Are Third Party App Stores Too Hidden In The Play Store? - DTNS 5332

[music] This is the daily tech news for Friday, August 14th, 2026. We tell you what you need to know, give you the important context of all of it, and help each other understand. >> Today, a judge tells Google that those third party app stores are too difficult to install from the Google Play Store. >> Too difficult. Make them easier. >> Too hard. >> I'm I'm Jason Howell. [laughter] >> I'm Wow. Let's start with what you need to know with the big story. Yes. US District Judge James Donado has given Google one week to remove some of what he called barriers that are making rival Android app stores harder to both find and install inside of the Google Play Store. Google officially started showing uh thirdparty app stores inside of Google Play. Well, we saw the first one earlier this week. Um, through a dedicated landing page inside of the app, first app store to appear inside of the app, it's like inception, uh, was Apttoid Games. But [snorts] the way to get to those app store listings inside of the app store required either a direct link or a specific search query to locate them. And Judge Donado um, doesn't like the friction of the process. He shared that searches like um store for apps still didn't pull back those stores in search. In fact, Epic's lawyer Jonathan Evan ran that search and instead of getting third-party app stores ended up getting a result for Walmart. So, you know, the search the search was store for apps and then you get a Walmart result in return which is a little weird. Donado uh said that quote every possible variation that's even only 70% properly phrased end quote uh should return store results. That makes a lot of sense to me. And that they should be presented just like standard apps with an install button in results instead of a view button that still required someone to click through one more time to install them. Right? Google argued that the added step actually protects users. Uh but Donado said it was actually just kind of an example of anti-competitive friction. Donado's given uh Google until August 20th to make the appropriate changes. Google says it will address it. 20th, you know, it's basically 7 days away. So, it's kind of like one of those situations of like, all right, you told us to make sure that these third party app stores are in our app store. We did that. Um, but you know, did did you say how easy it had to be to find it? I mean, maybe maybe somewhere in the details it actually did spell this out, but kind of seems to me like like I don't know that I necessarily believe that Google was like, "We're going to make this really really hard to find, but they probably didn't go above and beyond to make it easy to find." >> That's where I'm at. I actually, this is not really fair, but I thought it was funny because I was thinking about when uh I'm visiting my sister and her kids and we're like, "Hey, we're going to go to the store." and that my niece doesn't want to go and eventually we convince her to go to the store but then she refuses to put her shoes on or something like that. Um, but that's that's not really fair. But I I agree with you. It's it's >> it's probably more like and and I've been at companies like this where we have something I think I remember a little bit GDPR days where I think there is levels of meeting a legal requirement or a legal ruling and it I mean to be fair like you probably just want to do what you you want to fall you want to not get in trouble. you want to do the thing, but there is a level of let's make this the best experience possible that may or may not be there. GDPR actually we really did try really hard, but I could see with this that they were like, well, it's there. Uh, and to be fair, I did try I remember for Android Faithful, I did try to install Apptoid and I did get confused. I did I did get confused for a minute because Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. No. >> Oh, no. I even just typing in Apptoid, you don't see the Apptoid store. At least when I did it Tuesday for the show, for our show, when you type in Apttoid, it does show a tiny little message box that says something about third party stores. Go to the store page, but then the actual Apptoid store doesn't show up in the results for literally. Uh, yeah, >> now it does now. Maybe that's a change. Like I just did a search just now for Apptoid and it has this big kind of like bolded call out up at the top where it says looking for Apptoid games. If you're looking for app stores, you need to go to the third party app store page, >> read more, >> go to a little it is a little more clear, but it it it's still confusing because I'm like, well, why you know why can't I just go to this page? >> Because if you look at your results, you have Abtoid wallet, which I assume is associated dice roll SDK. You're showing me other Aptoid things. Why isn't the Apptoid Store in there, too? >> Yeah. Well, and this is another part of what what um Judge Donado was talking about. So, go to page. First of all, there's a separate page for the third party app store. Go to page. Then, it takes you here. Right now, there's only one thing listed there. I'm kind of surprised that other app stores haven't gotten in on this, but winning on the the Notability front because they're the one that's there. But what you see here is a view button. And oh man, what another part of what Donado is saying is this is a point of friction. In order for me to install it, I now have to tap into view and install. And and I'm sure you know as a developer, you know, probably better than I do that every single point of like confirmation and click to get to the next step is another point of attrition. Somebody's gonna drop off and you know, and actually now that I think about it, I'm I'm doing this in real time. So folks, if you get the video version, then you're seeing more. But like do we have on these listings, like what I'm looking for is an install button like right away. And I guess I'm not seeing that, you know? >> No. And even if in the regular search results, if you click on each, like if you do the regular search and you get the regular results, you go right to the details page, it's like one, two clicks to install. This is one, hold on. Search one, two, three. like and like and and I know that doesn't seem like a lot but maybe it does and I've definitely been at places where we say refactored identity or login you know people do not put up with you know a lot of the way that software companies have to do login where we're trying to integrate Apple and Google and our own thing and I've definitely been in places where we're trying to settle all that you end up with five steps for a user they get real mad real fast. >> Oh yeah, totally. >> Um especially for something that >> normally doesn't have as much friction. So I I definitely agree. I you could really I I think you could argue that Google has a point in that because these are other stores, having it having it be not called out and just being a regular app next to other apps might be confusing. And it is it is a little interesting because you open up this this app and it's like oh my god it's like a whole other store. There's not like a hello, welcome to this. There's not like a greeter at the store, right? To let you know, hey, you've arrived at a new store. It just is another app. So there is probably a valid point in that it's a little bit different. It's a little confusing. Sure, maybe you could argue protection for users because they're going to go go into a place where specifically you could be spending money. But I do agree that this is way too much friction. I think the like the the most a student uh yes, I follow all the rules way of doing this would have been to have something on the homepage or just somewhere a little more clear because yeah, it either intentionally or just through just going by the letter of the law, it is a very frictionful. So >> now I'm going to play devil's advocate. >> Okay. >> Because you open up the Play Store, you've got your apps, you've got your games, you know? Sure, they have like a suggested for you section. They've got top charts and everything, >> but but like so what are we what are we saying here that they should have like an extra thing here that says third party app stores or something? You know what I mean? Like that's one thing. And then the other thing that Donado is talking about is the install button right from the listing, which if I go to the thirdparty app store, it shows this. It says view. This is what he's talking about. Like I should just be able to tap that and install it. >> But as we've been talking, I've been kind of going through the interface and looking for any other example of that. >> And all of these things require you to go into the app store page or sorry, the app page in order to install it. So this would be like the only the only way in which that goes counter to what we what has been done forever on the Play Store. >> But but anyways, so that that's the devil's advocate side. I mean, >> do I think and and at the at the end of the day also like do we really think this is going to really change things a whole lot for Google and Play Store? like just because these app stores are in there like I realize Google's you know was dragged kicking his streaming to have to do this as Apple has been too >> but at the end of the day I think most people just they probably aren't going to install these anyways you know it probably doesn't matter a whole lot >> I think that's fair so um one thing that he might be referring to is like if you go to like the play pass homepage where they have like recommended like games of the week there is a direct install button on those but that is a different case from what you are talking about absolutely is that there is So I I agree with you though that might be that might be a manding though because I agree with you. Normally you just go and maybe that's what I was that's more what I was referring to is that you still have to go to the app store page which is fine. That's that's that's like that's that that's the path that people are used to. >> I and honestly I do think that this ruling is important. I do think it was good that they went through this rigor role. Do I actually think people are just going to be pouring into third party app stores? Probably not. >> Probably not. >> Probably not. I think that there there is going to be like segments of the population gamers I I mean I'm not and this is obviously Aptoid we've talked about this Apttoid is a game store I do think that there are populations that are interested in this and would go here like gamers for specific games or specific communities that makes sense the vast vast majority of play store people no >> um just not that's that's like I think as you said friction is a thing the most frictionless thing for people is just to unfortunately this is just how people and interacting with software works is they're going to go to the thing that's pre-installed and they're going to and but that but and then that's why also like we there are people that are attacking Google on the default search thing, right? So because this is a known behavior. I totally agree. I I I think this is a good step is this is going to re revolutionize things. I don't I doubt it. That's my opinion. >> Yeah, agreed. So, all right. Well, you know what? We really appreciate you for listening to us pontificate on the future of app stores and we just appreci appreciate you in general because you, the listener, make DTNS possible. So, we're going to take a little bit of time to thank Nicholas Gwyn, Paul Then, Ali Sanjabi, and AB Puppy. >> Thank you. >> All right. There's more we need to know today. Let's get to the briefs. >> All right. Well, on the other side of the fence in app store related news is Apple and there's and it has they have their own app store news. Apple has asked the federal court overseeing its fight its own fight with Epic Games. Again, Epic Games making all the trouble uh to let it charge US developers a commission when users follow an inapp link and complete a digital purchase on the developer site. Apple wants to charge US developers 15% for standard apps, 10% for certain partner programs and subscription renewals, and 5% for small business program apps. Apple's proposal goes to Judge Ivon Gonzalez Rogers, and the court will decide what fee, if any, Apple can charge for those external transactions. Apple also acknowledged that under the ninth court's definition of costs that are necessary to support web link ads, it would charge effectively effectively 0% for those purchases. That means those proposed commissions wouldn't be intended to recover costs, but to potentially pay for the broader value of its app store tools, tech, and services. Epic Games says those proposed fees exceed what the appeals court allows and plans to file its opposition within 60 days. >> Yeah. So 0% linkout cost >> um compared to an earlier like >> like 15 >> 27% or something linkout fee. >> Oh the fee. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Pretty pretty excessive by comparison. Um >> something lower obviously better low enough I guess we'll find out. What are those tools? What are those? So when Apple says and by the way we got to charge for we got to charge because we offer these other thing. What is that like? Like like customer support through it's probably discovery through the through the app store. >> Um I'm not sure >> just being there is is uh is a bonus I guess for the apps because they're represented. >> Um I I don't know the app store anymore, but going off by what I know of like Google Play, there's probably things for like marketing where you can create campaigns and then see how those campaigns are doing. Um even things like just metrics. on like all kinds of metrics about how an app is doing, how much has been down in the last month, like how like kind of things like conversion and engagement. So, there's probably a lot of like tools that help you analyze and detect things and also probably uh help with with rollouts like like even just the process of like how do I upload an app, how do I manage betas, how do I do all this and do that. So, there yeah, there's there's a bit of stuff there. So to be fair, all of that and I I presume like the Google Play Store app store, the App Store folks that people that actually build the App Store are probably always doing things to either improve or add new functionality to help out publishers and developers. So to be fair, >> that is not free. Um, and maintenance of that is not free. So I think that there is there is validity in in that. >> I don't know what that would cost. So, especially for a company at Apple scale, it's always like we have no I like it it's it's in general hard to to g I mean >> for me the average engineer it it seems hard to gauge but for Apple as big as it is it's hard to say whether their their commissions are right or wrong without actually being inside. >> Yeah, it's it's been six years since Epic Games sued Apple apparently that which just blows my mind. August 13, 2020. That's crazy. [laughter] >> Oh my gosh. I remember that. >> It's been six years. These things take so long. >> The these were like the first stories I remember uh helping to report on when I first started podcasting with you on our old old old show. And so it's like it feels like such a big part of [laughter] my podcasting life to check in with how Epic is doing. Yeah. I mean it's so I I'm not very good with some of these other than as a developer lower seems better. Um but yeah, this is it's interesting. I it's just interesting. Epic is continuing to be I don't know the right metaphor for this, but is continuing to be like the the the guard dog at least or presumably the guard dog for the rest be like, "Hey, you're not doing this right kind of like what you doing? What you doing?" >> Kind of crazy that that they came along and and changed such a a massive part of this thing that had existed for so long prior to them in a certain way. And you know, imprints everybody. We've all got smartphones. We we all deal with the stuff that touches into this. Epic Games is just um I don't know, they've they've forced through a lot of change in that particular part of the industry. >> All right. >> Interesting how that plays out. >> Yeah. Well, speaking of companies forcing a lot of change in the tech industry, OpenAI launched a new um a new effort, feature, software, whatever you want to call it, uh thing called, uh computer history, which when I read it, I want to say like computer history museum, which is a museum that look, you know, is near me here in the Bay Area, but it has nothing to do with that. Uh computer history for chat GPT desktop app on Mac OS to start. It's an optin feature that turns activity in approved apps and websites on your machine on your Mac OS machine into searchable timeline uh moments and local memories that can be used as context inside of chatbt and inside of codeex. Um it does replace an earlier feature called chronicle which was a research preview product. That one relied on screenshots to do this kind of work. Computer history actually taps into Mac OS accessibility features to track clicks, typing, keyboard shortcuts, app switching, other types of context that Mac OS basically exposes to it. Um, OpenAI says it does not capture screenshots, screen recordings, microphone input, system audio, or private browsing activity. Um, the interaction files that are used to kind of build up how it does its thing stay on the Mac for up to 48 hours before being deleted after they've been processed server side. And they produce these plain text memory files, I'm assuming, uh, markdown files, um, that are stored locally until manually deleted. So, it's kind of like it captures the context, puts what it detects into a markdown file. Again, I'm assuming it's markdown. um and you know sorts that somehow and then that becomes ongoing context for how chat GPT and codecs work um in your account. New features limited to pro business and enterprise users excludes the EA Switzerland and UK at launch. So are you going to be rushing out to use this feature? >> I don't know. I don't I don't I [laughter] don't I don't I'm not >> make you a little nervous. it >> in a little [laughter] nervousness. >> Um I Okay, so as a >> devel >> as a developer, I have definitely been asked on an an app that I've worked on to send we we we >> individual apps will already check or or basically track things like what you clicked on like how many times you clicked on it and like like try to different things to kind of understand engagement. So I guess I am party to some level of engagement tracking just doing my job. I don't I guess I'm I Okay, let me ask a question. I'll try to do this in like good faith. What What do we think tracking clicks, typing, keyboards, and app switching would do to help chat GPT and codeex? What What do we suspect that that that context would give? Well, I think I here's here's how I place it into my AI using world, which I don't really rely on chat GPT nearly as much as I do Claude, which I've mentioned a million times, but I do have the Claude app. I have it on my Mac Studio. I have it on my MacBook Pro. I am constantly taking things that I'm doing on the machine >> and almost translating that for the AI, you know, and I it's hard for me to put my finger on exactly what I mean when I say that, but >> sometimes I have to like create a a text doc or a voice note that kind of illustrates the thing that I just did in order to bring it into the context world of Claude. >> And having this always running essentially means that's one less thing that I have to remember to do. it kind of already does it for me. Everything >> if if I'm working on three different projects at once in different windows or whatever, >> that would essentially mean that it's tracking what I'm doing in those three projects. Okay. >> And without me having to go out of my way to take the time to feed it all of that information. That's what I think it might do. And to that end, that sounds incredibly useful to me with a large caveat of like are there ways in which it scoops this stuff up that I don't want. You know what I mean? >> And that I think is the real trick um that I don't know the answer to, but I could totally see why this is useful for me personally. Yes, >> you're right. And and yeah, I I do similar I have cloud I have cloud on desktop and certainly I do find myself trying to be like a pipeline for certain things whe whether maybe that's a me problem. I haven't figured out how to do it correctly. Um, but also, yeah, I I end up being kind of like a middle processing unit for for for certain for certain tasks. And so, yeah. So, maybe app switching and typing or even does it say mouse movement? I guess it didn't say that, but I Okay, I can kind of see it there. I can kind of see why you would use accessibility features for that. And I guess nominally, the idea that, okay, they're saving interactions files for 48 hours. They will be deleted. and that the output of this are plain text methods that are stored locally until manually deleted. I suppose that all seems fine. >> I guess I guess I don't have any like upfront objections, but I guess right now I'm just in a state of like sensitivity and like for sure >> hyper awareness alone. >> Yeah. Like what are you going to do with this that I that even you maybe even that you open AI don't know that you can do yet? you know, and I I I think it's >> I'm a little once you open that door, what does that lead to? >> You know, there's certainly a lot of that going on. There's also risk for things like prompt injection attacks. Actually, OpenAI acknowledged as much >> saying that paying users should actively pause the feature if they're working on like private or sensitive >> things. Um, so yeah, it carries some risk and it carries some discomfort, I think, for you. You are absolutely not alone. I mean, I'm not rushing out to activate it. I can I can look at it and go, "Oh, that's interesting. I'd play around with that and probably I'm guessing if Anthropic brought it to its tool set, I would activate it and test it out for a while and see what it actually did." >> Um, but you know, I also feel kind of nervous like it it really is. I mean, what was the what was it? Microsoft recall not too long ago. >> Yes. >> Although long enough ago for me to forget the name, but I think it is recall. um kind of did something similar to this and people were yeah really nervous about it but um we've also >> become more more comfortable with sharing more into AI. I mean some people have some people clearly have not but um and so maybe our kind of own personal evolution with these tools makes it more doable. Um I don't know. >> Yeah, it's interesting though. >> Keep um just just remember you can turn it off and turn it on again. So that's good advice to keep that in mind because it is easy to get complacent. I definitely have always unc reviews of the Nothing CMF Clip Pro are starting to drop. And unsurprisingly, actually, it sounds like nothing has a winner on its hands. Again, considering the budget category in which they sit, the CMF Clip Pro are true wireless open earbuds that clip around the ear instead of resting inside the ear canal. The Verge says they are incredibly comfortable and offer excellent environmental awareness, which they are designed for. That design, however, does bring limits to sound quality with full spectrum listening a challenge because of the open ear design. That also means that noisy environments can overtake the sound coming through the buds. CMF added a rotating smart dial to the case, which gives wearers playback and volume controls. The Verge did note some unintended pocket interference with that [laughter] control mechanism, which which is great for volume. Uh the $99 CMF Clip Pro is actually on sale at the moment for $79 through the Nothing site. And dude, I'm not surpris >> I I know like our our dear co-host and friend Ron Richards loves nothing ear uh ear products um audio products. I am similar. So, I I'm not surprised that that this has been sounding like a winner. Um, >> well, it's it's it's a form factor that I've not tried before. The kind of like clip around the ear flap. >> Yeah, they look almost like I don't even know how to describe. They look like two little balls on a on a curved stem. >> So, they look funky. Um, >> they do, but when you're wearing them, um, was it the Verge the Verge author whose name escapes me right now? I apologize, but she had a photo of her wearing them and you know she has kind of like longer hair or whatever and because they don't sit down near your like >> you know down near the bottom or fit into your ear canal, they're kind of like on the side you kind of couldn't see them like the way that they were positioned and then you get all that environmental awareness. One way one place I will push back on, maybe not push back on but just note is this is not the first time that um CMF has done the dials on the case thing. Um, and their earlier version of in-ear earbuds, God, I can't remember what the version of this is, but um, I'm showing off on video. It has, you know, a a u kind of a notched control mechanism on the outside of the case, which is a great fidget. It's an excellent fidget. But I will admit through my own personal use because I've used these a ton. If this case is in your pocket and you're out and about and moving, you'll be walking around listening to something then you'll hear as the volume like turns down because your pocket is something, you know, some way that you're walking is moving this dial slightly. So, not not a perfect control mechanism. Also, kind of not necessary a lot of the times. like why am I doing this when you know it's it's pretty easy to turn it down like with my voice or whatever. But anyway, something to note on these things. But I would love to check them out. I would love to test out this form factor. I think it looks really compelling. >> Uh I cheated. I looked it up. Those are the CMF buds that you have, the nice orange ones. I have the same and I have the exact same all the same feedback. I think a lot of us and I I like this about nothing and CMF is CMF being part of nothing is that they like that little clicky tactile little uh little offcenter features. But agreed. I was so excited to use this and then I ended up blasting my ears off a couple times and or and as he said, I just kind of because usually I have my phone out especially cuz I I'm like walking through airports a lot. I usually have my phone out anyway. So I just kind of >> that's it. That's it. >> Didn't need the dial. >> But yeah, this uh these open ear clip things. I think I saw one of my favorite uh Japanese voice actors. He streams a lot. He actually got to review the Huawei like a Huawei version which I won't get here. Um but yeah, it's just a really interesting little um new form factor in earbuds that we all get to kind of look at. I'm I'm just I'm kind of jazzed. It's kind of cool. >> All right. Well, we can't provide you with clip-on earbuds, but we at our store, daily techchnneow.com/store, have a lot of wonderful gifts, for co-workers, colleagues. I personally love my DTNS pint glass. Uh real talk, actually Tom just gifted it to me, so I didn't actually buy it. But if you wanted to have the snazzy DTNS pint glass like I have, which has a DTS logo with a little like uh the the little I guess DTS logo uh rainbow rather around it, uh you can get that. You can also get mugs, t-shirts, mouse pads, all with that very very pretty uh DTS logo. Um they're great gifts and of course a great way to support the show. >> All right, we got a bunch of headlines to get through uh and we got to make you look smart. So we're going to get through them right now. >> Let's do it. Anthropics Frontier Red Team released its research with put which put three cloud agents on the same project with conflicting instructions and watched them ultimately go to war by deploying self-replicating malware on each other when they assumed the others were sabotaging their work. Some of those agents called a truce and asked for a human [laughter] to step in instead. >> So the agents battling agents, this is where this is where things are heading. Oh [laughter] my goodness. Keyron has a new C100 8K macro pad uh with a 100 keys on it, 10x10 grid, all programmable by you, the user. It's got an 8000 hertz pulling rate, hot swappable switches, so it's ideal for things, you know, you could use it for like video editing or live streaming, having all sorts of things queued up and everything. Uh people basically who want dedicated zones on a hardware controller for their workflows. Pretty pretty interesting. I saw this thing, I wanted to buy it immediately. I have no reason to, though. Uh, [laughter] yes. >> Open AAI is previewing an ultra fast tier for its best model, GPT 5.6 Soul, running up to 14 times faster and pushing out 750 tokens a second using Cabris trips. It's meant for fast tasks like live customer support and is in limited preview now. >> Just sounds like that would be really, really expensive very quickly. Uh, well, this is speaking of quickly, this is a quick one. Google dropped Gemini 3.7 Flash. That is 3 weeks after their last Flash release and still no word on 3.5 Pro. There you go. Well, the Wall Street Journal reports that enterprise users collectively spent $300 million on quantum computers last year, which surpassed the combined spending of research labs and governments for the first time. Companies want to be ready when quantum computers are viable so they can secure their systems. Yeah, this whole quantum thing, it's it's kind of given AI early, you know, early AI vibes. Like they're kind of following similar trajectories in a lot of ways. Interesting. Metaphiled a patent for AI glasses that use facial recognition to identify people and generate and present a highlight reel to the wearer. Um, so we can imagine that this is going to make the backlash of AI smart glasses even worse cuz don't don't don't bring that feature. That that sounds bad >> to me. >> Um, something that is uh related to AI but less bad is dognosis. Uh, actually it's quite good. Dnosis is combining the dog's ability to smell chemical signatures indicative of cancer with a model trained to interpret the dog's movements, respiration and brain activity for more precise indicators if it smells cancer. Wow. Patients breathe into a mask and if the samp and and then the sample is then taken to a farm outside of uh Benaloo for the dogs to smell. Wow. Interesting. >> That's kind of cool. >> That's fascinating. France's constitutional council struck down Mcronone's plan to ban under 15 years of age users from social media, ruling that it required age verification for everyone, including adults, with no real safeguards on how that would work. The French government now has to rewrite it ahead of spring 2027. >> All right. Apple is sending out a round of warnings to people it believes were hit by mercenary spyware that is um that and mercenary spyware being surveillance tools govern spy to target journalists and activists. A new support page points people towards using lockdown mode and tapping into outside help like Access Now's digital security helpline. >> Man, it just sounds so aggressive. Mercenary spyware. >> Very aggressive. >> I think that's that's even like mentioned in the in the call out. Like imagine getting mercenary spyw wear on your smartphone warning. >> Uh and finally, Uber and China's Pony AI are teaming up to put 2,000 robo taxis on European roads across four cities. Pony uh will supply the tech and a local partner will run the fleet. There you go. All right, we end every episode of DTNS with some shared perspectives. Today, Dan P has a foldable question. >> Dan P writes, "Hello, DTNS gang. I have a question about screen long longevity on the new Samsung flip phone. Maybe Jason Hal can answer this, but input from anyone who might know is appreciated. My wife has a Flip 5. I like how small it is, but I'm concerned about the screen crease. I'm not talking about the crease when new or even at one year old. At 2 years old, it appears that throughout the 1/4 in of height where the screen folds, the factory screen protector has delaminated from the actual screen and is attracting fuzz. You can usually see through it, but at times it is difficult. What might you know about how Samsung has improved the longevity of the crease? Thank you. >> Well, I don't know. I I I know that Samsung continues to enhance this. I don't know. I couldn't tell you and point you specifically to exactly how they're making sure that doesn't happen. I know on the new phone it's a new you know the the ZFold 8 series is an entirely new kind of approach and uh when it comes to that foldable display inside and so there's a different kind of layering different probably kind of adhesive approach and everything >> again like we're kind of trusting them when they say oh this will last for seven years or you know however many tens of thousands of folds or whatever >> they've done their tests they've released their tests we don't really know until we put it in into use in the real world But I did come across an article from Burle King at HowTogeeek, uh, who was in the same predicament you're talking about, Dan. Uh, turns out he was actually able to take the phone to Youbreak I FixI, I think is the name of the store or the the the Fix It Place, or is it I Break You Fix? I can't remember that place. Um, and they swapped out that layer specifically for just $20. So, kind of a little more than if you were to get like a screen protector for your smartphone. Apparently, [snorts] you can take it in and they will replace that layer for you and it's not that expensive. So, I'd be really curious if you're looking to do this and you do it. Please follow up with us and let us know how that goes. I'm really curious. Like, $20 seems ridiculously inexpensive for this sort of thing. Um, but I mean, Burl King, how to geek did it and said, "Look, I promise I'm not a shill." Like, it just worked and uh yay, my my foldable continues to work because of it. >> Oh, that's a good tip. I might have to listen to that because again that inner screen is very soft. It gets scratches and nicks and cuts cuts but yeah all that stuff very easily. So um yeah definitely let us know and on all of you if you have anything you're thinking about challenges advice we would love to hear it any insight into any of our stories feedback at daily techchnewshow.com. >> Yes indeed. Thank you again to Dan P for contributing to today's show. Thanks to you for being along for Daily Tech News Show. You can keep us in business by becoming a patron at patreon.com/dtns. We'll see you tomorrow. Wait a minute. No, we won't. It's Friday. We'll see you on Monday. This week's episodes of Daily Tech News Show were created by the following people. Host, writer, producer Tom Merritt, host, writer Jason Howell, co-host Sarah Lane, co-host Rob Dunwood, co-host Jen Cutter, co-host Winau, producer Anthony Lamos, and producer Roger Chang, editor Hammond Chamberlain, editor Victor Bognot, contributing producers Kevin Tech, Nol Cow, and Brandon Richards. Science correspondent Dr. Nikki Acriman's, social media producer and moderator Zoe Deding. Our mods beat Master W. Scottis 1, Biocow, Captain Kipper, uh Steve Guadama, Paul Reese, Matthew J. Stevens, aka Gadget Virtuoso, and JD Galloway. Mod and video hosting by Dan Christensen. Music provided by Martin Bell and Dan Lutters. Art by Len Peralta. Acast ad support from Alli Gallow. Patreon support from Bobby Wagner. And thanks to all our patrons who make the show possible. The DTNS [music] family of podcasts helping each other understand. >> Diamond Club hopes you have enjoyed this broker. [laughter]