KERI Suite (KSWG) Monthly NAEU - 2026/09/08

Hey, Carly. >> Hi, Kent. How's it going? >> Well, the early bird gets the worm. We are the first two here. >> Yep. [laughter] Hey, can we add to the agenda very briefly that next meeting is two weeks before I present. Carrie said at um uh um URN said at the PIDFest p persistent identifiers in research. So, I have to pull together a presentation about that. And then I was going to I don't know give the highlights for confirmation at the next meeting. >> That's really cool. You should bring that up again when I'm I don't know if Phil is going to be here. If he is, then he usually runs the agenda, him or Sam. >> So, we can just mention that again when they jump on. >> Okay, sounds good. Morning everyone. We will get started here in just a bit when Sam shows up. >> I'm here. >> Oh, there you are. >> Aha, I see you. All right. This is the trust over IP carrier stack working group meeting. Sam, I'll pass it on to you to go ahead and get us started. >> Um, yeah, remind everyone of the antitrust policy notice. Um, if you're not a member of trust of the Linux Foundation, then you can observe, but you can't make any substantive contributions. Um, do we have any new members here for the first time? I don't see anyone. Looks like I recognize everyone uh there. So, let's uh jump to action items. Um first one is on the DOI process. We did some work on that. I don't think that's finished or is it finished? >> Yeah, >> it is. >> It's working now. Okay. >> Right. We will check. It consists of >> Yeah, it consists of a GitHub actions uh script that that does it for us as soon as we um we make a new version in GitHub. >> Okay. And then the version 1.1 branches for all three specs. I believe Daniel made made branches for those. So I think the next thing that we have the DOI would be to make the draft version of the spec be version 1.1. Is that correct? Daniel's here. >> Correct. >> Okay. So, we need to So, so we have branches. We need to move now that we have the one we need to um so so add add a new action item for next time um to move the 1.1 branches to be the main main draft version. And then we need to take the 1.0 branch make it it a release branch and then leave it alone. >> So move 1.1 branches of all three specs to be main >> to be main >> and move uh the 1.0 main to its own release branch. >> Okay. >> Anyone want to take ownership of that? That's a content content decision, isn't it? >> I'm more than happy to help out. So, >> the just the Caesar carry. >> Well, it needs to be somebody that's a m maintainer. >> Maintainer and someone who's familiar with specup T and what what >> what might be entailed there. >> Okay. >> Yeah, we will guide the process anyway, so don't worry. Okay. >> But it's it's >> Well, I'll you put me and Hank on that. We'll try to figure it out. >> Yeah. Because somebody has to decide over the content and then that's what we'll do. >> Okay. [clears throat] >> Uh this one is create issues for updating Wubby code and carry pie and assign to Kevin Griffin. >> I'll go check. I can't remember if I did that or not. I'll go check on that and check it off. If it's not, if not, I'll move it to next week, next month. Uh Kevin Griffin follow up on Ayana registration of well-known at Ubie. >> He is not here today. >> Okay. So I guess we'll move that. >> Yeah. >> Uh next week and maybe we can ping him. >> All right. All right. I'll ping him right now first before I move it. >> Um, so this one we have an action items review. So I guess we could put that in the discussion um uh to see if people want to do that or not. >> Okay. And the last one, the didds. I reviewed the DID web s specd draft. I found some some issues that I commented on. I don't believe those have been addressed. So, I don't think we're ready to approve the did what spec today. Somebody >> No, we are not. We have not your comments yet. >> Okay. All right. So, um, that's the end of action items. Um, >> and I'm break this guy off because we're reviewing him today. Okay. >> Yeah. >> And then, uh, uh, announcements. Um, I have a couple of announcements. Um it hasn't been uh detailed yet but um the SETI summit in November. Um the uh the state of Utah has got a website web link where you can go sign up and register. Um those people that are in the Kerry community can get a discount code through me. So, if you want to go to that summit and you want to get a steep discount, let me know and I'll give you the discount code. Um, the reason for that is the state of Utah is going to uh formally announce that they're going to publicly adopt Carrie and AC/DC. They haven't. >> So, you know, they they I mean, it's sort of like everybody assumed that's what they're going to do, but they but they didn't make a big deal. So they're going to have some Kerry sessions at that summit. So that's one announcement. So we'll be putting together some sessions for for that summit and the Kerry Foundation will probably be uh doing some demos and stuff like that as well and other people um you know uh uh that there might be some stuff there and that's a and we don't know what that how many sessions or you know what that looks like yet whether it's you know uh a couple a day or one day's worth or you know h how much it is we I I we don't No. Um, the other announcement is the pre the mini conference for prior to IAW. So that I believe that website's up, Hank, [clears throat] is that right? >> Yes, that's uh already on kerryconf.com. >> Yeah. So go to kerrycom.com and you can see that. Um, anybody uh I don't Is there a call for speakers on on there yet? >> Yes. If not, We we have you as a speaker and we know that Ryan is going there. Um I've asked around uh a few because it's always featured speakers. So we decide up front who we want to have there >> and um so I I I just checked the availability of people but we haven't uh decided yet who want to uh have there. So if anybody wants to speak or is planning to go there and feels like they you know that they they they'll be able there um you know let us know. So this is a call for speakers I guess. >> What's the what's the website I should be looking for? Kerry conference. >> Kerry comp. K I c nf.com. >> Got it. And it's the mini carrycon. Okay. Yes. >> The day before I so it's a single track in a single room in the same place as I think it's going to be room B. >> Yeah. >> So we get >> Yeah. So we have room B. So it seats about 30 people. Um so it'll be a um but it'll be uh just carry. Um, so if you can make it, if you're coming to IAW, you can come early for a day or a half day or something, you know, you can come to the come to the carry comp. There's a registration fee, but you get a discount for IW if you register for the carry comp so that it ends up not costing you um uh uh >> the registration fee. Yeah, of course. Yeah. >> But food will be provided. Uh the SETI summit if you register for that that includes food. It's at a ski resort in Park City. Um you you know they have they have a block of rooms available for people who want to stay at this stay there or not. Um so anyway uh those are the big big announcements. Uh a third announcement um uh of interest. Uh I wasn't there but at GDC last week uh ISO announced that they were going to remove the payw wall from their specs. >> Really? >> Yeah. >> And I and the scuttlebutt is that um it's because of MDL. [snorts] Um so a lot of the push back against MDL is it's an ISO spec and it's behind a payw wall. So people are saying well we can't adopt it. We can't we can't we can't as governments we can't adopt something that's behind a payw wall as a specification. That's just not going to work. >> But they could do that on a selective basis, right? >> Yes, they can choose. So they may may only do it for some specs, >> right? >> Talked about that as a big announcement and it is indeed a huge announcement. Another one that I heard about at GDC that I'm curious to know if anybody has better data about is the city of Lugano. Did anybody um [snorts] hear an announcement about the city of Lugano? >> Yeah, I I I I just saw in text somebody said that uh uh Lugano has decided to adopt Carrie. >> Wow. >> Yeah. This is what I heard is that Lugano basically said, "We don't like what the Swiss government is doing, so to heck with that. We're gonna adopt Carrie." >> Yeah. And Christopher Allen, I believe, is who they've who they've hired as consultant to help them with that. So, so kudos to Christopher Allen. Um, >> seems like an odd choice. No offense, Christopher. Just >> Well, no. Christopher was working with the with the Swiss government, but Christopher is not all in on, you know, things and uh and he and so apparently, you know, um so what they said is they're going to they're going to adopt STI. They didn't say they're going to adopt Carrie. They're going to adopt STI. >> But they Right. But that that implies they're going to adopt Carrie. >> Well, it's certainly going to imply it after Utah. [laughter] Yes. Yes. So anyway, so yeah, so that's all I heard. And so um but that's good. I I'm uh if Christopher Allen, you know, because he's always he's always gone his own way. He's always done his own stuff, but but he's never gotten, you know, a lot of traction, you know, but but you know, he's always doing really cool stuff with cryptography. So he's, you know, an identity, you know, he he was, uh, you know, been been around for a long time. So, so if, you know, if that's if that's true, then that's that's good. You know, love to see it. >> Is that Lugano spelled L U G A N O? >> Yeah, it's in the Italian side of Switzerland, which is the more um enjoyable one. How far away from where you lived in Switzerland is that Daniel? >> Um, well, it's um it's about two hours by train, but that kind of overstates the distance because, you know, you have to kind of go in and out of valleys and up and around curves and whatnot. So, it's really only about I don't know 75 or 100 miles away. But, >> Right. >> But going through the mountains, it's it takes a while. >> The tunnels go through the Alps. It's on the southern side. It's really a beautiful place. I've been there. >> Yeah. >> Anyway, so that's >> Yeah, I would like to add that I think Kerry Sweet got a lot of traction in Europe. Um I was in I wasn't at GDC in and I visited many of of the parallel sessions. Uh they didn't record it by the way. The carry conference has done that but they didn't record it. So you had to really choose. But what I where I was um there was always some uh you know Kerry um believer not even believer but also knowledgeable about Kerry and and and giving feedback to the to either the panel or the speaker. Um I didn't need to open my mouth or be a fanboy of Kerry. there was always somebody else in the room that um that stood up and uh and uh proclaimed um that there there should be a role for Carrie. That was great. >> That's good. [gasps] May maybe crypto periods has have finally finally become something that people take seriously. >> I think that's old thinking by N. [laughter] You can you can thank AI agents for that. [laughter] >> All right. Well, any other announcements from anyone? >> Uh, yeah, I have an announcement. >> Yes. So, next week I would like to put on the agenda that uh a a short review of what I'm presenting at PIDFest in 2026, unless unless somebody wants to meet with me separately to to do a a uh accuracy check, but I'm going >> Oh, that would be good. >> Okay. So, I'm going to be giving a presentation. I included the abstract and uh and I see I'm going to have to learn how to do more practical applications of setifi. So maybe can I will be reaching out to you. Um but anyway, I'm going to be explaining what a set is and why it's valuable in research for identifiers and that we have the URN said specification. I'm going to be presenting at the end of October in the Netherlands at the conference called PIDFest and I've included the abstract or records in the chat. >> Which date is that Kie? >> Pardon? Uh yeah. Um let me look it up. Pull it up on my calendar here. It's October October 27 to 29. >> That's great. I will be there. And where is it? >> It's in um it's not Amsterdam. It >> is [snorts] beside the Hag. >> All right. >> Yeah. >> If I can attend, I will. >> Oh, yeah. Either that or we could meet up separately. I know it there's a like there's a registration and stuff for VidFest, but there it is. It's at uh uh Leiden. >> Oh, Leiden. Yes. It's a quarter of an hour from here. >> It's like 25K. >> Okay. If anyone else is around Leiden and wants to meet up for dinner one night, let me know. >> That would be great. Yeah. So, can we just put I don't know as an action item for next week's discussion to to review that? I don't know if that's a Do we do that as an action item? >> I don't know how we do that. I'm going to put the abstract below this so it's not all in this grid right here. >> Okay. Any other announcements? [clears throat] Well, should we go to reports? anything um material to report on any on you know uh on the carry pie implementation or car or caria or signify ts. Yeah, one notable thing, I reverted some of the pull requests that I merged last week on the one to 14 branch and I'm just going to have them on the on the GLY fork for now. So, that's just to tie a loose end up, but that's all for me. >> Okay. Yeah. I um just as an overview there's work going on in carry pie in the main which is uh implementing uh 2.1 [clears throat] of the of the code which is 1.1 of the specs which is most you know there's um and there's a lot of uh new stuff to support SETI so I think that's where most of the most of the new work is um without going into a lot of detail. Um Sam, do you want me to report on the um uh Kerry conference uh learning system with uh now or is that later separate? Well, yeah. This would be the time to report on it if you want. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Well, you asked me a week ago to um to go through the recordings and what we've done with it um to create the um uh the learning system behind it. >> And but if you don't remember, we can also expon postpone it to the next one. So, you want to do a presentation go in detail? >> Yeah. >> Oh, [clears throat] okay. Well, let's let's um why don't since we didn't get it on the agenda um uh may maybe we should um give you you know um how long how how much time do you need for that? Is it like >> five or 10 minutes? I >> should be five. You said no. No. >> All right. So why don't why don't why don't we discuss the the the uh the the rename uh unique entropy thing and then and then we can um go over the learning thing. How's that? >> Sounds great. >> Okay. Do we want to open this guy here? >> Yeah. So, um >> I can just comment on this if you want, Sam. >> Yeah. Yeah, go ahead. So, um this this is something um I opened uh because I [clears throat] was actually actively reading the AC/DC spec and um uh I had a moment of what you might call I don't know um sel cognitive dissonance. >> Yeah. Well, first I had the sility then I had the cognitive dissonance. the sinility was I was reading this and I was like wait a minute we have a UYU ID in one of these fields and then after a minute I was like oh no no that's just a name that we're using to describe the U field the good old U field that I already know that's the dash >> or that that is the salty nons and I was like oh but for a minute my brain went to oh a UYU ID field so we're talking about RFC whatever it is um in the IETF world and we somewhere have a UUID field in the um structure of an AC/DC. And um so if you read the spec carefully, this um moment of dissonance goes away and you say, "Oh, never mind. Yeah, I know what we're talking about." But I still felt like it was worth asking, should we really be calling the U field a UYU ID when it's not an identifier in any sense of the word? It's just a salty nons. So that's why I wrote this up. Um I don't have like a ultra strong um argument to be made. It's I would say more of a kind of a purist argument that we probably shouldn't be calling something an identifier when it doesn't identify and we certainly shouldn't be picking a term that has a specific defined meaning that most developers in the world will assume that isn't actually what we mean. So I just proposed that we start describing the U field as unique entropy not a UYU ID. makes a lot of sense to me. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't I you know it's more historical that that UU ID was uh picked. So I would say UUIDs are salty nonses but their salty nonses used as identifiers. So I didn't have a better term for it at the time and just over the years it just w was the was the term. But, uh, you're not the first person who has who has read the spec who said, "Why do you have UU UIDs in there?" And then you go, "Oh, well, yeah." So, I'm So, I'm I'm happy with making the change. I just um um and I believe you already did pull requests, but they're probably outdated now um to make the changes. >> Well, this one was actually merged already. >> Oh, okay. >> So, let let me just talk about the scope of this. Um the the counterargument to be made for this is basically well yes fine. Um but uh we actually use this uh term uh far more broadly than you realize um because it's not just in the AC/DC spec. It's in a bunch of doc comments in Carry Pi and uh you know various other places that are less obvious and the scope of this PR is just in the AC/DC spec and I proposed um we could do a follow on to this if we wanted to go clean up some doc comments or something but I I that didn't seem as important to me as just the AC/DC spec so I just wanted to stop here. But um that's debatable. >> Yeah, I I I think if we put it in the spec, we should probably go through and clean up the comments in the code and stuff like that. There there are parameters insurgdc that set the U fields. Um uh so let's see or is it >> talk about talking about renaming parameters then it gets a little bit more questionable because then you're breaking a you know a an API of the carry pie library uh to rename a parameter on a function you know. >> So [clears throat] in version two that ship sailed a long long time ago. You can go ahead and rename. >> Yeah. So, so what we can do is leave the UU ID parameter as is, deprecate it, add a UE parameter, and then and but only do it in version 2.1 so it doesn't break any break anybody's code and it'll and we'll have a a couple years of of having both and then and then we'll deprecate it out. >> Okay. Well, I'm happy to do that follow on. Um but yeah, want to be clear that that hasn't been done yet, right? >> Yeah, it's just this. Yeah, if everybody if everybody's fine with that, you know, it it's a I I you know, don't have a pro problem with that. Appreciate the ef the work to to fix it. So, if anything, that's one of those things where once once you have it in place, it's like ah it's too much work to fix, but I I get the cognitive dissonance. Um so, great. So do we do do is it so so I guess uh do we have a motion to change the terminology from UUID to unique entropy in general specifically in the spec. >> Sure. I move that >> a second. Anybody object? >> I'll second it. Yeah. No. No. No. >> Okay. So it's passed. We'll we'll proceed on that basis. everywhere you see it in spec language uh change it from UU ID to unique entropy and >> can we comment on the fact that this was merged before we talked about it. >> Yes, that's why we put it on the list. But yeah, >> yeah, we probably shouldn't have done that. >> Yeah, I think I think um I think there's just a I think there was a miscommunication because of the uh the specup T stuff. some some changes that were spec related and other changes that weren't were getting merged and so that that shouldn't be happening. Um, >> that was my fault because I heard a general comment last time when Daniel wasn't there that all the all his PRs were were all right to merge. So that's why I asked court to merge them. >> So that's that's how it went. Yeah. So, it was a misunderstanding. >> Got it. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Cool. >> Good deal. >> Normally would we would never do that. Of course. >> As as far as merging stuff early, this one was pretty lowrisk merge. Um, but there's another one that I feel is more uh worrisome um that got merged and that's the one um with the postquantum codes. >> Yeah, that that Yeah. Yeah, that shouldn't have been merged either because we didn't even discuss that in the group or have anybody review it. So, it wasn't reviewed by reviewers. So, so the problem is is that there are multiple specs. There's Daniel is doing pull requests to version 1.1 and version one of the specs and some of those were okay to merge and some weren't discussed. And so, um, probably need to be a little more, you know, so if it if it was if we weren't clear, then that that's the problem. So, um, so we might have to revert that one on the Caesar spec until after it's reviewed. >> Okay. >> You want me to put that on a to-do list? >> Yeah. >> Do you guys use the GitHub thing about requirement review? >> Uh, generally I don't know on the specs though. >> Yeah, on the specs right now we don't have that in place. >> So, we should >> we should put that in place. Um there's a a lot of changes that were being made because of the specupt stuff which is >> kind of problematic in the sense that it's really not sub not changes to the specs in terms of normative content. It's changes to the specs in terms of the specup which is the rendering software. So, so we're bas So, our spec is not just >> a spec, it's also code >> because specupt is code. So, we're we're we're you know, we have two different types of pull requests. >> The pull requests that are changing specupt code and pull requests that are changing content and they and they've gotten confused. >> Wow. >> You have your own little rogue agent. >> Yes. And we tried to split that of course. Um but it's um hand work. It's manual stuff. So I made the mistake that I took a general remark about the quality and and acceptability of Daniel's um PRs and I said to Corwell, they're all good. You can just merge them. So normally I would not that of course. >> Yeah. Yeah. So no no worries. Um >> we tried to Yeah. So let's Yeah. So, so yeah. So, we can we can fix it. That'll be two items here for that. >> Yeah. All right. So, Hank, do you want to present on um >> Yep. >> What exactly? [clears throat] Just so I have it in the notes. >> It's on the Kerry Conference um um footage. So, all the footage and how what why we did what we did what we've done so far with it. And um I'll >> I can let you take over. >> Share the screen. Yeah, there we go. So you see the Car Foundation site and it's all on here the videos and what you see here is the 10 top 10 clips. It's interesting because there are very interesting oneliners and then you go exactly straight to that where that happens for example >> with just don't answer your phone >> and you go straight to that >> right or >> um all the um subtitles of the talks are have been edited curated um for the reason that we want to use them in training as well in in the future and how we do that. I will get to that. So everything has been curated. If somebody says something from from the room, there will be a dash in front of it and then that's most most of the times it's it's very late in the presentation. People start to to ask questions or to make remarks. Uh what we've done with this is um I went through it with a value system. And what is a value system? is the idea that uh uh decentralized or self-s sovereign identifiers have certain u principal values like for example first person control so we want to be in charge of our own identifier um there's like 30 of them and how we how we got them is from all these presentations during the Kerry conference I made one issue in the Kerry conference subtitles repo and I follow through this one. It's somewhere here I think. Yeah, the highlights carry conference talks. So what I did is I'm I try to distinguish unique values for um for carry for the carry suite itself. And of course we also have more common values that the carry suite has has but we share them with different other um uh identifier systems as well. for example, oorthth or open ID connect or whatever. Um, like for example, it needs to be inclusive. If you have a vendor lock, it's not inclusive. And there's more uh to to to name there. If it's not open source, it's not inclusive, etc., etc. So these are are basic core principal values of a digital identifier system of which Kerry owns I would say between uh um how you call that u well um I don't know the English word for it sorry but these these are own these values are owned by uh carry itself uh it's a perpetual identifier just to name a good example because all other other identifier systems have um they don't respect the crypto periods and um and Kerry does with with key rotation. So there's there's more of them. I think Kerry is one of them that will work at global scale and of course these are disputable but at least I went with these values principal values. I went through all the carry conference um talks and I labeled them per segment and that's what you see when you go here. This is the the uh a graph that has exactly all these uh value systems uh behind it and uh we labeled all the arguments that we have to use for carry for example first person control. It's very nerdy. Uh we won't present this to anybody else than just for you. Um because I think we you might you might like graphs and and the way we label them. Um but of course we want to have a a UI on top of that that is able to to uh answer questions that people have about the carry suite and why they should choose it over any other uh solutions. um we want to feed that uh question and response system with this graph. What you see here is all the presentations and also every um um slide deck that we've received from the speakers. You can find that as well here as a as a PDF. And what we've done, if you go to YouTube, maybe Cora, you could help me out how I could do that. But um I I think Kora is in the in the meter. Just >> Yeah. How can I go to um YouTube? >> All right. Um today, so the the title of the talk is fire and CMS. Um and we'll talk a lot about >> I'm not sure if you can already. >> Okay. So you have to >> I have to cross link them. Yeah. >> Oh, you have to cross link it >> about that. Oh, sorry. >> I don't think there's a YouTube link yet. >> Yeah. >> So, what you what you can do here is if you see a certain part from in this case Jared that has value for somebody for for some of your relationships, you can simply go to that specific part. And >> I actually want to spend a little bit of time today going over what the vital framework is. It's actually the vital >> and then take another step somewhere. You copy it >> um >> and you go to the end and copy it again. Then you have a sort of a URL here. I will stop >> this URL here above in the bar. It says exactly from um time 19 to time end time 143. And you can send that to anybody. Um I will paste this one in in the in the chat of uh of the Zoom. Then you can uh see the proof that that it works. So what this means is that you can go to any uh Kerry conference uh u session and pick any uh segment of it and send it to somebody else. Um the segments are in YouTube. I'm I'm not sure whether I can go there quickly but uh we'll we'll spare that for the next time and show it to you how how all the segments that are labeled with the carry value system um get a get a sort of I I think I can go this way here beginner expert could you help me out go to uh here this is I don't need this time so these are all the segments that uh comply with that the the this specific value here. So first person control I go to more and I get all the segments in the videos of of the car conference that mention um this quality this principle value of uh an identifier system for example this one so and you can also go back so you go to the specific segment and this case it's I think it's I see Sam talking there um and then you can also go back to that visualization of uh the the value system. The good thing about the value system and that's my final remark here is that it doesn't mention carry u for maybe once or twice but we try to keep at all the word carry for for people that use this because of course we we want to um sell it so to say as um agnostic even agnostic to carry but finally they want all these principal values and then there's no other way out then just carry that was my presentation are there any questions about it would love to hear them >> I don't have a question but that's a really cool uh tool that you've created there love the node graph very cool ink >> thank you I hope you're happy with my segmentation of your talk I you can go and check if you have any >> yeah any remarks just um they they're on um in that um repo with subtitles. There's every talk has its own subtitle and segments there. >> Okay. >> Would it any other remarks? >> Well, thank you for your attention. >> This is great. >> This is really really good work. Is there a link to mine by the way or anywhere? >> Sorry again. Michael, >> I was saying this is really good work. I was just curious if there's a link to my talk in here or a reason why it was removed. >> Um I can't remember a talk on the Kerry conference in April of yours. Uh it it is in the SEI you have been speaking at the SEI conference and we have those two. So I will again share and quickly show it to you where it is. So this is um here let me see Gary conference go back >> awesome okay >> here you can find it here the SETI conference and about around here >> we didn't by the way we haven't segmented these u um videos yet but that's still work in progress but you must be somewhere around here yeah there you are >> thank you so much wonderful >> there you are >> hey um I want to just uh independently chime in and say that um I discovered what Hank had been doing because I um was asking an AI to help me research um what was uh documented about uh observers and registars and I said um you know let's go look through um the code bases and and all of the um uh specs and let's go look at Sam's uh white papers website and anywhere else you can find. And what's great is the AI came back and said, "Well, there was a carry talk by Sam given on such and such a date, and I found all the transcript of it, and here's where I found it, and it's at offset such and such." So, um it's just really cool that, um that information is now findable. Um so, it's really awesome, Hank. >> That's fantastic. And it's also core of course it's not my work only. Uh I've been doing the content core has been um up the website with these um uh fantastic blogs to to click on and uh make it all work. >> That's great. >> Yeah, this is really good work. Thank lot of lot of lot of work put in. So, so when you guys participate in the carry conferences, you're you get to have your your your stuff immemorialized. Um, >> what do you mean you get to >> No, that's cool. That's pretty cool stuff. >> I got to make sure everything's right for make sure it's correct. Um Hank, if we wanted to put a bookmark in um our browsers to, you know, kind of find this kind of content, is there something that starts at the level of here's all Carrie conferences and then below carry conferences we you know recurse in and find the video for specific conferences and so forth or is it just >> uh at an individual conference level? Yes, we we we set up the Kerry Foundation website uh in a way that we can uh archive every single conference under um oh I don't share my screen yet but um so if you go to the Kerry conference website there is a menu and it's called you can help me out where you go uh >> archive >> archive where is it [laughter] there should be an archive here let me see resources, careers, good question, Daniel, because I can't find it myself. So, there should be a >> link. It's on the Kerry conference site. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, you're right. It's on the Kerry conference site, not on the Kerry Foundation site. Then you find archive. There you find Kerry Conference 2026. So, we can add more menu items there. And uh uh we'll we'll have the the also the recordings under that submen. >> That's great. Okay, >> I'll put a link to that in the uh notes for today. >> All right. Well, if uh our Well, if you're done with that, I guess we can give people back 15 minutes on their day. That um >> Sounds great. >> Yep. >> All right. Thank you everybody. >> Thanks everybody. Bye-bye. >> Later. >> Byebye. >> Cheers. Oh, I remember you weren't in because the sponsorship was last minute, correct? At least we have you at CD in November 2025. Ow!