Church & Ministry Administration | Lecture 2 : BC310-CMA-20260812

Okay. All right. Um Let me just check once again. Oops, something happened. Okay. All right. Good morning, everyone. And um thank you for joining the lecture today, BC310 on church and ministry administration. Uh let's pray. And then we will get started. Um I would like somebody in the class uh if you could just unmute your mic and pray, uh we will get started. Uh anyone can uh just pray with us together, and then we will start. >> Father God, we thank you, praise you, worship you for this morning. Thank you, Father God, for this class, second day, as we are here with Pastor Ashish. And we are going to learn about church and ministry administration. We are so thankful to you for the lecture of yesterday >> [snorts] >> that we learned how important it is in your eyes to be orderly and to do things in a orderly manner. And we pray, Father, make us also and help us also to learn, Father God, to be organized, to be orderly as you are orderly, Father God. Thank you, Lord God, for the lecture of today. And we we know, Father, your mouthpiece is going to speak to us, and it is going to touch our hearts and lives, and it is going to impact our ministries, Father. We thank you, praise you, worship you. Our hearts may be connected to you, and we may be focused on this teachings, on these lessons in the mighty name of Jesus. We give you all the glory, honor, and praise in Jesus' name we pray. Amen. >> Amen. Amen. Thank you. All right, let's um good morning again to everyone. Let's uh continue from where we stopped yesterday. I will share the PDF. Yeah. All right. Let's hide this um and shift to the PDF. Okay. So, we got started in lesson one and and our plan is to try and finish this today. Um in talking about the importance of good administration for church or for any Christian organization. Um why should we think along these lines? First, we said our God, the God we serve, is a God of order, design, organization, and creativity. We see this in his creation, the way he created everything, uh whether you look at the big things or whether you look at the small things, there is order and there is design. Then, we started looking at some examples in the Bible. We started, of course, in the Old Testament. We will journey through into the New Testament scriptures. >> [snorts] >> Uh we looked at Moses. You know, there were two instances in in in the leadership of Moses. Uh Exodus 18 when uh he had just kind of started that journey. Uh Jethro, Moses' father-in-law, sees what's happening. He advises Moses and Moses, you know, if you sit and try to do it all of this by yourself, it's not good for you. It's not good for the people. So, you have to appoint leaders of small small groups and let them handle what they can. Uh similarly Numbers chapter 11, this is later on in the journey when Moses complains to God. He says, "God, I can't handle this. It's too much." God himself tells Moses, "Moses, you you select 70 people. I will anoint them to be spiritual leaders under you." >> [snorts] >> So here you see God himself guiding, directing Moses. Another instance that we looked at was in how the the whole movement of the people was going to take place. That is in Numbers 10. That's where we stopped yesterday. Uh God himself gives very detailed instructions on how the 12 tribes should camp. So when they stop at a place, he said, "Okay, you know, these three tribes in the north, these three tribes east, west, south." You know, so the 12 tribes very orderly around the tabernacle. And then when they had to move, again very orderly, he said the priests would blow the trumpet. And then tribe by tribe, they would march. So you see that God himself is very orderly in the way the people are moving into the land of promise. So these are some examples. Uh some other examples that we see in the Old Testament are quite uh uh impressive. Uh one is in the the tabernacle of David. Uh we read about this. Uh one example would be in 1 Chronicles 25. Uh and you know, I'd encourage you to take time to read these chapters. Uh we're only making reference of it uh here. But in 1 Chronicles 25, you know, this is after David had become king, he had set up his uh uh throne in Jerusalem. The tabernacle was set up there. And David does something very interesting. He institutes, or he puts in place, continuous praise and worship happening in the tabernacle. Now, this had not been done before, never before. So, David is, you know, the first king who, you know, uh who who does this. He says, "We're going to have worship prayer happening at the tabernacle nonstop, 24/7." Now, that's a big undertaking. It's not an easy thing. How are you going to have nonstop prayer and worship happening in the tabernacle? And when you read 1 Chronicles chapter 25, and uh it's an amazing description here of how David sets this up. He has, and I'm giving you approximate numbers, but the details are there in chapter 25. He has about 250 worship leaders. So, worship leaders, 250 people. Uh these are, you know, like prophetic uh worship leaders. Remember in those days, they didn't have songbooks. They didn't have, you know, uh LED projectors or any of that. You know, so these had to be singers who could just sing uh prophetically under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. So, he had 250 worship leaders. He had uh 5,000 people serving in the Tabernacle and another 3,000 people. So, they were totally uh and again, these are approximate numbers, but about 8,000 people serving in the Tabernacle, approximately. And he he creates, you know, today we would call it roster. Uh but he literally creates a roster of people who are going to be serving every hour. Right? And um they would uh these groups of people would be serving every hour. A roster of uh worship leaders from these in our 5,000 people who are going to serve as musicians and uh who are going to serve in the temple in the Tabernacle in and around the Tabernacle, all the services that needed to be done. He creates a roster. And for 33 years, that's a long time. It's not even 33 days. We're talking about 33 years. Worship uh prayer and worship and sacrifice went on in the Tabernacle of David. So, you can read the details here in in First Chronicles 25. It is It is, you know, it is like a massive, huge undertaking to have a roster of people, so many people, worship leaders, um musicians, uh all the people who are serving in and around the Tabernacle, and non-stop praise and worship and prayer going on in the Tabernacle and this went on for 33 years. And remember they did not have all the tools that we have today. You know, they didn't like we said, no song books, no projectors, uh nothing. It was just human to human coordination. Which is very difficult. You know, today we have WhatsApp, we have uh phones, we have lots of tools that we can, you know, use to coordinate amongst ourselves, but those days didn't have all those tools. And yet David put this in place. It's really telling us about very high administration and coordination to make this happen. You know. And it went on for 33 years. Nobody else and no other king was able to do what David did. You know, to have 33 years of continuous praise and worship happening coordinating between the worship leaders, the musicians, and all these other people who had to serve in their appointed slots. They'd come, okay, this is your slot, you come, you serve, go. You know, what an amazing. So, a great example of administration coordination. Like this, you will see uh other examples. Uh I just may make mention of Nehemiah. >> [snorts] >> Uh and we read this in the book of Nehemiah, of course. And uh when Nehemiah, you know, had the burden to go rebuild the walls of the city of Jerusalem and God had given him wisdom, uh favor, and, [clears throat] you know, given favor and all the resources needed to go rebuild the walls. So, he comes back into Jerusalem. He [snorts] surveys the city, the broken walls, and then he speaks to the people. He says, "You know, God has put in my heart to rebuild the walls. Can we all do it together?" Uh the people, the Jewish people, they all agree. "Let's do it." But, there is lot of opposition. Their opposition's literally from every side, from the north, the south, the east, the west. I mean, these are all different tribes um uh uh who are around the Jewish people in those days, and they were all against the rebuilding of the walls of Jerusalem. So, literally, physically, from every side, there were other tribes, other groups of people who were opposing, and they were mocking, they were uh you know, insulting, they were threatening uh uh the Jewish people, Nehemiah and the Jews, from rebuilding the walls. But, when you look at the story of Nehemiah, you see how they actually built up the walls. They organized themselves all around where they had to build. People came to work. Nehemiah realized that there was tremendous opposition and possibility of attack. So, he said, "Some of you build the walls. Others, you stand, you know, ready with your swords." And some of them worked. They worked with swords in their hands, literally. And then he also said, "We have people with trumpets around. So, anytime you hear the trumpet blowing somewhere, everybody must get there. That means there is trouble, there is some sort of an attack. Uh so we all get together to, you know, support each other. So he organized the people in such a way that people knew that they can work and yet they are ready to defend themselves if any of the enemies would attack. You know? So again, God is doing the work through Nehemiah, but if you look at in the details, there is a lot of administration, there's a lot of organization, and then eventually the walls are rebuilt. During that time, um people tried to trap Nehemiah, you know, Sanballat and Tobiah, uh they're the enemies of the Jews, they tried to, you know, disrupt this work. Uh but Nehemiah was very careful. He He just avoided those things and uh you know, the walls are rebuilt. So here again, there's another example where God wanted something done, God moved on the heart of Nehemiah, he moved on the heart of his people, but they organized themselves very well, and they got the work done. When you come into the New Testament, um you know, when the church is born, literally, when that is on the day of Pentecost, the Lord Jesus didn't give any, you know, instructions on this is how you should organize yourselves. Nothing. He just gave them the commission. He said, "Go into the whole world, make disciples of all nations. The Holy Spirit will come on you. You'll receive power, and you will be my witnesses." So he gave them the commission. He told them the Holy Spirit is coming. But, when we follow what happens in the first uh 40 years uh of the early church, uh from AD 30, um so actually, by the time the book of Revelation is written, it's AD 90. So, about for 60 years, sorry, in the first 60 years from AD 30 to AD 90, the first 60 years uh of the early church, which is recorded for us in the New Testament, we see slowly the organization evolving that support that is supporting the execution of the Great Commission. So, of course, there it starts with the 12 apostles. Judas was replaced. And um the 12 apostles are there. And then in Acts chapter 6, they appoint seven other, you know, we would call them as deacons to help them. You know, so there is in Acts chapter 6, there is a little problem. Uh and the problem has to do with serving food to the community. So, it's a it's a it's a you know, a a real problem, a physical problem. Uh the Jew the Hebrew-speaking Jews and the Greek-speaking Jews, um they felt that they were not being treated equally. They felt that food distribution was not happening properly. So, they complained to the apostles. Uh what do the apostles do? They said, "Okay, you find seven leaders, seven men. We will pray for them, and we will put them in charge of the food distribution." So, you're beginning to see a a bit of organization coming into the church. The the early church. So, they pray for them. And notice they didn't just select anybody, they selected people who are full of the Holy Spirit, who are full of wisdom, and of good report. That means that even these people who are selected to serve as, you know, what we would call as deacons or just helpers, they had to have be full of the Holy Spirit. They had to be full of wisdom. They had to have a good testimony. And they prayed for them, and they put them in charge of the food distribution. So, that was the first ministry where that was, you know, organized. But eventually, what you see in the early church is more apostles, more teachers, more prophets, more ministries were raised up in the church in Jerusalem. And these people went out, and the ministry started multiplying. So, that now, when you come to 1 Timothy chapter 3, which is around AD 68, that means this is 38 years after the birth of the church. 1 Timothy was written around that time when Paul was being was imprisoned in Rome towards latter part of his time there. In 1 Timothy 3, Paul is now writing about bishops and deacons. So, by the time you go through the first 40 years, this is around I said 38 years from AD 32 AD 68, and there is a clear understanding of organization in the church. Paul is talking about bishops. He's talking about deacons. Uh bishops are spiritual leaders, people who are responsible for spiritual ministry. Deacons are responsible for the administration, and Paul is clearly writing about these people. And he's saying, you know, they've got to be people of character. They got to have, you know, take care of things personally and then they can take care of the church of God. And uh uh in Romans 16, uh let's go, please, to Romans 16. It's kind of interesting there. Paul uh in writing to the church in Rome, he identifies this whole area of beacons. And the reason I want us to go to Romans 16 is because he shows us that even women can be involved in these responsibilities. So, let's read, please. Romans chapter 16, verses 1 through 5. Romans 16, 1 through 5. Could somebody read that for us, please? >> I commended to you >> It's coming up. >> Phoebe, yeah. >> I commended to you Phoebe, our sister, who is servant of the church he's sent to share that you may receive her in the Lord in a manner worthy of the saints. And assistant her assist her in whatever business he has she has need of you. For indeed she has been a helper of many and of myself also. Greeting Roman saints. Greet Pris- Priscil- Priscilla and Aquila, my fellow workers in Christ Jesus, who risked their own necks for my life, to whom not only I gave thanks, but also the churches of the Gentiles. Likewise, greet the church that is in their house. Greet my beloved >> Epaphras >> who is the first fruits of >> Achaia >> to church. >> Mhm, to Christ. Okay. So, you know, this is Paul the Apostle. He's closing out his letter to the Romans, to the church in Rome. And there he makes mention, of course, in this in this passage he makes mention of many names, many people who worked alongside him in different uh ministry areas. So, Paul didn't ministry by himself. In fact, if you, you know, like through the whole New Testament, if you try to count the names of different people that Paul mentions who were his co-workers, mhm, uh you I think you come up with at least 24 other names. So, that means there were at least, and definitely much more, many more people who were Paul's co-workers. Uh uh because he went across many cities. He traveled many places. And wherever he went, he had people working alongside him. And here in writing to the believers in Rome, he's saying, "Oh, there is a sister. Her name is Phoebe. And uh she's from this particular church in Cenchreae. And uh you know, when she comes to you, please receive her. And he says, "She is a servant." Meaning a deacon. You know, so we we we use the word, you know, some in some congregations they use the word deacons. Uh Paul in some translations translated servant. Uh she's a deacon. She's a servant. You know, we in today's modern settings, we may call them as volunteers. Uh we may call them as ushers. Uh, we may call them by different names. So, the title itself doesn't matter. The point is this person was responsible for certain areas of business, meaning uh, administrative aspects of the church. So, she wasn't like a spiritual leader in the sense she wasn't a bishop or a preacher, but she was in charge of some administrative aspects of the church. And Paul is recommending her, you know, when she comes to you, she's got to take care of some organizational administrative things. Please support her. I mean, you know, help her get this work done, is what Paul is saying. And he says she has been a help to many including myself. So, you see Paul, the apostle, he's doing spiritual ministry, but he has co-workers around him who are helping him with the practical administrative organization side of ministry, and he's very grateful for them. He's recommending them. In this particular case, it was Phoebe. He's saying, "Oh, no, please, she's going to come. She's going to take care of some administrative things. Please help her or support her." Right? So, what we are seeing, starting from Acts chapter 6, all the way on through towards the end of the early period of the early church, there is a recognition of people who are working alongside those who are doing spiritual ministry. People who are doing administrative organizational type of work, but they are working side by side with those who are doing spiritual ministry. And I think uh, another very important thing that we see in scripture is that these ministries are specifically called out in scripture. So, we go back to chapter 12 of Romans. Romans chapter 12 and we will read please verses 4 through 8. Romans chapter 12 verses 4 through 8. Somebody could read that for us, please. >> For as we have many members in one body, but all the members do not have the same function. So, we being many are one body in Christ and individually members of one another. Having then gifts different differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us then if prophecy, let us prophecy in proportion to our faith or ministry, let us use in our ministering. He who teaches in teaching. >> And verse 8, please. >> He who exhorts in exhortation, he who gives with liberality. He who leads with diligency. He who shows mercy with cheerfulness. >> Mhm. Behave like a Christian. >> Okay. [snorts] So, thank you. So, when you read verses 4 through 8 what is Paul telling us? He's saying, "Look, in the church there are people who have different functions." And notice he's not talking about gender. There is no mention of oh all the men have these functions and all the women have these set of functions. He doesn't distinguish that. Meaning, whatever he's going to tell us from in verses 4 through 8 is available or is given to both men and women equally. There's no, you know, saying, "Okay, only men can do this. Only women can do this." Nothing like that. He just says, "Look, in the church, in the body, all of us are members, and each of us have some function." And verse 5, he says, you know, we we are all part of the same body, but uh we have diff- we are individuals. We have different functions. Verse 6. And we have different functions, and also having different gifts. And then he mentions a set of gifts. This doesn't mean these are the only gifts available. It's just a representative list, meaning there's so many different kinds of gifts like these. So, he talks about prophecy, that will be a spiritual function and gift. Uh he talks about service, ministry. That word ministry there simply means serve, service. So, that that service, that ministering, ministering, which he mentions in verse 7, could mean any kind of service. So, if somebody is doing accounting for the church, that is a service. If somebody's doing media for the church, that is a service. If somebody is doing, you know, IT work for the church, that is service. Somebody's doing admin work for the church, that is service. It falls under in verse 7, ministry. Any kind of service that you're doing, it is part of the function of the church. So, here's what I want to get into our hearts and minds. Administrative organizational functions are part of the ministry of the church. Sometimes in our minds we keep it separate. Oh, you know, these people are doing spiritual work, like maybe preaching, maybe worship, maybe prayer. Oh, that's part of the church. And these people are doing administrative work, you know, they may be doing accounting or um you know, some other kind of admin work. That's not part of the church. That's That's there. We keep it separate. No, that's not true. They are also part of the body of Christ. They are part of the church. They are members in the body. God has given them these functions, administrative functions, organization functions, and they are serving in the church. They are as much part of the church as a preacher or a teacher or a worship leader or a person who prays. They are They are part of the church. Ministry, service. And notice he also mentions here um leadership. This is in the end of verse eight. He who leads with diligence. So, leadership. You know, providing leadership. This is so important. Somebody has to take responsibility. Somebody has to provide leadership. And he says leadership is also one of those functions in the church. Right? So. God calls out these, you know, what we would generally think of as administrative or organizational type of functions, God calls them out and he says they are part of the church. They belong to the body. Uh they're they are God-appointed and they're God-anointed functions in the church. And 1 Corinthians 12:28 brings it out even more. So, let's go there, please. 1 Corinthians 12 and look at verse 28. 1 Corinthians 12:28. Somebody could read that for us, please. >> Here are some of the parts God has appointed for the church. First are apostles, second are prophets, third are teachers, then those who do miracles, those who have the gifts of healing, those who can help others, those who have gifts of leadership, and those who speak in unknown languages. >> Mhm. Think about this. Verse 28, he's saying God has set these in the church. Right? So, that means uh these are part of the church. And then, of course, the first list is all about spiritual ministry. There are apostles, prophets, teachers, miracles, healings. But then, what after that? Helps and you know, the King James the other translated as administrations. Helps administrations. Of course, different Bibles, different versions would translate those two verses, you know, those two words slightly differently. Helps administrations and then varieties of tongues. So, in this full list in verse 28, we recognize many of these are spiritual functions in apostle, prophet, pastor, teacher, and you know, miracles, healings, all that, tongues, all that. Okay, fine. But, there are these two words, helpers, administrations, or you know, leadership, or government, different It's translated differently, but but these are organizational functions, administrative functions. So, any helper, any person who's helping in any way, he's he or she's part of the church. Administrations, government, organization, leadership is also part of what God has set in the church. So, notice that administrations, or Romans 12 talks about ministries, here it talks about helps, government, organization, these are God-appointed and God-anointed functions in the church. Second thing I want us to notice is there is no mention of gender. You know, that means both men and women can serve in these functions. God didn't say only men or only women can serve in organization, administration. No, it's there's no mention of gender. Anyone can serve. So, what we must begin to realize or really embrace in our hearts is that when we are doing um ministry, Christian ministry, whether in the church or in a Christian organization, and when we are doing things that are administrative in nature, organizational in nature. Kind of just helping somebody else who's doing spiritual ministry recognize that this is also God appointed and God anointed. It's not second class work. We're all in the church. Put in the church. And these are all functions that God has created or God has appointed in the church. Right? So, we need to honor We need to honor people who are doing a lot of the administrative work. We're doing a lot of the organizational work. They're planning, they're strategizing, they're thinking. Sometimes we look down on them, oh, it's not that spiritual. No, no, no. They're anointed and appointed by God in the church. [clears throat] They're equally important. And they're of course supporting those others who are doing spiritual ministry, but they are part of the church. We should honor them. We should appreciate them. We should develop them. We should encourage them. And there are so many different kinds of these helping administrative organizational functions. We should recognize it and encourage people in those areas. Right? And then like we saw yesterday, in several places in his epistles, Paul talks about order. In the 1 Corinthians 11, when he talks about people coming for communion, he says, "Do it in an orderly way." In the Corinthian church, when it was time for the Lord's table, people thought it was like a big feast. And okay, who can grab the biggest piece of bread and who can get the biggest cup of you know, wine and it became like a disorderly uh thing. So, Paul is saying, "No, no, no. When you come to partake in the Lord's table, do it in a very orderly way." We saw 1 Corinthians 14. When you when you're trying to minister in the spiritual gifts, do it in an orderly way. And then, Titus chapter 1. Let's go to Titus chapter 1, please. When Paul is writing to Titus and uh Paul has appointed Titus to take care of the churches uh in an island called Crete. So, this is towards the end of Paul's ministry. Um uh Paul actually was um uh on his way back to Rome where he was going to eventually he was going to be killed. He was going to be martyred. So, this was in the in the very last stage of his ministry. He appointed Titus. Now, Titus was a Greek believer, a believer who you know, uh who came to faith from a Greek background. Uh most likely he was a young man from the church in Antioch. And he had traveled with Paul to go to Jerusalem in the first council that was held at Jerusalem. And Paul had actually used Titus as an example of a Greek person coming to faith in Jesus and all of that. So, there's a long relationship. Paul is towards the end of his ministry now, and he appoints Titus to oversee the churches in this island called Crete. And uh and then Paul tell and so that's this episode Titus which Paul writes in on his on his way back to Rome and he writes this episode and he sends it to Titus. And one of his instructions to Titus is Titus, I want you to put things in order. And so let's read verse five, please. Somebody could read it. >> This is why I left you in Crete A so that you might put what remained into order and appoint elders in every town as I directed you. >> Mhm. Paul is saying, "Okay, Titus, you've got to oversee many churches. So what do you do? I want you to put things in order. So these churches shouldn't just be, you know, doing their own thing, going on the No, no, no. There are so many churches in Crete and I want you to set things in order, appoint leaders. And obviously these leaders will then be under the oversight of Titus. And so you see Paul is really uh emphasizing organization and order across local churches. So within the local church, you know, there must be order in how things are happening during a service, when you're coming for Lord's table, when you're ministering to one another, and across [clears throat] churches. How all these churches are running, there has to be order. Uh there has to be organization uh in that as well. Right? >> [snorts] >> So in closing of this first lesson, let's stop think about this, you know. We've talked about a biblical perspective. That means, okay, we can see it clearly in the Bible. Um uh administration, organization, leadership, ministry, helps, >> [snorts] >> all this are part of the church. It's in the Bible. But also if you look at it from a practical perspective, there is a need uh you know, an expectation for efficiency. So, for example, if somebody in the congregation um they need a letter from the church. Maybe, you know, uh uh uh uh uh for some reason. For example, uh for admission of their children into a school. Uh and these days, at least I know in Bangalore, certain schools will ask, you know, give us a letter from your church. Uh so, the example, they want a letter. Uh uh so, you know, they they should be able to get that letter. And they should at least make they should be able to make a phone call or send an email. And they should receive that letter. And and and many times it's happened, and we make sure that they get the letter within 1 or 2 days. You know, they get it because it's important for them >> [snorts] >> uh because, you know, they need to apply for admission for their children. So, people are expecting that kind uh of uh support, organizational administrative support uh from the church. And so, we should be able to provide that. Uh another practical perspective is many people they want to serve in church. They may not be interested in preaching and teaching or singing in worship, but they have other skills, like administrative or accounting or organizing, coordinating. Uh these these these helper type of skills, you know, and they want to serve. So, we can't say you can only serve if you are a preacher. No. The church should be a place where, you know, bring whatever skill God has given you. Let's find a place where you can use it in the functioning in the service in the ministry. Right? So there are people who have got many different skills. Some people like to make a video. Some people like to do graphics. Some you know, they've got technical skills, other skills. And if you can create opportunities, they will feel so much part of what God is doing. Right? And another practical reason is we require these kinds of skills for the church to be relevant. So today when the church is ministering to people in this world, you know, it's so good for the church to have a website, to be on social media, to be able to you know, reach out to people by using this these tools that we have. And it helps us be relevant. It helps us reach people using these tools. But in order to use those tools, you need people with those kind of skills. Right? So a person, a pastor may not be able to do it because he needs to focus, spend time on ministry the word. So what do we need? We need people with those skills who can do those things to come alongside spiritual ministry to help the church be relevant. Right? So these are practical reasons why you know, we we need to have good administration, organization. And we need people with those skills to help us in the ministry. Finally, there will be some excuses. You know, sometimes there will be people who are reluctant to want to put things in place in terms of administration, organization. You know, what are some excuses we could think of? You know, uh some will say, "Oh, we we were not trained to do this. You know, I went to you know, like for example, a pastor or someone so I went to seminary and they taught me the Bible, but they never taught me about administration or management or things like that. So, why should I be involved? Why should I bother about it?" So, the tendency is, "Oh, I will only preach and teach the word and let's not worry about having good organization, administration." So, sometimes people are not trained in the ministry for this. So, they just neglect it and eventually the whole everybody else suffers. Uh sometimes there is a lack of skilled people. You know, we know that we need an accountant, we need, you know, uh people who understand administration, etc., but maybe they're not able to find those people or they're not able to hire those people. So, then uh they neglect that. You know, we we do we don't have the people, we don't have the means for these people. Well, the solution there is, why don't we get people to volunteer? If we cannot hire people, why don't we have people who can volunteer their skills and help the church and eventually you you will be able to hire. >> [clears throat] >> Um sometimes, you know, uh the wrong idea is Christian ministry must only be done by people who are deeply spiritual, who understand spiritual things, etc. Well, like we said, as you saw in the Bible, in the church, there are people who are gifted differently. That means they're gifted in leadership, they're gifted in other functions. But yes, of course, they have to love God, they have to have a good testimony. That goes without saying. But, we recognize that their gifts are different. Their gifts may be in administration and leadership. >> [snorts] >> And they're also part of the church. They're also part of the body. Right? Uh sometimes people say, "Oh, we want to only focus on spiritual matters." That is true. You focus on spiritual matters, but there are also practical matters that the church must take care of. Like I said, you know, um uh a letter that somebody might need. Uh and there are a lot more things that we're going to talk about, managing finances, and so on. So, while the church definitely is doing spiritual ministry, these other things must be taken care of. Or you know, sometimes people say, uh "We don't want to become like the corporate world." You know, we are a church. Of course, we are a church. Organization doesn't mean we're becoming like the world. We see that organization actually comes from God. So, organization is not a worldly thing. It's a godly thing. It comes from God. Our God is a god of organization. So, we have this wrong idea that organization is worldly. No, no, no. Organization is godly. It comes from God. And um you know, and it's it's a god thing. So, uh sometimes, you know, we have all of these wrong ideas, and therefore we don't pay attention to administration, organization. So, we need to change our thinking. We need to get a fresh perspective, a biblical perspective, and understand that organization, administration, is something God wants among his people. So, let's pause here. I know we're almost out of time, but are there any questions? Anything that people would like to ask? Any questions? Okay. Um so we'll close here for today. Uh let's continue this next week. Next week I will be in person uh at the Bible College, so I look forward to uh meeting all our students who are on campus. Uh online students, you continue to connect online. E-learning students continue to uh journey with us on the e-learning portal >> [snorts] >> and we're going to learn uh a lot of good things together. Let's close in prayer, please, and then we will dismiss. Could somebody close in prayer? >> Heavenly Father, we thank you for our time together today. Let we learn from your word take root in our hearts, Lord. Guide our steps and keep us safe as we go our separate ways. Help us, Father, to live out your love every day. I ask this prayer in Jesus' name. Amen. >> Amen. Thank you, everyone. God bless. I'll see you again next week. Thank you. >> Thank you, sir. >> Thank you, pastor.