5 Tips for Bigger Arms (The Mistakes Most People Make Without Realizing It) | Mind Pump 2919

Easily one of the number one fitness goals when people go to the gym is to get bigger arms, more sculpted arms, to have arms that look amazing. We're going to give you five tips. They really work to get those arms that you want. Let's go. >> Big arms. >> This is all I cared about >> when you were young. When you're young, >> this is all I cared about. >> That's me, too. >> Yeah. [laughter] Yeah. >> You know, arm training >> um arm training isn't super complex, right? So like if we talk about developing the lower body, working the back in particular, >> um training the core, some people think that's very basic and simple, but uh can be difficult. >> There's a lot more complexity, but a lot of arm exercises are pretty straightforward. >> Yeah, it's it's pretty easy. >> Single joint action. >> It's pretty easy, but people still uh mess them up and they mess them up in ways I don't think they realize that they're leaving a lot of gains on the table. In fact, uh what we're going to talk about, um when I would train experienced lifters or when I manage gyms and they weren't clients of mine, but they were members of the gym and we'd have conversations and we would include some of these things that we're going to talk about. They they seem like minor changes, but they make a big difference in your arm development. And here, I'll give you the first one. The first one is this is going to sound obvious, but you would be surprised. In fact, if you're listening, many of you are probably guilty of not training in a really full range of motion with your arm. >> Yeah. I was going to say there's actually push back to this. I've I've encountered it. Uh we Yeah. And in terms of like the time under tension kind of philosophy of, you know, not necessarily going to full range of motion like there's some drop off, but yeah. If you're not expressing full range of motion, you're not actually achieving the full potential the the entire muscle. So, I always hated the the I got to maintain tension on the muscle, which is why I'm not doing a full range of motion. I hated that argument because uh unless you're relaxed in a full range of motion, like I'm setting the weight down, >> right? >> The muscle is under tension. So, stay connected the whole time, but >> the studies on full range of motion uh demonstrate this pretty clearly. you build more muscle and the strength that you develop is more complete because it's applied to you know most of the strength you gain in a r in a exercise most of it goes to the range of motion that you train in the further outside of that range of motion you move the [clears throat] the less of that strength uh is applicable so in other words if I do half squats uh [snorts] once I go down six inches below that it's like significant drop off >> it's a big force direction drop off right and when it comes to muscle development uh full range of motion has been shown in studies to make a difference. So, this this one's simple and like I said, a lot of people are guilty of this of stopping their curls, especially like a preacher curl. They'll stop it just short or tricep exercises where they don't go all the way up. They kind of stop at halfway. Like, just do the full range of motion um with your current exercise and watch what happens. >> Yeah. I I think this is because they end up or we end up uh trading weight for full range of motion. >> Oh, like cuz I got to go lighter, >> right? And so I think there's this idea that, you know, if I shorten the range up a bit, I can go up another five or 10 pounds on the weight and my my ego likes that better that I can, you know, now I can curl 45 lb dumbbells instead of having to stay at 35s >> uh through a full range of motion. Um, but just to highlight like um I mean I've talked about this before with my legs. Uh I remember when that was unlocked for me. That was a real obvious one because I squatted down to 90 for so long and then to go full range and it was a significantly lighter difference. To see my myself be able to develop bigger legs. Uh going through a full range of motion with like significantly like 100 lb plus lighter weight is just highlights like you know you going down 5 lb or 10 lbs on your bicep curls to go through a full range of motion is far better than you going up 5 or 10 lbs and shortening that range. Not to mention the the longevity of this approach versus the other. And it's, you know, whenever you're going to be encountering anything uh in life where you're picking something up or you're using uh your arms to uh express that push or pull like movement. Um if you're in just a I don't know, let's say 5 degrees, you know, outside of your normal like lifting patterns, like that's injury susceptible. Yeah. It's susceptible. Your body's not going to recognize that. is going to immediately tense up and and try to protect uh what it can so you don't get injured. But >> I I have a spec you just brought back a a memory, Adam, that I totally forgot about. So I at this let me see I must have been I was 18. I was probably 18 years old. I was a I was a fitness manager and uh at this point I had been working out for a while. So I started working out at 14. So I'm already experienced with working out. I'm a certified trainer. I'm not a good trainer yet. Uh but I I know what I'm doing in terms of exercises, let's say. Okay. And I had this trainer that worked for me. His name was Mitch. Uh you might know Mitch. You might have met him before. Vietnamese dude. Uh was kind of lean, muscular, and he had these really incredible looking arms. And him and I did this workout together. Now, I distinctly remember this because I had gotten so proud or so I was I was so prideful of the fact that I could do preacher curls. So, I was 18. I could do preacher curls with the curl bar with the 25s on each side. Right? So, you got the curl bar, throw the 25s on, and I would do my preacher curls like that. And I did a workout with him. He put tens on each side. And I remember thinking like, "Oh, this is gonna be easy." Then I watched him do his preacher curls and he went all the way down like way like full extension almost like he's hyperextending his elbows and coming all the way up. And I always stop just short of that. I would stop, you know, maybe a couple inches short of that. >> And so I stuck with his weight. I did the real full range of motion with the curls. I got the craziest pump. And [snorts] from then on, I changed the way I trained my biceps, especially on that exercise. And I noticed results very quickly. I didn't change the exercise. I didn't change anything. I went lighter, >> but I moved a couple r a couple inches further with my range of motion. I also got this with overhead tricep extension. This is one that, you know, if you especially if your elbows are healthy, you can get really strong and you can press a big dumbbell or whatever. And I learned the same thing. You know, I had the big 100 lb dumbbell and I would stop just short and my buddy's like, "Dude, grab the 50, go down as far as you possibly can, bring your elbows back, feel the stretch, and then go all the way up." And it fried my triceps and I had great results. It was all because of the range of motion. Uh, so here's the next one. >> In your arm exercises, >> try to always include one that loads the muscle in a stretched position. Okay. So, this is a an this would be an exercise where you feel the muscle stretching and you're also fighting resistance. So, a good example of this for biceps would be like inc incline curls, right? I'm laying back on an incline. >> My elbows are down by my sides. Lower the b the dumbbell all the way. And that's actually a stretch on the bicep, right? If my elbows are in front of me, there's no stretch. But when I bring it back because the attachment over the shoulder, like if I were to stretch my bicep now, I'd have to bring my arm back in order to do so. That stretch position and loading it. the data shows seems to have uh a little bit more it's a little bit more special when it comes to hypertrophy. For triceps, this would be an overhead exercise where you're really stretching uh the the tricep. >> So, in your workout, always try to include at least one exercise that loads the stretch position. And what you find often times is their entire arm workout, there isn't a single stretch exercise. None of them. >> Yeah. I mean, I feel like you got to do one in the stretch and one in the flex position. That's just that that's the uh the key to that was a big unlock for me cuz uh you know even I don't know how many years of you know biceps and triceps uh three four times a week I was doing >> but for sure I'm at year you know two or three by this time when this finally comes together for me. I didn't realize that, you know, standing cable uh rope push downs, straight bar push downs, triangle push downs, and reverse push down the same all the same [ __ ] >> you know, and so, you know, in a world like that where like that where I would do one of those exercises back to back like I was getting like a different workout and you of course fell for the trap of, oh, it feels a little different and so maybe it is different and it's like, no, I'm not I'm not hitting the tricep different from a different angle, right? I'm not putting it in a stretch position and a contra in a fully contracted and then somewhere in the middle type of position and understanding that you're to your next point like the elbow positioning uh of each one of the movements. >> That's what that's what makes it a different exercise for the most part is elbow position. So although hand uh supernation plays somewhat of a role >> in bicep development, it does it does nothing >> for tricep development. But what does uh change things is where your elbow is. So now when you're looking at your workout and you're like, "Whiches should I pick? I'm going to do three today for my biceps or three for my triceps." Well, now you have all these exercises to pick from. You're like, "Okay, which ones do I pick? I can only pick three." Pick three that where the elbow position is different. This is such an easy arm training program hack. Now, when it comes to training chest and back and legs, it gets more complex. For arms, it's literally this simple. >> Yeah. >> Pick different different elbow positions. Done. You now have perfect a perfect arm workout. >> And an example that would be like elbows other side, elbows in front, elbows behind >> for triceps. Yeah. Perfect. Or for biceps, elbows behind, elbows the sides, elbows. Like if you just do that uh load those muscles with a different elbow position, >> you're going to get really a great workout and really full development much more >> than if you picked three exercises with the same or similar. >> I was waiting for this this next one. [laughter] >> Compound lifts. >> Compound lifts. Yeah. just because you know uh in terms of loading um muscles and also getting the maximal benefit of that you know really loud signal and then following up with a single joint movement a lot of times too like playing between both um just and this is the funny part you think like powerlifters themselves you know like dude they get really big muscles like and it's a very demanding uh signal that they're producing when they're you know summoning all this force and so the only way to do that is with these compound lifts. Uh, and then to, you know, sharpen it, sculpt it. I understand all that, you know, as a result of that. But if you're not going to include compound lifts, you're not going to even touch the amount of gains potential. >> No. And you're a good example of this. I mean, uh, you probably, if you're watching this on YouTube, you can see Justin. Justin's got some guns on him, and he probably does an isolation exercise for his biceps and triceps. I don't know, twice a month, maybe. >> Yeah. Very infrequently. But >> for the It's all compounds. >> I enjoy them. But yeah, it's all compound lifts. Yeah. Yeah. And and so compound lifts uh for triceps are things like close grip bench press uh dips. We're get when it comes to biceps where people are like what's a compound like back exercises kind of. You just do them differently. >> Right. >> Right now we have a buy one get one free thing going on with maps programs. The top 10 most popular MAPS programs. MAPS anabolic aesthetic performance 15 minutes anywhere symmetry starter muscle mommy powerlift and 40 plus. Buy one get one free happening right now. Go to mapsboggo.com. All right, here comes the show. >> All right, real quick. If you love us like we love you, why not show up by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs, or training gear over at mypumpstore.com. I'm talking right now. Hit pause. Head on over to mypumpstore.com. That's it. Enjoy the rest of the show. An exercise that I learned from uh Mike Mener. So Mike Messer talked about this uh and he learned from Arthur Jones was a supenated grip pull down. Now I know you you're like, "Well, that's a back exercise." It is, but you can change the way you do it to make it a bicep exercise. If you kind of lean forward and curl the weight down on the way down, >> uh watch what happens to your biceps. They will >> really recruit your biceps. >> They will you will feel them like you've never felt them before. And you'll be able to load them with a weight that you normally wouldn't be able to curl. um and which uh plays a big role in their size and development, not to mention the functionality. >> Well, just to back up how powerful compound lifts are for building the arms. Even these because you guys are naming movements, right? Like dips and and supernated curls, which are you're you're trying to you are trying to target the arms, but you'd be surprised how much your arms grow just from heavy lifting the the traditional >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> compound lifts. So, I mean, since my pec tear, what a year and a half ago, I can probably count on one hand, maybe definitely under two hands. I can know less than 10 times, maybe under five, that I've trained my arms in a year and a half. >> Yeah, >> I never train my arms anymore. But I still do a lot of the heavy compound lifts and that's been enough to sustain arms. Now, I don't have as impressive as arms as I did, but I still got arms. You know, I still don't look like somebody who doesn't work their arms out. And that's just been able to be sustained from doing compound lifts and not doing any of these lifts that are even targeting it. And I know a lot of guys that are like that that just don't even do arms. I mean, a lot of your your CrossFit people, >> almost all CrossFit guys are not don't do isolation curls. >> Can't get a big bench from bicep without Yeah. [laughter] >> without getting massive triceps and shoulders as a result. It's like it has to balance it out. >> Yeah. No, 100%. A good example by the way of this and sometimes I get a little bit of controversy [snorts] around but look at gymnasts. Uh gymnasts have crazy looking triceps and biceps. Now part of this is you know when you look at top level gymnasts what you're looking at are genetically gifted mini bodybuilders. They have these polymorphisms that make them really good at at gymnastics. The other part of it is how they train. Uh you know the iron cross. I mean this is crazy tension uh on the biceps. constantly doing pull-ups, constantly doing dips, very little if no isolation exercises, >> and their arms uh look like amateur bodybuilders. >> Yeah. >> With the development, and it's all from these compound lifts. Compound lifts are like your bread. This is like your meat and potatoes. >> The isolation exercises are great and they do something. >> But if you get strong, you get strong at a close grip bench press. Watch what happens to your There is no tricep press down in the world that will come close to adding 30 pounds to your close. >> No, that's to Justin's point. Show me somebody who bench presses heavy and I'll show you some big triceps. Show me somebody who rows a barbell really heavy, I'll show you some biceps. I just >> it comes along with that territory. And the reason why I and the reason why I want to put emphasis on it is because I wish I knew that. I know. >> I wish someone had really hammered that home to me when I was younger because I spent so many years doing arm full day arm workouts and all I did was arm stuff and it was all isolation stuff and it was like it all to grow these arms and it's like man if I would have just got a bigger bench a bigger row >> and not to mention like that we're talking specific about the arms but the carryover that getting those things have to just overall building muscle development everything like that it just it's has a compounding effect you Uh, it's just you can't you cannot stress that enough that that should be the cornerstone is because somebody who listens to an episode like this that wants to get big arms, I I bet you are already training arms like all the time, but and they're probably trading that out for other days of deadlifting or rowing or bench pressing or like don't do that. >> Make that your cornerstone. And then yes, then take the advice we're giving right now of, you know, elbow positioning and do these compound lifts and that's all. But it's like, man, the cornerstone should be go get big at these, go get strong with these big lifts and watch what that does for you. >> No, these are simple, like I said, these are simple tips uh that make a big difference. And then the last one, this this applies so well to arm training. So, occlusion training or blood flow restriction was really popular I want to say like nine years ago, eight years ago. This was this this builds muscle, you guys. It builds muscle and it's a strange way to train. It's it was used in physical therapy far be way before any bodybuilder got their hands on it. Um and it it was discovered I want to say 60 or 70 years ago. Essentially, when you olude a muscle of venus outflow, so of blood outflow, uh, waste byproducts build up in the muscle and the the the fast twitch muscle fibers fatigue and adapt as if you were lifting really heavy weight. You also get this crazy stretch phenomenon from this intracellular pump, which is the most in intense you've ever felt with occlusion training. So, for people aren't familiar, it's really easy with arms. It's more difficult with other body parts. But you would take a knee wrap and I would tie it around my upper arm tight enough to where I could feel it's cutting off some blood supply. I don't go so tight that I'm numb, but enough to where oh yeah, I could feel that's pretty tight. Then I go rep out some curls. And I'm going to warn you, the fire that you will feel [laughter] in your biceps by for doing this lava. It is there nothing more painful than than this feeling right here. It's literally because the waste byproducts are just building up in the muscle. You can't get rid of it. It burns like crazy. The pump you get is insane. It's the craziest pump you've ever felt. And [snorts] it uh it adds another element. Uh when I've done this, I've done this on calves and I've done this on arms. And within weeks, I added a quarter inch to both of them just for adding a couple sets uh in the week. Just a couple sets in the week and it made a huge difference. Um and it's funny, I don't see anybody doing this anymore. >> It's the forgotten method. >> But it's why it was hot and popular for a minute. Um, and I don't know why it it fell out of favor or not, but I mean for both for arms and calves, this is like such a hack, >> such a cool. >> It's crazy. It's fun. It's crazy. And again, you grab some light dumbbells, rep them out. >> You'll [snorts] feel the burn. Rest 30 seconds to a minute. The burn will not go away while you're resting. You're It's actually going to intensify. >> Super novel stimulus. >> Then go grab the really light dumbbells again. I mean, just so people know, for me it was like 10 lb dumbbells. Rep them out again. Do this three times. Then let go of the dumbbells. sit for another 30 seconds while everything's on fire. Yeah. Take off the the knee wraps. >> And you did it. And the the again the the pump and the swelling you get from this is just super super crazy. >> Anyway, I have uh Doug has a study that I'd like for him to pull up on non-essential amino acids and how they're not necessary to stimulate net muscle protein synthesis. Okay. So, I want him to pull this up. So, this is really interesting. Okay. So muscle protein synthesis we can measure and when this is positive when we see this what this means is the body's building. Okay. So we're building. So if we measure this and >> is it certain that's always happening when that's happening? >> Well it's got to stay positive all the time. Okay. So so obviously you can go positive then you go negative much later and it comes out to like nothing. >> Okay. But what we do see by doing certain things eating particular ways or whatever is like oh this is stimulating muscle growth. Now it used to be I think believed that you needed a complete protein for this to happen. >> And what they found what they found in this study and other studies is that the non-essential amino acids are not needed. [snorts] Only essential amino acids are needed to stimulate uh muscle protein synthesis. Now this doesn't mean this is all you ever do. So, all you ever do is take essential amino acids and you never have complete proteins, that doesn't make sense because you're going to eat food. But what this does mean is that if you're in a cut, this is where this applies. You're in a cut, your calories are low. Adding a bunch of extra protein now is you're counting all of your calories. So, you're like, well, you know, how do I get more muscle protein synthesis, but I can't go over all my calories? Throw some essential amino acids at yourself on top of that. >> It's very low calorie, almost no calorie because it's not a complete protein. and you're gonna get more muscle protein synthesis. And so this is a great strategy because the main strategy in a cut is uh besides is keep my muscle >> y >> and essential amino acids, you know, like the keon ones that we've been using. >> You take six of those capsules >> three, four, five times a day to keep that muscle protein synthesis high. Your calories barely budge because it's not a complete protein. >> Well, that makes sense. We've been saying that for people in the GLP1. Totally. And uh so of course, yeah, to to take that into somebody like who's on a cut, too. I would imagine that's a benefit. >> I experimented with it last year. It was super effective. I I wish I had it when I was bodybuilding. Um you know, or at least I I wish I did it uh when I was bodybuilding. I didn't do it when I was bodybuilding. >> Um in fact, I was still like big, you know, amino acids, essential amino acids or just all this. Yeah. Waste, BCAAs or waste, all this. That's I was in that camp still at that time. So I didn't waste my time >> uh with doing that. And I look back now and I wish I would have I saw I mean I did a DEXA I did DEXA before after and the whole cut I did that I lost like no muscle and you do a cut for you you typically lose a little bit of muscle expected. >> Yeah, you're expected and the goal is to lose as minimal as possible. >> And so to be in a cut uh for as long as I was and shred down like I did that last that time last year. Um, that was like really impressive >> if I were to do an aggressive and I have I I don't really have any intentions of doing an aggressive cut, but let's say I wanted to get into single digit body fat. And for me, it's a little different from person to person, but if I start to go like I can maintain around 11% body fat, maybe 10, and I'm okay. If I want to start to get into the single digit, it's like I know I'm going to lose some muscle. That's just just what happens if I get especially if I get below 7% like and there's nothing I could I'm just going to It's just a matter of how much muscle I lose. >> The way I would do it now is like I normally do with my diet and everything is I would have the Keon essential amino acids and I take that like five times a day. I would throw six six capsules at myself five six times a day. >> Um and I would preserve more muscle uh than than I have in the past. That would be the strategy. So, >> did you see Adam, I don't know if you saw this. Did you see the meme that's going around about I'm going to pull it up right now about uh Germany's tax uh brackets and system and how and how like weird it is how how crazy >> managing that. >> Okay. >> No, no, >> dude. This is wild. So, somebody did the math on this and what they did is so this is a dual earner couple with two children. um how much money they would make and how much money they would take home based off of the tax system >> in Germany. >> In Germany. Okay. So, [laughter] >> did they convert it to US dollars so it's easy for us to kind of translate? >> Well, it's in euros, so it's fine. Whatever. >> Close. Close enough. >> So, here's what's crazy. Because of the way the tax system works, you take home essentially the same amount of money if you make €3,000 or €6,000 a month. It's almost the same. So you could make twice as much, but because you make so much more, they tax you that much more and you end up taking home almost the same exact amount of money >> as a person who makes three. >> That's right. As a couple. >> Well, I mean, how it's it's not double is crazy cuz we're not double like that. But I remember, don't you remember this yourself? Like I remember work working my way up, right? The annual income. And now this is granted 20 something years ago. So, this has probably moved and changed a little bit, but I clearly remember >> when you move into a new tax bracket. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, I clearly remember what it was like to go from like 70,000 a year to like 90 to like 110 range. And I remember getting to like the 110 and like that was like a big milestone to be in the six figures, right? And going like I didn't feel any wealthier at 110 than I did at 70 because at 70 I had very minimal taxes I paid. I had enough write offs, expenses, like I basically like paid no extra taxes. But once I got into the six figure mark, like I was paying extra paying extra taxes. So it's like I brought home a little bit more during the year, but then I had to pay back stuff at the end of the year and I'm like when I look at the math and I wash it, I'm like, God, for that climbing all the way up to there, I really don't feel like I made much more. And there it really and they and I've heard I've seen people put this up before where it's like the leap you have to make to really make the lifestyle feel different is it's wild. And so even in the US it's like that. It's maybe not that extreme >> where it's three and six. >> Well, what's crazy about this is it's it deincentivizes uh people. >> So imagine if you're this couple and you know this and you're taking home x amount and you're like, "Okay, should I work harder? Should I go for that promotion? Should I try to become more productive? Uh, >> incentives aren't even really a part of it. >> And you're looking at each other and you're like, "Honey, if we make double, we take home the same amount. Don't even waste your time. >> Why waste your time?" >> This happens with a lot of um with some of our like social programs. So, I know somebody like this. >> Yeah. >> Where they get so much money from the state >> and and I'm like, "Hey, why don't you get a job?" And they're like, "If I get a job, I don't get this. >> I lose these." Yeah. >> I don't get this anymore. And and so essentially if I get a job, I'm gonna make the same amount as I'm already currently getting except now I'm working. >> Yeah. >> So I think I'm just not gonna work. And I can't blame >> Yeah. >> Like that's that's a logical thought process, >> right? >> You know, >> so it's kind of crazy. >> No, I mean that's uh Yeah. No, I know I know plenty of people [laughter] that are that are like that that I've seen it. That's tough for me to wrap my brain around that, but that's >> we've But you've created that. You create uh when you and you incentivize people to do that. Why go to work when I make what? I'm gonna make a couple more bucks and I got to work harder. I got to work way harder. Does it make sense? I mean, don't you remember going that way? Like with yours like So the the one positive to that I guess was uh it really made me look at what I did and how much I like it. And so like when I would get opportunities and I'm sure you guys did too from clients and stuff like that to to move careers, right? Like I always had always, you know, I don't know how many times in a year, maybe a couple times a year, I'd get a client who that we connected. they really liked me and they would be like, you know, hey, come work for me. >> You know, you should come work for me and I'll pay you this much >> and it was, you know, sometimes it was more money than what I was making, but it was always like a little bit more than what I was making. And I was always like, >> yeah, [clears throat] >> yeah. No, I know what it's like. I love what I do. I love what I do. >> This is fun. Doesn't sound as fun. >> Yeah. I love what I do. And another 30, $40,000 a year, which sounds like a lot, is not really a lot. Cuz when you move up, that's another tax bracket you go up. And it's like really what is that difference per month? And when you live in an area that's expensive, it's like uh I mean it it doesn't make that big of an impact. >> One of the tough things I think for [snorts] um you know I think people and I get why this is a difficult one. Um and and I was lucky I had some really you know I come from an immigrant family so they're very hardworking. Um I was constantly preached to about uh all the great opportunities here um that we could take and you know my dad grew up real poor. my mom, her dad came here when he was uh, you know, it a very difficult time. So, I I was brought up in this kind of like, you know, um, you're very grateful for what you have, go out there, work hard type of deal. And it was it was it was a a huge plus. But I I I and I kind of understand where people, you know, where this mentality comes from, but you see someone producing so much or or making so much more. Well, yeah, they should pay so much more uh in taxes. But what you got to be careful with is what you don't want to do is take your most productive people as defined by what the market says is productive. So I know sometimes people argue this like I work out I work real hard too. Like I know they work but I also bust my ass. It's like okay you do work really hard. Okay but uh the market determines value. >> And so if somebody's being really productive based off of what the market says uh and often times it's skewed, right? like could be that they're making some product or whatever that's like okay is that really benefiting anybody? But often times it's also like they're innovating, they're doing some things that are really what we don't want to do is deincentivize people who are are really productive um by saying hey you're going to get hammered >> u you know more u the more you make the more you produce and what ends up happening is you can get people to go what's the point I'm not even going to try anymore. Yeah, I think it I think it's really easy to look at that when you've you've been kind of an employee your whole life. It's different once you've had to build a business like you have a total different lens that you can see that through. >> I've learned I've had very different conversations about this with um you know my friends that are work as a teacher or like work with the government or yeah have just been an employee and like has never even attempted to own their own business. It's a totally different um world view and perspective you get as a as a small business owner and a lot of those, you know, tapes and restrictions and things that you have to kind of bust through just to get, you know, what what's on paper, you know, bringing that home. It's it's pretty substantially, >> you know, it's been fun. It's been really fun. And uh I Your oldest works, right? >> Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah, he does. >> Okay. So, this is really interest This is really cool. This I think every kid goes through this. My niece gets a job, right? She starts working. She gets her paycheck and she's looking at it and going, [laughter] >> "Wait a minute. Where's the rest of it? >> Why is my >> make 15 an hour?" >> Yeah. Yeah. [laughter] And I'm like, "Oh, you pay taxes." And to see the light bulb go on and for her to be like, "Wait a minute. Where's Isn't that money?" I'm like, "No, that's how much you got to pay." >> Yeah. >> To [laughter] see that that come through is pretty funny. Have you guys experienced that with your kids? Have Have they said anything about that? >> Uh, yeah, just a little bit. Yeah, same it was a paycheck. And uh yeah, I think the realization of that was too when um the nice part was was Ethan was running his own experiment with trying to sell t-shirts and he was originally trying to sell like these packets that were like like Gatorade that he was like hustling at school and kids were buying it from him and stuff. I like that. >> And it was a cool little thing he was doing. And then he was making, you know, some some side change from that. And of course, you know, I was buying some stuff like off uh Amazon for him initially. And then I was like, you got to put that back in. >> His margins were 100%. >> His margins were 100%. And and so then he he, you know, moves all that into like, well, I want to sell t-shirts now. And like he actually was pretty resourceful and got this like whole setup um from his gymnastic gym. They had like uh made t-shirts before in the past, but it was like they, you know, they weren't using it. And so he asked if he could use it and and so basically brought it home and he's got this whole thing all set up ready to go. Yeah. I'm like, "Oh, cool." Like I'm all about like helping you like get this thing off the ground, launch and all this, but I was like, you know, you're going to have to buy all the t-shirts and you're going to have to buy the ink and, you know, and all that kind. So you got to factor all that in and, you know, see how we're going to recoup. Uh and and so he bought all that. He sold a few few and it just it like crushed him, you know? [clears throat] He was just the realization of like I don't think I'm going to make my money back down. [laughter] I was like, I know it's hard, right? You know, but it's like, you got one under your belt. I was like, the more of these you keep doing and you figure it out, like that's what entrepreneurship is. >> I can't wait for that day. It was rad, though. It was fun. >> My 5-year-old uh he he'll buy like um it's like jewelry making kits, but it's like for kids stuff, like you make a bracelet or whatever. and he was selling them to family. Of course, family members are going to buy them all. And so now we go to the store and he's like, "I want to buy this for me." I'm like, "Wait, so I can sell some." >> So then I'm having the conversation of like, "Okay, it cost $15 and you're going to sell them for a dollar each. You're going to make $10." >> Yeah. >> You actually lost $5. And he's like, "What?" And I'm like, "Yeah, if you buy this and you sell them for a dollar each, you lose money." And he's like, "The wheels are turning." [laughter] Wait, >> I need to raise prices. Yeah, totally. >> Did you guys see um they just this is the new data that came out uh was it was a federal national survey on drug use and health. >> The number one used addictive substance in America. Do you guys want to guess what it is? >> We're including things like nicotine and like alcohol. >> No, it's legal stuff. The stuff >> Oh, legal stuff. >> Caffeine. So Oh, yeah. Caffeine. >> They didn't put caffeine. That counts. They don't They don't count that. That's a good one, Doug. They should if they put caffeine. going to be nicotine or or I mean I guess nicotine >> for the first time actually not alcohol went way down right >> for the first time ever weed. >> Wow. >> Oh wow. >> Weed weed. Cannabis is the number one used most popular daily >> drug. It now beats alcohol and cigarettes. >> I don't know how I feel about that. >> Same. >> I don't know if I like that. >> This is not a good thing. >> I don't think it's a good thing. I definitely just from what I've seen from teenage kids and like how insanely pervasive it is and and how unproductive, you know, a lot of >> You guys sound like me. You guys remember when we had this debate like like a couple years ago? You don't remember this? >> Yeah, >> you did. Yeah. You already started that. >> Yes. I I said, "Man, I would way rather catch my kid drinking >> and drunk than catch him smoking weed." >> And that was coming from back then I was smoking weed all the time. I was like, "That's coming from somebody who smokes." Like, I I >> I would rather that. And it's and it's not because I think one is more or less healthier. It's not even that angle. It's that it's per weed is pervasive like that. It's easy to justify it's healthy for me or it's not bad or it's like oh it helps me with my anxiety. >> Hangovers and you don't there's not a lot of like um yeah like immediate consequence right things. >> Right. Exactly. And so that and that to me is it's it is um it it creeps on you and then before you know it it's a daily habit and you don't you're unproductive. You don't do [ __ ] >> You know what's one of the crazy things about this? So I was wrong on this and I'm going to say this publicly. I thought that legalizing cannabis, this was back when it wasn't legal. Okay, now it's mostly legal. It's not federally legal yet, but it's basically legal uh because so many states have legalized it and the federal government doesn't doesn't really care or do anything about it. I thought legalizing it would not increase its use. I thought, oh, it's just going to be about the same and maybe even people will use it less because it's not as like seductive because it's not this black market thing. It's not exciting, >> right? [snorts] >> Which now in hindsight was one of the dumbest opinions you could possibly ever have. >> It for sure increased through the roof. I don't I don't think it's fair to to call that yet. It's still novel. It's extremely novel for a vast majority of our society. >> You think it's going to You think it's going to go up in >> 100%. >> 100%. It's novel. I mean I mean I see it in my like own like family of like people that were like weed was so taboo and enough education's come around that it's actually it's not too bad for you. It's like okay let me try it you know. Oh, and they're like there's there's this curve happening or this this pendulum happening right now of everybody can get it. It's not so bad for you. Oh, let's try. Oh, it's fun. I never did it. Like it's there's a lot of that happening right now. And then also kids can get it's legal. I do think I definitely think it's going to swing back. Will it come way back and lower? >> How high is it going to get before >> right like that? That the verdict's not out. It's just wild to me that in the US it's used more daily >> than alcohol or uh or tobacco, >> which is wild. Here's the other part of this is interesting to speculate on. >> Okay. >> Smoking weed by yourself is not as uh as as like uh bad as like drinking by yourself. >> Well, I was Okay, so you're kind of along the lines where I'm going. So, >> okay. Definitely alcohol can have some horrible uh effects. Alcoholism, terrible. >> Like how often how often did anyone ever say like, "Yeah, man. I had a couple beers and played some video games. You definitely smoke some weed and play video games. >> Well, this is where I'm going. Uh most social most people exactly where I'm going. Most people >> who drink, you know, who enjoy the occasional drink, even weekly or whatever, are not alcoholics. We know this. The vast majority of people who drink alcohol are not alcoholics. >> The vast majority of people who drink alcohol are doing it in a social setting. >> Yeah. >> It's a social one of the effects of alcohol is it's kind of a social lubricant. Yeah, >> cannabis is not. >> Cannabis people get weird. >> Cannabis actually is. Now, some people say it's social. Not really. >> I know a lot of introverts. >> Put yourself in a scale. Put yourself in kind of a scary social situation. Smoke a joint. Guaranteed you won't run away. I don't care who you are. I mean, there's obviously my my brother's an example, someone who who who uses it for social anxiety, right? But that he's a minority even if that is true of people that do it mo and if it's something that you can smoke in your room by do in your room by yourself like it's not a it's not a social that's like intervention you know with alcohol if you're just sitting there like drinking hard alcohol by yourself >> like people are going to be really concerned. >> Yeah. But also I would challenge that Adam. So I don't know your brother. Okay. Would you say he's like a super social person? >> Oh no. I'm That's why I did the air quotes is this like I don't I don't buy that. >> It's right. >> Yeah. Yeah. But it's like listen, who am I to say like maybe it does what whatever. It's like I still would argue that he's an anomaly even if that's true. >> So I I'm the reason why I'm like sounding the alarm on this. I'm speculating, but you know, I've done both, right? If I've smoked weed, I've had alcohol. Weed does not make me uh more social. Uh maybe when I'm with close friends that I trust. >> Yeah. >> But you put me in a place I don't know anybody. if you give me any cannabis like now I'm now I don't want to talk to anybody. I'm way more anxious. Okay. >> Um I think with the loneliness epidemic with the fact that society is now organizing itself in a way [clears throat] to make >> it's a dangerous combination. >> It's yeah it's social socializing. Okay. So this is what happened to activity. >> We organized society to make being active uh difficult. It's actually being active now is you have to you have to go out of your way to be active. Being sedentary is the default. This is how we organize society. We've also now slowly maybe actually quickly have organized society in a way to make being social with people something you have to get go out of your way to do. Whereas so being social used to be the default. You had to be social. If I went to the store, you know, I I had to walk to the store. I had to go to I had to talk to people. I knew my neighbors. >> We have organized society now to isolate ourselves. Door Dash, internet, like everything is like, and we know this, the loneliness epidemic is is crazy. >> You throw weed on top of that. >> Holy cow. bad combination and that's not good for for people. Yeah. No, I I don't I don't disagree with that at all. I don't it's a bad and that and that is what could potentially cause it to continue to go really really bad and stay bad for a long time. >> And listen, okay, I'll say this about alcohol. Is there a difference between uh drinking a beer and doing shots? >> Yeah. Okay. >> Cannabis does not look the same as it used to. It does not look the same. You go to a dispensary and you find yourself a joint and you try to find one less than 20% THC. They don't sell them. >> Oh yeah, >> they don't. >> No, >> they're all 25 plus. It used to be 15% 10%. They making them strong as hell. >> So, this is uh this will be interesting. >> I mean, if you I mean I mean I just going to say if you could finish a finish a joint, you're a stoner. I mean, that's like [laughter] today today's cannibis. I mean, yeah. No, I'm blitzed if I have like more than two hits or something. I mean, that would be just >> if you can actually finish a whole one like that's that's crazy. That's Crazy tolerance. >> Yeah. Which Yeah, exactly. Which means you had to do a lot to get to that you had to do a lot to get to that level for sure. Yeah. No, I I mean uh I mean part of the motivation there was several things that motivated me to to quit. Uh but I also know my son's getting to that certain age and I like I definitely if I want if I don't want him to ever do that, one of the easiest ways I think is to him not see his dad or you know be around that or any of that stuff. And so that was a big big motivation uh for me. And I'm not an anti-cannabis person. Like I And even when I said uh when I stopped, I was like, you know, I'm not saying I'll never do it again. Like I'll like there's I'm sure there's going to be a situation or a time where I partake or do that, but it'll be few and far between. >> I have a friend of mine um I won't say who they are um and give too many details, but someone I know very well who was a a regular cannabis user. Uh so they have it on kind of a daily basis, which now we're finding is not that uncommon. Okay. So they used it regularly. They also had social anxiety and would not necessarily like to be in in in public or social situations. Thought that that was their personality. Just thought that that's who they were. >> Yeah. >> Quit smoking cannabis >> after getting through the first couple months of the difficulty of whatever. Became much more social, hosting events, being around people, and literally told me said to me, "I thought that was my personality. I had no idea it was the cannabis." >> That's like the people that think they're productive on it. [laughter] And then they get off of it. It's like, whoa. That's what productivity looks like actually looks like. It's like caffeine. Good for you. You went to work. You still went to work. You still did your job. It does not mean you're productive yet. [laughter] >> You guys know that one meme that says like hard times create good men. Good men create good time. Okay. They made one for nicotine. And in cannabis, it said it said nicotine uh >> nicotine produces uh produces good men. Good men produce good times. Good times produce weed. Weed produces bad men. Bad men. So basically saying like nicotine was getting guys >> get back to smoking cigarettes [laughter] guys back >> work our way back to Marorrow. I think that's hilarious >> dude that's hilar that's hilarious. >> Uh I just learned something the other day. Have you guys ever heard of the overjustification effect? Have you guys ever heard that? >> I could I feel like uh I can guess what it is. >> It's really cool dude. I I looked at the study or I saw this study. It was really interesting. So scientists took a group of kids who love to draw. >> Okay, >> these were already kids. They love to draw. That's just like their favorite thing to do. Whenever they have free time, they draw. They enjoy it. They took and they divided them. And this, you can look this up. Look up the overjustification effect, Doug, if you don't mind. And they took the kids, they separated them. They gave half the kids a star every time they drew. So every time they drew, they give them a star and a reward. The other kids, they left alone. Here's what happened. The kids who were given a star stopped drawing on their own. >> They just stopped. The kids they left alone continue to go, continue to do it. They call it the overjustification effect. >> Interesting. >> Athletes experience this as well. >> You have athletes who are passionate about a sport, love it, >> get all the trophies, >> do everything, then suddenly they go play pro and now it's a job, they're getting paid, and they lose they lose the passion for it. And you'll see that as well when they talk about >> I wonder what that curve looks like. >> Yeah, I know. It's like because obviously there's some positive reinforcement that probably happens early on. You start drawing and you get a star, you get the things like that. In fact, actually, I think I I saw Hermoszi just talking about this. This must have been what he was alluding to this study because he was saying that like that falls off after a while. >> So, what's the curve look like? Because initially that reward signal does work like initially. >> What does what does it say, Doug? >> Well, I don't know. But the if you look at the graph, it looks like it falls off very quickly. That's right. Oh, interesting. Can you pull it? Can you put it up on the screen? >> Oh, it's not there. Okay. Sorry. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. [laughter] >> I thought it was up. >> No, no, no, no worries. Yeah. It's interesting, right? And so you see this with people, too. >> Yeah. >> Uh so people who love doing what they do. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Look at that. >> Yeah. What's What is that? What's that gra? What's the >> intrinsic motivation? >> What's the x and y? >> Okay. Um obviously the motivation is on I guess this would be the x- axis. >> Yeah. And this is uh over time >> and that's shows and >> this is when the rewards introduced >> right so I what I'm curious about is oh as soon as reward is introduced >> well it looks according to this graph as soon as the rewards introduced I I I find that hard to believe it's so quick >> I I I find that way hard to believe >> what does it say yeah check >> how does it explain the over justification effect is there something there >> the uh read what that says about the overjustice >> so yeah it uh it's the introduction of an incentive ive that has a detrimental effect on an individual's intrinsic motivation to complete a task that they were initially motivated to do alone. >> Yeah. So, so recognizing a kid that likes to draw is different. That'd be like, "Yeah, man. I really I I love these drawings that you make is different than saying every time you draw, I'm going to give you a song." >> Okay. This this is actually really interesting considering we just had a a we just did this with our our leadership team with uh like Okay, another way to say this is like, okay, I've got an employee. this is their job. They've been doing their job and task for the last nine months, those things. And then I reward that job. They didn't do anything else outside of it. And then we give them a raise. Wouldn't that cause the same thing? >> That's interesting cuz I wonder if that would apply because they're already getting paid to do what they do. So, they're not doing it for free. >> So, I wonder if that makes a difference. >> It'd have to equate to their um their result, right? And so this is another say let's use another example. So this is would also imply that I've trained my son to um make his bed before he goes to school every day and he's consistently done it for let's say a year of his life and then all a sudden I decide I'm going to start paying you $5 for for for making >> So here's what it says. The overjustification effect can occur almost immediately often taking effect after just one or two exposures to an expected tangible reward. The decline in intrinsic motivation is triggered when a person's brain reclassifies an enjoyable activity or chore being done strictly for a paycheck or a project. >> Okay. So, okay. This there's >> we have to reframe it. >> Yeah. >> So, where Okay. So, that means that means this, let's use my son bed making analogy I was giving. That would mean that uh he's been making his bed for a year >> on his own. >> On his own. >> Loves doing it. I decide he on on on on you know the the 56th time I start paying him $5. Great job son. And now but I start doing it every time but then I don't do it then it then that's right. >> That's why cuz he expects it now. >> Yeah. >> Okay. But if I kept doing it I'm sure he would keep doing it. >> I don't know cuz what they showed in the kids study is >> well that's Yeah. Because look one or one or two exposures. One or two exposures would be the giving. >> So scroll down Doug more. So this is the this is the experiment that I read. Uh it's uh leopard green nizbits landmark 1973 nursery research school study. Researchers documented this shift within a matter of days. Children who already enjoyed drawing were observed after receiving a tangible expected reward for it. And here is how the timeline conditions unfold. So they saw an instant shift in self-perception. Individuals learn about their own preferences by observing their own actions. If they notice they're receiving an external reward for a task, they rapidly conclude, I must be doing this for the reward rather than I am doing this because I like Is this more about art than it is, you know, about like chores? >> I think if kids >> Well, this is what uh this is what Scott Donald teaches. >> Yeah. Artists, >> he talks about this is why you don't give uh allowance for basic chores in the house. >> He's like that should be that's part of being the unit and the family. You make your bed, you take out the trash. Yes, you do. It's like, >> but then we have other things. >> He organizes them as like jobs essentially. >> Exactly. So, it's like these are chores that you do and you don't get it's part of being the the family. You do. We all do this. But if you want to make money, there's opportunities for you to make money. You can babysit your sister for a weekend. You can go wash and detail the car. You can go, you know, break down the cardboard, whatever. Like he has t and he's like those you you create to as jobs. But >> well, I can I don't know. I guess I could see this from a different perspective of it being like, you know, an athlete and like you're you're you love sports, you love the game, then you don't love the game because it becomes a job. But like the same thing with artistry, like if I'm making music or something, I'm just doing it for that. And then I get paid this exorbitant amount of money for that all of a sudden. Then I'm like, well, now I'm just doing this for somebody to pay me to keep doing this. And then, you know, my my interest is going to fall off quickly with that. But I I guess like it like I don't really see it from that other perspective. If I'm if I'm actually doing hard work, I want to get a reward. >> Yeah. But yeah, I think that's different, right? We're already paying them. They're already working for us. >> Yeah. So I don't know. I guess I'm just trying to understand. >> Yeah, me too. And I'm like trying to use the the example I get cuz I get making a bed would be a chore and would be a thing that you could train to do your kid to do without getting paid and then if all a sudden I decided to pay him, it would he would he would inevitably fall off of doing that. >> Yeah. If he's already doing it on his own. >> So it's intrinsic motivation. So I think it's you know their desire within to want to do something, >> right? And so then maybe he does it but he's now doing it just cuz he wants the money, >> right? So that desire fallen away. Yeah. >> So, I think that's what's happening with >> sports and music and things like that. >> Yeah. Interesting, right? >> I mean, it's interesting and I I mean, it makes me wonder how that does carry over to job and other things like that, too. It's like >> seems a little bit different. >> I mean, kind of, right? But there's a part of me, I mean, even when uh you know, the the example I'm thinking of right now when when we did something like this where we where we just raise up to raise up, I prefer to like >> attach it to something. >> Attach it to something. Yeah. like or give a new goal like hey I want to raise you up but these are the things I'm looking for >> leading up to that point to get there. >> Yeah. versus just like, hey, you've been working for us for a year and doing your job. Here's another x amount of dollars cuz then like what what are you rewarding really by doing that? And you're just like and then they're just literally just doing the same thing to get that and then you then now they'll expect that every year of like oh if I just do the same job I'll >> almost like the incentive version versus like the 10 tenured you know like I expect like just because I've been here that long I get paid more. >> Yeah, that's interesting. >> Yeah. Interesting. So along those same lines like psychology stuff, I'm reading this book uh validation. >> It's called validation and it talks about the power >> of essentially validating people when they're coming to you with something or they have an experience which by the way doesn't mean you agree with them. It's just you're validating their experience. >> The data that's cited in this is pretty remarkable. So when somebody has a difficult situation, stressful situation, [snorts] validating somebody uh essentially validating their experience lowers their fightorflight response. >> Invalidating them triggers it. >> So like your kid comes to you uh like, "Oh my god, I I'm freaking out over this thing. >> It's not that big of a deal." >> Yes. Worst thing. >> Oh, who cares? Don't worry about it. Like get over it type of deal. Triggers worst thing. >> Triggers their fight or flight versus validating their experience. What's funny, what's crazy about I'm reading the book and by the I grew up in a household where we didn't invalidate anything. Everything was invalid. Like everything was like get up, you can do it, whatever. Wipe it off. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um so I grew up that way. But when I trained and coached people, I learned that this was very powerful. Like when I had clients come to me with challenges, the worst possible thing I could do was invalidate. >> Well, I think that I think when you say this, you have to be very clear, too, because I think somebody will interpret validation to being like coddling. And it does look different. We do this with my son. It's just like he he can have a a moment of breakdown and you can validate his feelings, but then also correct his behavior >> and be like, I know I know that that felt like it hurt and it was this, but you're going to be okay. Like this happens when we play rough. You fall down. It was an accident. You're going to be all right. >> Yeah. >> Like you can you can validate their feeling, you know, whatever they're going through and then turn around and coach right afterwards. >> It's like it's like, "Hey, I can see Yeah, I can see why that really bothered you. Because I also sense I also think that that somebody can take the validation thing too far where it's just that's all you do is validate and you don't follow it up with the coaching. It can just be like, >> "Oh, you poor thing. Oh my god, that's oh, I can't believe that." And there's that's it. >> And so then that that then you also create a victim. You create somebody every time something rough happens or anything bad there's like you come running up and you're just validating how they feel all the time. And then we have this society of people that want to be validated. >> So that's the thing. So there's a confusion, right? is that validating isn't uh that you agree that that Yeah, I agree with with with what's I I I agree with you. I agree with your with your the fact that you're so upset that you know uh you're you're you got a an A minus on your test and you're freaking out like you don't have to agree with it but you can say look yeah I could tell you worked really hard you expected an A and so that's really disappointing. >> Yeah. >> And then the conversation right >> but you lower that fight or flight they feel valid and then you can have that conversation. I mean that conversation though has to be equally as important. >> Totally. >> Because otherwise if you just like >> as a parent for sure. >> Yeah. Cuz if you just go and validate feelings all day long about when especially when they're wrong. >> Yeah. Cuz then you kind of reinforce it. >> Yeah. I mean you're if they're acting uh >> but it's different. Validating your kid is very different than like your friend or especially your spouse. >> Yeah. >> You know like the correcting part with the [laughter] work so well. >> Let me tell you, honey. >> Yeah. I can see why you're upset. Let me tell you why you're wrong. Here's why you shouldn't be [laughter] upset. >> That's not going to work. That's not the same thing, dude. That's how that works. Anyway, I'm going to take a laugh. And so, guess what is available uh back available as a peptide that you can now again get >> what was it was off. >> M is available again. For a second there, you couldn't >> couldn't for me. >> You couldn't get it. Uh they had put a pause on it. But Matsi, if you like if you go through back on the menu, >> you go through our partners at mpormones.com, you can get Miy again, which is very exciting because that's one of my favorite favorite >> P. You and Justin both have been on that a long time. >> Oh, it's the best, dude. >> Yeah, you two have always raved about that. Why Why was it off? >> Because the FDA sent letters and scared everybody. >> Was that around the same time as the BPC one? >> That's right. So BPC you couldn't get for a while either. Yeah. >> And now they've kind of made it so that >> so you could get you can now get a prescription again from Matsi. Get it from an FDA regulated compound pharmacy and you get the the real deal. >> So Mi the nickname exercise in a bottle. I know that sounds sensational. >> Uh but essentially uh it really does supercharge the mitochondria. So what people get from it is mostly what they get is energy. >> Yeah. It's energy boost. >> You feel just really good energy all the time. What it's also doing is helping things like burn body fat. So bodybuilders like Matzi for fat loss because of the increased energy production, the increased metabolic rate. Um, in studies with animals, uh, they'll feed them a high calorie diet and they don't gain as much body fat. >> Interesting. >> When they take a matzi increases insulin sensitivity, uh, really good as well. >> Interesting. >> One of my favorite, dude, is one of the few peptides I took. >> I actually haven't taken it. >> It was one of the ones I took where by day three I was like, "Whoa, dude. I feel like >> I feel like it's hit and miss with uh people that I've talked to at least like it's like very awesome for some and then some are like I don't >> I mean I feel like that's almost everything with peptides. >> Depends on the peptide. Uh some people like the SS I think it's SS31. I think that's what it's called. Is that Doug? Look it up. >> Sloop. >> No, no, no. That's totally different. That's a different So I think it's Is it SS31? Put SS31 peptides. See if I got that right cuz I might be wrong here. Yes. So SS31 also targets the mitochondria but works differently. People either respond really well to MOSI or SS31. That's >> okay. So that's the alternative >> cuz I've done SS31 and I've heard people rave about it and I've done it and notice nothing. >> Miy for me. >> I haven't tried that one. >> It's like a light dimmer. Like I turn up the light. >> Yeah. Same. >> Interesting. Is it So is it injectable or is it pill? >> Injectable. >> Daily. >> Yes. >> Oh, it's daily. >> Yeah. That's why that's why [laughter] you >> forget. Yes, dude. >> It's a little tiny. >> It's not. >> That's not what it is. Use this to forget. >> Yeah. It's just the habit of doing a daily thing is like it's that's uh just another thing. >> I know. >> You guys want to hear some cool patents that uh I saw this um this post on these new patents that just got uh submitted that for pretty innovative interesting inventions. I'll read them off to you. Motorola just got a patent for a throat tattoo that works like a microphone. >> [laughter] >> What? >> Yeah. >> A tattoo. How does that work? >> That works like a microphone. I'm not sure. I'm just reading you the headline. >> Is Motorola still a who are they owned by somebody else? Is that like a >> wrote tattoo? >> I realize Motorola is still doing it. >> Check this out. Amazon has has a patent for a flying warehouse that releases delivery drones. It's happening, you guys. >> Oh, I've seen that. I've seen that. >> They'll be in the air. >> Yeah. and you're going to order something and a drone's going to come down and in 10 minutes you're going to get >> flying warehouses >> bro. Imagine that. 15 minutes you buy boom delivered to you. >> We're so close to Wall-E, >> dude. It's going to be >> I feel like that was the beginning before. >> What was they I thought they they've tested this and it and it didn't it didn't go. Why? Why did they >> The drone delivery hasn't really taken off yet, but >> they they've tested it in areas. Yeah, they they've tested it in some areas, but it it it kind of I don't know why it didn't take off. I don't know. But >> are you scared to regulate? Maybe. I don't know. >> Who knows? But uh let me see. Because of FAA regulations, noise pollution, privacy concern concerns. >> Oh, that makes sense. >> So I I I think this is going to be the future. Uh I think it's going to be crazy cuz Amazon really I mean Amazon was crazy, right? You get stuff the next day, which is wild. Like that's crazy for those of us who know what it was like before. [laughter] >> Like I used to buy stuff. >> Oh, you used to the same day, >> bro. You know you do. You know what we're going to have because of this? We're gonna have freaking flying pirates. >> Oh, [laughter] 100%. That's why it won't Justin. That's why it won't That's WHY IT WON'T WORK. >> AND THEN THEY'RE GOING TO STEAL [laughter] HIS PACKAGES. KILL ME. >> YEAH. >> On motorcycle drones. >> Yes, >> bro. 100% that's going to happen. I mean, if you The risk [laughter] the risk of of robbing >> I want to make a movie, dude. The risk of robbing a person is has that has to be a major deterrent in in in comparison to robbing a robot. Like it's not it's a nonhuman a drone flying like it. >> People are going to punk robots like crazy. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Humans. They're going to punk. Well, the only the counterargument to that is I if you would have asked me if we could go back in time and uh you know 40 years or more because it'd be even longer than that. We have about 40 years or more and say one day every day there'd be all kinds of packages dropped off at people's doors and people wouldn't steal them off their doorstep. >> Yeah. >> I wouldn't believe that. >> People don't. >> Oh yeah. I mean, the fact all the time now >> the fact that there's there's you everybody's got a box at their door right now and it doesn't get stolen. So, you know, maybe people won't >> It is crazy. >> There'll be there'll definitely be some pirates originally. >> There'll be [laughter] rampant like pirate activities at least for a while. They're [laughter] on motorcycle drs on their shoulder. >> Dude, >> have you seen all those? I I wonder how many of them are real and how many of them are staged. those viral videos of people that do steal the boxes off the >> Yeah. People put the bait box. >> Yes. And they bait them with >> Well, now with AI, they've just done so many of those where it explodes on. >> Yeah. I don't know if they're real or not. >> Those bring me joy. This is really bad. But I get really happy when I see a thief get blasted with blue spray. My face is like the worst, dude. It's up It's up there. Like what do you It's really annoying. Like really >> lowest common denominator. Yeah. Thing to do. >> It makes it makes me really mad >> cuz Yeah. Anyone? Do >> you guys ever So I the Do you guys remember the first time something really valuable of yours stolen? >> Yeah. [clears throat] What was it? >> Yeah, it's a car. >> Oh, [laughter] >> more than once. >> That's a big one. >> You know what? Hey, what are the odds? I don't think I think most people have never had their car stolen, let alone two cars stolen. >> Yes, two cars stolen. You know, the irony of all that though is >> I the the So, I had I had the the car the Integra and then I had my truck stolen. the car being stolen. The thing that broke my heart more than anything was my thousand CD CD case. >> You know, I had the big four four flipper >> of CDs I've been collecting since I was in high school. >> Gone. >> Gone. That was just like cars replaceable. That collection was not replaceable in my truck cuz I had a DVD player and stuff inside there. I had at that time so you know my annual trip that we go to the lake all the time. Um, we we would make a a short video and of us wakeboarding and jumping and doing all stuff like that, right? >> And uh I had at least 3 years of DVDs. >> Oh, you can't replace that. >> Oh, I can't. And my buddy, we still can't find the original stuff of that. So, it's just like they're gone. And like And those were really special to me. Even more so now that I'm older. Like it was I loved them when we were close to that. Now it's like, man, that was a >> I had the first time I ever experienced it was my bike. I [snorts] I rode my bike to like the local. It was a convenience store. They had a Street Fight or two there. Remember that? And I was playing it. And I look out, check my bike. It's there. Still playing. Still playing. Look out. Bike's gone. Huh? Bike was gone. And I went to my grand uh parents house. >> We went to my grandparents house. My grandfather found out. This is a true story. I'll share it. He passed away so I can share it. And I told my grandfather and he said, "What? Somebody stole you a bike?" I said, "Yeah." He goes, "Come with me." So, I get in the car with him and we're driving around looking for my bike. Here's the scere here's the crazy part. Okay, this is the crazy part. He had his Beretta [laughter] in the car, dude. >> Oh my god. >> And I remember thinking this as a kid. This is a true story. I didn't I never even told my mom. He had his Betta in there and I in my mind I'm like, I'm not going to tell him if I see [laughter] my bike. >> Is he going to shoot like some kid like, "Yay!" >> No way, dude. The kid could ride right in front of me like, "Hey, what's up, S? [laughter] My bike. terrified. >> That was the first time that I old Sicilian, >> you know, you just made [laughter] >> the the the DVDs. Okay, so Katrina told me that we were we were going through I shared with you guys that old picture of Katrina and I when we first got together and because we were going through all these old photos of her and I, one of the other old photos that popped up was the very first kind of thing that we ever did together was I took her snowboarding and I taught her how to snowboard and uh and there's a picture of her and I doing that and she goes, "You remember that day?" And I'm like, "Yeah, I know." I told she's like, "You were so patient this and that." She goes, "Do you remember uh what you did on the drive all the way up to the thing?" And I'm like, "No." She's like, "You you had me watch your wakeboarding videos." >> No, [laughter] you didn't. >> Oh, look what I do right there. >> No, you didn't. No, you didn't. >> An hour of me like doing tricks. >> A whole hour. [laughter] >> She's still She's still stuck with you, dude. >> Wow. >> That's a good woman. >> That was good, bro. It was kind of cool. [laughter] Were >> you turned on the music behind it and everything? Oh yeah, dog. Oh yeah, dude. Busting tricks >> highlight reel. Oh wow, dude. I need Courtney to watch any of my highlights from football or anything. Any old She's tra she was trapped in the truck the whole time. That's why she ain't going nowhere. >> I should have held her hostage. [laughter] >> That's the move. That's the best thing ever. How long were you guys dating at that point? >> Oh, we had just It was the first real like thing we ever did. Um, >> no way, bro. Early on, too. >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm 29. I was 29. She was 30. See, she's smart because she's probably like, "This is ridiculous." [laughter] >> But she's also probably thinking in her head like, "He's really confident. >> This is going to go somewhere." I know. >> Exactly. [laughter] >> This confidence is interesting. We point this in the right direction. We're good. >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm just have to direct this. >> That's awesome. >> When your system that is meant to guide your health falls short, it becomes necessary to take your health into your own hands. Introducing Element. So, Element is an electrolyte powder you add to your water. There's no artificial sweeteners, no sugar, and it's got all the sodium you need for better muscle contractions, better performance to feel better. Here's the deal. A lot of people who work out hard, especially if you're on a low carbohydrate diet or you don't eat processed foods, you need more electrolytes. Maybe you have muscle cramps or you have excess fatigue or headaches. Try Element. It tastes amazing. It's inexpensive. There's no sugar, no sweeteners. It gives you the right amount of electrolytes to fuel you fuel you for your workouts. Go check them out. Go to drinklement.com/mindpump. On that link, you'll get a free sample pack of their most popular drink mix flavors with any purchase. All right, here comes the show. Our first caller is Kayla from New York. >> Hi, Kayla. >> Hi. Wow, this is surreal. [laughter] >> How are you? How can I help you? I'm good. Thank you for having me. Um, well, so after listening to your episode that aired on Monday, I switched things up and decided I should just be straightforward and real. Um, I'm turning 40 in February, and I want next year to be the year that I've looked the best I've ever looked. Uh, yes, I want great mobility, functionality, and strength, but ultimately I want to look amazing, but without doing any harm to my hormones or metabolism. For my background, I spent the last eight years being pregnant, birthing, nursing three babies, uh, just to start pmenopause, a year postpartum after my third, um, to then have nearly a year of almost daily diarrhea, to learn that I had SIBO, I treated the SIBO, started hormone therapy, had a return of the SIBO eight months later, that I need to increase my HRT um, a few months ago, and I also had carpal tunnel surgery six months ago. So, I'm 39 now. I'm a wife and mother to three little girls, 7, five, and three. I want to set set a good example for them and show them how they need to respect their bodies and take care of their bodies. And they already know that we value protein in our house. Um, I used to run to lose weight when I was younger and as a form of punishment therapy. I turned to circuit training to lose weight. That was a bad idea. Um, in my early 20s, the circuit training worked, but it doesn't anymore. Um, first world problems, but life has been a roller coaster the last eight years. My husband and I had a rough patch when I hit 37 and my parameopause came on. Um, thank God I got the HRT because that poor man may have divorced me otherwise. And my girls were kind of on edge because I was just a raging lunatic. So now I've gotten my digestion to a better place. I still have to steer clear of gluten, sugar, and most dairy. But um before all this, I was a selfish person and my husband always spoiled me. And then the ons onslaught of babies and how my body changes and all the things that come with the the entire life change was really hard for me to accept. Um but accepting it now has made me a better mom, wife, and just person in general. Um I've got back to my faith and that's helped me a lot. and also your podcast has really been beneficial. Uh, now that I have things pretty well settled, I'd like to focus on getting some self-esteem back, self-esteem back, and being a bit more selfish for a year. I want to build strength, lean out, and look amazing. But I recognize when it's time to push, and when it's time to slow down. My busy season for work is mid December through March. So, I'd like to do a bulk in the fall months, do like a 15 program and some light walking during my busy season just to maintain cut and increase do um increase some cardio or something to lean out in the spring and burn some fat and then maintain again through the summer months if that sounds doable. Um, my question is, what programs do you think would benefit me the most during these seasons for the upcoming year? Good question and I'm glad you called in. Sounds like you've been through the ringer. >> Well, I mean, what mom hasn't, but you know, such is life? But yeah, it took me a little while to accept all the chaos that kids bring. >> Yeah. Although it may seem common to you, it's very difficult. And I've worked with a lot of women through uh having children, through the hormone changes and all that can happen and uh oftentimes contributing to poor gut issues. And so, you just had all of it all at once. Is it are the gut issues pretty much rectified? >> It's not perfect. Um I unfortunately fell in love with sourdough baking. [laughter] That's good. >> So that doesn't help me. Um but >> okay. >> As long as I steer clear of that then yeah. >> Okay. Okay. So we got we got to make sure we maintain that. So maintain good gut health because that'll throw everything off. Is your HRT stable now? Have you found the right dose and it's right and everything feels good now? Yeah. Yeah. When I started it last June, um I was doing a bulk that fall and my metabolism shot through the roof. Um and I talked to my um OB/GYN and she said that it could be that I'm metabolizing things much quicker. So, we needed to up my levels a little bit, but I'm pretty good now. >> Okay. And you're on uh what's part of your HRT? Is it is it is it the whole gamut? Are you progesterone, thyroid, testosterone? >> No thyroid. Um, progesterone, estrogen, and testosterone. >> Okay, good. >> No thyroid, huh? >> No. So, okay, good. Um, so a good what you want to focus on right now is traditional strength training, and you want to get stronger. That's going to be the best thing for uh setting yourself up uh for the cut later on. >> Um, are you tracking your calories? Do you have an idea where where you're at with that? >> Yeah, my maintenance is around 2,000. Um, when I was doing a bulk last fall, I could get up to 27 to 30 3,000 calories. Um, and I'm not going to lie, it was hard to cut from that because I love food. >> Yeah. >> Um, it's kind of my comfort zone. Um, and plus the sourdough, you know, just throws that out the window. >> And when you got up to that, were you gaining a bunch of weight or were you building muscle and maintaining? No, I really only over the last year I've really only fluctuated. Um, when I was lean in the summer, I was like 125 and when I was bulking at my weight, my highest, I was 135. So, >> Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. >> I oscillate between that. >> No, no, no. That's phenomenal. Um, because you're This is perfect. I mean, you would be somebody that I would really look for a body comp. >> Yeah. >> You know, so I would put you in a reverse diet. I wouldn't have you climb as high as you did last time and then kind of stay, you know, if you're at 2,000ish right now, I'd put you, you know, 24 25 and just get strong. And what you'll see over time is this nice body composition change that wouldn't require and and you're what are you sitting at right now? Uh body weight, are you are you around the 135 or >> um like 130? >> Yeah. I mean, if you just [laughter] did that, you're at a good weight. >> You would be good and you would just see yourself kind of lean out as your body sculpted and in shape, you know. Kayla, I got to tell you, with everything that you're doing, you're a perfect candidate for coaching. To have somebody coach you through the process would be perfect because you've got all the other stuff and and look, and maybe correct me if I'm wrong, managing more things, uh, is a lot. You've got kids, you've got a looks like you got a job, >> you've done all the, you know, managing of the SIBO and the HRT. Um, I mean it it it would be a it would it would probably benefit you to just offset that and have someone kind of walk you through the process and meet with you on a semi-regular basis with nutrition and exercise programming. I don't think you need anything special. I think you're in a in a great place. Uh I mean a program like MAPS Anabolic or Muscle Mommy, you know, 2400 calories, I think you get great results. But what a coach is going to do is walk you through the kind of reverse diet process. maybe throw in some mini cuts, modify the program so that it's, you know, instead of MAPS muscle mommy, it's a maps Kayla, and then just kind of move you through this, you know, maybe six to nine month process where at the end of it, you're like, man, I'm everything's great and it feels good and my body's working the way I want it to. >> Yeah. Okay. Um, I don't know about the cost of a coach at the moment, but that's something I can talk to my husband about. So, >> Okay. But that you'd be perfect for that. But I think uh how many days a week are you able to work out in the gym? >> Well, I've been what I'm what I call lazy exercising at the moment. Um I pretty much do a 15. Some days I'll double up so that I can have a day off or whatever. Um but >> I like that. >> Uh I work out like I have a home gym. Um so I'll go in the basement and I'll do a couple lifts a day. Um almost five days a week. >> Oh, that's fun. >> I like that. >> Yeah. How many steps are you taking on a daily basis? Um, my average for June was 14,000. >> Oh, wow. >> Kayla, you're kicking butt. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Honestly, I don't do anything too aggressive. >> Yeah. >> With the cut. I think if you stay the course, especially now the HRT uh dialed in, >> what you're going to see over the next 6 months to a year is this really nice consistent body composition change. >> The the mistake you can make, Kayla, is to try to force it. >> Yeah. >> Is to try to push too hard in any direction. >> Yeah. I think part of that is what kicked off the SIBO the first time. Um, you know, like the 3,000 calories I was impressed with even even myself that I could m maintain that. Um, but I think it was too much for my digestion to handle plus the stress of my busy season. >> Yeah. >> If you want to try any supplements for gut health, Organifi has a new parasite cleanse that I really really like um and it seems to be benefiting a lot of listeners who have uh kind of reoccurring SIBO uh issues. So >> yeah, >> it's natural. It's an easy supplement. You would do like two cycles of it. But as far as a workout, so so here's here's the deal. And this is the mentality. It's like, man, I dealt with all this stuff. >> I'm coming out of this cloud that lasted years, and I think my body's starting to work the way I wanted to. Now I'm going to slam on the gas. This is a mistake. >> I am. >> You You don't want to do that. You're You're going to progress just fine. Y >> as long as you're consistent in what you're doing at 14,000 steps a day, you know, bring your calories up to 24 2500 consistently, hit your protein targets, >> be consistent with a mass 15 protocol, 15 muscle mommy, 15 powerlift, 15 symmetry, either one of those. Um, and just stay consistent. We're going to see, like I said, over 6 months to the next year is just this nice change in body composition, this nice consistent change. and and to address kind of your thought process cuz you were kind of asking about the whole year during certain seasons, this program then that program you a 15 protocol year round is great for you. The thing that changes is your mindset and intensity in the lifting. >> So when you're in your when you're in your busy season and maybe you're not getting as much rest or you're not as dialed on the diet, back off on the intensity. Go through the motions. You go to your workout, you just do your workout, you get your steps, you walk the when you're in your less busy season and you're more rested, you're more fed, you feel really good, push the intensity. This is where I'm trying to get stronger, so I'm going to add more weight to the bar. So that's what it looks like. It looks less like a radical change in the programming that you need to switch up or you need to all a sudden start doing all kinds of cardio. No, what it looks like is when you're really really busy and you got a lot on your plate, your workouts are almost therapeutic. You're going through the motions. you're you're doing your lifts, but you're not really pushing it. When you are feeling great and you're well rested and that might look like week to week, uh it could look like month to month, like depending on what your, >> you know, what your seasons look like, but that's how you gauge what you should be doing is like the 15 protocol is perfect for you, but you're you're manipulating the intensity based off of what's going on your outside. The only way you can mess this up, just based off everything you're saying, Kayla, and where you're at, the only way you can mess this up is if you try to rush it. >> Yeah, >> that's it. I'm not worried about you not working out. Sounds like you're pretty consistent. >> You're active daily. Your metabolism is not in a bad place. Hormones are now where they need to be. >> The the only way that Kayla can mess this up is if you try to rush it. So, that's the issue. Don't If you don't rush it, you'll get great results. they'll be nice and consistent. If you think you can get results faster by rushing it, you'll be wrong and that'll move you. >> The only reason I mentioned cardio um in like the springtime to really like lean out was um because a little while ago you guys were talking about your hit program and I thought, well, maybe that could kind of jumpstart my cut phase or whatever, but maybe that's just too much for me in this phase. >> Well, you're also you're at such a great place. I wouldn't need to cut you. And and I feel this has been a common theme when I've been talking to a lot of our female clients and callers is build into the body you want. Like you don't [clears throat] need to you don't need to cut into the body you want. You're at a good weight for your side. How tall are you? >> You're you're at a good weight. >> I'm only 5'3 and that's rounding up. >> No, you're fine. >> Yeah, that's a good You're >> Oh my god. You 100 Yeah. 130 lbs. Uh you you stay on this path. Your body fat will fall in the low 20s. >> Yep. >> You'll have sculpt, shape, muscle, metabolism. Yeah. >> You're going to be great. >> Yeah. You don't need to get smaller. You'll get you'll get tighter and denser. So your your weight will stay the same or maybe go up a little tiny bit, but you'll have the physique you want. And that's with the mentality of building into the body, not kind of burning and leaning out into the body. >> If you do anything like HIT or cardio or anything like that, that would be for endurance. I I would if you're training for an athletic endeavor, you're like, man, I want some stamina so I can go running with my kids or go, that's fine. Go for it. But if you're looking at body composition change and aesthetics, stay the course. >> Yeah. >> Just stay the course. This is perfect. >> Yep. >> Okay. Awesome. >> Yeah. Do you which which MAPS 15 programs you have and because I'd like to send you another one. >> I have Muscle Mommy and Symmetry. >> Okay. I'll send you Powerlift 15. >> Oh, that sounds awesome. I've heard you guys talking about that lately. >> Yeah. Yep. You're good. You'll love it. >> Yeah. Cycle through those, Kayla. >> That's it. >> Perfect. Thank you guys so much. I really appreciate it. >> Yeah. Thanks for calling in. Thanks. >> Byebye. We we we need to have I mean she just brought she brought up parmenopause and how how hard that was uh for her. >> Uh it is very hard for a lot of women and it's very hard for a lot of uh marriages when when that starts to happen. >> Yeah. >> And without education it can feel like what the heck is going on? >> Yeah. >> Um but it's uh hormone changes are no joke. They are no joke. They will affect you. Um and without the education around it and what's going on, it could feel like you're losing your mind or like what the heck's going on. Oh, I I think I've mentioned this once before that um you know, Katrina's mom life coaches a lot of people and a lot of people that are in their late 30s, 40s and above. And almost always um she's when she's dealing with when people have got like a lot of marital stuff, a lot of >> hormones. It's like the first thing she sends him like you need to go like go do that first and then we can work on all the other stuff because if that's out of whack and we're trying to fix all this like >> and she says it's always life-changing for people. Our next caller is Robert from South Carolina. >> What's up, Robert? What's up, Robert? >> Gentlemen. Oh my goodness. Um, I'm gonna try and stay cool here. Uh, a little fanboyish right now, but I'm going to try and stay focused. >> Yeah, man. >> Um, uh, just thank you so much for um what y'all do and uh, thank your team for letting me be on here. Um, it's a truly an honor to be able to speak to you guys. Um, you've been an impact on my life for a decade at least. >> Wow. Um, I heard you first on the Ben Greenfield podcast a long time ago. >> Long time ago. >> Wow. >> Yeah. >> Yeah, dude. >> It's been a It's been a cool journey. >> Thank you. How can I help you, dude? >> Uh, so I don't know how far back I need to go in relevancy for for a little context, but um I've taken up the bold challenge of trying to train my wife. >> I got my um uh I know Adam, you can relate here. Uh, but I I just got my um NASM and um I talked to Ann on the school um and she uh >> she was amazing. Um I talked to her like 15 minutes and I signed up for the for y'all's academy uh academy course. >> All right, dude. Awesome. >> It's been Thank you. It's been It's been incredible. >> Cool. >> A lot a lot of stuff in there that I don't know how I would have approached it. So, it's good to have a guide. Um, and a lot of stuff that challenges me as a person. Uh, cuz I'm not the salesy person as you mentioned all that like a lot in that course. Like these are things that typically trainers struggle with and I am right there. >> Yeah. Right on. >> Uh, so I appreciate that. >> Good stuff. >> Um, so uh, but my current call again trying to stay focused. My I'm trying to figure out how to best support my wife. Um, we actually met at a Planet Fitness at 5:00 a.m. um, like five or six years ago. So fitness is kind of in in our relationship from the beginning. Um but she uh she has been dealing with and we found this through functional some functional uh medicine stuff testing. Um her cortisol levels are just tanked out. She's got like the midday crashes. She's got the migraines that come on like a lot. Um and I had tried to start her off with like map starter. She did great. She was fine with that. try to do the uh muscle mommy with her. It was kind of she she likes to do something every day, so I was like, "All right, let's try the mass 15. Let's try and see what we do there." Um but she still gets those like hard crashes midday. >> Uh so >> um I used your little Dexa AI to see get y'all's advice on um on how to approach that scenario. >> And it's like scale way back, you know, because you don't want to I guess push weight on her so much. She don't want her to stress her uh physiological system there and burn her out. Um so I didn't know whether I should be going all the way back to like let's just do movement based stuff like prime Matt's prime level like that kind of thing or um if I can keep pushing her weight wise. She really wants to grow in strength. Uh so I kind of struggle with how to balance that >> starter. Good question. Robert, what's the uh protocol that the functional medicine practitioner has her on right now? >> Uh, well, she's uh using a lot of supplement based stuff. Um, I don't know if you know like what ADR is and um there's another it's it's like a it's like a mixture of different um arurvedic stuff uh >> just to kind of give her uh adrenal glands on support. >> Okay. >> Especially in the morning. Um, but nothing. She hasn't really addressed the lifestyle part of it, which again is like a lot of keep stress low. We have a five and two-year-old, by the way. >> Another thing that you and I relate on. Y'all's story about your kids is excellent, but um yeah, so that that's hard to take that stress out of it, you know. Uh so that does that answer your question at all? I don't know if I did. >> And so I'm sleep is there sleep okay? >> Sleep routines. um sleep at we we try to be in bed by like 8:00. It usually ends up being 9:30. Uh but it's pretty solid. She has various nights of bad sleep. Um but she mostly gets some pretty solid sleep in there. >> Okay. Cuz that that would be number one. Uh would be sleep. Uh diet would be number two. Um I would I would I'm assuming she's avoiding caffeine and alcohol >> during this. >> Yeah. Hasn't hasn't hasn't done those in a long time. Okay. >> Um, I push her a lot on creatine. I don't know if that's helpful. >> No, that'd be very helpful. >> Okay. >> Yeah. No, no creatine would be very helpful. Um, as far as extra, so here's the deal. If she's still dealing with HPA access dysfunction, right, if her cortisol is still bottomed out, um, you have to be very careful with added uh, stress. >> Would you go like starter? >> Yeah. I mean, starter might be okay. Um, even MAPS 15 would be okay, but it'd be low intensity. >> Yeah, >> it'd be low intensity. [clears throat] >> Yeah. And and the idea is uh a nice starter. >> Yeah. I'm going to get your I'm going to have you perfect your technique. >> And your intensity is 60%. >> Uh and if she gets stronger, great. If she doesn't, that's fine, too. Uh we're just if she doesn't get the the the hormone um if she doesn't get the cortisol back to normal, if she doesn't get her hypothalamus or pituitary and her adrenals, uh you know, back to normal, uh nothing's nothing's going to happen with the strength training. So that's the number one priority. number one priority is that whatever gets that better is what we're going to focus on. And so the strength training is really this is how I would do it. >> What makes her feel better throughout the day and so it's probably going to look like is low intensity perfect the technique doesn't even feel like a workout and she's going to do a little every day and that's it >> cuz what'll happen is you push it a little bit she gets she's going to get more energy crashes >> bands. Yeah. >> Mhm. >> And so that's it. And it might take, you know, HP accessis dysfunction can sometimes take a while, can sometimes take 90 days or longer to get things moving back um to where they should. How, if you don't mind me asking, how old is your wife? >> Uh gosh, 38. >> Okay. >> I'm 40. I'm turning 40, so she's 38. >> Yeah, you better get that right. >> Yeah, I know. [laughter] No, >> I know. I know. I know. We'll edit >> like when is this coming out? >> We'll edit Yeah, we'll edit that for you, Robert. Yeah. [laughter] >> Has she had other hormones? I'm sure I'm assuming she's had her thyroid checked and progesterone, estrogen, all that. She did a Dutch test. >> Uh >> yeah, she had that she had the like a Dutch test. Uh thyroid seems to be doing well. Um and uh the hormones are crazy off. Um and we think that's from the adrenals being off. Um >> could be >> a lot of that hooks together. >> How long has she been doing the protocol with the functional medicine practitioner? >> About a month. We actually checked in with him earlier today. Okay. Um, so >> you know, I'd give it another I'd give it another month or two and see what happens. She's also 38 for some progress and, uh, par menopause um, and having two little kids can kind of start, you know, causing some issues. >> So, you know, I would say if after a month or two you're not seeing huge improvements, uh, then hormone replacement therapy would be another option. Uh, you know, and and you could send the blood work to, uh, npormones.com, the doctors there, and have them look. Um, but of you know, of course, let's see if things balance out without having to do that. >> Do you know if they're in South I've been actually looking for them from me personally. Do you know if they're in South Carolina yet? I think they were one of the states. I believe so. >> South Carolina was one of the ones they weren't. They were I know he was working on it though. So, >> they just got into Hawaii. >> Yeah, they're working on it. They might be now. >> Yeah, I would check check with them and see if they are. Yeah. >> Um, and see if they're in there now. But that would be the other thing I just because of her age, right? cuz she's at the right, you know, mid to late 30s, parameopause starts to kick in. Um, and that can make this >> Do you uh do >> you guys happen to use like a Aura ring or anything that uh measures and track sleep? >> Uh, we don't have an Aura ring. She has uh a very kind of basic fitness watch, but it does track sleep. Um, >> so I didn't even think I didn't even think to look at that. >> I I would invest in an Aura ring. Um just because just because sleep is such a priority of all the things that we're talking about, it's probably the top of all the things that we're talking about right now. >> And even though you're saying like she gets pretty good sleep, um measuring it and then also playing with habits and routines to improve it >> even. Yeah. >> Yeah. So that you're like, "Hey, I noticed that when we have that chamomile tea and we do this and do that, you get these 80 plus scores and when we don't, you get SE." So you have a measurable thing when you play with different things to improve sleep, you know, that you can start to improve the habits that encourage, you know, better and better sleep scores. I think that can be extremely valuable. Um, it's how I use mine. I mean, I use mostly mine for steps and then my sleep. That's the only two things I use it for. I don't care about the calorie [ __ ] I just want to know, am I hitting my daily activity? And then I want to see my sleep score because I'm constantly doing different things and I'm like, "Oh man, when I do that one thing, if I eat after eight, boy, does that really impact me negatively and stuff." You know, some things are obvious, some things are not obvious. Uh, everyone's unique and different. Um, certain things hurt. Some people can uh have a drink before bed and be fine. Other people have a drink before bed and it'll screw them up. So having something like that that's a a measurable thing that she can pay attention to, I think is worth the investment. >> Yeah. But as far as >> Yeah. Do you do you find Go ahead. >> I was going to say as far as a workout is concerned, Mass 15 or starter would be that would be where she would live. >> Yeah. >> For a while. And then has she started the creatine? >> Yeah. Yeah. I I I'm the one who dumps it in [clears throat] her drink in the morning. And the other thing that the Temple We got the Temple electrolytes. >> Um and then I I sneak in and dump the creatine in. >> Good. Uh when she's not looking. >> Yeah. I would go five grams three times a day. So breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I'd have her try 15 grams a day to see if that makes a difference with her energy. >> [snorts] >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Okay. Wow. Okay. Yeah. I only did five in the morning. So, adding the extra because I I do remember you talking about the test where the 15 actually is >> that's where that's where the cognitive benefits kick in. >> Yeah. That's for the cognitive benefits and if she's operating at a deficit stomach can handle it. >> Yeah. Yeah. You don't you don't want to take all 15 at once. That's what Justin's saying because that can cause gastro issues. >> You know, breakfast, lunch, and dinner, >> five grams. Uh and within a week, if it's if it's something that'll help her, you'll know. She'll know. she'll be like, "Oh my god, I feel good." Um, and and that's pretty much it. But the workout is like, "Let's perfect the technique. That's it for now. We're just going to practice the technique and that's it." >> Which is something I I as a aspiring trainer, I've learned that I I am way deficient in like technique. I've gone back now through the videos y'all put it up. Thank you. Of like the cues y'all use like push the door close with your butt, like the, you know, let the weights slide up crushing. those kind of things like, "Oh, okay. That's how I can get her to not just, you know, feel it in your back. What does that mean?" >> Yeah, exactly. >> So, um, so, uh, that's been helpful. >> Yeah. >> Um, cool. Okay. >> Do you have both of those programs? Do you have I know you have Starter. Do you have 15? >> I do. I do. That's actually what I use. >> Oh, good. >> Um, I I love that program. It's It's so nice to be able to do something every day and not feel like I'm overdoing it or underdoing it. So, it's been really nice. And I can do it in my garage, so that helps. >> Yeah. Perfect. Right on. That's it, my friend. >> All right. >> Keep us. >> Can I Can I say >> Yeah. Go ahead. >> One thing just one thing. >> Yeah. >> Before I go, um I uh I've been playing uh s I don't know. It was like a year two years ago, I guess, now when you went to a Brandon Lake concert. >> Yeah. >> Um I've been playing that all around here in Charleston because I play at one of the uh satellite campuses where Brandon Lake started from. >> Oh, wow. and your your description of uh the I it's something different. It's not like the like the the crowd effect. There's something different. I'm like, "Yes, yes, yes. Somebody knows what I'm talking about." So, um it's it's been really great. I wish I had your speaking ability of sharing your testimony. Um but what what a gift. So, it's been really cool. >> Yeah. Appreciate it, man. Thanks, dude. >> Uh but thank you again for having me on. That was incredible advice. Thank you. >> You got it, brother. Yeah. Let us know what happens. Okay. >> Yeah. I will. Thank you. >> Robert, take it easy. >> All right. >> All right. See you. >> You know how crappy that is when your cortisol is flat. >> Well, that's why I mentioned the sleep becomes the number one priority. I wouldn't she think almost certain she'd go HRT route, right? >> It sucked because of her age. Uh but you know, back in the day when I used to work uh when I had my studio, I had a a woman in there that was really good. She did hormone testing, all that stuff. And they she did not do HRT. She was not a doctor in that sense. and she had a lot of success with working with clients with HPA access dysfunction. >> The reason why it sucks so bad is it can take a while. Could take three months, sometimes six months >> and it sucks you feel like you're doing nothing. It's like man you're telling me to like rest and like walk and >> you know I'm doing one exercise like it suck but it can take a while and it's and it feels like crap bro. It feels like you're dead >> like no cortisol is dead. No energy all day long. >> Our next is caller is Aiden from Kansas. Hey dude, welcome back. >> How you doing, Aiden? What's happening? >> Hey, good. How you guys doing? >> Good. >> Good man. So, give us an update. If last time we talked, I believed you had like a you had an asymmetry going on, uh, some weakness on one side after an injury, trying to balance it back out. >> Yeah. Um, so, you know, we, um, ran through a bunch of different ideas on what it could be, and we really weren't sure for a while. So, I just said, "Screw it." I got the MRI. Um, so I'll read my, uh, update for you guys. So, I did run map symmetry you guys sent over. That was great. I do feel like that helped out. Helped kind of correct my form a little bit too. Uh because I was having some issues cor like uh with the delt wanting to take over a little bit and just not getting like full activation of the chest. Um after our last call, I got an MRI. Um the big finding was I do have uh so I have some pretty bad stenosis in the C6 C7 vertebrae. Uh so they said it's uh actually caused by a little bit of bone bone spurring going on. Um and so the only real solution is uh just PT. Um maybe looking into some other ways to you know get the inflammation down a little bit. Um surgery. I definitely I don't want to do that if I don't have to do that. Um I I don't know. I still think there had to be some kind of postviral component that kind of caused all of this cuz >> the timing was crazy. like pretty much started right after I was, you know, dead ill for about 5 weeks. Um, I think over the past, you know, few weeks though, it seems like things have kind of calmed down a little bit. So, I'm not getting as many, you know, zaps, tingles, you know, that weirdness going on. Um, my biggest questions are just kind of, you know, where to go from here. Uh, because I feel pretty good. I want to, you know, progress towards getting back to, um, you know, heavy lifting. I kind of I miss being able to, you know, be intense with exercise. because I feel like it's kind of it was an outlet for me, especially, you know, like heavy lifting, deadlift, squat, bench, all that stuff. Um, and I just have been avoiding it for so long. I want to kind of figure out what my path is to get back to it. >> Yeah, man. So, um, uh, actually not bad news because I remember you had mono if I'm not if I recall. Okay. >> And we were a little worried that there might be something going on, uh, that it was connected to it. Um, do you know how bad the stenosis was? Uh they said moderate to severe, but like I said, I'm not really having uh severe symptoms or anything right now. >> I would stay let's stay in symmetry. I don't think we should go heavy just yet. If you're still feeling the zaps and the tingles here and there, >> um are you on uh I'm going to recommend a supplement for you for inflammation. Uh that could help if the inflam if bringing inflammation down helps, then the supplement I'm going to recommend should make a difference. >> Uh but I want to make sure you're not on any blood thinners or any medications that uh that Okay. So bromelain cheap supplement >> take it on an empty stomach uh two or three times a day. Don't take it with food otherwise it just is an enzyme to break down food. So take it you know first thing in the morning uh you know 30 minutes to an hour before you eat. Take it in between you know breakfast and lunch again in between lunch and dinner. >> Um and after a week or two see if it makes a difference with the inflammation. Stay in symmetry. I would stay in symmetry um until you're like, man, I think feel like everything's okay, then move to the heavy lifting. >> Uh because if the stenosis is indeed the issue, >> what we don't want to do uh is cause that to flare back up. >> I I I [clears throat] have a recommendation for you too, just just because I've been kind of going through similar type of stuff uh inflammation related and and uh myself personally and how I feel currently right now based off what I just did. um you know going on a kind of a low calorie cut for a little bit and and just kind of leaning out and stay low for a little bit and see how much that just brings down systemic inflammation in your body and then seeing how good you feel when you go lift uh in that state. Now, here's the drawback of that. I'm I'm nowhere [clears throat] near as strong on my squats and deadlifts uh in this calorie deficit and down 10 lbs than thicker fed me is. But I feel way better in my lifts. And obviously that means more to me than you know hitting some PR or whatever like that. I mean I feel strong. I feel good even though I don't feel I feel strong for right now and not relative to what I've been. And so that's the the hard part is a guy that's lifted heavy weight before is doing what I'm doing is like I can't focus on what I've done before. I just have to go off of how I feel now. But I can't tell you how good I feel right now um from kind of going on that. And so maybe consider that for a few weeks and just to play and see how just leaning out and being low calorie for a while to just kind of bring the entire inflammation down in your body if you are anything like me where you just kind of might have this kind of mild low level systemic inflammation always going on and bringing that down just makes you feel way better. Um, okay. That's been my personal experience right now and and uh notice that. But again, the tough part for someone like you is the same thing for me, >> which is, you know, like putting on kind of [ __ ] weight for me on the on the squat like messes with my head psychologically, but I feel really good when I'm moving the weight, you know? >> Right. Okay. >> So, >> yeah. No, I can give that a shot. >> Cool. Um, what would you say like what would be a good metric to kind of know like when you think like when would everything be good enough to go back to trying to push it a little bit like how long would you say to give that? >> It would all be based on your symptoms. So, no more tingles, zaps, everything feels balanced. I think I'm I think I'm good. I don't I'm not having any of those symptoms anymore. Then you can start uh playing with, you know, challenging the weight with the bilateral exercises. But I would wait because if there's still some impingement going on, however minor, >> pushing the weight heavy, especially with things like squats, uh, you know, the C6 >> C7, I mean, you could potentially cause it to go backwards again. >> Um, so that that would pretty that that's basically it. It's like when you feel like and it's it sounds like you're coming out. Sounds like it's already reducing >> so you're already on the right path, >> right? Okay. Um, yeah. No, that sounds good. um just [clears throat] have kind of just been confused on where to go from here. Um had so many different, you know, um theories on what could possibly be going on. So I'm kind of glad to finally have some >> but bromelain >> concrete evidence. >> Yeah. Do the bromelain. Uh like I said, two or three times a day on an empty stomach within a week you should notice just reduced inflammation. It's actually quite effective. >> Okay. Yeah. No, I can definitely give that stuff a shot. >> You got it, man. Thanks for calling in, dude. >> All right. Yeah, I appreciate it, guys. Thank you so much. >> You guys remember his call? >> Yeah. >> First time. Yeah, cuz we weren't sure what it was after the mono. >> Yeah, here's the thing with stenosis. Uh, it's not uncommon. >> No, I've had clients go completely This is why I brought up the the systemic inflammation thing because I think I notice a big difference with clients that when they're inflamed, they're like that versus when that's all tamped down, then it's not bothering them very much. Soon as they get a little inflamed from either stress, overeating, things like that, then it all kicks up. Yeah. >> So, physical therapy, posture, movement stuff, of course, symmetry type things, that's all going to make it better. And then keeping inflammation down I think will will help. >> And I still I still I still veer towards the you know the viral uh impact because it happened after he had this really really bad illness. >> Yeah. >> With mono which can influ it can affect the nervous system. Uh it's but he's getting better which is good. Just takes a little time. >> Our next caller is Clark from Oklahoma. >> How's it going Clark? >> How you doing Clark? >> What's happening >> guys? How's it going? >> Good. >> Good. How can we help you? >> Uh thanks for taking my call today. I really appreciate it. This is pretty neat. Um, I sent you guys a novel in my email. So, I'm going to sum it up a little bit and give you guys just the details. Um, so I'm I'm a pretty average guy here. I'm 61, 240, 32 years old. Um, I'm a landscape architect and pool builder out here and uh I'm in the field quite a bit. My average step count on a on a daily basis is about 9,000. Um, [snorts] and uh pretty I'm out probably 12 15 hours a day. But um a little bit of background, I lost 135 pounds when I was a 17-year-old. I did that in about six months, uh by doing a lot of cardio, um in the HIT program, Insanity. I don't know if you remember that one, but of course we do. [laughter] >> Yeah. Um I was doing like 45 minutes on the elliptical and uh 3 or four miles walking 7 to 10 miles riding a bike. Um and then going home and doing that and it was uh yeah, it was a lot. So, um, I was prioritizing protein, but at the end of the day, I lost a lot of muscle, a lot of lot of fat, and, um, I felt really good, but realized I'd done it wrong and just kind of hung on, uh, to that weight as best I could by just staying in a deficit as much as I could. Um, but then, uh, when I got to 2022, you know, throughout the years, I I lost 40 plus pounds on on five different occasions, and at this particular moment, I'm looking at that sixth time. And um but when I was in 2022, I got serious about lifting weights. Um got on a SARM stack and then I had a buddy that uh convinced me to start testosterone and uh eventually a little bit of NPP there and uh yeah, just kind of felt like a [ __ ] for doing that. Uh didn't like how it made me feel and um so I stopped doing that. And now at this particular moment, I'm out of the relationship I was when I was doing all that and um haven't been in the gym. Uh my living circumstances are a little unorthodox and um just kind of lost on what to do at this point um with working so much and um uh yeah, things have changed from those macros that I sent you. Right now I'm kind of at I'm about 2,600 calories a day. Uh 220 g of protein, 181 gram of carbs, and about 80 g of fat. I do take uh 10 to 15 milligrams creatine, 1,200 milligrams fish oil. uh 2000 I used V vitamin D that's about all I can really keep up with alongside multivitamin. Uh but yeah, I'm just kind of at a loss. My main question was um is maps 15 my answer with a reverse diet or what do y'all think? >> I do like that. >> Yeah, dude. I do like that. >> Are you doing a lot of other things pretty well right now? >> Yeah. Let me back I'm going to back you up a [clears throat] little bit. Well, first I want to ask you, so how long were you on the uh the peed cycle? How long did you do testosterone and MPPP for? So testosterone about two years. MPPP was only about two months and I was only doing 10 milligrams a week on that. >> Okay. Did you have you had your testosterone levels checked recently just to see if you had any any long-term effects? >> So I'm actually waiting on uh Vabella to get back to me. We did a draw two weeks ago. So I'm waiting on my results and a protocol to >> Okay, good. Okay, good. You got that covered then? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Cuz sometimes that can affect Not all usually it doesn't, but um but sometimes it can affect testosterone levels a little later. >> So I'd want to see what that looks like. So cool. So, you're already on that. So, I want to ask you what what what was it about cuz you've lost weight and gained it back, you said like four or five times. >> Mhm. [clears throat] >> What happens when you gain it back? Are you at a point where you're like, I'm done with this. This is too much. Is it just uh you know, I'm tired of >> Go ahead. >> I think I just kind of fall off. Uh like discipline is not the issue. I can get pretty locked in and and stay on. Uh, but I things just seem to change so often that I'm I'm just having a hard time keeping up with that and sticking to whatever protocol I was on at that time. >> You seem very all or nothing. >> Yeah, that's what I was going to say. >> You seem very dialed. You seem like the person who's like dialed, doing all the things, taking the supplements, training hard, and then you swing the other way pretty hard. >> Yeah. trying to and at this point at 32 I'm trying to get rid of that all in or all out mentality and just try to have something that's more manageable honestly. >> That's why I like the 15 recommendations. >> The way to fix that is not to look at the out side of it. So typically what happens when people do [clears throat] that which is real common dude this is like this like most people uh when they go through the cycle is they focus on the why they stopped and they're like man I got to just if I could just not do the thing where I jump off the wagon I'm good. But what they don't realize is the allin is what causes the all out. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, so, so that's the beginning of this. The beginning of the the beginning of getting you not to to to to stop the allout part is to solve the all-in part. >> And so the all-in part has got to look like something that's very sustainable long-term. I'm not rushing things. You know, I'm just a guy that works out. I'm just a guy that eats healthy and whatever happens happens. Kind of the attitude uh that you got to have with both on the both on the lifting part and the nutritional level. So I like whenever whenever um you know I'm like not my ideal eating and I've allowed drinks and ice cream to come in which I allow those to eb and flow in my diet and I know that >> I don't go anymore from like the guy who was having you know handful of whiskey glasses and scoops of ice cream through the week to all a sudden like dialed weighing my food measuring every it's like I'm just going to stop the whiskey drinking. You know what I'm saying? And it's like, no, I'm only going to let myself have ice cream once every couple weeks. It's like just instead of going one hard swing the other way, like take assess your your eating habit. You're good on protein, which is that's the main thing we always focus on. Try your best to always eat whole foods. You probably have a couple offenders in there like everybody does that you have either a sweet tooth or you like the whatever the stuff, whatever it is, right? And and and and make a commitment to less of this or no more of that. But don't do it all right away because you're all said motivated right now. And just stack on that and and like, oh man, [clears throat] I haven't had a I haven't had a drink in months now. Okay, cool. That's no longer part of my life. Now, let's try the next level. I'm going to get better about doing this thing, right? Like do that both with the way you train and the way you eat. And that will really help with the real hard swings on and off. >> Yeah. Now, Clark, because of your activity, uh because you're pretty active with your job, >> uh and the [clears throat] history with all um you know, I definitely would like to reverse diet you with strength training, >> uh but I know because of your past, you're probably apprehensive, uh because you've been overweight in the past, so and that can be a real [clears throat] fear. Is that resonating? Do you feel a little bit like, oh man, if I reverse, I'm a little worried. Yeah, a lot of that um hesitation and a lot of the all-in motivation is just from having severe body dysmorphia. I mean, I grew up a big kid. I've always had high endurance, high stamina. I've been landscaping since I was 10. Um so, it's just yeah, that that's the hindrance there is just wanting to feel good and look good and going all in and then getting burnt out or just kind of falling off. Okay. >> With uh too many changes. And to uh to your point, Adam, I I just I gave up um drinking pretty recently, probably within the last month or so, and THC as well. >> Good for you. >> Um appreciate that. Um I also bought a cafe, so I'm kind of I'm around sweet tooth food all the time and and good drinks and uh so that's that reates. That's been fun to manage. [laughter] Yeah. >> Well, so that's a perfect example, right? around so much of that and it probably when you're off you allow it all to come in like crazy and then when you're on you restrict completely like don't let it look like that look like like all like I'm I'm like comparing myself like kind of week over week and it's like hey this week I want to be a little bit better than I was last week >> diet-wise and training wise it's like not I'm not going to go from I was I'm way off the wagon now I'm dialed it's like and that and I was that guy and that caused these swings back and forth where now I never I never get too out of bounds. You know what I'm saying? like and it's because I don't I don't go so hard in either direction. And so I think that'll really help is just make those small. >> Clark, I I like where you're at. I like the that you you you've stopped the THC and the alcohol. I like your approach. Not that you need to like not that Oh, I'm so glad you stopped doing those things, but rather it sounds like you're trying to make the right steps >> to move in the right direction. You mentioned the body dysmorphia. I'm so glad you're honest with about that because that's a difficult one to work through. Um how how bad do you want to solve this forever? In other words, is this something like look, yeah, I want to get good results, but I just don't want to deal with this anymore. I don't want to do the up and down. Like, how >> I don't want to deal with it. Okay. It's it it's exhausting. I mean, it's been my entire life. So, >> yeah. I just want to get it manageable and just feel good, be healthy, and and go into this next stage of my life, trying to grow this cafe. >> Clark, Clark, >> uh, healthy >> Clark, nine nine months to a year of working with a coach. We'll do that with you. >> I'd love to see that. >> Like, you're you're in the perfect place. It it would be it would be a good nine months, maybe a year of working with someone on a monthly basis, having them guide you through. You're [clears throat] going to have ups and downs, guarantee it. >> Uh but to have somebody there guide you that you can go with that you can message, it's going to pull you back, push you, >> um kind of help you stay accountable, also prevent you from doing the all-in thing that tends to cause the allout >> uh on the other end. Yeah. >> Uh that plus you're, you know, you're getting your hormones checked, which would be great to see where that's at. >> Uh this is the perfect time to do it. Um if that's something you want, I can have somebody [clears throat] call you. But I I I I think you're looking about 9 months to a year of just kind of working with someone monthly and then you'll solve it, dude. >> Change your life forever. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I I absolutely agree with that and I'm thinking about that pretty much constantly. Um I actually just yesterday learned that my uh landscaping and pool building career is going to come to an end pretty soon. So uh on a financial side of things, a coach is probably not going to be uh as easy for me to do at this point. But um I do have the NASM training course. So I was going to dive into that and just try to self teach as much as I possibly could and uh talk to my friends who are in the health space uh and see if they could help me out holding me accountable these days. >> So that's good. It's different. Okay. Coaching is different. It's very individualized. I don't we don't talk about this on the show. Uh but we have something called concierge coaching >> which is far it's a much much less of an investment. uh and you're meeting with someone monthly and it is a mind it is a mind pump coach and they are guiding you through the process. Um, but this is kind of like when strike when the irons hop. Like you've got these big life changes. >> It's momentum based. This would be the time to do something like that and you wouldn't have to deal with it >> uh later on. But like I said, if that's something I can you look at it, I guess someone call you, you talk with them. >> Um, but I do like >> I would love that. I appreciate it. >> Okay. I'll have someone reach out to you. But I do like a reverse diet for you. I do like a MAF 15 protocol. I think it's going to be kind of this like stay consistent type of deal, not rush the process too much. Um, and then and then, you know, be able to prevent those those setbacks. And like I said, you're looking at about 9 months to a year uh of kind of working on this before it starts. >> You're in a good spot, dude. We can solve this right now. And then it it'll be forever. So >> that's encouraging. I appreciate that. And I I do wind up at the gym most days just to take a shower. So 15 20 minutes to uh to, you know, something else. Not a big deal. >> Perfect. >> Uh just know just knowing what that is and um is the big part. But >> I mean, as far as a reverse diet goes, I mean, where do you guys think I should be at calorie- wise if I'm doing all this activity? I mean, 2600 to 2,800 seems to keep me pretty energetic throughout the day, but I definitely do fall off at a certain point. >> Yeah, you eventually should be able to get up over 3,000. You should be all the way up to 32, 3,500, but we incrementally get up there. That's right. And so the goal would look like, >> you know, two to two to 400 calorie bump and then you stay there for a while. >> Weight should stay about the same on the scale. You should feel good. Strength, everything like that. Once that's been stabilized for a week or two, go up another two or 400 and just keep doing that incrementally, you know. >> Okay. >> And and uh easiest way to do that I like to do is either uh two more ounces of the meat that I'm already eating or adding one more small meal. Whichever one's more convenient. People tend to >> do better. Right. My opinion with just adding a larger portion of the the meat they're having or a fattier cut. If you're somebody who was eating chicken breast, they go to chicken thighs. If you're somebody who was eating a, you know, leaner steak, enjoy a ribeye, you know, those are easy ways to get an additional, >> you know, 2 to 400 calories. Um or you can >> I definitely do the I definitely do the chicken thigh um after [clears throat] I heard you preach about that [laughter] and it tastes so much better. So, I don't mind doing that. >> Yeah. And chuck roast is my go-to just cuz it's easy to get a hold of and uh but yeah. No, that's yeah, good point. I mean, 3 meals is pretty easy for me to manage. It's hard to do anymore than that. Uh even when I was doing like my testosterone and NPP, that was I mean I was down about like 3,500 calories and I was like, "Oh my god, I can't eat anymore." So >> good. >> Yeah, >> that's it, man. You'll get some you'll get body comp through that process. So you you'll kind of get leaner, build a little muscle. >> No big swings on the scales. And I saw I saw your numbers before. You're a strong guy. So like you you lift like you hit those lifts like that and you stay strong in 15 and you feed yourself appropriately, you'll have body comp. >> Yeah. Yeah, you will. >> Absolutely. Thank you guys. >> You got it, man. >> Um bicep tendinitis. What's your what's your go-to move for that? >> Oh, yeah. Deep deep bicep stretches. >> Okay. So really really long static stretching for the bicep uh tendon. Uh it's actually not a hard fix. And then with the other hand, you can rub on it. >> Those rifle flips. Yeah, rifle flips. You can look that up on our YouTube channel. >> Um, we do those several times a day and it tends to take care of it. [snorts] >> Awesome. Okay. >> Yeah, you got it, man. Thanks, Clark. I'll have someone call you. >> Okay, sounds good. Thank you guys so much. >> Easy, man. >> He's He's in a good place. >> He is. He is. Um, and you're if we can get through the psychological part, that'll be challenging. >> That's why the co That's why the coach is so important. It's not about the information. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> That's valuable. The information is valuable, but it's about the coaching. That's what we have to convey. >> It's about the coaching through the process. >> It helps a lot. >> And I know it's an investment and for people listening, it is an investment, but I'll tell you what, of all the investments you can make when it comes to getting results, nothing comes close. >> If you commit and you do it right and you say 9 months to a year, you'll never have to do it again. >> I mean, the tools that you'll get from that um will last you for the rest of your life. So, it's it it that's why it is like an investment. And it's not it isn't cheap to do that for 9 months to a year. But, you know, if you think about it like anything else that you've invested in yourself, um, it and what better than the thing that's going to be help you control your health. >> That's right. >> That's right. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. It's Mindput Media. All right. I know you like that episode. If you did, check this one out. Stop doing three sets of 12 to build muscle and do this instead. You guys want to guess? >> Stop doing the three sets of 12 and do this instead. Uh, with that intro, my guess is you're going to tell people to change the rep range up to Yeah. 5x5 or low rep range. >> Do you guys remember when you're going? >> Yeah. So, um, often times we get stuck in like a set count and a rep count or a range