarterback one and you didn't have you don't have nobody that had him quarterback one. You might have had people that was oh he QB6. They we all felt like he was gonna do something. But the reason I put him at quarterback one because he's a more explosive person in Shane Stiken's offense. But there's other things I didn't take into account that I couldn't see. I didn't know how he was what his approach to the game was at that point in his young NFL career. By the way, I still don't think Anthony Richardson is done. Let me just put that out there. But at that current time, like his his approach and preparation is something I can't see. What I could see was his potential on the field and how easy and seamlessly it was for him to just operate in that read option type of stuff. You know, that's why a lot of people projected him to be a top 10 fantasy quarterback at worst. But I feel like, oh no, more explosive than Jaylen Herz in this offense. He's got the running back. Um, he's going to be heavily dependent upon near the goal line. But in whatever the case, it didn't work out. It was wrong. But that was my process to why I had him there. If I think you can ball, then I'm going to put you there. >> I love that. I I love that mentality of like I don't care what anybody says. Um, but hey, Anthony Richardson, if is he done or not? I don't know. It just depends on if he goes to the LA Rams and stuff. >> I hope he ain't done cuz my man right there, Marlin, got him in our dynasty league. >> Anthony Richardson. >> Man, [laughter] it's your time will come. Your time will come. I still have faith. But that that's awesome that you have that mentality of like >> Yeah. taking in account like, oh, the Dolphins and cold weather, taking in account, uh, how is this player going to match up with the defense and um, things of that nature. A lot of fantasy creators though, they're kind of like in their bubble and they don't really think outside of the box and look at the whole game and perspective. Think of like the perspective of like what is a coach thinking? What is a player thinking? Like how do we utilize certain personnel and use that to our advantage and predicting who's going to go off in fantasy? So, if you had to give any sort of advice of like of to those young fantasy content creators that kind of just like look at the numbers, you know, they just go to profreerence.com and they just see like, oh yeah, you know, he's on pace, 17game pace. Uh then like what how would you what kind of advice would you give to those guys? >> I would say tap in with your local high school football coach. them really the people who be like in most cases they be they be knowing the football for real if you can do that if you have that access if not then uh you know it I I was ask for help and keep on trying to learn and and just um don't feel like you got it all figured out. You may not you may not feel like you know it all but if people think you think like that then you know it's going to be tough for you like that. Uh I I still um be trying to learn today whether it's doing social media stuff uh whether it's um how to be better on air and doing I I will ask people who have better experience than me in that arena. Right? So when it come to football, ask somebody who have better experience than you in that arena. Uh one of the trends, one of the reasons why I kind of step away from fantasy football was um this was 2022 was like my last season. I saw a trend happening of more and more people were trying to watch the game for fantasy and betting >> and that kind of diminishes. >> Definitely. Yeah. It didn't change the game. It it is it's the fantasy and betting. Well, I'll say fantasy f whatever fantasy betting is the great gift and curse of it all because it does bring a lot of eyes to football. Some people know about the sport of football because of fantasy football. That's just the reality of it. Um, but you know, you just got to know at the end of the day who playing and why you really there >> like why you so you back in the day we just used to watch football and cheer for teams and players and just there there was nothing at stake for it there. Now a lot of people feel like you got to have something on the game to um en enjoy the game. So to those people, I would say, why don't you go 3 weeks w without without any plays on the game and see what you think and see if you can see things differently, you know? Uh don't feel like this player suck just cuz you ain't hit your little weak ass parlay, you know? Don't you know like, oh man, uh Devon A this [ __ ] guy, he's too small. He ain't every just because he didn't run for 100 yards that game. Oh, now he's small now. Like but but he but didn't he just run for300 yards a year ago. Right. So people really come like they'll come they'll get on their little social media. This guy sucks. No you just didn't hit your your five leg parlay that was plus [ __ ] 1300. It wasn't going to hit anyway. >> Like you ain't getting rich off this man. Like play it for the fun. Like have some fun with it. Like you you like they always say gamble responsibly. Like we have the term in betting called sweat the sweat. Sweating it out. Like you should not literally be sweating about losing your money in in a bet, man. Just do it the right way. >> Yeah. I wanted to uh pitch something to you or see if you have teetered with it at all. Um what is your thoughts on standard deviation and using that and fantasy football? Do you know what that is? >> No, I I actually thought you was about to bring up prediction markers, but go ahead. >> Oh, like koshi and whatever is Oh gosh, I don't I don't know anything about that, but that just looks >> I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong. Yeah, >> maybe it's great. Um >> yeah, go ahead. >> But standard deviation, so back in 2019, I had a league um where I went like six and eight or something. >> Um but I was third in points. >> You talking about all play? Yeah. Set that up. It should be that. Yeah. Yeah. What what's what's that? >> Are you going the route of saying like I was six and eight, but I was third in points. I I feel like I should have been the playoffs and you should have. >> So to that they say, "Well, too bad. Tough luck. That's fantasy." Whatever. And like I know there's like playing against the median. Um so you get like two wins if you're like top half in points. >> But there's also um I I'm not even arguing that, but like in 2019 when that happened to me, I was like, you know what? Why did that happen? And it was because uh one of my big hits was Aaron Jones. I had drafted him and he was like RB2 that year. And it was great, but he also had games where he would only score two points and that would cost me my week. And I was like, I'm tired of that. I'm tired of like the inconsistency. So, let me try to figure out a way to get the good players, but also the consistent players on a week-to-eek basis. And since I've done that, I've like made the fantasy playoffs every single year uh when I create my rankings. So, I don't know if you had like there's nothing out there that really talks about standard deviation or shows how consistent a player is. Um, like for instance, if a player's been playing with like this coach for like the last two years, you think the last two years, how >> consistent? >> I would say the thing about a player like Aaron Jones, um, you should probably not be shocked that some of those poor fantasy outings came because he's never he's rarely been a guy that you give the 20 three touches in a game. Jir Gibbs on the other hand last year had days where from a football standpoint he was completely shut down but because he caught seven passes for 32 yards it gives you an unbelievable floor in that situation and you know that going in with a player um with with a player like him you know he's going to get to a certain amount of touches whereas to a guy like Aaron Jones even in his best A 18 touches might have been and that's just depending on how the game goes, >> but then he could take 12 touches and give you 30 points cuz he had to break away speed. That's what I would say to that. >> Okay. Yeah. And I mean it was fair because there was times that they would like switch in and out with Jamal Williams, >> right? >> Uh to kind of handle handle in certain situations. But yeah, I've always been a component of that low though to try to see like who's consistent, who's not. Um, and just try to play at the perspective like when I'm drafting, draft for like the year long and then like when it comes to like weekby-eek matchup, I'll figure that out. You >> figure it out. >> Um, but like I don't know, I' it's really helped me out and it's something like when I was doing fantasy football content that I've introduced to my audience and they really loved it, but there's not like really anything out there that says like, "Oh, this guy's like the most consistent." So >> yeah, >> maybe there should be, but >> um no, your your point of the touches makes a lot of sense. Um we could wrap up here and with a couple of questions. What I wanted to ask you is you're a fantasy football guy. The 2026 season is coming up. >> So I mean just hit us with your Matthew Barry Rider guys like who are some players that we got that are going to take off? >> My my first one going to be Devonte Smith. I always thought he was the like a uh talent-wise like a top 10 guy. I think he'll finally get that opportunity to show that. Um he showed it as a rookie before they had AJ Brown when he went out there and all they had behind him was Quz Watkins like Jaylen Rager. He went out there got 900 yards as a rookie. Um I think he's a 1500 yard type of receiver. Um I'm trying to get him in every draft right now. He's still going in the third round. Um I don't think by this time next year he'll be going at that time. Uh we we'll see there. Uh you know, sticking with the Eagles, I'm bringing it like I'm circling back with Seaquan again. Um I think he's dropped back into the second round, which is where he which is where he was going the year he got the 2,000 yards in the year I championed him. Um he he was actually getting some washed allegations coming to Philly. There was some people that might have thought he was uh getting W. But anyh who, I think this year he gets something in between what he did last year and that record season that he had in 2024. He'll get in the middle of that. And uh we going later round or mid rounds. I like Jadarian Price, Kenneth Gainwell who caught 73 passes last year and he was and he was splitting time. If you want to go way deeper in drafts, I'm getting the rookie uh uh Ted Hurst, the wide receiver out of Georgia State right around here. He's the closest thing on that roster to Mike Evans except he's more explosive and as rookies better run after the catch. Um he'll get the ball at high point by any means necessary. Can make the acrobatic catches, stuff like that. And so I'm getting him like last few picks of the draft. >> I love that. To wrap it up, tell me your future goals. Like what do you what do you want to accomplish and how do you want to get there? uh do what I do now at a uh bigger level, at a bigger and broader level, and just uh keep on getting after it, man. I I want to get more eyes, more ears, just like the next man, you know, uh to just spread the real, you know, football gospel and yet have fun with it when we do this fantasy stuff, man. >> That's it. Short and sweet. Love it. Well, Lawrence, appreciate the time, man. Best of luck. >> No doubt.