FOI Fest lightning talk: Carole Ewart, Campaign for Freedom of Information in Scotland

Duration: 7:26 1347 transcript words EN summary

Video summary

Carole Ewart from the Campaign for Freedom of Information in Scotland opens her lightning talk by clarifying the organization's distinct status as a Scottish charitable incorporated entity, separate from UK-wide campaigns. She highlights a crucial structural difference within the legal system: unlike other parts of the United Kingdom where appeals can be delayed through the Upper Tribunal, Scotland allows direct appeals to the Court of Session only on points of law. Ewart argues that this streamlined process prevents tactical delays and ultimately fosters healthier decision-making practices across public authorities by encouraging quicker resolutions without unnecessary postponements. The core of her presentation focuses on supporting requestors who often face significant barriers due to the closure of local council offices under a "digital first" policy, which has made informal verbal requests much less accessible. Ewart shares that many citizens are initially shocked when they discover how straightforward making an FOI request actually is, dispelling myths about its complexity and challenging their preconceived notions that public bodies will withhold information. She also addresses the tension between practitioners who may write poor requests due to a lack of training versus authorities who sometimes refuse valid claims because colleagues fail to admit what documents exist within their own organizations. Beyond individual cases, Ewart discusses FOI as a strategic campaigning tool used by NGOs and journalists, though she notes that funding bodies often discourage such inquiries to protect relationships with public sector entities. A major concern raised is the impact of copyright notices on published responses; these warnings can intimidate ordinary citizens into fearing they cannot share information within their communities or action groups, thereby undermining transparency efforts despite the data being legally available for publication. She concludes by advocating for an agile legal framework that accommodates modern communication methods, such as recording requests via social media to assist individuals with impairments like dyslexia, ensuring the system evolves alongside societal needs rather than remaining rigid and outdated.

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Welcome to FOI Fest 2026. >> Okay, so it's good to to talk to you all today. I'm conscious that people want to get to the pub, so I have 5 minutes to be short [music] and snappy. And my lightning talk um is sort of three parts. First of all, the work that the Campaign for Freedom [music] of Information does with requestors. And obviously, because we've got small resources, that's not a huge proportion. >> [music] >> Um as a campaigning organization, we use FOI, of course. And but also as a strategic operation in public policy. Um I'm just going to sort of have a few reflections on that. And but first of all, I just want to be clear that the Campaign for Freedom of Information in Scotland is separate from um the other campaign. Um we used to be a a Scottish committee. And in 2019, we were allowed to go on our own. And we are a Scottish charitable incorporated organization. So I know she referred to earlier as a UK campaign, but it's just to clear that slot. I think it's important to um understand that one of the significant differences in Scotland is the fact that the Upper Tier Tribunal does not operate in Scotland unless, of course, it's using the UT Act. And I do think that that ultimately changes practice and decisions um throughout the system because you can only appeal to the Court of Session on a point of law. And so you don't have that postponing tactic. Um and I do think that's that's really healthy. Um in terms of the requestors that we work with, we've heard really sophisticated approaches to FOI um being prompted by um curious journalists or practitioners. Quite often, um people that we deal with in living communities, it's issues of local concern. And we have noticed a difference in the last 21 years since FOISA has been operational because at that time, there were lots more local offices and sensing things from council services to housing and they have gradually closed down because of the digital first approach. So, they are less acceptable. And of course, you only make an FOI request if it's recordable and people want to go into the local offices and just verbalize, ask the ask for the information. And it's amazing how it can be really beneficial because you go in and you speak very nicely to somebody and they then enthusiastically give you the information you're looking for there and then and you don't actually have to be there a very long time. And we also work with people who do decide as local offices have shut down, they do want to make an FOI request and they realize that they think it was they believe it is very complex. And recently we we did some work with a group of people who were really quite shocked that it was so simple. And they are also were shocked that they got the information that they requested because they actually started off from a point of view that we're not going to get it and that just confirms our suspicion about this public authority. So, um one of the contributors said earlier that you don't really make an FOI request unless you know something about the subject matter. And sometimes we work with requestors who actually know the answer, but what they want to do is have proof because the information is not in the public domain. And recently we've had a couple of examples whereby people are actually holding the document, they've requested the information and it's been told they've been advised that it's not held. It's holding the document. So, if if what do they do then? Do they expose a whistleblower? Um or or what do they do? So, that's an interesting one to navigate. One of the other issues that we find out with requestors is that FOI practitioners very often complain that people write very very bad FOI requests, but we do point out that they've not had the same training that FOI practitioners have had. So, um you know, give them a break, please. No. >> [laughter] >> There's also the other side and problem with FOI practitioners not actually knowing what they hold. And we're very aware that they are dependent on colleagues knowing what they hold or being prepared to admit what they hold. And and that's one of the reasons why we are very supportive in in terms of the Freedom of Information Reform Scotland bill that FOI practitioners be put on a formal footing to give them authority within their organization to uh require their colleagues to produce what they know and so it can be considered for disclosure. And in terms of a campaigning tool, I said earlier that one of the issues we're very concerned about is the fact the engine was allowed to use FOI. And uh sometimes we have to make the FOI request for some NGOs who do not want to spoil the relationship with the funding body. And because it's seen as aggressive or confrontational. And sometimes we have to frame the FOI request quite differently because if we've framed it because of what they know, then the recipient authority would know that it was them that was asking. [laughter] I mean, it gets so complicated sometimes. And so sometimes you have to convey the themed uh a degree of um ignorance in order to get the FOI right. I would also say that in terms of a a campaigning tool, um FOI has been hugely beneficial in improving public trust. Um and that, of course, depends on the information being published. And we're very conscious and and with the Commissioner's office has done some work about this in the past and that a matter of concern is when people get FOI responses back and I don't know if you've been in this position, um it's got copyright statements at the end about not sharing. Um and that the organization that had shared it they retain copyright. Now, to the layperson, that's quite a startling warning. Um and that's something therefore they worry about. Can I share it with the community council? Can I share it with the action group? Can I had with my relatives. Um and there is a drive towards plain English, but you know, they might reveal the information, but people may be scared to share it. And so, I could go on for quite a while, um but I won't. Um I would just say that somebody had talked earlier about social media and making an FOI request. One of the issues that we've been persuaded about recently is um people recording an information request and submitting it. Um particularly people who have um an impairment. Um it's people who um perhaps have a dyslexia or whatever, and it's easier for them to do so. And also for some dumb people, it's a much easier way to communicate. Um and it's going to be [music] interesting to see how those requests um are dealt with. So, one of the things about um FOI requests um is that it's [music] got to be an agile system, and that's why we want to change the law, because it's got to be adapted to the environment we're working to. So, thank you. >> Hello to our most completest [music] listeners. If you're still listening, thank you so much for sticking with this right to the end. I'm Miff from MySociety, [music] and it's my job to put these podcasts together. And you know what? It would be really helpful for us to know a bit more about how and why [music] you are listening to them. So, if you have a moment, please do take a look at the show notes, where you'll find a link to a very short survey. It would help [music] us so much if you could fill that in. Thank you.