How To SURVIVE & THRIVE In The Upcoming Financial Crisis! (PREPARE NOW) | Ray Dalio

It's the same for every individual, same for every company. If you understand this, look at your income, expenses, and your savings. And then, do a stress test. So that you get yourself secure. The same things happen over and over again through time for basically the same reasons. A lot of these things happen once in a lifetime, you know. And if you don't go back and see how they worked over time, then you're in in trouble. So, um there's a pattern. I could describe the pattern, um but there's a pattern that happens over and over again, and we're in a particular spot in the pattern. And then, um it's to understand it not just because it happened before, but to understand mechanistically how it happens. And then, one has a sense of how to deal with it. So, speaking of the mechanisms, what's influencing this more? When you started looking back into history, are you looking for um this sort of moment in the debt cycle, or are you looking for pandemics? A collision of the two? Um what do you think influences this more? Well, um pandemics come along occasionally, but uh anything that's important. Let me Let me say the three most important circumstances that existed before we had the downturn, which was caused by a pandemic, but any downturn would have produced the same results. The three most important things that are happening in the world now are um that we're at the end, late, in a long-term debt cycle in which central banks cannot control monetary policy the same way. They can't lower interest rates. They have They can't get money to a lot of people who need the money um in the traditional way. So, just like in 1929 to 1932, there was a debt crisis. That came as a result of an excessive amount of debt in the boom years. And then when you have that in 1932, we hit zero interest rates. And when they had when they hit zero interest rates in 32, like in 2008, central bank prints money um and buys financial assets. When you talk about financial assets, this is one thing that even I found myself a little bit confused by. What What is a financial asset? Well, mostly bonds. Okay. Central bank is allowed to buy bonds and mostly government bonds. So, if you were going to describe what a bond is, like what's the easiest way to think about a bond? Um when someone borrows for a number of years um and has to pay back that makes a promise to deliver currency, that's a bond. And so, one man's debts are another man's assets, which we call a bond, and that is a promise to deliver currency. And so, what happens in these cycles is that normally uh central banks can stimulate the economy by lowering interest rates. But when you hit zero interest rates, that doesn't work. So, the last time it hit zero interest rates was 1932. And what they did in 1932 was the same thing they did in 2008. And that is that the central banks prints a lot of money and buys government bonds. And so, we're doing that now. And just to be clear, the reason that they're doing that is so somebody has bought a government bond, the government is basically saying, "Hey, you, dear person, lend me the money. I'm going to build something, roads, whatever, but I'm going to pay you back in a year, two years, 10 years, whatever, um plus interest, I would assume, that makes it worthwhile." Um and the reason that the government is going in and buying those is to get back liquidity to the people that have loaned them that money. Yes, because think of it this way. The central government and also companies and individuals don't have the capacity to create money. So, the central government has the right to determine they can tax people, they can get money from people, and they can spend money on whatever they want to spend money on, but they don't have the right to print money and create money and credit like the central bank does. Central bank is the Federal Reserve. Similarly, the Federal Reserve does not have the right to um spend money and determine how it's spent. That's for Congress. All right, so before cuz this can get so confusing and I'll play the role of the layman here and just make sure that we walk through things. So, the Federal Reserve, I think most people think is a department of the government, but they're not. Are they a private bank? No, they're they're a part of the government that the govern- that the system has put into place so to get the creation of money out of the political system. Okay, so it sits sort of outside of the political sphere of the government. Um it is within Congress, but it has a set of rules like the Supreme Court has a set of rules. That means that the president can't control it, the Congress can't control it, um that it's operating in a sense uh separate way. And so, the important thing to know about this crisis and that it happened in the 1930s is that in order to get the checks that we're needing, you know, a lot of people, a lot of companies um need checks. Now, where will that those checks come from? So, there'll be checks from the government. The type of support we're going to receive is two types of support. Where does this all this money come from? So, the the government when they say, "I'm going to pay more for unemployment insurance or I'm going to give you a loan for a small business." or so on, they Where did they get the money from? Well, they either tax it, but if they tax it, that's bad. So, the government they can borrow it. That's what a deficit is. The government runs a deficit. And then, the question is who's going to borrow it when everybody's financially strapped? And the Federal Reserve says they have the power to print money, and they will say, "I will borrow it and I I will lend you the money." So, the Federal Reserve is lending the money, and it is also lending others the money. All right. So, really fast, when when they print money, are they literally sending a Brinks truck with bags full of cash and distributing it through local banks? No, money is digital. Okay, so they're literally just making ledger adjustments in a digital file somewhere. Right. The important thing to know is that all that we think about money is not limited in any way like there's a certain amount of money out there. It's all make-believe. It's all digital. So, they can change the digits and then they can create money. Now, that's an important consideration because if they can create money so easily, how do we know it's going to be a value when they're creating a lot of it? That's one of the considerations that are being faced today. But the main thing to know about this stepping back for the big picture is that every individual every company and every government has a certain amount of money that comes in in the form of income a certain amount of expenses that and then a certain amount of savings. So you do individually and every all your listeners do and it works the same way for everyone. So that if their income falls and they don't let's to be less than their expenditures they're in trouble unless they have a good savings. And then they go to the savings. So all around the world there are lots of entities that are in trouble in that way. So the government the two parts of the government the US government two parts want to give checks to to people. Now it's a difficult that decide who gets it who doesn't get it. But if they don't give checks to people or to companies those will go bankrupt because they may not have enough savings. So you you saw um J. Crew went bankrupt just went bankrupt. And you'll see others go bankrupt because they don't have enough and so when they go bankrupt then that's a whole other process. So in order to prevent that they have to give money and so they print money. We call it print there's not even paper much. It's digitally create money and then that comes in the form of loans. Okay so basically they're digitally creating money which they're allocating to the government and then the government is deciding how to disperse those funds. Yeah the Federal Reserve will buy government bonds, so it's a transaction of buying it. Mhm. And that the And they will also buy private bonds. Okay. They might pick a company. Um at many companies, and they'll say, I will buy your bonds, which is the equivalent I will lend to you. And that's what happens. Okay. And that's happened through history. So, what we're going through is the same process as happened in the 19 30 to 1945 period. So, as I was saying, there are three important things. Uh that is one. The second is large wealth gap. Third is that um we have a rising power in the form of China uh emerging to compete or challenge the United States leadership. So, when you have these three things together um it's um it's a challenging mix, and that's happened repeatedly. Less effective monetary and credit system makes it they have to print a lot of money, can threaten the value of money. Second uh when you have a large wealth gap and you have an economic downturn people are more inclined to have conflict. So, how that's dealt with, we're going to reconsider how we're going to that wealth will be divided. And that'll change taxes and relationships. And then the third is we're no longer in a world order where the United States is the only dominant power. These three things existed and the most important things existed, and then we had the downturn terms in terms of the virus. So, you could think of the virus like being a tsunami that came and if it went and if we had not know more of it, it still would have left a lot of economic damage. So, you in all different ways. So, the the economic damage has to be understood and dealt with. Yeah, so the understood and dealt with is exactly why I wanted to talk to you. So, I think that people that are familiar with finance and financial institutions and how the economy works and all that, um they'll find their way through this. But, for the average person who um doesn't understand a lot of this, like when you look at this historical perspective, I find a certain level of comfort in that because of the notion of another one of these, right? So, we've seen this before, maybe we haven't in our lifetime, but historically um people have. So, what can the average person take away from that? They don't have bonds, they they don't think like that. They may not even understand what their 401k is, or they may not even have a 401k. So, how do they navigate this? Is it just head down, do your best to weather the storm, or is there actually something that they can learn from the historical perspective and move on now to make this easier for them? Yeah, it's the it's the same for every individual, same for every company, same and you if you understand this, then you understand there well, there are three things. Um the first is look at your income, your expenses, and your savings. And then do a stress test so that you get yourself secure. If you were to lose your income or if the income were to fall beyond the certain And you play that out. Maybe that's means you go get unemployment insurance or whatever. How long can you live in an acceptable lifestyle? And do you have a savings that is adequate for that? Okay, so what you do is you calculate if I lived in a simpler lifestyle and I had this amount of earnings um how many months how many months or years could I live acceptably? Then you look at your what what do you put the money in? What do you save in? Don't you worry though that there's a level of financial literacy? So you're you're saying the basics, right? And there's no question like it's your blocking and tackling right before you start trying to get fancy. But Ray, I have legitimately started losing sleep over like how we help the average person through this. Um I'm not a guy, I don't lose sleep over much, but when I stop and think about most people, I think the stat is the average American, if they're hit with a surprise $500 bill, um they're not able to make it. They are living month to month. You've got 30-plus million people now um out of work. It's you know, it trying to figure out like um definitely basics, right? Uh you've got make sure that you're spending less than you make. Austerity first, cut cut cut, get your expenses down to as low as I can, 100%. Um what what I'm hoping for is that there's um I don't know, there's something that we can see in in this kind of transition where either you've got a new rising power um and there's opportunity with that. I I'm trying to find that sort of ray of hope for people of what they can do to be proactive either to generate more income if they've lost their income or to be more proactive in their 401k. I think about personal finance the way I think about health and right now I worry that people are outsourcing everything to somebody else to the government. They're they have a wait-and-see approach and what I'm desperately trying to figure out for myself is what level of proactiveness of learning about their health they can do to try to weather this storm because short of just saving and cutting expenses and maybe that's it. Maybe there there isn't any more that they can do but I guess that's my direct question. Is there something more? I mean you know the parts, right? It's it's income, expenses, and savings. Okay. Now you can go get the money. Maybe the money money comes in and you say, "Okay, my unemployment benefits are going to be this or my this is but um those are the parts. Then the issue is how clever are you at dealing with those parts? me ask it another way then. Who who should they be voting for? Like when you talk about a beautiful deleveraging, which one you should probably um define that. So you you've looked at this stuff so many times it's really really quite breathtaking um that there are ways to do this well, there are ways to do this poorly. Uh you know, we're in an election year. I consider myself like the most apolitical human being on the planet but when I stop and think about, "Okay, well, if I'm an average person and let's say that I'm really doing my best. I'm doing the blocking and tackling. I'm saving what I can save. Um I've cut my expenses back. I'm I'm earning, you know, what I can. Let's hope that they either have kept their job or were able to quickly get another job. Um how should they be thinking? Like what are what is the right way to go through this deleveraging at a um a political level? Maybe politics isn't the right word, but like at a higher level. Well, I'm I'm you know, I I don't know what you want me to say. I think that each person should understand there's a certain level of basic understanding. First, take care of yourself and then you know, you hope that you have uh smart people who I think will most important thing is that they're smart in being able to engineer an economy that will increase the size of the pie as well as divide the pie well. And then also um that this is done in a non-antagonistic way. Um smart people working together in a bipartisan way have the capacity of managing this well. So, if I was giving political advice, and that's not what I do, but if I was giving political advice, the most important thing I think is um who can do this who's got the intelligence to do the engineering plus to do it um in a manner that we are not fighting with each other. That what history has shown us is that when things get difficult, people get stressed and they get they can get angry and they could all fight with each other and that produces the next leg of a terrible economy. Because the economy won't work efficiently if people are fighting with each other. The system doesn't work well. So, one would have to say um you know, who's going to bring the country together behind sensible, I would say bipartisan programs. Because if you don't have that, then you have a form of revolution and you don't have good management. And that's the greatest risk I would say politically. So, looking at the historical perspective, um who has done this well? And then, what have been mistakes that have led to literal revolution? When you say who has done it well, what do you mean? Um what countries or what periods of time has going through this kind of crisis been managed well so that we come out the other side with as little sort of um pain and suffering as possible? Well, an example of well would be the differences in um the way Roosevelt did it. Um so, again, 1929 to 32, interest rates hit zero, they print money. We had a large wealth gap. And then they sat down and they figured out, how do we keep it orderly? And how do we change the circumstances with um whether it's taxes or um how do you reorganize it so that the system works well? There is a risk also at the same time because the world is going through that, there's a risk of conflict. So, in Germany, Hitler came in power in 1933. And he came in power in 1933 because there was a lot of internal fighting as to to try to bring produce order because everybody, the left and the right, you know, the communists and the fascists, and they're all fighting about wealth cuz everybody's fighting about wealth when you have a downturn. And then they need the they were democracies, four democracies existed then that chose not to be democracies because they became so disorderly that they wanted some strong leader to take charge and run the country. And then, of course, we had a bunch of strong those types of leaders, and then they had a war. That's how World War II happened. So, when you look at that, uh you know, that's kind of the political landscape. But, back to the average man in terms of his finances, I would say the important thing is those three elements, to have a plan, and maybe to have a plan with uh both your family, you know, um how do you get down uh when things got tough and and you know, and then you have to look at um you know, what happens in policy. Well, policy um is a depends on the person. Some people would understand more about policy than other people. If if you know, so it depends on uh what they should do depends on what they're able to do well. As we um sort of take step back and start taking a longer view of this, what's the role that you see education playing in? I've sort of When I grew up, it was just assumed I was going to go to college. Um I did go to college, and I would have for a very long time told everybody they should be going to college. Now, I've sort of cooled off on that in terms of the debt that people are getting into. I know you and your wife are working a lot in the school system there in Connecticut. Um how do you how do you think about that? What's the importance of education in, you know, when when we start thinking about protecting um successive generations, how much of that comes down to education? I education is is the most important thing. Um I I was um raised with a very modest economic background. My dad was a jazz musician. My mom was a stay-at-home mom. Um and but I was lucky to have uh parents who cared for me, and I went to a public school, and I got a good education, and I came out to a world of equal opportunity. And I believe that those are fundamental necessities that um that you have to know how to have an education of you know facts like um you have to know how to read, write, and arithmetic, but you also um have to know how to behave well with others to be a good citizen and operate in a civil way to be able then to go into jobs. And that those that education um can be um anything that works. I think the big thing is, you know, three big things on on what I think work should be. Um um make your work and your passion the same thing and make it economic. If if if it works that you love your work, you'll probably be better at your work. Um and then you find the um so you you want those things and then the then there's the economics of it. And so it could be anything from learning um trades um whatever it may be. Education certainly does not have to be college. College is uh overemphasized. And um having a good productive career, when I watch the these remarkable people who are on the front lines of dealing with this virus situation, and I look at them. The great some of the greatest people are the people who have the capabilities of doing certain things that are not have nothing to do with going to college, and they're on the front lines and they're contributing a lot. And so we have uh so in education and civility, but that means that there has to be equal opportunity. So yes, what my wife and I have done, um, is, um, we're particularly, um, um, heartbroken or disenchanted with, um, poverty affecting, um, children in at high schools child students having the equal opportunity of education. So, our particular focus in Connecticut, we made a a donation, a large donation, $100 million donation to the state of Connecticut for them to match, um, and are working to get those, um, students, uh, through high school and but it could be trade school, um, and into jobs and to be able to be, uh, productive. So, you look at all societies and these are the things that matter most. The society, um, becomes a fairer society when there's equal opportunity for education and also it becomes a more productive society because the opportunities when extended throughout the whole population means that you get more people on the basis of merit. Right now, that system is not operating in a good effective way. For example, people in the top 40% of income will spend about five times as much money on their children's education than those in the bottom 60%. And that's not that's that's neither fair nor productive. So, I think that these types of questions are going to have to be examined by policy makers in a bipartisan way as we go through this, but yes, in answer to your question, you know, it really starts with good total education, the good raising of children in terms of their actual formal education and their informal education, and then going out and having an environment of equal opportunity. What is up, my friend? Tom Bilyeu here, and I have a big question to ask you. How would you rate your level of personal discipline on a scale of 1 to 10? If your answer is anything less than a 10, I've got something cool for you. And let me tell you right now, discipline, by its very nature, means compelling yourself to do difficult things that are stressful, boring, which is what kills most people, or possibly scary or even painful. Now, here is the thing. Achieving huge goals and stretching to reach your potential requires you to do those challenging, stressful things, and to stick with them even when it gets boring, and it will get boring. Building your levels of personal discipline is not easy, but let me tell you, it pays off. In fact, I will tell you, you're never going to achieve anything meaningful unless you develop discipline. All right, I've just released a class from Impact Theory University called How to Build Ironclad Discipline that teaches you the process of building yourself up in this area so that you can push yourself to do the hard things that greatness is going to require of you. All right, click the link on the screen, register for this class right now, and let's get to work. I will see you inside this workshop from Impact Theory University. Until then, my friends, be legendary. Peace out. So, one thing that I know you have leveraged to tremendous effect, and this is the very thing I took from Principles that changed my life is um to stress test your ideas, to put them out there, to ask how do I know I'm right. So, like I said, I've I've really been losing sleep over how I can be most helpful in um helping people navigate um all of what's happening, and and I have come to a conclusion that could be pure delusion, and I would love to know what you think. It's along the lines of education, which is why I was asking about that. So, my obsession is skill acquisition. I think that So, the advice that I've been giving to people, if you've lost your job or not, like we have spent probably the last 10 years, maybe more, in an employee ease market. They've really had this election. They've been able to put a lot of pressure on employers. And now you're seeing a flip and you're seeing this is going to be an employer's market. Um there's going to be a lot of people obviously there's north of 30 million now. It's going to be a lot of people looking for work. And my thing is if you want to get your ideal job, you want to make your passion something that you're able to pursue, you've got to be able to outperform other people. And I would say the same thing to a kid that's coming up, somebody that's about to graduate, whatever. Like you've got to be better than the next person. You've got to build a skill set that allows you to excel. And my thing is like you you are living proof of one simple thing. If you can outperform people, there really is no cap to how far you can go. You put your money where your mouth is when it comes to an investment strategy obviously with Bridgewater. Um you guys have just outperformed people. It's really been quite extraordinary. And yes people need to save. Yes they need to um focus on where uh you know they're getting their income from. Um they need to practice austerity measures, all of that. But ultimately people can propel themselves forward if they're out there learning, growing, getting better, pushing. I would go so far as to say even being aggressive to try to continue to move up. Um but it comes down to recognizing that skills have utility. They actually let you do something. They let you out invest somebody. They let you build a better house or a better bridge. Um and so what I want to see people do through this time I I just think most people will be obliterated mentally. They're going to get scared. They're going to panic. They're not going to be able to think clearly. And they won't put themselves on a path to excel. Um so wonder what what am I missing here because I know that people don't that is not a popular thing to say right now. Not something that I get a lot of negative feedback from people. It's like basically pull yourself up by your bootstraps. So I'd love to understand like where the flaw is in that thinking, um where when you talk about the um there not being equal opportunity, one, what can people do to right that ship at a personal level? I get I get at the higher-up systemic the way that we address it through policy and things like that. But, at a personal level, is there is there something people can do? Well, I think you're exactly right. I think that uh that uh though is short of specifics. And um you know, that particular action, and the question is um who can help them? So, yes, um if they're wily and hard-working and clever enough, they still need triangulation and help to find out where is the training program? What is that skill? They They can't do it alone. They have to do it with the help. I um I and I would recommend you know, I did two 30-minute videos. One is Principles for Success, a 30-minute YouTube video, and it's about an approach to life that a lot of people, something like 14, I don't know, a lot of people have seen this, and I would say um it's worth your 30 minutes, I think, in terms of approach to life. And then there's also, if you're interested in the economy, I did a a 30-minute video How the Economic Machine Works uh in 30 minutes, and that had a lot of views, 14 million, I think. And it was liked. So, um I can't tell them in this very brief interview how we're going to, exactly, who will get them that training and that capability. But, I think you're right, skill that you love, sell that sells, is what you need. Now, you go to each person has their own particular way of possibly getting that. To some case it might be a start low in an organization and work your way up. To some cases it may be a government training program. To some in some cases it may be a relative or a friend who can get you going and so on. Uh as I said one of my main principles is there's always a path out there. You just don't happen to see the path now. So, you have to find the path. If you find that path and you can't find it alone, the way you find that path is to speak to other people, get many ideas by other people. And then you know, you have to keep yourself trial and error. You got to keep at it like when you're getting a job or getting a skill. It's a lot of trying and so that requires certain amount of discipline. Well, and if you have a discipline problem, get help with the discipline problem. Have somebody kick you out of bed or whatever it is. That um you can get there. There is a path. You just don't see the right path at the moment. So many aspects of life are more actually uh opposite convention. Like comfort, it's comfortable. Well, look, life teaches you over and over again. You want to get stronger? Okay, it's not comfortable. You want to Okay, so stronger does not go with necessarily comfortable. Pain, okay? Pain plus reflection equals progress. Pain is a teacher. You want to eliminate pain from your life? You're going to have a better life? No, no, no, because it's giving you messages, okay? So so many different things are the opposite of what we're taught. And it goes down to even the education system, okay? You failed. Hey, that's the beginning of a discovery process. That's a good thing, okay? Okay, now how do I look at failure and learn from failure? No, you're stupid, you failed. How do people find out like their nature? And do you think of us all as having a sort of true nature? And then from that, how do people decide on the paths of accomplishment or savoring? And what to define those for people? Yeah, there's a there's a couple of concepts in there, so I'll and they're related and I'll but I'll parse them. Um First of all, on the nature, it's really a self-discovery process. Discovering what you want, um discovering what you're like. Like you were describing your various cases where you're discovering what you like and then you go through that discovery. And and the best way to do that is to want to do that, right? It takes an hour. And it's a self-discovery thing. I Did you guys You created it yourself? Yeah. And and we've used others, we've used Myers-Briggs, Team Dimensions, Workplace Inventory and so other and then we move beyond that. The main thing like is if you want self-discovery, you then you then you'll find your ways of getting the self-discovery. They'll appear all around you. And yes, you have your nature, the thing that pulled. Don't be, you know, a round peg in a square hole. Find your nature, what's going to flourish and make your, you know, that's why I said when you were talking about your development, mine too, make your passion and your work the same thing. Know what your nature is. Yes, so I believe in terms of um that particular nature. Then we get to the particular of um one of the big choices in life is savor life or um accomplish. Like we have a lot of choices in our lives. And they're almost sort of mutually exclusive sometimes. Uh you know, I just I want to go to the ball game and I want to watch movie and I want to do that and I just want to sit back and on a nice day and smell the roses. Okay, simultaneously I want to change the world. Okay? I want to change the world and I've got this or um the work-life balance question and all of those. We face those types of choices, right? So, um it's really important to go above oneself and to reflect on that. And also, by the way, to realize that um the choices are not you're approaching the choice wrong when you often see it as kind of that trade-off because the truth is you can have a lot more life and you can have a lot more if you just know how to get more out of a minute. How much do I get per per minute or how much do I get per hour? Do you have secrets on that cuz I would like to Well, there there were there are a number of them in in here but and we can talk about them. But the capacity to rather than we do all have to face our choices. But to also realize that you can expand how much life you're going to get out of life and how that range if you really do it well. So, there are those choices. Which are those choices and we face them and then you have to decide how to do them well. Give me a couple things that I can do to get more out of a minute. First of all, if you do make your passion and your work the same thing, um then you're it's great, right? Because your passion, whatever it might be, you're a painter or you're an entrepreneur and whatever that is, and you find that more enjoyable than going to a ball game, let's say, then that's becomes a passionate thing. That's one thing. Second, to know how to work with people who can do things really well to get the most leverage out of people, okay? Third, how do you get yourself really what are the right work habits? Um you know, anyway, there's a whole bunch of those kinds of things where you how do I just just you what you say, how do I get it done without me doing it? Who's the best to do it and how do I get All you All of a sudden you open yourself to up to all different possibilities of how you can do that, right? No time. I think Tim Ferriss wrote what the 4-minute 4-hour 4-hour work week, yeah. work week or something. Like, okay, 4-hour work week, okay. Or okay, there are approaches all those ways of being able to do that. So, I just gave you, you know, a few. What are the elements of struggling well? What does it mean to struggle well and how do we do it? Well, first that that's why that phrase I use the phrase struggle well or tough love. Okay, I put those words together because that exemp- exemplifies the fact that people don't think they go together. And so, if you start to realize struggling well is what you're uh will get you what you want, okay? Rather than avoiding struggle, um that's what I'm trying to convey. And so, um if you realize that, then you will go to the struggle. You won't be averse to the struggle. And you will think and and then under that in the book, I wrote all these different ways of what it means to struggle well, okay? How you uh have thoughtful disagreement, how you listen to maybe or you're not good at that or not, how you learn, how you navigate all the ways through that so that you get stronger. Because if you don't struggle, you won't get stronger. Okay? So, struggling well, go above it, you know? Okay, struggling well, a big element is to go above your struggle just like you did. I you know, look back and say, "Okay, um, am I struggling well?" rather than be in it and doing those things. So, there are a lot of different ways of how to struggle well, but if you know, okay, that struggling is a good thing. Okay, if you want to be strong, it's a good thing. I'll give you another good example. I have a uh uh a saying. If you worry, you don't have to worry. And if you don't worry, you have to worry. Okay? Because what I mean is um, if you're worrying about what can go wrong, you chances are you will create the protections against that thing going wrong and therefore, that's good. And if you're not worrying about the things that are going to go wrong, then they'll probably the things you never expect are going to come and hit you. Okay? And so, it sounds counterintuitive. If if you worry, you don't have to worry. If you don't worry, you better worry. But what it means is that process of, "Okay, go to the thing. Go to it." And enjoy it. View these things as puzzles. Your personality will change. You'll enjoy it. Okay? Because life is a puzzle. It's it's a going through the jungle. Okay? It's a It's like that. I'll I'll I'll tell you a story. Yeah. So, I um I crash. And I figure, oh, risk and reward go together. You want to have a great life, okay, and you want to be safe at the same time, they sound almost like mutually exclusive. Okay? So, I So, I viewed it as, okay, I'm like sitting on one side of a jungle and that if I can get to the other side of a jungle safely, I'll have a great life. But uh Okay, but if I cross the jungle, oh, all sorts of things going to happen. Now, what am I going to choose? Am I going to be on this side of the jungle and uh have just an ordinary life? Or am I going to have the what I think is the best life possible, but oh, I can get bitten and all those things. And that's just the nature of life. And then I And I said, I have to. It's my nature. I have to have the best life I can have. So, I've got to go into the jungle. Now, the question is, how do I go into that jungle and be successful at that? And I could tell you the answer. The answer is, first, by worrying about what I don't see that I might be wrong with, and to do it with people who see the things that I might not see, and we are all doing it as a mission to get through that jungle well together. And when I went through that jungle and we do with that together, the thing I found out, which is so wonderful, is I don't want to leave the jungle. I don't want to get to the other side because I want to be with those people on that mission and that whole experience has become great. So, I found my way to be successful in the jungle, to get to the other side, and I found out what really is a great reward. And that's extraordinary and and I that resonates with me so hard about really enjoying the struggle. And A, that's what's making you stronger. B, there's just something innate certainly with a certain personality type that that is what you're going to love is that fight and reaching your limits and pushing beyond them. Now, I'm curious. Is there going to be a struggle for you in the third phase? Is there a new jungle that you're going into? So, you to quickly define that for people, you said uh in phase one, you're dependent on others, you're essentially a child and you're learning. Phase two, you go to work, other people become dependent on you. And then at the end of phase two, you pass it off to other people. You want them to thrive without you. You give them the knowledge and the wherewithal. And then in phase three, you do what? Uh Um you savor your life. Um What's that going to look like for you? It's the freedom to do whatever you want to do without obligations. It is the realization that you shouldn't and it's not good to control anybody. It's just savoring life. That you have your you can do anything you want. You go from free you go to freedom. Um if there's a life arc Yes. There's a life arc and in um I put together this book is a 600-page book. I also then uh was asked by a lot of people to make a um simpler version um about uh principles for success and a little book. And it'll be out uh we're putting it out on the newsstands. You actually can be pre-ordered on Amazon. Um and in that book, I show a life arc. And I track through what are the various phases of life. And what what is the happiest phase? What is the least happy phase? And how does it work? And I could take you through all that if you're interested. interested. Oh okay. Well, I don't It depends on what time we got, but um okay. That um It may be the slightly nutshell version. Okay, this the nutshell version is you start off and it it is very very um it's a it's a really enjoyable phase in life. You start to have um start to experience responsibilities like junior year, okay, do I get into the school I want to get into or whatever. That's quite common. College is great. It's exploratory. Come out of college, there's the most amount of freedom you have. So, that transition end school coming to now the new phase of life is totally different than the first phase of life because what it means is you don't follow any track. All all through there you were following track in the definite and the direction of others. And now you could live anywhere you want. You can pick any job you want. You can do anything you want. You have total freedom. There's no guide. You can do anything you want. You have that freedom. And you move forward with that and then you start to make decisions and you start to um take on obligations. You might get married. You might have kids. You have jobs and you take on that. And the least happy period in life by sur- surveys of happiness is um 45 to 55. Okay, that uh uh because that then you have huh the work-life balance and the obligations and too many things to do and uh and then maybe it's not as idealist idyllic as you want. You know, uh you get into the marriage and whatever it is and then maybe it's not the marriage that you expected or the things that you're having and all of those things. That's a difficult phase of life, that middle part of that phase in life. 45 to 55 and so on. Um and then people transition. It's interesting and opposite than what I would have expected that the happiest phase in life is um between uh 60 and 80. And and and the you know the funny thing about it, which is really funny, um they ask people um how good do you how good do you look? Um and they rate it the highest at that age. Now, that's not true, right? But what happens is people at that point feel more comfortable with themselves in various ways. When you make that transition, you're eliminating all of those obligations. You're eliminating all of those things. You're giving yourself free. I don't have to take care of it. I savor uh my family's well without me or whatever as I've got the free time. I could do whatever I want to do. That doesn't mean life isn't exciting. I find life very exciting. I'm very vital. I like those types of things. But totally free of choice. And you also savor the life arc, you know? Even as people approach their death, they approach the death in a whole different way than what death seems to be for people in their early years, right? Oh, you're terrible terrible thing. No, it's just part of that particular process. And how do you do that life arc? And the curtain goes down, you know? And that is a different phase in life. So, you know, my responsibility now is to pass along what I'm doing. Like right, I got plenty of money, so I'm not working for money. I'm giving away plenty of money because of cuz it helps and whatever. And I'm just passing along. I'll have that life arc and and then I'm going to go quiet. And I'm going and I savor life. And you go, I could just I love nature. So, I go out side in nature. Okay, that has a big effect on me. I love it. So, that's what the third phase of my life looks like. Yeah, man, that the whole notion that you're living an arc, that there are phases, I think is really important. And I I don't think enough people recognize that your frame of reference will change as you move from phase to phase and what was important to you in one phase will not be important to you in the next. And uh because I was thinking as you were talking, I was like, I personally don't believe that you can skip a phase. I don't think that certainly not with my personality and probably not with yours. It's not like you can skip the the accomplishment phase and go straight to the savor phase. And I thought about that, you know, my wife and I have made enough money we could buy an island and retire and and just be done with it. And when I really thought about how that would make me feel, didn't seem like it would make me feel the way that I want to feel cuz I still want to be in the jungle. But as I hear you describe the savoring, it's like, yeah, I get how my life could get to a point where that's what I would crave. Yeah, you see what I'm hearing you do well is you're looking down on yourself again. You're you're describing, I'm looking at how I feel, I'm looking at So you're connecting the the feelings with the thinking and I So that's that's true. And in terms of No, of course there's a sequence to that life. What I did in the book, which would be fun for people to do, is I show all the different markers in and and all the different phases and little boxes next to them. And so what they can do is they can check where they are. They know exactly where they are. And then also by showing that, I'm showing them what they can expect. Because if they're if you're here on that arc, you can expect these things probably. As you're going check check check, you those are the things. Now you can start to imagine, where do I want to be in 10 years? And also, where are the people I love, who I care about, or what are their relationships? Where will they be? Where will my children be in 10 years? And what will they go through? Or what will my parents? Where will they be in 10 years? And how will that relate to how I want to have my life go? Because it and it's the same thing. You'll see the same things happen over and over again. All these lives are basically kind of the same thing. So and when you put that in perspective and you step back and you look at it, it's really great. of it's another one of those. Like the and I say that in a way designed to remove fear and uncertainty, which is something that paralyzes so many people. And I think one of the things you've really given, certainly me and anybody who's really deeply come in contact with your work, is that sense of there is that higher perspective that shows that you're not the first person to have a child, you're not the first person to embarrass yourself publicly, you're not the first person to go through whatever heartbreak or heartache that you're going through. And when you can contextualize it, then you get to another thing that you've said, which of course um Buddhists have been saying for a long time, this too shall pass. Like whatever hardship you're in the middle of or whatever joy you're in the middle of, it's it's all part of a cycle. And so all of it will ease in the end. And so, yeah. your preferences will change. Realizing how it works is so great because like the thing you love at 10 is different than the thing you love at 20 or 30. We all can think, what is the thing you love at 20 or 30? Right. Woo! That was fun. And then you go to 40 and you go to 50 and they change. And to realize how they will change and and you move beyond, it's it's beautiful and it's helpful. The most important thing I think is to know your nature. What is your nature? What is what what are your strengths and weaknesses and your likes and your dislikes? And once you know that, then you also think, what are the fits? Oh, I would like that job and the job could pay me well. And then you figure out, okay, how do you do it? How do I get to it? But there are different people in different circumstances, so I can't answer them all now. Yeah. Um I agree with you. So, I want to go back. One, thank you for the feedback that I'm I was being super vague. Uh I think that's really helpful. So, let's start getting really specific. As much as we can knowing that people are going to be sort of at very different places as they're hearing this. Um but I think this will be helpful. So, one, the video that you're talking about and I'll speak for you and correct me where I go astray, but I watched the video multiple times. Think it's really extraordinary. And basically, to put it in a really small nutshell, it's basically go out, try things, fail a lot, learn, and keep progressing. And that that's basically, if I remember right, you have like this sort of circular ascent. Um and it's from the failing and the learning that you ultimately make the progress. But if you put your head down, you don't want to see your mistakes, you don't want to see the flaws in your thinking, you're going to trap yourself at a plateau, and you're never going to be able to push beyond that. So, you've got to seek out disconfirming evidence. You have to seek out where you're weak. And in fact, one thing I will I sort of disagree. I get what people mean. So, when you say know your nature, I will say by nature, But before you get to that second part, let me just on the thing. Yes, it's the looping and learning from mistakes. But it it it another part of it is the realization that you don't have to make your decisions in your own head. Okay? That when you start to realize that you know what you're good at and what you're bad at, that a power comes to you when you start to know, uh okay, who's the best person to give me the advice? Or who's the best person to lead me through this? Or when you start to know that you can go beyond what you think and your opinionatedness, so that you can triangulate. I call it triangulate with others, so that you find three people who are really capable of giving you good advice, who will argue with each other and argue with you, so you can see all sides of it, and you work yourself through. So, it's not just your eyes looking for the path, but it's other people's eyes looking with the path with you, knowing that you're going to have uh successes and failures, but that power of that collective learning and triangulate well with humbleness is a great power as you go through that cycle. I love that. So, um I'll push that a step further and and I will say this. So, I'm going to be super blunt to anybody watching right now, and Ray, if you think that I'm wrong, I trust that you will jump in. No one is coming to save anybody, and that's the hard truth. And if I look at history, and even if I listen, which I have listened to literally every word that you've said on the subject publicly, anyway, that th- this is just going to suck. Like, there is going to be a a level of brutality that most of us have not experienced in our lives. Companies are going to go under. People are going to lose their jobs. There are going to be people that are going to struggle to find their next meal. And what what I want people to understand is, just like you just said, you can triangulate, you can get people to help you think through, but I want them to understand that they can do that in a book, at a library, they can do that online if they still have access to the internet, which as of right now, even just going to the library, you can get access to being online. You changed my life before you and I ever met. I read your book. I'd never I didn't even know who you were at that point, and somebody just said, "Hey, you've got to read this book. It's got really powerful ideas on trust and creating these hard principles out of all your mistakes." I read it, immediately recognized that this aligned with what I call the physics of being human. It was so in line with removing my blind spots, getting people, acknowledging that other people are better than me at certain things. And so, while I take a little bit of an exception cuz I I think that you can't say what you're good and bad at until you've been at this for a long time. You've been trying, you've been pushing, you're learning, you're failing. Cuz by nature, I'm lazy. I I am not very bright. I think there are people that can process raw data far faster than I can. But, I'm willing to admit when I'm wrong. I'm willing to admit that I don't know. I'm willing to admit when I make a mistake. And because of that, because I go in that cycle that you talk about of making a mistake, looking nakedly at it, not pretending I didn't screw up, asking people to point out my flaws, and then going, "And now I'm going to have to do what is called deliberate practice to get better at that thing." And I don't just ask, and I don't think people can afford right now to just say, "Oh, what do I want to do?" Work For a lot of people, this is going to be Maslow's hierarchy of needs. You need safety, you need security, you need food, shelter. And I think it's going to come to that. And so, recognizing there are people out there right now that know more than you. You are going to make a mistake, but those mistakes are huge learning opportunities. You have to admit that you made one. You have to seek people that can help you remove those blind spots, and then you have to put in the work to get better. Does any of that sound crazy? No, that that's totally totally right. And then, um it comes from once you have a fear that you might be wrong, but you have still the audaciousness and courage to go forward, you're a lot smarter than the person who thinks they know. There's a There's a quote that's Jefferson said. He who knows he knows not is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods. And And so, when you know that, and And with the and then with your character and your determination, you go forward. The smartest people I know are the most humble. It What the more you learn, the more you realize, oh, I'm eager to take in. So, that's right. Um but back on your audience, I think your audience ranges from um you know, there's a wide range that you have in your audience. And I would say that there are many people in your audience who can plan for a simple lifestyle that can be wonderful. Sometimes we acquire these needs that aren't at anywhere near as big as as we make them out to be. Um you know, um do you have a bed to sleep in? Do you have food to eat? Do you have basic health care? Okay, if you start to think, okay, what are my needs that I really need and I'm okay, and how can I make provisions for those needs? Then once you've got that in your mind, you're you're free. Okay? You you can go beyond that. Uh that You may say, "Listen, oh, I can do that for a year or 2 years or a month or whatever." But you I think we visualize too much the things that we're used to. One of the good things about this exercise is that you can bring it brings you back to basics. You can be brought to basics. And like I'm saying, if you have a bed to sleep in, and you've got food, and so on, and you have those basics and and good relationships with people who care about you and basic health care. So, if you budget for that, and you figure how do you have it? Maybe it isn't in the luxurious place you're in. Maybe it's in the country and so on. Once you visualize that and you get that down in your head and you say, "Oh, I can get that." Then your stress will disappear because you as you visualize that, in many ways that's a happy life. It doesn't take a lot to There's stimulation, there's nature, there's relationships. These fundamental wonderful things, the most important things can be obtained. And so for many of you, I think if you look at that and you budget for that, I'm seeing a number of people um who are um going broke. Uh and and I've watched this over many years. And really it's just the adjustment process. When that Once they get to that point where ah, you know, they have they get settled, they're fine. It's the ambiguity, it's the worry, it's the stress. So if you do that from the beginning and you have that that played out in your head, then you know everything from there you can play with and it's your it's icing on the cake. So I want to emphasize you can budget for that, you can look at that, find that scenario. Find what that looks like so that you know you've got it down. Then you know you're safe. Once you've got safe, everything beyond that is luxury. I forget who the Greek philosopher was, maybe you remember, that used to go and he would sleep on the street like once a month or something like that in shabby clothing because he wanted to remind himself, "Oh, this is what I'm afraid of and this thing isn't that bad." I mean, I always found that interesting. I take a slightly different approach. I think that is really powerful and I think that's an important anchor for people. So my wife and I always say to each other cuz look, we have been dirt poor um and we have now been very wealthy. And all along the journey we've always said to each other, "Look, man, if I have you, like everything else I'm good." So, literally, there are only two things I'm legitimately afraid of. There are things I don't want, but there are two things I'm legitimately afraid of. Brain damage because then I cannot build my way back. I can't have the level of fulfillment that I want. And losing my wife because a life shared to me is like the the highest importance. Now, having said that, I'm going to set all that aside. And I I hope people heard you and I hope that they take it to heart to paint a lifestyle that they can love and it's beautiful, but it's simple um and you know, they don't have all this overhead hanging over them. But, I know thyself, as you were saying. Know what you're good at what you're not. I've always told people, "If you want a calm, peaceful life, I'm not your guy. There There is somebody else for you to go listen to um and and follow that journey." If If you want to be aggressive and you want to build something that matters to you. I don't need it to be big. I don't need it to be a business, whatever. I just People that want to express themselves, that want to get great. They want to become extraordinary at something. That's what I'm far more interested in. And so, the way that I look at it is right now, it's a time where economically the chessboard has has been flipped over. But, in in that moment, there's going to be opportunity created. And for people that And this my central thesis is what I said earlier. Panic is the problem. People cannot allow themselves to panic, which is why I like what you're saying. Don't Don't worry if you're if you lose everything, right? As long as you have the things that really matter to you. And I think that's important so people don't panic so they can be clear-headed, so they can figure out where the opportunities are and then they get the skill set that they need to capitalize on that opportunity. Which for me is like when I And that's why I keep saying I'm losing sleep over like how do we get information out so that I've worked in the inner cities a lot. And to get the information to somebody out there that they can triangulate, right? That that's not a rich, upper class exercise. That's a the the information is out there. It's been put in books, on a website, in a podcast. Like the the number of the world's greatest thinkers right now that you could be taking this information from, but you have to be willing to test it. You have to be willing to incorporate it and actually act on it and do something. So, I'm not clear what's your question about that? It Not so much a question is I I'm I'm presenting what I think are ideas that I want people to run with. Partly, I'm hoping if there is a flaw in my thinking, I want you to point it out. So, going back to the need for specificity. So, um we're talking about there isn't equal opportunity because there's not equal um access to education, which I will take as the core of your thesis for generationally moving forward in a useful way. True? It's It's a core piece, yeah. Okay. So, what I'm saying is I really hope that that gets addressed and I will certainly do whatever I can. You're obviously uh doing a massive amount there. But, I also want people to not wait for someone to make that change. I want them to realize right now today they can go and learn something. They can educate themselves. You said that it's not about college, it's about getting a skill that lets you live a fulfilling fulfilling, meaningful life um with a meaningful career. And so, I want to see people take action. But, if there is a flaw in that thinking, I want to know. No, no. Um I don't think Of course, I think it's totally right. I think uh then the issue is going to the next step for the particulars of actually um helping somebody and um and there's a combination of not only what they can do themselves, uh but finding others who will help to take them by the hand and help to provide that guidance uh to be able to do that. All right, so And finding a job, let's say, you know, you think, "Okay, how do you find a job?" So, it you have to be specific. Uh so, we could say, "Great, find a skill." Okay, great. But, literally, how do you go about finding that skill? Let's talk about that. So, one thing you've talked about from an investing standpoint is when this begins to happen and monetary policy begins to break down, won't spend a lot of time describing a fiat currency, but essentially money that isn't associated to anything like gold. So, you've broken that. So, you said that it gets reassociated because gold has intrinsic value or rocks because it's used to build things. So, what is looking at the historical perspective, what are things that are safe bets in terms of this job is going to be here in 5 years, that this is a good place to begin building that skill set? You're talking about the skill set, not the investment, I guess. Yeah, skill set. I think that that's maybe more useful for people if they've just lost their job and you know, they're sort of just trying to make ends meet at this point. Well, in terms of um I think in terms of any environment the lessons that we get over and over again is that you can't be sure what the next environment and twists and turns are. What you don't know is greater than anything you do know. So, if if you were in the airline business or you were in the hospitality business um and that was wonderful and you liked it and everything else, all of a sudden that changed in important ways. So, the important thing it more are the more general abilities. In terms of investing what that means is you need to know how to diversify well. That's the most important thing. In terms of any aspect in life, to know how to deal with what you don't know is more important than anything you know, because the world is so much more surprising than you can really be sure of. So, in a general say sense for skills, I mean, I think uh and skills are part of you what what are your environment. You know, find out those things that um are that are self-sufficient and maintain uh flexibility. You have to know how to maintain flexibility and change well. If your career is in one area, um you have to know how this you have to develop the skill for changing a career. And that all comes down to knowing how to find the path, to know how to triangulate well with others. I want to talk about that. You've done such an extraordinary job, Ray. I I truly stand in awe of being able to go and learn uh new area, a new um elements of the world. When you announced that you were going to be taking this historical view and that you were going to go backwards, I mean, something like a thousand years or however far you went back. Um how do you begin that research process? So, for somebody that's like, "I want to invest my time wisely." What is sort of a high-level way that you approach learning in general? Well, for for me, um it's a lot um the alignment of the three things that I said before. What is my passion? Um then, you know, knowing my nature, what is my passion? Um and can I align my work to my passion? And then, um does it pay adequately for me to take care of my needs? And for me, um I'm I do that because it's my passion. Um, you know, and so when you find your passion that's aligned with your work. If you can do that. But how do you go about learning something new? So when you started researching the historical context of what we're going through now, is it picking up books? Is it, um, Well, for me, you see, I have been my nature is I'm extremely curious. Okay, and I love my game. My game is to learn about the world, interact with the world, and bet on it. And I'm very curious. So it So it might be whatever your game is. Like you've got a game. Okay, that's why we're you're interviewing me. Cuz that's your passion. That's your game. And if you can line those three things up but and you know your nature because there If you know your nature, you can find your role. You want to find the right role for you. Right? It's not just go get a job and, you know, I might say I would like to be, um, an architect. Well, I mean, you have to know your nature. And then you can find your role. And so I'm I'm hesitant to say that what is true for me is true for somebody else. So when you ask me what, you know, like, okay, those are my big things. Uh, meaningful work and meaningful relationships. Like relationships matter a huge amount to me. So if I can have a work that feeds my curiosity that, um, I'm passionate about and that, uh, pays me adequately and you know, and I do that, uh, with great people those are the things that feed me. And so you have to know those things that feed you. Like I like the big picture. Somebody might like uh details. You know, that you know, you have to pick those things that are for your nature and and align those things I'm talking about. And how did you specifically go about starting this big research project? Did it start with a book? Did it start with reaching out to historians? No, no. It's I mean in a sense the journey started out when I was 12 years old and I caddied and I um and and then I I took my caddying money and I had newspaper route and I did a number of things like that. I took my odds and ends and I put it in the stock market. And you know, and and then I and I got hooked on the game. Do you ever think about the nature of questions in that process? Like that So I think it was Tony Robbins who said, "If you ask a better question, then you're going to get a better answer." And basically questions are going to control the outcome. Um do you focus on what question you're asking and trying to answer or is it something completely different than that? Questions, questions. That's right. It's the hunger to know. You'll you'll notice it different in people. There will be people who Wow, you listen. Good question, good question, good question. Then there will be people who can't ask questions. That they're just telling you what they think. They almost you think they're acting smart, they think they're acting smart, and they're the stupid ones. The smart ones are Oh, question. Now, how do I go I have to find the answer to the question. Next question. Because the questions and the power and the pull to answer those questions and so on is the thing that drags you forward and that's excitement. Do you have a pull? Okay, what's your pull? You know, so um yeah, it's all in questions, I think. It's all in a journey. Life is in a journey, an adventure. That's what I'm trying to say in in principles and uh for success. Or you can get, by the way, principles um a- any of these principles are also Principles in Action is an app that's available on the iStore iStore and it's free. And it has all of these things in it, but it so I don't I you know, cuz we'll we'll separate. Um I think people might like that. But you know have to know your pull and then along the way you're going to have your adventure and you're going to learn and then you go through your phases of life. And each phase is different. Like you talked about your phase. You're in the middle of your phase in life. You talked about your wife and your relationship with her. Okay? That is a phase of life and when you go and by putting it in perspective, it's helpful. Um in the back of that book uh Principles for Success, there's a life arc chart. And if you know where you are on that life arc and you know what the next 10 years is typically like and you know what you the people you care about are on their life arcs you could almost know what's coming at you and then you could start to think about it. So it's at that level of knowing yourself and knowing how these things happen over and over again that you can achieve your path. Don't be surprised. Most life is the is the same things that happen over and over again. You're born, you probably have parents to take take care of you. Maybe you have one, maybe you have two, but somebody does. They teach you. You have your first phase of your life where you're dependent on them and you're learning. Then you come out to your second phase of your life and then you're working and others are dependent on you and then you have that. So, these things happen over and over again and and you just have to know that path and know how to approach it. So, really fast before I let you go, you're working on a new book, The New World Order, which I find very fascinating and you've been publishing some of the chapters on LinkedIn. What do you think the odds are, just to to really go back to the finance side of this? What do you think the odds are that America remains the reserve bank and the reserve currency? And if it's not us, who do you think it will be? Well, all currencies eventually die and all empires eventually diminish and there are other empires and the question is essentially the pace of what hour that happens. I think that but for most of your listeners, it's most likely going to happen in a way that's tolerable if you can manage it well. Think about the decline of the British Empire and you see that people are living in London and so on. It's not that the world blows up, it's that they have to readapt and they know how to readapt. And so I think that we're going to come through more difficult times. I think the next three to five years will be difficult times in ways that haven't existed in their lifetime but has existed in other periods of time, like the 1930 to 45 period. So, to be able to adapt well, to invent yourself again, to adapt and to navigate that, maybe with a perspective of knowing what those other times were like, is the best thing to do. So, the reason I'm doing that series on LinkedIn is to help people understand what those times are like, and then uh help them be prepared. The reason I wrote the book Principles is so that it's it's a particular approach cuz the same things happen over and over again for basically the same reasons. And once you get that and you have the self-discipline to know how to play the game well, then you'll be fine. So, um one, where can people connect with you right now? And then I have one last question that I want to ask. Well, I'm um as I say, I'm on social media and um we um and I'll interact with people on social media. I'm the the standard, you know, LinkedIn, Twitter, Face- Facebook, and Instagram by and large. Um but the more the most valuable stuff is if you go to uh principles.com, you can get the whole pile or or I would say that So, of those places, you know. So, as this next 3 to 5-year um part of the cycle hits us, what is one thing that people can do um that you know from the historical perspective will most um insulate them from the the probably emotional um and maybe financial damage, whatever you think is more important. Well, the the things that I thought about some of the things I mentioned earlier, the plan for uh the worst-case scenario and make it terrific is one of the things. Um the understanding how to triangulate well to deal with whatever problems that you're going to face and how to work that through to find the path and find your nature. But also, uh one thing that's helped me a lot is meditation. That um um meditation gives you a calmness, an equanimity, so that you can almost look at your circumstances and you can navigate it with a clarity of thought without all of that stress. It's healthy cuz it reduces stress and it also makes you smarter to make the decisions well. So, I would say that that would also be something that I would recommend. Because if if if you have the equanimity, that centeredness, that calm centeredness, and you have your plan, and you triangulate well with others, so that you can get all the best advice and don't have to approach it in your own head, you know, you're a long way there. In your mind, that we think what do you want? And the reality is when you look at the neuroscience and psychology, that there are different parts of your brain that want different things. And so, in the simplest sense, there is the logical part of the your brain that you're conscious of. It's called the conscious. And you think you're being logical and you want to make those decisions. And then there's the subliminal, below the limbic system, part of the brain, which is the emotional, and it's not as conscious to you. But it has more of an influence on you than really the logical one. And so, they're not aligned. And so, when you're experiencing that pain or let's say the ego, right? There were two main things. You got an ego barrier and a blind spot barrier. If you can get past your ego barrier and you get past your blind spot barrier, you can accomplish anything because you'll also know that you don't have to do everything to you don't have to figure it out yourself. You can take in from other people the different ways to approach things in the best possible way. And so, the realization that we all are really struggling with ourselves and to think which are which is in control. Meditation helps to deal with the alignment of those two things because both are valuable. In other words, intuition, imagination, the things we really love come from our subliminal us's, right? Our needs, whatever they may be, they come from here. That's subliminal. They may be valuable, they may be scared damaging. You don't know the difference. And so when they come up and you're looking at those with your logical mind and you can align those things, you're probably in good shape. If you can do that, that alignment between the subliminal and the logical, and you can do that with other people so that you can triangulate with other people and say, "Does that make sense?" Or and get alignment, that alignment is the path to the future because you only have to know what the best things to do are. You don't have to have them all come up from your head. And for God's sakes, don't be overly opinionated because just because you have that opinion, it doesn't mean it's true. So, that's where the two U's in the alignment really is so important. All right, I want to talk about the process of getting those two things aligned. Tying this into meditation, so in my own experience, meditation is a a stillness, it's a quiet from the chatter of the mind and more maybe profoundly than that, I can feel my brain shifts into a different gear. So, maybe it's less linear thinking, it's more lateral, I'm making connections that I might not otherwise make. So, is it in in that still in that quiet where you're able to look at your what's bubbling up from beneath the limbic system, your your emotional life, you're able to look at that without judgment? And then able to say, "Okay, but this is what I'm trying to do sort of consciously, these are my plans, and all of that. And now, how do I Are you altering either of them, or are you beginning to say, "I need to understand if this is a useful emotional driver, or a destructive emotional driver?" Like, what is that process? Yeah, I think you described it very well. Um and when you go deeper, by the way, you go literally into your subconscious. So, you're creating a connection. When you transcend I do transcendental meditation, when you transcend, I I'm not conscious, and I'm not unconscious. I am in the subconscious. I I'm not aware, uh but if somebody would make a little noise like that, boom, I would I would So, it's not like being asleep. And that's also, by the way, where creativity comes from. If you know, it's like you go take a hot shower, and a great idea comes, not cuz you're muscling it. So, when you're having that, then, um you're calm, and your natural state, and then these things bubble up, and it helps that alignment. So, you say, uh "Okay, let me look go above myself. Let me Let me go above myself, and look at myself within the context of my circumstances. What is around me? How does that work? How does reality work? Okay, if I do this, what are the consequences?" And so, the the going above it, and just saying, "I'm responsible for my decisions, my life, and how do I navigate the things the things there that I can pull the levers of to Who do I get? How do I do? How do I deal with those?" And going above it in that calm way, is really what it's about. And when you do it well with others, so you triangulate. That's why I have the radical truthfulness, and the radical transparency. When you have that radical truthfulness, and the radical transparency, You're triangulating with others. You're going above it with them and you're just looking at that circumstance and you say, "Okay, well, we're in the same goal, or are we?" And then how do I navigate those so that we get to where we want to go? Cuz if you're forming your company, you've got your company, we're on the same mission together, right? So now let's all go above ourselves. What are your strengths and weaknesses? How do we get it? What's true? And how do we do that with transparency? And that's it. Yeah, oh man, so so powerful and putting into action, I'm really seeing exactly how it begins to um allow and I think truth is probably the what you call hyperrealism, the getting to such an objective look at what is true. Um and going back to sort of an objective look at that emotional state, which I think is where a lot of people struggle. One of the biggest and most profound, probably the only lightning rod moment in my life, where it's like, "Whoa, my life can be divided into before that literal like instantaneous recognition and after everything is completely different." And that was the first time where I realized that I was being driven by something that I had not yet recognized, which was I was telling everybody that I wanted to generate wealth in my life, but I was acting like I just wanted people to tell me that I was smart. And so the the like friction between those like hit this collision. And so at the time I was just copywriter. And the guys who would later become my partners at the time were my employers. And we got in this huge fight over something stupid. And I was arguing and arguing and arguing for my idea. I I needed my idea to win because I had they were just so much farther ahead than me. They were smarter than me in that they can process data faster and and that that's just true. Like they could think through things more rapidly than I could. So I was like, "I have an inferiority complex over how fast they think and they're like 15 years ahead of me as entrepreneurs. So, I just always feel like a buffoon. And so, I'm starting to really feel badly about myself. And so, I'm arguing for this dumb idea, arguing, arguing, arguing, and then finally I wear them down and they agree. And I was like, "Shit, I know it's the wrong idea." Like, there's a voice in my head screaming, "You know this is a stupid idea. Stop arguing for it." But, I needed to win. And so, when they left, I thought, "Okay, whoa. What what's real? I I just need to know what's real. No judgment on me. If what you want is to get rich, you have to change the way that you're acting immediately. But, if what you really want is to just feel smart, you need to leave this company. Because butting heads with them every day and feeling inferior is is never going to get you there. And so, in that I realized, "Wait, there's actually a third option where I could value myself entirely for learning. And if I switched my identity over from being smart, being right, being good, being worthy to just I learn. That's what I do." Then everything will change. And it did literally like that. Like, I remember that day so clearly. So, to me what you're describing is just another one of those. Right? You have Go go deeper on that concept, the notion that everything loops, that history repeats. Because I think people get it from like a US history class, but they don't necessarily understand it in their own life. There's practically nothing that hasn't happened before, really, if you look at the theme. So, when I take your your particular case, I can digress into it, but I want I I won't talk come back to that in in a second. Almost everything that happens has happened many, many times before. And just like I described, there's the hero's journey and there's this and that, there's that particular path, and the whole thing happens over and over again. So, um to what you're saying is, um yep, that's absolutely right. That's a winning strategy. So, if you step back from that, and you write, "Okay, what happened to you?" What we're What happened to you is what we're talking about. You went above yourself. Okay? Not So, you exemplify it. You Okay, here are the things. You went above yourself. Now, you could have had the ego thing the ego barrier. Okay, the ego barrier is going to be the thing that's sort of going to kill you. Then by reconciling what your subliminal desires were, okay, I want to be the judge that's smart. And then connecting that with your intellect and saying, "Okay, now intellect, what is really going on here?" Okay? And then to be able to step out of that. Now, you just did it alone, but you could do it with others and it's even better. And And so, you figure out, "Oh, okay, this is that. Here's what the choices are. Here's what how reality works." And so, I'm just saying you did what we were talking about, right? And if every If everybody gets that and really understands how to go do that, the number the two big things is how do you get your alignment of your lower level you with your upper level you? How do you get past your ego and your blind spot? And we know what the ego barrier is. Like, I got to be right or whatever it is or I'm not good at this. The blind spot barrier is the realization that people actually see things different. They see different things. Like, somebody will see the big picture. Somebody will see the detail. They'll focus on different things, almost like a color spectrum type of thing. And if you realize that you will see a part of that spectrum and other people will see the other part of the spectrum. And so, that you really need to when you go above yourself, you really need to orchestrate all those ways of seeing. Because you are not just one of those people that's got to do it yourself. Your way of being the the success is to go above it and be the orchestrator and know what you're good at and what you're not good at. So, it's almost like if you want your life to be successful, you will not let yourself do certain things. Because you're just no good at them. Once you get that picture down, then you can find the path wherever the paths are. You're open-minded because you Now you've given up your ego barrier and your blind spot barrier. So your particular case just was another one of those. Yeah, the concept of just another one of those I think is um it's bizarrely easy to miss in your book. And so I want to linger on this point for a second. And it's funny because people ask you this question all of the time and you give the same answer. You're so consistent. And yet people don't spend the time that you spend. So let me encapsulate. Uh you've done so well as an investor. It's kind of crazy. And so needless to say people like, all right, what's the strategy? And your answer is actually usually not specific. Your answer is understand the historical context. Understand the historical context and get smart people around you so you're not making decisions by yourself. So the notion of it's another one of those is looking at investing, looking at the human condition, looking at your own life as this thing that has these repeating elements. Every dimension of every everything the way is another one of those. And um so that's how you could if I can get people to think what I want to convey what that means. And then I I want to then understand how to think at the principle level. Because then life becomes so much easier cuz if you have the principle. And what I mean by that is um like you could look at all the things that are coming at you. And they're just the things coming at you. If you instead uh think of each thing as being like a type of species. Uh think of that as an like an animal species or something. Okay, what one of those is it? And how do I deal with those? And you have your principle for dealing with those. So you have the species coming in. you have a principle that lines up with the species, so now there's no guesswork or refiguring it out. I figure it's like I don't know, it's a a type of snake that's coming at you. But, everything is another one of those. So, when you start to think about how do I deal with that, how does reality work, and how do I deal with those? So, the way it looks to me, I'm I'll speak figuratively to help to convey the image of what I mean by that. Maybe there is something like 50 different personality types. I don't know what the exact number is. And they are all living out the same scripts happen maybe there just 50 different scripts. And then through those, you know, maybe there's a certain X 100 things through time. And it seems all confusing because we're looking at them bit bit by bit, you know, it's like you're in a blizzard and a snowstorm and each of these bits come at you and so on. If you can kind of step back and just say, "Okay. Okay, what one of those is it?" And it's happened before and it's happened to different people. So, let's say for example, you have a kid and you think, "Okay, now I'm a kid." And you could just sort of say, "Okay, now you're parenting." But, whatever it is, you can sort of say, "Hey, it's happened before a million times." And in that particular circumstances. So, when you realize everything happens over and over again pretty much for the same kind of reasons. Okay, and you understand that and you can almost look at who who's been through it before, who knows how it works, how do I best navigate that thing, what are my principles for that? Then it's great. The reason I discovered it accidentally, I discovered this accidentally is because I got in the habit that I'd suggest you get into and other people get into. And that is whenever you're in a situation where you're making decision important decision, just pause and write down what type of decision was it and why did I make that decision that way? That's writing down your principles. It's kind of your recipe for success. And we could talk about it. And then every time I'm in a situation, I'll write down why did I make that decision? And we could look at those criteria. Did that make sense to do that decision that way? Would you have different criteria? And so on. And you do that over a period of time, okay? And then you have your principles. And then it So, they're just your reasons for making your decisions and and what matters to you, right? When you do that, so that's why I'm encouraging you because you're going through these and then you have found a path in life. I viewed your story, what you just told me is just another one of those. Now you keep doing it, it'll become apparent to you how everything's another one of those because what'll happen is the next time around, you're going to find, I don't know, let's say you're firing somebody, use that as an example. You would say, "Okay, now I'm firing somebody again." Okay, now let me just kind of reflect. Would I modify that principle? And how would I do that? And then, okay, now maybe you you're firing somebody who's been with you for 10 years and you love. And that's not the same as firing the son of a [ __ ] who you want to get rid of. So then you refine that. How How should I deal with that one and that? And why does it make sense? Because that reflection, why does it make sense? Why does it make sense? And really wanting truthfulness. You You know, not worried about being embarrassed. Making mistakes, learning on the struggle with all of you together is a good thing. Yeah, so the How do you define a species? Like, how do you begin to codify all this stuff and go because I I think it's all too easy to get lost in the Well, this isn't another one of those. This isn't just firing somebody. This is firing somebody that I love. And so, oh, there's, you know, this is all just so different. simple because all you have to do really is to sort to say, if you start to think everyone's another one and I was on a making decision, I just got to write down why I made the decision. I don't care how you tie title it. Okay, just write down, okay, uh okay. What's what what What are your criteria? Make it write it down. Well, you'll see that they're close cousins. You know, let's say if you're saying is it a different one because it's a close relationship that you've had for a long time or somebody is new? Okay, well, you'll see those two things are close together. Okay, but it's another one of those things. And it changes your way of seeing things. Okay? It changes your perspective. Again, I want to repeat because then life becomes easier because it's not all these bits and pieces. Okay, it's okay, it's another one of those. It gives you an equanimity and like a ninja. Okay, it's another one of these coming at me. Okay, and how do I approach that? And then you can have a conversation. It's just reality. How should you deal with that reality? And if you do that, then you think in a whole different way. Okay? You just want to get to the best way to deal with your realities. You've talked about how about 30% of the people cannot do radical candor. It'd be great for you to I call it radical transparency, but whatever it is, okay? radical transparency, define what that is exactly and then what is it about that 30%? Like, are they they can't get rid of the ego or what? What is that? It's just what you're talking about. This the struggle is between themselves as you go into a conversation and and you're looking at that. They find So, radical transparency is saying super hard [ __ ] really direct, nice and clear. They're not good at this. Yeah? Yeah, saying while simultaneously saying, I don't know if that's true. In other words, if I say that I don't I don't think you're good at that, I'm being honest, but also who knows whether you're good at that. So, how do we then go from you think you're good at it, I don't think you're good at it, and how do we go through a process to find out together whether you're good at it or not? How do we go through that process? That's one of my one of my key questions. Okay. The best way to do it is you do it in an agreed-upon way. Okay. The idea is, okay, we say, "Okay, Tom, you're not so good at that, I don't think." Okay, and then we go through the how would we judge? Can we ask other people? Do we go through this test or that test? How do we find out what's true? Because if you can find out what's true, your life will be better. Like, do you want to know what you're not good at? If you know what you're not good at, it's your life's no problem. Because it you don't even have to get good at it. You just have to work with somebody who's good at what you're not good at, right? So, there's a path forward when you get out of your head that you got to do that. So, the only basic notion is, when we're if we would have a relationship is, if you And by the way, it's non-hierarchical. You could say, "Hey, Ray, I don't think you're very good at that." And I'm I'm going to be the same way. I put it in because I needed it. Cuz I I'm worried that I'm going to be wrong. So, then you come to me and you say, "I don't think it's very good." Well, how do we find out in a non-ego-constrained, objective way whether I'm good at that or not? Do you actually lay out criteria like Oh, yeah, you will do. You'll Yeah, you'll we will do. Yeah. Absolutely. You'll how do you come upon that criteria? Would you do this as a one-on-one? Would you do this in a group? Um how do you begin to tease that stuff out? Um first of all, in terms of the group, um I like to make everything transparent. So, it everybody could watch the same thing happening with anybody. So, I like would do this in front of a large group of people? No, no. I would say taping. We do a lot of that tradical transparency. Because that way people see is it fair? Is it a good process, right? So, I like to do that discussion. But, anybody can do it with anybody, right? And so, but I would like to have that conversation if it's like if if I don't think you are good at something and I am relevant to your life or vice versa, we got to work it out. We got to figure that out together. with your wife? In all relationships. In one way or another, you have to find out how you're going to make decisions. There are going to be agreements and disagreements. And you have to have the art of thoughtful disagreement. Now, people find their domains differently. Maybe somebody says, "Okay, I'll take care of these things and you take care of that." I don't know. Some people, you know, the traditional household might say, "Okay, I'll take care of making the money out." And the man goes out and he makes money in the world. And then the woman says, "I'll take care of the kids." We're not there anymore. But, each role, I'm trying to say, in some way you have to find out how to do the art of thoughtful disagreement. It's and it makes sense. And then also, knowing what's good what you're good at and what you're not good at. It's a good thing to know what you're good at and what you're not good at, right? What do you do though? Like when you, let's say, you and your wife realize, "Ooh, we actually have something that we disagree with how to do with the kids." And that's high stakes. If you do something wrong, you could have a material impact on on their psyche and the way that they approach the world. So, there's sort of elevated stakes and there's just two of you. Unless you guys had a way of appealing to other people, would it come down cuz you've said, "Um don't worry so much about what the person's saying, think about the process by which they got there." Yeah, so I'm saying whenever there's a disagreement between two people that they can't get along on that, they should pause and they should go above it and they should say um how do we how should we deal with each other when that or happens? In other words, what are our protocols for um working ourselves through that so that we can then move beyond that to make a decision. And with a specific protocol in a marriage be something like if it has to do with the kids, you have more believability than I do, so therefore if we can't come to an agreement, we'll go with your decision. There are That could be one of the protocols. The main thing I'm trying to convey is when people are ordinarily in an argument, they just argue and they and and they don't know the ground rules, they don't have a process in place. So if you look above it and you come up with whatever your rules are, it may be you could have domain. It may be that you have a mutually agreed party that you would say, "Okay, let's plead our cases to it and have them mediated." It could be a lot of different paths could exist to say, "Ah, I think that's a good path when we have a disagreement on how we plead our cases and then move beyond it." But you need to have the path and that's what I mean by principle level thinking. Go above it, how should it be instead of, you know, this kind of thing, right? We all need that in order to have successful relationships. It's fundamental, right? When you got this and you're not going above it and saying, "Why do you have this or how should this occur?" then you got trouble. The key is you want to connect with them. You want them to fall in love with you. You want them to be inspired. You want them to feel better about themselves when they're around you than when they're not. And if you can pull that off, they will go to war for you.