BRICS Summit 2026 (Global Connections)

Welcome to Global Connections on Think Tech Hawaii. I'm your host Jay Fidel. This episode is entitled The 2026 Bricks Summit. Will there be a strategic showdown in New Delhi? Our co-host for the show is Dr. Rrookmani Kandakar, geopolitical analyst. Welcome to the show, Rupi. >> Hello, AJ. Thank you for having me on the show. Real pleasure. You know, in the way of introduction, the foreign policy objectives and directions of this brick summit are very relevant to us given the diplomatic interactions involved. We are witnessing rapid changes in global alliances and the isolationist foreign policy of the Trump administration. This brick summit is different, I think, and could well reset the contemporary geopolitical order. What do you think? What's different about this one coming up only in a few days from now? >> Jay, so this is very exciting because it's a dynamic uh international system that we are living in. So many changes so fast, unexpected diplomatic uh work used to take long to do but now this is the 20th year that the bricks is in existence. It's the 18th bricks summit uh and it's hosted by in New Delhi by prime minister Narendra Modi on behalf of India. So uh uh big thing because it's uh you know it brings together these countries as a coalition uh in the international system and uh it is uh it's got around 11 member countries J and 10 uh partner countries. So huge number of nations worldwide that are part of this. So you take the bricks basic as uh Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa and then you have a whole lot of uh nations which pitch in and Jen now why this summit is generating so much of the discussion and interest is because it's on the backdrop of the SEO which happened just a few weeks back the nomad games if you seen spectacular ceremony over there but uh uh the SEO security council uh organization. So Russia, India and China were the ones who garnered the most uh attention and you saw the Bellarus uh minister saying that these three countries are the most powerful countries today and when they come together they make it a force to reckon with. So that's the foundation that bricks is going to run on and the theme for this year is building for resilience, innovation, cooperation uh uh and sustainability. So the bricks synonym has been expanded for the theme and uh a whole lot of promise that comes in J because the three core pillars of bricks that happen that is the political cooperation political and economic cooperation the people-to-people exchanges that take place and the fundamental structure of the bricks to bring about peaceful uh settlement of conflict and you know uh bricks is always looked as a block which challenges the unilateral fun uh domination of the hegeimon in the system. They call they want uh they they put it under the multilateral um functioning of the international system that they aim for. So direct call uh against uh for a united front which would balance the westernled uh hegeimon system of the world. >> Okay. So why is the United States not involved? Is it because these guys are not inviting the United States into bricks or is it because Trump and the United States don't want to have any anything to do with bricks? Which one? >> Yes. So what used to happen? See uh the bricks came uh on the on the face of the 2008 financial crisis which saw that uh up to that point you had the G G8 G7 um nations which were considered to be economically top after the post world war nation u scenario you had the meetings of these people and India and China which are the most uh developing robust economies they have they have huge populations huge uh money but they were not part of this G uh 8 G uh 7 structure. Uh so they used to be invited as guests and they used to be made to be sit on the sideline when the main meeting took place these had the guests had to leave the core members would attend and uh Russia was at the mercy of domination of the western nations. So when Crimea happened they were removed G8 became G7. So now you have people on the sidelines who are the main characters in the economic system but not being able to make decisions for the financial system coming together then to form a block which would uh try to resolve financial um financial structure problems and conflict together as a unit. And so it started with brick South Africa was not involved and then South Africa came into 2013. So uh this happens when it's not including America or not. It was exclusion of India uh China and then eventually Russia which has led to this kind of formation. >> Well it's actually called bricks plus these days isn't it? It was the original BRICS. Um, now it's more and uh I guess they've invited they probably mean meaning Putin and she they've invited a number of other countries and so uh and here's just some of them. Egypt uh we we were hoping that Egypt would be more in the western block but it looks like it's in bricks. Ethiopia h that's interesting. Um Indonesia that's interesting Muslim country really. Uh, Iran. Oh, where have I heard that name before? Iran is in bricks. How about that? They're probably going to be there, too. Saudi Arabia, which has been, you know, um, in the wrong side of a fight with with the Yemenes right now today in the news. I'm not sure where Saudi Arabia fits, but they're going to be there. And the UAE, and they have all joined the original five. and and and then there's all kinds of issues that flow out of that. It gets so complicated because some of them are friendly with the US and some of them are not so friendly with the US. But I want to talk to you about Modi and India. India was one of the family members of Bricks when it was originally established a few years ago and he is the host of this of this party so to speak in New Delhi right now. Um and he has a country which is going somewhere. Um what is it 1.3 1.4 billion people and he is a smart guy. India had been very smart about staying in a balance with the east and the west. It really has been smart and and he's not only is he a founder and a host but he's a big player in this. So my question to you is how big a player is he? Is he the leader of bricks? What influence does he have on the other members of bricks in his very special role that he has in this meeting? >> Yeah, Jay, it's his charismatic personality that comes. He's one of the top leaders in the world, most number of uh awards all over, most popular leader and he's been democratically elected by 1.4 billion people three terms in a row. So, he is doing something good for the country. uh is closing to 15 uh years in on in power. So uh he has the backing solid backing based on his development plans and so that's what you see when he comes on the international stage also J he has a vision and his vision has been uh in this um brick summit he's calling it humanity first it's like a follow up on his Rio 25 summit when he called up for uh everybody to be included all inclusive growth and development so his contribution is his vision that he puts forth And technically speaking practically uh practical results in the country J he set India on a path of 7.8% growth even in the times of COVID in the times of economic instability. So he knows what he does. He walks the talk and uh that's what Modi is. He's a leader with vision and practical implementation. rare to find because you can find so many speeches and nothing done or nothing done and you know the leaders don't know how to coordinate efforts. Now India and China have always had these differences for the border. We have an undefined border left by Pand Javaru uh previous prime minister and that has caused friction in between our countries for a long long time now to manipulate and to uh be able to over overpass these hurdles of uh this internal disputes and form a coalition with China J that has been one of the big fores of Modi's diplomacy. today leaving Pakistan aside because China used to support Pakistan. We are putting Pakistan out of the equation because it's a fail country. So you have something known as the Rick R I Russia, India, China, Troa which is developing in uh the world. You have Russia uh biggest supplier of u energy in the world, China which is the biggest manufacturer and India which is the biggest market. These three are trying to have this system. they are you know the foundation of the brick system. So when these three decide that they can and should and uh you know coordinate amongst each other it forms a very viable basis for the bricks. Otherwise bricks would have just been talk J bricks would have never been this uh concept. It for so many years it was uh uh shown as just having u no practical implementation. It was just stock. So when you see the Rick in action you find that the viability of what the bricks talks about is very very uh uh much on the horizon and they've also spoken of these development banks they they've always kept the foundation of bricks as economic so they criticized the uh monetary system of led by the United Nations of the IMF and the World Bank which used to have development financing to nations and you know those development financing saying uh non-payment led to uh interference in your entire internal system. So countries would go on the brink of uh extinction like 2001 Argentinian monetary crisis. So these were the uh parts that uh countries which took loan on went and the de the proposal of a new development bank which would help development financing was set up by the bricks. So they wanted inter intrabrick trade uh which would help these countries to use resources amongst themselves and the main part is to use the local currency instead of being dependent on the dollar led uh this. So all these things were concepts which were helping uh now the reason why they wanted to uh get uh you know bypass the dollar system was because Russia had to face sanctions in the swift system. This brick system allowed them to trade in local currencies. Uh not be dependent on the dollar fluctuations and also not be under wetland um led domination of you know imposing restrictions, sanctions uh currency uh uh what do you say uh checks on your uh on your nation. So this is a this is a zone that they are promising where you have your own um you can you can progress on your own uh your own prowess. So it's very rare J and very promising it looks that's the thing that comes >> isn't it already realizing their promise I mean for example um you know you know this is like a world of acronyms if we had a show sometime where we just listed all the acronyms of all these you know multinational groups and crisscross all over the globe it would last a long time just to make a list of them I suggest to you that a there's going to be consolidation. There's going to be larger and larger blocks if that's not already happening. And B, you know, each one of these large blocks is going to have greater control greater control in many ways, not just economics or in, you know, financial arrangements or trade. So anyway, uh let's look at Modi for a minute. what does he hope to achieve in putting his weight behind this meeting in organizing the meeting bringing the people together? Um what let's say you're there and he's going to make a speech to open it. What is he going to say? He he is going to uh really put u this brick summit on the center stage mainly because you see uh his friends uh Putin and Z are now expected to they already the convoys are already landing in India and when he speaks he's going to put this concept of humanity first economics as the base uh you know the Marxian theory of economic is the base superructure of foundation for everything. So that's the main uh thing that bricks talks about everything politics society uh everything depends on economics. So when Modi presents this concept of economics first uh and uh he talks uh of uh bricks being that space you know it's progressed from nation to nation this is the fourth time India has got presidency of the um bricks uh it's hosting the bricks and Modi has been a veteran in this because 12 years he's 13 years he's attended this he knows the trajectory that he can place bricks on he is one of the main people who has got uh uh the uh the African uh cooper African nations into it the bricks plus uh concept that has come in it is largely because of the outreach that bricks wants to come in it doesn't just want to be limited to five people maybe three people would be decision makers but you need the will of the majority to have a democratization look in the international system and that's what bricks aims for when it gathers all these members has Indonesia is the head of the AER and uh uh the you know the personality that Modi has got he's been able to garner friendly relationship with all the nations the leaders have a one-on-one relation with him he's visited countries uh in the world which the Indian premers would never visit for 40 years 50 years 60 years that's been the kind of outreach that Modi has done and it it culminates when he hosts these events. So he makes G20 a success. He makes the bricks uh talking point uh in the international system because the kind of uh diplomacy that he outreach that he's achieved, people want to uh believe what he says. people see what he has done and he uh gives uh uh the Indian uh uh method of saying that you know you you are welcome to come in and uh uh uh what do you say you uh experience the hospitality of India uh at its peak J so when you have a conducive atmosphere your decisions are better you have a joint there are so many so many uh summits that we see which do not even have a joint statement so when you have such a conducive partnership uh you know floral kind of atmosphere. The joint statements are better, your bilaterals are better, there are more decisions made. So that's what Modi brings to this uh summit his personality. >> Okay. Is he going to say u you know we we need peace in this world. We have too much war going on in this world. Too much conflict and bricks can be, you know, an organization that can advocate for peace. Is it going to say now now boys, uh, let's not have Iran bombing Saudi Arabia? Let's not have Russia attacking Ukraine. uh let's let's not uh you know and and let's try to communicate to the US to Trump that it ought to be more peaceful instead of creating wars all over the planet. Um you know if you counted up all the wars that are going on little ones, big ones, intermediate ones, there's a lot of wars and there's a lot of incipient wars that are likely to happen given the very volatile nature of the geopolitics these days. Is he going to try to help advocate for peace? >> So Jay on the sidelines of the SEC when Russia and India had a bilateral Russ India Modi told Putin on uh his face that he needs to end the war and the war would not help humanity in any way. So he's been able to convey that and he keeps on even in the uh G20 summit he has spoken of condemning the wars. But now the international summit is international system is such a that the entire world and its agendas have put war on a sideline. It's something going on in the background which people have learned to bypass and carry on with the other functioning. So that's been such a concern because wars lead to loss of lives. Wars need stoppage. And what has happened today is that nations are able to uh maintain bilaterals, multilaterals. Iran is able to participate in bricks today uh the SEO uh last week without having to worry about the big war that is happening. So it's a concerning fact for us that nations are able to do this. War has become a uh great to diplomatic effort not a matter of concern or matter of immediate action and uh J the this brick summit also would uh do the same that they would condemn war. They would give one line on war that uh it needs to be stopped but how do you stop it? Where do you stop it? Who should stop it? And which war should be stopped is the question. So we have multiple wars on multiple fronts. multiple issues. Earlier if there was a war on say oil and gas, we could we could solve it. But today we don't know whether it's security, whether whether it's about finance, whether it's about borders, whether it's about your own um expansionist theories. It's a multiple uh facade of issues in the international system. And also we have something known as the Trump factor which uh his volatility in the international system causes nations to panic and uh when you don't know how much tariff you're going to get when you're going to get why you're going to get. So they they're kind of running into the bricks as a zone of uh relative peace relative relative stability. Now today we have to talk of subject relative. So, is he going to talk about um nuclear weapons? Is he going to talk to Iran and say, you know, you really shouldn't do that? Is he going to talk to Russia and say, "You stop stop rattling chains and threatening nuclear war?" Um, is he going to talk to China and ask them to, you know, not spend so much time and money developing their naval and, you know, army forces? um or is he going to just let that happen and hope that over a good meal where everybody's very friendly they'll come collective collectively to that decision. What what kind of discussion will the BRICS meeting have over these very threatening uh you know considerations? >> J it's going to be a brick summit which is going to uh consolidate unity amongst the brick nations. That is for sure because uh they need to have uh um bricks is reviewed as antagonistic to the US but what they have done is trying to show that they have unity amongst themselves to res solve problems. They are going to focus on new uh themes of AI inclusion, AI infrastructure, fintech uh they're going to focus on uh condemning terrorism in it all its forms. the the issue of terror funding which comes in because India as you know is a country faced with terrorism issue from Pakistan for uh since it's Pakistan existed. So uh to to get a statement on condemnation of terrorism is what India would aim for. So you have national interests uh coming uh into it because you see like the uh 2013 summit which saw the inclusion of um South Africa into it. So they spoke about about uh investment in Africa for development. So each country which hosts it tried to tries to bring their national interest to the forefront. So for India terror funding is very important because India has stepped into the semiconductor industry. You have the AI, you have the uh infrastructure of electric infrastructure to come into the forefront. You want development financing, you want um an outreach intra intra uh bridge trade which should uh increase because the kind of export import that is taking place between Russia, India and even China now is on such a phenomenal uh level J that they need to take it forward from here. They cannot let it fall. So what's the followup group? In other words, they make these high-minded you know uh statements and come to agreement on the very important moral choices around the world. Try to preserve humanity, preserve peace, stability, what have you, the planet, climate change, all that. Who's going to follow up? Is somebody going to get on the phone like Modi and talk to some other country in in the BRICS organization and say, you know, you should you should listen to what we resolved at this meeting in September 2026, you should follow through on that. Uh we if we do this meeting what every year or how often they do it, you've got to remember what we decided and go along with that in between the meetings. Who's going to follow up? to the next brick summit because it's around 350 meetings that the bricks has uh taken place. It's got a permanent infrastructure. Uh it's not just um verbal uh arrangement like the asim. Um so uh you have something of a very concrete infrastructure. You have financial uh finance ministers which would meet. You have foreign ministers which would meet and then eventually the next summit which would have the heads of state meeting again. So they kind of build on these um um themes broad themes that they have and it goes in a trajectory and you know you have uh something like uh concrete decisions taking place which would uh lay the foundation for this. So the new development bank which they bought it was one of the things then they have the bricks currency which is talked about but that is not going to be implemented in this um summit. they instead of bricks currency they're focusing more on intrabricks trade chain that uh uh uh to uh to bring about cooperation in uh terms of uh infrastructure development that causes you know that brings these emerging economies that's very conducive for emerging economies to come inside uh if you have uh development financing that takes place you want them to be part of this network that comes in and uh you have the road the BRI the belt and road initiative of China India having with the on the other side with Europe and Saudi Arabia. So all these things J these are developments which are taking in the international system and these countries are the core of brick. So their decisions their followup uh are taken up by the countries themselves who who there's a long list of over 30 participants waiting to be even partner states. Today we have five core members totaling up to 11 member states and 11 partner states and a long list of 30 nations who want to come in. Well, already bricks has members that um represent something way over half of the GDP of the world. Uh I don't know the exact number of it. It might be close to 90%. It's it's very substantial percentage of the world. And if they really came to a conclusion that was binding on all their members, including new members that they are willing to admit, that has a tremendous effect on world economics, on global trade and so forth. And if they made a statement, you know, um suggesting this that or the other thing, it would have enormous power simply because of the dollars and cents of their global trade and relative positions in the world. Uh but the US doesn't have that anymore. Um we have under Trump we have broken most of our alliances if not all. Um and we don't have that kind of group. So it's interesting how bricks falls into a um a great position of advantage. Now, we thought it was limited to China or possibly other countries, but when you take all the BRICS countries together, wo, you know, that is way more powerful uh in going forward than than Trump could be. No matter what he says about how powerful the US is, bricks could be more powerful. So, I'm you know, I'm waiting for a time uh when they get together. And and at the same time, I'd like your comment on this. NATO thanks to Trump is has lost its mojo. Uh the UN has lost its mojo. Uh a lot of organiza a lot of these acronym organizations have and organization of American states lost its mojo. So organizations that the US founded or was active in um or you know was central in the development of the organization they're going away and BRICS is coming together. So I find that very interesting. So tell me on the larger geopolitical level what is happening here and what is likely to happen in the future even though right now they're just an economics trade organization. um they don't really have a a structure like maybe the United Nations had when it was first established but they will they'll have more they'll have more members and they'll have more power don't you think and they will be a force to be reckoned with Jay the bricks since its inception has always supported the multilateral administration of the system by the UN so they've always asked for a democratically organized uh administration of the UN where you would have will say of the nations and you had these G7 G 8 meetings which were not representative of the real economies of the world they should have changed it according to the real uh G8 you don't have India China in the top eight or top 10 where are you what are you going to discuss about in the financial system so this was one of the shortcomings which had led to the coming of the bricks and it stayed on and even today when we find that when decisions are made in uh the multilateral systems established by the uh the conqueror the the victors of the world war II uh to reform them. We've spoken of the reform of the United Nations for a long long time but the entire system needs to be reformed to be representative of who can be the decision makers. Maybe in this decade these five are the decision makers next decade there can be other members. So any uh decision-m body of the of the world has to be represented. And uh today we see Trump's policies are showcasing more of a unilateral uh internally collapsing uh American system, a closed conservative uh economic system. The entire concept of bricks was developed by the foreign minister to uh after the Soviet Union collapse. They wanted Russia to come back into uh the international system and that could happen only when you had the support of countries which were other than the western countries which had caused the Soviet collapse. So they looked towards China and India initially and then they went on to these emerging economies. So it was a trajectory that they followed for growth which started coming from these three core countries to include the emerging economies and like you rightly said it's dominating the uh international market intern share of finances in the market. So today they are most capable of um making decisions on finance of the uh international system based on their uh unity and uh Jay tell me one thing how can Canada and Italy make decisions alone for the entire world. You have to have a grounding um support or foundation which bricks has managed to put up and they were always always criticized as just being vocal never in um never in uh action. It was not up to the sixth or eighth summit of the bricks that you had the uh new development bank established in China. So that gave kind of uh headquartered in China. So you had something that they could do some action and that's what they fear that the bricks currency should not replace the dollar uh dominate because with the entry of UAE inside uh the uh Saudi Arabia has still never confirmed that they're part of the bricks or not but uh the oil producers the markets the suppliers the manufacturers all being under one roof easier for them to make decisions there >> you know I'm wondering if they came to a consensus about for example opening the straight of Hormuz and saying to Iran will you you know will you cut it out whether that would have any effect if they said uh to China uh why don't you not make any more threats about Taiwan leave alone um if they came to some kind of consensus agreement wouldn't that be a positive thing what kind of response would they get I mean a lot of this is rhetorical I know but if they made a big speech after it including Nendra Modi or anyone else representing the you know the progress of the organization of the BRICS organization. Uh would that have any effect on the world or is this just a nice social experience? >> BRICS is smart J they have left all these big topics of war and everything to the UN. They say we we believe in the UN as the sole intergovernmental organization. We are talking of finance. We talk of economics, we talk of intra bricks trade, we talk of sustainable uh development for all humanity. This is the kind of uh narrowed down perception that they speak about. They condemn terrorism. They don't want terrorism because member nations have faced the issue. But they do not want to talk of specific wars, specific interests because they do serve the national interest of some of the countries who are members of the bricks. So it's very conveniently put and it's a very smart uh organization because it's not bulkier like the UN. It is more flexible J. So uh to to admit members not admit members the only criteria to get into the UN is that you have to have a sovereign state with borders and you get government and you get into the UN. Here it is on the uh basis of inclusion by its founding members. So they know who to take who not to take. So smart flexibility and also uh a thinking organization and they have made adaptability they have forage. So they need to in spite of so many differences between China and India or you know uh they have been able to overcome that they have been able to understand the need of the hour is to focus on our cooperation uh to focus on how we can take bricks ahead of or how we can protect the nations from uh the setbacks that the tariff system brings in or how uh there's nothing military involved no military allian alliances involved. It's not like the NATO. It's not like if you something happens to you, we'll come for you. If something happens, uh the countries would collaborate and uh enter into a war with anybody. They have kept the controversial subjects out of the agenda. The agenda is very very uh um on the top just the cream of the uh this day and they've kept just the economics as the base. So if the there was a consensus about China's supply of drones and drone elements uh to Russia for fighting Ukraine, um that that wouldn't that wouldn't go anywhere in bricks. You know what I get on this is that it's it's nice for trade, nice for money. Um that it is it's a counterweight to the United States or what the United States should have been, would have been, could have been, historically could have been. Um and uh it's a counterweight to the hegemony of the United States and and Western Europe such as it is uh and and the predominance of the dollar and all that. It may not establish its own currency, but it's it's certainly trying to undermine the dollar as the hegemonic currency. That's for sure. So is this sustainable or is this just going to evolve into something we don't want to hear about? >> J brickson is is in its 20th year of existence and that's why sustainability now uh is possible. Uh and the thing is that uh because these three countries are not still fully developed. They're on the path of development uh India and China uh fast development and they have a long way to go. So uh it is sustainable in the near future at least and because they have just kept the five core countries. So uh another reason why the US cannot join in because US would be want to be part of the acronym but they're too big a country to be able to uh just be as a partner nation or a member nation. They want to be at the head of the table. So the US has to watch from side line of bricks because uh it's already been founded and the core member is Russia. So uh it's watching as uh you say it's like another another version of the act kind of a thing. Russia took its friends and made a small small little uh non-military u alignment and making good decisions in the world J and uh this uh dolonization factor that they the threat that they put up is generally uh concealed under the guise of intra bricks trade. Um you know you have this development financing that they are putting in through. So uh everything is taking place in local currencies without the dollar but the name of dd dollarization is not given. So it's a I like I told you it's a very smart organization flexible and also uh very very robust state because decisions are not taking that much of a time as it would have taken. You're seeing the UN being redundant in taking decisions. They don't want to have a consensus here. You don't need a consensus. Five five members agree in spite of all the internal uh differences and national interests. Five members agree and it becomes a decision. >> Yeah. So they have special power the five members they have like a security council arrangement where if they vote on something if they have an agreement over something that rules what BRICS does. >> They don't have this kind of a structure of a permanent veto or veto structure anything but they want to have a consensus. So that's one of the reasons why you don't have direct enemies of the members founding members being inculcated as member states. So you have Turkey waiting on the sidelines. You have Pakistan waiting on the uh sidelines, Azarbaijan uh waiting for. So these um nations which are rogue countries in the world, they are not taking place but Iran finds a place at the table. Uh so that's a kind of um accommodative side of the bricks that they see that all five members would agree to this uh nation coming in okay if one member has a big problem with that nation let's keep it on the sidelines so that's kind of an understanding that they are coming to and the troa of rick is one of the most important uh structure that makes decisions in the brick state >> you know that's true and it's so different the way things were in the days of the post post-war organization between the US and and the allies in Europe and so forth and Russia. Um so different but that's what's emerging isn't it? So okay so uh I asked you before if you could tell me about the reverse Kissinger uh strategy what what is that and why is that relevant to bricks? J. So, uh, just before the FCO, um, a convoy flew from America to meet Russia, uh, Vladimir Putin, and they they told him about how China was trying to take over, uh, dominate Russian interests and, uh, you know, take over um, buy out uh, land or, you know, buy out the allies. and China was trying to uh press on Russia to be able to dominate in the international system on its own. So it was kind of a a filling of the year of Vladimir Putin against China. But uh we we know that Vladimir Putin is a big strategist. He's got a mind of his own and he holds his ground in putting China as a friend because they know these two together. China. Put in know that China is that kind of a nation which follows the art of warfare that there you don't know what they're going to do next. China is uh Chinese warfare has always been don't let the enemy understand your next move and Putin knows that. So he doesn't trust China blindly and he has kept India as a counterbalance for China always. He counts India as a strategic friend over and above China. But China is also kept close. So that balancing act is mastered in the sense that J Russia and India can function on their own. China and Russia can function on their own and Russia plays the mediator between China and India. So the reverse kissing policy did not work uh for Russia because Russia at this point does not trust America as much as Trump trusts Putin. You know, I heard a very very good speech, a follow-up speech by Mark Carney. Um, he gave a a great speech at Davos a couple weeks ago and now today he gave another fantastic speech on behalf of Canada and uh it made your heart sing where he is trying to take Canada where he is succeeding in taking Canada. uh and one of the elements of their new policy is to have relationships all over the world including including Asia, including China, especially Europe though. Uh and he is trying to build a kind of trade alliance um with you know the members of that community right now. Um so I'd like to ask you a question about Mark Carney. Suppose he calls up the rent from Modi and he says, "Hey Modi, I want to join BRICS. I want Canada to be a member of BRICS." Would he do that? And what would Modi say? And what would BRICS say about, you know, bringing Canada in Canada, a traditional member of NATO, a traditional ally, although not so much anymore, of the United States, and a and a new, you know, trade partner with a newly enhanced trade partner uh with with Western Europe. Um, so what would they what would they say? What would Mark Carney say at all? And what would Modi say in response? And what would the original three or five members of bricks say on the introduction of Canada for financial and and trade benefit mutual multilateral trade and economic benefit? What would they say? >> So um Canada J would love to have themselves as the sea in the bricks. So there's a complex that they have a superiority complex that how can they can come in and play a subordinate role in the decision where where they're not the real decision maker they love to attend the G7 or G 10 summit where they are at the center table but here they would be partner countries or they would be the plus big plus uh nations and that's a that's a very bitter pill to swallow for these nations Because you see decision making bricks has played a very smart game in bringing in the concept of democratization majority will. So they're trying to get the majority say in the financial system to be able to make decisions for the financial system and we never had a a forum of uh this level J because just which would focus on finance of the international system and make decisions for uh say development financing. It was just the IMF and the World Bank. It was never another new development bank and uh loans or your money plays a very important role for all nation states. They want to come in for the money. So the IMF was able to dictate terms. Today the bricks bank uh would tell you that you uh would be part of the intra bricks trade or you would be able to settle in your local currency that is more conducive more beneficial for loan taking and also feels safer when you don't have to mortgage your country for a financial crisis state. So this is the way bricks has played its game. It has showed itself to be uh um a problem solver, financial problem solver. And Canada right now is not in the midst of uh uh political um decisions or political uh what do you say in the world because it's already having Trump at its doorstep. Uh it's not able to it's got immigrant based economy. They just invited the immigrants and they're not able to develop. You see, it was just promised as a when you have too much of immigration taking place without the immigrants working for the development of a nation, it always falls. It always fails. The culture is destroyed. your economy doesn't develop in the same way that you would have natives also working or immigrants which would assimilate themselves into the so Canada is on a different uh path of development because today they are faced with a uh not a very stable uh economy as it would have if they had more um uh focused developments. It lost out on leadership decisions very badly. What about I make you the Secretary of State of the United States in a better time, a time without Trump and I say to you, hm, we have to deal with bricks. Um because bricks is bricks is emerging. Uh and what they say today may not be what they say tomorrow and bricks may be a real force to deal with going forward. What kind of policy would you recommend to the president um to deal with bricks and whatever bricks represents in terms of these bricks members? J as a mana uh to bricks. It is something not uh not to be portrayed as an antagonistic thing but to portray bricks as something which would keep or uh to take decisions based on how bricks is functioning or their themes that it takes a very long time for bricks to uh put their decisions into action and today America lacks that system of uh you know you have don't have a NATO backed uh uh alliance or you don't have that uh economic make G10 or G8 which would be robust partners who would make decisions in the world and say let's cut down the repo rate let's put the uh dollar this at this rate nothing of that sort you don't have partners which would supporting allies in finance is one thing which the US is missing big time because partners like the UK have not become that you know they become weak Canada, you had these countries which would be a backup for the U uh the for the US. These three four countries together would dominate uh world economic decisions. But today the US alone is facing the exact exact pretext on which bricks was uh formed. Bricks was formed to um oppose the unilateral uh functioning of the international system. They wanted a multilateral democratically based uh functioning. So exactly that uh US is lacking its partner uh partner um nations which would really blindly back the US today when we are facing the war in Iran J when Trump asked for a warship from the UK UK said we don't have one that's not the way you work with an ally when the ally says I need help that is the time when you have to blindly come in that is known as a strategic partner that is known as a having your back in international relations and uh Russia has always done that for India the having your back thing. So when you when Trump uh saw that NATO did not help, they refused to let his planes land in Spain, Jay, when you're fighting, all questions aside, when you're fighting uh the the pro uh the protagonist of the axis of evil, you need all hands on deck. You need somebody to uh have your back. You need support. however um whatever Trump is, but he's fighting an enemy which would be potential uh potentially grave for the international system. So, you need to support him. And all his allies, the UK, the the the NATO countries, they did not help him in the way that they should have ideally helped. When he said he needed help, if all had come in, the Iran war would have stopped a very long time back. the backdoor policies, the Macron being able to talk to Iran, trying to put his national interests way above the international interests of backing. >> He wasn't going to accept their advice anyway. He was going to do it alone and uh and he alienated them as he has in the past. So there's, you know, just sitting on the sidelines, there was no way u, you know, just as a matter of what we call national policy where they were going to step step up to a guy who's been insulting them and um, you know, uh, challenging their sovereignty. But let me let me go to the last thing. The last thing is this and it's back to Modi. We know he's he's good at balancing things. India is good at balancing things. had been that way for a long time for decades and he balances uh you know the interests of India with the Quad partnership uh with Washington um the relationship of Beijing, the relationship with Moscow and the Middle East conflict and all that. Um so can India be an honest broker at this summit? Can it take things a step further? Does hosting bricks at this moment in time force Modi and um force other members of the BRICS organization to pick a side in the emerging global realignment or will it not happen now? >> It would not happen now. Jay, you're right about that because um Modi would never want bricks to be a controversial uh issue. He I told you he he put it as development for all humanity enco encompassing all uh all nations prosperity um bringing in uh cooperation and uh the main main theme would always be condemning terrorism in all its forms. It's not condemning war, it stop the war but condemn terrorism in all its forms. uh and uh he his focus would always be on the new innovations in the international system J which can affect finance in such a big way. Uh like I told you the AI uh industry which is going to be big. So they are focusing on these fringe uh to make it a success you need to also have these elements which make the entire palette look very uh tempting and that's what he's done for these bricks. the on paper the theme the uh the the points to be discussed are extremely important and when you see that what on the SEO if you see the visuals they have all three have met together they have shown themselves uh to be hugging each other holding each other's hands the three the two went for dinner the two had bilaterals all these uh things happened because they set the foundation for this brick system they showed they're showcasing the unity that between the rick that that is the main foundation for how uh bricks would function in the future. The troa right now in today's international system have no rivalry. uh America has to face these three head on to be able to make have a say in the international system or to collaborate with these three when these three function together it's a big thing but uh to have India China fighting would be a dent in the brick system but the fear of international tariffs has brought India and China closer together they are not and Pakistan being um with uh the US has removed that uh point of contention between India and China that would be who would support Pakistan now they're supported by the US so China is much more willing to be closed with India and so you know the the US has when faces this uh bricks um organization it needs it has to deal with it in a different way that it would with the UN because UN they are the biggest uh budget um uh contributors in the bricks there is nothing like that they have just one reserve contingency fund 100 million uh 100 billion dollars that they have put in and that's enough for those countries so how does the US deal with the bricks is what Trump uh puts in and Trump has taken a very u narrow-minded approach to bricks he just fumes and he's just watching them as anti- dollar and he keeps it closed. There's no no mention of a partnership or no mention of how he would be able to uh whatever the aims how US would be able to resolve it in the international system or how US could present itself as a solver of international like it always has it has been the hgeimon of the international system. So how it would present itself as a more concrete uh more decisive uh um decision maker rather than the bricks is what the US should focus on rather than just being against the bricks. Let it function. >> Oh, I totally agree and you know I'm sure that Trump is angry at every member of Brits for opposing his policies and opposing him. But wouldn't it be great if Narendra Modi as the ostensible leader of bricks for now in New Delhi in this summit uh would actually take a position and try to get everybody together and um you know uh actually realize some of these very high-minded goals. Oh, that would be nice. Anyway, we'll have to leave it there. Uh Bruty Kandakar, thank you very much to our host co-host Brute Kandakar. I'm Jay Fidel, host of Global Connections. The title of this episode has been the 2026 Brick Summit coming soon. We'll have to discuss it after it's over, don't you think? Thanks to our viewers for watching. We'll see you again soon for the next one. Aloha to everyone and aloha to you, Rupari. >> Aloh. Thank you so very much.