Israel and the Kurds: Why two people see each other as natural allies

Now, Kurds and Jews have often described each other as natural allies, two peoples with long histories of persecution, displacement, and struggles for self-determination. Israel was the only country to openly support the Kurdish independence referendum back in 2017, and Kurdish flags are still sometimes seen alongside Israeli ones at demonstrations and cultural events. But, despite decades of quiet ties and public sympathy in much of the region, even openly supporting relations with Israel, can carry a political cost for the Kurds. Joining us in the studio is Kurdish-Swedish journalist Suzan Quitaz who has argued for a much deeper strategic partnership between Israel and the Kurds, and Yehuda Ben-Yosef, president of the Kurdish-Jewish community in Israel. So, I'd like to thank you both so much for joining us. Yehuda, I actually want to start with a little bit of history about the Kurdish-Jewish population. We know that Kurdish Jews have lived in Kurdistan for centuries, but how much of that connection would you say is still alive in Israel today? >> The connection is all over the years of Israel who's very good connections. We keep on connection. Not only the community, all the state of Israel with the good connection with the Kurds. As you know, when Mullah Mustafa Barzani was in Kurdistan, the Israeli government sent the soldier to to to help him to do things about it. And the connection between the government and the and Mullah Mustafa Barzani, it was our community that talked the language and and interesting very very very carefully. As you know, the Jew lives in Kurdistan 3,000 years. After the temple is broken, we are immigrate to Kurdistan, and we stay until three times that the Kurds of the Jew coming to Israel. In three times they are coming. First in 1818, they're coming. They're coming >> Mhm. >> uh They're coming first to Jerusalem, the holy land, you know, the holy the holy city for the Jew. And coming to Alqosh, it's some a little village in the north in to Segwa. And uh uh coming to from to be Zionist here in Israel. After that, they're coming from 19 26 to 1936, a lot of them coming. My grandfather >> Your grandfather. >> coming in Yes, he was the big rabbi. Uh we say in Hebrew Haham Bashi of of of the Kurds the Jew Kurds in Dohuk. So, he coming dream about Israel is existing. So, he go by walk to Damascus. And Damascus was a train for the autonomic train coming from Rosh Hanikra inside to Jerusalem. And they're coming to to what we say in Jerusalem Nahlaot. And we call him Shkunat Hakurdim, the the neighborhood of the Kurds of Jerusalem. And all my cousin uncles was in the Mahteret. They fight to to Jerusalem to Israel exist. So, >> Yeah. >> we all this time we was with the good connection with the Kurds. >> really maintained a a relationship. But Susan, when you speak to Kurds today, you know, whether they're in the diaspora or actually living in Kurdistan itself, how is Israel actually viewed? >> So, Israel is viewed very positively. And to answer that question, I will tell you a bit about my family history. >> Mhm. >> So, uh in 1980s, the Iraqi Arab regime, they decided to deport Kurds. Uh they deported about half million. Our crime was that we are Kurds. We were the lucky one. So, after they took everything, they revoked our nationality. Uh they just kicked that kicked us out to Iran where we went to the Kurdish region in Iran. Um, so we were deported because we were Kurds in Iran. Constant discrimination against the, you know, the Kurds. So my family had to leave Iran to go to Syria. And I'm talking about Syria during Hafez al-Assad. I will tell you, I lived in Syria to the age of 12 where I actually thought I was an Arab. Why did I think I'm an Arab? Because in Syria you would face jail. You would go to prison. You would be tortured and you sometime you would be killed if you talk about openly about your Kurdish identity and you speak Kurdish. And now 10 years ago, I came to Israel. So remember, uh, I just mentioned Iraq, I mentioned Iran and Syria where Kurdish identity is severely suppressed and discriminated. And I remember where I when I landed to Ben Gurion Airport and the border police he asked me because it said in my passport Baghdad. And he said to me, are you are you Iraqi or you Arab? And he trust me for the first time in the Middle East, I said to him, no, I'm Kurdish. He didn't laugh at me. He actually said, ah, are you from Zakho or you from Arbil? He knew what Zakho is. He knew what Arbil is. You have more than 50 million Kurds, minimum 50 million Kurds who lives in what we call like Kurdistan divided between four country. Till today, Arabs, Turk, Iranian, they deny our right to exist while Israel recognize there is the Kurdish nation. In Israel, you know, as a Kurd, I'm proud to to say I'm Kurd. I'm proud to celebrate my Kurdish identity, my Kurdish culture. So to answer your question, that summarize to you how Kurds view Israel. >> Is is that understood though widely by the Kurds that this is accepted that your identity is accepted accepted and even celebrated here in this school. >> Of course. As just Yehuda said, you know, we talked about Mullah Mustafa Barzani. Mullah Mustafa Barzani is a is a national leader. Like, you know, he's legendary. All Kurds know him. When he wanted to come for medical treatment, he came to Israel. And a few weeks ago, I met a former IDF soldier and he said to me with such a pride, he said, "When I was a young soldier, when I was 19 years old, I was one of the soldiers who actually protected Mullah Mustafa Barzani when he get treatment in Hadassah Hospital." Kurds know that. You know, in 1960s, when the Kurds came under attack by the Iraqi Ba'ath fascist regime in Iraq, who helped us? Israel helped us. >> Is that why you think that there I mean, why do you think that there is this kind of you know, natural ally description that is shared by both Kurds and Israelis? >> First, I tell you the Jew all over the world suffer for a lot of people. In Kurdistan, they suffer, but not a lot. You don't see pogroms. You don't see things that you do to the Jew. Because we find a way to live together there in in Kurdistan. And if we if you live good with with with the best place there they are here there, it's built connection. Mullah Mustafa Barzani, when he come to Israel, he want to see someone. He say, "I want to see Khwaja Gabbay." Khwaja Gabbay was someone in Tiberias. >> Mhm. >> He was very rich in Kurdistan. And Mullah Mustafa Barzani remember him like a rich man. >> Yeah. >> So, when he come, my uncle was in the place that what I do now. And these days, we don't Facebook, Instagram, you have to find him. So, we find this man and he have a little shop in Tiberia. He he sells vegetables. And they come together and they hug every one of them. >> Hug one another? >> Yes, another. And they take Hawaja goodbye to Kurdistan, make him a travel and back to here. So, you see what is the relationships between the people there and the people over here. >> Mhm. >> The second things, as you know, the enemies of Kurdistan, they are they are our enemies. So, the same enemies. Another things that um that uh in the Kurdistan the religions, it's not matter. You are Jew, Muslim, uh Christians, >> Right. Kurdish identity is what trumps that. >> You you never ask him what what what is your religions. They they want only to know you are a Kurdi and you kill the non-Kurdi. >> Right. So, you know, I want to turn back to you, Suzanne, really just talk about, you know, what needs to change, if anything, to I guess make this relationship a more public one and to really promote relationships between Israelis and Kurds. I know there's a lot of sensitivity around this issue because of issues of safety. >> Yes. So, when Gideon Sa'ar was appointed to his position in 2024, I was living in Israel. And when he talked about the Kurd and he said the Kurds are our natural allies and the Kurdish nation is a great nation. You have no idea [clears throat] this man became like a rock star. >> Mhm. >> It among the Kurd in in Kurdistan and Kurd in diaspora. I'm as a Kurd, a million of Kurd, we really appreciate the moral support we get from, you know, politician likes him. We do appreciate that, but we need more. We need more. You know, it's great like we have all these political statement, but we need more cooperation. And yes, the Kurds uh living in a very sensitive neighborhood. I'm not saying that everything should be out in the open. But Israel need to open a direct communication with Kurdish leadership. And you know, to foster a stronger relationship. The same relationship we had like back in the 1960 with the Kurds in in Iraq. We we really need that. And another things I will emphati- emphasize on is the Jewish community and the Kurdish community, especially in diaspora. This is a great opportunity. If these two people could work together. And I you know, I'm sure Yehuda could fill you more. Like what more we could do like you know, to strengthen this relationship between the two. >> The reason the reason we the relationships between Israel and Kurdistan is on the table. It's be because Israel want to care about the Kurdistan. If the Kurds say we're on relationships with Israel, you know, all your enemies coming on the poor autonomic. And it's be very bad situation. As you know, as now a lot of missiles coming on Arbil from Iran. >> Right. >> Second things that you don't remember. The only prime minister that support independent of Kurdistan who is was You know? >> Yeah. >> Benjamin Netanyahu. >> Yes. >> When when Masoud Barzani want to independent of Kurdistan, the only >> supporter was >> supporter was from Netanyahu. Only all over the world. >> Yes. All right. Well, I'd like to thank both of you so much for joining us. It's really really fascinating to hear about the history of the [clears throat] you know, Kurdish Jewish population. Also about your experience as a Kurd here in Israel. I I think the work that you're doing is hopefully going to contribute to some level of change. Thank you so much for joining us. >> Thank you so much.