How to Be an Exceptional Leader | Judah Smith on Impact Theory

Everyone does not have to believe what I believe, but I want everyone to feel like they matter, they have purpose, they have someone who loves them, will listen to them, care for them. And I actually think we can do that on a grand scale. And I I imagine that communities that can also do that, before you know it, um you know, we could have a lot less lonely people in the world. And that would be pretty awesome. Everybody, and welcome to Impact Theory. You're here, my friends, because you believe that human potential is nearly limitless, but you know that having potential is not the same as actually doing something with it. So, our goal with this show and company is to introduce you to the people and ideas that will help you actually execute on your dreams. All right, today's guest is the chaplain for the Seattle Seahawks and leads a mega church attended by over 10,000 people. He is one of the most phenomenal public speakers I have ever seen, and he's making so many waves that he's been interviewed by everyone from Maria Shriver to the Today show. Known as the millennial preacher to the stars, he counts Justin Bieber, Russell Wilson, Kevin Durant, Tim Tebow, and top golfer Bubba Watson as congregation members and close friends. And while I'm sure he hates any title with to the stars in it, his impact on some of the biggest athletes in the world led Fox Sports to call him one of the most influential people in sports today. A pretty incredible title for someone who doesn't play or even coach, but no matter what you call him, it's impossible to deny that he's tapped into youth culture in a powerful way and captured the imagination of an entirely new generation of people that have been moving away from organized religion in droves. With over 1 million social followers, 50,000 people listening to his sermons online, and churches in Seattle, Los Angeles, and Guadalajara, it's easy to see that he's touched a nerve. And having witnessed him on stage first hand, I can tell you right now that he manages to bring together and electrify the most eclectic group of people I have ever seen in one space from rabbis to die-hard hipsters, celebrities, and everyone in between. The young, the old, the well-dressed, the under-dressed, and a kid with a sequin trucker hat that simply read [ __ ] He welcomes everyone regardless of faith and captivates them with stories of not only who they are but who they can become. A seventh-generation pastor who is radically inclusive and clearly one of the greatest orators of our time. He's got insights, wisdom, and a deep humility that transcend faith and denomination and make his message truly accessible to all. So, please help me in welcoming the New York Times best-selling author who is changing the face of religion one Instagram post at a time, Judah Smith. Dude, thank you for being here. What an intro. I want to meet that guy. You you made that very easy, very easy because I've seen you speak and I've seen you speak live. Now, the great irony of all of this is that a mutual friend of ours who happens to be Jewish is the guy that took me to see you speak. Yeah. And he was saying that, you know, regardless of faith, denomination, he was like "Every time I go see Judah speak, I feel better." Wow. And I thought, "Wow, that's actually really interesting." So, I wanted to go, wanted to see it for myself, and I was captivated is the right word. And as somebody who at least makes part of my living speaking, I was astonished. In fact, I had a moment like you had. You played So, you played basketball. I did. I was a hooper. And you played against a kid, Tracy? Uh Tracy McGrady. Okay, Tracy McGrady. And you said when you saw him play, it it made you want to quit. quit. That's a true story. It did. Seeing you speak made me want to quit. that did. deadly serious. It was crazy. Thank you. So, before we get into that, I know that we'll talk more about that later, but I want to start with Pete Carroll, the Seahawks, and leadership. So, how'd you get that gig, and what is Coach Carroll's job? greatest job I've ever had. I have to say that. And And I don't know if that's okay to say like if church members are watching, but um being like the chaplain for your favorite sports team in the world uh I still pinch myself. I love that. It's awesome. So, you've said that Coach Carroll may be the greatest leader you've ever seen. What What makes him great? Um there's nothing about Coach Carroll that is disingenuous. I don't even know if it's in his DNA to be disingenuous. Um he uh says what he means, follows through on what he does, and um cares so deeply. We'll have guys that will be in workouts that aren't even on the team yet, and Coach is there to affirm them and encourage them and say, "Hey, man, it's real honor to have you here." It's just It's completely abnormal how much he cares about people. Uh any room he walks into, he's making eye contact. The little things that I think are big things, makes eye contact, will make connection, shake your hand, "Hey, are you doing good?" And when he asks, "Are you doing good?" he doesn't walk away. It's not rhetorical. Like he says, "Are you doing good?" and he waits for a response. And so, I watch him like a hawk, to be honest, the pun's definitely intended. And uh we're the Seahawks. I've just learned so much from him. I I I really respect him. I love his wife, his family, his son Nate also leads on the team, and um I just hope he's watching right now. So, for anybody For anybody that wants to be a better leader, um what are some principles that you think any great leader does? Someone asked me one time, they said, "W- When When do you think you became a good communicator?" First of all, I love the question. I'm like, "You're insinuating I'm a good communicator. Thank you." And I said, "I actually have an answer." Um I know exactly when it happened, which is which is weird. I'm definitely kind of an abstract, random person, so so sometimes I don't have concrete answers, but I had one. And it was when I I cared more about people than speaking or preaching. And when I when I walked through that threshold and fell in love with people who trusted me to lead them or add value to them, I got lost. And all of a sudden the gift that I had been working on for so long was free to be what it truly is. And um co- coach embodies he really kind of lose he's not thinking I'm going to lead today. I'm going to be the leader today. I think he's thinking I'm going to love these guys. I'm going to encourage these guys. I'm going to build them up. Um and so I think intentionality is so imperative, but as you develop your gift and your ability and it grows, boy if you fall in love with the people that give you the privilege and honor to guide them and lead them it never ceases to amaze me Tom. I'll be in a green room looking out kind of the back of our one of our buildings and I see, you know, single moms in the rain in Seattle pulling trying to find a parking spot to come to church or come hear me speak and it's like whoa, I really got to got to love this individual today to ensure that the effort they took uh you know, it to to get there pays off. So coach is uh he really cares about people first. That's cool. And one thing that I like about that assessment is also and you've said this that in sports is black and white you either win or you lose. So how do you marry some of the softer side of leadership with loving leading with intention and the like, but we need to win. And they're they're an extraordinary team and have been in what two Super Bowls in recent memory. Um so how how as a leader do you and there in many ways correlates between what you've done with your church which is now massive. Um how do you continue to push that forward and make the church bigger and more successful and marry that softer side. Like what where does the drive and just like execution path come in? Uh the word accountability comes to mind and I'm really on this journey right now discovering what true accountability is and that it's first of all it's it's steeped in in ancient scripture and this idea of real relationship. Um I don't know if there is such a thing apart from accountability. My I am prone to because love love love is like my mantra um because of what I believe and I'm passionate about adding love and care and concern and value to people that way that sometimes I cannot keep people accountable. Then so like I read The Advantage by Lencioni and and he talked about one of the last cowardice act of a leader is firing someone sometimes that you were never willing to keep accountable. And um kind of in my line of work so to speak, we just kind of love hug and hey if you don't come to work today, if you don't deliver, if you don't produce, if you don't if you aren't good at your job, it's okay. God loves you. I love you. And that's sloppy. It's not authentic. It's not genuine. And so what I have learned from Russell QB1 or coach is that keeping each other accountable actually breeds intimacy. Um it breeds camaraderie and it's a beautiful thing. So I guess the only answer I could give right now is I'm really leaning into what does accountability look like. I don't think I'm good at it and I want to be good at it. I love to love people but part of loving people is saying hey, you need to follow through and I think that's where you know, coach will love all the players but oh my god. I mean if they don't deliver, if they don't make the catch, if they don't run the route, if they don't make the block, he's the first guy in their face to say you are letting as he says the team down and the family down. Pull your weight. And I think there's a beauty to that that actually breeds security cuz you're like, you know, dad or the coach is going to tell me the truth um if I need to shore some things up. Wow, that that is actually really amazing and in in business I have found something similar to be true and it it stung a little when you said cuz I haven't read the book that you mentioned. Okay, yeah. Um and when you talked about that it's actually laziness to fire somebody that you weren't being you weren't holding them accountable through the whole thing. Um and and I get that and have been guilty of that in the past. So, how can if somebody is rather than the coach they're the player, how can they embrace accountability? What are things that you do you say that you want to be more accountable? What are things you do in your life to actually work towards that? Um not avoid conflict, which is it is part of not only what this book speaks to but what I've experienced. Um avoiding conflict uh minimizes the depth of relationship that you can experience and of course the excellence in which um you can experience progress and fulfillment and uh live live your dreams. And so, um we are conditioned particularly if I could speak to people in the faith community, we're very conditioned to just like love love love. It's all good and it gets very um greasy and it's not authentic. So, I think you actually address hey, there needs to be some conflict here and this is good. So, we this literally happened yesterday in one of our executive meetings is two individuals in the meeting I was like hey, you're not saying anything. You just shut down. Um you are clearly visibly your body language is you are frustrated. You guys need to have conflict right now and it's a good. So, let's go. And sure enough this person was like well, I feel like intimidated. And this person's like what were you talking about? Well, six weeks ago and I'm like here we go. And I stopped him for a second and said now this is good. This is family. We're going to keep doing this. But before the emotion begins, we've got to set up like okay, we're going to look for conflict in this relationship, in this business, in this organization because it's going to be good for us and it's going to keep us from being robots and show up to work where eventually we despise where we work because nobody's genuine and honest and we end up talking at the water cooler about the person we should be talking to face-to-face. So, I think really leaning into conflict and now you're you're picking up on where we are right now as an organization and where I'm at as a leader is I've been avoiding conflict and now I'm like I'm like making guys get into it and gals get into it in a really healthy way in a safe environment. Have you read Principles by Ray Dalio? No. Ah, dude, I think you would love it. So Okay, I will. literally what you're describing is is what he writes in that book, that need for the saying the honest thing, saying the hard things that ultimately though that's the only kind of culture that's sustainable, that's scalable. Um, and yeah, like really taking the time to say the things that are obvious but something about society tells us not to say. Like when you see the person's clearly pissed off and shut down but actually saying it out loud is is pretty incredible. And I want to take that and and talk about athletes. So, calling out the obvious thing that nobody talks about seems to be something inherent in athletics that I love which is the the black and white thing that you talked about, you either win or you lose. How can people bring that notion into real life where it is so hazy? How can you get like laser clarity? I I definitely think um recently I was hearing a speaker and he says what what what do you want? And the room gets quiet and he's like, most people don't say what they want in life, where they want to go, who they want to be. They take it as it comes. Which is really disturbing and sad but it's true. We like for instance, we take friendships as they come. We just like, well, I guess we kind of met and you like juice boxes and I like juice boxes so let's just hang out and like, you know, talk about Capri Sun or whatever. And it's like, no, like I I'm going to pursue people that I mean like like you do. I feel like you you challenge me in that regard. Like you're pursuing people that you want to mine out the gold in them and learn from them. And I think we ought to be uh intentional and and be honest. What do I want? What kind of friends do I want? What kind of life do I want? And then, um I think speak that out, first of all. Like, declare that. Be honest. Recently, I did an exercise again, back to our team, and they said, "Why do we exist? Judah, why do you exist? Why do we exist?" Not the answer you think you're supposed to give, but the answer like the truth of what you want and why you exist. And, creating a safe space with the people that you intentionally have have chosen your life to go "All right, we're going to like we're going to get bare-bones honest here. This is actually what I want in life. This is actually why I exist." And then, and then we've got to like hold each other accountable to that. Like, "Bro, you can't wake up at 11:00 p.m. every day if that's what you want." And, I think there's a That's why I'm a big proponent of community. I don't think people can be who they're supposed to be without community. And, community doesn't have to be 10,000 people. It can be five. It can be three. It can be the right people, not just a bunch of people, but the right people. You know, it's been said, "Show me your friends, I'll show you your future." Like, it's it's real. I can tell you where you're going right now by the people you're hanging out with on a consistent basis. So, that's one of the questions that I get asked most in the world, which is if you're the average of the five people you spend the most time with, then how do I find those people? Um how aggressive do you want to be? Um I'm married to the woman I'm married to today because I drove 3 hours from Seattle to Portland, didn't have a second thought about it. And, by the way, at a moment's notice, if she's like, "I got 10 minutes later today," I'm like, "I can get there in 3 hours. I'm going to be there at your doorstep, and I'm going to keep bugging you." I have friends today, if I could be so bold, and I am their friends because I they finally wore me down. And, it was like, "You know what? We're going to hang out because you're always around." And, one of the teachings steeped in ancient scripture is abide in me, and I'll abide in you. And my pastor, my mentor, his name is Brian Houston, pastors a global church. Um, he doesn't have to text me or call me. I text him. I call him. I'm always where he's at. If he's in the states, he's usually in Australia. If he's in the states, guess who's going to be around him? I'm going to be there. If he's speaking somewhere, I'm going to do my best to be there because I chose him. You know, and eventually he's like, "All right. All right, you know." He sounds like Bruce the shark. He's like, "All right, mate. All right, you know." And and we end up just being together, but um, I would say, man, get aggressive. And I feel like I I can make an assumption that I think you're that way, too. It's like, no, this is a I'm going to get to know this person. I'm going to be around this person. And uh, you know, and and you say, "Well, Judah, they live across the world. I can't even meet." Well, then download all their material. Get everything they have. Read it. Devour it. Study. Watch. And grow and learn. Dude, so I I'm not religious at all, but what I what I love is that you it it's harder to be like you are and to have grown like you've grown in a religious community. In some ways it's been easier for me because I'm not beholden to a certain set of rules and guidelines. How on earth have you built what you've built? People must be giving you like a hard time about the size of the church, how visible you are, that it is very easy to call you famous. When I went to um, to see you speak and we went backstage um, briefly. And I won't mention any names you haven't already talked about publicly, but dude, there were so many famous people backstage. I was like, "What the [ __ ] is happening?" Like it it was it was pure insanity. And how have you been able to stay the course, to be aggressive, to say what you want, to go after it, to build it, and only include more and more people? How have you not alienated? Like when I dude, honestly, I've never seen a more collected group of people together. It's not just a bunch of hipster kids. Like it was there were old people there. There was a rabbi. It was so crazy. So how how do you balance the you guys want to hold me to this standard, the traditional religious narrative, but this is what I want in the world and still go after it. Um honestly, the only true answer I can give is relationship and the power of relationship. I'm a curious so I love listening to people. I love hearing your story. Um I'm a quick assimilator. So I love to just like whoa, I'm going to take that. I'm going to take that. I'm not a big reader. That's my dirty little secret. Um and leaders are readers and readers are leaders so I'm failing, but I love to I love to read people. I love to read people. I'll read people all day long. I love reading body language. I love room dynamics, uh how people are feeling because of who they are, how they look or their background and culture. So I love that and I feel like um that certainly helps us um tell it tell a story that hopefully resonates with people. But but big picture um you know, I'm a seventh generation speaker, communicator. My dad is my hero. I was given such a secure life. My dad was the most loving, caring person. Tom, every day of my life my dad said, "People like you and they want to hear what you have to say. People like you and they want to hear what you have to say." So I got to be really honest, I had a huge head start in life and I have to own that. It's incredible and I I definitely want to talk about your dad in a minute, but something you said in there I want to go back to which is you're really vulnerable. And seeing you up on stage and being so like you never try to make yourself look cool. When when did you and I mean look and and I think you're probably self-aware enough to know that that's in some ways the ultimate form of cool, but you admit things that you're struggling with and and do it in a way that that makes that really accessible. Was that a choice? Like, what's the power of vulnerability, I guess, is my real question. It's definitely steeped in our tradition and what's taught in scripture. That's my ultimate inspiration. I also was taught at a very young age that people relate to your weaknesses far more than your strengths. And preachers, if I could be so bold, are the absolute worst at this. Our platforms are getting higher and bigger. I think the trend ought to be our platforms, you know, it might not be the actual stage height, but you know what I mean metaphorically. They need to get smaller and we need to recognize that like I told a pastor friend of mine recently, I'm like, you know, you you lead a church, but you're not in it. Like you lead a community, but you don't participate in it. You're just the pro speaker that shows up on Sundays, but you actually don't bleed with anybody. You actually don't weep with anybody. You don't share your problems and challenges and weights and difficulties. It's like you and your wife and you just kind of hunker down. When are you going to be in the community? I mean, the real story is I was 13 when my dad started the church I now pastor. So, I it's been my family. This is my community. I'm not speaking professionally to people. I'm talking to people who have raised me. My first job at the church was cleaning toilets. I was a custodian listening to Bishop T.D. Jakes, listening to Tony Robbins, listening to others, learning and growing. And so, I I'm just going to be that guy cuz that's just really who I am. Talk to me about that the learning and growing part. So, you I I and I don't want to make you uncomfortable by continuing to harp on this, but I'll tell you a quick story from my own background. So, I used to want to be a stand-up comic. When I was a teenager, that was that was my real pursuit. And I was going I was going hard for it. And I went and did an open mic and I the way that open mic nights work is it starts with a really crowded audience and then established comedians come through and they try out their stuff. It's like a random Tuesday night and so it's not like a you know, big audience or anything. There was about 300 people to start. After so many of these famous comedians had gone this terrible material cuz they're just trying it out. There was literally, I don't know, seven or eight of us, 15, something like that left. And me and my friend get up to leave. And this manager comes on and he goes, "Guys, the funniest man in America is about to walk out on stage. And you're going to want to stay for this." And so I grab my friend and I'm like, "Ah, what do we have to lose? Let's sit back down. We'll watch." And this guy comes out and he was like, "Everybody, Mitch Hedberg." Now, I'd never heard of Mitch Hedberg ever in my life. And for those of you that don't know Mitch Hedberg, probably the funniest human being ever to live. And so at the end of that, I was like, "Yeah, I'm not doing stand-up comedy." Because in all seriousness, to get that good, I would have had to dedicate myself to it in a way that I wasn't prepared to. Not that I couldn't get that good. Not My belief system is that I could have gotten that good if I wanted to, but I just looked at the amount of time that it would take to become that extraordinary, and it was unbelievable. When I saw you on stage, I was thinking, "How much time does it take to get that good?" Like, how do you get that good? I mean, first of all, I've I I would like to do this interview with you every day. Uh because I really feel like we need to do that. It's not for me, man. It's for you. Like, I I just need you to encourage me like this. Um I Yeah, so I don't know if we can get co-host. Is that something we're doing here? Cuz you know, um well, I I uh my dad, right? I I grew up watching my dad and uh he grew up watching his dad. I started doing this at 9 years old at just to audiences uh any ranging from 4,000 to 400. I'd get on the stage and dad would say, "This is my son, Judah El Smith." And he'd say, "Son, you know, basically take it away." And I would tell my story of how I almost died three times before the age of 1 years old. And that I believe that my life had purpose and that I'm here for a reason. It's not an accident. And so I have to own the fact that I got to start speaking at 9 years old and listen to who I think is the most authentic man who's ever lived speak over 800 times. I guess to answer your question honestly, I I have been doing this since since I was since well, for 30 years now, since I was nine. Wow. I mean, the classic tale, right? So, if you know the story of Amadeus Mozart, and everybody uses him as the example of somebody who was just born with talent, then you realize actually his father was a piano teacher who specialized in teaching children, and Mozart started playing when he was two. So, by the time he's 12, 13, he's already been playing for 10 plus years, and he practiced like a fiend because he loved it. And you begin to realize, right, that there that even someone like you, or someone like Mozart, it's like there's a lot of hours of practice that go into that. So, now talking about your dad, the person that you watched 800 times. So, one, what are some qualities that you've taken away from him? Um he any room he walked into, he he never he never you know, the cliche never knew a stranger, but like my dad's value was if there's someone in this room that classically would be ignored because they're simply a helper, or they're a worker, or they're an assistant, all these horrific categories we place on people to to to devalue them even subconsciously, my dad raged against that. The first person he wanted to talk to was the person that maybe wasn't even acknowledged. Hey, my name's Window, what's your name? What's your story? And so, when you watch that your whole life, that becomes a massive value. So, my dad taught me from a young age, hey, we we look for lonely people. So, if you ask my 13, 11, and 8-year-old, who are you guys? They would tell you, we're Smiths. We're kind and encouraging, and we look for lonely people. And so, um I I I adored that about my dad. I felt like it made us different. I felt like when we walked in the room, when the Smiths show up, you're going to see a difference. How did you handle his passing? Um really well in until 3 months. He was gone. Um we did the funeral. Uh 5,000 people showed up for his funeral, which is pretty radical and I don't know, tens of thousands watched online. And I cried. I wrote letters to my dad at the funeral that I shared. And then I started to try to lead the church that he that he left. And and doing the best I could. We had made the transition right before he had passed. And so I'm in it and I'm in it and I'm in it and I'm in it. We have a board meeting. And my uncle's on the board, so is my mom and it's not all family. And then other board members and they said, "How are you?" And I'm like, I'm I guess I'm the chairman of the board, you know, but I'm like 30. And I'm like, and then the waterworks came and I'm like, I'm not okay. I miss my dad. This sucks. I don't care about preaching and teaching. By the way, I'm out of all of my material. You know, like I feel like I preached all the sermons I can. I feel trapped. I feel lonely. I feel all these things. And so Chelsea and I went to our happy place, which is Palm Springs and for a month. And we spent time together. We cried. We laughed. We told stories. We prayed. We read. We walked. Played golf. And I came back with a with an appreciation for my dad that was very healing. All of a sudden I became grateful. All of a sudden instead of, you know, people would say, "Hey, sorry about your dad. Man, it sucks about your dad." Everything changed for me and I said, "Wait a minute. No, no, I got the best dad for 60 years. Am I not the luckiest man who's ever lived? Who How many people don't even have dads? Don't even have a father figure? Don't even have an uncle to call? I got the best, most secure man in the world for 60 years to raise me." Oh, no, no, no. I have nothing to complain about. I have everything to be grateful about. And that gratitude and that attitude of gratitude, which rhymes, is uh has healed and changed me. And so after that, what do you tell people now if they're in that moment, they haven't had that realization of gratitude? How do you help them through that? Um, definitely don't go there straight out the gate. I think that can be come across as a little crass and maybe a little insensitive. Um, the first thing I say to be, I guess I'm just going to tell you the truth. Um, I'm about to lose probably it it it it it it it it it it it it it it it it it it it today, it could be tomorrow. It's very soon. Um, my the only real grandfather I ever had. Never had a grandfather, but this was this was my grandfather. And I call him grandpa. So, I went to see him. Uh, he's not hungry. He's 85. Um, and and and so, I'll probably have to say goodbye to him in the next couple of days. Um, there's no quick fix. And I I I would oppose anyone who says there's a quick fix for the heart. There's a quick fix for a broken heart. There's not. Time can be a healer. Relationships can be a healer and memories can be a healer. Um, but uh, it's for real, man. And I I I you got to know there's somebody watching right now who's going through something like that. And um, you know, for me to sit here and give you cliche little curt answers to like, nah, there's none of that. There's just brokenness and pain and hurt and we need each other. And I I needed to feel someone hold me. I needed to feel someone hug me. If that's okay to say, that's what I needed. And I cuddled with Chelsea this morning. Um, my wife of 18 years because um, just just uh, thinking about um, you know, gramp grandpa. So, you know, it yeah, it's easy to be strong on a stage and tell everybody like, yeah, man, like everything's going to work out, but a lot of it isn't. And so, we're going to need each other in those days to um, like I don't know, like I was going to be a co-host and now I'm never going to get invited back because I'm like breaking down. It's like, bro, you can't co-host a show if you're emotionally unstable. Um, but uh, you know, it's a it's a it's it's it's it's a real thing, but I wouldn't have it any other way, man. The pain is part of being alive. It we're not living a Disney cartoon. We're living real life and the pain we feel it it it makes us more human. It makes us more alive and I held my wife tighter this morning. I just did, man. I just did. Um because I realized we're not always going to be together the way we are right now. No, dude, that's incredible. So, let's talk about your wife. You guys seem to have a a pretty incredible marriage, one filled with honesty. You guys are seems like you're honest with each other. You're certainly honest with the public. Um I've seen you guys talk about, "Hey, every marriage is hard." And and so, how do you guys deal with that? I've heard you talk about love languages and things like that. What are What are some of you guys' secrets to a strong marriage? Um I have to give Chelsea all the credit she deserves. Um I can already tell just by meeting your wife um then you're a great man because I think a spouse is a dead giveaway. Always a dead giveaway. Um I truly believe that we can make each other better. And um Chelsea has made me a better human and a better man. I think developing fun things to do together. She loves to go on walks. She wants to go on hikes. I hate hikes, so we compromise with walks. So, um we we go on walks together, long talks, but um you know, this may sound really spiritual, but one of the most intimate things we do is we uh we pray together. We pray together. And whatever you believe about prayer, we pray together. And to hear her express to God what's going on in her heart is so intimate. And by the way, side note, sexy. Um many prayer times lead to other times, which is my favorite, right? Oh, you want to pray together? Sure. Like weird things pastors admit, you know? That's so gross. Um but it's so true. You're like, "What pastor's like, 'Yeah, prayer times lead to sex. Pretty awesome.'" I'm like that guy. But uh yeah, we do we do we do that. And you know what we we've set rules of engagement. Not allowed to use the word divorce. You can't use it. It's a cheap shot. You can't do it. You can't say you always, you never. Can't use the word hate. You can't cuss at each other. We broke that rule a few times. But rules of engagement, things you can't do. I can't take shots at her for things she can't change and can't control. And has helped us fight good. You got to fight good. You got to fight good and making up is awesome. But you got to learn how to fight right. Cuz I think you actually need a good fight now and again. And you need to argue and you need that conflict to bring intimacy. So I don't we're so far from like perfect and awesome. We're going to keep growing. But Chelsea's really good at making sure we fight right. And so our fights actually seem productive. We definitely got into it going through TSA yesterday on our way to LA because she's talking about hoodies we made for this event for young people. We made 12. We wanted it to be exclusive. And she's like, "That is weird. Why did we do that?" I'm like, "Babe, just stop. Let other people" She's like, "What do you Tell me to stop?" I'm like, "Stay in your lane." I said, "Stay in your lane." Who says that? Like she's like, "Did you tell me to stay in my lane?" And then my son's like, "Roasted." I'm like, "Bro, you are not in this conversation. Go through the metal detector right now. Keep him in there." Search him, you know. So but you know what's crazy is by the time and I know this this sounds so like we really mastered this. But by the time we got to the end of the TSA line and we're picking up our bags and putting our shoes back on, she's like, "I'm so sorry. Will you forgive me?" I'm like, "Yeah, I'm so sorry. Will you forgive I'm just tired. I don't know why I said that. I love you. Let's not do that." She's like, "Yeah, totally." 10 years ago we it would have been an all day thing probably. You know, like I'm so annoyed at you. But then like you like the older you get you're also like I only have so much energy. So I'm not going to use like I I want to use this energy not to fight all day. I want to use it to do other really fun and potentially sexy things. It's incredible. Um, what do you teach your kids about communication? Um, you can't say bored in our family. If if you say you're bored, it only means you're boring. There's no such We don't believe in it. So, boring is against our belief system. Um, if you're if if you're tired, get rest. Don't walk around and say you're tired. I think tired becomes a a um something we talk ourselves into a lot. I'm tired. I'm so tired. I'm so tired. You keep saying that, you're going to live a tired life. You don't want to be married to that person. You don't want to be a friends with that person. You don't want to be led by that person who's constantly tired. So, actually the people we really admire are not tired people. They're actually energized people who love and have energy to give and value to give. So, I'm trying to teach our kids, hey, we don't I think words are very formative. I think they're very powerful. And they create the culture in which you live in. We don't say hate. Um, we are very open and honest with each other. So, at the dinner table two nights ago, we're very honest, highs and lows. We talk about about highs and lows. We say what we needs to be said, not what we think we should be should should be said. So, those are some of kind of the the the the the driving values um that we have. We we we diabolically oppose cutting people off in sentences. So, that is a very big thing. If someone is talking at the dinner table, Grace interrupts Zion, we stop and go, you just interrupted your your brother. That devalues him. That's not okay. Zion, you speak, you Grace, you wait your turn. Grace now is being a little cheeky. She's eight, and she's the cutest little thing in the whole wide world I adore. So, now she's raising her hand to make a point. And I'm like, okay, you don't Raising your hand while he's still talking is still interrupting, and it's a distraction. So, those are Up the top of my head, those are some of the guiding values we have in terms of communication and words and and how we engage. I actually heard you say a quote, uh, I'll at least paraphrase it, but I think I'm going to get pretty close, where you said, "I I want to live what I preach, I want to preach what I live. Yeah. What do you mean by that? That's my dad, a quote from my dad. Um if you're not living it, don't shout it from the rooftop. Cuz here here's I'll pick on preachers. Preachers are classic for this. There is a discrepancy that begins to form, and it happens very subtly, and then it happens surely, and then ultimately publicly and clearly. You start to say stuff you don't do. You start to tell people to do stuff you don't do. And subtly you you you slip into self-deception. And now what preachers tell themselves, if I preach it, it's as good as doing it. Because if I'm helping somebody else do it, I don't need to do it because I helped them do it. And who who's losing? You, the preacher. And um I don't want to become that guy. I also think it what resonates with people is when they can tell there's what I like to call wind behind your words. And the only thing that gives you wind is the life you live. So if you're living this thing and you get up and go, "Hey, let's actually learn about each other, care about one another, listen to one another." If I don't care, if I'm not a learner, if I'm not listening, it's rhetoric. It's cliché. It's elevator music. It's white noise. We've heard that. It's It's a It's a It's pretense. But but just yeah, just share with people what's really changed your life and what you're really living out, and your words will have a lot more power. And so I believe that the things that people move towards are going to be their biggest goals. What are some goals you're trying to move towards? I I just can't imagine that your church has gotten as big and thriving as it is without it having something really big driving that. Yeah. I um I love I I do love targets. Um I've had a I've had a weird relationship with goals, so I've just changed the word. So now my mine is my word is target, and it somehow I've got fresh passion to set more targets. I I the world is changing very very fast. I think globalization is real, it's upon us. I'm no longer from here, I'm from the world. I'm a part of the world. I see the world. I represent the world. I am the world. Globalization is very fascinating in relationship to faith, community, and movements. And I truly believe that globalization has set us up for global communities. And um my passion right now is I I can I can see in the future that churches and communities will have millions of people engaging all over the world in different languages, maybe even utilizing technology. So, I'm really passionate. Um obviously social media has proven that um people want to engage. I think social media and technology has to lead to tactile. It has to get to tactile. And I think some of the innovators are even speaking to that right now. We need this. We need each other. I need to like hug you and and and feel that embrace. So, I'm passionate because that really aligns with my passion in life, um which is to help people feel loved. Everyone does not have to believe what I believe, but I want everyone to feel like they matter, they have purpose, they have someone who loves them, will listen to them, care for them. And I actually think we can do that on a grand scale. And I I imagine communities that can also do that. Before you know it, um you know, we could have a lot less lonely people in the world. And that would be pretty awesome. It's pretty incredible now. How did you get to know Bieber? I would say he was 8, 9 years old, and I spoke at a convention in Toronto, where he lived. And Patty, his mom, brought him. Wasn't supposed to was for young people. And um they heard me speak there. Patty goes out to the tape desk, the tape table, and buys tapes, that's how old I am, and would play the tapes every night to put Justin to bed. So, he first time we met, he goes, "Do you remember when we first met?" And I go, "No, I don't. I want to, but it was like, you know, just a bunch of young people." And he's like, "Well, guess what? Um you put me to sleep every night." And I'm like, "Dude, that's not really what a preacher to hear. Like, for real, it's not." But, um um I I just I just want to say, um Justin has changed my life. I have learned more from that young man than he will ever learn from me in 10 lifetimes. His exposure to the world, his experiences, his spiritual journey has, I mean this, dramatically changed me. I do not believe I would see the world or even talk the way I talk without it. He is my brother. I honor him. I respect him. I look up to him. I love him. Um and he is a genius and not just musically. So, um I'm honored to be his brother. That's really interesting and seeing how many people in that um sphere of celebrity have been drawn to you, it's really, really interesting. What is it that you think cuz they're obviously there different slings and arrows coming their way. What is it that draws them to you and your message specifically? I think everybody deserves a fair shake to grow in life and to to to to to be loved. And I think, um and a lot of people will disagree with this, I actually think people in the limelight um don't get a fair shake most of the time. Um they are are not treated in a way that would give them a fair shake. I'll give you an example, people will complain sometimes like, "Wow, all the celebs get to sit on the front row. Wow, all the celebs get a side VIP entrance." Absolutely. And do you know why? Because they deserve a fair shake to be in a room, to feel safe, and to feel like actually, oh that's right, everybody else in the room already feels. No one walked into the theater last night going, "Oh man, I hope hope no one wants a photo. Hope no one wants a picture. Hope no one wants to right?" Most people got to walk in just like like a human. So, my passion is to provide environments where my brothers, my friends, my sisters and brothers that I love a lot get a fair shake to actually experience that and get to be one of the guys, you know, one of the guys. And um so, maybe that's a reason, I don't know, but it's a I we get blasted for it, but I will not I will not stop doing that because we're doing it for a purpose that people don't initially see. It's to actually ensure that everyone in the room, no matter who you are, gets a fair shake. If you need signing because you're hard of hearing and that's a challenge, we're going to get a signer to help you. If you if you're if you're in a wheelchair, we're going to get you get if you if you speak a different language, we're going to try to find a translator. We want everyone in the room to get a fair shake and hearing about the fact that they're loved and they belong here. Aw, that's cool. I love that answer. Um so, before I ask my last question, where can these guys find you online? Well, uh church church home uh 1H is kind of our new name. We want to be a home for humanity where there's a family where there's a home is a family is kind of our thing, so uh churchhome1h.org uh and I think you can kind of find information there. And um my email is judah@churchhome.org. That's my real email. So, you can email me. Well, if if like if it's a nice thing. judah@churchhome.org and and that's uh that's us. Awesome. And my last question, what's the impact that you want to have on the world? I want um I actually think we're suffering from a lack of love on a grand scale, on an epic scale. It might be um the greatest epidemic in the world. Maybe it always has been. Um I think things horrific things like racism are symptomatic of the fact we don't feel loved. Um we don't feel like we matter. We don't feel like we're valued. And so, we devalue each other and we fight and we war. Um my passion is to love people and to express that love that I believe um ultimately comes from God. So, that's my passion in life. That's awesome, man. Thank you so much for being on the show. Appreciate it. You're incredible. Guys, you know me, I'm not a religious dude. I did not bring him on here with agenda. I brought him on because my Jewish friend took me out to see a Christian pastor and said you've got to see this guy. I don't know what it is about him, but every time I see him I just feel better. I went and saw it for myself and the the eclectic people that he puts together is breathtaking in its simplicity and its beauty and the way that he makes everybody feel included. The insights, the deep wisdom, the ability to read people, and the fact that he has practiced an art so much that he can become a true orchestrator of emotions to create such an unbelievable experience to feel more human, to feel more alive. It was absolutely breathtaking. It It really was one of the most incredible live events I've ever witnessed in my life. It was really, really special. And that's why I wanted to bring him on here so that you guys can get a taste of it. I'm telling you it does not matter what you believe. Somebody that wants to make your life better, that wants to make you feel loved, like that is all good in my book. And that is something that he does in spades. So, I hope that you guys will dive into his world regardless of what you believe. Take what makes sense, discard the rest, and I think you're going to find that you take a whole hell of a lot. All right, if you guys haven't already, be sure to subscribe. And until next time, my friends, be legendary. Take care. Hey everybody, thank you so much for watching and being a part of this community. If you haven't already, be sure to subscribe. You're going to get weekly videos on building a growth mindset, cultivating grit, and unlocking your full potential.