Calais Selectboard - September 14, 2026 [CS]

I'll call the meeting to order. Um, and the first item up on the agenda is an update from uh Stephanie and Katherine on the community nurse program. So, how how would you like to dive into what what you've found so far? Um, and we can take a conversation from there. >> Yeah. Um, I think you want to know if you want to review. >> Uh, well, it's been quite some time uh since we had the fairly comprehensive uh presentation. um and my takeaway certainly from that was that um uh was that there's there's a lot of different ways they can be formed and funded and um and and part of uh what the takeway was is there's going to be more research uh by by the two of you on on what what could be kind of a right-sized uh approach for for callus or one that we may want to consider um uh coordinating with uh with adjoining communities. But um um I I think it without spending too much time on explaining what what the community nurse program is, I guess there could just be a refresher on uh on on what a community nurse position is and what they wouldn't wouldn't do. and then uh and and maybe five minutes on um uh how how that could look I guess in in Callus or or in collaboration with surrounding communities. That makes sense. >> Yeah, that sounds purpose. So the first thing we talk about is we're trying to remember what's our purpose tonight, why are we here? And I think the main the main overall thing is that we want to know if the town will take this program on and there are we'll talk about the funding later but just you know we figure based on you know Kristen Munich Kristen she presented from the uh the community nurse connections she did a presentation and we've talked with her a couple times and you know the sort of the I'm just going to give you the bottom line and then we go into the detail, but the bottom line would be we would hope to start out with 10 hours a week. And we figured it would cost up to 30,000 a year. And that's sort of the bottom line. And what we're asking is, and we will tell you all the reasons why we think that the town should take it on. So just so you know where we're coming from and then we'll tell you we'll do a quick review just >> okay so um one of the things you know what is a community medicine that's someone who's who's um employed by either an organization or a town or whatever and they're they do holistic care they do not do direct medical care they are more of a person who helps um the it's based for the elderly and we have 33% elderly age 50 in this town. Um we did a small uh survey on town meeting day and it was resoundingly positive um the um responses um but the uh the nurse um helps with um goes into the home so it's always home visits. She establishes trust. She does um medication um um she makes sure their medication is okay and um that they're taking it appropriately. She does she offers resources for them. She makes sure there's enough food. She makes sure that their home is safe. Um it decreases um isolation. It decreases 911 calls. Um, and it makes not like the individual that is on a boot like ultimately putting she she doesn't do you know she's not a doctor. She doesn't do medical care with people but she can assess people's health. She can refer them. If she feels like somebody needs to see a doctor she can arrange them. Right. So, one of the primary positives is that they don't deal with insurance. So, um you don't have to have a doctor's orders um due to your nursing care, but um any nursing care did not require a doctor's order and you don't we're not dealing with insurance. U Medicare is great except for the fact that it is very limited. Um and they tell you what you can and cannot do. So if someone doesn't meet certain criteria, they don't get that service. Whereas we could go in and say we do need that service or we can help them find resources for that service. Um what else? Well, also you talk you talk about doing community education also. There's medications under health >> at any type of any town event. >> It's also to as many notes about it that you know it's basically it educates people about illness, disease prevention, safe health practices, how to obtain healthcare services. facilitated in order to produce health outcomes. Well, the idea is we have a bunch of old people in this town and nobody's looking out for them. Nobody's looking after them. They don't have family members living with them or close by who have time. There's there's nobody looking after a lot of the older people in this town and a lot of towns in Vermont have community nurses and um they're old really really well received and just to remind you that this community looks at home and actually community nurse connections the work they're they're there in order to help uh organize community nurses help establish them, help support them, get grants, help them get grants um for ongoing. That was the other thing about how are they how are they funded um with the funding of um startups by anybody else. >> They they get to help you start up that that that's why they exist. They exist to help communities start up community nursing home programs and also to help them ongoing. The one thing that they Kristen did uh suggest we actually talked to somebody about this in in other towns and um uh she suggested that we don't um join with another town because many times um the intent or the interest or the um mission purpose whatever you want to call it of one town does not meet the same as another town. So once we're established and you want to seek out more people, then that's an easier way. You've got your goals, you've got how you want to handle it, and you can ask another community to join us together. >> Um, >> thank you, Jordan. >> No problem. Sorry for my arrival. >> Um >> yeah, >> there's uh also um really good evaluating. So we evaluate the program. Again, community conventions can establish some um good evaluation processes across the program as well as annual review of the nurse performance. So, I always have some on the pulse, so to speak. Um what's happening? >> Does uh the community health connections, they're nurse connections, they're out of Maine, is that right? No, they're right in um rather than >> Oh, okay. Um do they also have I guess um generic policies and like procedural documentation uh for that kind of help govern how the nurses interact with with the public. Um I don't think they have an IA overh. >> Um so when you choose a nurse you should be looking for a registered nurse. Uh one who has assessment skills, one who has experience and um the board of nursing is what declares how we have to nurse um not that organization. your evaluation or your review, your annual review of the nurse tells you how how it's going with the public, how they're interacting with the public. Um, so you get feedback that way. Do they have guid guidelines on us? they tell us I think more or less they're going to suggest um what we can do and not do not telling us but this is a good you know your community seems to need this so therefore let's look at how we can support that and get that um done >> but did I hear correctly that uh community nurse uh connections will help um facilitate or perform that that annual evaluation >> perform it but they'll help establish a robust evaluation program or also a template for um nurse um performance and they suggest that you they also have suggestions of people that you should get to do that. One thing that they did um Kristen did tell us what I mean when is that one problem it is there is is um with non-medical people are starting to evaluate the nurse it can create a problem that's usually when you see towns um programs forward >> um more questions but let's open it up to other select board members to ask any questions up to this point. >> My initial question was just um you mentioned other communities in Vermont. Um do you can you say you said a number you know many other communities in Vermont and I'm just curious who that is and if there's anyone nearby that's >> Well um I talked with Woodbury. Okay. Um there was someone who was initially interested in in maybe being um a community health nurse and then um that person declined and decided and also the town declined >> at this time. They didn't have enough information and they didn't want to do that. Mhm. >> Um so we not only talked with her but also with town um uh >> um >> um and so they're not ready to make that decision although they think that it would be a great idea and they were thinking of having it be part of a fire department. >> So there's other avenues of of doing it. Um also uh you know my thought process was >> wisknit and I used to be the sign officer also >> were but were there Stephanie I think you mentioned that there are other communities that do already have existing programs. >> Yeah. I think I think origin and um I want to say I think yes are together um and there's one and each other might be one >> so it's in that um Valley area because she too, but she does all this her just do a search because they're more and more popular obviously one at >> I'm familiar with the one in town that's in the Hampshire where they that they have some somebody funded them and they they that is available for children for children. I mean it's not just elderly people. They have money that somebody funded them with. >> Yeah. >> But they do a lot of fundraising. I have I lose them in town with me. They have a lot they do a lot of fun. The town itself they they have the office of the committee nurses right in the town offices. They're so supportive and the town raises money, but they're also set up. was set up like um a health care facility because they actually have a doctor who's um >> that's that's not what I understand but it doesn't matter. The fact is that they have a lot of support that's important town really supports >> right and person says it's growing it's becoming a nationwide >> thing because there it's so hard to get in to see your provider and um and to know the resources and we are such um a country where we our expanded family um our nucleus family is is all over the United States so we don't have that um extended family >> um other other questions yeah >> um couple things one is um when Kristen spoke with us on in January she mentioned something about um the first year or two um funding the program through donations as a way to sort of build the program and it also sort of generates I think she was saying support um and sort of testing how how supportive people are but but am I remembering that correctly do you remember that part of the discussion >> I think that was one of the um suggestions that she had yes >> um yeah anyway that's something we should keep in mind and the second one was um just if we could see the results of the survey if you compiled those from town meeting. I don't I don't know that we never saw >> that. Yeah. Um so I'll have to see where I can find those. Um because I did compile they were originally going to have a meeting shortly there after you know >> I just wanted to say for my personal experience of having to my husband You know, we have a means to hire caregivers right now, but it is shocking to me because I have a lot of contact with people. It is shocking how little resources are available. How little care is available for the people. It's really unbelievable. You You have to have financial resourc. There's just nothing out there to help. There's just nothing. There's like a there's something if there's like a $2,000 a year grant for the caregiver to have respit. You know, that's about what you get from the government right now. You get nothing. Medicare does not cover caregiving. That's not what they do. And you know, Medicaid does, but then you have to be eligible for Medicaid. So, you know, I would just say this health care system is horrible. It's a mess. And anything we can do as a town to help people in this town, I think, is really just critical to you. Yeah, I completely agree. I one of the places my mind goes is, you know, we've been bouncing around the the number 10 hours a week and as somebody who's helped various community members with various things over the years and dealing with getting cocaine turned back on or whatever, there's like a hund things everyone needs. um where you find that sweet spot of you know if we launch this and 10 hours a week means you know there's a six month wait for a visit what does that mean for the direction goes I guess and it yeah have found that 10 hours a week is you know a reasonable amount >> it's very small but Yeah. >> Well, devil's ad just kid there. I think that, you know, relative to the need in rural communities, um, you could have a program that is intended to be a toe in the water approach from, you know, both a cost and logistics standpoint. And then, uh, you know, the feedback from the community is negative. is not enough or doesn't it doesn't seem like the program is fulfilling its obligation or intention because you've >> either have folks who are high need high use or high engagement. Um and and it it'd be hard to >> it could be hard to manage kind of the equitable access to uh to the resource without enough hours being allocated to the individual uh individual role. Um, you know, I I think I'm I'm I recognize the need and I'm sympathetic to the uh to the cause. >> I my immediate concerns I think are around the >> recording in progress. >> Um, of the role. I I mean it's a relatively specialized skill set and a a specialized individual who would need to be hired for it and that is even on a part-time basis is is an employee that the town doesn't have the experience in managing the a relationship with that kind of employee. Um um you know it it would I would think I would be personally uh would be more comfortable with entertaining um a part-time aotment of hours. um if if the role was quote unquote owned by another organization that already kind of specializes in man managing those services like in in an ideal world um that very from a lay perspective like um Council on Aging or or maybe one of the nursing organizations that um that already engage with those communities. in a particular way and um and I I understand Stephanie that they don't do this but that's what I was saying that neither does the town >> and so the liability and the logistics around managing an employee with with that kind of specialization is is kind of a is kind of a leap. Um uh >> what is your um what is your here is you're talking about managing managing someone with that expertise you're hiring someone with expertise they're hiring someone experience >> doing this >> not doing any medical care >> so they're offering resources and guidance and education all things that nurses do. >> But even even doing even performing like an annual evaluation of the program or the service like that that is something with the support of community nurse connections like they they'll have the resources to kind of help guide give us like best practices there. that that that is a a level of evaluation or a program needing evaluation that that that is outside of the scope of you know the the normal individuals or like certainly the members of the select board or to our current town administrator like we do evaluate programs and roles but they're um they're they're not these types of programs and roles. >> No, I think um EV valuation is more of a satisfaction type of evaluation according to the websites but I've read um again you're you're correct you absolutely do not not have any managerial experience evaluating >> and I wouldn't want you to yeah >> I would think most times people wouldn't want you to >> because that's not a fair shake for either person. Um, have you So, I just I did Google um Norwitch because they have they have a separate 501c3 that's the their Norwitch community nurse um program and so that's a and and it's you know underwritten by the Norwitch Women's Club, the Burns Foundation, Muskoma Bank Foundation, Norwich Lions Club and we know and generous citizens of Norwich. So we know that's a larger community than than callous and I think the so I'm I'm uh I I very much agree that this is something that a community should be could support given the context we have in our healthcare environment and our demographics. Um, but I, you know, I just question whether it's something we can handle ourselves. And I really appreciate you, you know, leading upfront with like we all know this is probably a need and given and only an increasing need in our community at the same time as there's dollar um value associated with it that's quite high given the taxes we're you know facing and and so forth in our community. So it's it's almost the um the momentum around it is something that's you know there there's a there's sort of a continued effort around education for there to be really a groundswell of support for such a thing it seemed it would seem to me. Um, and the other comment I would just make is and and I'm sorry to say that a lot of folks you're saying Stephanie your own experience. This is, you know, this is unfortunately how we've learned, right? We have our own experience or we see someone else's our neighbor, we're helping our neighbor and it becomes too much or we see it and that's when you when you know that this kind of thing is so valuable. So, um, anyway, you know, it's it's just really palpable to me that that's part of the education process. Um, the the mention you made about Woodbury looking at this is affiliated with the fire department does feel like a an interesting scenario to explore further. Um, I I'm not concerned about sharing resources, you know, as well as I do. We're our towns, you know, to people right across the road that are in other than that, you know, I don't I don't I'm not concerned about coming to agreement about what the purpose of such a >> such a role would be. Um, it takes work, but I think, you know, that's worth work worth doing. Um but a larger group of people um spreading the cost is I think essential. There's absolutely you know I just have no you know I mean it would take you know administrative time to also secure additional support um from the community or area businesses that kind of thing. Um we're not a community that has the central business sector. So, um, we're we're we struggle, um, for that reason as well. So, um, lead me back to where Jordan was around, you know, some of the programs that already exist and is there a way we could be, um, you know, collaborating with with other agencies that are providing support that there could be a base somehow. And I I don't mean um the agencies that are already stretched that that can't actually provide the support we're talking, you know, um it's it's more the um anyway, something similar to the, you know, meals on meals scenarios and the volunteer support that's happening um touching base with our community members that could somehow be in that space. But just there's a more drilling down to do it seems to me on making it an affordable option that we could actually pursue. Is that >> I agree. I mean my take is that uh we don't want to spend another year talking about this. We want to um we want the select board to feel um good about bringing a proposal to town meeting. >> Yeah. >> Whether to fund this or not. And I think you probably want more definition about the cost benefit of of this program, >> right? >> And I don't know, maybe maybe I could help with that. I mean, I'm just thinking like you're you're wondering, okay, how are we going to fund it the first year, first two years, first three years, >> how are we going to manage the program? Even if we're not managing managing this person, they're going to be an independent contract very soon. But how how is how is the town government going to evaluate and and and and just coordinate and and work through all the things that a first year program needs to pay. >> So >> but in listening to your concerns, I'm just wondering about other towns. I'm not familiar with the details, you know, and the size of other of every other town that has a nursing program, but it'll be interesting. I think really look into it and find out how the other towns do it more size than northern size. >> Right. Right. Exactly. >> Towns that don't have a that don't have a business sector, you know. I mean, we don't even have a bank an ATM bank um here. We have an ATM. Yeah. And we love our businesses that are here, but they're not um Yeah, in the you know realm of animal sponsor something like that. So >> um so Stephanie do you feel like you have the ability to talk to other towns? I mean that is something that I am um willing to do. >> I don't I'm not surprised but um but I I think that's imperative. We have to talk to people in town where it's working instead of town. So, >> um I think we need to find find out would the community connected to the town. >> I'm sure they do. I mean, >> yeah. And they're together little but just talking to Kristen and getting I'm sure she's getting the names of every town and the contact. Well, that's what I mean. If I don't mind talking and finding that information out and then maybe we can figure out where >> Yeah, I I think that makes sense. And if you could coordinate or or at least kind of keep parry so when you kind of get that information and and I I I think to keep things most efficient >> that having having a proposal so to speak of something that is right sized or at least some some comparisons to go from >> um and and I'm a good >> and I think like I I'm already kind of seeing like just because we're rolling into budget season um uh being able to carry on this conversation as we're looking at budget allocations and and preparing articles and that sort of thing. Uh going into a town meeting, I I think about the uh the community funds and and the um uh that we separately fund. Uh >> that's one thing that um Christie had mentioned because she looked at uh um data and um >> she said this town is jealous. >> She said we we do pay a lot to a lot of organizations because she said you know our >> Yeah. So take not that would I mean that was so good. >> No I don't I I certainly don't disagree and and I I think that putting putting the comparing the value of a program like this as opposed to uh being you know more broadly generous to other programs that may have over overlapping values or functions or that sort of thing. like maybe this is something where we want to redistribute some funds to to help to help offset the cost of a program like this. Um and and I think that that's a conversation that's healthy to have. Um and and how do we go about like getting community feedback on on making that kind of decision in a budgeting process. So >> I I want you to be careful with that because um what I'm hearing saying is they have the same function and I don't believe they do. >> I I not the same. I I I don't mean to imply that. No, not necessarily. U but having gone through this budgeting process a number of times, you know, a $30,000, you know, funding a $30,000 annual expense is like is uh a couple of percentage points and um and cost to the taxpayer uh through the through the budget. and uh and and we go through a very mindful process of of weighing what the impacts of those are and where we might where we might be able to reallocate. Um anyway, um it would be interesting just to if if we had to make a decision like that, what I was trying to say or get to is that um it's hard to make those conver make those decisions in a vacuum. And so how how do we want to go about trying to uh get feedback from the community saying like okay this is that important like and we want to fund this. Do we is it something that we are taking funds away from in another area to apply it to uh initially or uh I mean I think that that's a conversation that needs to be had and that's feedback that you know that a select board would want to have um uh through through a budgetal process. Anyway, Christy, thank you for uh willingness to um continue to reach out to um uh other communities uh about their programs and for offering to help bring some organization to it and we'll we'll find an opportunity to bring it back on the calendar money that's coming to Vermont for rural healthare. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I remember we talked to Chris Kristen about it a while ago and we were talking about how it's pretty interesting. How can they get it? How can they get some money? I'm going to contact her because it's really been in the news lately that there's all this money coming into Vermont and you're scrambling to figure out how to use it. >> Yeah. you know. >> Yeah. >> Uh so I want to contact Kristen and ask her if she's made any progress or has gotten anything because that's one of your organizations that one you think is quite qualified some of this. >> Um so I want to be mindful of time. I really do appreciate you guys uh coming back in and and providing an update on the work that you guys have done to um to keep this conversation going. Um, and uh, I think in the next couple of months we'll we'll try to get it back on the calendar and dedicate some more time to talking through some some options and how that may play out leading into town meeting. >> Thank you. >> Uh, the next agenda item up is a conversation about Berry Mountain Road and we've got Card and Nancy. >> Yeah. enough. This is how I >> letter. Um I wasn't going to read I think it probably just saves the most time to actually just read this. >> Um and some various other things. >> Are these the same >> the pictures are all different? There's only one set. >> Okay. Okay. >> Yeah. We're supposed to answer already. >> Um, um, N are concerned that recreational traffic on Woodbury Mountain Road is causing excessive long-term damage to the road. Um, the traffic which includes four-wheelers, sidebysides, motorcycles, and mud trucks may be more common than most people think. On any typical weekend day, there are dozens of vehicles that go by county, but I don't think it's a stretch to say that upwards of 30 or more rates pass their house, but most of the ones that go up do end up coming back. Uh there's even Facebook groups that actively encourage people to use the road for recreation. Quick Facebook search mountain road many posts that included organized groups that plan riding their members as well as individuals mentioning the road and encouraging others to ride there. We are not against people enjoying the road or using it for recreation at all. In fact, many of our friends use it often. We even enjoy sometimes seeing the different vehicles pass by. But if the town is protecting these areas as recreational areas, as indicated by the research recreation district overlay, then the town should count not count on only the people living on the road to bear the burden of the cost of keeping the road usable for recreational purposes such as walking, hiking, biking, sightseing, and exploring. Um, some of the things you're seeing bullet points, heavy recreational vehicles putting additional wear on the road surface. um sideby-sides ATVs, motorcyclist using the road regularly, particularly during warm months, increased traffic beyond what you would normally expect from a road primarily serving residents who live there, additional impact on drainage, ditches, covers, and road conditions. Social media and Facebook post actively encouraging people to use these roads for recreation, which increases traffic. Uh class road has limited uh has limited resources when we have significant recreational traffic, especially vehicles that put an additional burden on the road. people would depend on it for access to their homes. Whoever told this current select worth even being even considered closing the road past our house in the spring due to the damage caused by those vehicles. Seems reasonable to think that the damage occurs all along the road, not just in certain sections. Uh if one of the reasons for having land on preserve for recreational use, the town should have some responsibility for it sub beyond what would be typical for a class 4 road. We're not asking for the road to be designated as class 3 road. some additional maintenance occur when conditions are warranted samples. That's our basic statement. Other observations, >> you know, also all the vehicles come up and they have big gnarly tires and they go up on a pretty steep hill and they just chew it up and as they leave Blueberry Mountain Road again, they're just and you know, they like to spin out and they're, you know, all squirly and stuff like that. And um one day I came home and there were eight brand new Jeeps from Jersey parked all over the lawn letting the air out of the tires. And so this is >> parked on your lawn, >> which I don't I don't I didn't really care. Sergeant is pretty crappy anyway. But um uh it's it's remarkable how well known this Woodbury Mountain Road is. And we're and we're often helping the people. People, you know, break down and they they bicycles, um motorcycles, other vehicles, they break down and I don't whatever. I guess that doesn't really have anything to do with it. But um it's a very busy >> busy road. >> Yeah. And and also we understand like I I know the town does not want to set the president that oh Basco roads we're going to take care of we're I think we're in a different scenario because of the recreational resource repres that the town is necessarily encouraging people to go up there but it's being preserved for that reason for the people that are just walking or biking or you know taking their dogs for walks up there. So um we don't I know you don't want to get into a mess of other people asking for the the cross to be taken care of but if you look at the town of Dallas where the overlay is where the roads go maybe the literally the only one where there is a path that goes up to the reparation that is heavily used >> um and there may be others similar but nothing like to the extent that it's >> it's also the only one that that is one of the only ones that that is connecting more substantially to other to other towns to other there's there's other ways out you know like so it can be it's desirable as like a route where people are trying to you know make a day of of you know enjoying their vehicles and >> um we're not asking for plowing that's getting the rest of the roads we're not going to that extent um but I just think that's something that you know it gets beat up from the traffic. So, is there I mean, can you say that that like it's difficult to stay on the road because you're pulling out of your driveway and the road is wrecked and that is that kind of you know >> it's pretty ruddy right now like there's places where you know it's it's ruddy and a lot of you can say I mean just if you go out there you see tire tracks I mean it's just I mean not that that's the only cause there is rain there is all the other things that cause road but it I mean come hang out at my house Saturday on a nice sunny Saturday it's like It's a lot. And I just think that because the town has the recreational, they're it's expected that other people are going to go up there and enjoy that land. So like there should be some shared responsibility. We have Andy and I >> $5,000. >> Yeah. >> Before lasting or >> just Yeah. ratings, a little bit of cover that had gotten plugged out, but just >> and that's only one of the Yeah, that's the most we ever had to spend. >> 5,000 in that one thing when it went to work, but we spent money other times got crosshairs and farms to, you know, when things get bad, >> it's expensive. >> Do you um This is This is a camera. I mean, is it if we if the road is in better condition, does that make for more people traveling up and down the road? >> No. >> Those people don't want >> It doesn't matter, right? I know. >> Yeah. It's not a good >> Yeah, I defer people from It's really interesting question. How about it? >> Well, oh, you stole my heart. Uh, no. I I think I think uh there's two things that I' I'd like to like make sure we're all on the same page about you, you know. So, it's a it's a right of way. Like a class 4 is a is a municipal right of way uh and right of use. Um and so you know anybody who is uh is going up there only has a right to be you know within the right of way and using the travel plane as it's maintained or not maintained right >> right yeah and I'm not I'm not saying you're not but I'm just saying like to the extent I think it's important especially for you know anybody who's not familiar with the community or Vermont land use regulations. You know, I think there's plenty of people who would take issue with saying like the land up there is for recreating on and it's just like well it's a road that is going through a a very particular, you know, land use regulated area and and some of it is sensitive and uh and I' I've certainly heard um Bill uh make this point and I and I agree that like um the term the towns bears a certain responsibility for making sure that those rights of ways are defined and maintained in a way that they can be safely and sustainably accessed. Um, and part of the rationale for the town doing some culvert work up there after the flood and contributing to maintenance was because like yeah, these these vehicles are designed to handle rough roads. You don't want them choosing their own path up a rough road. Um there is some rationale behind having a reasonably maintained or established, you know, travel traveled lane. Um that that keeps people from feeling like they need to interpret where the road is um and and do things that they're not supposed to do or would have uh unintended adverse impact. So, um, you know, I think it's interesting to put this into context with the conversation that we had over the wintertime um about Apple Hill. K mentioned that in, uh, in his memo. Um, that I think is probably the closest we have to kind of a comparison. um uh Apple Hill, the southern side of Apple Hills, uh uh issue was more winterbased, but certainly we we occasionally do some grading um like upon request um or as needed or as efficient whenever it's possible and the road crews in that area. It's kind of evaluated. Um so there is, you know, a certain precedent for doing that kind of ad hoc work. Um >> and it is 600 ft basic. It's not it's not the wall. >> Is there something that you're looking for in particular right now? >> Um I think like I don't think a greater come I don't know the bid of the trucks and all that stuff. Um but I think there's some covert um work that there's some water that comes down just above and driveway that I don't think is getting to the cover correctly and that's what might have caused the wash out which you guys did fix a couple years ago when the big storm came through the bottom of the road washed out and I think it was partly because some of the upper covers were blocked up and clogged up with junk. I think that would probably be the biggest benefit right now is to prevent if we did get a big stop to make that walk a little better. >> It may be worth creating a little beyond your house so people don't stop in front of it as well to make the road a little better further. >> Another thing about a separate issue sign that says your GPS is wrong. Do not go past here. We've had >> cars, people walking down that were stuck miles up. Realtor trying to get to end of the stage who got went past our house in the winter time twice. >> Was it a big white jeep? >> Yes. >> Jeep. >> I came up up on her this summer and she was having a hard time navigating a K turn in like a huge turnaround. Like you've got plenty of SP. Anyway, >> that's a separate issue. out. >> Well, I'm I'm I'm going to we're going to get a ba one of those signs from Bast. >> Okay. >> Put it up there for just for the winter time. Anyway, please >> think they can get to >> Yeah. >> Especially after it's just been groomed. It looks like a nice >> I had somebody follow me up there in a jeep with a groomer and I just stop go like this. What are you doing? >> They're like they're from they're at New Jersey plate. >> Well, in in fairness, it is how people get around now and that is what GPS is doing. And so, you know, there is that problem. But you also talked about volume. Are you trying to address that at all or you're not really >> like No, the sorry the number of vehicles going by that's not really where you're at. >> No, that doesn't >> Okay. I just wanted to ask. Yep. >> No, that doesn't bother us. >> I mean, we didn't. >> And most people are pretty good. You know, people are a little squirly. They drive a little fast. vehicles are loud, you know, but but I really feel like their big tires and stuff coming up that really steeped part of of the beginning of the road, it just >> and that's what they want to do, you know. >> So, >> um, >> so thank you for bringing the issue up and and articulating it so well. You know, I think it's uh a pretty reasonable conversation to continue. I think um the next step would be to uh have a conversation with the road crew to see you know what what makes sense and um >> will be in next meeting and yeah prepare them >> take a look at >> I think that makes >> sounds like ditching ditching and culver if there's any culvers that are struggling >> yeah I think that would be a huge >> and then evaluate >> yeah we got like this year we didn't have a big big rain but I think you did it >> I think it I I think it's probably going to need some some dirt. Yeah. Some material on there because it gets cleaned up and travel. >> But but we're we're only talking about to the to the driveways. There's two homes, correct? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't care beyond that. >> Yeah. Yeah. Right. Correct. >> Um so the Roku can have a look at that. And I think, you know, um I don't want to speak for everyone on the board here, but um but I think we we've arrived at some pretty reasonable consensus around the last issue with winter maintenance. You know, I think our class 4 road um policy provides us enough leeway to uh you know, not stand up a huge commitment on either side, but um certainly uh provides an open channel of dialogue. So that uh if you guys are noc conditions that are problematic, then you know by all means let know >> and if there's a select board decision that needs to be made, we can we can entertain it without you know revisiting everything. Um My road group does probably show that they should notice that maybe in the lead we can't see. >> Yeah. So maybe a little preventative work saves a lot of headaches later in the future. >> Yep. Uh great. Thanks. >> All right. >> Appreciate it. >> You thanks for coming. >> All right. is um is the driveway next or the store? >> Uh no, that is almost next >> items ahead. >> We've got some uh >> right away >> right away uh conversations >> that should be pretty short. >> Yeah, I'm sure it'll be too long five minutes. Um so the next items up are uh some applications uh for uh work in the town rightway. Uh the uh first is the 874 Baton Road application. Um uh Cars they've rebuilt studio is it that's across the road >> in the same footprint I understand >> and you want to install power um beneath the road. Yeah, there had been power struggling from the top of the farmhouse over to this the top of what was the existing building. We cut that down and it just seems better to run it under the rope instead of straight overhead again. >> Is it just power? Are you putting uh Ethernet under or water or anything else? >> Water. Um, and >> who would do the installation? Is it was it Wack >> Washington electric? Who's going to install it? >> Uh, the electrician. >> Um, >> electrician. Electrician is going to dig the hole. >> The excavator will dig the hole. Yes. The house run the power from the farmhouse over to >> Yes. But who's doing the excavation? >> Uh >> okay. >> From Marsh. >> Um yeah. So the only the only concerns I have I guess with that is um is that it you know is going to be done so that it is buried sufficiently deep and then marked with uh usually when you're burying conduit like that you're it get it gets marked with uh uh at a minimum with some burial tape essentially so that it's known um Um, >> I meant to look into this, but often you see the utility will label if there's buried electrical >> with signage. It'll be like I've seen the green posts basically >> to say electrical buried here. >> Sure. Whatever is necessary. >> Normally what they're approving is not electrical. It's it's uh communications line. So there's an added liability obviously. Mhm. >> Um, but anytime anyone digs in the road, they should or the digging anywhere, they they need to call dig safe and have someone come out and look. So, that's the first line of defense. But I think anything that's reasonable to do to provide safety down the road for someone who might be digging is is a good thing to do. >> There's a minimum depth, too. If you don't down go down the deep, you got to put it concrete. So, >> four feet deep would be the the normal. Yes. >> And anything less than that, uh, concrete on top. Sure. >> We can put that in the conditions. >> Yeah. >> The dig safe is is also a condition. Correct. From here. >> Yeah. That's Yeah, that is standard. >> That that's a state. Yeah. >> The excavator would >> Yeah, that that's your role is responsible. Um so yeah if we can just uh add some conditions uh to at least note that there's a minimum requirement to bury at least 4 feet and >> uh concrete cap >> concrete cap is depth isn't >> met and signage and burial tape >> are all pretty standard practices but we've been trying to get consistent about documenting that stuff >> um because it is a increasing request and we're we're getting more and more pieces of infrastructure buried through the road surface which you know plenty of good rationale behind it but um don't have green systems for documenting it uh quite yet. Uh does anybody else have any other questions or concerns with those uh conditions? Can I get a motion? Oh, sorry. >> Sorry. When there is a per Sorry. When there's a permit like request like this, is there followup? Do we do expect a report back? That kind of thing. What? >> I don't know if I've ever provided a report back. We ultimately go and inspect make sure it was okay >> built to standard and then it gets recorded. >> Thank you. by the clerk which is part of the fee. >> Right. Thank you so much. >> Um so and then you typically ask for as built. I don't think we really need necessarily need that in this case because it's pretty clear where it is. Uh right there's signs on. >> Yeah. Um I the only other thing that just kind of popped up is that is gonna cause the closure of the road. So, um, if they could at when the contractor is ready to start the work, if there could just be or is there a reasonable amount of time for the road crew to be provided notice of that >> 24 hours? They they've been good about that. They've had construction trucks. >> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. This Okay, great. >> Uh, so can I get a motion to uh approve the application for work in the town right away? So moved >> second as >> with conditions as noted. >> Uh all in favor I >> any opposed. >> Thank you very much. >> We will mail you the permit conditions. >> Yes. >> Thanks so much. Um the next application is a application similar application uh but uh for 154 West Pond Road uh with uh a fiber installation uh request and you had some notes in your memo and >> so and Jeff uh which is with us again. Um, so this this was one that they applied for um um previously and then withdrew that so they could do the redesign based on um our site inspection and just a morass of polls and different things that are going on. >> Exactly. Thank you. Thank you for that. >> Um so they are looking to cross the road um and but but then it's a very short run up to to their final destination. And I was just talking with um one of our inspectors and it looks like we can um probably do a missile across there which goes underneath the road and doesn't require um trenching across the road and disturbing the um the surface layer. >> That's better. >> Yeah. >> They called it a missile. >> A missile. >> Yeah. It's called a missile. It's >> not a term we're familiar with here. very little to do with an actual missile, but that is the term. >> Um, so yeah, so it would cross very shortly like you said um and then follow the right of way up um what is it probably about 200 feet or so. Um and then it tucks into um the property at 154 Bliss Pond Road. Is there a desired depth for the where it's being buried uh through the road segment? >> Um well, we follow your guidance on that. I mean, we sort of boilerplate 3 ft. Um I just heard you mention um you want to go four feet and if we can't get to that, concrete it. That's definitely doable and happy to oblige. Um, I mean, I prefer to see it as close to 4 feet as possible. Uh, it's a fiber line, so, you know, the need for concrete is >> well, the safety repercussions are pretty low. Um, since it's not electric, um, you know, the inconvenience for the for the customer and for the person in the excavators, um, you know, we want to avoid all of that, of course. Meanwhile, >> is there any any reason? I can't imag There's got to be a ton of fill there like for that segment of road. I can't imagine. >> If we're staying in the rightway, I would imagine it's a lot of fill. So, I would imagine that would be fairly I don't know how deep that fill goes there, but um yeah. Uh, I'd be I'd stop short of making a request for for concrete, but I'd say, you know, if there for some reason is going to be a shallow burial, yeah, some sort of consultation with the road crew to make them sufficiently comfortable with the depth, you know, >> with the conditions on all the permits that we >> Right. I think that's I think you're right. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I mean, we can shoot for four. If we can't get to three, then call the foreman and >> Yeah. contemplate concreting. Is that what you're thinking or? >> Yeah. Whatever, you know, whatever I think is adequate to make them comfortable with the with whatever the depth is. You know, >> I don't recall if there are any culverts in that area. Do you do you remember? >> I don't think so. >> So, I mean, that might be one argument for allowing a little bit shallower just because you won't have to excavate any culvers or anything or replace anything like that. But um you know we do say 3 ft in our boiler plate. So >> I just I mean if you want to amend that I think that's in the um >> application itself if you want to amend that to say something different. Uh I think if you can make a target of four and contact road foreman for anything less than three and then that you know if you guys are between implying that if you guys are between three and four then >> okay >> then we've done it but >> yeah that's very reasonable I think. Yeah. Thank you. >> Now you you also put markers in either side of the road too where it goes under. >> Yeah we put markers and there's a tracer wire in there too so it can be >> Yeah. It can >> right can be found >> be detected. Yeah. >> Uh does anybody else have any other questions? >> Moving on. >> Um then with that, I'd like to entertain a motion uh to a approve the Northeast Kingdom Broadband uh application for 154 Blissbound Road. Um uh as conditioned. David. >> All right. Thank you very much. >> Thank you all very much. >> Thank you. >> Next up is the curb application for um Maple Borner Community Store. Tada. Uh so I missed the last conversation, but it sounded like there was some dialogue uh there. And then uh there was a curb cut application that was submitted. Uh I mean you've been recusing yourself because it's a gross conflict of interest. Um but do you want to kind of provide an update on where the project stands and the rat behind the curb cut application? >> Yeah. So, this all comes from trying to maximize parking space on our property to help solve the parking dilemma in Maple Corner, the broader issue. Um, and what we've seen as we've been monitoring it is that there's that grassy island that delineates our two curve and our main parking from the road >> and the the old cur mean the cement >> where the cement is and there there used to look at old pictures there used to be >> flag pole there was a gas pump sign but even more recently it was a pretty significant chunk something go long. >> Um, and over the years it's sort of been absorbed into the parking lot anyway. and what but pieces of curb are still kind of sticking up and there's that big cement block in the middle of it that you know I've seen people trip on it roll ankles like park pulling in at night and parking there and one wheels up on the edge of the concrete and it's just a matter of right there it's um it just seems like it causes more hazard than benefit Um and so the idea is it and it's approximately the size its original size is approximately the size of two parking spots. Um so the idea of that piece of this project which is what required the herb project is to remove that um and have that be smooth parking. Um and then we're still working on um line of contractors and getting bids. I'm not positive it it'll happen this fall or in the spring. Um but we wanted to be prepared in case somebody we find somebody to do it. I'd say there's ongoing conversations about sort of how you delineate parking lot from road >> because it is a long stretch. Um and and I think we're you know would like to chat to road through and we'll chat with different contractors about ideas. We've talked about some type of curving like maintaining some type of curving for that middle section. But what what would be functional and also not be in the way and an obstacle for the town plow and for our plow because logically, you know, you sort of want to plow the whole thing. >> Oh. Guess that's not that's sort of where we are. >> Yeah, I feel this is historic. I used to pump gas there. >> I love that. >> Love that very much. >> Um, so I >> So we need a clap, a historic clap. Bill Davis. >> Yeah. >> Um I my my very initial instinct is is that it's a little premature for curb cut and that that curb cut request of that width. Um well I can understand like kind of maximize this flexibility for the store to make some discretionary decisions there. um is pretty abnormal. And the whole intent of the curb cut is for the town to weigh the traffic patterns and coming in and out of the town right away. And and having, you know, something that's just 100 ft wide is uh uh is hard to compare that to anything really. Um, so I and then there's, you know, well, first I Well, I also want to acknowledge that like the the store is making an effort here to really try to figure something out. And >> that's just here though, the way you describe that in other places that would not be unusual at all that amount of space. >> Uh, >> so it's just that's that's here in C. Well, if you look at the at the at the Worcester store, they have an entry and they have just other places. All right. Um overall, that's a small small area and just observing a parking lot, you know, place where it's >> for a commercial rideway. >> Yeah. Right. >> No, a big store 100 ft and like entrance in eress is is is a lot. Okay. Um um >> can I just ask a question? The the removing the cement um doesn't require that, does it? And you're what you're trying to do is both remove the cement and remove the need for it. But then you but but you're asking for a curve cut, but you're also mentioning and you just mentioned uh like contemplating that you still want to maybe put put some kind of barrier there. So I'm just >> so there this is of course after we left our meeting last week I or two weeks ago I was thinking about this and also just the the looping like are you guys looking at you know talking with traffic because there's people who specialize in this stuff which is fascinating but um but just you know changing the pattern of of flow because it you know right now it's a loop and is there some thought that there's going to be a change to that I I think the main thought of that is to maintain one lane of the closest to the building, but then to have what's sort of happening naturally and I think is the best park and flow for the lot is essentially two ending spots facing each other. You draw a line from the front door of the store >> to where the cement pad is now. >> They're sort of natural and in perpendicular spots. >> Um, >> so you people would be nosing in towards the store or they'd be pulling up the way they do now. But >> but you'd have two and two plus a lane by the store. >> Okay. All right. >> Yes. off of the road like this is the this is the county road and you're saying you pull in like that and like that. >> Yeah. So you actually exactly >> which people do. >> People do now anyway. Um, so then I still that makes me wonder if I've heard about like you'd still need that you still might have that barrier there or something that would >> I guess the question for the road be should we have it like >> you know I we're imagining in the summer maybe having you know to sort of train customers having combs with ropes are, you know, um delineating for the summer to get people used to it, but are trying to avoid something that's hazardous to the the plowing and lock in the road, right? Like I feel like if we have a 6 inch granite curve for that 30 ft, it's just going to get >> people are going to run it over. Clouds are going to hit it like I mean it it's the town's respons if there's if a town if it is if it's a curve delineating the town travel way you know that is going to be a town piece of infrastructure and then it would be our job not to plow it not to plow it out of the ground and you know and and that that's not a lot of uh that's not a lot of curbing to consider. Uh it's, you know, it's regionally appropriate. Like I I I kind of like the idea of of having the I know the idea of like creating like a swale or something was was kind of thrown around a little bit as as like a delineator. And I just think I think with the reality of like how that roaded in the parking lot move during wintertime and mud season that the likelihood that a swale is going to be is is going to remain a delineation uh that's going to be more fluid I think more more of a fluid situation than a piece of curbing that moves and heaves or gets hit or something like that. And um and I I don't they're not hard to move, they're hard to set, you know, especially when you're only talking about that particular area. So I think playing around with this idea of continuing to use like some form of furbings that delineate, >> you know, where the road road path or traveled way ends and what the entry and exit is for the store make makes sense. There's already some there's already some there around the uh around the concrete, right? Um >> yeah, that's probably not worth using. Yeah. Um the the other thing K and I discussed when we were looking at it when we were talking about that curving is deciding where exactly to put it. Because if you put it, you know, in line with the ditching, which is sort of on the out the parking lot side of what would be the store shoulder, then you'll end up with people trying to park on the side of the road side of the curving. >> So, it feels like it would want to be >> as close as it could be. >> I think it's the inside. I think it's on the inside edge of the ditch of the ditching uh which is the edge of the travel lane not on the outside edge of the ditching >> which gains you the >> parking area and to your point yeah you know it's a it's a delineator of the travel lane um and I think the question is whether or not >> there's need to entertain that like further down so that there's some sort Because right now you also have the area where folks like start to park uh towards Hobie's driveway and uh and you take all kinds of liberties down there. Um >> is also awesome that they're not >> it's not identified as an issue. >> Is it the plan to not have parking then on the on the on the traveled way side of that people park there now? >> Yeah. Right. So that's what we're saying is if we inch it closer to the travel portion, >> yeah, >> people will be more inclined to park on the parking lot side of the curb than on the road side. >> But it is it our intention to put a no parking sign there or not. >> That's a that's another >> I don't know. >> Yeah. >> Can we ask question to the public? >> No. >> Yeah, sure. have to be a circle or can it be just a straight line? >> I think it would just be a straight line because then you could get rid of the inner pieces and you both get what you want. >> Yeah. >> We are talking about getting rid >> where do you want to place the straight line? >> I don't think there's I'm not hearing a question about removing the cement and trying to address >> right. Yeah. Yeah. >> Like secure, you know, making that a a safer, easier place and freeing up some space. That's not a question. The question is >> how do you do it? >> Does does a curb cut application apply in this situation if they're just pulling that out? We're saying I think the conversation >> the right way is right. >> Uh yeah. So I I'd say I think next step would be to if you are gonna move forward or would like to move forward with removing some of the island components then um I think it'd be a work in the town rightway application that would likely seem pretty reasonable. Um, and in the in the interim, I think if there's it sounds like there's some consensus around if we can try to leave the outside curbing uh to see how how that impacts traffic or or look at, I guess, a more detailed idea of like where where you want how you want parking to like lay out in the >> uh so that we can make a an assessment on a more informed irmed assessment of like how traffic is going to be entering and egressing the store. I mean, I think we all know the answer to that, but like if that can get represented in that application a little bit um and and whether or not there needs to be any kind of consideration to closer to driveway, >> I would just um offer that the residents directly across the street with >> Yes. um you know that that people parking on the roadside >> right >> obstruct that driveway. >> Yes. >> And so that you know trying to address that at the same I hear that that's part of what you're trying to also address. >> Yeah. That's the whole point of the conversation just to try to mitigate >> right >> the traffic problem. Right. >> Yeah. >> Which we appreciate >> very much so. >> But I think Yeah. I like the I like the scenario that we're just moving to a rightaway work and then >> the curb cuts there is no permit right predates the permitting process most likely. So, we thought this might be an opportunity to bring it in, but if if you're comfortable just allowing it as a sort of an existing condition, then we can um just focus on the curbing and >> and yeah, >> does the you know, does the road crew or or road commissioner the road commissioner feel that we should institute a a curb cut for this situation? I don't see a big benefit to that. >> If it's more or less what exists for >> Yeah. >> But I think the next step is to have John out and just take a look at where they would like to see that curve and then we go from there. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And what what other ideas they have? >> Yeah. Maybe it needs to have a some kind of a post or something on each end. Yeah, >> I just based on how everybody, you know, most a lot of the parking is happening at night >> and you know, people just go where there's space. I think even if this is a 6 in, >> myself included, I'm going to be one of the worst offenders. That that's sort of what I'm my fear is that even if this is a four, five inch tall granite curve like I think people are just going to drive longer think >> but I think if you have a drill on each end the full rope >> it delineates but go to go to Memorial Hall and say we've done up there to kind of keep people Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I don't necessarily but use pylons, but something that's a little more durable. At least, you know, you get to train people. >> Yeah. >> You know. >> Yeah. Bill, that's good. I mean, I've been over there. I checked that out. It's cool, but it's not it's not seeing the kind of action that's happening. >> Exactly. I agree. >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, having being the owner of a truck that can navigate that navigate that terrain, but like part of the problem is it's just not terribly well defined and and the and the grade of the driveway is higher than the curb on the inside of the island. So I think if some of that is corrected and the and the out you know renewed or reconditioned curb area is like more definitive like it I I think it'd be before considering like a like a trying to document any change or official curb cut like it'd be worth approving some work within the town right of way to see what kind of changed behavior can be achieved right and then Um and and if we seem to be trending in the right direction, then maybe we can like modify something with a curve cut application that is a little more official. >> Uh great. Well, thanks for the patience and dialogue on that. I appreciate it. So, we're going to table this particular application >> and I'll coordinate get together with the road crew out there. >> Um this week for next. >> Okay. Well, >> thank you. Thank you. >> Thanks. Yes. Um, public comment. We have any Michael Miller such a missial attendee online. >> No, I don't recognize >> Michael's. >> Yeah. >> You may. So, uh, yeah. Were you planning on commenting on anything on the agenda specifically or just >> Well, something for my road. >> Oh, sure. >> I live on. >> Great. >> Go ahead. >> All right. So, I live on Jack Hill Road and I can't find a speed sign. I'm assuming it's 30 miles an hour. Um, and I live close to the bottom of the hill, but there's a big there's a big curve. Um, and and there's a big drop over of of a ravine and also a new parcel has been sold and there's a a driveway cover. So, there's all this stuff on this curve. This is right by Peac of a mile up Jack Hill. Okay. Um so uh so it's a it's a dangerous curve and I've lived here for 30 years. Um, and I'm noticing, you know, there's significantly more uh I don't know, traffic, speeding, big trucks, more bicycles. I'm not against that. Um, more runners and more walkers and you cannot see around that particular curve. And, um, I think it needs a slowdown. time. Um, and well, you know, it it just it people need to slow down there. So, I've been out on the road sometimes. I go to my mailbox or whatever and people are I'm not saying everybody, but it's mostly bigger trucks go fast through there and and they can't even see me coming up the road. Like if they make that blind curve, they still can't see my driveway until they've gone some a little bit more up. So when I when I um so so that's that's one, you know, that's the worst area I think on Jack Hill Road. Um, and if there were signs, I mean, I can deal with I I I when I come down my driveway, I look left and right and left and right again because sometimes causing people fly around that curve is straight near my by my um driveway, but I still have to look down the road, look up the road, and And many times someone's going so fast that I I'm glad I didn't pull out without looking again and again. You know, people go around that curb and they just keep on going. Um and then also up at the Jack Hill House, it's one lane and I remember when the school bus went down there. There's lots of big trucks now that go down. School bus doesn't this year, but it will. there's need in other years. Um it's just another dangerous place which I think needs a slow down sign or you know you would know best but um let's see and and someone that lived like lost her dog from someone over her dog. Um and and uh I just wanna I'm just thinking back to a long time ago with um driver's ed classes learning that you know for every car length 10 miles for every car length. So people come around that that curve I was explaining at 30 miles an hour. Well, they're going to get around it and they're not going to be stopping anytime soon if if the car is right there. So, I just think it really deserves some signage there that will get through. I I also asked for that years ago on Pink and Brook. There was no sign there and that was just as bad, if not worse. Well, they're both bad. Um, and they they did they they they did. Um, but I think they need authority from from you guys. Um, now let's see. By the way, I did find the speed limit. It's 35 >> and it's 30 on Peek and Brook a small on on a hill size >> with a couple of pretty bad spots, >> you know. >> I mean, I've been wanting to do this for 30 years, but it's really now it's really changed. There's a lot of favorite paper trucks coming through going fast. Yeah, we've come up against this a fair amount in the last couple years and it does seem like, you know, speed limits were said set peace meal over the course of many years and one gets addressed because it becomes an issue, but it doesn't feel like there's sort of a corated theme or the standard logic to what it is on what road. And you know, we we keep addressing them peace meal as we are able, but at some point it might be wise to do a a townwide a holistic look. >> How dare you? >> Well, the one system you have put in place is to request speed studies and get gather some data. >> So, we could certainly put Jack Hill on the list. That makes a lot of sense by some time. I did by coincidence. I was out my mailbox and I saw the sheriff the other day >> and I I thought maybe because I had talked to you or something, but he he was saying we're having trouble with speed in Callis. >> Oh, yeah. >> And knew he he knew, you know, where the places were and he's just going all over the place looking. I see it too in the lake. I swim every day in the lake and there's there's some someone with some motor machine that he wants to go really fast down there. Anyhow, but that's and they're loud and all that, but but um >> yeah, we've been trying to be fairly systematic. In the last couple of years, we've been increasing the sheriff department uh budget for, you know, increased enforcement. And we we'll actually be talking about this I think maybe a little bit later in the meeting um because we just got some results from um speed studies that have been outstanding for a couple of years that get performed for the town upon request and then that informs dialogue around um changes to um speed limit. Um, so I'd say if uh with Jack Hill, I think it it some a little more information I think would be helpful if we I think it would make sense to get some feedback from the uh road foreman on uh because I'm hearing what what's the current market and sign inventory. It'd be nice just to kind of have a better sense of like what the uh what our current inventory of signs are either denoting speed or curves doesn't sound like there is one for for >> Jack >> what's that? >> What what's the current signage inventory on Jack Hill? >> Yeah. >> But it is I mean really I tried to find it. I thought where is this sign you know at the bottom of Jack Hill? I I didn't see it coming. I thought, well, maybe I, you know, it's behind a tree or something. I don't know. >> Not every road has one. And and the way it kind of works in rural communities, it's not too different in other like states and that sort of thing is that like there's a there's like a default unmarked speed that gets set by an ordinance and that is often done long time ago outside of any other context. Um, and out of consideration of like sign budgets because the signs are expensive. But we also have a sign budget for like incrementally adding uh adding signage. So >> a lot of bends like this in Callus, but I'm really I'm I'm really worried about it now. And um and I have one more which is um a friend of mine that I pick up a lot. He helps me with some handy things and he his name is Doug um Guy. He lives on Jupiter Brook and I he doesn't have a paw but he I pick him up when I come back to my house and help me and and it's a that's the worst of all. It is it's it's um I think it's 644 or 466. I think it's 644, but it's um Guy Doug Guy and it's um it's it's right sort of at the top of a of a Zbrook. It just blinds all over the place. And his driveway, it has hedges, which doesn't help, but it also has a real quick there's a hill on one side and there's a curve on the other. And I to park in his house or to be able to get turn around, I have to back in unless I go all over his wand, you know, which maybe I'll start doing, but I I it comes fast and he he was saying he couldn't come tonight. Um but but it's it's serious thing. He's he's been meaning to mention this for a long time because that, you know, both sides are bad. So, I'd like someone to look at that, too. >> What was the address again? >> I think it's I >> think it's 644 because it doesn't >> be 466 maybe. >> Yes, it could. Maybe >> Larouche was the owner, you know. >> Yeah, Doug Doug lives there, but they have a a >> rental. But he he lives there. Yeah, >> I know the property. It is a I've driven in out of that I went before and it's a bit of a blind spot. >> There's a lot of blush brush there. The sight line's bad there. >> It is. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Cuz someone can come up like if I'm backing in someone can come right up and not see me. Especially these people fast. >> D Brook is so windy. There's a dozen driveways on the Brook that I wouldn't want to back out of. >> Yeah. The thing is, I mean, I mean, I used to be a sign painter and calligrapher and stuff. I mean, you know, I probably get some signs together, but they're not legal unless you do it. So, um I don't know. I just I just feel like I've been around for a long time and it's getting a lot worse and I'm I'm going out in the street sometimes and I hear something coming real fast and and the I didn't know the sheriff was coming up there, too, but I was out on the street and just I just slowed them down. Stop. >> Go get stop, you know, and and animals get hit. People can get hit. No, it's really is dangerous. >> You can't just slow down. >> Yeah. I I just um I want you I just want to reiterate that we we actually have been quite concerned about speed in the town in and safety um on our roads and all of that. So it it's not inconsistent with issues we've been trying to address. >> It comes down to money for expensive science, you know. >> It's also behavior and education and you know >> that's true. They won't probably listen anyhow. I have noticed that some of the people that I've actually said you just slow down. They do but it's it's mostly trucks and and trucks that I don't know. I just I just felt like I really had to uh come on now and and say this because thank you. You know, someone's going to get hurt. animals have gotten her there. And like um unless I said this at the beginning, when I asked for the one on Peak and Brook, somebody contacted me and he said, "When I was young on a school bus, I was witness to the school bus hitting a motorcycle on that same curve. I was asking them to put a sign up and and the guy on the motorcycle died." and all the kids saw it in his room. So, I mean it can happen and um I just feel you know I'm off the road but I do have to go to the road and get out of the road. it would be helpful do something and I don't think it would really qualify for for some signs on that road because um you know especially that that first that first bend you know it has the ravine God help you >> yeah I think we >> yeah I think many of us are familiar with it and you know I I >> want to be mindful of our our time here. Um U but I appreciate the the input. I I do think we have some clear action items to um take take stock of the road road sign inventory that's there. >> Um and uh I think it'd be good to have them evaluate like visibility relative to the curb >> and exist these >> put Jack Ellis for future speed study. >> Uh yeah, future speed study. And if we did consider if there's no signage on there, maybe before that, too. >> Yeah. I mean, does it have to be 35 miles an hour? I mean, it is $35 an hour, but there's no significant. >> There's less at least even at the beginning like $25 an hour. Well, we want to we want to be consistent and and part of a uh being consistent around these is is like taking a certain methodology to setting speed speed limits and then putting that into context relative to other roads around it and um I'm not trying to be obtuse about this, but um uh we try not to just like designate a a a speed at random. Uh we we take into consideration like points of entry and how and like how fast that the average public is traveling on that road and and and how um uh compatible that is with uh with how many driveways are on it and how many curves and the width of the road. Um so all of that comes into play and then we can make a decision. >> If it's not labeled it's 35 miles an hour. I saw on my way over here that he can focus 30 miles an hour. That's a busier. >> It's busier, but it's >> Yeah, I hear you. It's not intuitive and and >> Yeah. Yeah. >> It It's likely more of an artifact than it is anything else because at some point the default paved or unpaved road speed for roads that are unmarked was set at 35 miles an hour. Um and and then incrementally as roads were as uh individual roads were considered uh speeds were arbitrarily set relative to what people thought they should be. So likely 35 m an hour is what was set for that road out of default and then peak and Brook was then at some point revisited at a later time and and 30 miles an hour was set for that and and that was so if it's 35 miles an hour which it is right now I guess >> um how how is that justified on a nerve like that? I mean, >> we can't I can't answer that question. I that was it was set like a long time ago, >> but I think the the point is that we we can at least look at like as we're saying the inventory of the signage. If there's if there's if the road crew can identify whether there might be needed for slow curve, you know, slow curve um type signs and that kind of thing, that would maybe help. Um maybe there's a strategic not posting of 35 miles an hour at the moment. Um because it might >> actually the speed people are going already. Um but I think the what what I want to reiterate is that there's already several actions and a speed um the and the road is on a speed um speed study list. So that's kind of what we can do at the moment is that I mean I I think that's what we're saying is available to do at the moment but I do will it take a long time before it comes up to be that >> the study would be next year >> next summer on on it was a while ago but um you know know that it would just be a dog instead of none of it's acceptable. I understand what you're saying. >> I just it's expense. It's what it's expensive, you know. I mean, it really does come down to that. is is I mean there's there's all kinds of roads like that, you know, >> but it is kind of a thorough way between Moscow Woods, the lake or whatever and um you know, keeping Brook >> and I've just I I've just been letting it go, but I just feel like it's really changed. And and what I understand from someone who told me, I think it was Doug that told me this, >> even though if if a road says 30 miles an hour and you're going around a bend, you not that doesn't excuse you from going 30 miles an hour around the bend. Mhm. >> And so that's what I'm saying is that if and and I have stopped people sometimes, >> you know, and >> there's I I I I don't mean to cut you off. I your your point is is very well taken and there are sign there is signage that has uh recommended curb speeds and there there are things that we can likely do in the interim that address your concerns. Uh but it needs to be done with with the feedback of the road crew uh and and with a little bit of information. >> No, no, I absolutely and then they need the direction from from us to uh to do that because it that is >> that is an allocation of their time and they need to hear from this body to have their time committed to that and and we hear you and think that it it is certainly warranted. So >> uh so we'll uh get some more information from them and see what we can do in in the interim. >> Ask your name. I apologize. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, I mean thanks for coming in Cynthia. >> Yeah, >> I feel a little strange that I had this is not a big deal compared to everything else that was here and I waited through the whole thing and you're saying let's go. You got other stuff to do. >> Well, I'm sorry the wrong >> No, I'm sorry. I I I wasn't stopped with whatever they were doing. >> But but Cynthia, I I'm sorry that you feel that way, but this also wasn't on on our agenda. This is usually for uh raising issues of uh uh like during public comment. It's only allocated for 10 minutes. and and we we've been talking about this for at least 20 now. So >> 10 minutes thing. Yeah. Oh, everybody else had a an agenda. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. All righty. Okay. Well, but we >> but when we do get feedback from the road crew, we'll I'm happy to uh we'll let you know and and it will be coming up as a dedicated agenda item for discussion at that point and we'll allocate no >> when we're when we're getting feedback from the road crew uh about sign inventory lines of sight and whether or not there's some interns that we can take to make um uh Jackville number >> if you could put your uh contact info on that signing sheet. >> Touch with you. >> All right. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> I have one quick thing. >> Yes, sir. Darling, >> friends of the town hall, they need to close damn windows upstairs. They're open with screens and it's rained twice now. So, when they get done with it with with a meeting, they need to close the windows. So, I tried to close my I I wasn't sure I could move them without breaking. I don't know how they got them up, but someone suddenly it can't be the windows up in my opinion. I don't leave my windows up when it rains, but >> Okay, that's >> all I can say about that. >> I can I'm happy to >> Thanks for >> uh the next agenda item is the uh uh reviewing the draft highway budget. uh for the FY 2028 budgeting process. Um had some notes in uh his memo >> on there is the draft >> first first draft of this. Um I've included all the known costs and what I think are reasonable estimates and we scrubbed it a bit. You know, there's obviously more that could be done. It does include set aides uh for a new loader and for uh more paving on county road in FY29 as we discussed in the capital budget uh discussion getting ready for those um to the total is 7.3% at this point. So, um, we'll be looking for some guidance on how much you want to reduce that or or if you have specific areas where you want to reduce it. Um, one one thing I didn't mention in the memo, what's not in here is an allocation for the Moscow Woods Bridge, which we also talked about during the capital budget process. >> Um, >> that was going to be my question. Yeah, I should have would have mentioned that in the memo, but there is, you know, my thinking is that this that more or less I think necessitates a reserve fund that be set aside and that's that's known to be for the bridge. In my research about reserve funds, it was pointed out that now that you have the statute allows it and we also have a fund balance policy. If it's just going to be for a year and the select board is has continuity, you can say like this 20,000 is we're budgeting and we're going to we're going to spend it in 29, you know, on on a loader and that can be remembered. If you're talking about some multi multi-year allocations of larger amounts of money, it's probably more important to have it in a reserve fund. And and so having it as a reserve fund is still money that would be spent, but it would be um contingent on voters approving both a creation of the reserve fund and the money and >> and spend the reserve fund. You mean to add? >> No, no. The once it's in the reserve fund, it's at the select board's discretion as to when to spend it, but and to create a new reserve fund with a particular mission such as a highway infrastructure fund. Yeah. >> Um the voters would need to approve that and they would presumably be as be asked to pres uh approve the first allocation and and if it were 25,000 which is what we had initially talked about um 25,000 per year for several years um >> for the for the for the bridge >> $2 million bridge. How did we get there? >> Yeah. Well, this was this was just, you know, in the in the first pass of the capital budget, we we're not going to be able to fund a $2 million bridge. >> I know that, but $25,000 is going to take you 10 years. >> It would be it would be for the match, you know. >> Oh, okay. >> Building the funds for a match. >> It wouldn't be a one to one match either, by the way. It's not what what we're discussing, right? Yeah, I mean it's a small portion against >> so you know for for example was a federal aimma brick >> 8020 split. >> Okay, >> we're getting closer. I you know >> it's a policy matter and if it needs to be more it needs to be more. What I what I was gonna just if I could just add to this that it seems like there's a more there's immediate need for addressing the costs associated with the bridge being eliminated, right? like you were starting to talk about the road crew having to go around >> and yeah like I that's that that was another like the near-term costs implications of the bridge were what I was thinking about with respect to >> and that's that would that's something that needs to happen this year if it can and we didn't budget for it >> right >> so that's a >> I guess it's >> it's less of a budgeting question in my mind for what can we do and where do we come up with them funds in this fiscal year. >> Okay, fair enough. Yeah, >> but um just for context, 25% is or 25,000 is another 2% plus on the entire town budget. So, it's it's not a small thing. No, but I'm personally of the feeling that when things need to be done, we need to do them and not kick cans down the road. That's how I feel. >> Yeah. >> Well, we all agree, right? >> Yeah. >> But what can we do now about the Mos road bridge? We we don't have $2 million. >> No. >> So, what we can do is put money aside and apply for grant. Is there more? >> Is there anything more? We should be >> We could entertain a bond, but I don't know how we cover the cost of paying a bond. And >> our people would like that. >> No. No. Um, I think but you know I hear what you're saying, Bill, and I I don't disagree. I I I think that we're we're often fighting over not fighting, but you know, debate, you know, having healthy do conversation about every percentage that we add to that. I understand. Yeah. And and so I think you know the question for me is like I I think that this isn't this is a really good way to force a conversation with the uh with the community about how we are p how we are planning to um to fund these projects and and um because we've got the paving projects that we don't historic ly save any money for or at least we hadn't been, you know, right? And so, uh, and and we have, you know, other kind of substantial infrastructure, bigger coverts and that sort of thing that we don't typically, uh, we don't that the community doesn't necessarily have a lot of line of sight on what our what our planning efforts are for those. You know, we have lists that we maintain and we apply for grants and that sort of thing, but we don't even really sock away any money for or the matches for those grants or at least have a fund allocation that is dedicated to that that is visible to the community and I think you know into the context of some of the other programs that we're being asked to think about funding you know the community has to start thinking about what are we saving money for and um uh you how much taxpayer dollars are are being saved and uh allocated earmarked for various uh needs in within the community. And um you know, I've heard the argument before that, you know, it it that there are folks in the community that would believe that they could make better use of their money until the town needs to levy a bond and and then the town levies a bond. But I my personal feeling is that that's that's not a great way to make a plan for anything uh to get done. And um if it needs to be more than that, it needs to be more than that. I think it it would be pretty easy to go to town meeting and say at a minimum it needs to be $25,000 if we're going to approve this particular fund. But um and and then maybe the following year it's $50,000 or $75,000. >> What can be amended on the floor? >> Or it could be amended on the floor. >> It's a starting point for a discussion. >> I think it needs to be probably discussed in the context of what the infrastructure capital planning looks like. Like people need to know how much these projects are. >> Yeah. >> Um >> but the town the town can't do without that bridge for for five years. you know, that's the fact, but do I I don't know what a match what a match amount would be compared to what you know, is it but is 25 enough to be put 50 in there so we if something does come down the road, we can jump on it. And I just don't know what the mechanics are. Let's say let's say we needed 75. We need to hold a special vote with the people in order to get that money. I mean, what do we do? >> Well, we could spend it out of our fund balance or go into a deficit. I mean, we do end up with a fund balance. So, >> I think we're not that stressed by between 25 and 75. Seems to me I would just offer >> and that 25 at least isn't too much of a burden. But, I mean, we're talking about a 30k for a nurse like >> Yeah. >> You know, these things >> I know this bridge that you use every day. Now, school buses won't be able to use it. Our town trucks can't use it. the emergency services can't go over, >> right? You know, it's a big deal. >> It's a huge deal. >> Um and and maybe at at some point it's a annual convers uh comp contribution of$25 or $50,000 and a percentage of any fund balance uh that >> is somehow allocated to it. Um which is maybe you know more complicated for people to wrap their heads around but >> it doesn't need to be decided tonight but but so what is the right balance is the big question yeah >> is so the capital the infrastructure capital planning um that you've been working on party that that that's not necessarily in this budget >> it is >> uh well it and the >> the loader and the relaying >> are are the new items on the capital >> were we're already paying for three dump trucks >> but that's all that's equipment. I'm just talking about like infrastructure projects like so I guess the the highway paving would be an example >> and originally we planned to do that in fiscal 20 >> that's why it isn't on yeah >> which one isn't on here right last two grand I'm sorry >> it is but it's not the full amount >> right but >> it's a it's a it's a partial >> okay >> partial It assumes a a grant. >> Okay. Right. >> Which I hope that's a good assumption. >> Yeah. >> We got two two of the three grants being applied for us. Yeah. I I think it I think it's something I personally think it's something that we should probably be working on preparing to ask the voters for, you know, as a fund as a reserve fund. Yeah. Like and I think we should probably spend some more time talking about what that what that number needs to be. >> Yeah, absolutely. >> As we refine it. But >> you you'll have a better sense when you see the full budget. >> Sure. because that's an add-on on top of that. >> Yeah. Yeah, that's noted. >> And and the order of things, you know, people be asked to consider the full budget before they consider this at all. >> Do we do we dare add the the pay moral Never mind. Sorry. >> I'm sorry if I missed this. Did we um Sorry, when I was looking at this, I was wondering about fuel cost. >> Yeah, that was >> um >> sort of a stab. I put a $5,000 increase budget over budget. >> 6.7%. I wanted to see a bill. What are we what are we paying for fuel right now again from uh I wanted a look at that. >> Yeah. Take a look off. >> Well, and like fuel uh Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Um, another small question. >> Sorry. >> Paying five $5 one. >> Yeah. About 501 right now for diesel. >> 510. I'm sorry. >> Yeah. That's right. US >> there is. >> Yeah, six. >> Um, and is that part of a pre-by commitment that we get for are we using highway for that? >> Yep. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. It's being delivered. >> Not using Red Rocket. >> Okay. I can't. I can't. I just >> another >> Why isn't there Why isn't there a cooperative fuel buying forities? >> Yep. >> Well, we're not going to solve that problem. >> Um, does chloride application save us money? >> Yeah, I think so. >> It does. >> Yeah, >> because it hold keeps the holds the road together. >> Okay. >> Longer. It has the other benefit of keeping dust down when there are parts of towns where that's necessary. >> Yes. >> Um but but I think John would tell you the main benefit is it it keeps the road in good better condition. >> Right. I did hear him I remember him talking about that. So >> and and the trailer the benefit of the trailer is that they currently place the chloride um tank on one of the trucks and it just is really rough on the metal. Um they they spray it down after every application, but they they >> Oh, it's damaging the vehicle. >> Yeah. >> So, this would be a trailer dedicated. >> And that that's an item that we could live without, frankly. >> Uhhuh. >> But they don't have to keep putting it in and out of the truck, which is >> But it would it would be a a tangible benefit to own that. >> It's a good idea. it. You know, when I was looking at this, I I just I mean, I think it's thoughtful and um I don't know how we avoided some of these increases. Um like there's there wasn't anything that really jumped out at um to me like that's a very prudent suggestion that we purchase this. >> Yeah. A wise investment >> so that we're not >> spend money to save money. it really this very expensive vehicle. >> Yeah. >> It's just there's there wasn't very much in here that I was like >> health insurance jumped out to me pretty big. I mean, you know, >> that's a big driver that we had another employee move to a family fun. >> Yeah, >> that's and that's contract. There's nothing redone. Um but it it definitely um makes makes it a harder complex overall and >> you know we did add 300 hours for mowing >> you know and I don't know that we would be able to fill that unless recruit bill or something but >> um that's something we could we could say no to this time >> given exactly that Maui, I'm not for that. >> Well, I I mean that just means that we're going to be committing those 300 hours out of our budgeted hours, >> right? Opportunity cost. >> Yeah. >> It What else do you need from us on this? Because >> Well, um >> I agree with you. It is a reasonable starting point for deliberation. You're right. But are we at the point right now where we need to start identifying aspects of this? >> We need to, but um there's only so many meetings between now and December. >> Yeah. >> Um and this is I don't know the exact number. This probably around 60% of the overall budget. So, the only items on your list though that are that are move like that we don't that we have control over that are not part of like uh the agreement with the union or whatever is like the 300 hours for spring mowing given some of these other things are estimates but like we can't we know medical insurance going up uh >> right um >> trailer Yeah, >> those two things. >> I mean, the paving and the and the loader things, you know, could defer. >> Um, materials. We've certainly tightened up on materials before. >> Um, >> to what result? We end up buying it. we end up budget because >> um >> do you have a sense yet on the other the general budget town budget increases like do we have more people on insurance less? >> No, that that'll be >> that's all >> that'll be unchanged. We won't see the last year's big savings was moving Barbber's position to >> part time >> hiring me out and um we won't have anything dramatic like that. >> I I would hate to see us um you know walk back commitment to the paving. We've just started to plan for making these these amendments to infrastructure expenses and paving is a very >> uh is a very obvious improvement though I think that that then has to be weighed in a conversation about the uh about the Moscow Woods Bridge. Um, I do think um the loader is probably one where having some input on I mean I know it's heavily used but how much it gets moved around the town and whether or not like what what's the costbenefit analysis of punting hunting the loader purchase and how do we get by with keeping our keeping our existing equipment running longer. Um um you know, but the but certainly, you know, having the road crews feedback that a trailer is like good money spent on trying to keep our existing equipment in better shape. Like I think that that is very indicative of like you know where where it's worth spending money and where uh where it's worth trying to save money as you know probably not being as aggressive in our uh in our purchasing regiment like how we spend the life of our existing equipment. Um I don't have a good sense of what kind of condition that loader is in but feedback from John about how that thing's doing, >> how far we might be able to stretch it, how like how hard is it getting used? Like if it's just loading trucks, like loaders are simple machines, they're not as critical as the graders, that could be something where we're shopping for, >> you know, used ones or, you know, things that are maybe not in as good a condition and push pushing out that that purchase to find, you know, something more utilitarian. Yeah, that's my sense is it's it's not as heavily used although it's very old. >> Yeah. >> But um yeah, certainly take a look at that and we can look at other potential reductions >> and and then maybe you know h budgeting for half of the hours of the mowing. >> Yeah. Uh, you know, I I trust that three 300 hours is a is is a good number relative to Ogden's time in the mower this year. >> What what's needed to to perform it? Um, I think budgeting for potentially needing to hire somebody part-time to do it in a more timely basis if it's needed is is maybe helpful for like applying a very acute part-time need to get something done and like if something comes up and we can't afford to pull our crew away from it. But, you know, knowing that it's kind of one of those fundamental um scopes of work for our road crew to perform, like again, I think it's >> Yeah, it's a good point. And if that does happen in the spring at the very end of the fiscal year, so if the person we hire is flexible, we can work with the budget that we have. >> Yeah. if it doesn't look like we have the time and the scope of work that the rest of the road crew is getting into is a better value for them to be applying themselves to other other infrastructure work um and we need to find somebody part-time to do it then then that's a decision we can make then >> yeah but but one thing I taking from this is we should think very carefully about how we present county road versus Moscow woods in the town meeting. >> Yes, >> there has to be the equity balance has to be on on the right side of that >> because that's just spectating some paving county >> the bridge or the be west you know concern. Yeah. >> Yeah. I think that that's such a critical link >> to accessing the community off of Route 14 and and and the members of that like that >> everyone will see the value. >> That's a no-brainer. Yeah. But it ought to be reflected in like >> whatever. >> And maybe that's how we, you know, seed that fund is with whatever we're saving or in part with what we're saving for um or more or doubling it. >> Yeah. >> Why? because I'm barely sitting upright. >> Um well, >> not to give a short trip to the budget, but I think >> need to move >> uh let's move on to administrative items then. Um, so, uh, the first item up is the, uh, we're not quite sure if we've, uh, done this, but accepting the, uh, the resignation of, uh, Linda, she's from the swim committee, um, uh, and, uh, consideration of appointing Linda. So, I think Linda had or uh, Linda Sheets had expressed an interest in stepping down a while ago. We couldn't quite remember if we had formally accepted the resignation. So, as just kind of a due diligence, we just wanted to acknowledge and thank uh Linda for her service on the committee and uh years and years of service. Um uh and uh with gratitude accept that resignation. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I >> um and uh related uh would be the appointment of Linda Gray to the uh swim committee who expressly interested. Perry, she's torch. >> Nice application. Appreciate. >> Yeah, appreciate it. >> Uh would somebody like to move uh to point Linda Gray to the East Committee? >> So moved. >> Second. All >> in favor? All right. >> Thank you. Um approval of the minutes from August 27th select board meeting. Uh has everybody had the opportunity to review those minutes? >> Yes. >> Um there any comments or would somebody like to move? >> I was not here so I will abstain. >> I will do the same. So that is >> I will move to approve the minutes. >> Thank you. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I >> and two abstensions for absenteeism. >> Hardly. Hardly. Uh the next is the board orders. Uh hopefully everybody's had the opportunity to review those. I had some additional notes in the memo. Does anybody have any questions about board orders? >> I I said a couple things real quick. >> Yeah. >> Um the Everest plow for 115, what is that going on? Is it going on the new dump truck? >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> And the extended warranty that gets to get us to seven years. Is that what that does for us? >> Yeah, for some reason that wasn't on the original purchase of that truck. >> Okay. >> We were waiting to receive the truck. You all approved that warranty a while ago, but we were waiting to actually take possession before we purchased the >> We have it now. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's the whole thing. >> Nice. >> One of our two trucks were hoping to have the other new truck >> before snow season. >> It's a miracle. Well, that truck was only a how many year miracle? >> That truck was was planned for prior to my being hired. >> Was it made on the moon? I mean, I just don't get it. >> It was the plow that actually the longest. >> Can I get a motion to approve orders and sign them? >> So moved. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I. Uh next is approve a bonus board meadow uh for website development. This was uh very efficient work that was performed yes >> outside of uh their normal scope of work um and was executed with expertise. Um I think that seems like a very reasonable request and so K I appreciate you bringing that up. >> Yeah. Well, it was a team effort. We talked it through and I thought Meadow was very thoughtful in saying we're not not even looking at comparing it to what we would have spent, but but what we are actually saving makes it seem pretty reasonable. >> Yeah. >> So, can I get a motion to approve the recommended uh uh bonus to me? Thank you. >> Second. >> All in favor? Hi. >> Hi. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you, madam. >> Uh >> so much >> transfer of uh 45,000 from the general fund to the FEMA fund. Uh this is to make up for what is kind of the finally calculated deficit, I believe. Is that right? >> Well, we're anticipating what the final amount be. um best way it's going to be in the in the neighborhood of 90,000 will be the part that's not reimbursed by FEMA or the state and um the auditor was basically suggesting you might want to set aside some of that now while you have healthy fund balance in fact we have fund balance in excess so >> we haven't we already spent the money >> um yeah it's not going to affect our cash >> it's it's because there's a dedicated fund for FEMA FEMA expenses and reimbursement. Yes. >> And that those don't evil out. >> There was always going to be the case that the town would have to contribute a certain amount of of money that it wasn't reimbured by FEMA or the state for tomorrow. >> Okay. >> And and so we're we're we're getting close enough to the end where we can project what that that um deficit's coming. >> This is just book work that >> this accounting it doesn't affect our cash at all. >> Right. But it will it will reduce the general fund balance. We have a pretty healthy fund balance. >> Okay. So, do you need a motion to approve that? >> Uh a motion to approve a transfer of $45,000 uh from the general fund to the FEMA fund. >> So, moved. Second. All >> in favor? I Uh next is a bit of a scheduling conversation. Um so there's a conversation around rescheduling the October 12th select board meeting uh which falls on Indigenous People's Day. Um Columbus is Columbus State. >> Uh it's we just missed it and um there are some options but many of them require stacking up meetings. >> So there wasn't there the suggestion of October 5th >> I could do >> is that the right date? >> Yes. Yeah. >> Monday the 19th. >> No, wait. What was the the idea was that we would cancel the September 28th. >> Yeah. >> And move it to the 5th or have a meeting on the 5th. >> That's right. >> And then uh and then not a meeting until the 20 >> until the 26th. So we just would move one but spread the spread >> two three weeks >> but it'll put some pressure on the meetings. >> Yeah, especially >> one fewer meeting then. Yeah, >> correct. >> Because I'm tired and meeting every single week >> for all number of reasons. >> Okay. Um, yeah. I I mean, I think that the reality is we're in budget season and it will create uh, you know, we're gonna we're going to eat that in longer meetings for those two meetings. But, um, but it also the alternative would be trying to shift some of the meetings a week or two and then and we'll inherently be meeting two weeks in a row somehow. if we try to reschedu it and potentially displacing other other meetings. I don't know if that was just a proposal. >> That was a thought that we're talking to. >> Fewer meetings is a good answer. >> I mean, you want Can we do Thursday meeting? >> Oh god. No. I'm sorry. >> I mean workwise I can't I but you you all could do it without me. Um, >> uh, we also don't need to make a decision tonight if we don't want to ship the 28th because we can just keep the 28th and we keep the 28th and move the 12th to the 19th. Then it'd be through on those two meetings and are feeling in good shape to be considered camping the 26. >> The carrot is different. >> Say what you just said again. >> Do all our homework. >> I'm not I'm not here on the 28th of September. So just I'm the I think I'm the only one who's on the calendar missing that meeting. >> So you're saying keep the 28th and the 5th or 28th and the 19th? >> 28th and the 19th was my if it's just we currently don't have a meeting on the 5th. We cancel the meeting on the 12th, right? >> And we had a meeting on the 19th. Well, we're super efficient on the 28th and the 19th. Maybe you could have the 28th >> 26th. >> 26 months. >> Yeah. I mean, I don't much prefer we do the 28th and the 5th and then >> hesitation to doing it two weeks in a row sooner versus later is there's less >> less information. >> Sure. >> Then we can be less productive >> in that time. >> Uh >> I don't keep the 28th, 19th, and then the 26th. >> Yeah. If other people feel strongly otherwise >> I don't feel particularly strongly painful to me as far. >> Okay. So the 28th 19th and 26 >> and people okayish enough with that. >> We'll maybe still like codify that on the 28th maybe. >> I don't care. >> I don't care what you do on the 28th. >> You didn't mean that in October. You heard. >> All right. Uh we'll see everybody on the 28th and then we'll revisit and to confirm the 19th and 26th. Um sign the state road and bridge form standards. That seems late. Yeah, you did sign a form, but not the >> form that's needed for when you actually change standards, which was something that the state more or less required if they wanted to have appropriate standards. You remember back in March, you adopted new standards. There was one change to minimum covert size, I believe. >> Yeah. >> So, they're just asking that you sign this one. >> Okay. So that we are eligible for a high higher level of reimbursement for RAP. >> We've all decided five. >> Yeah. All all of them. >> Uh can I get a motion to sign the state road and bridge standards form? >> Excellent. Second. >> Excellent. All in favor? Um, reports, uh, town clerk, uh, no Tegan Meadow, are there any? >> We did get ballots today. Um, we're prepping for November election that I may or may not be able to defend personally. Um, but we're going to be doing lots of recruiting. Um, but I mean, if you can can speak more to that. I've honestly for the past like two weeks had my nose buried in tax checks. So yeah, there may be more to report, but >> it's okay. Yeah. >> Okay. Thanks for collecting the tax checks. >> Um uh administrative report. Um so those to start with the speed studies and the three roads done pretty interesting data. >> Yeah. >> Um just to cut to the chase, I'm not seeing any reason to recommend a lowering speed limit. I don't think I would recommend an increased speed limit either. So >> there just some fast drivers. >> There are some fast drivers out there. Some of them is obviously messing with the one up on Max Gray. I mean, who goes 70 miles an hour? I mean, wow. >> Someone's having fun. >> That's a long straight stretch, man. >> That does that hill. You can get airborne. I mean to me it's always been a little bit of a conundrum using that 85th percentile which I totally understand the logic of it >> but I feel like over time people are driving faster and faster. >> And so one of the ways >> we can use to slow people down is lowering speed limits. But if we're always basing it on those faster average speeds, it feels like a little bit of a disconnect that I can't really wrap my head around. And I agree. I don't see changing those speeds, but I I feel like that's a sort of a Yeah. No, that's developing. >> I wish they would update that document because it's 10 years old. This feels There's been there's been conversation about doing that. I mean that the method I mean I think it it is fair to say that it is a flawed methodology. I think that >> many of them are going to have their inherent flaws. I I do want to give ourselves a little bit of credit for staying, you know, dedicated to a process of evaluation and looking at what it is and and putting that into context of how the road is used >> uh within our community. I I I think it's important to acknowledge that, you know, the 85th percentile for a peak and brookke is uh 36 miles an hour and that's only 5 miles an hour over what the posted speed limit is. And so that seems like a little bit of a win there, you know, to me like that that seems like >> the driving uh patterns on that road are are, you know, in the realm of appropriate. Um and >> and the same is is true on my creek really. pretty pretty >> 35 mph limit and it's 41. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> There's some crazy people. >> There are outliers which is the thing about the 85th percentile. >> Marshfield's a little funkier. But >> one way off 30 miles an hour and 85th was almost 50. But most of the roads that we've been trying to hammer the sheriff's department on have been Lightning Ridge and County Road. And you know, I think we do have an opportunity to maybe redirect their their way this can be in the term. >> Well, and giving the share the timing so they know what hours the really fast people are. >> That's right. >> Yeah. And and the overall volumes although note that two of the studies were only four days >> and another study was a full week. So >> um >> the do you know were these studies that the they used counters like the strips that are across? So the uh during the last transportation advisory meeting I attended um Ruben was talking about uh potentially uh using um other sources of data for driving doing uh traffic speed studies. Um >> oh I don't know about that. It may be worth following up with with him about that and whether or not that might open up the door for >> doing more of these faster. I don't know how. >> Okay. Well, I related to that leading into the next topic, I met with Ruben and Luke Baker uh uh last week to talk about traffic calming in East Callus. And um the one of the upshots of that was um Ruben is going to request an an immediate study of roost protein because we're trying to put together data to make the case for the traffic calming which is something that's needed um to get that that demonstration study approved. So that that sort of indicated to me that that's still their go-to method for collecting national data. Um but after that meeting I met with Luke and also Vicky Arthur from the planning commission giving them feedback about the housing committee um which had met a couple days before. Um, one of the big takeaways from that meeting was to there there's a desire to pursue a municipal planning grant um so that we could uh hire a consultant to work with us to identify possible locations in town where development might be possible and where we should focus our efforts really in the context of ADUs and >> um you know smaller scale you know things or or maybe maybe multif family but but Um, you know, it's I think we're all being trying to be realistic about what is possible. Um, because one of the most salient points that that I heard was Jim Clark said that new building construction costs are $400 a square foot, not including land. >> Yeah. >> So, so that just rules out so much. >> Yeah. >> So high. >> Um, but anyway, we still we still think that that's a top priority. And so I um we also learned recently that the town plan was never approved by the regional planning commission. Until it is, we're not eligible for a planning grant. That was news to me. I don't I thought that that was a step in the process. >> I totally remember this. >> I think they did a review. >> This has been confirmed by the RPC. Um so I brought this to to Luke and to Vicki. They think it's possible to get the updated plan approved um by the SL board and by the RBC in time to apply for a planning plan. Um we're meeting tomorrow night. Um Nikki from uh RPC will be there to walk us through the timeline and make confirm. Um but that what that means for you is that we will we will be reviewing the revised town plan soon and then having a public hearing um >> with all the elements in it. >> Yeah, with all the elements responding to the CRC comment that they >> do to finish it to having it being done. >> Oh, they it were too expensive. We just >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They're just going to >> We have to do it. No, I know. But I thought we like we were that far away from actually being You're saying it's done. It's near done. >> It's near done >> because soldier through. >> Yeah. >> They wanted to do some additional elements, some enhanced energy, and they're just going to set that aside. >> Great. Good. So, so look for that in upcoming agendas, >> right? >> You should be as supportive as you can. >> Yeah. And as we can >> Yeah. And and Luke had that mindset as well. Let's let's make this happen. >> Um and last thing is that remember the illegal dumping on Moscow Woods, right? I I heard from a state police officer yesterday. Uh they issued a court summon to the alleged perpetrator and they were the recommendation was to issue a fine the maximum fine maybe $800. So >> how did it get cleaned up? >> We don't know. >> Mysteriously cleaned up and cleaned up. Well, >> the mess showed up and then the mess disappeared >> within the John said like there was broken glass and stuff that you know it's really wow. Whoever did it did a nice job. >> There was some sort of drama happening, right? I feel like you had some somebody Yeah. Whatever. >> Exactly. >> All right. >> So, >> uh the last item on the agenda uh is a discussion about the East Mont Fire Department and the U RFP. Um >> so >> um so we have some context and conversation about the RFP. Does it make sense to go interview executives to work through that dialogue? Probably not necessarily. people want to discuss. >> Feel like you've seen this. >> Yeah, >> there are some documents that we're going to review and decide whether to do. Is that right? The RFP >> that's the it's the last step. We are ready for that as have all the other >> organizations. I you tell us that we need a closed session. I don't >> I don't feel like we necessarily do unless there's something you want >> I mean if there's there there is a conversation that needs to be had about the process for evaluation. >> Yes. >> Is that something we need to do in close session? >> It depends on where that conversation goes. But I I think we can handle it without that if if you want to delve into that at all. I mean my interest is just clearly we have trouble working together as three different entities and anything we can do to streamline our processes would be useful >> right >> so smaller >> smaller is better >> that's that would yeah >> um >> and I'm certainly willing to help with that I think if Jen and I are part of the team that can keep moving >> I think it's the there's not an equivalent of the two of you for the fire department. And >> so it might mean that one of us needs to go to Yeah. >> Yeah. So that there would be an evaluation group um and that we that that group would make a recommendation to the select boards, the two select boards in your area. I don't think there's any regret with that, but I don't know if they're announces. I thought part's um notes were very helpful and I want to shout out specifically for you getting to that meeting because it made a big impact to the um the Eastakota Fire Department board meeting. Thank you for that very much. Um >> very welcome. Thank you. Somehow >> that's over there and have so >> we have confirmation that the other two entities have approved. >> Uh actually it's not dealing with it. >> No but >> but Jen said that she will let us know right away. >> And is there reason it sounds like there's reason to believe there's uh alignment with the select boards on the conditions of the RFP. >> Yes. So, um my only other question is I guess like I guess we have in our scope of consideration um we we could if we were feeling adequately comfortable I mean we could potentially authorize uh the evaluation committee meter uh members to make a decision to hire. Right. >> Yeah. go that far if there was >> go that far. >> Uh >> do we want to make that recommendation to the other two entities? >> We potentially save a month's delay. >> Yeah. Right. I mean I think this process has taken so long to begin with and I think that the the from my perspective at least the people who are representing the entities uh each of the entities during these dialogues um have represented their constituents well um and I'd be comfortable for the sake of uh kind of the urgency of moving through this process a little more faster to authorize the um the evaluation committee or group um to to make that determination or to like make that hiring decision. >> Yeah. Imagine if there's only, you know, couple proposals is a very obvious choice. Why why take extra time, >> right? >> Great. >> Um so, uh with that, I guess the action would be to uh approve the distribution of the RFP. Uh seeking a consultant um that will be hired in operation with the smart player uh south and fire to fire. Great. >> Um so let's do that first, I guess. Second. >> Uh, all in favor? >> I uh and then I would uh like to propose a motion to um authorize uh the members of the representatives of the select board and Barbara for evaluating candidates um to also um hire that candidate or represent our approval and highly >> is the working group already is that a new idea that the the two representatives from each >> it's building off it's building off the three that started the process >> so it's like two-step process then first we're going to appoint two people >> our two people and each of the three entities he's going to appoint >> this hasn't been discussed among the discussed >> so so it would be proposed this structure >> and if you care to appoint two people now you can but it would be contingent on that >> proposing that and if the other two like it are to >> I like that >> can we say so can we say so I mean yeah >> uh all in favor >> I >> did we have a second I'll I'll >> I second it. >> Okay. >> Of course you did, Bill. >> Sure. >> No, that's good. >> Okay. Me getting a journal.