BULK and ACTUALLY See Results YOU WANT | Mind Pump 2943

bulking, reverse dieting, eating in a calorie surplus. You're trying it, but is it working? Here are the signs that what you're doing isn't working. If this is happening, let's fix it. Let's go. >> You get fat. >> Wait, it's a visible sign. >> Slow down. Let's back up. Let's back up for a second. >> You're doing it wrong, guy. Pay attention to that. >> You're doing it wrong, guys. >> So, let's back up for a second. So, uh, so let's explain what bulking is. And it's also being referred to as reverse dieting. Same thing, right? You're it's the attempt to eat in a calorie surplus or eat more than your body's burning with the goal being building muscle, uh maybe balancing hormones, boosting metabolic rate, maybe setting yourself up for a fat loss phase in the future. But the idea is ultimately, regardless of what the goal is, it could be hormone balancing, could be better health, could be better sleep, whatever. uh we're trying to build muscle and we're doing so with good strength training programming and we're eating in a calorie surplus. Now bulking used to be something that only like hardcore bodybuilders or dudes like me when I was a kid that just wanted to gain weight cuz I was skinny. We're the only ones that ever tried bulking. Nobody else >> Yeah. >> The word bulk is a turnoff to most people. In fact, that's why we say reverse dieting often times because it's such a turnoff. But the idea and the understanding and what it does for the body now has become so popular that you're seeing more and more people uh understand the benefit and attempt to move in this direction. And in my career uh for all the time I've been in the fitness industry, which is well over 20 years, I've seen more women now go on a bulk than ever before. That was almost never the case uh in the past. So uh but um um and a lot of it has to do with fear or just not the right uh information around it. >> Yeah. Do you think that there is a tendency um between the sexes? >> Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Uh I think uh and to be more specific, the dude uh who feels really skinny um has a tendency to overdo it for sure. Mhm. >> Um the everybody else uh tends to underdo. In fact, one of the clear signs that your bulk isn't where it could be uh or your reverse diet, you know, if we want to call it that, isn't where it could be, is you've lost weight. >> Mhm. >> If you're losing weight on the scale and you're in a bulk, you're not eating nearly enough. Now, here's the this is where it gets interesting. Some people would welcome that, right? they're going to go on a bulk because they need to speed up their metabolism. Let's say they want to build some muscle. They see the weight go down, which sometimes happens when you start to bump your calories a little bit. Um, and you're working out a little harder as a result. And then people are like, "This is awesome. This is exactly uh where I want to be cuz I was going to do a cut anyway afterwards." But I'm here to tell you, you are not reaping the benefits, the maximum benefits of eating in a surplus if you're losing weight. If you're losing weight, you're not eating enough. the weight shouldn't change on the scale at all in in many cases should go up a little bit if you're trying to burn body fat. >> We we just had a live caller who uh did go up actually in 90 days and still could have gone up more. >> What was the sign? >> Right. He was hungry. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> He was hungry and he looked leaner and so this was this was a caller who was coming from a place of being, you know, on the leaner, skinnier side who needs to needs to put weight on. >> He was undereating and kind of overtraining. >> Yes. and we adapt we changed his his programming. We uh increased calories and checked back in with him 90 days later. And 90 days later um he got he gained six pounds on the scale. So based off of that you go like oh he did phenomenal on the bulk and he did he did a really good job. I mean to to the the his intentions were were right and he did well but he could have done even better. >> Yes. uh had he had he ate even more which I think that's even difficult for people is they go like oh if so to your point uh if you gain no weight or you lost weight you definitely >> definitely >> didn't go the right way uh even sometimes when you gain a little bit you could have got seen a lot better results and I see that sometimes sometimes people that I I would put on a bulk see minimal gain on the scale and feel like oh this didn't work and a lot of times it's because they were so fearful of eating more calories and and or what they might see is like they didn't see a lot of strength gains and it's cuz they weren't fueling the workouts. So that so these so even though you you obviously losing weight in a bulk is a definite red flag that you failed >> but sometimes even uh maintaining or a small gain is and you could have done a lot more. >> Yeah. I think and the reason why this is so important to speak to is that so in the past bulking was always about gaining weight. It always was about gaining weight. Nobody went on a bulk in the past with the intention of their weight staying the same. That just didn't It doesn't make sense. It didn't make sense. >> Well, back then, do you feel like there was there was this mentality like get big or die? Like it was like a a mass uh focus like because you had kind of in in pop culture there was a lot more like big pronounced like bodybuilder type people like I I feel like that that sentiment sort of like uh went away for a while. >> Yes. But I think more than what you're saying, Justin, I think it's that more women are bulking than ever before. >> Yeah. That shifted >> that shifted it and women are afraid more than men uh not saying that there aren't men who are afraid of this, but more than men of gaining any weight on the scale. So in the past when you went bulk, it was to gain weight. Now the idea was to gain muscle. So nobody wanted a bulk to gain like just a bunch of body fat unless you had a medical condition or very special situations. In some cases, that's what you need to do. But for the most part, we wanted a bulk or everybody wanted a bulk to gain weight. What happened was we saw the other benefits of a bulk, which were faster metabolic rate, setting you up for a more effective cut later, right? Because you have a faster metabolic rate. Now I can cut later with higher calories because my metabolic rate is higher. Better hormone balance. You take somebody, you take a man or woman who chronically undereats and overtrains and you feed them more and fix their programming, their hormones balanced. Suddenly they feel amazing. Their libido goes up. So all those other effects are now what people are chasing >> and but they're also saying I don't want any weight to go up on the scale. And so this is actually a problem because part of the reason why all those things improve is because you're gaining weight on the scale. Mostly lean body mass and maybe yes some body fat. But that's why in those cases you notice all those improvements is because you needed the extra energy. So if you're losing weight on you go on a bulk you go down 2 lbs. >> Yeah. Not enough. Yeah, >> you're not eating enough. You're failing on the bulk. >> Yeah, I I really feel like this there hasn't been that big of a shift in my opinion on the male side. This has been way more uh unique or different for the on the female side. Yep. >> I mean, just 25 years ago, uh coked out skinny was the look. >> Yeah. >> And so it was eat as little as possible, burn as much as you can at all cost. You didn't want any muscle. you that that wasn't even desirable at that point. Then we talked recently on a podcast about the GI Jane and Terminator, you know, Sarah Connor movement where like, okay, I could I like a little bit of shoulders and arms. And so there's a little bit of acceptance there of, okay, I could I'm down with some muscle, but then still fear around eating enough calories to probably build for most people. Then we've gone on to like CrossFit looking girls and okay, I want and and JLo and ass. It's like, okay, now I want a big ass. Now I'm okay with even more. >> I want shape, sculpt. >> Yeah, I want more shape and sculpt and even more muscle. And so it's now we're getting a little more comfort like and and what the the narrative has been well because you pull up GI Jane and look at her like that you don't have to get a real aggressive bulk to get to her point. But if you definitely want shape like a CrossFit or you want ass like JLo, you're gonna have to Yeah. You're gonna have to eat more and bulk and and so I feel like that like okay, if you want that look, you got to build you if you want shape and curve like that, you've definitely got to eat a lot more calories to get there in order to build enough muscle to put on that much shape and curve. And so we've just watched this, you know, transition over the last two decades from absolute skinny skinny and that's what everyone was desiring to this really more def, you know, muscular look. >> And it's a good transition, but you're still there. Like I'll I want the shape. I don't want to but I don't want the weight to go up on the scale, which uh is a mistake because it will go up if you gain >> uh muscle. That's what ends up happening. Uh the other one which you kind of talked about earlier Adam is if you're by the way if you're doing a good bulk. In other words, you're doing the right kind of bulk. You're still eating whole natural food. So you're not eating garbage. That's a mistake that people made in the past. Like when I was younger, >> it was gain weight at any costor driven. >> It didn't matter what you ate. Just eat everything. Um if you stick to whole natural foods, uh your bulk's going to be clean. And if you're on a bulk and you're eating whole natural foods and you're hungry and you're not eating when you're hungry, you're failing. Yeah. >> You shouldn't feel hungry on a bulk. You should feel hungry in a cut. Like that's normal. You're in a calorie deficit. There's going to be some hunger. >> But if you're finding yourself at 7:00 at night and you're in quote unquote a bulk, you're like, "Man, I'm I'm hungry again. Like, what should I do now? I'm not going to eat. I'm afraid of what? Gaining body fat." No, no, no. Your body's telling you, "Feed me. Go get that whole natural food meal. Don't go eat garbage and eat it and eat it. You shouldn't feel hungry uh on a bulk. You should feel satisfied. >> By the way, let me tell you what happens sometimes to that person is they feel that way night one and they they resist because of fear of putting any bad weight on >> and they again man hungry again resist and then third night I can't do and then they then they eat something that's not ideal and they go off >> and they go off the rails and then they put some body fat on >> and they're like I knew it. >> Exactly. Yeah. >> Whereas if you would have just stuck to the plan of eat when you're hungry, just make whole foods, make the meal protein and and that both those nights in a row ate that and been satisfied totally, you would have built muscle. But what happens sometimes is we play this they play this we or any client in this situation a lot of times will play this psychological game of like I already ate my four meals for the day. I don't I can't eat anymore. Yet they just had a great training session. They've had a week in a row of consistently and their body is wanting to build and it's telling them that it needs to be fed and they're afraid to do it and so they resist they resist that feeling and then that feeling then turns into cravings and then that cravings makes it even more difficult and they finally go like I've been so good for the last 2 weeks I'm going to eat this and they go all out. >> Yeah. Cuz if you eat garbage food, heavily processed food or fast food or whatever, um you'll eat way more than your body needs in terms of calories. Those foods are engineered to make you overeat. So, it it's one thing to reach for, you know, my bowl of ground beef and rice, uh, and or versus hit reaching for pizza. You know, if I have that pizza, yeah, I'll satisfy the hunger, but I've eaten, you know, a good 500 more calories than I would have and probably not even hit my protein targets as a result. >> That's right. >> Here's a huge red flag that your bulk isn't moving in the right direction. >> Maps, abs, and butt. You want your abs to look good? You want a big round butt? This is the program for you. And it's 40% off. And we're going to throw in a free program, Muscle Mommy 15 or Muscle Mommy. We're also going to throw in a diet guide and a supplement guide. All that other stuff is free and the program itself is 40% off. Go to mapsabsandbutt.com. Use the code launch for the discount and the free stuff. Back to the show. Your strength's not going up. Like if you are if you're in a bulk and your strength isn't going up, uh it's either I'm not eating enough, I'm not eating enough protein, or my programming is wrong. It's one of those three things or all of the above. You should 100% get stronger in a bulk. In fact, this is what I pay attention to the most with my clients. When my clients are reverse diet or going on a bulk, what I'm looking at most closely is strength. Most closely. Why? Because it's so objective. It's nothing subjective about it. You either lift more or you don't. So, it's very clear. And I know this. I know if strength continues to go up consistently, muscle follows. I know this every single time. So someone who's attending a bulk that falls in this category, two things that I see the most common uh uh programming is inappropriate. Um so either they're the they they're on on the wrong program, been doing the same thing for too long, inappropriate amount of balance of of intensity and and volume and all the things and so they need a better program. Or two, uh they don't eat enough protein, but they're eating a bunch of other calories. So like or both. Right. Yeah. Right. So, it's like a lot of times it's that, right? So, that's what I mean is like someone who feels very confident. I'm in a bulk, but I'm not seeing the results. My strength isn't going up. It's normally those two things. One of those two or both those things that you're programming isn't appropriate or good for you. And two, uh, and or two, you're you're eating extra calories but not hitting your protein. >> And by the way, I I often times often times I've heard this. I'll talk to somebody like this who's afraid of gaining the wrong weight, but we're convincing them to go on a bulk or reverse diet. And I'll ask them, "Are you stronger?" And the answer they'll give me is like, "Yeah, yeah, I think so." Okay, you're not stronger. That's that's you thinking you're a little stronger uh or hoping that you're a little stronger because you're either afraid of adding uh more calories or usually that's what it is. You'll know you're stronger because it's it's pronounced and it's clear. You're you've added 10 pounds to your lift or 15 pounds to your lift or you're doing five more reps. It's not a I think I'm a little stronger. Uh, your bulk should clearly produce some strength gains. Clearly. Otherwise, it's a big red flag. >> Here's another one. Your energy isn't any better. So, here's this is the one of the characteristics of eating in a proper calorie surplus with proper strength training or workout programming is you feel better. You've got more energy to work with. You feel better. A cut, by the way, a cut. Now in some cases a cut starts initially makes someone feel better especially if they reduce inflammation or most importantly change the kinds of foods that they eat. >> Yeah. >> But all things being equal whole food based diet both ends going on a cut versus going to surplus. The cut can often times cause a little bit of a dip in energy or athletic performance. In fact that's expected. Why? I'm eating less energy than I'm burning. >> Yeah. >> So that's just like anything I have less energy >> isn't there. Yeah. when you're in a proper bulk or reverse diet, uh you should have more energy, you should feel better. In fact, this is almost this is pretty much always the case when it's done properly is people come back and say, "I just feel a lot better." >> Is so you think it's mainly the the types of foods that they're choosing within this bulk that would kind of, you know, determine that energy and also like inflammation and things like digestion or not enough. >> Yeah. All things Yeah. All things being equal, uh, like still good whole foodbased diet, high protein, more calories or surplus, you'll have more energy. Obviously, there's more energy that's available. You know, it's interesting when you look at the on studies uh on individuals when they take people and they cut their calories. >> So, they've done these really cool studies where they'll put trackers on people that will um track their movement. Okay? So, it just tracks their daily movement. Then, they'll cut their calories or bump their calories. Whenever you cut someone's calories, like clockwork, their daily activity drops. Even though they're not aware of it, oftentimes people ask them, "Are you moving less?" Like, "No, I'm not moving less consciously." >> They pick up on it less. They're standing less, they're walking less, they're they're moving their hands less. This is how your body, you know, conver conserves energy. >> When your calories go up, you tend to move more and have more energy. So, you should feel more energy on a good bulk. >> There's a there's a compounding effect there, too. I've noticed this with my own behaviors like uh calories go up, uh energy goes up, uh strength and consistency in the gym goes up, also daily activity all goes up. Like it's like and the reverse is true. And to your point, if you were to ask me, and now I know because I've tracked so diligently for so long and so obviously I'd have the right answer, but if I didn't have all that data and you asked me, I would think on the days that I'm really sedentary that it's really not that big of a difference than on on the other days because it feels the same. I feel just as tired from work. I feel like I accomplished the same amount. But it's like it's wild how much of that subconsciously when you are fueling the body properly, you're training properly, how much you're just your neat goes up. Totally. >> Your neat goes up uh organically and yet subconsciously it feels the same. >> Yeah. Because you're you're counting structured movement and exercise. You're not counting the like, you know, I'm sitting in my chair swinging side to side or standing up more and stuff like that, which all like I said, it's very well documented. They track this. your body will modify that movement uh and you won't even be aware of it unless it's extreme. >> It's it's to me it's we've talked about it on the podcast many times. I've I've shared my own uh journey of like, you know, I've connected it to like I'm a better husband and and father when I'm training and eating well, and that's part of what keeps me motivated. >> Yeah. Why don't you talk about what it's like being a husband or a father uh pre-contest? >> Yeah. You know, diet, this is a well-known fact. >> No, you're 100% right. Nobody wants to be around because I have friends that are bodybuilders and their wives know, all right, we're going to pre-contest. So and so is going to be a jerk >> and we just got to deal with it. >> Low calorie, you're low energy. You don't want to do stuff like that. And the opposite is true when you're fueled properly and you're and you're working out and then in a bulk like that. It feels amazing. And I don't you like you I just get up and do more stuff. I see the kitchen's dirty. I just get up and I clean like that versus put me in a calorie deficit and and or missing workouts and it's like yeah I don't have I just don't want to do it there. You're not going to and it's taken years of really peering into that to connect those dots and go like oh wow there's a significant difference. >> Remember in the extreme case Adam when you were doing the experiment with the GLP where you were just eating very little just to like let's this let's see what people experienced. I remember you telling me the thing you noticed the most >> was the low energy. Yeah. You were like, I I have to decide to either clean the house or work out. Can't do both. >> Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, it was it was an either or for sure because I knew I didn't I didn't want to do either. But I knew I got to do one of them. >> Yeah. I was like, I can't I can't fail on the workout thing and fail as a husband. I was like, I got to I got to give I got to choose. Yeah. I wasn't doing both, though. There was no way. I just I just didn't have it in me to do both. And I I battled that daily. Daily felt that. Now, you're highlighting an extreme example of that. But I mean, I think that I think that is happening to us on a smaller scale that you just don't realize it. And that's why cuz it's not as extreme. So it's not as obvious to people, but that's happening. >> It's well it's so well documented that people will often argue that the metabolism boost that comes from a reverse diet is more to do with this this kind of activity outside of exercise. Now, that's not doesn't cover it all, but it is so well documented that it does happen. No, I don't. I That's one of the thing that are the arguments I've always made in defense of >> when people try and argue that like one pound of muscle doesn't burn that many more calories. It's okay, fair enough. like if you cut out the tissue and you measure it in the lab and and it doesn't tell a full story. And you're right, uh it it doesn't account for um a guy with five more pounds of muscle, what it what he has to do inside the gym to have built that muscle, keep that muscle, and the energy and the food he has to fuel in order to do all that that gives him more energy that then so there is this massive compounding effect >> that happens subconsciously that all plays in the factor. At the end of the day, when we're training clients, it doesn't matter how we got I don't care how I got her metabolism to 800 more calories a day, >> but we do it all the time. >> That happens. >> Exactly. Like predictable. >> I don't care to fight over the science of exactly the mechanism at which got there. I just know the facts of I've done hundreds of people. >> I've seen that happen to. And at the end of the day, if it works for them and they now have attached and created those behavior for the rest of their life, it's it's working. >> That's right. And lastly, your sleep isn't better. So, one of the characteristics of being in a deficit is you don't have good sleep or your sleep doesn't feel restful. So, anybody who's been in a deficit for a long period of time knows what this is like. It's either I can't get enough sleep or man, I'm going to bed and I got this kind of restless feeling. >> Uh, being in a surplus, having that much energy improves sleep across the board. Of course, again, this is in the context of a healthy bulk, whole natural foods, appropriate training, but if you're going in a bulk and your sleep isn't better or or or worse, it's worse, um then that's kind of a red flag that you're not doing it uh in the right way. So, >> you know, you you didn't list this on here, but I think it deserves an honorable mention that I've connected the dots to. I've heard from clients a lot of times. Um impact on libido. I I've seen a lot of clients who Yes. when they >> and it goes down in the cut, >> right? when when they when they are eating when I put them on a bulk, it's one of the things I constantly would hear feedback of like >> within a week. >> Yeah, I know. >> Libido and and a lot of times when you have been underfed for such a long period of time, libido is one of the things that is crash even for people who thought they had an okay libido, right? They'll be like, "Oh, I'm no, I'm fine." >> Yeah. And then they go on a bulk. >> Yeah. And then they go on a bulk and they're like, "Wow, you know, and again, there's probably a compounding effect there. They're bulking. They're building more >> muscle. Extra calories. That's it. Perfect, >> dude. Totally. All right. Uh, yo, I was going to I got to bring this up again. So, recently I talked about how uh how old machines because I'm going to a gym right now that has both new and old machines because the gym's been there for a long time and everything's kept up really well. So, I I like older machines, like machines from like the '9s, early 2000s. Uh, none are from the 80s, although I'd love to find those, but they made them different back in the day. I talked about this uh on a previous episode where old machines were really designed for bodybuilders and athletes. New machines are designed to have a small footprint, be easy to use >> and safety and the average person. So, a lot of things are different between the old machines and the new machines. The old machines were more hardcore than the new machines. And there's one other and I talked about some of the differences, but there's one big I just picked on picked this up today. I went and I haven't done a leg extension in a long time. Okay? I rarely ever do leg extensions when I work out my legs. I prefer doing other exercises, but anytime I do do a leg extension at a gym, I could do the whole stack. The stack is never heavy. I'll do 25 reps with the whole stack. No problem. >> Heavy. >> The old ones are, bro. The stacks on old machines were made for bodybuilders. >> Just the levers are >> I automatically went whole stack. And I was like, "Oh boy, that's way too heavy." And I'm like, "Oh, yeah. I remember like >> old machines were for strong dudes." >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> So you you whole stacking >> the starting point is already kind of heavy. Yeah. just >> I'll typically use the whole stack on new machines in any exercise. >> So funny you said I I trained in the gym yesterday and I used a machine. I used a dip machine and I was doing stacked the whole thing. I'm just like silly. >> Bro, use a dip machine from 97. Bro, you're going to go halfway down the stack if you're lucky. >> Like belts on them and stuff. >> It's got a whole new chair. >> Yeah, >> I was cracking up. >> Radiator belt holding it together. Yeah, I I literally I literally just took the pen and I went all the way to the bottom just out of habit and I'm like pick myself up the chair. Oh no, dude. >> What is going on? Anyway, I got to tell you guys about my uncle who um he got back to me. So we Yeah, I told you guys last weekend we did tomatoes. So my whole family came together and my uncle comes up and he doesn't work out or anything. Uh but I guess I'm on his algorithm. So he comes up to me and he goes, "Hey," he goes, "One of the products you talk about, I've been using for a while. I've been putting in my coffee. I'm like, "In your coffee?" I'm like, "Paleo Valley protein?" He's like, "Yeah, I love it." I'm like, "How do you feel?" He's like, "Man, I feel great. I have more energy." He's like, "I gained a couple pounds, though." I'm like, "What do you mean you gained a couple pounds?" So, we started talking more and found turned down my aunt's been making him eat sweets. So, I'm like, I don't think that's what's happening, dude. I don't think you're under calorie of protein. But, he loves it. He loves how he feels. He loves adding it to his coffee. Normally, he would just have coffee and now he's having, you know, the Paleo Valley protein in there. and he likes the way it tastes. >> Doug and I just had uh our final walkthrough on one of the properties and uh the the agent that was doing the walkthrough with us uh you know afterwards she was so she was curious about what we did >> and so she went and must have researched us and then after that like the algorithm has been falling now it's all over her. Yeah. Yeah. So she she the last time we this last time when we walked through she's like so tell me about this this Paleo Valley bone broth because my I can't I'm lactose intolerant. >> Yeah. like, "Oh man." I was like, "Boy, that algorithm is pretty good." The fact that she didn't know who we were. >> She went and Googled us within and then within within like a day was asking Doug and I about Paleo Valley. And I was like, "Oh my god." I'm like, "That's uh that's a pretty good advertising there >> by far." And this is what my uncle told me cuz again, he doesn't work out. He doesn't care. And he's like, "I was afraid to buy it cuz I hate protein powders." He's like, "They always taste gross." He goes, "This one is so good." As I told you, bro. >> It's the best. >> That's what I was telling her. I'm like I think it's for especially for somebody who is lactose and you can't have you know dairy can't have whey >> cuz whey weight typically is one of the best tasting proteins on Yeah. that you could taste. >> Um but a lot of people it they're they're intolerant to it or it bothers them a little bit right and so the bone broth is just so good and I love that I can do >> it's easy to digest. >> I love that I can go high. Yo, I can do 70 grams of protein >> to be able to like I can't even with I I can have whey again, I've talked about this before where I can I can do whey proteins. I just have to have moderate amount. Yeah, >> once a day is enough for me. And I definitely can't do like a double up shake. Like if I had like 60 to 80 grams of whey in one sitting, like that'll mess me up. >> But I can do 60 to 80 g of the bone broth and it digests so easily water. >> Yes, I know. Yeah. So that's a huge win. Uh, did you guys uh have you guys seen the new dating app? It's real, by the way, that's kind of going around. >> The new one? >> Yeah, Doug, look up >> how do they change it? >> Look up the dating app. So, this is interesting, dude. And I almost could have predicted this. So, it's called Doug, look this up. It's unjected. So, u N J E C T E D. >> Unjected. >> Un. >> So, instead of rejected, you're unjected. >> Nope. >> It is for people. people people >> people who want to date people who were never vaccinated with the COVID vaccine. >> It's literally a dating website for people who never got the COVID vaccine. >> I mean, I feel like this is kind of a way of being like the non-political way of saying the political thing. I feel like I feel like that's what that is. Not not necessarily this, but like um so way back when like I was telling you guys like one of my my sister-in-law was looking at >> you know getting a donor uh you know and so like one of the parameters I'm like did you find out like you know the history like how much detail do they give you and it's like I did I don't think they were revealing or not but then they start revealing if they had the the vaccine or not. >> Yes. I I'm so >> I heard this not confirmed but I heard that that uh donors >> like sperm donors that are unvaccinated they'll charge more or more demand for >> Yes, that's what I heard. >> Yeah. Is are are uh sperm donors who did not get the COVID vaccine in higher demand? Let's look that up. >> But it's crazy that they have a side >> unvaccinated. I mean, don't you feel like that's like a like like a subtle way of being like >> Well, there's a lot of like there's a lot of conjecture and conspiracy theory stuff out there. Some is it true? Not I don't know. We won't get into that. But um but people want it. They want they want to date people without it. >> Whoever like threw that my way on my story isn't going to like this. >> Oh, you had somebody you had somebody >> Yeah. They're like challenging me on our our COVID science and it was just like >> Yeah. Oh, the stuff that you listed. >> Yeah. >> Everything you listed was a fact. >> Well, yeah. No, I I listed that as a response. >> Yeah. a response because it was like I I think they they had a hard time because we mention a lot of studies all the time and you know back a lot of what we say with science and they're you know obviously just looking at one specific study that was like >> you know making it look like the you know the vaccines like had a pretty high effectiveness which is like oh that's interesting because like I've seen a lot of conflicting studies that >> oh there's people that still believe that. >> Yeah. >> Oh that's funny. >> Oh yeah >> that's hilarious. You know, I still do you guys get like I CVS sends me the get your COVID 19. Are they sending that? >> Yeah, like a robot one or that. I'm so petty. I like I send a message back. Laugh out loud. >> No, you don't. To the robot. >> Like, I'm really going to go get that. Come on, bro. Are you serious? There's people that really believe that it had that much of an impact. Wow. That's interesting. >> Yeah. Yeah, it is interesting. And it, you know, it just goes to show too like how segmented we are and like how much No, no, no, no. What it goes to show, which is such a perfect transition for this cuz I wanted to bring it up anyways, is what Chris Nibi just talked about and it's like >> how well media paints a narrative and how well and today how crazy it is where >> Yeah. >> holds all the power. >> What I what I love about this episode, Chris did such a good job on this episode. It's one of my favorite episodes he's ever done. >> Higher standard is >> Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, Chris, our good friend, we've been on the show before, Chris Negi. uh higher standard podcast and what I love that he set the table before he went just telling hit like history like this has been happening for 200 years. >> Yeah. So just a little context. So historically speaking so if you live in a first of all this is important in all societies but it's especially important and valuable in a free society where people make choices. So, if you live in a society like you do, if you're listening to this podcast, you probably live in one of those societies where you can choose for the most part what you can buy, what you don't want to buy, where you want to live, um who you can vote for. When you have that kind of choice, uh the the who controls the narrative, which is done largely through media, has a lot of power, right? Because you can sway people in different directions. And this is not new. We've known this for forever. We've done this for a long time but like the look at the first newspapers and who bought those and on those and why and when uh when it was TV how TV became influenced radio became influenced um you know >> magazines >> magazines now it's like social media >> so whoever controls the nar it's very valuable >> for either companies the platform dictates >> politicians or anything is who can control the narrative tends to control uh the situation and so and by the way the reason why this came up and you know our one of our friends is involved in this and I so I respect the guy I think you know he does a good job but it was really interesting to me when I saw um our friends podcasts be the highest selling podcast of all time so this was the >> TBPN I think that's what it's called TBPN podcast so this was a >> they called it like sports center for Silicon Valley so it was a podcast uh and they kind of treated it like sports center where they're reporting on what's going on talking about Silicon Valley it is this super new podcast that got bought recently for >> hundreds of millions. >> Yeah. So some so >> just under uh Joe Rogan. >> Yeah. Like around $200 million. Now the reason why this was interesting was because uh Joe Rogan gets 10 million views or listens. >> He gets a million an episode. >> They got they like very little >> very little in comparison. They weren't producing. There was nothing that justified the selling of their podcast for nearly that much except for and this is what we speculated on. I think this is what's happened that AI companies in particular first off they have really low approval ratings. So AI is like it's this emerging technology tons of potential money in it. Everybody knows this. Like this is why so many trillions of dollars getting dumped into it. But AI uh >> there's been some backlash though. Like >> public perception around it is like iffy. Yeah. And you know if public perception public perception goes the wrong way, it'll get regulated into into smitherines. >> Have you seen all those commencement speeches that are flying around? Yeah. And then mention it and everybody's just >> That's why this has become so important. >> So owning the narrative is very important for an AI company. Okay. And who bought their podcast? >> 80enters all this stuff. And and who bought their podcast for $200 million, right? It was uh Anthropic. >> Yeah. >> Was it Anthropic? >> What? Sam Alman. >> Yeah, I think that's the one, right? >> Anthropic. Yes. >> Uh and it and then they bought it and they canceled their app. So whatever money they were making, they stopped. No advertising. >> Yeah. >> How can a podcast who first off wasn't earning nowhere near what would be worth uh $200 million in purchase. And how could they sell for that much? And then on top of why would a company buy that and cancel advertising anyway? So it makes no money. It's because they want to control the narrative. and they need uh a propaganda arm or an arm of of media. And there really wasn't a good popular one in Silicon Valley. And you got these guys on there. One of them we know well. He does a good job. >> Yeah. >> Uh good-looking kids, smart, sharp, >> smart as a whip. >> It's like, hey, let's buy this and let's use this to to to to control the narrative. That's And by the way, that's what I speculate when I saw that. I'm like, oh god, I know what happened. >> Well, and what have I been saying about the whole AI movement right now, too? that so much of it is propped up and so they they need to keep all the money flowing there. And you ask why why? Well, of course, there there's uh all these companies that want to IPO where they make big money, but even if they don't IPO, you and this was like >> this is huge for me to kind of see behind the curtain in the last like 5 years being a part of um a lot of people that are VCs and do seed rounds and funding and have close friends, people that are on Forbes magazine, stuff like that that I got to talk to and and talk business intimately on how all this I was so unfamiliar here 10 years ago on how all this worked. And when I saw it, I remember sharing with you guys, and I don't know how much of that I I've shared publicly on uh on here, but I know we've talked about it that I was like so blown away by the the hustle. >> Yeah. The VC. Uh >> yeah. just that like so when when something when something especially like this like AI when billions of dollars are flowing in a direction of a movement and they're they're popping up all over the place you don't even care if that company ever makes it to IPO so long as you can keep it growing and and and raising money y >> every six months to a year you know seed rounds and then series A and then you Keep going. Keep going. What these what these founders can do >> is every round that comes around, you go, "Oh, we're rate. We hey, we grew this much over the last year, even though we spent this much to grow that much. So, we're still negative, but we're growing. >> We need another $10 million. Cool." So, you get $10 million. And he goes like this. I'll take 1 million for myself and we'll pump 9 million back into it to make it to the next. And to be clear, many of the biggest companies in the world that we know about did that for a long time before they became extremely like Amazon wasn't profitable for like 10 years. >> Tesla like so it's the game and what they're doing is they're betting. >> Well, yeah. So you you you just you just named uh two outliers. >> That's right. Some of the winners, but how many hundreds of losers or thousands? >> Huge percentage >> don't ever even come close to that and making that way. Meanwhile, they're still making a ton of money. And so, it's like a good old boy club where it's like, "Hey, let's all agree. Just keep pushing this narrative this direction. We all eat >> because if if we keep and this this, by the way, this is this is good news and bad news. This is scare stuff, too. That's why that was my point. Like when you bring, oh my god, all like it's keeping it top of news." Yeah. >> So, whether whether it's there's fear-mongering happening on what AI is going to kill all of us or it's going to be doing our dishes in the next month, it doesn't matter. for so long as it's top of the news and everyone's talking about it and it's going to re it's like it's.com all over again. >> Well, and here and here's the big thing. So, for a long time, tech has uh enjoyed the advantage of having good public perception. For a while, up until relatively recently, relatively recently, there's been criticism. There's been cynicism around tech. >> You saw it affected the elections. >> Yeah. Like, like when the iPhone first came out, like it was everybody was like, "Let's go. This is awesome. Apple's the best company in the world. Amazon's amazing. >> Now people are more cynical and skeptical. Um, public policy is starting to move in that direction. Social media is starting to get regulated. Tech moguls are getting criticized. They're looked at as bad guys in some cases. >> Facebook, >> they were heroes before, you know, Steve Jobs was the guy like every they were all heroes because it was new. So what my point with that is today more than ever and definitely in the next five or 10 years >> they are going to need to control the narrative. >> They are investing heavily in controlling no no different than politicians. No different than politicians have throughout the past. So you're going to see more of that kind of stuff cuz your options are this. You're anthropic. You got two options. You're looking at public perception. You're one of the top companies like guys we got to change everybody's opinion on us and what we do. either a we build a nar a machine, we build our own show that pumps out good information about us and makes us look good. Good luck with that. It's one thing to build an incredible AI company. It's a completely different thing to build a media company. Or you look at one and you go, they're promising. Let's give them some money and they'll do what we say anyway and let's rock and roll. Which, by the way, if you're if you're listening to this and this conversation at all interests you, the breakdown that Chris does on the the timeline, >> such a good episode >> and uh in the links to everything to back up all the stuff that he's talking about and the connections to everything. It's fascinating. Such a good episode. >> And by the way, if anybody is like questioning this, like does anybody question that Elon Musk buying X, which was Twitter at the time, didn't influence the last election? >> Yeah, of course it did. >> Yeah, >> it totally did. He's just they're playing the game that's been played. >> I didn't realize the part. Did you hear when Chris talked about uh the uh when Elon and Biden both texts the same day and and Biden's text? >> He was like 29 million and then he was like 9 million. >> So that was like the that's what set off the buying of uh Twitter or or >> Oh, his tweet you mean? >> Yeah, his tweet that went out. So he >> Biden's tweet crushed >> crushed and his was suppressed and he went in and like fired fired a bunch of people that was responsible for that. changed the algorithm or anything like that and flipped it like completely. Uh-huh. >> So I mean just >> do you know you know that one of the reasons why uh this is connected one of the reasons why cannabis went through this whole period of prohibition was because uh who was it? Was it William Hurst who owned the paper mills >> and hemp was starting to compete and because William Hurst owned the newspapers, >> he started printing a bunch of uh articles going talking about how dangerous cannabis was. And the goal was to get rid of >> the goal was to get rid of competition paper >> because because hemp was so much or so so much cheaper and inexpensive to produce >> and more durable. It's like it's such a missed opportunity. It's such a great material. And I the point of all this were bleaching everything. >> That's the part that I think Chris does a really good job of this is like he he talks about what's going on with TBBN and and that the narrative and the purchase of all that, but he sets the table of like like this is not new strategy. >> No, this has been >> And nor am I like and and he's like nor am I hating. It's just like it's I mean if you're them, >> it's an old game, dude. >> Yeah. But it's like but it's like people needs people need to know. You know what I'm saying? you just need to know like what's what what your but all back to my point of going on this tangent with you is just I just feel like that's what's so much of the the the narrative whatever you're and boy it's today it's crazy once you like something and you watch something and the algorithm figures out what you like or the information that you that >> you just hover over something >> oh it just it just get ready cuz the next six months everything will just confirm your >> I've had people I've had friends of mine I've had friends of mine that I'll meet like friends at church for example who don't know the show they don't know Mindpump they don't know who I am we meet we start talking the next day they go listen I didn't look you up or anything but now you're showing up on my algorithm I'm like is your phone listening >> is it listening >> I'm sure it is the thing they and uh I forget what it was but they they had shown um you know through drive-ins that predictably you know they already knew your order I I don't know if it was McDonald's or one of these franchises was using this technology before it was legal you know then they had stop because it was like an invasion of privacy. But they were like tracking license plates and like you know so they've been doing these things like that that's the first roll out is like you know you're testing it and you're getting the beta testing and >> you guys have seen it with your navigation haven't you? >> Oh where it's like >> it predicts where I'm going all the time. It's rarely wrong. >> I know. >> It's I mean it's wrong sometimes. I'm like dude this like is it could be like literally it's >> Are you going to buy a burrito right now? It's a random day in the week and I'm I'm heading somewhere and it's like it populates, you know, it suggests where I'm going and I'm like, how does it know I'm going? But it's it's it's been tracking >> the habit. We're Yeah, our patterns are predictable. >> Do you you guys know that back in the day, I don't know when it was, and maybe you can confirm this, Doug, but uh they experimented movies experimented or they tested subliminal messaging and they had to make it illegal. >> Uhhuh. >> Where they flash a picture Yeah. >> But that you don't necessarily perceive. that movie uh Thank You for Smoking talked about that. Show showed that highlighted that where they flash a cigarette smoke and and he had to you had to freeze it to see it. But if you didn't see it, >> look at this. In 1957, market researcher James Vickery claimed he flashed drink Coca-Cola and eat popcorn during movie boosting concession sales. Oh, wow. Well, okay. So, it says, >> I mean, subliminal messaging. There's >> You know what movie does this by the way? There's a movie that does this that you can actually you can actually find the frames. Fight Club. Flight Club does certain flashes. >> Yeah, thank you for Smoking does it too. They did they did they did it in there. They did like little like cigarettes >> burn mark. Yeah. And then it like >> Yeah, they did they did stuff like that. I mean they do this with um grocery stores with music and and and stores. >> Yeah. There's certain music played to keep you shopping, you know, >> certain temperatures, you know, like coffee shops you keep, you know, buying dude. We were talking about uh um dating dating app earlier and uh do you guys know what's a trend right now on social media with uh the younger generation? >> What? >> Pheromone maxing. >> Pherom look up pheromone maxing. >> Pheromone maxing. >> You know what this you know what they're doing? >> What do they do? >> Dudes are not showering. >> What? >> So when they go on a date that their pherommones are maxed out and that'll maybe get the >> they just smell like trash. a viral online dating trend where men intentionally skip showering, ditch deodorant, and wear unclo un unwashed clothes before dates. >> Weird. >> Does that work? >> So, okay. So, here's the funny thing about this cuz someone's listening. They're like, "That's gross." >> This is Here's what's weird. >> I mean, there's some >> a woman who's ovulating versus a woman who isn't ovulating. Same woman, >> she will perceive uh if a man wore a shirt or not as attractive or not. So if she's ovulating and a man wore a shirt, she'll smell it. Oh, this smells really good. So this might only work if she's ovulating, bro. But if she's not, you're not going to get >> So you think Okay, cuz they're they're also like trying to capture this with um like cologne and there's like one that's like it's always trying to market I I think like my son and it's like, you know, it has pherommones in it and it's like, you know, the only one that has it and it's like super expensive and you know, so that way too. Yeah. like women will will you know pick up on that like subliminally. So, isn't there isn't there science of support that we like that we we pair and match with with the appropriate like pherommones for us? In other words, like so one of the things unless your hormones are all >> I remember like connecting this a long time ago through dating is like there's I I would date a girl and um one girl could be that let's say one girlfriend uh could be all sweaty, not shower, come to the gym and I like the way she smelt. Another girl that I dated, I would notice I was repulsed by that smell. So both sweaty, not showered. So that but one of them that smell I'm attracted to and I >> pick up on something different% where another one I would date and they would have a a smell and it would be offputting. >> You know what's you know what's crazy about that? Uh I tell my wife she doesn't believe me but this I tell her this all the time her her she I don't necessarily smell anything but I love to smell her. >> And she'll and she'll be like oh my god I didn't shower. And I'll be like, >> "Yeah, see, don't you don't you think that we have >> Don't you think that there's certain >> There's got to be." >> So to me, that makes sense. >> Which, by the way, when women are on birth control versus not completely changes how they like >> Now, the funny thing about this that I think is is talk about a quick way to like know you're not matched up is like, >> "Oh, yeah. Yeah, you're >> the right person probably is like, oh, they they smell either they it's either neutral to them or they smell good." >> You need to think about that, dude. You don't like someone's smells. It ain't happening. You know what I'm saying? I'm not I'm not going to be with someone that I don't like their smell, bro. >> Well, they're they're bad. I mean, I don't know. There's a there's a there's a >> Oh, God. Just I didn't hear what he said. >> I heard what he said to you. Disgusting. >> Did you, you know, speaking of dating and relationships and stuff? I shared with you that Arthur Brooks post. >> Oh, yeah. Happiness. That's old data. So, I'll read I'll read his post because >> it's it's really good. It's good. I have thoughts around. >> It's good. And the reason why but I brought this up a long time ago because there was this >> you have and I I wanted to revisit it because I wanted to share. >> No, there were these studies that would come out actually article and the title of the articles would say because of studies they'd say uh PE parent couples without kids are happier and they'd quote the study and I hate stuff like this because it's not telling the full picture. So here's what his post says and because he knows the actual data. So it says couples without children enjoy their lives more than parents do but they suffer a hidden cost. When researchers compare parents with otherwise similar couples, the childless report more day-to-day enjoyment, more sleep, more restaurants, more finished sentences. So, are the couples deciding against children reading the data correctly? Well, they are reading only one line of it. Happiness has three macronutrients: enjoyment, satisfaction, and meaning, and they're all fed differently. Children are a trade between macronutrients. They draw down enjoyment, sometimes for a decade at a stretch, and they deposit meaning. So when researchers ask people to rate their daily activities, caring for children lands near the bottom for momentto moment happiness been near the top for meaning and nothing splits the two so hard. And then he talks about his own experience uh with his own kids. So, I wanted you to bring it up because there's something that I've always tried to figure out about my own personal journey with this because I I' I've fell in the category of somebody who would be like uh thought about not having kids for the longest time. And and one of the cases that I make for is man, especially Katrina and I did it for a long time without Max, right? We had a really really good life. Yeah. Like we had a lot of fun, a lot of you know, a lot of basketball games, a lot of concerts, a lot of fun travel, a lot of lot of cool stuff and and really really enjoyed each other. And so there was this possibility like I could see not having kids >> yet. I also say, you know, seven years later, Katrina and I have done more of all of that. >> And so I've always been like, what? That's kind of weird cuz that's that's the opposite of the the the narrative around that. >> And and so another reason why I don't like those studies that show that because it doesn't tease out um what I have and cuz when I compare it to my like two best friends cuz I don't think they would say that. They would definitely say the children gave meaning, but they would say, "Man, when we were single, we definitely had more of those." >> Well, there was a period of time when you didn't, right? When Max was really little, you know, it was a couple years, right? Or a year where you're not going all over the place. >> When he he was 3 months old, we were already up at our Tahoe house. We were flying with him by the time before he was 6 months old. >> We were >> Well, that's not the that's not the typical, >> right? So, that's so this is this is me. So why why I'm saying why that story doesn't tell everything because here's here's and and the reason why what I've unpacked for myself is how valuable family has been for for for us and and what I have found is because we have family so willing to help and support which I think is so valuable. I think Katrina and I have been even more intentful to do those things because it's like we uh uh we we got Friday mom's my my mother-in-law's got our son so we're we're we got this we're going to go do and then we got this and we're and so we plan even more not to mention we do a lot with Max and so then on top of that I find that we go out of our way to do even more because we get that one night or two nights off a week and then we So it's like I think that there's more to that. It's like, yeah, if you tease out uh somebody who is uh married and has a kid and also isolated from family and of course they're going to see a dramatic difference in that. >> Yeah. When you look at >> there's other there's other my point is that there's other factors that play into. >> Of course, when you're looking at studies, you're looking at the general. Yes. And so there's always outliers, but generally speaking, I think it's uh reasonable to expect that you're not going to have as much personal enjoyment in freedom when you have kids, especially multiple kids, especially for the first 5 years uh that they're around. I think that's a very reasonable thing to expect. That's also what the data supports. But I think what more important about this data is my own personal enjoyment. If I just do that all the time and that's the most important thing to me, you know what that turns into? a hedonistic hell, >> a treadmill of hedenism. And all of us know some people like this, right? They're in their kind of late 40s. They've lived this life. It's all about them. They still don't have any kids. And they're now at the point where they're like, "This is like this is worn out." Like, "This is worn out. Uh I'm either on some kind of anti-depressant or I'm not happy or what's going on." And sometimes it takes that long for people to figure that out because if you look at all the data, again, we're speaking generally because some people are way more miserable with kids for whatever reason, but generally speaking, uh when you inter when you do this these studies, people are generally better off having kids than they weren't. Yes, you are trading personal freedom and enjoyment for meaning 100%. Yeah, I think I think it's a good I think it's a good way to frame it that you should go into expecting that, but I also don't think that's I don't think you have to either. >> I I think that if you if you go into that situation and you're intentful about it and you you make that like, hey, this is what you know, mother-in-law or auntie or uncle, if you have that, right? I so I definitely think if you don't have that you should prepare that you're not going to go as many concerts. You're not going to go as many of these things, right, as you did before cuz you don't have >> you're just going to grow in in incredible other ways than expected. >> Exactly. So you're going to get you're going to get the meaning part. You're going to get heavily on the meaning part. But I I do believe that there is I mean I know that I was an exceptional role and I know that I was the person who probably was afraid of having kids because of of fear >> of giving so much of that up like that was going to happen. And the opposite was true for me and I did not see that coming. And so it it changed. >> It's so funny. I have a buddy who's uh now how old is he? Mid-4s and he's lived that life. So, work, made money, did whatever he wanted, dated girls, never settling down type of deal. Now he's in his mid-40s, and now we're having conversations. And he's like, "Yeah, dude. I'm I'm kind of lonely. Like, I think I'm like ready to settle down. I think I'm like ready to do this." And uh and I'm like, "What is that going to be? How's that going to feel for you? Because you've lived this other way for so long. Are you willing to like trade this freedom and whatever to be with somebody who and now you're also 45 so >> not only that s >> and like you're decent looking and you make good money but you are you going to find you your age group or below in an appropriate age range you're probably going to find someone with kids >> who's divorced >> not only that so we we're having this funny that we went this direction in this conversation because Katrina and I were having this discussion last night I've got three people in my life that fit this category. >> Yeah. >> And one of the other things that becomes also extremely challenging is that you're in your late 40s or 50s and you've you've established these patterns of how you live your life. And when you've lived it for that long, a certain way for and I'm I'm not going to sell out one of the people that I was having this conversation, one of my friends. I was talking to about this. This is this is one of my female friends. >> And uh she's like, I am she really wants a partner. She wants all these things and she's expressing that >> and I'm like, you got to you can't keep doing the same thing you've been doing for the last 30 years. You and and well, I joined a gym and I'm doing this. I'm like, yeah, but the time you go, you're not going to meet anybody going that time. Yeah, but that's what work that's the problem. Everything you do is like this is what works for me and this is my schedule and this is when I do this and this is when I do that and you have this routine that you won't break out of yet you want something different. So, it's like you got to break out of that same friend circle, meet new people, you got to stop the like, this is the time I always do this and the time I always do that because you've already met all those people. Like, you got to shake all that up. And boy, that's hard to do for somebody who's been doing that. >> We've also just And we've also just, and this is, we talked about this earlier, controlling the narrative. And the narrative for a long time has been the most valuable thing is personal freedom, personal enjoyment, uh is hedonistic pleasure. And we've been hammered this into us for so long. People believe this, but the data is showing we've been wrong. It's been wrong, everybody. In fact, in fact, you know, you know, when birth control, because birth control plays a role in all of this that we're talking about when birth control was first brought to market, do you know how it was advertised? >> It was advertised for married couples to help them stay married longer because now they have an option to control, you know, whether or not they have children. Because back then they were like, "Oo, it's a stress. you have a kid, you can't afford it. That causes a lot of strain, but now you have a way to control your fertility. Then, of course, it turned into, hey, now you can control your fertility and you can sleep, you can have sex with other people without the risk. And you know what? That's better because now you can see if you're compatible. And this was kind of the narrative. You know what happened since since that became mainstream? Divorce rates went from 8% to 50%. >> Childless house households went through the roof. And people are less happy. Men are less happy. You know who's especially less happy? Women are way less happy. In fact, they call this a par they uh this is like a paradox. Why are they so much less happy than they were when they had, you know, perceived less freedoms. And it's because we've sold this idea so long that the most important thing in your life is having a lot of stuff, having all this personal freedom and having all this this personal enjoyment and pleasure. That's just not the way it works. The data doesn't support it. We can see it. And you know what? marriage and kids. Is it hard? Do you do you have a lot of responsibility? Do you give up personal freedom? Do you give up personal enjoyment? You do, but what you get in return >> is well worth it. >> Purpose and meaning. Cuz that the other two aren't the formula for purpose and meaning. So that's exactly why. >> No, totally. Anyway, you were talking about working out earlier and I was excited. I don't know if you saw this, Adam, cuz I thought of you. >> What? >> Vori now has pickle ball paddles. >> Yes, I did. >> I already put a call in. Did you really? >> Yes. I'm trying to get some paddles, >> dude. How first off. So So Vor smart for >> I mean last time Doug brought up when he went river rafting they had the rash guard stuff for the whatever for them. I just they're on top. >> They had snowboard last winter. I saw when they all snowboard they're like man they're expanding into all all different areas. >> What are these real quick? What are these sweats called again? We have the same ones. >> Seaside. >> They're the best. >> Oh the seaside. >> Best best best sweats I've ever had in my life. >> I wear those pretty much every night. >> Comfortable, warm chill. They last forever. >> Oh, look. There's the paddles right there. >> Yeah. Vori does a good job. Look at that, dude. >> It's so good, dude. >> Is Is so paddle uh excuse me, pickle ball has literally exploded. >> Yes. >> In popularity. Is it one of the fastest growing sports right now? >> I do believe so. I I think it is. I imagine so. >> I actually looked that up. I'm curious. It's got to be. >> Yeah. >> I I never heard of it. >> Did you guys Did you guys see the uh the uh the pickle ball movie? Dink. Dink. >> Yeah. Did you watch it or did you see that? >> I just watched the trailer. I didn't watch it. >> I mean, it's not I'm not promoting it. Fastest growing sport in the United States. >> Yep. Y >> the fastest growing sport. >> So the whole I told you >> what's the rate of growth, Doug? I'm interested to see >> over the last 5 years. >> US has more than 24 million players. >> Cool. >> Yeah. >> Uh let's see. I'll find >> Yeah. Yeah. Just put in pickle ball rate of growth over the last 5 years popular to jump on that. So smart. >> They're very, you know, Vori is it's so crazy. I know we How long have we been with them? >> 10 years. >> Has it been 10 years >> almost? They went from being this kind of unknown like cool company to like dominating. Yeah. Like crushing all now. It's it's it's got to a place where when I see someone in athleisure wear it's it's almost always >> I always see Vor both women and men. It used to be just men I would see that but now it's women and men I see it's like they definitely it'd be interesting to see how much of the market share they have now taken you know because Lulu dominates. Look at the growth of pickle ball the last 5 years. 479%. >> What? >> It went from 4 million players to 24 million players. >> Well, didn't you hear? Was it Gary Vee who bought a team? >> Should we buy pickle ball courts right now, >> bro? He bought like a team. No, it's a it's a would be a brilliant investment. You know how hard you know how hard it is to get on a pickle ball court right now? >> We should buy some land, put pickle ball courts on there, let people rent it, and then sell it before the the crate cuz the craze will go down. It'll crush and it'll go down. >> It'll drop at some point. It has longevity. I don't know about that. and it's been around forever. So, it's not like it's a new thing suddenly. >> I think because it's multigenerational, you know, this fight's going to stick. >> Multiple factors and I will I would bet against you that it's going to go away. Will it uh slow down 100%. It can't grow at that rate forever. But here's the thing. >> You've talked about this all the time. Uh we don't we don't meet up >> socialize. And the barrier to entry for pickle ball >> is low is low. You can be 70 and go play and you could be super athletic and go play and it's competitive at all levels. >> I like tennis or ra running groups. >> So I mean listen I I would bank on this ain't going away for quite some time now. I can't predict 20 years from now what we're doing or what that but it's going to be hot for a while and I don't I don't think we're going to see a >> Are you trying to talk us into maps pickle ball? Well, I mean, I like your I I like your idea of some land, like an acre, and throw on some pickle ball. >> I bet it will crush right now. >> It would absolutely work. >> And then you'd sell it after it grows, just sell it real quick, and then somebody else will buy it for a profit. Start promoting Jasmitt. >> I'm not a I'm not a guest at all. >> Jasmine. >> Yeah. I told the guys I got for one of the Christmases, I got like the boys this like game. It's like a popup square. So, it's a square that has like, you know, >> Oh, I saw that. >> Yeah. And so you have paddles, but it's like basically bad mitten, but you have to hit it through this little square. Jazz mitten. >> Oh, I love that. I'm telling you. Oh, that's it. >> Yeah. Kids would love that. >> Yeah, exactly. Like that. That would be like the next follow up to >> When I was a kid, bad mitten was popular for kid for for families. >> Yeah. Bad mitten never really took off like But that was always another easy one. >> So weird. I totally forgot this. My family used to get together and play badminton. >> Mhm. >> What were a group of Sicilians doing playing? >> Because it's like it's more of a European thing, I think. So, you remember uh uh Karan, >> you had to say that it's >> right there. >> That's what it's called, you guys. >> My my uh our trainer uh Karan who comes in here was like a bad mini champion. He's like like world ranked way. Yes. Yes. >> Was he a pro? I mean, tournaments. >> He was like a champion. Yeah. Yeah. No, he's like really >> Yeah. Which is why like he's he you he would he would surprise you. He's pretty athletic. Like he like he's been on my softball team. We play basketball. Like >> he's athletic. Like he can just pick a sport up and play it. And I I remember always being like, "Hey, dude." Like I would have never guessed you. And then that he he I found out years later after being friends and knowing him, he's like, "Oh yeah, I was a bad man champion." >> You know what sport? >> I beat him in ping pong, though. Kron. >> You know what sport fascinates me? I've never seen it live. I've only seen it on videos. I don't know what it's called, but they have this big hook thing on their arm and they whip a ball. >> Oh yeah. >> And it goes high. >> Highlight. >> It goes The ball goes so fast. Brazilian a Brazilian sport. Yeah. And it goes like 120 mph. Scoops. >> Yes, dude. It looks crazy. Whip it. >> Yeah. And they throw the ball super fast. It's uh >> That is a crazy sport. >> It looks Yeah, there it is right there. >> I don't know if it's hurling or there there's a sport, too. Scotland that just it's so brutal. >> What do you do? >> Well, you you can throw it really fast and like it it's dangerous. People like lose teeth all the time. Oh, yeah. >> Oh, that. >> Yeah. It's pretty fun to watch it. >> Smash hockey. Listen, there is no sport. >> It's way more brutal. >> There is no sport that's crazier or more brutal uh than uh kalo stoico in Italy. >> Oh, is that the one where they fight each other? >> It's it's an ancient sport. They've been playing for hundreds of years. >> They fight playing. It's like football where you fight too. Is that >> gang fighting? But then they add cio and then separate words. They beat the [ __ ] out of each other. >> No, dude. It's literally It's an ancient sport. >> Yeah. Yeah. We >> you have to be from the town. >> That's right. >> To play for the team and it's four major cities in Italy. I can't >> I would love to go to one of those and watch. >> And literally you get a ball. The goal is to get one ball into the other goal. And is it like is it a once a year thing that happens or is it it's not happening? >> No, it's a once a year thing. >> Yeah. I was say it's like a big it's like a traditional thing that they >> and you can do whatever you want to stop the guy. >> I'm sure has one that's competitive to this. >> Oh, well Russia's got great. But this has got pedigree. This sport has been around for I think years. It's like a town pride thing is really what it is, right? That's like where where the history >> Watch, let me see how old this is. Watch. You're going to trip out over how old uh this was. Like kings and queens were were competing with each other with their teams. Let's see. Ancient roots. Uh the Roman army. Well, keep going. 1400s, young Florentines revived this game and evolved into the sport for wealthy aristocrats, noblemen, and even future popes. What? >> Whoa, dude. Or or that one Mayan sport where if you're the winner you die. >> Yeah. You sacrifice. >> What? When you win like your prizes, you die. >> Yeah. >> It's great. >> Yeah. It's a game I would suck at on purpose. >> Everybody sucks. Both sides suck. Nobody's glorying. >> This game's going on forever. >> Pocket talk. >> You just found the most downloaded health, fitness, and entertainment podcast in history. Approaching a half a billion total downloads. This is Mind Pump. Today's episode, we answered listeners questions. We picked four of them from our Instagram page, Mind Pumpup Media. We answered them, but this was after the intro. Today's intro was 62 minutes long. This is where we talk about muscle building and fat loss and diet and current events. Again, if you want to post a question that we can potentially pick, go to Instagram, Mind Pump Media. Now, this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Paleo Valley. Today, we talked about their protein. It's a bone broth protein, which means it's super easy to digest. It's also good for gut health. Uh, and it tastes um it's the best tasting protein powder I've ever had in my entire life. I'm not lying. It tastes so good. You got to try it. Head over there and try it out. Go to paleo valley.com/mindpump. That link will get you 15% off. This episode is also brought to you by Vori. They make athleisure wear that lasts a long time. It looks great. You know who they are. They're super popular. They're amazing. And if you go through our link, you get the biggest discount on the internet. 20% off. Go to voryclo.com/mindpump. We also have a brand new maps program. Maps, abs, and butt. You guessed it. It's a program that focuses on developing the abs and the butt. It's 40% off because it's a brand new program. And we're going to throw in muscle mommy 15 or muscle mommy. So, you get a free program with it. And we're throwing the butt building diet guide and a supplement guide. The whole thing is 40% off. Go to mapsabsandbutt.com. Use the code launch for the discount and the free stuff. Here comes the show. >> Our first question is from Kathy Steinhill. What is the best way to improve leg strength when you do not have a squat rack? >> You know, split stance exercises are right up there. >> Would be for sure. >> If you look at the biomechanics of a split stance movement like a lunge or a Bulgarian, the front leg is squatting. >> It's a onelegged squat. It's a onelegged squat. >> It's there. That's by the way some people athletic coaches I should say some athletic coaches argue >> yeah Mike Bole >> that split stance movements are better >> than it's a solid argument. >> I agree for athletics I I think I can see that >> you can actually really load it too. It's not like something that's impossible to do like it's just it requires a lot of skill and like you have to like master you know the balance of it but you can really like increase strength with that movement. Yeah, the ch the challenge. So, the thing with a squat is because you start to get really strong and and you're able to load it very heavily, a squat rack starts to become necessary. Yeah. So, it's like, okay, I can't pick this weight up off the ground and put it on my back. But split stance exercises give you a lot more room cuz you're not going to use as much weight, but the the intensity and the tension is up there. >> Still there. >> I mean, that being said, uh some Bulgarian split squats with some wrist wraps could take you a long ways. >> Very far. >> A long ways. >> Very far. Like I mean you could literally if I have wrist wraps Oh yeah. >> I can hold on to 120s 150s and eat. I mean that's a 300 lb single. Yeah. I can't I couldn't do that. But that's my point. My point is heav rack it too. >> Well that would be I could front rack that much weight but I could I could wrist wrap that kind of weight. You know what I'm saying? >> The other one is front racking 150 dumbbells dog. >> I'm more impressed with the rack than the squat. >> The uh the other one is like uh heavy step-ups are also really good. I know there's a balance component, so it's not going to be as much of a strength builder, but it is phenomenal. >> So, you could load, you know, grab a couple heavy dumbbells and um and do a very heavy step up onto a bench or a step. So, there's a lot of great exercise you could do and you're really not missing out on a ton because you don't have a squat rack. >> Next question is from Make Wellness, Elizabeth TWWP. Before I started lifting, I was rather flexible. Now, I seem to be tied all over, which is a bit frustrating. Am I not stretching enough or is this a normal part of the process? >> Cut out that last part, huh? >> They also added Adam Cowboy. Why? Why do they say that? Why? >> It's cuz it's football season. Yeah. Yeah. Football. >> Yeah. Football season starts this week. Okay. >> So, here's the deal. Um, when you're building strength with certain exercises, let's say I only do five exercises and I get really strong at them. Here's what happens. >> I get really strong in those movements. my body starts to recognize a discrepancy between the strength I have for that movement and the strength I have outside of that movement. And so what it starts to do is it starts to tighten you up so that you move less outside of where you have that strength. So you start to feel tighter. Now the remedy to this with strength training is to do lots of different movements to move in all different planes and use a full range of motion. In which case you won't feel tighter. You'll have more stability. But let's say you only do squats, deadlifts, bench press, overhead press, rows, which are great muscle builders, but that's all you ever do. Yeah. You're going to feel tight going laterally. You're going to feel tight moving outside. You're going to feel tight rotating because your body is just really strong in this one uh particular way. >> Yeah. And it's beneficial, too, for producing more force. So, it's like, you know, you don't want to be all flexible uh you know, trying to approach these like heavy lifts. So, you know, it's it's really it's about yeah, like managing that uh based upon like range of motion and then getting more familiar with it. >> Do you think this can be sometimes too uh people that are overreaching in their training too? A lot >> that can cause tightness. >> Yeah, cuz sometimes sometimes uh I this can be me and this is always like my sign that like I'm I'm overreaching. It's like I'm I'm pushing so hard the intensity in my training that I'm like constantly feeling sore and tight >> uh versus the appropriate amount of intensity. I normally feel really good. I normally leave the workout feeling really good. I feel like I lifted the day before, but I don't feel restricted and ah every time I move like oh wow really sore there. Like that's all signs of overreaching for me. >> Um so possibly pure that. Now if you're following like a map 15 protocol and not training to failure, you're that's probably not your situation. But sometimes that could be the possibility. >> Yeah. There's also this like you know your what determines your tightness. It's not the muscle, it's the central nervous system that controls >> the muscle. And so if your central nervous system is uh maintaining a certain amount of let's say tightness with a small muscle, when that muscle's larger, it can feel tighter because you're working with a larger muscle with the same kind of central nervous system signal. So, it's important when you build muscle and strength to train in a well-rounded way because it's not without its own uh risks. Like move in different planes of motion, move with the full range of motion, involve uh mobility and static stretching. And what'll find what you'll find is this isn't going to be a problem. Uh there's bodybuilders, there have been pro bodybuilders who've maintained uh good balance in their flexibility. Like Flex Wheeler would do the splits on stage, you know, Tom Plattz was famous for his flexibility. And that's because they kept it up while they did their strength training. And both of them were very >> maintain it. Yeah. While you're building strength. >> That's right. >> Next question is from Sepier 2524. >> How do you feel about not following a specific program, but rather letting your body kind of guide you on what to do in the gym? I find I'm more consistent and enjoy the workout mo much more when it's not a structured checklist. I focus on getting strong at compound lifts and I track and progressively overload. I just have a hard time staying on a program. Winging it makes my workout feel more like play. Hence the consistency. >> I love this so long as you're not also going but I wish I could see this and I'm not seeing the change I want. Like so that the follow-up statement to this is what matters to me because this is actually the place I want all my clients to get. This is where I I operate from this place. I don't go into a workout with structure because but I also am not trying to make crazy change right now. I don't I'm not like I'm not going >> No specific goal. >> Yeah. I don't have like a specific goal that I'm trying to achieve. So I'm enjoying my workouts. I do them for the sake of it makes me a better father. It makes me a better husband. It makes me feel strong. I have good energy. I sleep better. I move more throughout my day. Those are the desired outcomes. And treating my workouts like play will do that. But if I'm like, I'm trying to lose 3% body fat or I'm trying to get my my squat up to this, I'm programming because then it makes it that makes it a different >> for this person. I'd say you're fine because they're saying it keeps me consistent. I'm having fun. Consistency trumps so long as the crazy the workout isn't horrible >> kind of trumps everything. Uh but here's the deal. Like the PE there are people who can wing it and also have excellent workouts, but these are people who know how to work out. They've been doing it for a long time. >> They have the experience. They have lots of experience. Like Adam goes into a gym winging it, but he's also got, you know, 30 years of experience training his body, training other people. >> You know, somebody who's been working out consistently for 6 months suddenly says they want to wing it. I'm going to say no. >> That's you have nowhere there's there's you have no base to wing it from. >> No. So long as be able to structure it appropriately. >> I guess so long as you're happy where your results are, though. >> Yeah. >> Right. I mean, cuz I I've even >> You know what happens when people no experience wing it? They either hurt themselves, overdo it, or >> they usually do the same thing to me >> or the same thing over and over again. >> Right. Right. Which again, my point, if you're happy where you're at and you're not trying to make make change, but >> if you're happy where you're at, clap your hand. My bad. >> If if you're not trying to make change, you're happy where This is like how I I would tell people that we're doing things like Orange Theory. >> Yeah. Like, hey, if you love coming here, the community is fun, you enjoy the workout, and you're consistent, and you're not trying to make change, >> keep doing your Orange Theory, >> keep doing your fun workouts. It's I'm I'm a [ __ ] But if you come to me and you go, Adam, I can't get this last, you know, 5 lbs of body fat off or I man, I'm not getting any stronger or >> I can't build my butt. >> I can't build Yeah. If you have goals that you're trying to do and you're winging the programming, well, I mean, there you go. There's your problem. And let me add to that, Adam. I've had this happen, too, where someone's like, "Ah, I don't like structured workouts. I have so much more fun doing my thing, but I have these goals that I, you know, want to focus on." And I'll say, "Okay, well, give this a shot. Uh, follow the structured program." You know, you know what ends up happening most of the time? They come back and say, they say, "You know what? I like it better." >> Because they like the results. They result. Yes. I mean, you're Exactly. That's my point is that if if you there's there's you you want more from your workout, uh following a structured program is going to give you more. But if you don't care, like I know I know I'm sacrificing up a more aesthetic version of me or a stronger version. I don't give a [ __ ] I don't care right now. I'm not trying to do that. I'm just I'm trying to do the things I said I'm trying to do. And going with like winging it also to your point with 30 years experience, I can go like this is probably best for my body. may also be the complexity like or it's that they're having to draft it up themselves versus like a lot of times it's alleviating to have this all just like oh here and it's it's it's you know simple enough to where I can just go do this because it's right here I just look at it I do it now I'm taking my mind out of the equation um so there there's that part of it too which I like it's just like oh well you know and two why we reduce it down like a 15-minute protocol that's like the ultimate because it's like two exercises, you know, and it's so freeing. >> You're right. Do you Justin, do you work out this way? Do you kind of go in and you kind of have a rough idea? >> I have like Yeah. four or five compound lifts that I typically, if I'm not doing the 15 protocol, like if I do like a three-day schedule, that's usually what I do. >> Same here. I don't follow a program, but I have a general idea of where I'm going to what I'm going to do and then based on how I feel. But again, this is I've been doing this for a while, >> but it changes as I'm there. >> Yeah. know this completely like I right now I'm all how how I feel like right I know over the week I got to make sure I hit every body part once or twice it's I'm more of a 15 protocol so the two exercises are typically comp compound lifts yesterday was uh front squats and dips >> so those are my those are my two movements the way I decided it uh I had leg stuff to do I hadn't front squatted in a long time right I've been doing a lot of back squatting so I'm like time to switch it up and do front squats. So, I did front squats, hadn't done dips, uh chose the machine. If I had the the belt and the weight, I would have done weighted body weight discs, but I didn't have the belt and weight. So, I did heavy on the on the machines. Um and then I walked for 20 minutes. That was my that was my workout. And that's how I decid uh today. My legs are really sore. Uh so, if I go in, I probably won't do anything for it. If I do, I'll do something very light, maybe hamstring focused. I'll do some like leg curl stuff just to touch them or something like that. Um, and the last time I did any uh upper body stuff, I did chest and shoulders. >> So, maybe a back exercise. >> So, probably some back some back a pull-up or something will happen like that's and so I'll literally go off of how I feel and what I've done and that's kind of how what winging it looks like >> for me. But you're to your point, there's 30 years of experience of knowing how my body feels. >> What are the best bang for your buck exercises? What have I been doing consistently? So all that is, even though I'm saying I'm winging it to just to nail home your point, I also know what the hell I'm doing. >> I'm pulling from something. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Next question is from Burke himself. What would each of the four of you be doing if Mind Pump never happened? >> So we have to we should guess for each other. >> And if we do that, are we being funny or are we being serious? >> I don't know cuz I think I think sometimes it's both funny and serious, you at the same time. So >> yeah. >> Uh >> I feel like Justin would be a football coach. >> Yeah. Oh, >> isn't that but like isn't that like a can you just see him being >> he would either a continue down the path of of being a personal trainer and just becoming more exclusive with clients and stuff like that cuz at one point he was training some pretty uh important people in the area because he's excellent coach. But I could totally see him do some kind of coaching not far off. I could see Yeah. I I actually really enjoy I just it's such a full-time commit like I think that was the biggest reserve for me. Yeah. It was just like what am I doing? I don't have time, you know, like to to give and like you really it's a year round commit like it's not just like the season. So yeah. >> Yeah. You were also doing it while you're running this business though. I mean so it's like if that if you didn't have this >> if I didn't have this at all. Yeah. >> Maybe you would enjoy you'd enjoy the commitment. >> Sure. That's that's not a bad call. >> What about Doug? What do you think Doug would would would would be? I think you'd be in Arizona cuz your daughter's there. So you probably would have followed her out there. >> I think he would lead Iowa Hoska trips. Yeah, I'm big into that. >> Does he seem like he'd be a good Sedona Iaska like uh >> wearing a feather necklace? >> Yeah, dude. Giving up guides. You know what I'm saying? >> I could see him either teaching language or uh or something involved cooking. I could see you doing either one of those things. >> Yeah. >> Oh, the cooking thing is a good guess >> cuz I know he did insurance. He did uh life insurance which paid the bills. But I don't feel like are you you're not passion about sales are you? >> Not sales. No, I'm not. I'm very interested in marketing though. >> So before mind pump, >> you know, that was the thing that I presented to Sal is like, let's market maps anabolic. Let's create something and market it. >> And so I was very fascinated with marketing and how you could sell things online. So if it wasn't S, it would be somebody else. >> Yeah. Yeah, that's true. You were really into that for sure. That's definitely true. I don't know about you, Adam. Adam must say exotic car sales. >> That's a really good guess actually. >> That's a really good guess. You can see that >> because I have always I've always said that if like everything fell out uh I would do something in sales. Obviously selling things that are that you like >> like inherent. So >> Yeah. Cuz you need a big rip otherwise. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So yeah, exotic exotic cars, yachts, mansions. I would fall be a yacht salesman. >> Yeah, totally. For sure. Or or private jets. I would totally be into one of those. I could totally get down like that's hilarious. >> Yeah. So, I mean, I would love that. I would love >> How do you get leads to sell a private jet? >> You don't. That's referral. Yeah. A matter of fact, I heard I heard someone say something one time I that thought was really interesting that So, you've never seen uh a Rolls-Royce commercial or a Bugatti commercial, but you know where they where what you don't see is that if you go to like a private jet event or like that where they're the Bugatti will be there. >> Oh, cuz you know that the buyers for private jet. >> That's right. >> Well, that makes sense, >> right? And that's reason why the rest of us have never seen anything. So we're like, how does Rolls-Royce get these customer how do they get these customers? They don't even waste their time with us. You know what I'm saying? They're at those and that's that's their customer base right there. And so yeah. No, I would be super in that's a that's a pretty good guess right there, Doug. I think I could see myself. >> You feel like S might be like a Baptist preacher. >> That's a good guess. >> I don't know. >> I know. I know. I'm just throwing it out there. Either that or he start his own religion. No, >> no, I'm not start. >> Oh, dude. >> Oh, no. You get charismatic. You got 100% that is what you would do right now. >> If you were not in mind pump right now, you would be >> I'd be serving somehow. >> You would be a pastor ministry. >> I would not be I don't think I would. >> I don't think >> you had have to scratch that edge. >> Don't you have to go to school for that? >> No, you don't. No, you don't. Yeah, you do. >> No, you do not. >> You have to be to start your own church. I guess you don't. But I would not do that. I would I would I would go all of them. I know. Interesting. What do you mean? You don't have to do that for anything for any church. >> Divinity school. >> Then we'll hire you. >> Yes. >> I've asked. >> Yep. >> Not because I'm trying to be. I'm curious. >> I'm curious. I'm like, what does it say? >> Oh, so I mean >> I mean either that or like >> that's not like a law. That might be a standard that a certain church might have. So maybe the church you asked has that standard, but there is plenty of churches that would hire you to be especially with your background. >> Oh gosh. especially with how charismatic and and and and good of a speaker and how you how you have a photographic memory you could read some I mean you would be great at it >> so I totally think that I would have five years ago if you asked me this question I would >> five years ago that would have not been the answer >> I think I would have liked to have been a teacher professor yeah I like that uh but I mean it's hard to say without fitness what I would do because I love it so much I love every aspect of it working with people I love the science behind it I love how it helps So to think like what I would do outside of fitness is really really difficult. I mean this >> I don't think I don't think it's difficult. I think what we all hit on things that outside of here >> Doug you probably still loves reading books around marketing and researching the latest trends on that. You love the conversations you have with Eli and them on that that side. Justin's definitely on his side doing coaching stuff. I'm obviously researching exotic car markets and stuff like that. you I would argue you're probably reading, watching or consuming biblical content more than you are fitness content. >> Oh, for sure. >> So, I mean, I think it all aligns pretty well. Probably what >> I got to say though, the fitness stuff, it translates so well. Do you guys know that? >> Oh, it's such a parallel. >> It's so wild. Uh, how it >> Do you remember how Do you remember? >> Yes, I remember. >> Okay. Feel like I you I should get my flowers sometimes. >> I gave you flowers all the time. when he when you say when he say I used to tell you I was like bro wait until you start to dive in the word and you start going just be like everything you start connecting all these crazy yeah it's all in there it's crazy coconut you know it's so funny when I said that forever and I've said it to you many times and then I do post the the other day I do the the guys give me by the way you guys when we do Instagram content it's like we're we don't that's not us coming up our team it's like read this do this we're that right so they they're they give me like uh you know five or six books that They pick randomly out of the books that I've read and they're like, "Hey, I want you to rate these." >> Oh, cool. >> Yeah. And then like in the comments is like, you know, where's the Bible? You know, so it's like, well, I didn't get the Bible. >> That's number one. >> Yeah, I know. I go, first of all, it's like, yeah, great. Definitely. You know, that's a study because it was like it was the pass >> uh read or study. Oh, >> you know, and so I did that for like these like I don't know, five books that I've read or that I didn't pick that they just randomly give me. And then people were like, "What about this? What about that?" I'm like, "Well, >> you think I just run around flashing everybody?" Oh my god. Hey, that did so good. And it did so good. We had a ton of We actually had a ton. >> That's one of my favorite ones so far. >> We had a ton of t-shirt. First off, >> you know what's so good about that was I had no idea what that was. That's my f So my favorite part about the business today, okay, is that >> we divide Danny that our our media team like I said does all the stuff. None of us have any know what's going on. And we're all I don't see Justin doing his work. You I don't see you and vice versa. So when I see it on Instagram, when I see it's first time and obviously when I see stuff that's when I see S break down the science and something like it's like okay I've heard that a million times but yeah but when I see something that I haven't seen like Justin running around in a robe looking like he's naked I'm like what am I watching and I'm like what I have no idea what's coming oh that was >> people don't know he was doing it to everybody he's got clothes on underneath but when he did it to Doug he surprised them >> so that was a real reaction >> that Yeah, it was I was I'm still scarred. >> I shout out to our media team. Uh they do such a good job. I'm so proud of them and that that it makes it fun for me. >> You like got injured a little bit. We won't talk about that. >> What? >> That was one of my favorite ads. >> Fell into the closet. >> That was one of my favorite ads I've ever I've ever seen. >> It's hard to fake fault, dude. You know, like I'm glad other people are realizing. >> They did a good job. Everybody did good. >> All right. I know you like that episode. If you did, check this one out. One of the keys to fat loss is protein. It's true. If you're not eating a high protein diet, you're not going to burn as much body fat as you can. So, today's episode, we're going to talk about the smartest ways to use protein for fat burn and to build muscle. You got to watch this. I wish I understood this earlier in my career. I think it was probably almost 10 years in when I started to just focus on this with clients. >> I knew it was important, but I don't know how important. >> Yeah. I also did I knew what was important and but I also