If You Love Working Out, You Probably Need to Hear This | Mind Pump 2936

You've probably heard people say, "Eat less and move more." That's the formula if you want to get in shape. But here's what we say. Many of you need to eat more and move less. Here are the signs that this is what's going to actually improve your health and fitness. Do the opposite. Eat more, move less. Let's go. >> Can't wait for these comments. [laughter] >> Yeah, these are great. >> No. So, this is for uh I want to be clear, right? This is not for the person that doesn't work out and uh who eats kind of, you know, whatever they want, eats a lot of heavily processed foods and let's just say garbage, right? This is for the fitness fanatics. This is for the person that's super into fitness, that's super consistent. Often times, these are callers, right? Often times we'll start the show, we'll have callers call in and they'll tell us about their issues and why they're not progressing or or what is it? Why can't I not progress or I'm plateauing? And our advice revolves, I mean, generally around this. Often times we tell people, you got to eat more and you got to move less. And when they listen to us, they come back 30 days, 60 days later and they're like, I can't believe that worked. I can't believe eating more and moving less. Uh, you know, again, generally speaking, uh, really is what got me to a better place in fitness. And so, these are the people that we're talking to, and you know who you are if you're listening right now. >> Yeah. And I mean, we've we've had different clients that fit that category. And like I would say it's more of like a perma cut. It's almost to the point where, you know, they're just always so conscious about trying to to to to keep their weight at a certain amount and um to make sure that their cardio is there, to make sure that they're eating underneath and, you know, playing that like that calorie game uh for so long and and then to get them to eat is like transformative. >> Totally. One of the last clips that um Josh had me shoot for Instagram um it's it's going right now. It's performing pretty good. It's similar uh similar topic, right, with like if you're in a plateau, you're not getting any stronger, what are some of the things? And it basically my point of that clip was if you're listening to this clip, that means you're getting served up fitness content, which means you're probably into hardcore into fitness. And there's a good chance reducing your volume, reducing your training, uh will give you more results. And I think this is very true for the the fitness fanatic or the person who has been working out for a decade and they're consistent as hell and they love to they love to train. Uh not so much for the general pop. And so I think >> that's the the clear message here is that like okay, yes, when we're talking to general population, most people need to move more, probably eat less. But when you're talking about people that have been consistently working out and they are health conscious and they train very consistently, uh many of them love to train four, five, six times a week, sometimes seven, some double days. those people uh would benefit from moving less and eating more because what has happened is they are just constantly breaking down and caught in that recovery trap you talk about where >> they're they're never adapting and growing and building. They're constantly their body is in def on defense all the time because they're constantly hammering it. >> Yeah. This is also a word of caution for beginners because often times what a beginner will do, right? somebody who is moving from a place of I don't exercise I eat whatever I want and suddenly I'm very motivated I want to get into shape and then they make the mistake of going too hard doing too much eating too little right so they go way they take the pendulum and they swing it way in the other direction and they uh run into a wall uh they initially get some good results and then they find them themselves in a place where they feel like they're doing so much work they're eating so little nothing else is happening and then they eventually uh fall off because it's like this totally isn't worth it. So, there's a few signs uh that we're going to talk about today, and there's more than the ones that we're going to spell out today, but these are the big ones that this may be you that if you have one or more of these signs, if they resonate with you, eating more and moving less may just be the formula that you need. And here's the first one. Uh you're worn out. You're just worn out. You work out all the time. You watch what you eat. Uh and yet, the only time you have energy seems to be for your workout. You show up for your workout, you take your pre-workout, your caffeine or whatever, you do your thing, you get that cortisol spike. By the way, cortisol is an essential hormone. You need it. Um, but if you're constantly redlinining and undereating, more cortisol in the short term can feel good because cortisol will initially give you a little boost of energy. So, this is the person who's like, I got no energy for the rest of the day. I feel tired. I feel burnt. I'm always sore. Uh, but then I do that hardcore workout class. No, this is the one I love and suddenly I feel great. Um, and that's why I do it. Makes me feel good. But if you were being honest with yourself, you really only have energy for your workouts. You really only have energy for that. And everything else kind of feels like you need more. You're kind of dragging. Uh, you're worn out. By the way, as a experienced coach, I hate to say this, this is very true and I know Adam and Justin will agree with me. Often times we'll get callers that'll call in and when they call in, they call in, we can see them. We get it's like a Zoom call. >> Often times by looking at their face, >> I could tell >> just by looking at their face, I could tell >> Y >> you're overdoing it. You've got that worn out look. You've got that worn out fitness look where your face shows an age older than you actually are. Even though you're consistent with your workouts, even though you're eating quote unquote in a perfect way, you've got that worn out look. Now, the average person uh can't necessarily pick this up, but as an experienced coach, um just cuz I've worked with so many people, often times I see it. I see the person. In fact, I can see this in the gym. I'll go work out in the gym. >> Tell a lot. >> Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I was going to say because even too, you're watching your client as they're exerting themselves. and you can know right away if they're they're sort of like tunnel vision or if they're kind of hitting a wall or you know there's a lot that that you could uh receive information wise from just looking at their eyes. I'm glad you went the worn out direction instead of focusing on the constantly sore one because that can be a signal too, right? When someone's always sore all the time. Totally. But I actually find it more common that the person who trains, you know, five, six days a week consistently, and has been for a really long time, they don't get sore anymore. They they they've gotten to a point where their body has adapted to this just getting beat up like that all the time, but it's not changing. It's not growing. It's not they're not seeing body composition change. Um, and so and they think because they're not constantly sore that, oh, they're not doing enough and I could have pushed more. And so I like that you went the worn out cuz one signal can be right like for sure, especially my beginners. If you're a beginner and you're you're constantly habitually sore, there's a good chance that you're just you're overreaching. You need to scale back intensity. But if you're somebody who's been training for years consistently, many times you're not getting sore hardly at all. And so you think that it's a problem with >> say never get sore. >> Yes. So you think it's like I need more volume. I need more intensity. I could have pushed further because I didn't even get sore. >> I'm so glad you said that, dude, cuz I I totally forgot about that. You know, I had an experience with that years ago where uh years ago I'm like, you know what? I'm going to work out like they did in the 70s. I'm going to do twice a day workouts. This was crazy. It's crazy, right? It's like double split routine, doing all this stuff. And I remember by week two or three, I wasn't getting sore anymore. And I thought, "Oh, this is a good thing." But just worn out. I was just destroyed. And I just had no energy throughout the day except for those stupid workouts. Like that's all my energy went into those workouts. 100% right. I just wasn't I wasn't sore. And I thought that was a good thing. I thought that would meant I >> I actually think that's probably more common. I think the um overly sore is more common to a beginner who's overreaching and doing too much. >> I think the advanced person who's been lifting for a long time, they they correlate, oh, I'm never sore, so I I'm definitely not pushing too much. That's right. And so they think they're that they're not doing but they're already way beyond uh too much and that's why their body is not seeing change anymore. And actually taking that person and scaling them back to the advice you started this with and you know moving less or training less and eating more will result in better results. >> Totally. Uh here's the next thing and this this you really have to do uh some self-examining. uh if you find yourself sacrificing more important things for your workout and your diet and this is a common thing now sacrifice is important like if you if you live a healthy life there are things you're going to have you are going to have to live differently that's just the fact right if you follow the world uh the world's default is poor health so I'm not talking about living differently what I'm talking about is you miss birthdays you miss dinners you skip certain things or certain holidays or you celebrate certain holidays. Maybe you show up, but you don't celebrate the holiday with other people because it's off my diet >> or no, oh my gosh, if I miss my, in fact, I'm going to organize this vacation, that was me, around my workouts or this event around my workouts because God forbid I miss a single workout or god forbid I eat a meal off my meal plan or I don't track the macros. This may be, in fact, this may be a question you ask the people closest to you. Hey, do am I inflexible? Yes. >> With my diet and exercise? >> Am I being annoying? [laughter] >> I'll say yes. >> Yeah. Like this is this this this is a problem. By the way, you have made your workouts a stress. You have made your diet a stress. You're not really living your life, or should I say your workouts and your diet are not improving the quality of your life. They've become your life. They were never designed to become your life. exercise and diet were made or when they're should I say when they're done properly uh improve the quality of your life. They don't become your life. >> Don't you feel like this is one of the really tough ones for people to see? >> Totally. >> You know, because becoming this person who has become so consistent and track your food and do all the things, they've obviously seen some of the benefits of that, right? You're organized, your meals are prepped. You could argue it saves me money. I'm healthier because of that. I stay in great shape because of that. >> And so this is a tough one, I think, to get somebody to kind of uh let the reins go a little bit. >> Well, it masquerades as discipline. >> Well, yeah. I think it also it creates this like me versus everyone else. Totally. you know, like you you kind of corner yourself as like, well, I'm, you know, I'm doing all the right things and you guys just need to get on board. And then you kind of start isolating yourself uh from, you know, instead of u really leading as an example and like, you know, immersing yourself uh with your friends and family and whatnot. But yeah, it's I I see that a lot where people just get really into it and then just kind of push everybody else. I always wonder if like if I would have experienced the whole competing thing earlier in my life versus later if it would have had a different like outcome from it. Meaning uh >> like I was so ready to be done with that. I mean I was there was there was no there was no like new this is my identity and and like I >> I remember it. You hated it. >> I hated it. I hated it. >> In fact, you hated being the guy on the show. >> I hated it and could not wait >> watching you flex. Yeah. It was awkward. I was so over all of it and didn't like it and yet absolutely saw lots of benefits from it. I mean, obviously I was in the best shape of my life. I was the strongest I was. I looked the best. I there was value in >> Oh, yeah. There I could go down the list of all these things that I could see could become very addictive. Uh but be and I think and that's why I'm wondering is like man maybe if it was like if I was 25 and I went through that uh process versus in into my 30s uh would I have experienced that different? Would I would I have become more of a person who identified as that is what I'm saying. I see what you're saying. >> Yeah. Cuz I went into it with a very different >> You already had a pretty strong identity going into it. You knew why you were going to do it do it. It wasn't like I'm going to be this bodybuilder. It was more like this is a great way to build the social platform to work in fitness. It's a great way to show social proof that I know what I'm doing. you kind of already knew who you were, but I could see in your 20s, I don't know. >> Praise, you know, it becomes Yeah. something everybody's sort of acknowledging like, "Wow, that's so impressive." And you really builds up your ego, >> right? Is there That's why I'm wondering is like, is there a type of avatar that that tends to fall into this trap course? >> Like a person who gets all that admiration for the first time in their life, like, "Wow, I've never they receive all these compliments. This is who I am." they they they are the most confident they've ever been because they feel really good about their butt. Like, you know, and that's what I mean is like maybe when I was going through more of an impressionable time in my life >> and then that was formed, it would have been a harder pull. Um cuz it's hard sometimes. I know I can talk about this because I've had so many clients and so I can I can relate to the clients and talk about it, but I didn't I didn't experience this personally. Personally, it was uh couldn't wait to not do all the >> Well, you know, you know what's interesting for me because I've gone through lots of cycles of this process. This is can still be a struggle for me, but it's not like it used to be. I'm definitely better, much more self-aware around it, but it still can become can be a struggle for me. But, you know, one of the ways that I noticed or one of the differences that I noticed for myself with this was when I used to go out with friends and family, what people used to point out or or or mention was just how disciplined and strict I was when we would go out or do things. They noticed that when we'd order food or we'd go to the movies or it was a holiday, how S ate specifically a way and didn't miss workouts. And I identify with that. Like it's cool. Yeah. You're going to point out the fact that I don't eat candy at the movies. You're going to point out the fact that uh at the celebration I'm not doing these things. Like yeah, that's because I'm disciplined. I identified with it. Here's what's funny. Here's what's different now. Now, when I do certain things or I celebrate, people are shocked that I'm having a piece of cake. Yeah. And they'll say, "Wait, I thought you were a fitness guy. >> What are you doing eating a piece of cake? I thought you were a fitness guy." Yeah, I'm at a birthday. >> I'm at a birthday. We're celebrating someone's birthday. I'll have a piece of cake or I'll go to the movies, which I don't do every week. You know, once a month or if or less, I'll go to the movies and they'll notice I'm buying some candy to eat. And I went with a buddy of mine not that long ago. And I remember him looking at I'm having gummy bears. And he's looking at me like, "What's this guy doing?" And so he thought he said, "Man, you you work out so much that you could just eat this stuff all the time, right?" I'm like, actually, I almost never do, but I'm at the movies and it's, you know, I'm kind of hanging out with you and it's okay, [laughter] >> but you know, it's okay that it's not a big deal. Uh, but it was uh it was it's a totally different um experience whereas before I was never flexible. I I ne I sacrificed things that were much more important uh than, you know, me being perfect with my workouts. You know, I sacrificed the celebration of the birthday. I sacrificed the meal that someone might have made because I got to be on this on the strict regimen. You know, here's the next one. Uh you're super lean all the time. Now, yes, there are those people out there that this is they've got those genetics that allows them to walk around shredded all the time. This is extremely rare, everybody. Okay? Very rare. This is like less than 1% of the population [snorts] >> who seem to somehow walk around super lean. everybody else. If you're a woman and you're walking and you're a fitness fanatic and you're walking around in the teens all the time, you've never you've been in the 16% body fat range for years or you're that dude that's always at 9% body fat for years and years and years. You got to eat more and move less. Dude, here's here's your evidence. When you look at maximum fitness performance, endurance, strength, stamina, generally speaking, body fat percentages are higher. Women don't aren't 15%. They're typically 20%. Men are typically 15%, not 9%. Why? Because you need body fat. You need some body fat for health and longevity. You can't be shredded all the time. This is really evident sometimes in our callers when we'll get, especially female callers, they'll call in asking us why they can't build a butt or why they can't improve their their deadlift and they'll tell us their DEXA scan and it's 15%. It's like, how long you been 15%. Oh, you know, the last eight years. Okay, you need to gain some body fat. That's your problem. You're not eating enough. You know, that's >> remind me. I don't want to to hijack where you're going right now, but we did uh Karen did her next Dexus scan, so I have a lot to share to this point. >> Um because it's just it's given me even more insight uh in regards to what you're talking about right now. And I want to be able to share I hope she doesn't mind um that I share the numbers and stuff like that because I think they're important to highlight the point uh uh that you're making right now and how detrimental it can be if you don't >> get out of that place because then you get stuck in this place where your body won't respond and then your bone density goes down and all the other things that happen with that. And so, um, yeah, I have an update, uh, for the audience that's been asking and waiting for like some of the things that we've been doing and a lot more, uh, a lot more we have to do to get to where we want to be. For sure. >> Yeah, that's good. >> Yeah. Well, I mean, too, uh, a lot of times people are in that comparison trap where it's like a social media thing. It looks like these people are lean year round and it looks like it's very much a perception thing where you could take a lot of pictures and you could go through phases where you're that lean but you want to portray yourself as always this lean person. Um so I mean it's it's again like that that could also be you know in itself it's very you know alluring and it's something that like people want to like have goals towards but you know to maintain that it's you're just not in a healthy place. Well, that to Sal's point about that's 1% of the population and then I'd say then because right now so many more people see that to your point because uh 15% or is [ __ ] you know, or 20% or whatever, >> like the 1% actually could like maintain. >> Yeah. a very small percentage that actually do maintain it and it's actually okay. You know that that that the genetic anomalies, right, that exist. >> And then there's a whole bunch of people that fake it by taking a bunch of photos at a certain amount of time and then dripping it over the year that make people believe that they're maintained that way. So for the average person who's tuning in to uh Instagram and YouTube and the social media world, they have no idea that what's going on there, that there's one a very small percentage of people that can and should even be able to maintain that. And then there's this large percentage of these people that act like they're that 1% and they're not even really that 1%. They're just staging photos in one month and then dripping it throughout the year. Well, what's funny too is uh you get this weird really strange perception uh drift where >> you think you look best shredded uh whereas gaining four or 5% body fat actually makes you look a lot better. This is true for both men and women especially women >> but uh even true for men like you know I could get down to 7% and be shredded when I get my body fat up to 11 12%. My wife will tell me you look much better. >> Katrina never liked what I look like on stage. She hated that like the last head look. >> Oh yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. And and you'll see this with the women. They walk around 15 16% and just gaining four or 5% body fat. They look good. You know what it is? They look healthier cuz they are healthier. >> You know what's funny is that uh the you know that the old saying the the camera adds 10 pounds or whatever. >> It only looks okay or good on a picture on in a in a picture or on camera >> in a fitness context. >> Yes. In in real life it doesn't look bad. Which is funny because I think that's the part where people get misled is they look back at this picture and they're like, "Oh, that looks so" But it's like, "No, in real life it doesn't look that good. It actually looks better for you to be a little bit." >> Here's here's another one. Um, you haven't improved objective performance in a long time. This is a sign you're working out too much and you're not eating enough. It's like, has your strength really gone up? Has your stamina gone up? or are you kind of staying the same while you're eating low calorie and making every single workout? In fact, often times uh with a client, all I would do is bump their calories and suddenly they're hitting PRs. I'd have them bump their calories 700. I said, "All right, fine. Keep training like you are, even though it's too much. Let's have you eat 700 more calories." And they come back, I'm like, "Oh my god, I added 30 lbs to my squat." >> It's like, "Well, yeah. Oh my god, my energy is through the roof. What's going I'm sleeping good again. What's happening? >> You're you're not redlining everything. You're just eating more." Yeah. Um, and that's, you know, your performance isn't a perfect metric, but it is an objective metric. Looking in the mirror and and you know, judging how you look, there's so much subjective to, you know, quality to that where you could really fool yourself. You could even be fooled by other people. You could be in a fitness fanatic circle of people that will tell you how awesome you look even though you're unhealthy. But, you know, strength, that's objective. You either lift more or you don't. Stamina, that's objective. Uh, you either are able to do more or not. And when those haven't improved in a long time, uh you may just need to eat more. That'll make the difference. Uh and then here's the final one. It's not joyful. This is not a joyful thing for you. It's not, and I'm going to be clear, your life isn't more joyful. If your life, if your joyful aspects of your life are your workouts and everything else is not joyful, uh then the workout is no longer serving you. >> Yeah. >> And that and that's a big problem. 100%. >> I mean, I think that's actually more common than not. I think a lot of people uh talk about their workouts as their escape. >> Yeah. >> From from the rest of their life. Yeah. That's their that's their place where uh Yeah. I mean then for that >> you're using it a lot of times or at least in my experience with clients. >> You've turned your workout into a drug. >> Yeah. They're running away. Totally. Yeah. Yeah. They're medicating with it. >> 100% 100%. I want to ask you, Adam, because you mentioned off air and I didn't ask you because I want to save it for the show >> that you were using uh you were sautéing your mushrooms in the >> fireplace pan. Yeah. >> Are you using the the the one it's called? It's I don't remember what it's called. It's like the multiunctional pan. It's the one that you can do all kinds of things in. >> Ceramic or which one? >> It's so Yes, I think so. Cuz it's chemical. >> It's the It's the giant tan colored ones and I think it has the ceramic coating. It has the coating on the bottom where you literally just run water on it and everything wipes right off of it. >> Um Yeah. Yeah. No, I was actually talking with Doug because uh I've I've gotten my sautéing my mushrooms and onions from watching Doug and I went down this rabbit hole last weekend and I'm just like, you know what? Like I love mushrooms so much I want to like look up some other recipes and how I can improve. >> I love mushrooms. >> Oh, dude. I'm going to make you some bomb. I took like another level of like my mushroom game came up. Yeah. [laughter] I just I you know >> really fun game. >> I'm not a cook by any means. >> Sorry. Did you say >> he's a fun guy anyway? >> Dad jokes are heavy today. >> Yeah. The ceramic nonstick is the >> It's called the always pan. >> The always. That's the one. I knew it. Uh so you know what's interesting? So here's what I want to bring up. So mushrooms have this unique ability of absorbing anything that they come in contact you both when they grow but also when you cook them. This is why they taste so good. Like you whatever you sauté them in, they kind of absorb the flavor. >> Which also uh to the our place. So, our place uses um uh what is it called? Uh forever chemical-free pan. So, it's non-stick, but it doesn't have the forever chemicals in there. If you sauté onions uh excuse me, mushrooms in a pan with chemicals, >> it'll absorb more chemicals than anything else. >> So, all foods will pick up those forever chemicals, but mushrooms are like sponges. Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. You'll get a really high concentration. So, especially if you cook something like a mushroom, you want a forever chemical-free pan. >> What a good point. What a good point. Yeah. I didn't realize how I how much I was uh over cooking them before. They were because they tasted so good still cuz to your point if you sauté them in garlic and ghee or butter like that, it's hard for them to taste bad, >> but my texture was off and I thought it it wasn't right. And I learned a lot about like at what temperature that I I cook them and then when do I like season them? I thought I can just season them right away. You don't do that cuz then it pulls everything out too early. Like, so I' I've figured out how to do them a lot better and I've now it's like the third time I've cooked them. >> You guys are two You and Doug are like two of the best like meal like cooks that I know. >> I would not put me in that category. Doug can cook. I have a few things I like to do. You know what it is? Um >> Well, you're both passionate about it. >> So I I you just recently for me in the last I don't know how many years in my life, maybe the last five. >> Yeah, >> maybe five. I like I uh >> You're really into it. >> I never was into it. You know what it is? It's um >> You're old. >> Yeah, [laughter] >> that's definitely something to do with it. >> I think it's definitely something to do with it. you know, I' I've really uh and I I think this kind of hearkens back to um when I shared the story about Katrina and I um you know, me getting frustrated with like the house not being so clean and like then we like had this like it was I had this epiphany of like I care so much about that like why am I getting frustrated with her? Why >> the epiphany is I'll clean house. >> Yeah. So that's what so it was like and because here's the thing I have a wife that's like it's not like she's lazy. She's over there doing laundry and taking care of my son. >> She's very good at what she's good at, too. She organizes everything. >> That's right. Exactly. And she's and she has this incredible strength. It's like, so why am I beating her up on the one thing that she just is not as she doesn't care as much as I do. So, I had that epiphany. This was back when we lived in Marina. So, I don't know how many years, like seven years ago or whatever. And we >> I just started like that's I do that every single night like clockwork while she's getting our our son together. And what has happened in the last few years and what h what what came of that to how I'm tying this all together is that uh it became enjoyable something that was >> because now you're not feeling like you you're you're doing it out of choice. Yes. Yeah. Is that huge? >> And I I'm playing music and it becomes this uh my alone time and I'm alone. I don't I don't my phone's not cuz my hands are working so I'm like no phone. So it's like an hour an hour hour and a half of just like in my thoughts doing what I'm doing. And so it's become this I've that is I've I experienced that there first and thought wow something that I considered a chore that I hated or pissed me off and we get into fights whatever whatever you want to say uh has now turned into this thing that I really like to do. I'm like that's interesting. I wonder what other aspects of my life are like that. And I'd say cooking was kind of like a chore for I've always been able to kind of do it but I'm not in the mood to do it. I'm I was always really kind of simple like you just form and grill [ __ ] whatever. look at things like protein, carb, fat. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. It was like it was a means to an end type of deal. >> And I thought, well, what if I started to kind of get into it and take my time and like, you know, do everything slow. And so, I've actually learned and and I've over the last couple years, uh, I've started to enjoy that. I've enjoyed the walk away and it's me in the kitchen for two hours and I'm doing my thing and That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. So, it's kind of >> Yeah. cuz you and Doug I have I've had some of the best like steaks and meals around steaks that I've ever had with you guys. Oh yeah, for sure. Yeah. >> Yeah. He's I think he's way more of a cook than I am. So >> Doug's been doing it for a while. He's been into cooking for a long time. >> Yeah. Probably 50 years or so. So >> at least at least maybe 60 almost [laughter] >> fact. No, my grandma and I used to cook together. >> Really? Really? >> Yeah. >> Now, okay. So that's interesting. So I'm curious. Did uh >> do you think that's where your passion came from? And did you pick did you start doing it even in your 20s or like when did you really start? >> I really started when I was I was very interested in food and cooking when I was even 10 years old. >> Oh wow. Really? This is a thing for you? >> It's been a thing for me. Um I love food to start off. I love food but I'm also fascinated on how certain flavors are achieved. So I've had like these lifelong pursuits for various types of foods to cook. One including one is pizza. I always wanted to make an incredible pizza and I just could never figure it out. >> Does he know what you did? Does he know you? >> So I ended up hiring a pizza coach. >> A pizza coach? Yes. >> Do you guys know this pizza coach? >> Well, no. This guy, his name is Luigi. He's from Positano. Okay. >> Which right away, you know, he's authentic. >> I have pursued the perfect pizza for years and I just could not figure it out. And then I discovered at one point, okay, you have to have the right oven. It has to be hot enough, right? But even then, I just couldn't get the right um what do you call gluten structure, if you will. You have to have that perfect crust, right? >> And I just couldn't figure out why that was. So, I was at this popup uh pizza place in the Campbell Farmers Market. >> Okay. >> And this guy, Luigi, I I tried his pizza and I go, "This is amazing." >> So, I talked to him and he goes, "Yeah, I'll come and I'll teach you." So, I paid for him to come out. He brought all his dough and then he taught me how to make it. Uh but one of the things I discovered is I had this mixer. I had a Viking mixer. I figured, "Oh, this is a good mixer." Viking, good brand. >> But the problem was it's it goes around. They call it, I think, a orbital mixer. It's like the KitchenAid or whatever, but it just bangs the dough on the side of the uh the bowl. >> So, you need an actual true uh spiral mixer. It has like a steel bar in the middle and then it wraps the dough. >> So, it makes it so it's the way it mixes it with the air and everything, >> the way it needs it, right? >> Yeah. So, you have to have proper gluten development to get the proper crust. And I just could never get that even though I made decent pizzas, right? And so I uh I so I ended up buying one of these mixers. It's an Italian mixer. It's 88 pounds. >> Uh this is massive. This is like a commercial thing. Anyway, >> expensive. [laughter] >> I've hired him four times, maybe five. He's come over my house and we just keep working on my pizza skills. And uh I'll I'll say I'm pretty darn good. >> Now, what about throwing it in the air? Is that a thing? >> That's I think that's more of an American thing. if you're looking at like the Neapolitan style dough. So I make kind of authentic I I would say authentic Neapolitan style. >> Uh so from the south like Napoli, right? >> And it's it's a different it's different than some of these other like like your New York pizzas and that type of that's American. >> And so the dough is Yeah. It doesn't really do well by throwing it up. I'm sure you can. >> Oh, I see. >> But uh No, it's more you stretch it by hand. >> That's awesome. >> Yeah. You gonna have us over? >> Yeah. Well, when I have the new place, I'm going to have >> you have I mean, you would totally You're you're going to build an oven outside eventually. >> Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. >> I mean, that's how fun. >> Wood fire. >> But anyway, that was like a lifelong passion. But there's other foods I've been trying to make my entire life and have learned little by little. >> Well, your Thai dishes are fire. >> Yeah, those are so good. >> That was actually learning how to cook Thai food was because I moved to Japan and I was such a Thai food fanatic and I couldn't find any Thai restaurants uh to go to. So, I learned how to cook to make yourself. >> Yeah. >> Oh, that's cool. So, anyway, I'm definitely I'm definitely not on that guy's level for >> No, but like I said, you guys are both into it. >> Well, you know what my favorite thing is though is that because everyone's all into their things and stuff like that is like that's where Doug will shell out money. >> Oh, yeah. Cuz he loves it. >> Yeah. Yeah. And that's where >> I don't even want to know how much that cost. >> Yeah. He acts all quiet about that stuff like that. And I know I get railed for being the guy. >> Well, this is the Ferrari mixer. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. He's definitely got the Ferrari mixers and his espresso machine. I remember his espresso machining box. I >> saw Courtney one of those and I was like, "Yeah, that's so cool." >> Yeah, there's definitely those. >> We have a $90 espresso machine at home. We buy it on Amazon. It breaks every once in a while. We just get another one. I swear to God, [laughter] it's literally 90 bucks. And we just use that all the time. So, Wow, that's great. >> Dude, I got to tell you guys about this uh this incredible >> Oh, wait, wait, wait. Before Before you go, I don't want to go too far from uh your fitness topic because I think it's >> Oh, yeah. Okay, go. Sorry. >> Bring it back. Yeah, I want to bring it back to that because I think since the audience that is tuning in for that and wants to hear, I think it's important. So, you know, we've been on Karen's journey for quite some time now and uh >> she's one of our top trainers here. >> Yes. Yes. And and she falls in this category of somebody who has stayed in that team lean for a very very long time and competed at the high level and uh and is has struggled to add muscle to to put weight on. And remember we did the first uh you know Texas scan and it came back that we did we put nothing but body fat on it >> which was super discouraging for >> although I want to say in that period of time if you haven't listened her stren her strength performance way of >> PR cities >> she needed to gain body fat sometimes that has happened you have to gain body fat >> so that so the and if just to recap for people that didn't catch the the the beginning of that story and and what you're alluding to uh the reason why I even had her Dexter scan. Typically with a client like that, I wouldn't even a Dex scan, but I got a anxious because we were hitting crazy PR 30 pounds to lift >> in everything and squatting and hip thrusting and just and we had been doing that for like months. I'm like, oh, hell yeah. And we and when the weight on her scale, like we put on like 10, 15 pounds on the scale. So, I'm like, hell yeah. >> So excited. But according to Dexa, we get this report back and it's no muscle, all body fat, and still takes her to like the I want to say we were at 19. >> She's still shredded. She's still lean. >> Still super super lean. And and I remember telling her that, you know, you are at a place where we're your body, you're going to have to have a higher body fat percent to put muscle on. Your body doesn't feel safe adding more muscle right now, speeding your metabolism up any faster. um we're gonna have to get and I imag and what I'm learning even with her is as long as I've been doing this and have had clients like this before. She's probably one of the the the um clients that I that I've had that has kept their their body fat percentage this low for very long and training this hard for as long as have. And so it's been this interesting, you know, even challenge for me to see what what's happened. And so we did a DEXA. It's been it's been a while. And she'd been asking for it and I said, "Okay, we'll do I said, "But I don't care what it says. You You can't let it >> stay on track." >> Yeah. We got to stay on track and stuff like that. >> And so we are now uh weightwise a total of we're about I think 17 lbs heavier than she's ever been right now. So 15 17 pounds heavier. >> And uh we did the scan and both uh bone density went up and we added and we added 2 and 12 pounds of muscle. >> All right. >> And so >> the bone density one was important. Yeah, we still went up body fat percentage. Okay, so we still uh went up more body fat than we did muscle. And what it really highlighted for me is that your body is just now entering where it's starting to feel a little safe to do that. And you know, and >> by the way, if you guys saw her, she looks amazing. If you saw her, >> I get compliments all the time. >> She looks amazing. >> Yeah. Yeah. No, she looks >> she looks healthy, strong, fit. I mean, she looks great. and and and and I and I love that she's been open and talking about her journey and and sharing as she's gone through because I think she's helping so many other uh ladies that have have like struggled with this cuz you know we're she needed a break. I want to keep going, right? And so she's and the whole goal is eventually to get back on stage again >> and here we are peak weight for her right now, right? And I see how her body's responding and she's like, "Can we cut now?" And I said, 'Only if you feel like you need a break. I said, 'But what I've learned from being with you this long now and now that I see where we're at, this is where I want you to hit stage at. So you feel the biggest you've ever felt and you don't like where you're at. I'm telling you >> that we've got to go another 15 lbs >> so we can cut down to this. >> So we can cut down to this because this is where your body needs to be. Uh, and now granted you'll we'll put muscle we'll put body fat on, we'll come back down and you'll have more muscle at this weight and so you'll be leaner, but I can tell based off of the results we were getting from this that this is we needed to get your body fat percentage higher in order for you to start seeing muscle and we could and we could still afford to even go a little bit higher and we have got to get comfortable with what you consider a fluffy look even though I think you look incredible. >> There's three things here that are working uh in her favor. uh one she's a coach uh and she coaches a lot of people who struggle with this and so she speaks to it very well. She's an excellent coach because she herself experiences the challenges. >> Two, she's working with you >> uh and you're obviously a good coach. You've been doing this for a long time, one of the best. but you're also her boss and somebody that she respects because I don't know I I could imagine how difficult it would be for her to work with any other coach and have Dexa scans show just gaining body fat and being like I'm out. This isn't working. >> But because it's you and she trusts you and she works for you >> and because she coaches other people, um I think that's keeping her on track cuz that's tough. >> Oh yeah, >> that'd be really hard out there being vulnerable too. Huge. I I mean I feel for her when you get that because in inside everything I I want her to see is just m we put on especially the PRs that are happening the effort to to put to eat the calories we're eating to do all the things we're doing. But, you know, the reason why I wanted to bring it up today because what you brought up today is because it just highlights that when you if you've been in that place and I guess and you can communicate this maybe better than me, but the be the best way I can communicate this is that you have been so lean, borderline unhealthy lean for so long and pushing the body training wise. And so now you start feeding it and it start you're starting to train and you're starting to hit you're starting to get strong. So the body wants to get strong because it's been dying to have those extra calories. But it also still doesn't feel safe to add a a fast tissue, a tissue that is going to require more calories. And so it's saying we're going to put body fat on >> and we're going to Yeah. We're going to we're going to continue to put body fat on until we feel that we're in a place that's safe enough to add this other this this, you know, higher metabolic tissue that onto your body. And so, you know, yes, and and that's been a lot of the conversation is like, hey, if you really want to put this muscle on and and by the way, I'm this applies to even someone who's not trying to compete if you are a female and you just Yeah. just kept yourself lean for so long and you're and you know you want to build a butt and you want to build your arms or whatever the body parts that you want to build but you struggle with the phase that it nec may be necessary for you to go to in order to get that butt to build those arms whatever it is once you build >> you have to get comfortable being fluffy a little bit and that and that's >> which is funny cuz she's not fluffy at all >> right right but they will feel it >> that's right that's why I'm using that term because I don't I think she looks to me the best she's I've ever seen her right now like incredible but you know in her she, you know, using her words, fat, fluffy, yeah, filter terra, like so, but I get it. And so I I know that there's a lot of women that can relate to that feeling, but you simultaneously say things like, "I want to build my butt. I want to build my arm." And it's just like, you know what? You got to And this is uh this is for both sexes, but it's extremely important for women. >> It's much more common in women. >> Yes, for sure. >> Very, very much so. >> 100%. Well, good job, dude. I'm really proud of her for doing it. >> Awesome to watch. All right. So, uh, this weekend, let me tell you guys about this this incredible experience I had this weekend. So, I don't know if you guys remember when I So, I go down to LA here and there to get on some shows. And there was this podcast. There's this podcast down. My buddy Dave has it. It's called um, Street Gospel. And so, he'll have like uh rappers, graffiti artists, fighters, but it's also kind of faith-based. >> Uh, he was a fan of the show. Invited me down. I went down there. Great guy. He's the guy that sent that that um >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. >> that the bat with the spiral, you know, whatever. cuz he's like also a fan of movies. >> That's cool. >> Uh yeah. So anyway, cool guy. >> Walking Dead. >> Walking Dead. Right. So anyway, he sends me a clip of this uh pastor that was on uh his show and he's like, "Hey, check this guy out." And right away I noticed the guy's Cauliflower ear cuz you know I knew I did jiu-jitsu. So oh you guys a jiu-jitsu guy. >> I don't know what about what it was about what he said but I reached out to the guy that passed. His name is Troy Troy Frink and I sent him a DM. Hey man, I love your stuff. And he's like dude I love your stuff. I've been following Mind Pump for a long time. So, we messaged each other a couple times. He goes, "Hey, dude. I'm doing this like this men's uh retreat um in a few weeks. I'd love for you to come." And um totally out of character for me. I mean, it's up in the mountains. You're sleeping in a dorm room. There's like It's like totally like You guys know me. You guys know that it's nothing. Okay. So, >> but for whatever reason, >> you're not Mr. Adventure. >> No, dude. Not even close, right? But for whatever reason, I felt kind of convicted. I knew nothing of what was happening there except for I had this feeling messaged the guy. So I said, "Yeah, dude. I think I'd love to go." And uh right out the gates, two people came to mind for me that I'd want to bring. It was Dylan and Josh. So I I messaged, "Hey, you guys want to come with me?" Both of them were like, "Yeah, let's go." So the three of us go, we drive down to this place called Pinerest. >> Pinerest. >> Yes. Do you know where that is down by LA? >> Oh, not that at Pine Crest. >> It's like the mountains by LA. Okay. So it's like six hour drive, right? So, it's all the way up there or down there, I should say. So, the three of >> Bear. Is it near Bear? >> No idea. I have no idea. >> That's the lake that's up there. >> I have no I didn't know this place existed. So, anyway, we drive over there >> and it's a group it's he So, Troy started a church uh he's he's been a pastor for a while, but he started a church a year ago in his home. He did a Bible study and the Bible study grew and he decided to put together this retreat. And so, I didn't know any of this stuff. I just found this out while we got there. So, we get there and it's a men's retreat with just all these dudes from different churches. He seems to really attract a lot of guys that have been lost for a while. So, we get there and it was it was great, dude. It was this incredible experience. Part of it was for me was cool that I was in this in this very uncomfortable situation. Like I like I said, we slept in these these like dorm style rooms with like no mattress, no AC. Yeah, dude. The whole thing. There's no B. There's no shower bathroom in there. Oh, yeah. Dude, you guys know me. So, but I did it. >> Uh, and we hung out there. Uh, Dylan and Josh got baptized, which was really cool, which was actually interesting for me cuz >> they both decided to do it, and it got me super emotional. So, I'm sitting there crying while these guys are doing their thing. And it was just uh it was just great experience meeting these guys and hearing some of these testimonies. Like he had this one guy go up who uh you know he's now been sober for a while but he had gotten so bad he had lost everything his house his family uh was a heroin addict um tried to kill himself many many times by overdosing um and you know comes to comes to Jesus and ends up you know cleaning himself up and now they're going to start some program uh for people who need help and so it's really a great experience the whole time. So, tell me how how does how does this relate to you not being fat? >> Huh? [laughter] >> He sees it in your you talk about what happened. >> You came in today and I'm like, "Bro, you you are the inflammation is so down. Uh, it's very very obvious to me." And so, I don't know what you did when you did fasting all weekend. >> Well, the food I don't want. Okay. So the food was like, you know, you know, it was like you're eating a kind of buffet food and it's not much and you're kind of limited to what they made. >> Sure. >> So I just didn't eat a lot. That's all. So that's why when I came in [laughter] like I didn't really eat much, dude. >> Yeah. It really brought down a lot inflammation. >> It was very limited. So I had like fruit >> and meat >> cuz the other options were like macaroni and >> Yeah. It brought your calories way down. >> Yeah, dude. >> Yeah. Yeah. You look health. You look really good right now. I appreciate it. And you know, and I'm sure you've seen it in me. you made comments before is like you don't really notice it until you like I'm so used to seeing you all the time and then like to see you come in I'm like oh my god bro you look like you leaned way out >> it's a lot of old chiseled out your face >> oh wow >> yeah [laughter] yeah started to look like my face >> spiritually healthy brok [laughter] it was a really it was a really uh >> was that all weekend was it >> it was all weekend bro Saturday and Sunday >> and I didn't even know you were doing that Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I just went up there. Like I said, it was kind of like a >> Did you guys shoot any content or No, >> no. No. I mean, I have clips and if it's up to Josh and and Dylan if they're okay with it, we could post their baptisms. Kind of cool. >> Mhm. >> But, uh, it was, uh, No, it was kind of on a whim. I didn't know Troy at all. Didn't know anybody there at all. Uh, but I end up talking with Troy. He's really, really great dude. He's, uh, he really loves, uh, people a lot. And he's got this, it seems like he's got this because of that, he attracts people who've been lost for a long time >> and they feel like they're they're coming in, they're not getting looked down on, they're not being judged. >> Um, and it was just one. It's just great environment of of of men coming together and worshiping. It was really really cool. Really good experience. >> What' you do this week besides fight over door handles? >> What? [laughter] >> Yeah. There's just been like little scuffles. I What door? What? >> He told me a story. blast right now. >> Yeah. I mean, Courtney and I get get in fights over the dumbest things, you know, and it's like really we're both up here. >> We're just [snorts] like redlinining a lot with like fixing things and and constantly trying to prep. Like we just put our house back on the market and so it's like >> stressful. >> Yeah. Stressful. And it Anyways, we Yeah, we got into it a bit, but uh uh like I I I didn't really do anything crazy. I went to the pool uh with some of my friends and um we uh my my kid actually watched the Odyssey again. I wanted to talk to about this. >> Oh, so who watched it? >> So um Ever watched I actually watched it with my boys when I was in Atlanta. >> I went back and saw it twice. It was so good. >> So you guys liked it that much? >> Yes. I think it's one of the best movies. >> I thought it was so boring. >> Right. So here here's >> I'll watch it again. I'm open to watch it again. >> Yes. Let me let me preface this because I think I found somebody that will help you like oh okay like I could see it from a different perspective because so Jonathan Pia I actually found like he did a really good commentary on this >> um and he breaks down a lot of mythology and he gets into the nitty-gritty of the detail of the story and everything and like what like Christopher Nolan actually changed and kind of altered and honestly I think you're a Trojan horse dude. What do you mean? meaning the entire packaging and the exterior of the movie was uh basically to appease uh you know him being able to get awards, him being able to sell it to that you know kind of like Hollywood caught up in that. >> Yeah. And it really like everything he he he put in a lot of really good storyw writing. Um that leads back it hearkens back to a lot of like old uh stories that they're about like finding yourself and about like you know taking that that journey to get like save like a lot of the hero's journey kind of like um stories out there that are like really compelling. So uh a lot of it was like trickster. So the the whole movie itself is like the theme of it really is like you know being able to to do like a a kind of swap out like like a trick with the and so even in the beginning like he's teaching him how to fight by opening himself up a little bit more vulnerable and so they come in to attack and then he can make his move. Uh, and so that's really the the theme of the whole movie and like how he's trying to kind of portray and he swapped out the transgender character that everybody thought he was Achilles but it's actually this other like yeah >> less ins and like wrote in this whole but but it's really interesting for him to break down because >> uh so basically they like he replaced uh the other kid that was supposed to go to war to to Troy. Uh, and so like there was this whole like underlying message with that even even using a transgender person like in replacement of an actual man. >> Oh, >> and so like anyway, it if you look at it like from a meta perspective, >> I'm not sophisticated. >> It's dude, [laughter] >> I'm going to send I'm going to send you I'll send you the breakdown and I won't get into more of the details. To me, it was good. >> But um >> I cuz for literally for me, I didn't care about that. It was literally boring. I was so boring. >> What? >> Yes, dude. Crazy, dude. Too much story, I think. Right. >> I Well, I maybe I don't watch it long enough. I We laughed with when with when with with the Cyclops part. By the time we got there, I'm like, "This is killing me." >> And the Cyclops didn't keep you engaged. >> I mean, a little bit. >> What? >> Yeah. >> I mean, now, hey, now I know why you got blasted on Twitter, bro. Sure. >> That is why cuz all of my I had a lot of people agree with me. >> All of my all of my Well, I mean, >> I mean, there's been opposite of course. There's a pool of idiots everywhere. You know what I'm saying? that are going to >> violent dude. >> So that means nothing on Twitter. All the real life I haven't, but all of my friends when you told me they were all they were all they were like we got to go see this together. And I'm like a Sal said that's terrible. They're like what? All of everyone I know. >> I can't wait to see what you guys think. What you and Doug think. >> Well, yeah. I I'll go see it. Um but Justin was like this wasn't just a good move. He's like one of the best moves I've ever seen. And the the thing was too I was going in like a going to suck, you know, and I was just like we're just we need >> that's why you liked it cuz I made I did say that to him too >> and I stuck it out and to your >> to be fair like it was a little slow like building in the beginning and you're just kind of okay where we going >> every three and a half hour movie >> but yeah it's a three-hour movie to the point where I I don't know I was like super engaged and then it it like it's it's been a long time since I've watched a movie and I felt like every emotion and I felt like I was scared in in that cave. Sober. [laughter] >> I was sober, bro. It was like in like an IMAX. I don't know. You got to hear all the sounds and like, dude, >> I I could go off on it. >> I mean, I'm going to I'll watch it again. I'll try. >> I'm definitely going to go watch it though now. >> I'll watch it again because it was >> But I [laughter] was just like, what? I was just so confused when I left the theater cuz I was like, >> so I didn't watch the whole thing. I told you I left. Bro, that that's the part that that's the part that I can't wrap my brain around is >> from I I can count on one hand how many times I've walked out of a theater and it's definitely not five. It's like three two or three in my life, bro. 45 years, three movies I've walked out of. >> That made one of those three. I mean, that that to me is like it has to be a shitty movie to walk out. >> The Hills Have Eyes. Like I walked out of that movie, but that was just cuz it was so grotesful. >> Well, I'm not a movie critic. Don't take my advice on that. No. Yeah. >> My advice on that, but yeah, I'll I'll try it again, dude. >> We'll see. Yeah, >> maybe I have. Maybe it got good after I left. >> Yeah. >> You know what I mean? [laughter] >> I think so. Haven't seen it yet. Have you? >> I haven't seen it yet. I want to see it, but 3 hours is daunting. >> Boy, I know. And I are like tiptoeing because of you guys. >> I know. I had I had all this time to kill, so that's really the only reason why we went, but it was just like so mind-blowing to me. I was like, I didn't expect that. Well, to be fair, when it comes to movies, uh, opinions on movies, Justin and I often times agree, sometimes disagree, but we are probably the most different from both you and Doug. >> Oh, yeah. That's why >> because there are movies that that he loves that you love, and same with me. Like, I'll stand on this lonely island over here, dude. I think it was so amazing. >> I think you guys will be the tiebreakers, but I'll watch it again. I'll give it another shot. >> Well, my I have my I have a couple buddies. Uh, and I and I have my my my suspect, one of my best friends. He is very and I don't know which one of you two you would fall in this category but like you know just the blow him up shoot him up whatever like doesn't have to have a good plot to it. So he I mean so it's like oh him like that's how my my brother-in-law is like that too. So like when they recommend movies like I know what I'm going into [laughter] right like so >> but then I have my buddy uh my childhood my buddy goes all the way back to fourth grade and him and I are we we used to collect movies when we were little. So we when we first cassettes back in the day and uh we were really into movies and we used to critique them and talk about them all the time and that was our thing and so we and we loved finding like movies that a lot of people may not know about that were really good hidden gems and so yeah we like stuff like that and he was like it was epic dude I don't know what s he's like s is freaking crazy. Wow. >> So yeah so it was that him and then Justin tell me that was enough for okay I need to go watch it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then I had another ghost experience. So yeah. >> What? There's a >> What do you mean ghost experience? >> Yeah. So [clears throat] I told you the previous You remember when like the when I was sitting in the living or the dining room and then like one of the chairs like caught fire? Yeah. It was super bro at that house again. >> It's same house. Yeah. Wait a minute. >> Same house. Yeah. This is your new house. >> That's why that's why it hasn't sold yet. >> Yeah. Maybe that [laughter] little disclosure. >> It's haunted. >> You're going to be living with somebody else. >> Yeah. People might actually want to say that might be a selling point, you know, real baby, dude. But I I mean, I wouldn't have thought anything of it because I thought it was pro cuz I was just in the house alone with Everett and u this is the middle of the day. Everybody was gone. Like I think Courtney was taking uh Ethan the gymnastics and I was like just tired and and decided to lay down and I was like kind of taking a a nap and I was like half awake, half asleep and then I just hear this like it it was almost like a a whining but it was like a almost a yodel. It was like you're like >> like that. >> Yeah. Like like and I was and I'm like I'm like Everett, what are you do? like what's going on here? And like nothing. I get nothing from him and it keeps going and then it goes away. Uh and I get up and I'm like, "Oh, that's really weird. It woke me up." And so I'm kind of getting myself together and I and I go into Evers. I'm like, "Hey man, like what what what was all that?" And he's like, "What? The Yoda League?" And I'm like, "Yeah, what? Like what was all that?" And he's like, "I don't know. Was it me?" And then like no was and then so I'm like sometimes we we catch noises coming up from the school because we're kind of like we're up a bit higher and like down below us is a um a frisbee golf course and so some people like kind of go through there they make noise whatever I'm like ah it must have been something like that >> but it literally sounded like it was in the house like whailing noises like and we were just like [laughter] dude this is creepy dude and he's still tripping on it. Isn't that a common thing that people will say that ghosts will make that sound? Isn't that a like a common thing? >> Is it? >> I think Well, you know, when like when you see ghosts in cartoons, isn't that what they >> Yeah. >> Look it up, dog. Doug, sorry, dog. >> Look it up, dog. >> Do [laughter] look it up, bro. >> Google that. Yeah. >> Yeah. Look up uh the ghost. What is it? What do they do? Moaning sounds. Is that common or wailing? >> Or whailing? Yeah. because they're like like the banshee, you know, like they bring that up a lot. >> So, what did you do? Just go back to bed or did you like >> No, I got up and I was walking around. Was it in the middle of the night? How late was it? >> No, this is right in the middle of the day. >> Yeah. And it was when I was sleeping. >> Oh, look. This is telling you it was the wind and weather or the house moving. So, maybe maybe that's what it was, dude. >> Yeah. It sounded like a human. >> Yeah. So, >> that's creepy, dude. So, you just say go back to bed or what? >> No, dude. I'd gotten up and was active and and uh cleaned the house, whatever. I don't know. I was like not going to go back to sleep. >> Oh, that's creepy, dude. >> Super. >> I'm out of there, bro. I'm out of there. >> No, thank you. >> That's some fun fun stuff. >> I'm going to change subject and get to talks about supplements here for a second. You know, there's some >> data that suggests that the higher higher protein intake. So, we talk about one gram of protein per pound of body weight. even higher amounts may be even more beneficial for uh people who want to build even more muscle cut. >> I thought I'd seen Lane do a breakdown that there on the studies as high as 1.5. >> Yeah. So, what I was going to say is this may be why cuz I always hit one gram of protein per pound of body weight. I almost never go over that. So, I'm eating about 220 grams of protein a day. More than that is insane, right? It's like I'd have to eat a ton. But I do notice uh I seem to notice benefits when I'm consistent with uh Keon's um essential amino acids. So I eat so much protein, adding the essential amino acids, I still notice some benefit. And it might be that >> well that might be the reason that that even more essential amino acids than what I thought was a lot might be beneficial. Well, I did when when we did la was it it's been now two years since I documented that whole uh cut that I did on um the YouTube channel and one of the things I did was use those uh essential amino acids during that process and I still hit my protein intake. I still was hitting over one but I was doing that in addition to that. Well, yeah, that did I had the Dexus scan come back one of the first Dexus scans I've ever done and not lost any muscle. >> Yeah. So to be in a cut, you typically expect to lose a little bit. >> Always. >> Yeah. And so, you know, obvious obviously the game has always been, you know, can I cut just the right amount and minimize how little amount of muscle? That was the first time I did a cut like that and uh didn't lose any muscle. So, uh I that was that was a big selling point for me. I know we >> were you doing it in between meals or with meals? >> In between. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So, I would literally take seven like three times a day between meals. So, I'd do a meal and then I keep them I had I had one here. I had them at in my gym bag and I had them at next to my bed so I had them so I could just grab them. >> And then I would literally just between after I'd had a meal, it' been an hour or so I'd reach over, grab take seven of them, go back to my day, eat, do it again, seven like so between every between every meal I'd have seven. >> Yeah, I'm sold on on that. I'm sold on it. But remember, if you take, for anybody listening, if you take essential amino acid supplements, they have to be high in lucine. Yeah. >> Very high in lucine. That's the key. If lucine's low, then it's like you got to take twice. Don't even mess around. >> It makes a lot of sense in a cut, you know, to supplement with that, too. But like what you're saying with like even on a high protein, you're going to get benefit on. >> Yeah. One other thing I want to touch on is just how good you guys look with the new lighting. I'm looking at you on TV. >> Dude, I know. This whole time everybody thought Justin and I were sixes. [laughter] You guys are solid sevens. >> We're like a solid seven and a half now. Solid seven and a half now. >> And that's cuz of the lighting, right? We got We got What is this? Movie lighting. Is that what we did? >> I actually had it was somebody's client called me a snack. >> A snack, bro. I was like, I'm a snack. I'm like a bag of Doritos. >> Still getting that in your mid-40s. [laughter] >> Well, cuz Yeah. They don't I guess they don't watch the show or anything. And then it was like video. Yeah. >> So, I agree. Funny though. >> I would agree. You are a snack for sure. >> 100%. >> Yeah. Adam's a meal. Yeah, he's a he's a full meal. [laughter] State dinner. >> Somebody I did a I did a video I did was doing weighted pull-ups and I videoed it since I never video my workouts, right? I was like, "Oh, is it I'm in here. I was working out >> and uh I was like, you need evidence. [laughter] Just want to make sure everybody knows I still train every once in a while. One set, that's it. That's all you can see. [laughter] That's it for the day." Y >> uh but I was doing that and somebody's comment like not bad for a bigish guy you know [laughter] >> it's a weird compliment you know I mean bigish that's good you know >> I I'm back to that uh I actually really uh I hadn't done that in a while I've now done it it's been I think this is the third time or so trying to get up there I want to see how heavy I was doing uh the 60 lb kettle bell >> wow dude >> um how many reps >> I got five and then of course the one >> bro that's The one I recorded got four, but the one that's what made I was like, "Oh, I should record this. I haven't done this weight." >> Bro, that's good. >> It was It was good. >> Cuz what do you weigh right now? 220 230. >> 28. >> Wow. >> Yeah. >> Oh, that's pretty good, man. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> You're lighter than me. >> 18. >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm down. >> I outweigh you, man. >> I feel like a big >> Yeah, I've been down. I've been down. You >> freaking balloon. >> Ever since you tipping the scale of 27. [laughter] >> Damn, bro. He's not a snack dog. Yeah, that's a full meal right there, bro. >> I'm a hearty meal. [laughter] >> That's a full meal. If he's a snack, he's keto. >> Yeah, for sure. >> Yeah. No, I've been I've been down uh I mean, ever since you made the comment about my my inflammation has been down. Remember when I was complaining about all that? >> All better. All Yeah. All better. It's been gone. I've been I mean, just full transparency, I've been I've been utilizing Trisepatide on a micro dose. >> Yeah, that helps. >> And it's made a big difference for me. It's actually really help. >> We really I mean, I know we joke about this about our cumulative body weight always staying the same. It does. Like when one person loses, somebody else gains. >> I think it's true. It is. I mean, you just add up our body weight. Somebody needs to do it just to see. I'm willing to bet >> cuz when I was >> We never go within about 5 lbs. North or South >> probably because when we first started the show, I was I wasn't very heavy at all. I had a lot of gut issues, but I was super >> But you were jacked. >> And right now you're lighter and Justin's heavy cakes. >> Uh so I only went through maybe two times where I even cared. [laughter] >> It was like I was like 215 or something. Hey, he's like the uh defensive he's like [laughter] >> he's like the like the normal kind of B and then you and I fluctuate cuz you flex capacitors and you I mean I've been as I've been as light as uh 198 200 >> while on the show. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I was 195 I think. >> Yeah. And then as high as like 240. So I've like >> I got up to 230. >> Yeah. So you and I fluctuate the most and he's kind of stays around the same. >> How late How light were you when you did your transformation? >> Yeah, I was like 215. >> You got down to 215? >> Yeah. >> Wow. >> Well, that's actually not that light. That's not that far off. >> It's not that light, but it's >> Well, for him, I felt real like >> I mean, he's heavy, right? 230 is not is a heavier weight. >> You're 230 or higher than 230. >> Are you higher than 230? >> I've been higher, but I'm 230 right now. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I'd say, >> but you hold weight well, dude. You're you're supposed to be a big box. You're supposed all your tits and ass. [laughter] >> It's your butt boobs thigh. It's all your tits and ass put together that new program. I'm not going [laughter] to tell anybody what it is, but it's kind of similar. There's a part of it. >> There's a category the thick with a couple. Don't give it away. >> That's always been me. Good stuff. Anyways, >> maps workouts programs have been enjoyed by over a 100,000 people. Hundreds of thousands of people have followed mass programs and gotten incredible results. They've built muscle, burned body fat and gotten some of the best results of their lives. Remember, these are the workout programs that myself, Justin, and Adam created ourselves. We're the ones that wrote these programs. We have trained and coached people for many, many years. We're also hosts of this podcast. If you like how we communicate fitness, if it resonates with you, follow one of our workout programs. You won't be uh bl you in fact, you'll be blown away. You won't be disappointed. They will work better than anything you've ever tried before. And here's what we got going on right now. We took our top 10 most popular maps programs and we did a buy one get one free. So buy any one of them, get the other one for free. And it's only for the top 10 most popular ones. It's happening right now. So if you want to take the leap, you want to try a maps program or do you already have maps programs, you want to take advantage of this promotion, go to maps bogo.com. Back to the show. Our first caller is Paul from Ontario. >> What's up, Paul? >> How you doing, Paul? What's >> happening, man? >> Hey, guys. How you doing? >> Good, good, good. How can we help you? >> Good. Uh, first of all, wanted to say thank you guys for everything you do, the information you share and the, uh, no BS approach. It's very much appreciated. And, uh, start this off by saying, S, congrats on your whole journey with, uh, Christianity and walking in faith. I think that's pretty incredible and really cool that a couple big badass fellas like yourselves are into that. >> Thank you so much. Thank you. How can we help you, dude? >> Uh, questions for you is uh just to keep it as simple and quick as possible, gentleman for I'm 41 years old uh career firefighter out of Kingston, Ontario. And for the average guy just wants to look good for his uh wife, perform for his career, and be healthy for his kids. Um there's a lot of contradiction between workouts and what would be your best kind of split, whether it be whole body split three days a week, um powerlifting a few times a week with kind of conditioning on the side. What would be your your advice to a fella just trying to perform better, look decent, and limited equipment? >> What's your what's your schedule like? Uh are you like uh 10 on, certain days off? What's it what's it look like right now? >> So it's 24 hours on, 48 off. But I fill some of my time on my days off with working side jobs as well. And uh yeah, but obviously fitness and and health is quite a priority in my life for for my family and my career. So >> that's good. Yeah. The the biggest consideration uh with firefighters and and there's other workers that would fall in this category is stress management. Now when I say that people oftenimes think about like stressful situations at home. I mean like like all the things that can that your body would deem as a stress and then try to adapt to which includes exercise. So whenever we're uh introducing a form of exercise something consistent with a firefighter for example the biggest consideration is stress and because of your schedule uh your sleep on a semi-regular basis is not great. >> That's right. >> Okay. So this does not mean you can't work out. It just means we need to consider that as a top consideration. Um, whenever we're introducing an additional stress like exercise, the best consistent form of schedule with workout with a firefighter. What we have found and what I found in the past is like a MAPS 15 protocol. Now, that doesn't mean you can't add other things when you feel really good, uh, like maybe some cardiovascular conditioning or something outdoor. Um, but when it comes to strength training, >> the MAPS 15 protocol would be what would give you the it would give you the best results. You get the most strength and the best results from something like that. >> Now, there's a there's a we have a lot of MAPS 15 style programs. >> If I were to pick one that would give you the best bang for your buck uh for your job, for maybe some of the demands that can happen as a firefighter, >> I would look at something like MAPS 15 performance. >> Performance. Okay. because it's got an athletic uh uh bent to it. And so that's it's not just about, you know, building muscle, although it is. It's also about like moving well um and having some athleticism. And so that would be your base routine. That'd be the routine that you would do consistently. And then what you would do is you would you could add conditioning and stuff like that >> when you feel like you're feeling great. >> Maybe two days a week, right? He doesn't. Two [clears throat] days a week of some sort of conditioning on the days that are most conducive would be more than enough. >> Yeah. And and really you gota you got to look at it and and here's the challenge. The challenge is is this what I can tolerate or is this ideal? So the tendency for um you know for people like yourself, emergency workers and and people that work in in kind of high stress jobs that in include high stress situations is that they tend to push exercise to the toler like what I can tolerate. what's the most they can tolerate? Um, and that's not going to give you the best uh results. >> Do you do you use um Aura or Whoop or anything to kind of track and monitor your sleep at all? >> No, sir. Nothing like that at all. >> It's probably a worthwhile investment. I've had a lot of success with my clients uh that have schedules like yours because uh you know guys like you, we what we have a tendency to do is probably push it on times when we probably shouldn't. Um, and so I would have you on a rec like, okay, we run mass 15, we have two days of the like cardiovascular training >> and then how I would dictate how intense your workouts look like would be based off of the data we're getting and how you feel from your sleep. So like for example uh you know you had the last two days you scored 80 plus on your aura ring or whatever just for using hypothetical numbers and it's like and now I'd be like all right Paul we can get after we can get after it today in your workout or let's say rough two days in a row a lot of work stuff going it was you had six 260s >> and I'm like hey today you go through just go through the workout but go through the motions you're not pushing weight hard just lift lifting moderate weight to easy for you and then get some good rest like so I would use a tool like that. Now, you can go off of how you feel. Um, I think that's most important, but I I I do like having an extra data point that we can pull from and be like, "Hey, you feel good. Numbers are saying it's all good. Let's get after the workout today." Or it's like, "Hey, man. We're we've had two bad days in a row of sleep." That's when your highest risk for injury is. Uh, this is not the most optimal time for you to get after your workout. Today, we just kind of go go through the most. >> Yeah. Here's why what Adam is saying is so important because I've trained first responders and you just have a you guys just have a tendency to perceive uh fatigue or stress >> differently. >> Very differently. You're supposed to. That's what makes you good at your job. >> So, I would have first responders and I'd be like, "Hey, how do you feel?" And it's always like, "I'm good. >> I'm fine. I'm good." >> Yeah. Yeah. No, I feel great. Let's go. >> I know. We'd say, "Listen to your body." >> You're like, "Bro, you scored a 50 two days in a row in sleep. You can't be good." >> So, objective data could be really helpful because then, like, I'm gonna listen to the data versus like my own, you know, perception. >> Yeah. or ring or whoop or something like that would actually make sense cuz it'll give you like a definitive sort of gauge of what that looks like. >> But that's what the protocol would look like would be max 15 performance two days of card. Same thing goes with cardio too. Like let's say it's a day where we had bad sleep and it's also your it's the day you're supposed to do some of your cardiovascular training. That would be like a low-level cardio. Yeah. I'd say do an hour of light jog instead of doing like intervals or sprints like and then maybe it's a day where you got great rest. Hey, this might be the day that we do some interval sprints and kind of push the cardio. So, literally, I'm using that data and how you feel to gauge the intensity, but the protocol looks like a MAPS 15 performance with two days of >> And keep in mind like whatever routine you're doing, uh, if it gives you more energy throughout the day, it's working. >> Yeah, that's if you feel kind of fried or like, oh man, I'm recovering, you know, I'm kind of whatever, it's too much. >> No matter what it is. no matter what it is. >> That's perfect. We We have two uh two buddies of ours that go to the same gym as us in Cornwall here. Uh Justin and and uh Jesse Coleman. These guys are probably the best shape out of everybody in the gym, and they push your workouts like nobody I've ever met before. >> They tell everybody about your workout. >> Oh, right on. That's great. Do you Do you take supplements, Paul? >> I I do. I take a multivitamin, fish oil, magnesium, D3, just basic stuff. Protein, creatine. Good. How much creatine do you take >> uh right now? It's funny. We just picked some up this morning. I was telling my daughter anywhere more than 10 grams a day. >> So, >> yeah. So, someone like the same >> someone like you, you could push 10 to 15 a day. >> Totally. >> Uh and in divided doses, >> cognitive benefits. >> Yeah. It makes a big difference for uh for sleep issues, sleep deprivation issues. Yep. >> Yeah. >> We'll send over Maps Performance though to you. So, we'll send over Maps 15 performance. Follow that like we're talking and uh Yeah. I think you're going to love it, dude. I definitely will do. I'll I'll take all the advice. I'll I'll take the workout and I'll I'll hop at her and I'll uh reach out to you guys and let you know how everything's going. Awesome. >> Thanks, man. Say hi to Say hi to your friends. I think we said Justin and Jesse. Say hi to them for us. >> Yeah, >> we'll do. Thank you. Appreciate it, brother. >> Thank you. >> Uh have you guys have trained first responders? >> Yeah. Yeah. Lots of them. >> Yep. It's just it's all about >> the schedule's rough. >> It's it's all about stress management. dress and they are [clears throat] they're somebody who I would I would like if he was my client I'd make him get an aura ring because of what you said >> because some people can uh you can trust their hey I but those guys have been trained this I would throw them in the category of my military guys my pro alete guys >> uh they just haven't yeah exactly crazy yeah their perception of stress lack of sleep is just way the hell off different >> and and so for someone like that. I'd be like, "Hey, how do you feel?" And then also, "Let's look at the data." And it's like, "Hey, I know you think you feel okay, but data is telling us you've had two, three days in a row of really bad sleep. We're going to do the workout today, but it's going to look real moderate." And then other times it's like, "Hey, I'm feeling great and you got great sleep. Let's get after it, you know." Yeah. >> Our next caller is Ryan from Ohio. >> Hi, Ryan. >> Hello. >> Hi. This is kind of crazy. [laughter] >> Uh, thanks for calling in. How can we help you? Um, so if you don't mind, I'll read from my thing so I don't lose focus. Sure. >> Um, I'm a 36-y old female, 5' 3, currently 197 lbs, and I'm getting married next July. My goal is fat loss. Um, I've only ever used the scale, and I've always wanted a healthier BMI, and honestly, my wedding dress is my main driving factor right now. I'm actually too nervous to even try one on uh for fear of how it'll fit and how I'll feel in it. Um I've been listening to you guys. I put a few weeks, but it's been a couple months now. And after a rough stretch that got me thinking more carefully about how I approached [snorts] this. Um some quick background about myself. I've done CrossFit in the past 2016 to 2022, cycled through keto, 75 hard, calorie tracking on and off since 2009. And this past year, I went deep into extended fasting, mostly 24-hour OMAD, up to 74 hours once, alongside starting then tapering off of an SSRI. Um, the fasting caught up with me, and I had a few fainting and blood sugar crash episodes that scared me and my fiance enough that I stopped. Um, I'm a high school teacher and I devote most of my summers to a solid routine and schedule. Uh, but once school starts back, the stress takes over and I lose momentum, especially going into the holidays, too. Um, I have a garage gym and a new online trainer. He's a family member, newly certified. Uh, I put that he gave me a 5-day PPL, but it's actually 3 days of PPL and 2 days of movement. So, like, uh, bike, rower, just some sweat. And I've now been getting 9,000 plus steps a day. Um, he gave me macro targets, but my fiance thinks that I should be doing more cardio and eating more carbs and less protein because I have since went up a pant size. And that kind of drove me to sending this email to you guys. Um, the macros I've been given is 2,000 calories, 150 g of protein, 205 carbs, 65 g of fat. Um, just wondering if that's right for my goals. I've genuinely never approached this any other way than straight caloric deficit. And that's probably been my problem. I don't have any other frame of reference for bulk versus cut versus maintenance phases. I've I've never really looked into how to apply those or how to think about a new timeline uh or pacing toward my wedding. It's going to be in July of next year. So, what I'd love your take on is how would you evaluate whether those macros I've been given make sense for someone with my past and my goals? uh what's a realistic and sustainable timeline for my wedding date a year out and how phases like bulk, cut, maintenance should factor in for someone like me. Um my experience has always been eat less, move more, and fall off the wagon under stress. So, I'd love your perspective on that. Um and I just want to say thank you for this show. It's generally part of what pushed me to slow down and think about things differently. Um I have not went the cardio route this summer, which is a first. Yeah, Ryan, >> congratulations first of all. Congratulations. And uh we got plenty of time. >> Yeah. >> I was just That's a good thing. >> I'm so I'm so happy you called in. Uh and and we have a lot of time, which is great. >> It's very challenging when someone says, "I'm getting married in two months." >> Yeah. Yeah. I know. I was worried about that. >> You So, we're going to do this the right way. Okay. So, let me ask you specifically. Is it okay if I ask you some more questions? >> Oh, yeah. I wrote down my answers because I just I knew I'd be so nervous and I I wanted to make sure I had a good train of thought. >> Yeah. Yeah. No worries. And I it's Yeah, I get you being nervous. And just remember, we were trainers for a long time and we're trainers. We do the show, but really we're trainers at heart. So, this is what we love doing the most. Okay. So, what would you say is your specific goal? Let's let's paint a clear picture. So, you're getting married in July. What is it that you want to accomplish by them? I ultimately keep telling people I want to look and feel the best I've ever felt. And I feel like I've always said that. And yet I'm always trying this and trying that. Um to the point of like I I don't know if I give up too soon, if it's my consistency that's not on point. Um I know when I was doing CrossFit, I I could go six days a week, but my diet wasn't dialed in. or I'd have my diet dialed in, but my exercise wasn't or or strength goals in that matter. But I I don't mind um getting stronger and feeling better. I would love my clothes to fit better to be honest with you. And I think that's what's holding me back right now is um you know, putting so much time and energy into this and not feeling like I'm seeing results. I I've been listening to you guys enough to hear about like um body fat percentages. So, I scheduled an inbody scan for Friday. Okay. >> So, um that's coming up. So, [clears throat] I think I'm going to try and use that as tracking instead of the bathroom scale. >> Okay. Okay. So, let me uh so let me try to paraphrase a little bit and you let me know if I if I'm if I'm on point or off. Okay. So, by July of next year, you want to look healthy. You want to feel healthy. You want to get rid of this kind of confusion around what it was you've done in the past and why it didn't work, >> right? >> And [snorts] is it a consistency issue or was it the method? >> Like I want to do this essentially the right way. Would you say that that's okay? >> Can you give me can you give me something objective by July just so I can kind of help plan this out for you. So feel healthy, look healthy. Do you have a weight goal? >> Do you have a size goal? >> I would love to to lose a couple pants sizes. I would love to to not be the weight that I'm at. I feel it at 53. You know, I've heard callers call in and, you know, they're 130 lbs and I'm pushing 200. And I just I fear that like, [snorts] you know, you say when you're strength training to feed yourself and eat more calories, I'm almost afraid that like I'm going to be stuck at this like bulkier size or like >> totally normal. >> I don't know how to how to shrink down, I guess. Yeah, that's a But all everything you're feeling is super normal. You you you feel like almost every client I ever met uh when they first came to me, hire me. I like to have an objective number because this helps me paint a picture a little bit better. Okay, so I heard >> 150 would be great. >> Okay, cool. Okay, so let's let's about 45 lbs. >> Yeah. >> Okay, so 45 lbs of loss. Can I throw some things in there like get stronger, >> more energy, more fit? Okay, we got plenty of time. Here's what it would look like. Okay. Now, there's of course because you're an individual. Uh there's there, you know, I'm going to give you kind of general, but every individual is a little bit different kind of what this looks like. And the and the the big difference between people is how this affects them mentally. Yeah. >> Because it is hard. It is not easy. Doing this the right way is very difficult. Let me explain why. Okay. >> Because you're giving us a great timeline. The focus initially is on giving you a a quote unquote healthy metabolic rate. I want to get your metabolism to burn more calories on its own. This going to set us up for effective sustainable fat loss later. Okay? Because if we do this the old way where you go move as much as you can and you eat as little as you can, here's what ends up happening. The body adapts its metabolic weight downward to match the caloric intake. So, you're moving like crazy and initially you'll see some weight loss on the scale, but then you plateau real hard. >> Real hard. >> And then you're in this position where you're like, "Okay, I'm working out five days a week. I'm starving. I really I kind of don't feel good. I've lost some weight, but I I'm like burnt out, so I'm doing all this stuff." And now I nothing's happening. What do I do? Work out more? Do I eat less? And so, you go down this unsustainable spiral where eventually what it ends up turning into is, uh, I don't want to do this anymore. This sucks. and you give up. Uh, and if that sounds familiar, uh, then you're in, uh, good company because that's how everybody, um, approaches this. Now, on the flip side, when you do this, right, here's what it feels like. And this is this and I'm going to tell you what's hard about it, okay? What it feels like is I'm getting stronger. I'm building muscle. I'm eating a little more. I'm feeding myself. I have more energy. I'm sleeping better. My libido is higher. The scale isn't moving. Okay, what's going on? Why isn't the scale moving? And then a good coach is going to say, "Hey, look, we're moving in the right direction. Don't worry. We're going we're in the build phase. We're going to set you up for the cut later." Then when you're ready, when we have when we have a metabolic rate that gives us runway, meaning I've got your body burning so many calories on its own that I can cut your calories and you're not in this place where you're eating nothing. >> Okay? I'd like to get you to a place where 2,000 calories is a deficit. That's your deficit. That's your diet. Then you see body fat come off your body and you've got sculpt and shape and strength. And by the way, that requires less effort in the gym than trying to manually burn calories on your own. Getting your body to burn more calories on its own is a much easier. It's like putting money in a pl in a in an account that earns money on its own versus you having to work every hour for every dollar that you want to earn. So that's the setup and then the cut. Now, in between that, there are interruptions that tend to happen. So, okay, I'm I'm I'm a little like if you're my client, what'll probably happen through the kind of reverse diet build phase is you're going to probably, you know, text me and say things like, "What's going on? I I need to see the scale move. I I'm going say, okay, fine. I'll give you a couple weeks of cut so I can show you some movement, but then we're going to go back on the reverse. And so it's going to be some coaching through that process. But that's what it kind of looks like. It's more of a snowball effect versus the old way of doing it where you get this quick drop off in this hard plateau and then it doesn't work. [clears throat] So there's a little bit more patience involved and it feels different. It's also very scary, Ryan, because you're used to restricting yourself to see anything happen >> and now you're trying to nourish yourself and that's going to make you be like, I'm going to gain all this weight. What's going to happen? I'm going to gain all this body fat type of deal. >> The exciting part about this is that the psychological part is difficult. The workouts and the eating part is actually easier than what you've done before. [clears throat] >> It's not 75 hard. It is not CrossFit. It is not eating once a day. It is it is far more balanced. Uh you should feel good, you should feel good energy, you should feel strength, you should sleep well, be all the things Sal was talking about and take way less effort. >> Yeah. >> It should not feel like you went from uh not doing much uh cardiovascular work and steps and not really lifting weight. So all a sudden now you're doing five, six days of all these things and every day getting on like it. It shouldn't look like that. It should like this beautiful gradual introduction of we now do this. Okay, we were doing that for a while, getting stronger. Okay, we're now going to add a little bit of this. It should be this beautiful dance and feel good along the way, not extreme. It does not for what we for as much run as time we have and what you're trying to do, which is very realistic. We we've got plenty of time to do this perfect and right. >> Ryan, can I ask you a stupid question? [clears throat] >> Okay. when you let's say in by July you lose the weight you feel great you get married do you want to gain the weight back >> I honestly think that family planning would be in our future so yes in some regards but not [laughter] in >> aside from gaining healthy baby aside from gaining healthy body baby weight and having a baby do you want to like do you want to get married you're fit and then just stop everything and it become like No, I mean I've invested quite a bit of money in my garage gym and I I enjoy it. I just always felt like I wasn't doing enough. Kind of like that mentality like go hard, go hard. Like it's almost hard like to take a rest day. I mean someone would have to literally tell me you need to not do something today or just go for a walk. I I'm the type of person that's like I'm in it, but like I also need to see results or else I start flipping out. And um it it is mental. It is definitely >> that's the coaching part. That's why the coaching part is huge. >> If you So here's the thing. So the goal is and I I know it's a stupid question because I know what the answer was going to be is to get you to a place where you you feel great, you look great, and it's sustainable. This is now part of your lifestyle. It's part of your family's lifestyle, but you're not doing five, six days a week. Here's the deal. You're not a fitness fanatic. 99.9% of people are not. Like fitness fanatics work in fitness. Uh the average person fitness isn't their life. It makes their life better. And so what you don't want to do is is is come up with a routine that's so ineffective, so inefficient that you're devoting all this time in the gym and you're beating the crap out of yourself. Here's the problem. A lot of people equate soreness, pain, and sweat to effectiveness. That's not those are not markers of an effective workout. I mean, if that was an effective workout, you could just do jumping jacks in place as fast as you could until you couldn't breathe anymore and then, you know, congratulations, you had a great workout. It's not how it works. There's there's a science behind it. And when you do it right, your body works for you. Here's what it's going to feel like. And you're the you're my favorite. You're one of my favorite people to work with. Cuz here's what happens when you're doing it right. You're going to come back to me and go, "This is weird. >> Easy. >> I'm my body's responding and I feel like I'm doing nothing." That's that's the response that tends to happen because of the ways that you've done it before, which is like the wrong way, which means you're just busting your butt and starving yourself type of deal. So, there's two options I'm going to give you, okay? One is is far more guaranteed to provide success than the other. Uh, but I'll give you a couple options. So, option one, I'm going to give you a free program. You can follow it. Listen to our podcast for nutrition advice and stuff like that. Try to piece it together. I don't think I looked at your macros. Nothing necessarily wrong with them, but uh it would be like bringing your car to somebody and saying, "Hey, what's wrong with it?" And the mechanic doesn't even look at the car to tell. So, I don't know what you were doing before. I don't know how your body's responding. Um, and so I don't know if that's what your coach did. If they had you track and count and they went off, I don't know any of that. It doesn't look bad on the surface, but it I don't know if it's right or wrong for you. But I could send you a workout that I think would be a great place to start. Second option is I could set you up and for a call with one of my coaches that I know is good because we hire them ourselves. And then if it works out, you could work with them for 9 months to a year, have them take you all the way to your wedding and set you up uh and and essentially they're going to coach you the whole time. The whole time you're with them. >> That's definitely the turnkey. >> They're they're modifying everything. The workout is individualized. The nutrition is indiv individualized. Every time you struggle, you're challenged, you text them, you me you message them, and they work with you. the entire way through. Um, and I'm very proud of our coaches. We we're we're very very difficult on who on how we hire people, but they're excellent. So, if you want, I could set you up with a call with a coach. Either way, I'm going to send you a free program regardless of of what you decide to do. >> Just to add just to add some more clarity to what S is saying around the diet part right now. I'm not sure again what the the trainer's goal is right now, but the goal should be to reverse diet right now. So, I'm not sure if he or she put you on this thinking that and and added the steps and the activity and everything is like, let's let's start getting cut and leaning out. If that was their strategy, it's the wrong strategy right now. So, I'm not sure if that's the strategy right now should be to reverse diet. We're trying we're trying to build right now. >> We're trying to build some strength. >> You have plenty of time to cut. We're going like cutting is way down the road. Right now, we're building and you cannot build in a calorie deficit. So you can you're not going to build muscle on a cal. I don't care how much weights you lift. If you don't feed the body what it needs to build muscle, it won't build muscle. So that should be the focus right now is let's build let's build a muscle. Let's build muscle. Let's get strong. Let's feed your body what it needs to do that. And then when we get our calories to a place and let's say somewhere it's going to be like 2,800 calories where you're not gaining weight on the scale, you feel strong, workouts are great, then we stair step down and cut. Then we start adding steps. we start adding cardio, that's when we start, but that's way down the road. Right now, we build the metabolism up. We build that engine so it's working for you. So, that that's that's what Sal's not sure about. If that's what the trainer was setting you up for right now that you you may have been so low of calories that 2,000 calories is a reverse diet for you. I don't know. But if that feels like a cut, that's not where we would put you to start you off. >> Just add. >> Yeah. Um, I I honestly don't know either. I I know that last year, um, I wasn't eating breakfast or lunches. It was pretty much I'd get home at 3:00 or 4 and I'd have a pretty big sustainable meal. And I I've always used, um, like real food. Uh, I I follow like an online, they send a meal prep thing every Sunday and and I cook and I make stuff at home. [clears throat] So, it's never been like, you know, ready make processed food. It's been real food, but it's just probably not been enough food. >> And so, I think that that's what happened is um I fasted for so long and my body started sending me red flags like, "Yo, you're starving us." And I think now I'm like in that I keep people keep telling me it's water retention or this and that, but really I I think that my body is just holding on to something out of safety. >> So, I'm not really sure. It could be. That's I think part of the confusion >> it to it totally could be Ryan. All you need you're actually all you need is really good guidance uh through this process. That's all you need. >> You're set up nice. You got a home gym. You got meals being prepped for you. You eat whole foods. There's no reason we don't crush your goals out the park. Just so you know. >> And by the way, I don't think this is a lack of discipline, hun. >> No. It was just unsustainable. >> Yeah. >> I don't think it's a lack of discipline. I don't think it's a lack of out of the gates. In fact, you would do really well if you gave the focus to someone else. If you outsourced it and you said, "Hey, coach, let me know what to do." And then trust the process. And here's what it'll feel like when you do it the right way. First off, uh probably don't weigh yourself, okay? Because that's going to mess with your head. Uh but what it'll feel like is you're just initially going to feel better. You just be like, "Man, I got good energy. Okay, I got I added 10 pounds to my, you know, my squat. I'm feeling good. I got more energy at work. My libido's up." Like, okay, this is cool. my body doesn't look like it's changing yet. Although your fiance will probably say something like, "You look a little firmer." Or, "Hey, are you losing weight?" You're like, "I don't know if I am." And so, that's going to be what it's going to feel like before you start to see the radical changes in the mirror. You're just going to start to feel better uh from doing that. But I I really good coaching I think you would do really well with through this process and it would set you up for for the rest of your life. >> Just hearing you guys say these things, it it it's kind of reassurance. I think I needed to hear it, you know. Um, uh, I I guess I'd been getting mixed messages from so many different sources and and not sure what was best for me and, uh, confusion along with, you know, like like the scale not moving. But I hope I hope that, uh, when I get the inbody scan, um, I can, you know, check it every quarter or so many months. >> Exactly. Yep. No, that would be good. >> That's exactly what a good co a coach would use that. And and honestly, I would use it and not even let you see it. I'd say, go get the inbody scan. I want to see it. I'll be the one to be that will dictate where we go from here just because I don't want none of that stuff to mess with your head. Uh but it is a good it is a good data point for us. But like Sal said, the things that we're really focused on right now, energy, strength, you will feel like you'll feel like your body's firming up. And that's why you stay away from the scale because the scale could easily shoot up 5 lbs and you actually felt and look better until you got on the scale and you saw that number. >> So like that's why we we'll tell somebody like you like don't look at that right now because you'll get like this husband will say a compliment. You'll feel you'll feel tighter. You'll feel stronger. You be like, "Man, I feel good." Then you scale and the scale it went up five pounds. And then you go like, "Oh my god, you feel like a failure." Then all a sudden your attitude changes. It's like, "What?" And then that's where people course correct. Then they freak out. They start changing when in reality they were heading right where I want them to head. That was perfect, but they got in their own way. So >> So I think Maps Anabolic would be a good program for you. Uh I would do prephase for about four weeks and then I would move into phase one uh and go from there. Um, I like walking. You said 9,000 steps a day. That's perfectly fine. That's great. Um, and I if you if you're open to just having a call with one of our coaches, uh, who I can vouch for, I can make sure I set up, uh, I set something up for you and you can get on the phone and you can have you can get in more detailed conversation with them about some of the stuff. >> Sure. I'm open to anything really at this point. >> Awesome. And thanks for listening. Keep listening. We talk about this stuff all the time. And listen to the callers. You're going to hear a lot of callers who sound similar to you. And a lot of similar advice you'll hear. >> Yep. >> And I just need to shout out um my best friend Amanda. She had purchased Muscle Mommy from you guys and she was the one that told me to give you a listen. So >> awesome. Thank you guys. Thank you, Ryan. >> See you later. Uh yeah, she's uh very typical, very common. I'm so glad she's calling us. >> Yes, right now. This is plenty of time. >> Doable. >> Very doable. >> Very doable. If she's with one of our I'll say this right now. If she works with one of our coaches through that entire process, her success rate is all but guaranteed >> for sure. Unless something crazy happens, it's all but guaranteed. >> Yeah, I hope you know she's already I hope >> she needs guidance though. >> Well, not just any guidance, too, though. Brand a brand new a brand new trainer to take. I know, dude. That's the thing. >> The diet I don't know how they set up the calories and macros, but what it sounds to me >> sounds like he put her on thinking that's a cut >> or it's like a standard 2,000 calories. Like that's what the RDA says, 2,000 calories. I'm guessing, >> but that's what it sounds like uh that they did. So, >> I mean, regardless if whether uh how the goal should be from here is to to add calories. >> Let's get you strong. >> Yeah. >> Let's get her strong. Let's get her feeling good. Uh which is going to trip her out cuz she's probably never felt that through working out. >> Yeah. >> And let's set this up and we got plenty of time. >> Our next caller is Melissa from Nebraska. >> Hi, Melissa. Hi, Melissa. >> Hello. Hi, guys. >> How are you? >> Thank you for having me on. I'm I'm doing great. [laughter] here. >> Well, I uh I uh so I'll do the same thing everyone does is um you know read my question. It's changed just a little bit, but um started my road back to fitness in September of 2025. Um I'm 43, 5'4. Um I started at well over 300 lbs. Um everything was difficult. Um you know, everything health was starting to plummet. So I was pre-diabetic and sleep apnea and high blood pressure and um you know, just everything was bad mad. Um, I decided I was done living that way. 100% still feel that way. Um, so to date, I've lost 60 lbs. Um, significantly stronger. Um, I started with about 87 pounds of lean muscle mass. I still have about 80 pounds of lean muscle mass. Um, body fat has gone down about 7%. Um, so I'm no longer pre-diabetic and blood pressure is normal and no sleep apnea, so out of the woods. >> That's awesome, so to speak. >> Incredible. That's been great. >> That's incredible. Incredible. And to just so you know, to be down uh that many pounds and only lose that much muscle is incredible. The ratio. So you did a you did a good job obviously of strength training, eating protein like you're supposed to. So well well done. >> Very good. >> Thank you. Thank you. It's been this is by far the best way that I've ever tried to get get in shape. Um you've heard all the stories. I tried to do it the wrong way many times. This has been awesome. Um so I worked with a trainer um a fantastic trainer for about six months. um and working with him, I lost about 14 pounds. Um before it, I just it was a really struggle to get nutrition um under wraps. Um so I started on a GLP1 in January. Um and my plan all along was, you know, short-term. Um I didn't want to be on it long term. I was just trying to get, you know, the right habits put in place. So I was on 2 and a half milligrams of Zbound for pretty much the whole time. I went up to five milligrams for about six weeks. Um, and my initial question I was really struggling with, you know, when do I taper off of the med? Because I still have about, you know, 60 pounds left to go. I still have a lot of weight left to lose. Um, and so about a week after I submitted my question, I just kind of got angry and I said, I don't want to do it anymore. So, I I just skipped it and I thought, I'll do two weeks. And then two weeks went by and I kept feeling good. It's been about a month. Um, and I've kept feeling good. Um, I'm down about three lbs since then. >> Oh, good. Um, and I think the hunger that I have is what you're supposed to feel. It hasn't been, you know, wicked cravings or anything like that. Um, so my question now is, um, what is your advice to go from here? Um, you know, knowing your your background with peptides, like is there anything that I need to look out for, um, in terms of micro doing or, you know, I don't want to hit a wall and, you know, relapse or anything. Um, and then I guess just a little bit on training. Um, I've fallen in love with strength training. So, I I do that three or four days a week. Um, I'm on phase three of MAPS anabolic, um, which I've loved. Um, so my lifts are bench about 120, deadlift about 215, and squat 205. >> Um, overhead press. I got cocky on this one. I was at 95 lbs, but I could only get up to like three or four reps, so that one's tougher. >> Um, and I'm I'm about 2,200 probably calories a day on average. um at about 180 grams of protein. Um and then on off days um I it's I try to do very very very basic Pilates and yoga and then just walking and pool stuff um on my off days. So I guess my question is on the GLP1 side, what should I watch out for, plan for or do anything with and then on the train training side knowing that I still have a lot to go um what are the guard rails I guess I should keep myself in. >> Yeah, [clears throat] Melissa, you are doing great. You did a great job. >> The way you're handling this. Yeah. Great job. Really good. >> What uh you mind if I ask you some more questions? >> Sure. Yeah. >> What what what's the difference now? Uh or let me let me ask you this differently. Before you started on this journey, uh what were the things that got you to where you were? Because that's going to help me. >> Yeah. Uh well, you know, I I I tried keto before and you know, I'd lose a bunch of pounds and gain it all back and my mood was terrible and um you know, I I would try to you know, do all kinds of cardio, which I hate and I'm really bad at. [laughter] And uh you know, I I just I guess I had the same mindset that a lot of people did is that's what you had to do to get in shape. And um I'd always been kind of naturally strong. Um, but I was afraid of, you know, looking manly or whatever. So, I thought that, well, I have to do cardio if I'm and like just nothing worked. Um, and I got myself to a point where like I just kept hitting brick wall after brick wall and I just kind of gave up. And I poured all of my focus and attention on career. Um, you know, like I sit at a desk and I stare at a computer and that only works for so long until you just I just hit a wall and I said I I'm going to kill myself if I keep living like this. It's not good. Um, and like my I have two little nephews. They're seven and four. And one day they said, "Aunt Melissa, will you come on the floor and play with us?" They're playing with cars or whatever. And I had to ask them to move the cars up to the coffee table because it was too hard for me to get up and down off the floor. And I was like, "This is not how I am. Um, not how I want to live, not how I want to show up for these boys." Um, so yeah, I guess just long story short, I think I have kind of the same trajectory as a lot of people did until I just I had to wake up or it wasn't going to go well. >> Yeah. And I'm glad you're starting you're you're you're kind of on this journey and doing what seems to be a lot of the right things. >> You're kicking ass right now. I I would love to co I want to I want to coach you. I want to take I want to take you the rest of the way. You're doing so good and you're set up so nice. >> I would love for you to work with our team. You just you're you're set up beautifully right now. you've done such a good job. Uh the fact that you've come off this GLP1 for a whole month and you didn't what happens to a lot of people after about two two weeks the appetite starts to kick back up and then people go off the rails and bad habits. So the fact that you've been able to keep that in check is huge. Just so you know too though there's nothing we've had I've had this with clients where we're off for a while then we use it we we bring it back in and we micro dose it for a little bit. So there's there's not that's not a failure to do that if we find it necessary to do that at one point. But the fact that you've done this already a hell of a job. Love that you have leaned into getting strong and that that is your strength that is going to be the your the thing that is your saving grace. The fact that you are naturally strong and I would lean you more into that is like let's keep getting strong and building more muscle right now and I think you're ready for that. I think we're ready to build for a little bit before we come back down again. >> That would be the approach. Now, in the past, had you lost weight before and gained it back when you had gone through? >> Yeah, I I lost about 60 pounds doing keto, but it was really fast loss and then I gained >> probably 80 back. It was Yeah. really rapid. T >> typical that typically happens or something like that. In if you could put yourself in the mindset of when you had done this in the past, let's say in the beginning when it's going great, >> did you feel motivated? Did it feel like yeah, I think I'm doing this right before things started changing? >> Not uh not really. I think I had, you know, the initial excitement of awesome, I'm losing weight. That's really cool. Um, and I'm going to ignore the fact that my breath is bad and and all these [laughter] other >> and I feel miserable and all >> totally is awful. Um, but I, you know, and like in high school I was super athletic, but you know, strength training for women was never really a thing. Like you'd go in and use a few machines in the weight room. I'd never ever tried Yes. >> Um, you know, strength training the way I'm doing it now. And I think that's for me the biggest game changer. Good. Good. Yeah. The reason why I'm asking this question is because when you if we do this the right way, obviously it's more effective. It's more sustainable. Uh you feel better. Doesn't feel like you're you're, you know, slamming yourself up against the wall. >> Yeah. >> That being said, if we do this right, we're going to be doing this for hopefully the rest of your life, right? So, you'll have some kind of >> exercise the rest of your life and nutrition habits and and lifestyle is really changes. >> But life changes through that process. And there are going to be periods of time in life, this is just what happens to everyone, where you're not going to feel so happy about it. You're not going to feel so motivated because, I don't know, work or life or stress or now you've been doing it for a while and it doesn't seem as exciting. And so that's when things start to get really challenging. >> Uh it's not challenging when you love it, but it's challenging when you start to not like it so much. >> And so what what a good coach is going to do is going to move you through that process. the the coach's goal is to get you to your your results, but the main goal for the coach is can I get Melissa to be able to do this for the rest of her life. >> That's what that's what a good coach is going to really do. And you're you're starting to do things the right way. The the the way the things that I'll caution you on is jumping in with this great mood, great attitude, and doing everything. >> Yeah. >> Like, man, I'm active every day. I'm doing math metabolic and I'm doing Pilates and I'm doing yoga >> and because uh there's nothing wrong with it. Even if it's appropriate, there's nothing wrong with it >> except it's a lot. >> It's a lot more than maybe what you were doing before. >> Oh yeah, >> I was a couch potato, >> right? And so what can happen is you go through one of those tough bouts of life that we all do like, oh my god, I got I'm gonna, you know, five days a week I got to do this thing and then you you skip two or three days you start to feel like a failure and you're like, you know, I don't want to do this anymore. uh I can't maintain this uh and then you stop. And so what we want to do is we want to avoid uh that old cycle. So whatever you decide to add or do you got to go into it with the mentality of is this something I can maintain for the rest of my life even in those periods of time when I'm not going to want to. That's more important than let's see how much I can get done uh right now. >> Right. That makes sense. >> Yeah. Now, a good coach is going to take you through that process and you're actually in a great place to work >> great place >> with a really really good coach who's going to work you through this entire process. As far as a GLP is concerned, uh it it has profound effects on appetite, but it also changes uh neural pathways because old behaviors aren't practiced while you're on it. So, although hunger may come back, it may not feel like it used to. Now, that doesn't mean you can't go back to where you were before because because oftentimes we will we'll reach out for food because we're hungry, but also because we're stressed or also because we're bored. And then you can rebuild those old neural pathways. And so, what Adam said is very common. You get back on the GLP, work through that again, come back off, and it sometimes take two or three cycles >> before you're like, uh, I'm totally off. Um, but the the the the question of where you because I read your email, and part of your question was where should I invest my my finances? The most uh effective thing you could do is work with a good coach. >> More effective than a GLP, more effective than anything else, is working with a good coach who's going to be able to work you through this entire process and get you there. >> So, that's that's the most valuable thing you can invest in for sure. >> And if you're and if you do end up having to do GLP one again, we'll save you some money going through a different route than what you're probably going through right now. You're probably paying top dollar for the direct and it's so expensive. >> Yeah. Yeah. No, we'll we'll help you we'll help you through that process. >> Yeah. Looks like you were using the brand name, not the compound pharmacy. Okay. Compounded is less. >> Yeah. Yeah. Way less and better. So, because you can you can adjust the titrate it. >> Yeah. So, better. >> Okay. Yep. >> Sounds good. >> Yeah. Question is um like guardrails for calorie. Am I in the right spot? You know, about 2200. >> So, you are you are right now. Mosa, what uh what our coach would do with you though is reverse diet you from here. >> So, that you would actually start to build those calories. Especially if you told me to you already see the appetite is naturally coming up is a good sign if we make the right choices with food. So I'm just use hypothetical numbers so you get kind of an idea what the vision looks like. It would look like >> we start ramping these calories up. We get it closer to 2,800 calories and then bring you back down again. And then we do that. Then you're going to and what will happen is weight loss right now will plateau a little bit. If we do this correctly, strength will go up. So you'll start feeling good in the gym. Scale weights kind of staying the same but you're feel you're eating more. you're feeling stronger. We get our calories up there. Then I go, "Okay, let's take them down." We take them down, weight starts dropping off the scale again. We do that for a while, then we're going to reverse. Kind of playing that game of do that for a while, weight comes down, then we reverse back up again, come back down. It's just this and we should see this beautiful over the next 9 months to a year of just you continue to get stronger in better shape and not a lot of crazy like you're already doing plenty of activity. So there there this isn't I don't need you to do more of more stuff. It's more of the right balance and focus and and consistency and then also being there for you in those moments and times where we don't feel as motivated and coaching you through that process because that's where the the curveball and changing. >> Yeah. And I I'll give you a few rules with diet that'll help uh besides counting macros, calories, a few rules. Whole natural foods. >> If you just avoid heavily processed foods, stick to whole natural foods. Make sure you have it's protein centric. So, aim for high protein. Eat the protein first. >> Uh, then that right there is a real nice natural guard rail >> to going way off the deep end. That's it. Uh, and what helps a lot with that, Melissa, is is meal prepping. >> Yep. >> Meal prepping helps a lot. >> Yeah, that's been helpful. Yeah. Takes the guesswork out of it. >> Yeah. Because it's a lot easier to be like, I'm hungry. Okay, I can eat. I'm gonna eat this whole natural meal >> versus I can't eat anything. or I'm counting my calories, but what's in there is hyperpalatable processed foods which make the appetite go even uh higher make it very >> it's what I did before my snack would be a whole meal of just junk and it's more so okay right >> that's awesome um I just I want to say thank you guys I've been listening to you since I started this whole process and you've re reinforced some good decisions and you kept me from making some really foolish ones so uh I tell everybody just you know dial in listen to these guys think they know what they're talking about So, thank you. Really appreciate it. >> If you're if you're open, I can have one of my coaches call you. You could talk to them about what it looks like to work with a mind pump coach. There's two options. One is a much less lower investment than the other. >> Um because we we created particular to help make it more affordable. So, there are a couple options, but at the very least, you can ask some questions. >> Sure. Love to have a chat with them. >> Yeah. I hope I hope we add you to the family because it's going to be fun to watch this process for next year. You're doing great. Yep. >> Awesome. All right. Thanks, guys. Really appreciate it. >> You got it. >> All right. Thanks. Bye. >> Bye. Well, I'm glad she's uh great. Yeah, she's approaching it the right way. The challenge is going to be >> because I can hear it in her voice. She's like, I feel good. I'm motivated. Let's do this. The challenge is always adding throwing way too many things at herself because she feels good about it. >> She wants to do a lot more movement or something else to add. Yeah. >> And and then the inevitable will happen. Uh you know, she's not going to have that same feeling and then it's like now I'm done or I can't do this anymore and I can't maintain it. And so that's really the challenge. But if she's working with one of our coaches, I am like confident. Oh, they'll blow her up. They'll walk. >> I hope she does. I mean, I love getting a hold of somebody like this where she's at, right? She's such a good place. She did such a good job already. I mean, uh I knew it as soon as I saw the 60 lbs down and only 7 lbs loss of muscle cuz it's it's hard to drop that much weight >> and in the time that she did from Sep September to now and not lose some muscle. I mean, so our goal is always to hold on and obviously perfect is lose 60 and you know, lose no, but that is very difficult. I'm just going to say this. On a GLP, what you see across the board, it's about a 30 to 40% uh lean body mass loss. So 60 lb would have looked like 20 lbs. >> That's right. >> Of lean body mass. Not to mention of that 7 lbs, I don't know how she tested her body fat, but most >> uh ways of measuring count uh fluid as lean body mass. It's non-fat mass, >> right? >> So that could be she was down water weight for sure. >> That's right. So, she probably and if she got stronger, which she says she did, >> uh, I'm like I I'm confident she lost >> plan and everything GLP1 is perfect. >> Great numbers, too, already on on bench, [snorts] squat, overhead prep. I mean, she's strong and she's doing that on like 2,000 calories or 22, what we start to reverse, >> man, we start to reverse diet her and get her really strong, that metabolism is going to be roaring and then she's just going to see the weight loss keep coming. >> She'll do great. >> Our next caller is Meredith from Texas. >> Meredith. >> Hey. Hey. How are you? >> Got you. >> Oh, thank you. Sorry about that. [laughter] >> It's all right. >> Hey, no, I'm glad you called back. I was looking forward to talking with you. How can we help you? >> Well, first of all, I want to like everybody else just give a big shout out and thank you. Um because you guys um have just really been such a you know, a great um just part of my life. That's all. [laughter] >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Okay, I'm just going to read my read my question. Uh my name is Meredith. I've been married for 24 years. I'm a mom of three teenagers. I'm a I've been a personal trainer for over 20 years. I've been a listener since 2017. OG. >> All right. [clears throat] >> Thanks to y'all. Um I've really built the body into the body that I've wanted. September 29th, 2023, when I thought I was in the best shape of my life. I was 44 years old and had a grand mall seizure. Um, [gasps] I was taken to the ER where they diagnosed me with metastatic stage 4 metastatic melanoma of the brain. [clears throat] Um, I underwent emergency brain surgery to remove the cancerous tumor that they could operate on. But I also had another one that I was sent to MD Anderson for imunotherapy. But the imunotherapy um triggered encphilitis. I was hospitalized for 12 days with severe inflammation on my brain. Praise God, I was able to come home, but it was the hardest time of my life. I didn't know my name. I hallucinated. I hardly knew who my family was. I couldn't be left alone. Um, this also triggered over a dozen seizures. Um, very serious seizures for two over two years. >> Wow. I'm so grateful to say now that I am cancer free, seizure free, and I'm working my way back into the gym. >> Praise God. >> Awesome, man. >> So, here's my question. As experienced coaches, how would you program strength, muscle, and conditioning for someone like me whose biggest limitation is not necessarily my muscles, but it's a recovering brain and nervous system? What would you prioritize to maximize performance without overwhelming the nervous system? I think this could really help not just me but anyone from recovering from brain injuries, neurological neurological conditions, um, andor cancer treatments. Thank you so much for all that y'all do. >> Oh, Meredith, God bless you. Thanks for calling in. >> Tell me about uh not overwhelming your CNS. like uh what does that feel like when that starts to get overwhelmed and what are the things that make it feel that tend to push it in that direction? >> Um when I get my heart rate up, of course, um getting my heart rate up really sends my central nervous system into kind of that uh fight or flight. Um real shaky. >> Okay. Um, I've come so far though and I keep trying to give myself grace because I couldn't even lift a bar when I first got back into the gym. I tried to lift a dumbbell. Couldn't lift a dumbbell. So, I went down to um bands >> and uh I started with bands and I've I've uh I've successfully finished um performance and I'm not where I was um of course, but I'm just trying to find my new norm. >> Okay. How thin is the line between like is it very thin between like this is my workout and if I just go just a little too far, I start to get this bad reaction. Is that what that feels like? >> Yes. Okay. >> Exactly. >> Okay. But you've been progressing this whole time. [snorts] >> I am. Yes. >> Excellent. So, my advice is going to sound a little generic, but your focus is going to be on range of motion technique. You're going to slow breathe through the workout. >> I also think turning the lights down or being in a semi dark room while doing it. So, what we're trying to do is minimize stimulus, >> long rest periods. >> Okay. Uh long rest periods. Um, and I like stability based movements for you. >> Yeah. Where you got to really focus. >> So like physio ball exercises, uh, unilateral type exercises and the focus is on the technique more than anything. >> And then when it feels like you've way surpassed the resistance that you're using, then you move up the weight. In other words, >> typically when we're not dealing with a very sensitive central nervous system, if you feel like you can add weight, you add weight. But what I would do with someone like you is we wouldn't add weight until it's like this is so easy. Then I'd add weight. >> Have you wor Have you worked with a suspension trainer much? >> I do. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Just >> it's boring. [laughter] >> Just being honest. >> Well, I mean, that's fair. That's fair. I mean, there is ways to intensify. I just think that the stability component to that and the focus on your body >> um positioning uh would be really helpful to build off of that. Obviously getting to the weights is going to be, you know, more interesting. Uh, but I I do think a good period that you could really kind of focus down on that and like take your time and, you know, really pay attention to your breathing and like where you're squeezing, where you're feeling, uh, is going to make a big difference. >> Yes. So, it's going to feel like while you're doing your sets, you're trying to keep your, um, your your your CNS down. So, while you're doing the sets here, [snorts] >> Yep. It's very controlled, very >> keep it calm. >> Yes. It's not like the traditional strength training and you drive. Like what we're trying to do is we're trying to keep things relaxed as we add a little bit of stress on the body to set the adaptation in motion for strength. The fact that you're getting stronger it it great sign. Yeah. >> Yes. That's an excellent sign. You're moving in the right direction. Are you doing anything that helps uh bring the CNS down? Are you doing anything that >> feels recuperative or rejuvenating for yourself? >> Um, walking is huge. Um, walking, sleeping a lot more. >> I've never been a good sleeper, so I've really prioritized my sleep. Um, you know, I have low blood sugar, so I have had to probably eat every couple to, you know, few hours, and I make sure it's protein and fat is my my main goal. >> Okay. Do you I >> I was doing a lot of yoga and slow breathing. >> Yes. >> Um yeah, I I kind of got away from that. Um but I can I think you know incorporating that again would probably be >> treat yourself some massages. >> Yeah, I was just going to say that >> massage therapy for someone like you. Calm that central nerve, relax, >> especially foot massage. So yeah, so you know we went through a period, my wife went through a period uh after we had our son. It was a very traumatic uh birth process and she was in this in in a place where her CNS would get uh it was like a trip wire like once it went off she was in this kind of fight orflight state and it was like she couldn't apply intensity and one thing that we found uh that to this day now uh I make sure she does this because it increases her resilience for everything else. So that's the way you want to look at it is because sometimes a little guilt could set in especially for a mom. It's like, "Oh, I'm doing this thing when I should be doing these other things that I'm doing." And I was like, you know, I got to take care of all these other And I I explained to my wife and she now gets it. When you do this thing, it increases your it improves your resilience for everything else. So, here's what she does. She goes to the mall. We have a mall that's not too far from us and they have foot massages there. And she sits down, she gets her feet rubbed, which for her brings everything down quite a bit. And then for her, she reads her Bible, which also is a very meditative process for her. And when she does this once a week and sometimes I make her go more because something stressful happened or you know something in the family I'll and she comes back and it's like her her stress bucket grew. It increases her resilience. And so that's something that I I would recommend to you as well. If if that's something that you enjoy, I'm not a massage person, but if that's something where you could sit down for 30 minutes, it almost recharges your batteries a little bit and you can sit and read. And what it'll do is it'll improve your body's ability to adapt to your exercise and make you more resilient uh for other things. So, because when you're looking at health like like a big health sphere, what we tend to do, especially as trainers, is we got workouts and diet and then we don't count anything else and then sometimes we get smarter and we throw in sleep, but nothing else counts. >> And it's like, no, no, sometimes massage or meditation is part of the formula because it actually it helps everything else. So, I don't know if that resonates with you, but >> I No, I I do. I love that, S. Um I have been super um consistent now that I can. I I used to not be able to listen or read. Um now I've been able to get outside every morning. I put my feet in the grass and I open up my Bible. >> Oh, wonderful. and I spend a good 20 minutes before anybody's awake and I have my I have my quiet time and that's how I start my mornings. >> Oh, that's wonderful. >> I think you're doing great. I and I' I'd love to send you some I'd love to send you a program that you could pull from. Uh but really it's going to be which it sounds like you kind of figured out. You you you just kind of go real slow and your body progresses and you got to be very careful pushing too hard. It's such a hard thing to do because it's a I'm I'm a recovering uh um hit, you know, addict and CrossFit addict. >> So, uh it's been a challenge to get to that place of it's okay not to work out every day. >> Yeah. >> To slow down. Yeah. And just so you know, u you might already know this, but let's say, okay, moderate intensity, right? We'll say moderate intensity. Low reps at moderate intensity is less of a stress on the body than high reps at moderate intensity. >> Okay. >> Okay. So, if I'm keeping my intensity like on a scale of 1 to 10, I'm keeping it a seven. Let's say >> five reps at a seven is less stressful on my CNS than 15 reps out of seven. >> Yeah. Okay. So, so because people when I say low reps to people who are trying to manage stress, >> uh, they're like, "Wait a minute, low reps. I'm going real heavy. I'm driving. I'm pushing real hard." It's like, "No, no, no. We're keeping the intensity moderate." >> Vitality of the high rep. >> We're just doing low reps at a moderate intensity. So, what it might look like for you is a set of five reps for squat, but it's not five reps with something you could barely do six or seven with. It's five reps with something you can do 10 reps with. >> Y, >> okay, >> that's easier on the body. That's easier on the body than doing a set of 10 reps with something you could do 20 with, for example. Higher reps stress the body a little bit more than lower reps do when the intensity is the same. >> I love that. I love that. Yeah. I don't I don't think of it that way. So, >> yeah. No. And then, uh, you probably train your clients on physio balls. I'm sure you've used them before. >> Yes. >> Physio balls will be good for you right now. >> Okay. >> So, like instead of sitting on a bench to do a shoulder press, sit on a physio ball. It's just going to help you maintain balance and it'll help check the the amount of resistance that you're using. Awesome. Awesome. I'm not back to training clients just yet. Um I will tell y'all though, it has been such a gift because um I have a an elderly couple that I work with just once a week and they have been such a blessing to be able to help them sit and stand. >> That's so great. and and that's been um a huge blessing for not I mean they they told me that I'm I'm helping them but honestly they're helping me so much because of just trying to find that confidence again to get back to where um I can be where I where I love to be. >> Oh, that's so awesome. >> So good. >> That's so awesome. That's great. This is great. >> Well, so what what program would you recommend? Um, like I said, I mean, I love I love all of y'all's programs. Um, like I said, I I did finish performance and I went to start strong. Um, just because I'm frustrated, I want to get strong. [laughter] >> So, that [clears throat] those are those are all probably more volume than I would want I would want you to do. >> Okay. >> I like our maps 15 protocols. >> I like mass 15 symmetry. >> You know, maps 15 symmetry would probably be good. >> I I like that protocol. That doesn't mean you can't be active on top of it and do, you know, yoga or walking or hiking, >> but [clears throat] a little bit every day is probably going to give you better results >> uh than some of our more traditional programs. >> Okay. All right. >> Yeah. Do you have any of our mass 15 programs? >> I do. I don't. I don't. >> Send you 15 symmetry. >> Yeah. Let's let me set you up for the next Let's see. These are what three months. Let me set you up for the next nine months. Let's set her two more 15s. I'll send you the original Mass 15. Mass 15 symmetry. >> Mass 15 performance. >> Follow them one after another. >> Thank you. Thank you so much. >> Yeah, you got it. >> You're all set, Meredith. >> Yeah, you're good. >> I Yeah, thank big shout out to Doug. Thank you for [laughter] um I know we never see him on camera, but I love uh hearing about him and his flute collection and [laughter] >> big flute guy. >> He's a big flute. >> Big flute guy. If you ever come come if you ever come out to California, come visit us, please. >> Yes. >> Absolutely. Y'all y'all mean a lot to me and I I I talk to my husband about y'all all the time and he's always like, "Okay, what do the mind pump guys say?" [laughter] >> Yeah. God bless you. Thank you so much for calling. So much. Yeah. You have a good day. Take care. >> Okay, y'all too. Bye. >> I mean, tremendous success considering what you've been through. >> Tremendous success. Yeah. Yeah. I've I've trained clients where their their CNS was uh like a like a trip wire. >> You know, I had one guy that I trained when I'd have to schedule them when no one else was there. >> Yeah. >> We turn off all the lights. >> Music. All lights. >> Yes. We turn off the music. We'd go train in the corner. >> I had a guy >> and and eventually we got to the point where he could come in, lights were on, people are working out. But this is all he his body could handle because even if I did a light workout, >> the lights, the music, and the people would like get his body >> uh over amped and it just wasn't well. It didn't work. And so we had to could gradually move them up. But the fact that she's already improved so much is such a good sign. All right, I know you like that episode. If you did, check this one out. Walking. It's one of the best things you could do for your health, bar none. But there's a better way to approach it. Yes, you can just walk, but if you follow the right protocol, it's far more effective. Let's talk about >> a walking. I can't wait to hear your walking protocol. >> Well, there is Well, there is a protocol. So, and I'll start with the first thing, right? Because just first off, uh let me start with this. One of the reasons why walking um is such a great form of just activity is because it's low risk of injury. Now,