Kevin O'Leary's Shocking Prediction For The Stock Market, Housing Prices, & 2026 Economy

Every story has a hero and has a bad guy. >> I want to be the bad guy. >> You're an Get the out of here. >> You're going to spew at me. That's going to cost you something. >> So what? This is business. Life is hard. Then you die. Get over it. >> Some people just go crazy uh when they hear the truth. And [music] I don't care. What really motivates everybody at the end of the day is money. What's an investment that everyone loves right now that you think is going to collapse? It's never the [music] one you think. I'm breaking a little news here. Something's going to go down 80%. Because of AI disruption. >> Will AI replace more jobs [music] than it creates? >> No. We just don't know what the transition is going to look like. AI is going to be such a powerful tool. It'll create new industries we haven't even thought of. >> When do you think the [music] next recession is going to hit and what do you think is going to cause that? >> It's not going to end well. It will destroy the fabric [music] of the economy. >> [music] >> Kevin Olirri, thank you so much for coming on the iced coffee hour. >> Well, I always enjoyed it. >> Really appreciate it. I want to get your reaction to this clip that just recently went viral and I want to know what was going on. >> My goodness. >> All right, Kevin, a quick last word. >> Oh, wow. >> Which last word is you're all nuts. Like that's just >> Oh my god. Thank you, Kevin. That's on that. >> I look, we we got to keep it together here, okay? Honestly, I mean, there's there's a way to talk about these things. If you don't have anything to say, just say that and I won't come to you next time. >> You know, you just said something very important in your own words, which was, "You're all nuts." >> So, I, you know, Abby and I have had a long relationship. Um, and she is actually very successful right now on CNN. I believe she has the fastest growing numbers on that platform. Um, and I think CNN has also determined through its producers that they will garner a larger audience if it's a real debate. In other words, instead of just taking one side or the other, um, which there was a time in media where that outlet was left, that outlet was right. But that's not what advertisers want. They don't want to baffricate the market in 50/50. They want every customer regardless of what their politics are. And so what I've learned, and I think I'm the only guy doing this, I go to every outlet. I go to all of them and I stick with policy, not politics. I don't show for politicians. I show for policy that I think is good or policy that I think is bad. And I have an opinion about that. I'm I'm a columnist. I'm not a journalist. And so in the case of that narrative, we were debating the performance of um I think it was Munich and it was AOC talking about policy in Munich and she clearly was not prepared and so she she did not have a good outcome uh in terms of the global press and we were talking about that and they seemed to want to say well that was okay. she just had a a brain fart or something um or whatever they were calling it. And I said, and they were trying to compare it to uh Trump. I said, "This has nothing to do with Trump. Trump wasn't there. This is a poor performance by AOC." Now, let's draw this analogy. If I get hired to go speak to an audience, which I do, I want to know who's in the audience. I want to know exactly what the narrative is going to be, and I want to prep I want to be prepared. I want to know my stuff. you know, before I get out there because I'm going to you're going to get fried if you don't know what you're talking about. And that's what happened to her. She didn't know what she was talking about and basically um didn't prepare and she so I say, "Look, she failed." And I to me that was factual and it caused a big debate. >> So why do you think it went so viral calling a CNN panel nuts? >> I thought it was a humorous moment. There was only 15 seconds left to the show and they were so >> Do you actually think they're nuts? >> Or do you think that they like >> that moment was a temporary moment of insanity for them? They just couldn't deal with the fact >> that I was not going to stop telling the truth. She failed on her mandate. She did a poor job as a speaker that day. And that is true. She was terrible. And somehow if you don't tell the truth, how is she expecting to get better? She failed. She got an F minus. She'll never do that again. I mean, everybody on earth watched her do ver word salad for 30 seconds. >> So, do you think that the CNN panel actually believe what they're saying? Like, oh, she just had a brain fart. Like, it wasn't anything that's reflective of her actual intelligence or knowledge on what's going on. Or do you think that they're being fed information and they're like, okay, well, this is just the narrative that we have to purport. You know, it's imagine this. You're into a vicious discussion, a really high uh energy discussion, and then we go to commercial break around the table. >> We should have an ad right here because that actually is what happens. and tempers are are high and people are mad and they're you know I've been doing this a long time and I learned long long ago you know when when you're on a doing live television and you're you're having a political narrative or debate there's a moment of of three minutes where all of a sudden just like the three of us sitting here it stops and >> and I always say well how about those Yankees like you know what else are you going to do because everybody's upset Um the the good news I think is in the end people want to see both sides. How it's presented to them is a matter of style and the show's producers and everything else. But Abby Phillips show is doing very well and I'd like to think I'm a contributor to it, you know, and I and and for me I don't want to go and sit at 10:00 at night and be bored to death. >> I want to have some fun. And boy, we have fun on that show because if you're a left-winger that's is not willing to deal with numbers, for example, we had a debate about the economy and and I'm sitting there, you're going to have a problem cuz I I know my numbers. I have facts. I deal with them. I know exactly where we sit on the S&P and the Dow and and where we're at in terms of cash flow, you know, per quarter and all that. And and you're going to spew at me. That's going to cost you something. What are the most astonishing facts on the economy right now? >> The resilience it has. Um, as we have major forces at play, I'll give you two major forces. Obviously, tariffs >> most people thought would be highly inflationary. That hasn't proved out to be the case. There is some increase in input costs. They need to be fine-tuned. But the impact of AI was underestimated as a productivity tool. Look, look at what happened with Square just the last 24 hours. And look how much the stock has gone up as a result of cutting the workforce by 40%. So there you have the good, bad, and the ugly in that thing. But AI is turning out to be a massive productivity tool for margin enhancement, increased cash flow and productivity all at the same time. Not just in one sector, in all 11 sectors of the economy. All 11 sectors use AI today. And 24 months ago, you would have said that's hype. And I can give you examples in my own portfolio of companies of which every single one is using an AI tool, paying for it, renting it, whatever they're doing, and how they're using it and how it's enhanced cash flow in the last 6 months. What do you think about Sam Alman saying that a lot of the layoffs are simply AI washing and that these companies are using AI as an excuse to fire people because they've might have overhired or spending too much money or maybe their financials just aren't good so they blame AI. >> Yeah, I think there's a lot of that going on. Um but the offset and I mean just look at let's use an example just a very this is two simple examples that everybody's going to understand that wasn't happening 18 months ago is happening now let's take the insurance industry make it easy the watch insurance industry I'm involved I have a company called Wondercare that insures watches so somebody goes online says I want to insure this Rolex Daytona it would take up to two weeks to write a policy you'd have to go do research you know actuarial data, how old, what zip code are they in, how much fraud is in that state, what are the laws of that state. We can issue that policy now in 9 seconds through data scraping. So the productivity is insane in terms of what and what's it what's it done for margin enhancement. How about this one? You own a large box retailer. Each year for your insurance, you have to send a guy up on a ladder or or a Wendy's or McDonald's. The same for any commercial building, no matter where it is in any state, you have to inspect the roof for leaks and all of the airvac, all all the HVAC system, everything. >> And then if there's any repair required, you have to issue work order and get it repaired in order to maintain your insurance. How about a 6K drone just flies over it in a matter of 30 minutes, compares that image from the one it took last year down to a 6K resolution and sends it to a satellite and before anybody even stops flying the drone, issues the work order for repair. Nobody gets up a ladder. The only person that went there, it's a company called Fly Guys. We own a piece of it. They just fly drones and it's all done with AI. So, you fly a guy out in his Ford 150 to that McDonald's above the the top, it's over. That's it. Nobody goes up on a ladder in the summer or the winter or gets injured. That's AI. So, you've said before that someone making $65,000 a year could become a millionaire. Yeah. >> Could you walk us through that math? And is there an income level where it's just mathematically impossible with living expenses that you just can't do it? >> Not if you're 65. It's when you're when you get to 65. The way it works is, and we don't have the discipline, and I'm going to walk you down a lesson that I learned over the last six years on this. Remember when fintech was smoking hot and everybody's bringing apps to the market to help you trade stocks, buy bonds, >> buy derivatives, buy options? It was all done on your phone. And everybody thought, well, this is going to make it just democratic. Everybody out there is going to be able to be like a multi-million dollar investor because they got the tools for nothing. None of that worked. None of it. And we I was developing something like that. We started with a version of bean stocks. I'm promoting something I invested in and it never worked because people actually don't know how to read a stock chart or what candles are or what 200 day averages are or any of that stuff. What they really wanted, it turned out, was the ability to push a button in one transaction and put 60% of it into stocks and 40% of it into bonds. That's it. That's it. and the and the smarter we made the app in terms of simplicity it when it got so simple that that's what you could do and that's what Beantocks does today then it took off because the only decision you have to make in your life is what is the discipline each week you have to take your income and what percentage 10 well some people five 10 or 15% are you going to put into the market and never take it out till you're 65. You want to be a millionaire at 65, a million half dollars, take 20% of your salary of $69,000 and put it into the market each week and don't touch it and just watch it on your phone grow. It goes up and down as the market moves, but generally speaking, the market for the last 150 years has given you anywhere from 8 to 12% annualized every [snorts] single year. You don't have to guess or pick stocks. You don't know. You just buy an index. That's what the app does. >> How are you investing your money? >> I only do indices now. I basically say um because I've learned through you know our bean stocks experience. I use uh an Alps product. I I helped design it then we sold it to Alps called um Oshares. So they have an index for S&P, an index for technology, an index for Europe and an index for Asia. I put 40% into the US, 20% into Europe and the rest spread across the other two and I forget about it. How often do you check your portfolio? Uh, every day at 405. It's all I have a huge dashboard, not only my public companies, but all my private investments, too. >> I mean, I have a lot in real estate. I have a lot in um well, in collectibles, you know, I've gone into we've have in in my my group uh that we formed, we have over 100 million in cards now. It's been one of my best invest. >> What's the most valuable card you have? Dual logo man Jordan Kobe, you know, I'm going to be walking on the red carpet of uh first SAG after the actors awards on Sunday here, >> but then the Oscars on the 15th >> and I thought, what could I give back to Los Angeles that would be really cool? >> And I came up with this idea. I thought if we could t take the the Jordan Kobe dual logo man, that card we bought last August for $12.93 million. didn't know you bought that. That's I I know I know the card sold for that price. I didn't know it was >> everywhere. Yeah, I saw the press store. But then I thought to myself, >> Paul Logan did something cool with his Pokemon. He hung it on a necklace and he wore it. >> I thought, how can I take Paul's idea and elevate it, turn it to 11? How can I max it out? So, I called up uh my good friends at Tiffany's and I said, "Can we talk to Paris? Let's dream up a necklace made of all diamonds and rubies and I'll wear that at the Oscars because Kobe should be back in LA and nobody knows I'm coming with that. That thing's going to be worth about $25 million. >> I'm only I'm going to have security everywhere. Obviously, brings trucks and everything, but when I get on that red carpet, I'm going to be wearing that thing. It's [clears throat] going to be a mindblower. And it's going to make the necklace that we've designed. I actually am wearing the two watches that we designed it for the classic Daytona rainbow which is rubies and diamonds graded colors. And then of course all ruby diamond AP skeleton. I think I'll be wearing both of those with the card here. Can you imagine the bling? I mean that's >> you're like the rich person final boss. You're like literally like Mr. Burn. This is like a side quest that it's about art. [laughter] >> It's about taking it into wearable art because the Kobe dual logo man is considered by some the supreme card. Yeah. >> In its design. The fact that it has the original jerseys, both logos are perfect. >> I mean, the whole thing and I I've only been able to see that out of the vault >> once because it's faulted. It's insured. But it's coming out on the streets of LA on the red carpet and it's going to be insane. That's going to be insane. >> So, we just had Logan Paul on the podcast. Yeah. And we were talking about the card and I was asking what the Logan Paul premium was for the card and he definitely said his name associated and the story behind it and him showing it adds a level of premium for a buyer because that has a story to it. >> I mean, think about walking the red carpet of the Oscars. We're nominated for nine Academy Awards on Marty Supreme. This is a chance of a lifetime to bring Kobe back into LA in in its flashiest moment, you know. >> So, what's your plan with the card? The starting a business sounds exciting, but the biggest roadblock for a lot of people isn't the idea. It's all the paperwork. Like, everyone says, "Oh, just go and start an LLC." But nobody tells you exactly what's involved and how to do it correctly. And that is exactly what today's sponsor, Busy, is all about. I've personally used them myself and I got to say I was so amazed at just how easy and simple the entire process was. I literally got my LLC set up in less than 10 minutes and just knowing that everything was getting filed properly and done professionally made getting started way less intimidating. Busy's helped over a million people start their business. And what makes them stand out is just how simple they make the entire process. There's no confusing paperwork or endless forms. You just answer a few questions and their team handles the rest so that you could actually focus on growing the business. On top of that, every business formation comes with your first year of a registered agent service included for free. And Busy does not just set you up and then leave. They offer ongoing tools and services to help you actually manage and run your business throughout the year. So, you're supported way long after the initial setup. Don't wait. Make 2026 the year you finally launch your business. Go to busy.com/ic right now. That is b i ze.com with the link down below in the description to get started. busy.comic. >> So what's your plan with the card? So the the card my philosophy we talked earlier about ETFs, right? I like diversification. So if I own Europe, I own 50 stocks. My portfolio is 50 of the largest European stocks in that Oshare. I want to own 50 cards. I don't want to bet the farm on one card. I want the 50iest most valuable cards on earth in one hold that I'm a shareholder in. That's what I want. Because I went back and did the research. Go back to 1958 in modern and contemporary art. Track every single painting. You can do this online now easily. What you're going to find out is 98% of the returns of the modern and contemporary art market came from the top 20 pieces of art, top 20 artists that their rarest pieces. So, a Picasso that you bought for $2,500 in 1962 that trades for 140 million today. Not some other artist, the Picasso. You could, there were thousands of modern artists, but Picasso is the one you wanted. Warhol, there were all kinds of people in New York in the 70s doing what Warhol was doing, but none of those have traded up. >> You got to own the Warhol. You want the MC Jagger, you know? You So that's my philosophy with cards. So I got together with two other guys, Shine, the probably the number one collector on earth. I said, "Shine, go find me every single Picasso and Warhol in every sport." And it it doesn't and what you've learned about the data, it doesn't matter what you pay. It just doesn't matter. You know, whether you pay 8 million or 20 million or 50 million, doesn't matter. If you just let time do its thing, those cards outperform all the rest of that sector if they are peace uniques. So that co the Jordan co you know Kobe logo man that's a piece unique. There's only one of those. So we paid 12 93 million middle of August last year. >> Go to Card Ladder. It's 17.2 million right now. >> It's better than the S&P. >> Have you gotten an offer after purchasing? >> Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We're not selling that car. I'm not selling any cards. Like how am I going to buy them back? They're peace uniques. Like th this is better. It's done way better than crypto, way better, like way better than Bitcoin, way better than the S&P 500. >> So, in terms of your portfolio, then if you were to allocate percentages and how it's invested, what percent would be alternative investments like cards, collectibles, as opposed to index funds, individual stock picks, private companies, real estate, like how how are you currently diversified? >> Yeah, that's actually the secret sauce and and it's the thing about diversity. It's the only free lunch in investing. Very simple rule for me on traditional uh equities and debt. No more than 20% in any one sector. There's 11 sectors in the economy. And no more than 5% in any one stock or bond. So think about you've got 11 sectors. Real estate's the 11th sector in the S&P, the most recent. The only rule I break is real estate. I have about 32% of my portfolio in real estate. >> Is that commercial real estate? >> It No, it's it's a it's a blend. But right now, what's really uh exploding in terms of value for me are the deals I did in um in data centers. I bought 10,200 acres in Alberta, Canada, and last week we announced 10,300 acres in Utah. Both locations have extraordinary attributes in terms of what the hyperscalers need. So I'm really really long real estate right now because if you look at the cash flow in all commercial real estate, there's never been in history this much capex allocated to this sector. This is we we have demand right now for 45 gawatts of data centers and only five under construction. Think about that. So for the next seven years, I want to be long land that has power, fiber, permits, and water. >> So how does it look then in terms of like percentages? Like if some person out there watching with 10K to their name, how are they going to mirror your portfolio >> right now? What's declined the most in the last year? So let's look at where where we sit right now. I would say in on a portfolio basis I'm about 60% um equities globally. >> Is that private public? >> It's Yeah, we're going to make it want simple numbers here. It's private and public. I'm about 5% in alternatives including cards. I used to be 11% in crypto, but I discovered something um quite disturbing I might add. We'll take a little derivative here. So, I'm I'm down, you know, quite a bit on crypto because last October, uh, when the structure genius act passed and the SEC made stable coins legal tender, [snorts] something really crazy happened. The Stability Act, or the Clarity Act, as it was called then, looked like it was going to close by December. So, here we are in October. We're at the Caner conference in October. October 20th was the date I think and the the word on the street was that within six weeks that we were going to get the final act for crypto which was going to be the structure clarity act. So all of the sovereign wealth funds that we index with on the equities started to say okay we're going to do some work on preparing for which positions to put on in crypto. Which ones do we need to own to actually get exposure to the alpha, the volatility of the market? Do we own Bitcoin? Do we own Ethereum? Do we own Salana? Do we own whatever? Whatever. You know, there's there's 10,000 coins. And they independently, without any emotion, because you there's a lot of emotion in the crypto market, a lot of Kryptonians and all that stuff. These guys were just independently saying, "We're going to allocate $500 million into crypto." and their researchers started to go to work. Here's what they found out. You only need to own Bitcoin and Ethereum and you capture 98% of the entire crypto market. You don't need anything else. All the rest is poo poo. So, the poo poo coins collapsed. I mean, it was brutal. Some of them went down 80, 90% and they're never coming back because they're poo poo coins. They have no reason to exist and there's nobody going to save them and they have no marketing money to go get the ticker that Ethereum gets every day on every cable network in the world that looks at business and bit Bitcoin's Bitcoin. So that's very sobering. People lost a ton of money that they're never going to get back on the poo poo scale. So if you're going to get exposure to crypto, avoid poo poo and just simply buy the two that matter. That's what I did. So I sold 27 positions gone put it into USDC which you know was giving me yield of 3.9%. And just bought more Ethereum and Bitcoin and now it's a very interesting time. Those things have been crushed too. >> So you know my I'd alloc I call that an alternative too but it didn't perform as well as gold. So, you know, if you think about it this way, for me right now, it's probably 60 um equities globally, 20 fixed income, and 20 alternatives, including cards, crypto, um gold, and that portfolio has done quite well. >> What's an investment that everyone loves right now that you think is going to collapse? >> It's never the one you think. You know, it's sort of the in fact, that's the great question because >> it's the reason that you should force yourself into into diversification because you think you know, you don't know. But you're right, something will collapse, but because you only own 5% of it or max 20% in that sector, it's very hard for a sector to completely collapse. But, you know, there's been a real correction on a lot of the AI assumptions lately and some of those stocks have pulled back. But because for me, it's it's just a 5% position. Doesn't really hurt. And yet, gold, everybody got that wrong. And that thing really saved my rear end. Like, look at my gold portfolio is insane. The performance. If you had to throw out a guess though, if you were to speculate, not that people should listen to what you're speculating on, but what would you say could be something people are bullish on right now that you're bearish on? >> I think the disruption that's going to occur in uh AI around I would say financial services. You you saw what Jack Dorsey did. He laid off 40% of his people yesterday. He in a sense he's financial services. I think that's going to happen again. Now, the the weird thing is the stock price didn't collapse, but the employment numbers did. >> So, it's hard it's hard for me to pick where AI is going to disrupt next. I would have thought it would have happened sooner, but it's this next year, the year we're in. Here we are in February. If we have this gathering again in 12 months, something's going to go down 80%. I just don't know what it is yet, but it will be because of AI disruption. So I'm curious for you. Do you just pop open your brokerage every morning and like dollar cost average? >> No. No. What I do is I mark to market um with a a dashboard. I have it's a you know proprietary dashboard but it takes every single global um because I have accounts in the in the UAE in in Switzerland. >> What do you mean a council? >> Well I have a company called Global in Abu Dhabi and it has investments. So I those stocks go up and down on that exchange. So I need to know what they are and and uh so at at 405 although remember 13 hours ahead over there I just take a snapshot. I I I look at it on my phone >> and I say I just look for variance. What moved more than 3%. And so it flags any position that had more than a 3% move in this trading session. And what's occurring now is there's more and more names every day. There's a lot of V. Let me give you an example. I'm a shareholder in Circle. You're probably unaware of this. It went up 35% yesterday. That's a lot. >> Now, why did it go up 35%. Because there's a emotion in the market now that it looks like the Clarity Act is going to clear in the next couple of months. And that solves the issue around interest on stable coins. So, boom. I have a big position in that company because I bought it privately years ago. 35% move in one day. You don't see that very often, but it, you know, was a huge winner in the portfolio. But my whole point is it's not more than 5%. But that when you get one 5% position to move 35%, you outperform the market that day. That's what happens. >> When do you think the next recession is going to hit and what do you think is going to cause that? I always look at the the canary in the coal mine. That's the consumer. When the consumer rolls over, um you'll see it. It'll be three data sets in a row and that means we're entering a recession. Now, you know, each recession is different. The wild card again is AI. People are saying today because of Dor, you know, Jack Dorsey's thing, the recession is going to be caused by AI. The only problem with that statement is yes, the people that lost their jobs don't have the same earnings power except how do you know they're not going to be sucked up into another sector? You don't. And so will will AI self-correct the economy by making it more productive with higher free cash flow? Like even in our companies in the last two years, just the private ones like you know uh Boost Oxygen or Blueand Detergent or uh Hello Prenup, you know, these are all small cap businesses. Cash flows are up 20%. Why AI? Now, I'm sure I don't have to say this, but cryptocurrency has taken over the mainstream within the last few years. But despite this, many platforms are still incredibly difficult to use. There's unfamiliar apps, neverending security loops, and confusing layouts that make it impossible to know which platforms you could trust. 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Thank you so much to SoFi for sponsoring this episode. And now, let's get back to the podcast. What do you think of the wealth tax? Because Jack, we were having a discussion earlier, believes that it might be a good thing. >> No, no, Jack, you're going to hell for saying that. >> But there is there is an argument to be made. >> No, there isn't. It's unamerican. It's it will destroy the fabric of the economy. Punishing wealth and success. >> Well, it's not punishing because they they already have billions of dollars, >> right? the difference between having $5 billion and then let's just say a 10% wealth tax, you know, $4.5 billion is not quite significant. It's just the idea that you're made a a promise to come to America as an entrepreneur [snorts] um to achieve the American dream and then some arbitrary politician randomly decides we're going to appropriate that from you. or you're going to steal your wealth just because we feel that a 10% wealth tax is appropriate. >> It's not really stealing. It's redistributing. >> You're going to go to hell, too. [laughter] Like, like both of you are going to hell. I feel sorry. I mean, >> well, we've never made any real money. >> I've heard that word before in Cuba, in North Korea, in Russia. It just hasn't been done right. They're all new. How about Venezuela? They redistribute all the time to corruption. It's aole. >> Well, let's assuming it goes to corruption. But if it doesn't No, the point is we are not very corrupt here in America. >> No. No. Because we have laws and we abide by them. But one of those laws is you can't steal people's money. So this idea of a wealth tax is going to be litigated right to the Supreme Court and it's going to lose because it's unamerican. And there is no such thing as too much wealth because it all goes back anyways. The guy dies or the woman dies that has that wealth and then we hit it again with state tax. You get it back and during their lifetime they should be able to enjoy their success, you know, unfettered because they took the risk to create. You know what people keep forgetting on this issue and Elon Musk is often used as the example, you know, nearly the wealthiest man on earth now. How many jobs has he created? How much tax has he paid? I mean, if we didn't have him, would there be Starlink? Would there be, you know, Tesla? No. Would there be all this innovation in robotics? No. Let's punish him for his success. >> I think he would be fine with a hundred billion dollars. He wants to use that money to He's not >> He lives in a shack somewhere. He doesn't care. >> We're We're totally kid. We don't actually believe in a wealth tax. >> Yeah. He's just trying to bait you. Yeah. We just thought this was a funny You're not going to hell then. Then you're lucky. But I was trying to hold back the last >> The whole issue is, and he said this publicly, I need that capital to deploy the next mission. And he's turned it from Mars to being the moon just in the last two weeks. I want to I want to give him as much money because if you look at executional skills, show me anywhere on earth where the per there's a person like that and thank goodness he doesn't live in Russia or in China or in you know North Korea. He's here in America because he wants to pursue the American dream. The reason those countries, you know, you you think about even if you have a great idea and you're sitting in France, you get on a plane and you go to Texas. That's where you make it happen. Even as far back as the V2 rockets when they were, you know, Germans, they came to America and set up Nassau. We bring the geniuses here cuz they want to live in freedom and they want to be rewarded the American dream. Look, I I'm very I'm I'm very stalworth on this. I'm very focused on it and when I see bad policy, I I rage against it. >> I got a question. Have you ever met Elon Musk? >> Yeah. >> When's the last time you met him? uh Mark Bernett's uh Christmas party. It has to be at least four years ago. Um because Mark used to do a he doesn't do it anymore, but we used to do a Christmas party for all of the Shark Tank uh you know, his television companies. It was great party on on the West Coast and everybody showed up. I I'm I'm talking to him and Lady Gaga at the same time. It was just wild. >> So Elon was talking to Lady Gaga. What are they talking about? What do they have in common? It's it's interesting because I found her fascinating, too. She was really interested in business and we were talking I think we're talking indexing. Um, you know, I think she's I think she's a it's very random >> and yeah, I mean I I really enjoy, >> you know, and and I'm I'm thrilled to be part of the acting community now because that's as eclectic as hell. I mean, these parties are incredible. They're just so interesting because I'm so used to financial services to find myself acting in a feature movie and then you know hitting the parties and all the rest of that stuff. >> Okay, but people also the viewers out there that don't attend the Hollywood parties have a very controversial opinion on the Hollywood parties. How >> I get it, but what you find out is those people um and and I'll speak on their behalf. I thought the same way about Hollywood parties complete bull. Then I actually went to work on a feature film for eight months. They work like hell. Their working conditions are brutal. They work 18 hours a day. You know, when you're shooting on the streets of New York or in Tokyo, I mean, it is exhausting. And you're living in a ball trailer with a portoan toilet. It sounds glamorous to make a movie. It is not glamorous. It is not at all. It's hard work. And now I get it. and I have a new respect for them. So, you know, for anybody listening, don't make an assumption that Timothy Shalamé runs around making movies and lives like a king. He lives like, you know, it's It's it's really really hard and it's it's exhausting because you got to get through that seven pages of script and if you have to stay there till 6:00 in the morning, you're going to stay at 6:00 in the morning and then you got to got to get up 2 hours later and do it again. So, when they were casting for the movie, they said they were looking for a real I'm curious if that's how you see yourself. >> No, I just tell the truth. Some people don't like it. Um, you it goes right back to the beginning of the of this narrative we had about, you know, what happened on CNN. Some people just go crazy uh when they hear the truth. And I don't care. Listen, the thing the thing is, and I've said this to, you know, a lot of my students, if you try to live your life pleasing everybody, you're going to fail. You cannot make everybody happy. If you decide to take on a leadership role in business, you are definitely not going to make everybody happy. If you want to get and be part of the narrative on policy, you are definitely not going to make everybody happy. The only people you want need to keep happy are your your 20th. Most people only have 20 people in their lives that mean anything to them. Their family and maybe an extended family and some close friends. There's not 200 people that you spend every day with everybody else. Your role is not to make them happy. It's to tell them the truth and make sure you don't do anything that that you you lose their respect. I mean, I think people dislike me. Many do, but I believe that most of them respect me even though they don't like me. You know, that's cuz I haven't done anything to do. I never lie about anything. Sometimes that causes a lot of problems. >> And have you ever taken your honesty too far? Like, has there ever been a point where you were too brutally honest or too blunt about something that the outcome was just objectively bad? >> Yeah, that happens. I mean, yes, I have. I can think of um you know uh recently Billy Isish comment. I didn't mean it to be I I think she was great artist that I had I listen to her music all the time but I didn't like what she was doing in terms of um being political in an award show that really she really got pissed off at me. But >> what is it like to have Billy Eyish mad at you? Is [laughter] she like DMing you like >> Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I mean it's, you know, she had she had a bunch of actors come out in her support and I think that's great. I don't dislike these people. Most of them I haven't even met. So it but it to me is, you know, when you talk about indigenous rights, something I know a lot about because they're my partners in data centers. What people don't understand about First Nation all over North America, very simple to understand this, there is no border for them. They have the First Nations rights. They drift over the Canadian-American border anytime they want. They don't recognize the border and we allow them to do that. They own the water rights to many, many places in America and Canada. It's their water. And so they're going to be your partners and they are my partners. And I I I don't like to hear anything said about them that um isn't true. And so I stand up for for my business partners and I claim why I do it. And you know, it's sort of important because they need to hear that signal from me that I am truly looking out for their interests because it's in my best interest that they do. Okay. And so when we build a data center, they are because they have what we we need water. We can't do it without them. So it gets into that. That's how complicated my life is. I'm always thinking about all right, what's what's factual here? Now, if that pisses somebody off, okay, but you know, I I don't think I'm a bad guy. I'm just telling the truth. It's still the truth today. Do you think that as time has gone on that the truth has become more elusive in terms of people now prioritize feelings over some form of objective reality? Like back in the day, you could be blunt, you could be brutally honest, and people were more okay with it. But as time has gone on, it's it's not as acceptable now. >> I think the answer to that is yes, that's true. but not for me. I don't care. I just don't care. I am I'm going to tell the truth every day. And it just it and the reason you need to do that is if you only tell the truth every day, you're never going to have to remember what you said. It's still going to be the truth tomorrow, you know? And and I I really and I really think there's something else going on. Just look at what's occurred on the Epstein files now that we have AI. Millions of pages. Okay. If you're in that, it's not about the criminal prosecution. It's destroyed hundreds of people's careers just to have their name in it. In some cases, maybe it's fair, some cases it may not be. I don't know the details, but every day you see fall from grace from somebody cancelled because, you know, they obviously didn't think that through. you every you have to live your life every day thinking is everything I did today am I am I comfortable with it was I honest did I do anything that I'd be ashamed of tomorrow because with AI coming and social media everything you do is seen by everybody all the time so it goes back to the truth thing I I would argue the best thing you can do is tell the truth cuz if it's not true you're going to get 100% and it and they will cancel you in 2 seconds. Did someone like lie to you early on or did something happen for you to have such a strong emotional attachment towards the truth? Because I remember the last >> Yeah. My mother caught me in a lie when I was like 15 years old and there was it was a boldfaced lie. >> What was the lie? >> I'm trying to remember. I was in high school. I think um is about smoking drugs, I think. You know, I rolled a big fat joint and smoked it and she came home early and she could smell it. And you know, at that time I was smoking drugs. cuz I don't do drugs anymore, but you know, I was experimenting with a lot of stuff back then. And she said, "You should have told me the truth cuz I've caught you in a lie." And and and she said then, "Look, if you only tell the truth every day, you'll never have to remember what you said because I just caught you lying to me." And it really had an impact on me. It really hit me. And I thought, "She's right." >> And I remember, you know, it was in the kitchen. I I remember it crystal clear. And ever since then, I' I've tried the truth. It It's worked for me. But it's got me in a lot of trouble, too. >> What's the hardest truth you've had to deliver? And what's the hardest truth you've had delivered to you? >> It's always when I'm terminating somebody, you know, I have such a massive organization now. I'm very fortunate in business, but I really require executional excellence. And uh you know people when you be you know you know we're we're going back into entrepreneurship here but when you become a leader and you take other people's money and you start investing it they make the assumption that you are going to protect their capital and give them a return. And in order to do that, your mandate is to find the very best best people to work in these companies. And so my job is to find the right CFO, find the right CEO, find the right tech person, find and and then you have to not only do that gel a team, the team has to work together. So my strategy has always been, let's hire someone for 6 months first, see if it works on a consulting basis, a 30% higher salary and no stock options or anything. And then if it doesn't work out on their resume, it simply says, "I consulted with one of the Oly Ventures groups and I just moved on." But the hardest thing is, and I I is when you when you finally come to the point where you've got to make a change, you have to tell them why. You got to be honest. And that's tough. It's really tough. But you also have to be fair. I think of, you know, the it's got to be thousands of people now that I've let go, you know, in in in my career, but every one of them got a great exit package. I've never heard anybody badmouth me afterwards saying he did he wasn't fair to me, man or woman. >> What's the harshest truth that someone's ever delivered to you? >> Yeah. I I would say my stepfather um said to me, you know, I was I was very much interested in becoming um a photographer because I was working as a cameraman at that time before I was going to college. and he sat me down and said, "I'm sorry, but you're just not good enough. You don't have what it takes to survive against the level of quality that's out there. You're just not good enough." >> And that was a real stunner. And he was right. He was right. And it forced me to go back into college and I did a business degree. And then the first thing I did to spite him was to start a production company. And I but I made sure I didn't I wasn't the chief photographer anymore. So, you still kind of listen. >> Well, but I and I sold that was my first deal. It was called Special Event Television. It did all the uh NHL Saturday programming, but I hired a great cameraman and hire and then I learned how to edit myself. I was a good editor. I still am. But it it's sort of it's you it's very hard to have somebody tell you you're just not good enough when it's true. It's true. He was right. Some people can't accept that. They can say, "Well, no, I'm going to get better." Executional skills vary on different mandates. You may be very very good at one thing and not in another. And the real strength in life is is figuring out what you're not good at. That's more important than knowing what you're good at so that you don't try and do things. I'm really logistics. It bores the crap out of me. Making widgets, shipping widgets. I've always had a partner that does that in every business I've done. I'm the marketing sales guy. That's I'm really good at that and I know that and I can measure that. But when it comes to like you know where do we inventory our wages I don't give a go figure it out and I'm willing to give up equity to people can solve that. >> So in terms of telling the truth you recently upset a lot of people saying that the movie Marty Supreme could have saved millions replacing the background actors with AI. >> Yeah. Well that >> why do you think that upsets so many? >> So let me tell you what I learned um about that. I'm going to modify that statement a little bit because I experienced it myself. In a in a scene where you have, let's say, 30, we had scenes with 250 extras and you're shooting it and there's people in a in a cafe or walking or bringing over, you know, a drink and or there's a narrative. When you have an interaction with an extra, that can't be AI. I would have thought it could have been but it can't be because what I realized is the real magic of film making are the mistakes you make. So I got to retract that statement a bit where you can use AI would be like Ben her had cutouts in the stands when it was shot in the 60s. They they couldn't put 1100 people in blazing sun for 12 hours. So they made cutouts. When we used to do hockey shots, we had blow up dolls. We had the first row with live people in the in in the hockey arena and then everybody else was a sex doll and blew them up. >> And because you know you the motion is it's very blurry in the background. That's going to be AI. You're going to get backgrounds that are AI, but not where there's interaction between the actors. That's never going to change. And I realized why. I mean, you know, I said that uninformed. So, I've changed my views because I've actually done it. >> What did you end up doing with all those dolls? >> We What we would do is we pop them and just throw them out because we give them donate them. >> You blow them out with a a CO2 cartridge. They come with a And you know, they always have really big [laughter] >> and we put like baseball hats on them and stuff. >> You [laughter] should have donated them. Really? >> And then we we shoot the scene and then someone would run up there with a knife and just chop them up. Oh my gosh. >> Take the hats off. >> Take a few of them home, too. >> You can't re It's really hard. It takes a long time to get the air out of them. >> Oh, so you just got it. >> Yeah. There there was actually a a Shark Tank deal last year. It's called Gertie. This guy comes out and he says, he shows a video of a dog that you know your security cameras. >> You leave and the dog starts howling cuz he's got anxiety. The owner's left. >> So he gets a sex doll, blows it up and puts his jacket on it. So this his smell is on it and sticks it in the living room sitting there like this and the dog just lies down beside it all night. >> I was I thought you were going to go somewhere else. >> No, [laughter] no, no. And so what he decided to do was take out the big lips part cuz that's what the sex dolls have and put his girlfriend's face on it. Her name is Gertie. >> We put it on Shark Tank. It was the stupidest thing I'd ever seen but it was so crazy that I invested in it and it's been one one of my best deals. You can go look at it gertie.com and you can buy a doll for your cat, your dog, your turtle, whatever it is. And the animal will eventually because it has legs and it's got arms and you put sweater on it and when you leave they just say, "Oh, there there he's still here." That it works. >> So when you say it was one of your best investments, what does that even mean? Like how long have you held on to it? Are you taking distributions? How much did you put in? What's it worth? I mean, in venture investing, you don't treat it like a normal investment because you don't get anything back till your capital's returned. It's not return on capital. It's return of capital. If you give somebody $500,000 and you never get any cash back, you've made nothing. You can't argue that the, you know, private company that is a consumer goods service company, your risk is is really high because they may never figure out how to get their customer acquisition costs down. That's why I came up with the royalty idea. In the beginning, everybody thought it was, you know, bad and they abused me for it. Now, every shark wants to do royalties because what's what you're doing there is you're slowly getting back your principle and you don't make any money till the first dollar after all your principles returned. So, my most successful deals are ones that are have strong cash flows that can pay the 7% royalty and eventually we sell the company. And some like deals like Blueland for example, my cost base on Blueland is zero. All my capital's back. The business is probably worth today 150 million. I bet you it's going to sell for half a billion because it's growing like a weed and I own I don't know three or 5% of it but I have I have no all the capital is returned through royalties. That's a great deal. That that's how you should structure venture investing. >> How do you think AI is going to change the structure of your businesses in the future? >> I don't think it's going to change the structure. It's going to change which ones I invest in. Because if you're not using AI tools now for customer acquisition, I'm not investing in you. In this season of Shark Tank, the first question I'm asking is, what's your customer acquisition cost? And which AI tools are you using? Cuz I use them all. We know every single tool out there. I mean, what people don't realize, there's only five vertical stacks of AI that cost billions to maintain and develop. But off of those verticals come very interesting applications that you can buy a subscription for. For example, let's say like in my case, I've got 12 terab of video and photographs. 12 terabytes in the cloud right now. That's cuz I've been doing television for 25 years. Every show, every photo, every you know that that thing doing this wideangle shot, all of that sitting in the cloud. How do I index that? How do you even remember where that stuff is? And so recently I found a tool, a very very specific tool that if you put it in a giant database in the cloud and you let the AI look at every frame of every photograph and every video and every film, it takes a long time, couple of months. But once it's indexed, you can say, "I recall a picture and I was on a paddle board in Jamaica and a dolphin looked up at me and somebody took a picture." Bang, there it is on the screen with the index to where it is or if it's a video, how long it is, what the resolution is, all of it just sitting there and you can just say click to download that. You know how much time that's going to save? So, that's a tool that's that really saves time. So, we're able to do these real deep dive uh social media things now for our own platform of, you know, young Kevin, old Kevin, uh Kevin with a beard, Kevin with full hair, all that stuff because all of it is at a second away from us. And the guys that do that are over in the UAE. >> Do you think you could be replaced by AI? >> I think I already am. I I have a AI Kevin. My wife can still discern the difference on a screen, but in about a month she won't be able to because the only thing now that is the slight tell is the voice intonation. And there's a new model uh just came out last week that you have to basically let your phone listen to you for about 3 days. Just record your daily life for 3 days and let it learn off that. Because in a 3-day period, you go through everything. sleep, you go through waking up, wake up voice, dinner voice, you know, drinking wine voice, coffee voice, all of it. And then and the tool then applies that to your AI model. That's an agent. I have a Kevin Olri agent and I'm able to, you know, it's remarkable. I I that agent's incredible and we're starting to use it. Do you think that could eventually replace your work hours that you just have your AI Kevin go and go to work for you, answer emails for you, take phone calls for you, and if it gets to a certain point, then it alerts you and say, "Actually, Kevin, you should hop on this call just to make sure." But like it does 90% of the work. The >> filter I think we're way off on that because I realize my best ideas actually happen very early in the morning when I'm on my bike uh riding at, you know, 6:45. Um something will hit me like that whole idea I'm so excited about because when I leave here I'm on my way uh to go see the first iteration of the Parisian um diamond >> necklace. And so I I I I c I was on my bike in um in Miami and I and I was thinking about that Kobe card and you know Logan Paul, he's good friends with you know I've done his podcast and I I like the [clears throat] guy a lot >> and another guy involved and I was thinking >> how could I how could I raise that? How could I make a piece unique like my watches? And while I was on the bike I I have Nicole Weiss. She's the head of high jewelry for LVMH. And I just called her randomly and I said, "Nicole, listen to this." She said, "I love it. It's crazy. How would how would we know how thick the card is? How would we know all that stuff?" So, we went to work on it and we we just got in a group chat and we designed this thing based on how that card looks and which diamond should be where, but we had the full support of LVMH. And I thought to myself, would AI ever do that? Nah, probably not. They wouldn't have the same reason to do that. I'm not sure that pure innovation comes from that. I think implementation, execution comes from AI, but I think the human being is so random in its thinking process that you're still going to need it. That's my iteration of it anyways because I use a lot of AI tools now. And and I'll give you an example. When one of my students, and this has been talked about a lot, sends me, you know, an answer to a question or an essay, I just look at it say, "AI slop." Like, it's you you get to you get to see it. It's just it's not their voice. You know, the person they write this thing, you know, and I just say, "Look, do it again. I don't mind you using AI to start it, but don't like this is bullshit." And I'm not even using an AI, you know, discovery tool because you have tools to discover AI in text, too. So, I'm not we're we're very I think we're in the first inning and maybe it gets better and better and better, but I don't think it's going to be it's going to be creative enough because people are trying to do this now. Let me give you an example. write me a song with a countryesque kind of middle eight and it writes it sounds like I can tell right away that it's an AI song. Write me a song that sounds like Steely Dan uh you know younger Steelely Dan second album kind of thing sounds like some of them sound incredible though. I've been listening to uh Korn, >> the the band as gospel, >> right, >> and soul. It's amazing. And I'll play that on repeat. It is so incredibly good. >> I get it. But, you know, if you listen to the real thing and you find the nuance and the little distortion and the mistakes make it better, I think cuz I've listened, you know, I have a lot of music and uh I try I listen to a lot of new bands and I listen to the AI bands. I mean, they sound so formulaic. they they don't have, you know, what makes great I listen to a lot of jazz. If you go back and listen to u even the 50s records, Kind of Blue is the classic. >> The the first version of that album was a mistake. It was it was about 10% slow. They recorded on a broken recorder. They had two machines in the room and they released the one that was slow cuz when people tried to play against it, they said, "I got to tune down here." what? This isn't in tune. Then they found the master tape that wasn't slow and they put the album out again. And yet you listen to those two things, they are definitely not AI. There's all kinds of little nuances and mistakes in there. And I I I think you could argue, well, maybe AI can make mistakes, too. But that's where I think the creativity is lost. I don't know. Show me a commercial success so far with AI. People want to go to a concert and listen to a machine play something to them. Now, real estate investing can be one of the best ways to build wealth, but it doesn't have to be like a second full-time job. So, whether you're buying your first rental property or your hundth, finding the perfect deal could often be a total time suck. And that's why we're so excited to partner with LAR investor marketplace. 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Thanks again to LAR for sponsoring the Ice Coffee Hour. And back to the episode. This episode is in partnership with Airbnb. So, Graham and I just wrapped up a trip. We were in Austin for a few days. We filmed episodes with Togei, Chris Camilo, and Caleb Hammer. And honestly, every time we're on the road, we're staying at homes on Airbnb. It's just become the default. And here's the thing most people don't think about. When you're the one traveling, your place back home is just sitting there empty. And that's a real missed opportunity. Whether you're gone for a long weekend or a few weeks, you can list your space on Airbnb and let it work for you while you're away. If you've ever thought about hosting, but weren't sure how to manage everything from the road, Airbnb now has the co-host network. 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I think a lot of people are probably wondering about finances as well because people see you as [clears throat] phenomenal entrepreneur, a great investor. I'm curious, who do you think is the best investor of all time? >> Well, the thing about that is it's only numbers because who made the most money? Remember, investment is very binary. You either make it or you lose it. And clearly Warren Buffett and Charlie Mer uh no one has been close to their success. And they had a very simple model, cash flow. And Charlie could ne he could never be into anything that didn't have cash flow. He didn't believe in anything that didn't have cash flow. And he would just say no, no, no. He was the no in Warren's yes. And they needed each other in the beginning. And then they got into their own discipline of of, you know, buying things that have very long-term stable cash flows. And that ended up being the right thing to do. The other thing I've learned is just buy the market. Like betting on on hedge fund guys and um stock pickers. There aren't too many good ones. So to the average person out there that's watching this right now, let's say they're making $50,000 a year, $40 to $80,000 a year, living all across America, how do they go from maybe monthtomonth not really being able to save too much to then being able to have discretionary spending to start to live a life of comfort? Like what is if you could instill one idea, one belief into them that could hopefully bridge that gap, what would it be? Well, the hardest part of that is the discipline it takes to decide that you're going to put aside 10 or 15% every week. It's so hard to do that because there's always the next pair of sneakers you want to buy that you don't need. People are weak. They don't have discipline. Don't buy you don't need. And and if you look at yourself and see all the clothes you have, you don't wear. You bought them because you had a whim for it or something, but you basically wear the same two pair of jeans and five t-shirts. It's crazy. that you would take that money and put it into something you're going to throw away in 20 months when you could have put it into the market. And the way you put it in the market, if you don't understand the market, you don't have a brokerage account, download one of these apps that does it for you on your phone, link your bank account to it, and just transfer in 10% each week. Obviously, I have the one I like is Beantocks, but it's not the only one. There's plenty of them that'll do it for you. I like them really simple. And then if you start doing that, two years later, you'll say, "Wow, where'd this money come from?" >> At what income is it just impossible to build wealth? >> I would say probably under $35,000. That's tough if you live if you live in a major city because you're being forced to spend, you know, 12-500 on rent, which is very very hard. But even in that, the discipline of not overspending because you're going to get yourself the the real task there is not to go into credit card debt. That's tough. >> What jobs do you think those people should take? >> Oh, I think the job that gets you the most money now is if you have talents in social media for customer acquisition. I used to pay those guys 48 grand a year. Now they're 250,000 because you can measure their work based on customer acquisition every week. So most of them become contractors. you know, they they make half a million dollars a year because they know how to take content, turn it into a 59 second ad on social and acquire 200 customers. That's a very specific. So remember everybody say you have to be an engineer and engineer and engineer. Now you want to be an artist again. Write stories, acquire customers, know how the social media platforms work, know how to post on Tik Tok versus LinkedIn versus Twitter versus Instagram. Those people in their early 20s are so valuable now. So if you know how to use your phone, somebody wants to hire you. >> So if you were to go back in time with the specific skill set that you currently possess, is that what you would do or would you? >> Yeah, I would use my editing skills to make uh 15s, 30s, and 59s. And I would I basically say, "Look, pay me uh you know 100 bucks for each customer I acquire for you." I'd make millions. I mean, I know how to do it. Now, you previously said that someone should spend 30% of their time outside of their comfort zone. >> Yeah. >> What does that look like for you? >> For me, that's going to be acting. >> I'm here in LA working on my next project. >> The difference between feature film and television is massive. Most people don't think there's much of a difference, but there's a massive difference. It's completely different skill set, and I want to do more of more of it. So for me it's going to be shoot a film every year. I don't mean you know a television series. I mean a feature film that's going to get theatrical release. So that's everybody wants to do that. I'm going to let my performance be the judge for those agents, directors, producers, casters that have seen Marty Supreme. Nobody knew how it was going to come out for me. I think I've done, you know, no one no one's telling me I the bed on it. That's for sure. Mhm. >> So, I'm going to take that tape, that's my my only role ever, and I'm going to say, "Look, I'd like to do this again." I want to be the antagonist. I think that role is far more interesting. It's far more interesting uh to be the bad guy because there's so many places you can go. There's so many twists and turns in being the antagonist of any story. Every story has a hero and has a bad guy. >> I want to be the bad guy. So that's that's what I'm looking at now is various opportunities for bad guy. >> Why why are you so drawn to the bad guy? >> It's so interesting. You know, you're reading these scripts. I read a lot of scripts lately and I look at them and I, you know, say to the director, that's not what the bad guy would say. This is what he would say. And they say, no. So, I find that with the writers and the directors, you get a lot more latitude to creating your role as the bad guy because the hero always has an outcome that's hard to change. They're going to kill the bad guy. They're going to get the girl. They're going to, you know, save somebody or something. You can't change that outcome. That's the core of the story. You know, if it's if it's a big action movie, it's an Avenger type thing, they got to save the world. But the way the bad guy during his interaction, he can go everywhere. And so you you basically what I find, this is my own observation, is when you're the bad guy, you get a lot of latitude in every scene. When we were doing Marty Supreme and I with Ronnie Bronstein and Josh Safy who were co-wrote it, I'd say, "Guys, guys, guys, he's got to say this, not that." And they said, "Okay, let's shoot it that way, too." So it was sort of like that whole vampire thing. Remember that at the end of the movie? I don't know if you've seen it. >> Um, we dreamt that up on my on my dock at my lake house because I we're at the end of the movie and I'm looking at the three of them. Eli Bush was there and I said, "Guys, do you think if I was the richest guy in in America, I would let this little screw me over this way? Do you think there'd be a chance that would ever happen?" They said, "What are you saying? I'm saying there's no way it ends this way. This kid has to die." They said, "Cat die. You know, we have a different ending." I said, "Well, then I'm going to bite his neck." And they said, "What the are you talking about?" I said, "Yeah, I'm going to tell him I'm a vampire." And they looked at each other said, "Whoa, that's crazy. Let's go there." So, it was sort of like, "Bring the dark arts into it. Make him think if there's even a 1% chance that this could be true that I'm a vampire." And that's where the line came out. I was born in6001. That gave Milton Rockwell the satisfaction that he held the dark arts over this kid for the rest of his life. And you could see, you know, Shalom played it so beautifully cuz we did that in Japan. He he freaked out. He kind of smiled and went, "Wa, like that's crazy." And it was crazy in the moment we shot it. But to me, that's why you want to be the antagonist. You can explore many different directions where you can't if you're the hero. >> How many times did you have to do that >> scene? >> Yeah, >> that's a one take that one. >> Just one take. They didn't they didn't want to put you guys through that. >> We did many scenes that were 50 takes, but that one was so crazy. That was one take. >> I'm curious on Marty Supreme, how much did they pay you? >> Oh, I don't even know. Oh, I I mean I I I couldn't buy protein with what they paid me. I [laughter] mean, it was it was like it was I'd never acted before, you know. The only question they had, "Are you a member of SAG?" I said, "Yeah." Because I think I was the last guy cast. They couldn't find, you know, Milton. They wanted a real bad guy. And he just called me out of the blue and said, "Look, you got to come to New York." I said, "No way. I'm sitting on the dock. I'm relaxing up here. I'll send you my plane. I'll pick you up. if you come up here, we'll do it tomorrow morning. And they said, "Shit, yeah, let's do it." >> And then I really got into it. There is a weird story about that though, um, that you should know. That script is a size of phone book and I hadn't really read it after they sent it to me and I forgot about it and I left it on the bar and this guy named Jean McBurnernie got up at 5 in the morning. We have a lot of people staying at the lake. It's a big party every night. And he got up 5:00 to watch the sunrise. and he took the script with him, not knowing what it was or anything about the project and he read it. And by the time I got to him at 10 in the morning, I went outside and he was sitting there saying, "Kevin, have you read this thing?" I said, "No, this is the craziest, most insane story I've ever read. It's whoever wrote this is a very sick, demented person." But you got to be Marty, you know? You've got to be the guy that what he meant was you've got to be the antagonist to Marty. You got to be Milton Rockwell. And I said, "I got to read this, right?" He said, "You got to read it." And I read it and I realized what he was talking about. He he saw the force that the force of good and evil between Marty and Milton as being the fulcrum of the whole story. And if you're not Marty, you got to be Milton. That was his point. I'd like to see you as a Bond villain. >> Yeah. I mean, you know, Bond is not going to be produced for years, so I I have to do other stuff. >> I mean, for me, it's sort of Well, here's the thing I learned. This is tough. I came in at the top. I worked with an A+ writing team, an A+ director, A24, the number one hot team in Hollywood right now. Gwennneth Paltro, a huge budget movie. >> Like, I don't know what it is to work on a dog movie. How am I going to do that? I've got to get another fantastic movie. I got to find another fantastic director. I mean, there's a lot of crap that's made. I don't want to work on that. I want to work on the on the El Supreo stuff. Now, that sounds ridiculous to make a demand like that, but I don't actually need a job. So, I want to do it cuz it's extraordinary. I want to do it because they they're considering risking a part on me based on the merit of my work. I want to do it because I'm a good actor, not I don't, you know, it's not like I need I'm not a starving artist. That's the problem. >> Are you going to get royalties from this? >> I I said to my agents who I like a lot, they're UTA guy named Jay Currus. I said, Jay, why don't you let me negotiate the deals? I'll handle everything. The agency can still get its piece. He said, "What are you? Out of your mind?" I said, "No." There's one thing I learned about Hollywood that a lot of people don't know. When you're negotiating on behalf of one performer, let's say it's me, and you're dealing with a network or a producer or you also have in your portfolio many other artists. So, let's say a certain television network wants to hire me and they're not meeting my agents price or whatever it is. Cuz in the end, these guys are about the money. It may go down like this. Give him what? Give what he wants and we'll get you XYZ for that movie you're doing in your studio. I can't do that. They can't. And all of a sudden, bingo, everybody's happy. That's what these guys do in Hollywood. They trade assets all over the place. It's a dirty secret, but that's exactly how it works. So, to be successful, you have to be under the wing of an agency that has a lot of assets and they're worth every cent because you can't I remember in season 4 of Shark Tank walking into whoever the president of ABC television was then and saying, "Don't need an agent. Um, I'm going to handle this myself, just you and me." He said, "No, not doing that. I don't want to taint our relationship cuz we're going to have a bloody negotiation in season 4. The show is on fire. It was going geometrically." >> And and I said, "Well, why don't just let me handle it? I'm a big boy. I have thick skin." He said, "No, >> I've made a few calls. You're going to get a call from a guy named Burkus and then he's going to take you in to meet a guy named Jay Currus in about an hour." I said, 'I don't want I don't need no stinking agent. They said, 'Yeah, you do, and I think you're going to like these guys, and I think you're going to sign with them. And it's exactly what happened. What's been your toughest negotiation? >> It's not around television. Um, it's with government in what I'm doing in real estate is so many moving parts. You know, when you're building a $20 billion data center, it's tough. You got to negotiate everything. And and you need the senators, you need the governor, you need the mayor, you need the feds, you need furk, you need everything. And and I'm I'm the guy sometimes that flies in there and and sits down with the staffers of the of the senator. I say, "Here's how it has to happen." And and th those are very difficult negotiations because they're public in some sense. They're complicated. The dollars are huge and you can't it up. Every piece has to work. I've never worked this hard in my life. But the deals we're doing now, I'm the I'm now the largest in North America company with land under agreement for for data center development. 26,000 acres. That's a lot. That's one hell of a wrench. What's the biggest screw- up that you've had during a negotiation? That's a good one. very in the last 48 hours. Um there is a card out there that we made a deal on and the guy that sold it who I did not know um it turns out what he did is he and I don't know this for sure yet but I think we're going to find out this is the case. He used my name to trade it sideways to somebody else. What's going to happen in the next few hours to him is He's not going to like it. It's going to be raining from the sky, lawsuits from hell. Because in in the in the mark, it's like the market in New York for diamond merchants. >> There is no paper. There's an agreement. There's a handshake and that stone is sold. It never goes sideways. And should you ever breach that 100-year-old trust that's been generation to generation, you you're banned from the industry forever. In cards, when you make a deal, cuz you're working with people all over the world, when you finally come to a price and you say, "Are we done?" And the other side says, "We are." It's sold. It's over. And in this case, I've never seen it happen before, but he renegged. And in I consider this contemporary art, modern art. The piece is now tainted because from my legal perspective, I own it. [snorts] The other buyer, everybody that touches that card is going to know that I I I'm going to litigate for my legal claim. So that card is going to be very hairy for the next few years. Even though it's a very valuable card, it's probably going to become very famous because of the litigation, not the card. Everybody that touches that card, I'm going to sue them. Anybody that tries to be an agent, I'm going to sue them. Anybody that tries to auction it, I'm going to sue them. As far as I'm concerned, that's my card because the transaction took place. >> Were you on the phone or in person with this person? You guys agree verbally on it? I was shaking. one of my partners was on the phone and um there was a witness as well. Now, because he's reneged, the only legal recourse we have is to bring a claim. I'm going to let the the process run it run its course. But every other I know every buyer of cards of this price on earth. I know who they are and they also know who I am and they know that I don't let this happen to me. What was what was the card? >> You won't I can't say, but you will know. You will find out soon enough. >> Why not get it in writing at that point? >> There is no writing on cards. That's not how it works. >> Why? I feel like just with any other thing that you would buy. You would get a contract. You'd sign it. >> The way it works is you you're on the phone with someone in Malaysia or the Philippines. The card is you've been discussing it for sometimes 6 months. You don't have an agreement on price. You're watching the markets move. You finally come to an agreement on price. The trust is unbelievable. You wire $13 million to that person while your representative is right at the table and they pass over the card in its clam like that when they see the money in the bank. >> That's it. You take the card, you leave, >> you go get it graded or you put it in a vault. You get back on an airplane and you fly with it. Whatever you have to do. That's how it's done. The trust is immense. It's just the market is a well-known mark. You just don't breach. You don't do that. Nobody does that. It's nobody does that. It just It's like a diamond merchant. If you did that in the streets of New York, your family would be banned for life and the next generation. >> You just don't do it. I was stunned. I couldn't even believe it. I mean, I just said, "No, >> this is after you already sent money." >> No, no, no, no, no. We were we were actually in the process of setting up a global live broadcast. >> Wow. >> To to to actually with a network I won't mention. >> But we were already and from Paris, you know, another frame was being built for that car. And all of this was arranged over a one-mon period. And everybody was flying to this location for the shoot which was going to happen at 5 in the morning [snorts] 8 o'clock East Coast time, New York time. And then of course in the afternoon in Europe it was going to be worldwide. And this guy just went awall. We thought something bad happened to him. It turns out he was trying to trade it to somebody else after an agreement had taken place. >> I mean it's not going to end well in terms of how tied up that card's going to be. It's I don't know what the resolution is going to be, but for the next 3 4 5 6 7 years, I think it's radioactive waste. >> Alongside cards in alternative investments, you have quite a few watches. I'm curious, first of all, when you check the time, which wrist do you look at? >> Well, left wrist is always local time. Right wrist is wherever um you know, the the majority of the phone calls are going to be this day. In this case, it's New York. So, it's New York time on the right, LA on the left right now. And I do that when I'm in Dubai or Switzerland. And sometimes I have three time zones. >> And so as a watch fanatic, let's say someone has a budget of 1,000, 5,000, we could throw 10 in there. >> Yeah. >> And then 25 and maybe a h 100,000. What is the perfect watch at those different prices? >> Yeah. I I get it. So, you know, this is a great question because I'm going to tell you a really interesting story about this. About 5 years ago, maybe it's six now. Uh this woman came out on the set of Shark Tank and she said, "Can I talk to you for a second?" I said, "Sure." you know, we break between hits or we get about 20 minutes while they set up the next pitch. And she said, "We're having a problem with the two watches." I said, "What's the problem?" He said, "Nobody can afford them. This show is about inspiration, about aspiring, about getting they start on the carpet. They want to become sharks. They want to become sharks. So, you have to stop wearing watches. No one can afford it. On your left, you can wear whatever you want. on your right has to be an entry- level watch. So, what's entry level? She said, "How about 200 bucks?" I said, "I don't wear $200 watch." She says, "You do now. From now on, you're going to wear something that people can afford." And I thought, "Well, that's what a you know," she was right because I immediately called Teddy Baldazar >> and we started doing videos together of every price point under 200, 200 to a,000, 1,000 to 2,000. And Teddy introduced me to all these incredible watch makers that make these amazing dials for like 1,700 bucks. But if you're buying a piece is to shorten this narrative here, cuz we've been going on for so long. But here's what I tell parents. They're always calling me up saying, "My son is graduating. My daughter's graduating. What do I do?" There are certain truths. Number one, tutor. You cannot go wrong with a tutor. It'll last your whole life. You know, the parent company's Rolex. People get it. But tutor is different. It's very very entrepreneurial in terms of case materials. You can get silver. You can get ceramic. You can get carbon. They got beautiful beautiful cases. And you know the black bay is an amazing it's the precursor almost of of almost every Rolex style. It's beautiful. Remember that these companies have been around a long time. Number two, Grand Seiko. Unbelievable quality. I mean just a spectacular watch. And these are sub $7,000. They're going to last a whole lifetime. No question about it. There's other places to go. Um, but those two represent in my view some of the greatest value on earth. Um, Japanese watchmaking is credor. They cost a fortune, but they're also owned by Grand Seiko. I the best advice I give is you go online and just look at any Teddy Beldar Kevin Olri video and there's that you're going to find 400 ideas and I wear those a lot. Google estimates your net worth to be 400 million. I don't think that's the case. I think that you based off of what you've said have more. Is 400 million accurate? >> You know what I learned again from my mother? Never boast about money or one day you won't have any. >> I never talk about my net worth. You know, it's it's it's I just think it's the worst thing you can do. It's almost bad karma. Like, look at how much money I have. >> Well, it doesn't have to be boasting. It could be >> But I don't I'm not like that. I just I don't, you know, I don't need more money. I need more time. That's the way I look at it. I don't want to with karma. I just never talk about it. People I've seen estimates all over the place. But let me ask you this. What percentage of your net worth would you trade to be 20 years old again? >> [gasps] >> Oh wow, that's a hell of a question, eh? I mean, I wish I could be 20 with what I have right now. I mean, what the things I could do with The trouble is I wouldn't know anything. That's the big dilemma about about this idea. It's what I know today and my experiences that make me what I am. And I wouldn't change anything. So I wouldn't even >> let's say you retain all of that and you just and you just you just can't get 20 years old again but you have to you have to say I'm going to give up 90 plus >> but the risk of that it's such a this would be a great movie script the risk would be you you get to go back but you start again with the outcome what would the outcome be you get more life you'd be like a vampire you go back to 20 but you don't know what the outcome could be you could have a horrible outcome I like this outcome I've I earned it I made it myself I made all those mistakes and look where I remember the first day of shooting Marty Supreme across from Timothy Shalamé with all those extras and for a moment I thought to myself, how the hell did I get here? That was amazing. How that's happened? And it's it's accumulation of all the things that occurred during your life that got you that point. So, I wouldn't go back. I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't trade it for anything. >> So, some more rapid fire questions. What was your personal best Shark Tank deal? >> Oh, uh, base paws cat DNA testing. insane return. >> What's the worst pitch you've ever seen? >> Oh, I've seen plenty. Um the the I've seen I've seen a pitch where a woman sang to a water cooler and said she could divide the the water into three elixirs that you could bottle and sell for $25. One that uh solved for jealousy, one that made you fall in love when you wanted to, and one that made you more productive. And I said to her, "You know, you sound insane." She said, "If I came here and told you I had an elixir full of cocaine and you drank it, would you invest in that?" I said, "No." "Well, that's Coca-Cola." Touche. >> Bitcoin price year end 2026. >> Uh, probably around here cuz I don't I'm not sure it's going to react until the uh Clarity Act is is if if the Clarity Act I'm going to answer it this way. If the Clarity Act uh is approved, Bitcoin will probably go back to that $100,000 range. >> S&P price year end 2026 >> up 8% from here. >> Gold buy or sell right now? >> Buy. >> Will AI replace more jobs than it creates? >> No, it's going to create more jobs. Everybody Everybody's got it wrong. It's just like, oh, you know, television destroy radio. No, it's not. We just don't know what the transition is going to look like. AI is going to be such a powerful tool. will create new industries we haven't even thought of. That's what's going to happen. >> Should a 25-year-old buy a house or invest in the stock market with that money? >> Um, I would buy a house. Um, and I would pay that mortgage off as fast as I can. It's it's it's always proven to be the best way to make money in America. >> At what net worth does life fundamentally change? >> 5 million. Liquid. Liquid. >> What would you say are the main four tiers of wealth where if you hit a certain amount, life? >> I tell everybody this. You should strive very hard if you're an entrepreneur to have $5 million in tea bills. Not in anything else, just tea bills. Making $3.82% this morning. You know you've made it and you've safeguarded your family for the rest of your life. If you can get $5 million liquid in tea bills, most people that consider themselves very successful entrepreneurs do not have $5 million liquid in T bills. They don't. But what net worth should you be at to h to to justify five million in T bills? >> Well, you should be at the first thing you should do is get to five million liquid. Be worth $5 million liquid. That's far more valuable than anything else. Liquidity with wealth is actually a superpower. Most people say, "I'm very wealthy," but they couldn't raise a million dollars by 2:00 in the afternoon if they tried. It's tied up in all kinds of things they think are worth a lot until the hits the fan. The plan is if you're an entrepreneur, the hardest thing is to make the first million really hard. And when you make the first million, put it in T- bills. Just as hard, but not as hard, is to get to 2 million. 2 to three is actually quite easy cuz you figured something out. But where you get undisiplined is you start buying you don't need cuz your mandates get to 5 million liquid. I you have to have 5 million liquid to call yourself a successful entrepreneur. And and I don't care who say who disagrees with me, they're wrong. >> But if you have a net worth of $5 million, why would it all be in T- bills instead of having it in S&P and international index funds? >> Because whatever happens, you're safe and your family. >> So you say get to 5 million T bills and then anything after that >> after that after that stick it in and I go into stocks, go into alternatives. The nut is $5 million. >> And so the next net worth with the highest quality of life change would be what? You know, once once you get to 50, you don't even need any more money. I mean, people say, "I want to buy a yacht and all this crap, but I didn't my life didn't change after I had $5 million very much." I mean, it's just, you know, I have a lot more now, but it it's other than watches, I don't do crazy stuff with money. What's one stock everyone should own? Oh, that's there's it's the index. That's what you should know cuz you can't ever get it right. >> Timothy Shalamé, is he a better actor or ping- pong player? >> He's a better actor. There's a lot of CGI in that. He can play ping pong though. He's a pretty good guitarist, too, by the way. That kid's pretty talented. >> Secret to building wealth in one sentence. >> Discipline. >> That was one word. Pretty good. >> Yeah. >> What's your number one regret? >> I don't have any. I wouldn't change a thing. >> Do you still want more money? And if so, how much? No, I don't want more money. I'm very fortunate I get more money because I really focus on what I do. Uh, but I don't need more. I need more time. >> Would you retire for $10 billion post tax right now? >> No. No. No interest in that. >> If you were to leave the viewer with one piece of advice, it doesn't have to be money. It doesn't have to be finance. It could be anything. What would it be? >> Figure out what's signal in your life and focus on that and avoid the noise. >> Cool. Kevin, thank you so much. We'll link to your info going. Really appreciate it. >> Thank you guys for watching. Until next time. By the way, if you enjoy this episode, we just posted our next one early for members. So, if you click the join button, you could literally begin watching our next episode right now. Really hope you enjoy it.