First Minister's Questions (Party Leaders) (BSL) - 25 June 2026

Thank you very much colleagues. That concludes general questions for today. The next item of business is First Minister's questions for party leaders. And of course it's slightly different this week because question one is for Alex Cole-Hamilton. I now call Alex Cole-Hamilton. >> Thank you very much indeed presiding officer. Presiding officer, I'm sure everyone in this chamber will join me in expressing solidarity with Scotland's Muslim community after the brutal and unprovoked attacks on the streets of Edinburgh last weekend. That community's response to those attacks has not been one of violence or revenge. It has been a plea for tolerance and for understanding. And in a society where that feels increasingly rare, we would all do well to listen to them. Presiding officer, new figures show that violent crime is up by 4,000 incidents last year. Crimes of dishonesty were up by 7,000. Of course one of those has dominated the front pages this week. But while everyone is focused on Scotland's prison population growing by one in recent days, I want to ask about those leaving our jails. All told, over 1,400 inmates have been let out since the early release scheme began. Because our prisons are bursting at the seams. But this isn't a strategy, nor will it protect the public. So can I ask the First Minister, how many of those who were released early went on to reoffend? And how many of them are already back behind bars? >> First Minister. >> So also first of all, can I associate myself unreservedly with the comments that Mr. Cole-Hamilton made about the feelings in the Muslim community. On Monday I visited the Broomhouse Mosque along with Sumita Kumar and the Annandale Street Mosque in Edinburgh with Ben Macpherson. And of course the Broomhouse Mosque is twinned with the Blackhall Mosque which I think is probably in Mr. Cole-Hamilton's constituency if not it is very close by. Um the uh and the feeling of unease is palpable in the community and as I indicated in my answers on Tuesday, uh I met young men who were the victims of the attacks last Friday and my heart goes out to them for the trauma and the physical injury that they have suffered and I reiterate my absolute wholehearted commitment to give the leadership in Scotland to ensure that we live in a tolerant and inclusive country at all times. In relation to the prison population, as Parliament is aware uh because the government has been very transparent with Parliament over the course of the last 2 and 1/2 years, the prison population has been rising significantly. The government has taken forward with parliamentary consent measures which have um resulted in the early release of certain prisoners although there are significant exemptions in place. And the Justice Secretary will lead a debate on the prison population and our strategy in response to the sentencing um the penal commission's report that we received before the election uh later on this afternoon. Uh I don't have the details about reoffending in front of me but I'm happy to write to Mr. Cole-Hamilton on that point. >> Alex Cole-Hamilton. >> I I'm grateful for that reply. We can be sure it isn't zero and for as long as we don't have a proper strategy around prison capacity, around rehabilitation and around clearing down the courts backlog uh and then early release will be a revolving door with people going in and out and back into our prisons. Our justice system, Presiding Officer, is in crisis. So we need that strategy and Lib Dems will of course play our part in that. But we also need to use the tools that we have right now. Presiding Officer, sexual crime is the highest it's been since 1971. Rape Crisis describes that as shameful and sharp. And many of those assaults will have been committed by a partner. Yet, the domestic abuse protections that this Parliament agreed to 5 years ago are still not in place. So, can I ask the First Minister, when will his government stop dragging its feet, act on the will of this Parliament, and restore the public's faith in our broken justice system? >> First Minister. >> Presiding Officer, I'm I'm I'm advised that the figures on return to custody, which is not quite the same point that Mr. Cole-Hamilton is putting to me, um is in the first tranche of the prisoner release scheme, 13%, and in the second tranche, 5%. But, I will furnish him with more details on this question. I share his concern about the reporting and the pursuit of sexual crime uh because no woman should be subjected to the uh to to to sexual crimes and to domestic violence, and the government has in place, and we've passed legislation to address these issues. There has, of course, been a very significant increase in reporting of sexual crime and domestic violence, and very substantial increases in prosecution. That's why the prison population uh that is one of the factors why the prison population is so high. So, although not all of the measures that have been passed by Parliament have been commenced, I don't think it's a fair characterization to say the government has been dragging its heels. But, I assure Mr. Cole-Hamilton that the government is entirely focused on making sure that women and girls are protected in our society, and that we have, as the uh the [snorts] the the recently retired Lord Advocate demonstrated, a very, very front-footed approach to ensuring the pursuit of sexual crime, and that will always be the case in this government. >> Russell Findlay >> Thank you. I begin by congratulating Douglas Lumsden on his election as MP for Aberdeen South and welcoming our new MSP colleague James Adams to Holyrood today. Also here today are former members of the SNP's Audit and Finance Committee. At the height of Peter Murrell's crime spree, Allison Graham and Cynthia Guthrie raised concerns. Nicola Sturgeon ordered them to be quiet. John Swinney assured them there was no problem. The new Victims Minister tried to bully these whistleblowers into silence and they back an inquiry because their testimony proves beyond any doubt that John Swinney and others enabled Peter Murrell's crimes. So, will he apologize to them for his central role in this SNP scandal? >> First Minister >> Presiding Officer, first of all, can I congratulate Douglas Lumsden on his election to the House of Commons? It will be a a very exciting moment for Mr. Lumsden and I wish him well in the arduous responsibilities, particularly in the tabling of written parliamentary questions. And can I Can Can I Can I extend a warm welcome to James Adams and express my apologies that I was not here as I should have been for his swearing in, but I was detained on other government business. But, I wish Mr. Adams a warm welcome to Parliament and I wish him well in his parliamentary engagement on behalf of the people of the northeast of Scotland. Now, Presiding Officer, I have apologized to members of the Scottish National Party for the events that have affected the party's finances and I reiterate that apology today. But, the comments that Russell Findlay makes about me are baseless, utterly and totally baseless. But we've become accustomed to that from Russell Findlay. >> Right. Russell Findlay. >> So, as expected, no apology to the whistleblowers. The truth is Peter Murrell should never have been free to commit these crimes. Members of the SNP Finance and Audit Committee blew the whistle. But they were bullied into quitting after being refused access to basic information. John Swinney twice went onto the BBC to say that his party's finances were completely sound. He was at the heart of the cover-up then and now. And that's why he's terrified of an inquiry because John Swinney, the king of the SNP cover-up, is desperate to cover his own back. Isn't that the simple truth? >> First Minister. >> Mr. Russell Findlay has gone on about the need for an inquiry into all these issues. This must be the first time in living memory that Russell Findlay who's championed the interests of victims wants an inquiry into the victim of this particular case. Now, I would I would simply say to Mr. Findlay to give him a reassurance about the issues about which he's concerned that I've addressed the issues in the SNP's finances and the SNP has got strong governance in place. But I think Russell Findlay I think Russell Findlay should pay slightly more attention to some of the things that have been said about him. Because in the newspapers this morning, a much respected a much respected >> Excuse me, I want to hear the answer to Mr. Findlay's question. >> Uh much respected former Conservative MSP Edward Mountain described Russell Findlay as a disaster. His leadership has been catastrophic. As we have just seen, he called out Russell Findlay's >> Can we allow the First Minister to answer, please? Quiet and down. >> He called out Russell Findlay's robotic delivery and lack of empathy. He thought that Mr. Findlay would consign the party to the wilderness. Well, on the basis of the Scottish parliamentary elections, Mr. Findlay is well on the road to the wilderness of Scotland. >> Sorry. Can we allow the allow the next party leader to to ask a question? Thank you. Gillian Mackay. >> Since we last raised the issue of hyper hyper scale data centers with the First Minister last week, over 6,000 people have written to him to back a to back the Scottish Greens call for a moratorium. Hundreds of those people gathered outside Parliament yesterday to make their voices heard. Communities are rightly worried about the local environmental impacts and the massive strain on our energy system these applications could bring. And now Antonio Guterres, secretary secretary general of the United Nations, has joined the call saying that AI data centers are hungry for land, water, and power and calling for every major AI company to publicly disclose the full environmental environmental impact of its systems. Will the First Minister stand with communities across Scotland and the head of the UN in taking on big tech, or will he continue to allow a free for all on hyper scale data centers? >> First Minister. >> [applause] >> Presiding Officer, as I as I said last week, I understand the concerns that have been raised here about the environmental impact and the impact on energy resources that are emerging from the proliferation of applications for hyperscale data centers. So, I totally understand that concern and I made that point clear last week. Now, I've been reflecting on the exchanges last week and looked further at this issue. And I'm giving active consideration to whether the Scottish Government should provide planning guidance to balance the rapid expansion of hyperscale data centers with national energy and climate goals, which are vital to our future prosperity. >> Gillian Mackay. I'm pleased to hear that the First Minister is considering that cuz councils themselves are saying they don't have the necessary guidance to decide on these mega plans. Fife Council has confirmed the Scottish the Scottish Government is looking at whether an environmental impact assessment is needed for the Octo Tool application because it's not clear enough from existing guidance. That comes on top of Edinburgh councillors saying they can't make a decision on local applications until the Scottish Government comes up with what a definition of what exactly a green data center is. If the First Minister is considering this pause, what timescale are we going to see it on to make sure that we can take this overview of these applications? >> First Minister, the >> The first thing I have to say is that I I have to compartmentalize my comments and not comment on the Octo Tool application because it's a live application. But on the general policy questions, I appreciate the urgency of this question because there are a number of applications that are now being considered by planning authorities and my view is that with the concerns being expressed by planning authorities, the government has to be responsive to that. And as I rehearsed last week with Mr. Greer, there is a careful balance that has to be struck between the extent and specificity of national guidance and the discretion available for local decision-making. Now, if the balance of that is not correct in this issue, then obviously that has to be examined by the government, but I give a commitment to Gillian Mackay that that will be undertaken as a matter of priority by the government, and it obviously planning authorities will hear what I'm saying in Parliament today and will be able to reflect on my comments. >> Gillian Mackay I appreciate that response from the First Minister, but local issues aside, the most significant impact of all of these data centers is the combined energy use. If all 24 applications were approved, they will use up to 1 and 1/2 times our peak energy use for the whole of Scotland. If the government's position is that council should be able to make these decisions locally, they can't. How are we supposed to possibly get a handle on those combined energy impacts? How many do we have capacity for because at the moment we simply don't know. Councils can't make these decisions in a coordinated way and planned way without the Scottish government stepping in. The Scottish government [snorts] has that responsibility to provide councils with guidance, communities with certainty, and they need that pause that we are asking for. So, while that um guidance comes forward for the First Minister, will he announce a pause on these applications? >> First Minister Gillian Mackay asks me to do or or for for the government to preside over two very different things. She asked me on the one hand to enable local authorities to take decisions that will be uh comment uh connection and and compatible with uh energy requirements within the the country. Um but uh expects local authorities to do that in a a coordinated and organized fashion around the whole of the country. Now, those two things I don't think are possible at the same time, which is why I have to which is why I have to explore whether it is appropriate for such decision-making to be undertaken at local level given the scale of the developments are involved. So, for example, when it comes to large-scale um renewable energy projects at a certain level and scale of application that is called into the government. The government is not called into the government, it automatically defers to the government. Now, what has been reshaped here is quite a fundamental reshaping of the planning policy of our country and the way in which decisions are taken. Now, I'm prepared to consider that and contemplate that. I'm trying to give as helpful answers as I possibly can do this afternoon on this question because I recognize the public concern and I assure Gillian Mackay that all of these issues about local and national decision-making and the implications for energy use will be fully considered in the exercise that I'm prepared to undertake. >> Anas Sarwar. Thank you, Presiding Officer. Before I begin, can I join others in condemning the appalling anti-Muslim attack in Edinburgh? No Scot should live in fear and every Scot should live in safety. And our thoughts are with those who were injured and with the wider Muslim community. And I want to put on record my thanks to all the emergency services who responded so quickly and effectively. I think we should say loudly and clearly from this Parliament and across the country that an attack on one, whether it's individual or one community, is an attack on all of us and hate has no place in our Scotland. >> [applause] >> Presiding Officer, this week also marks Armed Forces Week, so can I place on record my thanks to all those who have served and continue to serve in the service of keeping our great country safe. Presiding Officer, today Audit Scotland published their report on the government's progress with the reform of post-school education and skills, and it is damning. It says the sector faces significant challenges, that the government lacks a clear plan, and that reforms have not been adequately resourced, and there's a risk they will not achieve the intended outcomes. In 2022, Audit Scotland concluded that the SNP government had not provided the necessary leadership on skills reform. Four years on, and not much has changed, which has consequences. Because every year that passes, more pupils leave school without the opportunities they deserve. So, does John Swinney accept the findings of this report, and can he say how many more cohorts of young people will be let down before this government finally gets his act together? >> First Minister. Uh first of all, Presiding Officer, let me associate myself entirely with the comments that um Mr. Sarwar has made about the Muslim community, and about the necessity for all of us to stand together in the face of the spreading of hate in our society, and in the disputatious world of politics, and I'm glad and I'm not in any way surprised that Mr. Sarwar and I are in exactly the same position on that question. And also, let me pay tribute uh to the members of the armed forces for the service and commitment that they give. We obviously have a parliamentary event on Saturday, which is the uh the occasion of Armed Forces Day, um and I uh commend everyone who'll be involved in Armed Forces Day commemorations around the country. Now, I welcome the report from Audit Scotland, because it is important that these vital issues are the subject of active debate. Um the government, since the uh work was carried out to the report was carried out several years ago, has, of course, uh presided over the passage of legislation to uh to rationalize this area of activity, and there is work underway to transfer the responsibility for the funding of further education student support from the funding council to the student awards agency. There has also been strong progress in skills planning with the introduction of a new model for skills planning in Scotland and the Scottish government moving into a leadership role which comes out of that legislation as proposed by James Withers. And we have also begun the work on the post-school education skills reform program commencing in January 2026 to address many of the issues raised by Audit Scotland. And the other point I would make is that the one of the key outcomes here is about the destinations for young people when they leave school. And on the most recent figures available, 93.5% of young people were in a positive destination, which was an increase from 93.1% in the previous year, which is the joint highest since records ever began. So, although there are issues that must be addressed in the Audit Scotland report, the general position of our young people leaving school go on to a positive destination, which is surely the most important measure of this exercise. The government is pleased that we are in a strong position in that respect. >> Anas Sarwar. >> Very often, it's important that we measure not where our young people are weeks or months after they leave school, but years after school, because that's what impacts on their life outcomes. And our young people are the future of our country, so they must be supported to achieve their ambitions. That means no one right path after school, whether it be university, college, apprenticeship, or work. But that is not the reality under this SNP government, because shockingly, Scotland has one of the highest rates of young people not in work, education, or training, as many as one in six. And that's not helped by the SNP government cutting 20% in real terms from college budgets in the last 5 years, or in failing to meet its promises on apprenticeship numbers. And the data for 25/26 shows that apprenticeship starts fell below 25,000, the lowest number for over a decade excluding the period of the pandemic. So, if we are serious about ensuring every young person has a chance to succeed, then the system has to change. So, will John Swinney commit today that every young person who is qualified for an apprenticeship will have the guarantee of being able to access one? >> First Minister. >> It's also on a couple of points that Mr. Sarwar raised. In relation to college funding, the government increased in the budget that's just been put into practice. The budget for core college funding increased by 10% to 764 million pounds. So, we have recognized some of the financial challenges that exist in our college sector. Now, on apprenticeships, we are providing 198 million pounds a year to support 25 and 1/2 thousand new modern apprenticeships, 5,000 new foundation apprenticeships, and over 1,200 new graduate apprenticeships. Now, this supports and this also supports over 39,000 modern apprentices already in training, and we we committed in our manifesto to ensuring that we increased the number of apprenticeships to 150,000 over the course of the parliament. So, I I I'm a huge supporter of apprenticeship programs. I think the reforms that the government brought in with both foundation apprenticeships and graduate apprenticeships have been really important reforms that the government has brought forward which create new and successful pathways for young people, and I'm determined to make sure that every young person has that desirable pathway for the future. >> Anas Sarwar. >> Presiding Officer, the measure of success is whether young people get the opportunities they deserve and whether our businesses and the economy have the skills supply chain that they need. Because according to the Open University, over half of Scotland's employers say they have a skills shortage. And many of these businesses will will the apprenticeship levy. And the proceeds of that go to the Scottish government, but the SNP don't currently ring-fence it to spend on skills. That must change. So, that money could be spent on funding new apprenticeships for key sectors, or creating a clearing system for colleges and apprenticeships to help young people find opportunities. And in this Armed Forces Week, it could be used to match the UK Labour government's commitment to fund and create two defense technical excellence colleges in Scotland. He can make those commitments right now. Because we we do need to get serious about delivering a modern skills system that meets the needs of Scotland's young people. So, will the SNP government not hide behind process, and instead focus on delivery? Because it's time we had a government that matched young people's ambition with some ambition of their own. >> First Minister. >> Well, I think this I think this is one of the issues that I had in mind when I became First Minister after the election, where I said that there was opportunity for us to make progress across the parliamentary chamber. So, I think there's there's a lot of the points that Mr. Sarwar has made today about the ideas and the suggestions he made, which I think are completely reasonable. And we should embark on these conversations about how we can take that forward. As Mr. Sarwar knows, I've rehearsed it frequently in Parliament, the government doesn't have a majority. We need wider parliamentary support for our program. I'm delighted on such a number of occasions we are attracting support from other parties for the propositions we're putting to Parliament. So, this is one area where we can do exactly that. So, I invite um I'm afraid I'm not quite up to speed with um the the spokespeople um deployment of Mr. Sarwar's team, but I'm very happy for uh Mr. McClelland, the Education Secretary, uh and uh Stephen Flynn, the Economy Secretary, to meet with their counterparts in the Labour Party to see how we can take this at these serious ideas forward, because what I'm interested in, Mr. Sarwar will not be surprised to hear, is delivering for the people of Scotland. Um I think the Scottish government is uh hearing that loud and clear from the First Minister, and I'm delighted to repeat that in Parliament today. >> Malcolm Offord. Thank you, Presiding Officer. Does the First Minister welcome the recent landmark legal ruling by Lady Ross on the case brought by that excellent organization for Women Scotland? Will he ensure that it's implemented in full in letter and in spirit as soon as possible? Will he further [snorts] ensure that the principles of this ruling are rolled out across the entire public sector, including the NHS, immediately? That would avoid the need for any further waste of taxpayers' money defending the indefensible in court. And further, ensure that informational materials published by activist organizations, which are contrary to the letter and spirit of Lady Ross's ruling, are withdrawn from all public organizations and institutions, and cessation of their production and distribution becomes a condition of any further public funding to these activist activist groups. Finally, does he share my belief that Isla Bryson, apparently known in prison as Isla Mann, will now be retained in male jail, and upon release should not be allowed access to women's toilets, whether here in Holyrood or anywhere in Scotland? >> First Minister. >> Uh, I >> [snorts] >> I I I lead the government that uh believes in and follows the rule of law. So, when issues are of uh a legally contested nature, we do the proper thing, which is we allow the legally contested debate to take place, and then at the conclusion of that, we follow that legal ruling. So, uh Lady Ross's ruling is crystal clear. It has been implemented in full already in relation to the Scottish Prison Service, and the necessary um amendments to custody have been have taken place. Uh, I do not intend to talk about individual uh cases because that's inappropriate for me to do that. And in relation to the circulation of materials, materials and guidance have to be compatible with the law as it stands and that's exactly why the Scottish Prison Service withdrew their guidance at the earliest opportunity and developments of further guidance will be undertaken consistent with the ruling of Lady Ross. >> Mark Monford >> I thank the First Minister for that question which was more comprehensive than I expected. I was dreading that he would come back with a long-winded no comment which begs the question is saying no comment ever an acceptable response to sequence of serious questions? And of course he will be aware that all this illegal gender policy was implemented by his predecessor Miss No Comment who's now fled to London in search of fame and fortune and lower taxes. Is it true Is it true that the second edition of Miss Sturgeon's memoirs will be entitled frankly I don't give a damn? Meanwhile we have heard that the Miss No Comment is to star in a TV show playing the role of a Deputy First Minister Deputy Prime Minister in the UK. Frankly you couldn't make this up or is this part of John Swinney's cunning plan? Does the First Minister agree with me that the no comment saga must be part of the forthcoming inquiry into moral gate? >> First Minister if you want to comment on that >> The only The only The only person up until now who's ever accused me of being long-winded is is my 15-year-old son who tells me to shorten my answers in Parliament on a regular basis. So I think for the benefit of currying favor with the presiding officer, I'll keep this one short. Mr. Offord's contribution Oh, it's all very funny, Mr. Kerr. You're always laughing at things. Mr. Kerr was laughing at the very substantial points made by Daniel Johnson in the debate where Mr. Kerr trivialized the attacks on Muslim members of our community, which is an absolute disgrace. AND IF anyone who voted Reform was watching the exchange with Mr. Offord's question to me there just now, I think they would think what a waste of time it was voting for Reform because that was just an insulting lot of drivel from Malcolm Offord. >> Malcolm Offord >> It is the last day of term, uh, presiding officer. So, on the same theme, of course, the items bought by Peter Murrell with money stolen from the SNP are now part of Scotland's political history. And this saga will be taught to future generations of Scotland's children. Will the First Minister arrange for many items as can be found to be gathered together and displayed as the Murrell collection? Will he also arrange for some items to be gifted to Scotland's museums and galleries as permanent exhibitions and a tribute to SNP governance? Can I suggest that the fountain pen which Nicola Sturgeon used to sign her resignation letter, she go to the People's Palace to become the People's Pen? Or similarly, the two toilet seats could go to Perth to sit alongside the Stone of Destiny? Or the 3,000 pound coffee machine could sit beside the declaration of Arbroath to show how political priorities have changed? Will he encourage the people of Scotland to write to us with their proposals? We cannot allow for these items to be auctioned to the highest bidder who will take them into private collections abroad. So, does he agree with me that this part of Scotland's history must not be lost? First Minister. >> No, I'm going to get on with delivering for the PEOPLE OF SCOTLAND. >> [applause] >> THAT CONCLUDES FIRST MINISTER'S QUESTIONS, AND THE next item of business is a debate on motion 469 in the name of Neil Gray. We allow a 2-minute break for a change of places.