Canada's Wonderland Q&A: Everything You Need to Know

coming to the park today for the event. Um, this is obviously the uh Q&A portion. We are lucky enough to be joined by Peter Spitzer, who most of you met this morning if you hadn't met him already. He's our director of maintenance construction of the park, and Chris Mortonson, who is our park president. Uh, Chris has slightly delayed a vacation to be here for all of you. So, make sure YOU [applause] Thanks a lot for keeping them here a little bit longer. Anyways, over to them for the Q&A. Um, if everybody can just try to keep the noise down while we try and hear questions. >> Do we have a monitor for this or how we >> do you want one? >> I don't know if you need one, but uh how do you guys want to do this? You guys want to show hands or you want to come up front or you want to >> I guess whoever wants to ask a question, raise your hand and then stand up one at a time and ask it out loud. >> Well, that's great. I'm confused today. What are What are we building for 28? Is that a question? >> I think I think Peter has two rules, right? He can't can't talk about the future and what's the other one? >> Stop. Stop. If someone asks, we'll bring that rule up. >> Typically, we don't we don't answer questions about the future. We usually get that question in these sessions. What are you building next year? What's coming down the road? Um, all we can say is we're working on something and we're not going to say that. >> All right, first question here. >> What's your go-to fun fact that you tell people about Wonderland that you think the general public doesn't know? All right, we might both have one. I've got one. Um, it's regarding Wonder Mountain. Um, the waterfall on Wonder Mountain is our cooling tower for our chilled water air conditioning system in the park. >> So, the waterfall doesn't run. We don't have air conditioning on International Street. We don't have air conditioning in this building. Um, so does anyone know that already? >> All right. I've got one. and uh 312 Jake probably knows where this one's going. So there's a water fountain in front of the theater. And on the side there's panel that says drinky not and then there's a second panel every other panel it's uh it's blank. There used to be a plaque with the phrase on each of the Ultra 81. So it's covered all the way around. Uh I' I've tked some people here at the park to remember what that is and no one's gotten it right yet. So I'm still waiting for that. So once once someone finally gets that right, then all >> you tell us. >> We uh [laughter] I went back I found some historical photos from the year the park opened and those bikes didn't actually exist in the first year of the park, but they were added at some point before my time before Christmas time. But yeah, drinking not is a very important lesson. Wherever you go in life, if you find standing cool water, please [laughter] go. Okay, down here. >> What are your guys's favorite creation? >> Our favorite. Say it again. >> Creation. Um, so the question was, what's our favorite creation here in the park? Um, that's a tricky one. I've been involved with numerous projects. I think I told one of the groups today, I've been involved with every major or every addition to the park since Leviathan in 2012. Um, my favorite creation is probably all the cury finding finding a way to um make it fit in the park and have it fit through the mountain and thread the needle through the roof and out to the main gate back uh was a was a big puzzle, but being able to solve the puzzle and deliver it and have everybody love it is very rewarding for me. Uh, I'd say my favorite creation it was is really International Street and that whole kind of entry experience that you get when you enter the park each day. It's it's sometimes easy to forget how beautiful the park is with the the floral flag at the front. Uh, we're literally the only park in the world that has a mountain as kind of our Cinderella Castle at at the end of the street. So, I think that's uh pretty impressive. Still 40 45 years uh since the park opened and it will probably never be re recreated anywhere in the world. I got more. >> Well, who move it down here first? So, yeah. >> Is there any ride that we should have got that went to another park? >> Question was, is there a ride that we should have got that went to another park? >> Um, there's there's two that I know of. Um, some of you maybe have heard this story about flight deck or or top gun that became flight deck that became the air one. So, who who here has heard this story before? A couple or most of you. So, I'll tell it anyway for those who haven't heard it. When the park was deciding to add an inverted coaster, the plan was to put in a a coaster from Ballinger B&M inverted. Um, but the year prior to us installing ours, Cedar Point had installed Raptor and Cedar Point at that time was a competitor park to Canada's money and they had an exclusivity agreement with B&M that they could not build another one within a certain radius um within 5 years of Raptor opening, but Wonderland fell within that radius and Walter Bager did not sell us that ride. So we ended up with the intimate version instead. Um the other one that kind of went that way was Yukon Striker. So originally Yukon Striker was scheduled to be opened here at Kenny's one land in 2016. Um and it ended up going to C Point instead because Coint had done a bunch of work on the resort properties and they needed an acre ride to draw visitors to stay in the hotel. So, um, that ride ended up going to Ced Point, not our version of the ride. It was obviously designed for that site. Um, but ours opened in 2019 after uh, and I was just going to share uh, years ago years ago, uh, King's Dominion's version of Flight of Fear was actually, uh, talked about getting relocated here to Canada's Wonderland. Uh ultimately it did not, but it was going to go down where uh orbiter orbiter is or was uh over over kind of out where he was. So that that was the plan years ago. They were going to do that rotation, but that never happened. >> Uh going back to when I was a kid, uh do you guys ever plan on bringing back uh like the moving seats and things like that? So the question was regarding our motion based simulator um attraction. It was when it opened it was called Day of Thunder. Do we have any plans to bring that back? We don't currently have any plans to um to bring that ride back or or a version of that ride. There's nothing in the in the works, but like I said at the beginning, who knows what the future holds. Um maybe one day something like it would return but um yeah definitely not for 2017. >> Let's go. >> Um has there been any ideas out you worked on um Viking Rage uh ideas working with some of the other cycles and some of the other great flat rides we have on soaring timbers. I've seen uh YouTube videos of a ride called Air, which is the same ride in Europe, and it looks incredible the way that it cycles, where ours almost kind of slashes around a little bit. Not to be too critical, but could some of that cycles be, you know, tweaked up a little bit to be more or maybe even in the evening that something changes with some of these rides? So the question was we might explore uh modifying ride cycles to change the experience. Uh one example was um Saring Timbers. So Saring Timbers is one of four rides that were built by Montiel. They were all built as traveling rides. Our ride came from that circuit. It was a traveling ride. It was refurbished and uh made new again by Montiel. One of the changes that was made to that ride when we received it was we changed the u the propulsion system from a hydraulic system to electric. >> Okay. >> Um so it doesn't have the same um potential I guess to to to move the same way that it did in its previous life. Um I'm sure there there would be an opportunity for us to tweak it. I just don't know that we can make it as extreme as it ran as a traveling show ride. [clears throat] Other rides in the park, there may be opportunities for us to do that. Kirst. >> Yeah, Nightmares is one. Uh we need to do a significant rebuild on that over the next couple years. So there there is a plan to get Nightmares cut it back to where it used to be. Uh obviously Cliffhanger, we we got water feature back on that ride. Uh it's not as extreme as it used to be. We used to be able to program it manually. uh maintenance got took away that function years ago, but that was a lot of fun. Uh but yeah, we always look at all the rides to see see the potential. Uh we looked at Tundra Twister uh as well. Uh but that is a ride Peter and I have talked about it before. It's it's maxed out as as where it is now. So I know that's that comes up frequently and we looked at it, but there's not we can do it. >> Uh let's go right up here. What would you say both of your favorite parks besides Wonderland to visit? >> Question was, which are our favorite parks outside of Canada's Wonderland? Um, I'm a big Universal Studios fan myself. Um, both well all go to parks. I haven't been to Chris has been to to the new park. I haven't been yet. My my family really wants to go. Um, so that would be my answer. Uh, I would say for me, uh, Europa Park, uh, over in Roose, uh, Germany. That's a a fantastic park. It's really a show showpiece for for mock rides. Uh, and then they have a whole lot lots of other rides. Uh, just the the gardens, the atmosphere, the operations really. They've got everything dialed in. If you get a chance to go, it's it's highly worth it. >> Let's go back. Back. question was what do we do with the the used roller coaster wheels? So, uh many of you may know roller coaster wheels are made of multiple parts. So, there is typically an aluminum hub with a uh a group of bearings inside it with a spacers and then there's either a nylon or urethane rim. Well, some of those parts can be replaced. So the bearings we've replaced, the spacers we've replaced, the urethane outer rim can be rebuilt. So we take those used wheels, we put them in a crate, we send them to a factory where they remove the old urethane, and then they apply new urethane and machine it to the the proper diameter. So we have a crate maybe here two sometimes three times a year with hundreds of wheels in it. Goes by transport truck to that factory. It spends uh six weeks there or so being stripped and then remachineed or or rebuilt and then then shipped back to us and we install the bearings here and get them ready to go again. Um it's it's rare that we throw a wheel away. uh the wheel. The reason a wheel might be thrown away is if what we call the boss, it's the it's the bore that accepts the bearing. It it needs to have a certain tolerance. And if we get outside that tolerance and the bearing no longer fits snugly, then the wheel becomes garbage at that point. And we will recycle. It goes in a metal recycling bin and it becomes something else at that point. What's the uh specific process of uh deciding a roller coaster or a ride to the park and can you get specific on the process you use for deciding one of the major roller coasters here? >> So the question was what's the process about future ride selection I suppose um whether it's a roller coaster or something else. Um I can talk a little bit about that and then Chris can can add. Um our process is um looking at what does our park really need to service the guests and and bring guests to our to our site and bring them back to our site. So we've got uh a demographic [clears throat] that we try to appeal to. One is families with children >> [clears throat] >> um and the other is thrillsekers who want to do extreme things on on rides. Um so depending on what we need for a particular year, sometimes that's driven by what is our available uh funding. So we we could have a small year of of spending um we'll look for a smaller attraction to that. If it's been many years since we've added a major ride like Alen Fury, um then we would have a bigger pot of money potentially to invest that way. Um, but then there's other decisions that come into it. Where do we place the ride? Do we need to remove a ride to make way for that ride? There's there's many many decisions that have to be made along the way. Um, but it's it's a long process really um with lots of factors to to be considered. >> Yeah. And I'd also add just uh we do a lot of surveys and questionnaires. Uh I know one went up recently. I saw some screen captures of it. It's a an interesting survey to say the least. Uh but that that really helps drive uh decisions here. Okay. What what does our audience what does our passholders what do our guests what are they looking for as well? And kind of like Peter said, you know, it I I think probably everyone in this room, we're talking to the right audience and Peter and myself are also, you know, big coaster fans. We we always want the biggest, baddest, best thing or or the most unique or or fastest attraction, but that's, you know, it's it's a smaller demographic for that. So, we have to balance that between kind of, you know, the emerging markets or or or what, like Peter said, what what we're missing here at the park. So, you know, Alpha Fury definitely filled a void. I think, you know, from my return, from when I left, uh, you know, a coaster, you know, group, uh, like this didn't didn't exist 15 years ago, or if it did, it was very very small and very very niche. Um, so attractions like that really help kind of grow our audience on the thrillseker side as well. So, uh, definitely surveys is a big part. Kind of like Peter said, availability of of property or land. Um, so, you know, if Six Flags bought a a coaster from Atlanta, you know, where where does that go at Wonderland? You know, I'm not saying it's coming to Wonderland or not, but uh, you know, you have to look at the site that that would that would fit on. Um, so that that's also part of it. And then you see what what's out there. um you know what's new, what's innovative, what's cutting edge, uh what's been successful in other parks that we can kind of transplant uh to Wonderland and vice versa. So that that's all kind of part of the process. Um, you know, Peter and I attend IAPA frequently, uh, as well, and you can see, you know, again, what manufacturers are introducing um, and, you know, we have sales reps that that come up and visit us, and we go around the park and also kind of, uh, gain ideas from them. But, uh, a lot of the decision comes down to the park as well as through our park support center, uh, that's in in Texas. >> Are coming to the park, are they going to be more family centered or thrill centered? So the question was will the changes coming to park be family centered or thrill centered? Um that's a question related to the future. I can't uh can't answer that question. So you'll have to wait and see. >> Um let's go here with the >> Yeah. Thanks Peter and Chris. I appreciate you and everything. I had a question about mountain. You mentioned that it was such an iconic and unique centerpiece for this park and I don't know exactly what specific date the top two tiers of Victoria Falls were turned off. I was wondering why were they turned off and when were they turned up? Do you know when or why the top two tiers were turned off? >> Question was about mountain and the waterfalls. So you know about the main fall and its purpose. It's a it's a showpiece. It's one of the most photographed things here in the park. Uh it's probably the most photographed um uh site Chris is saying in Canada. Um you know, we we see millions of visitors here today and most people take a picture of that that site. There are there were two other uh falls. Um they were both fed from one pipe at the peak of the mountain. Um and those falls were show falls. They didn't serve any other function than show. Um and they when they ran uh they created other problems inside Lington. So when we introduced Guardian, Guardian um would sometimes become flooded from those waterfalls depending on which way the wind flew that day. Um it would cause problems in other parts of the building. So it is a a goal of ours to to restore them and to prevent that problem from occurring. Uh, but like anything, it depends on which fires are burning brightest and which ones you decide to take care of. Is it you put your money into getting nightmares to uh to become modern or you put your money into something else? Um, and Chris and I debate those questions. Um, and sometimes we have to make tough decisions about no, we're not going to deal deal with that right now. We're going to come back to that when we can. But, you know, hopefully that answers the question. Let's go for um so this question for both of you budget constraints. Um what type of ride? >> Uh so the question was if if budget or money wasn't an issue, what would we what would we build or or add to the park? Uh everything. Uh we we'd have as much as possible. Uh like like Peter, I think we we said like we we love rides. We love the industry. We love the business. Uh really there there's not a ride type out there I think we'd ever say no to. Uh but the budgetary uh you know aspects of the business and it is a business uh is very real and kind of like what Peter just said with you know [snorts] fires are are are the brightest we got to address first. But uh you know I think there's a lot of fantastic ride systems out there uh manufacturers that keep you know innovating and and modernizing their attractions. So, uh, you know, we'd love to see, you know, I know it's very popular, like an RMC ride. I think everyone would like to see that at some point. It's probably the number one question I get from from our guests is when are we getting one? Uh, so, you know, but like I said, I'm also a fan of that that uh that ride package as well. Uh, and, uh, a lot of the new stuff that Mob is doing is pretty exciting for the industry. So, I would I wouldn't say no to any ride out there, but uh, definitely those be kind of my top ones. I would really like to see a um an indoor aspect to the park that we could operate the park 365 days a year, whether it's indoor um attractions, hard rides, or whether it's indoor water park or combination of that. Um that's quite an ambitious project, but I think this market needs something like that. Um and that will be well supported by the community. So, um I'm sure I'll be getting it done before it would ever happen, but um I I think it well in this part of the world, >> uh just up here in the front. Um earlier today had the pleasure to hear your journey of of how he got to be the guy in turn real estate. What's your story like? How did you get to be the guy Wonderland in 2026? And it sounds like you have a history with the park through your work that I don't know. >> Sure. Uh so the question is kind of what's my background? How did I get to be uh you know park president Canada's wonder? Uh well first of all I have I have the coolest job. You know it's it's it's honestly the best job. even on the on the tough days, it's a lot of fun uh to be here. So, uh I actually started here in the attractions division uh back in O2 uh ride attendant uh 685 an hour drop zone and Wild Beast uh two of my favorite rides uh still in the park and just kind of from there fell in love with the industry. It wasn't my intent to to kind of be here. I went into school with business and urban planning and geography and that type of thing and then really kind of got hooked into the aspect and the guest aspect and the team uh building that that comes from this. So, you know, kind of just went up in the the layers uh lead supervisor, area supervisor, senior area supervisor, uh area manager, manager. Uh I got had a stint over in rides maintenance uh as one of the managers over there. Uh and then an opportunity at West Edmonson Mall came up. uh they're looking for a GM of their their indoor water park and uh it was a big leap for me to to leave Toronto in a place I love. Uh but it was it was an awesome opportunity and kind of again got to see a different aspect of the business. Got to do deal with food and beverage and and housekeeping and custodial and maintenance and divers and water quality. So I got to see a different side of the business. I was out there for 4 years and then uh the same owner the triple 5 Bianium family uh they also own all of America and American dream in Jersey. So, I got to move down to the US and be in New Jersey for American Dreams uh opening uh back in 2019 and uh was the was charge of water park um there. Our uh media day was going to be March 16th, 2020 and our grand opener was going to be March 18th, 2020. Uh so had 450 lifeguards and the whole thing ready to go and obviously that didn't happen. So, uh was down there for for pretty much 4 years. Uh then another opportunity came up to go out to Wisconsin at Nozzark water park uh America's largest water park uh in Wisconsin Dells and I was out there for about 3 and 1/2 years. Uh then this opportunity kind of came and uh the rest is kind of history but uh I think each of those experienced really helped me get to where I am today. uh you know, I don't I don't know a lot of things uh in in in the world or in the business, but I I I I typically know what questions to ask uh to kind of see where we can go forward. So, uh that's kind of that's kind of how I came came around to be back here at Wonderland, but I I wouldn't trade it for anything. >> We're uh we're really glad that Chris is back. [applause] >> Let's go here. So my group, was there ever a time you thought >> question was was there ever a time when we thought about replacing water mountain with a different centerpiece? No. There's never been a conversation about it. Um it is an icon that supports the four rides washing facility. Our our our air conditioning plant is is there. We've got high voltage distribution inside that building. We've got uh compressed air that we run to all the rides in the park um underground. Um it's quite a facility and and to replace it with something else would be crazy, especially because our short non-operating season is is so short to tear it down and replace with something else, it really wouldn't be feasible. Um it it couldn't happen. Uh, good gentleman towards the back of the middle there. >> I apologize. Sorry, the lights are my eyes. >> What has gone that you guys wish? >> Question was, uh, which have we removed that we wish hadn't been removed? And mine's pretty simple. it. And many of you maybe don't even know that it was here, but it was called the Great World of China. >> Yeah. >> Ride from Mach Rides. Um, and it's now running at Carolines, but it was removed to make way for Tomb Raider, which became tunnel. Uh, but it was a great family ride. It moved a lot of people and the kids loved it. I loved it when I was a kid. But, uh, that that's my personal. >> Yeah, I I'd say there's a couple for sure. Um I I I agree with Great World in China. Uh Zumba Flume, you know, kind of classic Flume Flume ride. Uh he's is, you know, sorely missed. Uh for sure. And and I'd actually say I just talked to the gentleman and his family earlier, Extreme Skyfly. I love a good sky coaster. Anyone that's ever worked on a sky coaster, they'll tell you how much fun it is. Peter obviously did it as well. Uh but it's a great it's a great attraction. It's kind of that that thrill that you don't quite get in other attractions here. So, but I think the the replacement is uh is pretty memorable. So, it all worked there. >> I'll go over here. >> What is your favorite flat ride? >> Uh for me, for me, it's Drop Zone. Uh uh sentimental reasons. Also, I love that uh freef fall sensation. Uh I prefer it much over the SNS towers. I think there's something just knowing it's literally gravity magnets uh and the PCU that's uh keeping me together. So, it dropped one for me. >> Mine is Cyclone. That ride weightlessness that acceleration it's pretty special to me. Um, >> just up here. >> Uh, trying to think. Was it intended to make Alvin Fury as loud as it is? >> Question was, uh, was it intended to make Alvin Fury as loud as it is? No, there was no intention to make it that loud. Um, we uh I mentioned to somebody this morning, um, we we're we're doing some work with, uh, different lubrication in in the wheel bearings to, uh, to try and quiet quiet it down. Um, we we think something's going on there as the season progresses with the lubrication schedule, the type lubrication we're using. So, our hope is to get it a little bit quieter. >> All right. So, there is >> Say it one more time. A little louder. >> Were there any issues that you guys ran into when building out? >> So, the question was, were there any issues encountered when we were building out the fury? Um yeah, there were a couple. So one issue we encountered was regarding foundations inside the mountain. Typically in this geographic area um we need to put in deep foundations. So it's a it's a drilled queson we call it. Um and sometimes they're down 8 10 15 years to get into um suitable soil to support the loads that we're imposing. Um and in in most cases when you're building these foundations you have a drill rate but if you move around and drill these deep foundations um and that was the case for many of them on Alpha Fury but many of them on Alpha Puri were also inside the mountain and dealing with drilling inside that building was quite challenging. We couldn't get drill rigs into some of the places where we needed to to to dig some of these. So some of them had to be done by um I call it by hand u and one of them in particular do with a hydrovac machine and a hydrovac is a giant vacuum. It uses compressed water to blast the the soil and then use a vacuum to draw the earth out of it. But this hole was 6 ft in diameter and it was about 40 ft deep. Um and it took us probably a month to dig. Um so it it was quite a challenge for us. Um luckily we were doing it in the winter when the soil was frozen. Um but uh the other one was related to fabrication. Uh when we built the ride, we we worked with um several different fabricators uh for the columns. We used one fabricator in Utah for the track, but we used fabricators here in Ontario. We used fabricators in uh two fabricators in Utah, uh one in Florida, um and one in Texas. And some of the fabrication that was done for these columns was not perfect. And we had to make field modifications to some of these column sections to make them make them work. I'm happy to say that all the columns built here in Canada were perfect. They were the best pieces. Unfortunately, unfortunately, some of the quality coming out of some of these US plants was not um was not perfect. So, um those are two examples from that project. >> Let's go. >> Um so, see point just six blacks just like Paramount has a lot of intellectual property. How much autonomy do you have as part of president in choosing meaning for a future interactive versus having to use what the parent company may want you to use? >> Sure. Uh so the question is IP uh intellectual property you know characters branding. Uh yeah so I think u you know obviously the the merger uh even though it's been 2 years it's still pretty fresh. So there's a lot of things we actually can't do in Canada uh because the licensing actually doesn't include us. Um so Warner Brothers for instance uh we're not able to to leverage that brand at this point. Um I I think it's it's probably too soon to make kind of a final decision on any IP uh all the properties. We're just we're really evaluating what we have right now. Uh but I I don't see I don't see Snoopy going away anytime soon. Uh it's very popular, more popular than I would have thought when we when we replaced Central with that HP uh years ago, but uh right right now we're we're just going to stick with CP. >> I've uh managed to go to several of our other parks recently and the surprise that I had was uh riding their wind seekers. They had music. Is there a particular reason why ours doesn't have to be audio track while we're writing or is that something like >> that? That's a great question. Um, we actually took the music a week ago. True story. True story. And then then it got struck by lightning. [clears throat] So if you're wondering why seekers down right now, uh, you know, one of the tallest structures or the tallest structures, second tallest in the park. Uh, so it's obviously a lightning magnet. So, uh, it it kind of fried our systems over there and our our team's uh, you know, the best of the best in the maintenance world. And, you know, when rides can't open for some reason, you know, it's it's a bigger issue. So, they're they're troubleshooting it right now. They they keep narrowing things down. We have some cameras up at the top. They all got fried. So, it was it was a pretty vicious storm last Wednesday or a week ago Wednesday. Um it was like a one in 100year storm um that we got and obviously uh Yukon Striker uh got got to kind of a little bath as well with that but to your point yes there there is uh park music uh just was turned on about but uh just before that storm. >> Thank you. You're welcome. The last um with improving safety technology and regulation changes, it seems like able to lower the height restrictions [clears throat] on certain favorites in the park like Vortex over the last couple of years. What goes into changing those height requirements and can we expect any rides in the park to have their height requirements forward in the future? >> Is height requirements? So, uh, you know, since I was here and when I came back, Vortex went from 48 in, uh, height requirement down to 42 in. And, uh, there's there's lots of, um, you know, standards and committees within Six Flags and the former Cedar Fair that really try to make sure we have standards across all the parks. So, one of the first things they looked at was, okay, all the light rides across the the the portfolio, where where are their gaps? So obviously the the arrow suspended at I believe at Magic Mountain was 42 in. So every everything gets manufacturer approved and I can't speak for the exact process on that one. The arrow is obviously not around anymore. Uh but manufacturer approval is the biggest part and and sometimes rides just built at different periods of time. It can be the exact same ride just have different requirements. Um, you know, I know when we installed uh Subies Revolutions, Zamp Beride, one of our other parks uh in the Cedar Pair Chain, we had that one for probably 15 years before, there's different requirements. So, uh, you know, as time passes, manufacturers, they evaluate, you know, they add restrictions, they remove restrictions. I think the industry as a whole has gotten a little a lot better actually and try to stay consistent. But when, you know, there's 45 properties come together, uh, we have to look at look at everything. And it's it's a big task. I did it when I used to be in ride ops on ride emission policy and uh obviously that just doubled in the last couple years. So that that's a big part of the process. But uh manufacturer approval is is number one if the manufacturer is still around and then government's approval. So we're with TSSA uh here in uh in Ontario. Uh different jur jurisdictions across all the states. Uh every state has someone different. Uh Alberta has someone different as well. So a lot of them look at um ASM as well for for standards. So there's lots of different moving parts and then we have a global safety a safety team uh for that enterprise and and we work with them as well. So there's a there's a few things that when I came back you know with spinator the height restriction increased and you know asked on that. So some have gone up and some have gone down and we've changed a few restraints as well. So all that's getting evaluated and and each year you never know but nothing nothing to report this. Um, let's go up there. >> Um, do you know, so I wanted to know, do you know do you know why uh do you know why some of the rides have shorter ride cycles such as Winder Clockworks and Swings Century and Nightmares? >> So question is ride cycle length and and it's it's good that you asked that because it it is different at different parks. Uh, as you guys know, Wonderland's the the number one attended uh seasonal theme park in in North America uh by by a long shot. And uh I'm sure you guys have all been here on those days where it's very very very busy. Uh so we we measure uh you know guest satisfaction a number of ways uh including surveys, including you know downtime. Uh but a big a big one that we look at is rides per guest. And it's how many rides a typical guest can visit uh on on a given day. Some days it's huge numbers, some days it's a it's a small number. You guys are probably going to be a very high number by the end of today. Uh but the way that we can we can tweak things there's there's a number of levers we can pull. Uh you know improving our operation, improving our downtime or our uptime percentage and then obviously cycle length. So there was a standard I believe over the last couple years um to kind of get them all around 90 seconds. Uh some rides it's just not feasible. Uh like Vikings raise that someone had asked earlier. We actually increased that one. So now it's at 105 seconds. So it's a little bit longer on that swing at the top. Uh so if there's a specific ride, uh let us know after and we'll take a look. Uh but but some of it's usually past the river. Uh when there's tens and tens of thousands of people here, we we got to get people through the rides as quick as possible. >> Let's go here. Uh, two little questions for you. What has been the very busiest day in the US? >> Uh, busiest day for me would be Canada Day 2008. I can't specifically get into numbers, but uh if anyone was here for Victoria Day, uh the Sunday, Victoria Day, and actually a couple weeks ago when we did fireworks, not not for Labor Day, but a few weeks earlier, uh that that's probably one of the busiest days that we've had. I think Brandon has some videos or or photos or something of of how full the parking lot is. So, uh those days are very busy. There is no maximum capacity uh on the park. It's more just a comfort capacity. Uh I it's it's tough on those days because if the atmosphere is great, there's lots of people here, but you know, back to the rides per guest, it's it's pretty low. So, that that was that was the busiest day I've ever been here, and it's one of the busiest days um in the in the history of the park. And then actually this past Victoria Day uh was in the last 25 years it was the busiest uh day in the park where there was a pa and there wasn't water park. So um we we felt it that day. It was it was a busy day. >> And then also your favorite ride and do you have a number of you can only do it so many times. What is that number? Have you ever reached it? >> Uh favorite ride I'd say favorite coaster is Vortex. I think Vortex is kind of a uh you know hidden gem of the park, so to speak. I think people write it off, but I think it's one of the best. I could ride Vortex probably all day. Albert Fury, I I'm a one and done. It's uh it's too much for me. I don't know how Peter does it. Uh but I wrote it twice in a day a couple couple months ago and I was like, this is just too much. But it's uh it's a fantastic ride. It's such a great ride. But that that's my limit on that one. All right. Uh, Bill's Bill's hat, but nothing about the future. [laughter] >> What's going on with row seven orange train on Alpha Library? >> So, the question was about Alpha Fury, row 7 that um there is an issue that was um came up this morning in the uh in the daily inspection that the guys didn't have time to resolve. So, uh we're going to leave it down this weekend and look at it this week. We want to make sure this all goods. >> Let's go. >> Would you guys ever consider [laughter] >> uh the question the questions on uh removing seat belts on the iPhone? Correct. Uh so that kind of going back to that committee. Uh there is a committee right now that's that's formed and they're actually looking at restraints um across again across the enterprise because we got to get consistent right like u you know just looking at all the other parks everybody's a little bit unique and what was required when those rides were put in versus us. So uh it's always considered but it's it's got to go through kind of that approval process. Uh take a look at springtime that's on my list for uh for seat belt adjustments. Uh when you guys are deciding to build a new attractions, whether it be like a flat ride or a roller coaster, what persuades you to choose like one manufacturer over another one? >> Question was regarding future attractions uh whether it's a flat ride or coaster and how we determine which manufacturer we're going to work with. There's a few um factors that we need to consider. One would be the history of that manufacturer and have we had a good relationship or a good history with that um supplier regarding support and reliability uptime all that. Another factor is um their production capacity. Do they have room in their in their window of manufacturing to provide what we need for that for that window? Sometimes manufacturers are I'm sorry we're booked up for the next 3 years. we don't have any work for you and we have to go somewhere else. Um, but those are the the two main reasons. Let's go. Uh, who hasn't asked question that I think it's your most aggressive I agree. sound amazing. It just resonates. >> Um I know that shut down later. question was about back up some coaster in the special effects up in the warehouse scene, I think. Um, and is there a chance to come back and why did we shut them down as soon as we did? Um, I don't recall the reasons that they were shut down. Um, at the time that they were shut down, it's it's not something that we're currently exploring bringing back. It comes back to that question of which fires are burning brightest and where do we want to put our resources. Um I can't say they will never be back. Maybe they will. I know that the kings on how we leave. Maybe that's something in our future too. I don't know. Um >> No, it's it's it's a it's a valid point. It's a it's a different ride experience without effects. But uh I think once it kind of went from a talent drop to Backbot, it kind of the theme kind of got a little bit watered down. She wanted to ask, "What do you feel the park is missing?" And it's not about cost or it's not about like with most things, but is there something that this park is missing that you would love to add sometime in the future? >> I I I think kind of like what what Peter was talking about before is lodging. I think that's uh you know, we we've got a different groups of guests that that come and visit us and on a day like today, it's going to be many many majority will be season passholders. Uh but during the summer season, there we call them outer markets. So basically uh you know anyone really 60 90 minutes plus away from the park. Um you know I grew up south of Lebanon Ontario. So you know when we when we came on a family trip here once a year you know it's a big 2hour drive to get here. You want to be here at 10 to 10 for rope drop and and to the end of the night and then drive home. So I think lodging is is a big thing that we're we're missing out on here. Uh I I I would love to get that in in the future as well. Okay, black shirt wild beast. Um, and are there any plans to retract it? Yeah. Um, we're well aware that it needs some work. Um, our hope our hope is that this winter we can we can tackle a portion of it. We don't have enough time um to do the whole thing. similar to how we tackled Mindbusters to do it in phases. Um the the great debate now is do we finish Mindbuster or do we move over to the Wild Beast? I think we're leaning towards moving towards Wild Beast. There's no decisions been made at this time. Um more to more to follow on that. Go up there. recommended like the weather um might bring in more guests um like more locals or whether there's a significant amount of tourist um here and whether there are any um bringing in or from other provinces or other countries like like I like Tell us how it is. >> Sorry, it's it's hard hard to hear. >> Could someone pull that door shut up there? Do you mind? Someone in the back. >> Just push the camera. A bit of noise coming in. >> Sorry. Yeah, noise coming in. Could you repeat that a little bit louder for us? >> Okay. Yeah. So I just want to know about whether um like Wonderland breaks or more tourists from like other continu more tourism into like adding hotels for happiness. >> Uh it's a great question. So it's it's really kind of our demographic mix. So we we we do have different different types of guests. We've got our our local season pass dart guests and then we have the we do have tourists. Um I think that's that's a big opportunity for us is to expand that tourism reach. Uh you know we are Canada's you know premier uh amusement park. Uh our goal is to become really Canada's premier entertainment destination. You know we're we're much more than than just hard park or water park. You know we've got events like the October Fest, Winterfest, Pawn, Tricks and Treats. Uh so that's really something we're we're working on. uh it does change kind of our our advertising strategy and and and Grace, she's a pro at this uh on on kind of how we target our our different audiences. So, we we do know there's um you know, there's there's gaps. It's hard to convince someone, you know, from Western Canada, uh you know, if they're going to come to Toronto for a week, we have to figure out, okay, how do we get them up to Wonderland for a day or two? And that's that's really really hard u sometimes to get th those people. Um, you know, I know a lot of us in this room and Peter and myself included, we we'll travel and we'll go see parks. That is a very very small group of people as you guys can imagine. So, uh, you know, we need to make sure that whatever we we add or or have here at the park appeals appeals to that. Um, so, you know, the special events is really something we're looking into. But, um, yeah, local local market uh, the majority of people actually live within 15 um, it's 15 miles is what our survey data shows. Uh so the most most people live really really close to the park. I I will say I have seen things change over the years kind of u even the demographics with our employees where they're coming from um and kind of you know now uh you know 25 years ago everyone that would come to the park they would drive 400 northbound get off at Weatherford. Now we see people coming from every direction. Um so you know how do we adapt to that and really how do we draw more more tourists out of that? Uh, I think I think there's a lot of potential for for us in the future with with those markets. >> Let's go red. Burg around marketing and some other parts of the chain. I thought great adventure did a very good job this year with project purple and that campaign leading up to announcement back is that sort of style of campaign where you're involving media and content creators more earlier in the construction process be something you consider when >> sure uh the question here is just related to great adventure Bakalana Bakanawa uh Michael will get mad at uh for that. But um yeah, I think I think that was a unique approach kind of um kind of grassroots and you know a lot of a lot of our structure has changed over the last couple years. So I think you know how we can involve the community and the the the content creator group I think is something that we we need to keep digging into as as we get ready to announce things. [clears throat] So maybe it's in a year, maybe it's in five years. I don't I don't know. We'll go right next to it. >> How do you guys pick crew of the year? >> Uh, so the question is how do how do they pick crew of the year? And uh I I'm not involved with that anymore. Um, but I know uh the operations uh team uh Bevendra, our director uh of operations and and the rides crew, Nick and Marcus and Carson um they they look at a lot lot of things. It's it's not just one singular thing. So, uh, ridership and, you know, how how close we are to getting target or exceeding target is is one part. Uh, guess compliments. Um, you know, we we we love getting compliments and you know, I I I have to remind myself every day cuz I obviously read all the feedback that that we get. Um, you know, and sometimes it skews on on the the not as positive side. Um, but when we do get those positive comments, it it really means a lot to us. So, so that's part of it. Uh, recognition. um you know just how the crew you know cleaning wise is the is the ride area clean are we getting the hair ties uh in the morning are we scraping gum in the morning uh that type of stuff as well so it's it's really it's it's multifaceted um and just a good crew that you know people people enjoy um enjoy the ride experience and you know a good crew can make or break uh you know an experience on on any ride. I know a lot of a lot of families uh comment about, you know, the kids ride. This operator was fantastic and and it's, you know, it's not a record-breaking ride, but it's something that they remember. So, I think I think that's a huge part of it is is just the the energy uh and what they bring to the guests. >> Um let's go. Um, this year Six Flags launched a chaperone policy and I'm wondering what effects has that had on the park as far as demographics of attendance, people who are coming and staying. I've noticed sometimes there's a lot more adults sitting on benches than I might have noticed in previous years. How's that affected as far as operations go? >> Sure. Uh, so the question is just about our shackle policy. So, I I believe it was introduced last haunt for for Halloween and we obviously extended it throughout the summer and uh you know from for myself living in the US um you know I I've seen kind of these teen takeovers or these like kind of um I don't want to say like mobs of people but it it can be very distressing and it can really negatively impact you know our our our core demographic which is really families. So, so the decision was um you know h how do we try to keep uh you know any any issues outside of the park and and not have it brought into the park. Um are there good kids that that get denied coming in the park? Sadly, yes. But, you know, the whole point is if you're a 9-year-old, you really need to have like an adult or a 12-year-old, an adult with you here at the park. Um I I would say, you know, again, I get security reports. I get all this stuff. Um it it it keeps the issues outside of our park. Uh I think that's better. I think that's better for everyone uh here. So, you know, I was I was unsure of it when I when I came back because I thought, you know, how this is going to impact us. Uh but overall, it's very positive. I I think it's one of those policies that a lot of a lot of people don't even really know is happening. Uh but it really keeps the park atmosphere much safer and much better. So, uh it's it's definitely continuing in in the future. Um but I I I I appreciate the the question. Uh, what are your favorite companies and colors? >> Our favorite roller coaster companies and >> colors. >> Colors. Um, in my The question was my favorite roller or our favorite roller coaster companies and and colors. Um, I don't pick the colors. Um, I may have a a voice uh upon a selection from options. Um but but yeah, the colors are done by a design team. Um with input from the park, obviously favorite manufacturers. Um I've got a couple uh art engineering out of Germany is excellent to work with. Uh they're very skilled. They provide very reliable um and easy to maintain equipment. They really focus on making sure that that product is going to run and run and run and run. Um, the other one is is B&M. They're very much the same way. They really want the equipment to be reliable and they want it to be safe. Um, but those would be my my two. Chris, I don't know. >> Yeah, I I definitely I I think all the manufacturers, they all have their place and and what they excel at. I I think uh you know, BF B&M, of course, uh it was it was really cool to be part of ride operations when we when we introduced our first one here uh back in ' 08. Uh but I I think you know kind of like Peter said it really comes to the support. You know it's uh the after aftermarket support and uh you know there's there's a lot of uh you know great great feedback from BNM and Peter can talk about that for hours of of the additional support they've done with Leviathan and other attractions over the years uh just to make them better or like the small small tweaks we need to to get uh fixed up. But uh yeah B&M um is is always a favorite. But, you know, I think Ginsman, Makoma, I think all of them have their have their pluses as well. Color-wise, I I do I really like Leviathan's uh color color scheme. >> Let's go here. >> Most iconic ride. I I think um currently and I can say pretty confidently it's it's Leviathan right now. I think that's uh you know our statement piece and it's hard to believe it's 14 years old at this point. Uh you know it'll dominate the skyline for at least for now. Uh I think Alvin Fury though is is starting to catch up. I I know from um from a merchandise standpoint uh you know we've obviously got Behemoth and Yukon and and Leviathan and Albin and the Leviathan merchandise sells significantly more than all the other ones. Uh even Alen Fury on its first year. So that kind of indicates to us uh you know okay what's driving people to to purchase those items. It's obviously you know a favorite and it's and it's it's the biggest in in Canada. So it's pretty cool. Uh we do have like 3 minutes left, so maybe we can take a couple more questions of people that haven't had a chance uh to ask questions um yet. Um all right, we'll go up here first. >> Speaking of merchandise, how do you select merchandise for cars? I went to a couple different ones in the states this year. Like my favorite my favorite one here has got to be the uh next the new era hats. >> Okay. >> Whereas in the States, they are really I don't know if it's just me, but I something that's like chain wide or how do you choose which merchandise? >> Uh so the qu question is just about merchandise and selection and quality and kind of design. Um I I'm just kind of getting into that right now at this point. So it we actually start ordering and planning merchandise for next year now. Like that's like that's already happening. Same with games and plush. So all those things start about now. So I'm just kind of getting into that. Uh we do have a really great merchandise team here. um if you guys have ever seen them uh in the park, sometimes they're kind of behind the scenes, but we do have a couple folks that have been in charge of product development and selection and and your your feedback will mean a lot to them. So, I'll uh I'll pass that on. I think what we've been finding is uh things needs to say Canada's winner. It needs to say, you know, the rides needs to say the attractions. You don't want something that you can go down the street and get that's kind of off the shelf. You want unique and higher quality stuff. So I think uh what the the CW store at Front Gate uh what they've been selling this year that I've seen I've been very impressed. So um that's that's really good uh question. Uh so a lot of it comes from uh you know again park support collaborating with the parks. Every every country and every park has different uh you know sizes of guests has different tastes and preferences and guests in the Canadian market. There is some nuances with that as well. uh but but they they help collaborating with the kind of the group buys as well. But uh over the last few years, we've had a lot of control over uh some of the styles. So I'll pass that on. We'll go uh uh I can't see Brandon. >> Yeah. >> All right. >> I have two questions. Sorry. One of us skip is there any way you can tell us some of the other manufacturers? >> [laughter] >> turn off your cameras. >> So, um the question was Alpen Fury and the other manufacturers that may have been considered. We um with every project we do, we look at multiple manufacturers. Um and I can say that we talked to I think there were five in total. Um I don't think so. We did we did talk to to B&M. Um we also talked to Tekoma. Um we also talked to Art and we talked to Mach. Uh and for a variety of reasons we settled on Premier. Um but those were the the five that that we received proposals from. And for a variety of reasons, like I said, we settled on Premier Ride. What was the followup question? Um, I guess you wondered pretty how you guys make decisions now since we flat rid that. So question is kind of, you know, we're we're well-rounded park, we we've got, you know, we've got the water park, we've got the theme park, uh we've got the entertainment, uh you know, kind of how do you how do you kind of expand and build off of that? Um I events I think is is an opportunity for us uh you know, this this year we did uh additional fireworks shows and uh you know, not just from an atmosphere standpoint, but from a guest satisfaction standpoint that really connected with with a lot of our folks. uh on those surveys I was talking about earlier. Fireworks is the number two uh reason that people come to to to the park um from from that. I can't tell you what the other uh questions on there, but uh that that's a big driver. So, I think you know expanding our entertainment um program and and our our offerings with festivals and that type of stuff. That's that's something we have to ramp up over the next couple years. And then just yeah, just try to see which which voids we have and attractions uh you know that that guests like. And and that's the great part about this industry is uh you know Peter and I know people across across really the world and it's it's always great to to hear oh this you know this product was you know a stellar addition to our park. It it increased our attendance or you know it satisfied this need or you know maybe avoid this this attraction that uh we had to rip it out after a few years. So that that's that really helps us as well with kind of making some decisions. >> All right, we got two more questions. We'll go uh down here uh in front of you. Yes. Or go along here. Y >> favorite holiday event. Uh for me it's Canada Day. Um I I think uh the celebration Canada was new to me that we didn't have that before. Uh we're that was um but to me I I love Canada. I think it's the best day to work at the park. Everyone's in a great mood. uh all of our hour in the team, they get time and a half. So, uh they love working that day. All the rides are running full capacity and all the stores that day as well. So, but Canada Day is a lot of fun. It's it's pretty special that we're, you know, we're Canada's, like I said, Canada's premier uh theme park and school to celebrate that here at the park. I'm behind. >> Okay. There's been a lot of interesting music coming up in the park recently. Um and some of his stuff we can't find available for us to listen to it. >> Uh so question is about uh park soundtrack. So uh that's something that we've you know we really wanted to try to bring the theme pack back into the theme park and and to me music music is everything and I know I know that's for a lot of people. So a question is like will that music be available? Uh I don't know at this point. I know a lot of it is uh we we pay licensing fees so we can play you know songs that you do know and do recognize. Um I I don't know if if we can ever distribute that. Uh but we try to pick music selection for each area that that really kind of fits with the theme. So uh our our team in-house uh put together the the music in in Expo um and then as well as in the Alpenfest area and Medieval and International Street. So uh Action Zone I think is next uh for person music um but that might not be till next year. All right, let's do Okay, who who has the most burning question? All right, first person to stand up. [laughter] >> All right, I was up here at the front. >> Uh, following up on Ride Cruise, I'd say Wonderland and Seed Point probably have the best train crews in North America. Does Six Flags headquarters look at that and do you think they're going to try and standardize that across the park? I know the merger is slow. >> Sure. So, uh, the question is, thank you very much for the compliment. That's that's totally for our our attractions and ops team. So, I'll pass that. Uh, just about about the crew. Um, crews in the park are generally very very well um, efficient. Uh, same with Cedar Point. Um, so yeah, there is there is these it's a stand SOG or standard operating guidelines that we have at all these parks. Um, so it looks at minimum number of positions, that type of stuff. to to me it really a good crew really comes from the leadership at the ride. Um I think it it starts with the the team leads and and the supervisor really just setting that tone setting that expectations. Uh the rides teams they've worked I got to give a lot of credit to them. They've worked really hard this year and and kind of like I was talking about that rides per guest. We compare across all the comp across the entire chain. So I can look at every single park. I can I can drill down to Windseeker at this ride, Windseeker at this park, and Windseeker at our park as well to kind of compare. So, uh, healthy competition is always a good thing as well. But, uh, I I'll I'll make sure they they hear that. And they they do have, uh, regular calls and then they do have regular meetings as well. But, uh, that's that's awesome to hear. So, thank you for that. Um, this concludes the the Q&A session um, today. Thank you very much for participating. You guys have been a great group. Um Chris and I will hang around a little bit if you've got a question you were too embarrassed to ask or you didn't get a chance to ask. Um, so you have the leaders