Federated instant messaging, 100% debianized

This session is uh federated instant messaging uh 100% uh devilized uh >> I'm sorry Thank you. Uh no. Um communi communicating is a basic human need of course and uh for the people in this room communicating through a computer is a basic human need probably. So, and with everything that is happening these days, it's it's more important than ever that uh communicating happens through means that um uh aren't that are in controlled by entities they that don't have the best interest of the people who are communicating uh through their their entities. Maybe they can just provide the service and then stop providing the service because they don't make enough money out of it or they even worse they can abuse it to extract data from from what we are communicating for profit. Uh it would be nice if there was um another chat system that was well established based on standards developed in an open way uh with all of the features that one expects from a modern uh instant messaging system. So it should uh work uh on computers on uh mobiles. Uh maybe you should also provide uh not only text but also video calls or anything. And uh it would be nice. It would be federated so that um you everybody could choose their own provider of the service and talk with everybody else who uses a different provider but using also the the same compatible way. So that uh uh everybody can choose to to get the service from somebody they could trust instead of just whoever has uh has the more money is the only one who's able to provide the service. The good thing it it does exist and I'm not talking about IRC even if it's a perfectly valid system but I'm talking about XMPPP. Uh XMPPP has existed at least since the the last millennium but it's not a chat system from the last millennium. The X stands for um extensible and um XMPPX been extended many times to provide all of the all of the the needs for for a modern modern system. Uh the these extensions are called uh except XC uh XCP um XMPPP extension uh extension protocols and they have been added to provide almost everything one can think so think of uh instance messaging IoT uh there is even um a social network based on XMPPP because it's very widely uh adaptable to various needs. Uh there's a myth that because it's there are a lot of uh ex XIP and uh they provide multiple different things. Uh there's a myth that XMPP is a mess of uh inco in unc in unc in unc in unc in unc in unc in unc in unc in unc in uncompat in unc in uncompatible uh things that uh uh people with one client can talk with people from another client and uh nothing works. Uh it may have been partially true for a short while but um this day there is an XMPP uh XM MP for that uh 0479 XMPPP compliance suit 2023. There is a new one every few years. This is an except which uh tells what XP are supposed to be supported by clients and servers that are providing instant messaging. And this means that uh people who work on servers or clients know what what they're supposed to to support. And um with the recommended ones, it just works. There's no longer problems of uh one unless somebody's using some very special client but there is no need for that unless somebody wants to uh to help develop something new or to make life hard for themselves which are very valid thing to do but not necessary. uh one just install one of the the suggested uh clients and it works. Uh such clients include um conversation AM for um for mobile uh which is developed by people who are actively working on uh uh supporting a good uh um environment for XMPP with comp compliance testings and other things. On Linux there are Dino and Gajim. Uh Gajim does uh everything including the kitchen sink. Dino does simple and easy to use. Uh there is profanity for people who want to use the text interf interfaces and I've heard that um monal works fine on uh iTings uh iPhones uh Mac OS and other things. Uh, it's the one that I know less often. Probably it's the one that is not as great as the other one. Conversations and the inorgim just work with everything. Yeah. Uh then there is uh one thing that um XMPP has uh it has been around for quite a long time and this means it has gone already gone through the stage where there is the great federated service but everyone is on the same server because it's the biggest one is the first one that people know about about uh XMPPP had this in the early 2000s and um we got burned hard by it and now we we've learned. So these day there are a few service like these ones that cater to newcomers and are somewhat bigger but for example sneaked offers the service but also offers a way to easily install your own service. They're all trying to to let people use different uh servers, smaller server servers and uh in practice most of the people uh I talk to on but there is no server that is big enough that they could say okay from now on you're doing things like I do or you no longer talk with other people which is a problem with federated service. it it happens naturally and it is a serious problem. So what I recommend as a service is as a server is community hosting. So instead of uh just going for the big ones uh or looking for a smaller one that can that offers uh accounts. I say start with a community. Look for a community you're part of and see if they already provide the a server maybe or uh uh if you can get some other people and say okay we are going to run a server for this community. Uh this way you can have a server where um the people using it and the people managing are people who trust each other who know and tr trust each other. Uh well for um Debian developers there is already a community that provides a service. Uh everybody uh you need to be a DD a Deian developer but if you are one you can go on that website uh set up your password and in an hour or so you have uh your account you can start using it. uh if you okay uh that server it's well maintained uh there is a good team that is actively working on maintaining it and if you're interested in knowing the team helping the team there is going to be um a buff uh about that uh on Friday uh 1630 uh and well if people want to join and uh help or ask for their favorite feature that is miss singer. Uh okay, they can come. um if you are not a DD or uh if you prefer to be on an even smaller server or if you just say okay I am um uh I'm a techn vaguely technical person probably everybody in this room is you know technically enough for this uh you can run your own server uh now these days it's as easier as a install one of those uh pro or a job. Uh you have to tell it uh the uh the name of your server. Uh set up a couple of uh DNS entries and it just works. Uh it's already preconfigured with the right modules, the right options to be compliant with uh the standards, the the mentioned before. Uh there is basically nothing to I'm a lazy person and I hate doing CIS admin meaning work and I've been maintaining an ex XMPPP server for years. It just works. You have to keep the the machine updated system updates security updates update your Debian system every two year and there is nothing more to do. Uh I'm running it for um a few friends and my family and I have to do a little bit give a little bit of help to my family the parts of the my family that are not technical at all. Uh but really a lazy person can do it. It's about hazard as maintaining a a web server with a static website. It's not for everybody, but in this room, it's probably something easy for most people. Um, that's it. If you have any questions, there will be time for it. Hi there. You mentioned I think XCP 479. Is that more just a collection of things to say if you meet 479 you must do >> um you know this set of extensions. So it's basically a meta thing. So it's like you must do XP 1 2 3 4 and 10 rather than >> Yep. >> Yes. Basically that uh that is a list of your server and your clients has to support uh this feature this feature this feature this feature. So that uh Yeah, a comment for French users. You have the Shaton initiative, C H A T O N, which lists like respectful hosters and it has um instant messaging in the list of criterias where you can search for like like you said local communities that can provide you these kind of services. It's not working. This it's written >> like like this, right? No. Yeah. >> H A T O N S. Shut shuts.org. >> Oh yes. Okay. Yes, I had forgotten about it. This is an excellent service. The there's another question. Hello. So yeah, so I switched to matrix for all my coms. It's great. Um, but I kind of assumed everyone had given up with XMPPP. So, uh, persuaded me that this is still a better way of doing things. What are the pros and cons? >> Well, um, I'm based towards XMPP. So uh when I looked into matrix self-hosting was sign significantly harder because uh uh both of the time and effort involved I don't know if the metric server is already in Debian when I looked at it it wasn't maybe now it is and the it required more um um power uh My XMPPP server runs on the cheapest uh VPN I could find and it runs with other things with no issues. Uh so I decided I prefer the XMPP significantly but I'm based very biased. I have another thing. I had another thing to add but I'm unable to decrypt the message. Okay. Yeah. A question to the matrix person. Can can you do calls with matrix like video audio calls? Okay. with TexP uh >> yeah with TMPP you can do calls um video calls uh with with matrix I have no idea what whether you can or not >> just to answer the question. In practice, I find uh audio calls work fine in matrix. Video calls might work, but don't always and uh if you meet me around, I'm always have happy to talk about federated things. All federated things are I think I'm happy to talk about. So thank you. >> Thank you. [applause]