From Kashmir to New Delhi: which way forward for the Gen Z movement?

The Revolutionary Communist Party in London express our fullest solidarity with the revolution ongoing in Azad Kashmir and the student movement in India. We condemn the violent actions of the Pakistani armed forces in repressing the movement that left several dead. And we condemn the police brutality in attacking unarmed students in India. We say that the Awami Action Committee in Azad Kashmir must take state power into its own hands. And we say that the student movement in India must not compromise with Narendra Modi, but renew the protests. Inqilab [snorts] Zindabad! >> Inqilab [clears throat] Zindabad! >> Inqilab Inqilab Zindabad! >> I and I want to start this talk backwards because yeah, if you're a contact or what we call a contact, you know, you will go to the pub afterwards or you'll you'll you meet us afterwards after the talk. And one of our lovely comrades will speak to you and they'll talk about, you know, this revolution that we're fighting for in the future. We'll say like, you know, oh, we're building a party for this brilliant revolution that's going to come in the future in the abstract future and Soviets will emerge as well and you'll have have these have these embryos of workers power. But those conditions currently exist right now in Azad Kashmir, you know, it's not something in the future. It's happening right now. And yeah, as Tomaso said, this is further revolutionary process is further than any country or place in Asia that we've seen. Really I can I can really remember and the mass of people in Kashmir around, you know, 90% sent to them, you know, support the Awami Action Committee and and the Pakistani despite the Pakistani state outlawing them, calling them terrorists, as as trying to assassinate their leaders, arresting their leaders, and yeah, they have begun this million man march to Muzaffar the capital Muzaffarabad. And yeah, there is enormous state repression. There is enormous state terror. I don't know how many saw of you saw, but was this brutal video that was circulated widely yesterday of shootings in Mirpur in Kashmir and apparently at least 30 people are dead. I think probably likely a lot more. And the masses but the this is the key thing though, people are not cowed. The Kashmiris are not being cowed by this repression. They are not going home because of the of this of this repression. They are unafraid. They are they're losing their fear and they want to fight. And you know, this is a sign that there is a revolutionary situation in in Kashmir. The situation is extremely fluid right now and it's also extremely hard to find accurate information. So just for context as at Kashmir or Kashmir in general is in the very north of of the of the continent of the of the Asian subcontinent and yeah, Azad means free, but I'm sure most Kashmiris will laugh at the fact that they that that to think that their people are free. And you know, this country is to blame for for for the situation that exists today in Kashmir where the northern part is controlled by China. The other part is controlled by by India and the other other part in Uh, both Gilgit and uh, Jammu Kashmir are are in in Pakistan. And you know, the Kashmiri people have been have been divided. This uh, the these these people, you know, because it has actually been you know, historically quite remote, they have such a rich culture, you know, beautiful spices and textiles and the most beautiful landscapes that you can ever find in in the whole whole whole of whole of Asia. It's been all looted and divided by imperialism. The Kashmiris, they have no political representation at the at the center in Islamabad. And and in their regional parliament, they have 12 reserved seats for the whole all of Kashmiris in Pakistan. And but the real reason why they have this is is basically so Islamabad and Rawalpindi where the where army sits control Kashmir politically. And all the important decisions on you know, like minerals, land, electricity, all of these things are decided not in this parliament by but by the military officials and the people in Islamabad. And there currently are elections being taken place and they are rightly being boycotted and they are rightly seen as a complete sham. And on the other hand, you have this parallel organization which has has emerged and called the Awami Action Committee. Awami just simply means popular. And I was watching Al Jazeera this morning and they were they had these three so-called experts on the panel. And they were and the the host of the show was trying to interview them and say, "What is this Awami Action Committee? What what what does it mean? Like can you explain it?" And one one said it was a pressure pressure campaign group. One person said it was just, yeah, it's just a campaigning a campaigning organization. And they really just couldn't really understand they were describing it, but they couldn't really understand what it was or its significance. And our Pakistani comrades are in the Inqalabi Communist Party are actually very fundamental to actually how how they founded these Awami Action Committees. So we know Ehsan Ali, he is the chairman of the one in in Gilgit-Baltistan and one of our comrades was key in setting it up in in in in in the Azad Kashmir as well in around 2021 and they mobilized around the flower subsidy, but through that process actually, you know, the the committees have taken a life of their own. And I believe that there are three representatives for each of the 10 districts. And yeah, they have gained an enormous amount of authority in the past five years. They've launched because they have campaigned and they have won one real real demands for for the people of Kashmir, you know, on on the flower subsidy, on things like cheaper electricity from the hydro hydroelectric plant plant. And you know, how do we then explain it how do Marxists explain it? You know, they this is and how it's emerged as as a parallel political organization which has the support of the majority of the masses. You know, the this is a situation of dual power. And you know, these are equivalent to Soviets that existed, you know, in the 1905 revolution in Russia and in 1917 in Russia. And it's not just in Russia that you see this in all revolutionary situations that emerge where the where the regime is completely discredited and the highest point of the revolution emerges, you know, you have the situation where Yeah, dual power exists. But the key thing is that the leadership of the AAC they they they somewhat might under stand that that they have a lot of authority, but they are not conscious that they have power. Power is with they have the the legitimate right to say that they have power and they are the legitimate legitimate authority and the the actual legal one that is written into the constitution of Pakistan is completely is completely not illegitimate, you know, the fact that there was a general strike after they called after the the Pakistani the Pakistani state with the Rangers you know, attacking this attacking the leaders of the Awami Action Committee. That the fact that this led to a general strike where you know, the all the shops all the bazaars everything all the all everything was shut down for over a month I believe shows that and that they have the authority to shut down and paralyze society as in they control they control if society functions and runs. But this is a key thing and it's a very serious point which is dual power cannot last forever. You know, the masses cannot stay out forever. They cannot they there's enormous sacrifice being shown by by the people especially by the women who have really held this movement together. But if they They not take power the repression that will be meted out against them will be 10 times, if not a hundred times worse than what we have seen this week, which is a very serious which is a very serious point that we must all understand and we must also explain to all the Kashmiris in the in the situation now to to say we need to take power now. They must seize power and to explain and broaden out from this that their only hope and and support is the other other workers and youth in Pakistan who suffer under similar similar circumstances of lack of jobs, lack of electricity, poor you know, lack of democratic rights, lack of even just having student unions. They are not agents of India. They are their fellow brothers and sisters and they are fighting for for uh demands which they should support. >> Everyone in the Revolutionary Communist Party has been incredibly inspired by the movement in Kashmir. So, would you like to tell us a bit about what's been happening in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir? >> First of all, I'm thankful to this Revolution to the Communist Party because you guys doing amazing job. And let me tell you about Kashmir. It's been like this moment started back in 2023. And then first time when we came on roads, they all accepted everything every demands were accepted. We had [clears throat] an agreement with the government of Pakistan. Directly with the government of Pakistan, not with the government of Kashmir. Then after like couple of months, they broke the contract. We asked them like just just just go with the contract, just go with the negotiation then like it took us maybe nine months. We we we we arranged we started arranging protest and then on 5th of June, they attacked our leadership, one of the core member Umair Naseer Kashmiri. They shot him and his driver was dead as well. He got shot in here it was it was God plan he was saved and then like after that obviously anger everything all over Kashmir all over Pakistan. We arrange big protest in London. It was fourth one like hundreds of thousands of people joined us till now because every protest was like in thousands. >> Mhm. >> So right now till last two days, I think I can say like more than 50 people died even children. I can show you picture videos of children died. Forces beating people because they don't want to they don't want us to win. >> Mhm. >> At the end of the day just because the work we are doing joint joint Awami Action Committee is basically working as a opposition. >> Mhm. >> There is no opposition in Kashmir or Pakistan right now. They all the parties they're ruling together. Because they don't have majority. So they have to come together lead together is major party. Imagine what kind of democracy is there if if you don't have any opposition. So that's the main root where problem start. If you if you have a good opposition strong opposition, maybe these revolutionary parties they will not get a chance. But if you don't have opposition obviously there will be third party coming because people they want to express and at the end of the day people got the power not the mafia not the establishment is the people common people. I think that's your idea as well revolution is common people that they got the power. So when they come outside they when they come on the road it's difficult to control. >> Mhm. Can you tell us a bit about how this movement has has been developing right like what kind of tactics what kind of methods have have the people been using and yeah and the role of the Awami Action Committees? >> Actually you know that Pakistan army is very strong army. It's basically they got like a lot of force in Kashmir right now. Our plan is just to be peaceful as peaceful as we can because they trying to like they trying us to to fight them fight them back because if they they they they shooting us, they want us to react. We don't want to react. We want to stay peaceful. We are fighting for basic rights like you explain water, electricity, stuff like this. Basic needs. It's just fight for basic rights. So, I think world can world can understand it. Basic right. Everybody need it. Everybody deserves it. And and one thing I would say is the Pakistani army whatever they doing is is is against humanity. Is against the every law every law in this country because imagine 2 months you your family you you can't contact. A lot of students in London, a lot of students in New York. They can't video call their family. I'm one of them. I can't video call my family since 5th of June. My mother is there. Literally my mother is in the city very right very city. So, I can't call her. I can just audio call her maybe like his audio call is uh I think what what what is is limited to 50 second 55 second. After 55 second it will just cut off. So, imagine the situation. It's like kind of you know prison. Right now Kashmir Pakistan Kashmir is kind of prison for us. No food, no internet. Uh and most of the time no electricity. If they want to cut electricity, they want to do any kind of operation, they will just cut electricity at night and then they because I told you protest they've been sitting there months. >> Mhm. >> They want to disperse them. They want to disperse them. So, they mostly in like maybe it's 2:00 p.m. in at night. They will come with a great force. They will try to attack disperse people but I will I will love to I will love and I will I will Uh, I will say that our people Kashmiri people, they they they will they will be part of this great revolution. >> Uh, yeah, how do you feel about the international movement that's that's coming up in solidarity with Kashmir? And what is happening in other countries? >> Actually, I'm I would say like international media, most of the international media it is quite by the students. The student like you, everywhere in the student, everywhere in the world students, they they they coming together and that's the main thing I think we we should work all together. Revolution Communist Party is working for this common cause as well. So, at the end of the day I would say the media is censored media all over the world. In Pakistan, India, even here I would say in Great Britain media is censored. So, they're not telling true face. We we students, we need to come together and we need to make a strong social media cell. So, we we we can we can show the world our narrative, our cell. We don't need media. We don't need this kind of mafias media or this this international established media. We should be our voice, our cell. Students should be making media cells, make lobbying in politics everywhere. So, they they can tell the world true face, true news, everything. Like with purity, not not with the mafias intention. >> In India, what we saw last week is something of a more generalized process within with this satirical cockroach Janata Party emblematized in this cockroach behind me. And you know, it's it's it's similar to what we've seen in the other Gen Z revolution, you know, in Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, and unlike in Kashmir, it's very widely reported cuz it's all on Instagram. It's all on Instagram. And it's very easy to follow. And I'm sure there's a lot of you who are terminally online who would probably like have been following this very easily. And yeah, the the chief India's Chief Justice Minister called the nation's youth cockroaches. You know, he says that these people are lazy, unemployed, you know, it shows the morals of you know, the Indian state and how they view view their own people. And their website is full of AI images. This is actually based off of AI image. You know, and you know, there's been so much creativity in this movement that emerged last week, you know, TikTok reels of get ready with me to fight the Mumbai police to you know, and I think a graphic illustration of what it what it was like this carnival like atmosphere is this young white like a young person from from London he just was on holiday in in in Delhi and yeah, he just lands in there and he says in in this viral video that he just spoke to loads of students who are just fighting for their education against this corrupt government. He goes on to say after listening to so many people about their stories Modi is [ __ ] everyone up. Everything should be fixed in this country. The censorship in the media is wrong. [ __ ] Modi and then they all all these Indians around just like celebrate like they scored a goal in the World Cup. They just like it's this carnival like atmosphere and yeah, you know, this also in this carnival like atmosphere reflects that this is very early in in in the in in the in the stage of of whether of of where the stage of struggle is and it also is also a product also of the composition of the people who are coming out. You know, for example, the image of the the Gen Z movement in India is actually this this woman who's putting her hand up against police van who are with people being detained. Her name is Riya Iyer, I believe. And yeah, she's a model and she's a daughter of a army general. You know, and all you know, all the key leaders of the BJP, they all went to prestigious universities in the West. And the fact that these people, you know, relatively better off layers are protesting shows how bad the situation is. You know, graduates have an unemployment rate which is nine times higher than those who are illiterate. Tens of millions of educated Indians who are promised this great life, you know, Achhe Din, great days, you know, India's going to be this great power on the world, you know, they they have realized that is not the reality of my life. It's a horrible life. It's a miserable life. And that is why the NEET medical examination entrance exam has led to so many suicides and has touched so many people because the system is is is full of nepotism. It's corrupt and there are so few good jobs that it is, you know, people would rather kill themselves than live in in in in this in this in this India. So, the context for the protest is is the which is really important is that India, there is just so much censorship, you know. And behind Modi, you know, there stands, you know, the all all of all of the big media, the thugs of the RSS, and also, yeah, like if you if you smear if you say anything against the government, you're called anti-national. And that pressure is has built over over over over decades. And last, yeah, but last last Saturday, you know, the fact that this strongman who who likes to appear who really wants to appear as like I am the strongman, nothing nothing stands against me, was absolutely terrified and it led to the yeah, the main demand of the movement, which was the resignation of the Remainder Burden, is extremely significant because he's only the second ever minister to resign in in the last 12 years. And Yeah, and the movement brought out so many young people who never been to a protest before, who are you know, expressing their anger for the for the for the first time and it had lit the whole country, you know, like the whole country was talking about politics, even the Bollywood stars were even talking about politics. Imran Khan, not the Pakistani one, the actor in Bollywood was even I think joined it and you know, the BJP they were terrified and it was exemplified in these dramatic videos that Narendra Modi posted on Instagram a very two you could see the the panic in his eyes and he said like he says, "Look, I'm doing something about it. We're listening. We're listening to your feedback, you know, like and he was terrified and these these videos actually I've got like 400 million views one of them and like all full of comments like "Pack your bags, we hate you. Out." You know, like you know, there's such anger, you know, really backfired and and there was a pure you know, there was just this euphoria that happened at the again like on Saturday, you know, it was it was exciting. Even I was just like, "Yes, like he's resigned." You know, like it was incredible feeling. He is a disgusting man. He's an RSS ideologue. He was someone who let out these people who these thugs who killed Bilkis Bano's family and raped her in the 2002 Gujarat pogroms. And students have been arrested and there's been mass repression not mass repression I should say repression of the hardest layers are going on is since since Saturday. And there's videos now going around you know trying to say like oh this was all a movement by Pakistan by Bangladesh you know with this foreign interference my my uncle sent me one of one of these videos you know so like you know the there are IT cells which are like BJP IT cells sending sending this and you know this was so clearly calling off the protest was a mistake. Clearly stopping at one minister was a mistake. But the BJP are now having pressure put on them to restart protest and they have said explicitly we will restart protest if this continues. So it's a very fluid situation but again shows once again how important leadership is in in in the decisive decisive moment. But I want to end with something positive which is to introduce our next speaker. Sorry to take take some of your your notes but yeah like you know Farid yesterday not yesterday on Sunday gave there was a solidarity movement protest in Trafalgar Square and he gave the best speech out of everyone. He gave a better speech than Greta Thunberg by far and he told me on the phone he told me on the phone that you know initially I was going to write this sort of in the third person like you know we support you and stuff. But But said like no look, I'm a Malaysian student who, you know, came came to to Britain and like, you know, I'm like like these people out in India, you know, is you know, fighting, yeah, for for for decent standard of living, you know, I hate all this corruption, you know, and when he said he spoke, he felt part of the revolution itself. And Tamasso told me as well, you know, when he was part of this million man march outside the Pakistani embassy, he said, "I I felt like I was in the revolution myself. I felt like I was in Kashmir, you know." And this is this is really important because this isn't some abstract thing happening 4,000 miles away, you know, we are a part of this. Our comrades are both in India and in Pakistan are a part of this. We are we are internationalists first and foremost. And yeah, onward to victory in Kashmir. Take power in in India, you know, no retreat until Modi falls. No retreat until this rotten system is all thrown is thrown away. And yeah, let the people of South Asia set the WORLD ALIGHT. >> [applause and cheering] [applause] >> INDIA WAS NOT THE first of the Gen Z revolutions that broke out in recent years. And Kashmir is not alone in what some people call the Asian Spring of the revolutions that have spread out in the past few years. Over recent years, we've seen in Sri Lanka the masses overthrow the hated family or dynasty of the Rajapaksa's in 2022. In Bangladesh with the downfall of the Sheikh Hasina regime in 2024. Indonesia with the movement to abolish parliament in 2025. And Nepal where they overthrew the whole regime in 2025 within a few weeks. And it's not a coincidence that these countries were the ones who moved first on the path towards revolution because if you look at them, these are countries with extreme inequality and extreme impoverishment. Um and had their wealth siphoned off by Western imperialism for decades if not a century or more. For example, in East Timor in which the revolution of Indonesia spread to after uh September 2025, nearly half the population lived below the poverty line. Think about that. Half the population below the poverty line. In India, 200 million people of young age are unemployed. 200 million people. In Nepal, youth unemployment was similar at 20%. In Sri Lanka, food inflation in 2022 was 100% and has worsened by the IMF required um austerity measures that the government had to carry out. And I should mention that these are also countries with brutal and corrupt dictatorships whose elites live in luxury and opulence. In all these revolutions, it was actually provoked by the ruling class who thought that they could do anything they wanted and they basically triggered the revolutions themselves, whether that be through social media ban in Nepal, by raising the allowance for housing for parliamentarians in Indonesia, or by calling young people who are who are trying to find a future for themselves cockroaches and parasites of society. The ruling class brought these upon themselves. Pride comes before the fall as they say. >> [snorts] >> And I want to speak on a number of these lessons from these movements and what it can teach us about revolutions in in the revolutions in India, Kashmir, and revolutions in general. Now, of course, the main features of these revolutions is that uh with the exception of Kashmir, uh many of these revolutions began from the youth. And how could they not begin from the youth? Because the youth are the people who grew up in these uh impoverished conditions, live knowing nothing except this inequality and corruption. Um and they have they have nothing to gain by staying in the system and have everything to lose by continuing the status quo. And so these are the people who are unburdened by the defeats of the past as well and are the first to move into revolution. But the point that I want to make, and this is a very big takeaway from the Gen Z revolutions, is that the reason that these movements succeeded in many cases to tear down the old regimes is because they were not confined to the youth. Whereas they began with the young people, they spread to the widest layers of society. In Bangladesh, it started with the youth, but then the actual student committees, the um anti-discrimination student movement basically launched an appeal to the whole population of Bangladesh. It was not just a vague appeal to the people of the country to join the struggle, but I actually came out with a public non-cooperation campaign. And here are some of the demands that they put in that program. One, the non-payment of taxes or bills, electricity and water included. Employees should not attend the offices, government offices should remain closed. Overseas workers should not send money back home to their families through Bangladeshi channels. Garment workers should not work and let the factory stay closed. And that is a very important one, because the garment industry, of course, is a very big industry in Bangladesh. >> [snorts] >> What did they essentially call for? They called for a nationwide general strike without actually kind of using the words. And to tell you what, the whole economy was paralyzed because a lot of people observed this non-cooperation campaign. And that's the strength of the working class, I should say. It's why the why Marxism and Marxists place so much emphasis upon the working class and why we call them the revolutionary class. It's because of the leverage that they have over the economy essentially and that they can um uh tear down uh paralyze the economy uh by their own uh by work stoppages. And basically the whole state apparatus was overwhelmed. The police fled the scene. The local government fled the scene. No one was willing to stay and defend the regime. >> [snorts] >> And that was the end. That was the end of the Sheikh Hasina government. Um and that was what they achieved in Bangladesh. And that was by appealing to the working class and not confining the movement to the youth. And I wanted to point out a negative case as well. Out of all the examples that I pointed out, Indonesia stands out because it was the only one that did not actually overthrow the government. And why is that? Um because if you looked at um the if you follow uh its development on social media and stuff like this, um it was a very powerful movement. You know, it wasn't just uh students out on the streets fighting the police uh with their water cannons and tear gas. It was also uh older people as well. You might have seen that um older lady in the pink hijab throwing her slipper at the police. That was a pretty viral reel at the time. So, these people were coming out. But ultimately, the students did remain isolated from the working class. The working class was kind of uh nowhere to be seen. And by that, I mean not not the people themselves, but that their methods of struggle and the organized working class themselves. Where were the trade unions and the labor party in Indonesia, which is quite big? What did they say about the movement? At best, they probably uttered a few words of support, but they never called for any sort of general strike or anything to help the students in there. And because they were isolated uh and and after the chaos of the street battles for several weeks, ended just like that. Um the student unions basically have nothing else to do afterwards. They were they called off their protests and many of their individual rallies were then taken out one by one by the police. It's because they lack the support from the wider society. Um so the blame lies squarely with the leadership of the working class in Indonesia, not the working class themselves who had a lot of Let me tell you this, the working class in Indonesia have no love for President Prabowo Subianto. But it's the problem is that the leadership held them back from actually helping this movement. Um but it didn't need to have been that way if the student unions, the All Indonesia Student Union, had waged a national campaign to agitate the workers to come out on strike against the parliament, then President Prabowo would have crumbled instantly. I don't think they could have done anything against the strike involving 150 million workers in Indonesia, which is one of the biggest countries in the world, by the way. Um but alas, that did not happen and the movement has been defeated for the time being, but there has been a sudden revival in recent months. But I think that's one of the biggest lessons from the Gen Z revolutions. It's the fact that the youth cannot be isolated. How do we apply this lesson then to India in which this movement is still raging? Now, Robbie talked about how the education minister, Dharmendra Pradhan, did resign, which was a big victory and that we should congratulate the students for that. >> [snorts] >> But we have to understand why that happened. It wasn't just the movement of the students, which was very, very powerful, but it's also the fact that the farmers were already beginning to enter the struggle. They have They didn't formally enter the struggle just yet, but because the ruling class of India saw the danger of what happened in Bangladesh and Nepal in India with with the sympathies of the farmers becoming a lot closer to the movement. Because actually the farmers union, which is very large, they actually said that they were going to join the encampment at Jantar Mantar on Monday before it was called off. So, they were already going to do that. And that was a very, very positive development that the farmers were going to join. Um, so that was a big reason why the Indian ruling class had to step back and concede this change of face at the top because they saw the alarm bells ringing for them. And as Ravi said, we should be clear that calling off the encampment at Jantar Mantar was a mistake. Um, the protests were the only leverage the students had against the state. And we saw this proven in the negative sense again in Indonesia because as soon as they withdraw withdrew their rallies and their protests, that's when the police repression came back in. That's when people started investigate the police started investigating students, harassing them, abducting them, and so on. And we're already seeing even on Sunday, the day after the the education minister resigned, the protest that was still ongoing in Kolkata and Chennai and in other cities, um, the police actually did arrest many students um, even though the BJP explicitly said that they would not they would not do such any such thing. Uh, some authority among the youth now, especially because they actually their their actions actually led to a concession from the Modi government, which Ravi said was very significant. Um, yes. Um, and it also has some authority among the older layers as well who's who's seeing, you know, one of the biggest movements in India for a long time. Uh, like I said, it already has the sympathy of the Indian farmers union, uh, who is a very powerful force in India, by the way, because they led a powerful movement in 2020 and 2021 that led to some concessions from the government. And this is a powerful ally that needs to be drawn closer. And uh, it should be said that there was a general strike this year and last year. Uh, the the reason why it was called to begin with was because there are genuine grievances by the working class against the Modi government. Um, the the introduction of the of the new labor codes, privatization of many companies in India, um, and so on, which, you know, there is a lot of shared class interest here among the farmers, the workers, and the students. So, there is fuel here among the masses against the Modi government. But, what is needed is for the for the student movement to do as the Bangladeshis did, which is to link up consciously with the workers and farmers, and bring them into the fold with their methods of struggle. And that's how you bring down the Indian state. Um, and we should also learn from the shortcomings of these movements as well. Because in many of these movements, it's almost inevitable. Every revolution begins with sort of like a phase of naivety almost in which you sort of like put some trust in the state. That maybe the negotiations, something can come off it basically. In Bangladesh, when they overthrew the Sheikh Sheikh Hasina regime, the students were willing to hear out the generals, you know, maybe we can get some arrangement here with this new government and maybe, you know, accept some positions within the new government, which is what they did. And the CJP, the reason they called off the protest on Monday is to have, you know, as as a gesture of good faith to the government so that we can maybe hear them out. Um, but the thing is, the state does not negotiate in good faith. And this is something that we have to understand. Um, because, you know, only under heavy pressure do they concede something, but even then, only in words and not in practice. Because the state is not something that can be made accountable to the people, as some liberals might say. The state is the organized expression of the ruling class. And I'm not just talking about the BJP and Modi or the military in Pakistan. I'm talking about the people who actually run society, right? Uh, The the the billionaires, the so-called billionaire raj in India, the wealthy tycoons, the landlords, the people who own these big corporations. These are the people who actually run society and have their representatives in the state machine, and that's who the state really represents. And for that reason, I think that has been the Achilles' heel of many of these revolutions in the Gen-Z wave. Uh because I think a lot of the student leaderships at the time thought that the state, you know, is the the the the organ by which many of their demands could be achieved. Uh but it's no such thing. It represents a layer of society whose interests are completely antagonistic to ordinary people. Because as some of us in the movement might think that this is a struggle for certain education reforms, the ruling class doesn't see it that way. The ruling class sees this as a struggle to keep themselves in power. They are very class conscious in that way. Uh and we should see it the same way they do. And that is fundamentally why the revolutions in Nepal and Bangladesh didn't solve anything for ordinary people. Because you've changed the faces at the top, but you haven't actually solved any of the economic woes that was the reason for these protests to begin with. In Bangladesh, much of the economy is owned by these foreign multinationals, your Zaras, Nikes, uh Apples. These are the people who have been siphoning the wealth from the country for decades. And we have to ask the same question for India. What does it mean for Modi to step down even if the movement takes up this this demand? What does it mean to have a fair education system? Would these by themselves um give a livable future for the Indian people? I would say that's not enough. The wealth of India would still remain in the hands of these tycoons even with Modi gone because you haven't changed the economic system. And I wanted to say something about Kashmir as well. One of the demands of the JAAC is for cheap or free electricity. What would it take to have cheap or free electricity in Azad Jammu and Kashmir? The Mangla hydroelectric dam, which is responsible for producing 15% of electricity in Pakistan and also a large part in AJK, uh who owns that? Islamabad, the Pakistani government. They would never relinquish it because of the importance of that to Pakistan itself and also because it is a a lever for them to maintain control over AJK. And that that is why like the the government in AJK is fundamentally literally impossible for them to give this demand to concede this demand to the people. And so for that to be achieved, the workers and people of Kashmir would have to seize the dam for themselves. That is the only way you can achieve even one of these demands. And we would say therefore that in India and Kashmir it's the same point. Um that there cannot be a compromise or halfway solution between the movement and the state. Either you dissolve the old state as we'll be was saying and seize power or the moment will be lost and nothing will be resolved. There is no middle ground with this. And taking power is only a means to an end of course. What is really necessary is to take over the industry and land um in some of the biggest countries in the world and actually take over the commanding heights of the economy um the the the the factories, the land and actually plan it for the usage of ordinary people. Uh India has 1.5 billion people with some of the most educated workers in the world. This is a country that can achieve light-years of advance if only the wealth is in the hands of the working class. And that's what a socialist revolution means basically. And for the struggle to succeed, it must be brought all the way not only to the fall of the regimes in Pakistan and and the Modi government, but be brought all the way um to the abolition of capitalism. Um and I'm running out of time now, but uh I want to say one final point. The common thread running through all this, the reason why these movements uh in many cases were unable to spread the movement beyond the youth or have any illusions in the negotiations with the state and the incompleteness of these past revolutions is down to not having a revolutionary leadership. And the point of such a leadership is to learn from history and apply these lessons to critical junctures in the movement. Because as Ravi was saying, the BJP realized that this was a mistake to call of the the the protest at Jantar Mantar. Um but the point is that we've already seen this many times in just recent years. Um if there had been um a conscious study of the lessons of history, this groping in the dark phase would have been skipped entirely. Um but that's the point, right? You can't really build such a party educated in these lessons right in the heat of revolution. It needs to be prepared much in advance because in revolutions you don't really have that much time or freedom to make mistakes freely. Because in many cases, especially in Kashmir I would say, any mistake right now would result in brutal uh counterattacks by the state. Um and uh of course that that is what we are doing at the Revolutionary Communist Party as part of the Revolutionary Communist International. Because I think studying the lessons of history and knowing what needs to be done uh for the movement in India or or the movement in Kashmir is one thing. Getting these ideas out to two people, millions of people or billions of people in the case of India is a completely different story. For that, you need a party. Um that requires building a party of dedicated communists trained in the ideas of Marxism and can connect that with the drivings of the masses. In Pakistan right now, we do have a section uh called the Inqalabi Communist Party uh of less than a thousand comrades in a nation of two uh 200 million people. And in AJK, we have an even smaller presence. Uh they're doing exceptional work, of course, but compared with the magnitude of the stuff that we need to achieve, we are far too small in Pakistan and internationally, I would say. And I'll just say say this. We of course in London, we are not in any of these places, but we have potential impact for many of these movements and we have had impact in these movements. Because of London's history and population, pretty much every movement in the world has some sort of expression in this country. Sorry, in this city. Whether that be the Kurds, the the Palestinians, the Iranians, the Pakistanis, the Indians, the Kashmiris and so on. It has some sort of expression in this very city, not too far from where we are. The ideas that we raise in these movements in London can reach back to to these countries. But imagine if we had a much bigger party to act as a bastion for the revolutionary youth and masses across the world right now. >> [snorts] >> I think that should tell us how important it is to build the revolutionary communist party in London, in Britain, and internationally.